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From Zero Reviews to $4K Clients: How Danielle Steman Broke Into Freelance Fashion With Just 8 Pitches
Ever wondered how to stand out on Upwork without a single rating, review, or testimonial? Danielle Steman did just that—and banked $4,000 from her first two freelance clients.
In this episode, you’ll meet Danielle, a former engineer from The Netherlands who left behind a stable tech career to carve out a bold new path in fashion. Specializing in made-to-measure and latex pattern making, she built a niche business from scratch—landing high-paying clients with just eight targeted pitches and zero experience on her profile.
You’ll hear how her technical background gave her an edge, how she uses mobile scanning and CAD to wow clients, and why saying no to non-niche work helped her grow faster. She also shares the mindset shifts that helped her go all-in, and the exact steps she took to start attracting international clients (hint: it’s simpler than you think!).
If you're new to freelancing or have been at it a while, click play now to learn how confidence, clarity, and a super-specific niche can unlock your freelance fashion career.
About Danielle:
Danielle Steman is a freelance patternmaker for liberated brands committed to sustainable practices and inclusivity.
She specializes in designs that fit like a glove, focusing on made-to-measure and latex garments. A fashion tech aficionado, she thrives on technical challenges and is a strong advocate for Made to Measure and Made to Order as the future of fashion. Over the past two years, she has been deeply engaged in exploring the integration of 2D, 3D, and scanning technologies to craft perfectly fitting patterns at the touch of a button.
Connect with Danielle:
Visit her website: https://daniellesteman.nl/
Email her at info@daniellesteman.nl
Download my Freelance Price List just for fashion (it’s free!): sewheidi.com/price
Creators and Guests
Host
Heidi Weinberg {Sew Heidi}
Heidi (aka Sew Heidi) is a self-taught freelance fashion designer who built a six-figure business without a degree, portfolio, or industry connections. After years of burnout in the fashion industry, she went freelance—and never looked back. Now, she helps other designers ditch toxic jobs, land better clients, and build flexible careers they love. Through her podcast, courses, and resources, Heidi has helped thousands of designers take control of their fashion path and finally get paid what they’re worth.
What is Fashion Designers Get Paid: Build Your Fashion Career On Your Own Terms?
This is a show for burnt-out fashion designers (and TDs, PDs, patternmakers, textile designer and beyond) who want more flexibility in their career while still doing work they love.
You'll learn how to build a freelance fashion business, so you can do the work you love on your own terms. Freelancing in fashion is the only way to get freedom in your day (instead of being tied to a desk).
Whether you want to earn extra money on the side, fund your fashion brand, or replace your salary, the FDGP podcast will help you get there. Listen in for actionable tips and strategies to kickstart or grow your career as a freelance fashion designer, build your confidence, and create the life you want.
Hosted by $100k+ fashion freelancer Sew Heidi, the show features interviews and strategy sessions with successful freelance fashion designers from around the world who've ditched toxic fashion jobs and taken control of their own destinies. This is the only place to get REAL insights from REAL freelancers who have built REAL careers on their own terms. (Formerly the Successful Fashion Freelancer podcast.)
Heidi [00:00:00]:
Imagine landing your first two freelance clients for $4,000 after sending just eight pitches and doing it with no reviews, no ratings, and a brand new Upwork profile. That's exactly what Danielle Steman did. A former engineer from The Netherlands, she quit her job, chose herself, and went all in on freelancing and fashion. Today, she's building a niche business as a made to measure and latex pattern specialist, collaborating with brands across the globe. So how did she stand out on Upwork without a single review, and how is she building a name for herself in such a specific niche? If you're curious about how to compete without experience and actually land high paying clients, this episode is for you. Let's get to it. Hi, Danielle. I'm super excited to have you on the podcast.
Heidi [00:00:40]:
Thank you so much for joining me.
Danielle Steman [00:00:43]:
Well, nice to be here. Nice to meet you, Heidi. Yeah. Finally in, in real life.
Heidi [00:00:48]:
Yeah. As real life as we can get from from across the right? Yeah. I love it. Well, I would love to learn more about how you landed your first two clients for $4,000, sending just eight pitches. I wanna hear all the details. So how did this happen, like, quickly, and then we can dive into all the things.
Danielle Steman [00:01:10]:
Well, I'm very picky with, job postings on on Upwork. I don't, send send out proposals to everything that comes by. So it it must be really something portable I like and, also worthy efforts. So I'm not responding to the ten hour, $10 per hour Mhmm. Jobs or the $100 projects. And these two were actually quite specific.
Heidi [00:01:44]:
How
Danielle Steman [00:01:44]:
do you say it? The the experience they were they were after. So, yeah, that was a bit lucky. But, yeah, and it's also, giving the right response. So tell them what you can do for them instead of or reply to their request, so to say, and not just say, okay. Here I am. You can I can do everything?
Heidi [00:02:12]:
Talk a little bit about that. Like, so you saw the job listings and you pitched for those. Is that correct for both of them? They didn't come find you. Yeah. Okay.
Danielle Steman [00:02:21]:
No. I pitched to for them.
Heidi [00:02:24]:
Okay. So so talk a little about, like, how you pitched and, like, what are some of the things you talked about in your pitch that you feel like help you helped you stand out?
Danielle Steman [00:02:33]:
Well, the the first one, they were looking for somebody who could do made to measure. So yeah. Well, okay. That's, that's my niche. So there are not not many people who can do that. So with the mobile scanning so I was also quite bold with my my pitch. My first, sentence was, okay. This is exactly what my remote tailoring service can do for you.
Danielle Steman [00:03:01]:
And, yeah, just a very short introduction about me and and how this this, service worked. And I think I thought the reply the next day or so. Yeah. So we we would like to meet, with you. Okay. And the other one was somebody who was really looking for somebody who knew, fit and sizing. So, yeah, that's also quite very, specific what she was looking for.
Heidi [00:03:41]:
Yeah.
Danielle Steman [00:03:42]:
Yeah. It's what it's what it was the same. The this pitch pitch was a little bit more generic. So not not, okay. I have a service for this, but, yeah, I can do this for you. Yeah. And, a little bit about myself.
Heidi [00:03:59]:
Okay. And so this is are these, like these are your first two gigs on Upwork. So you went into these with, like, a blank Upwork profile, like, no ratings, no reviews, no nothing.
Danielle Steman [00:04:11]:
Yeah. Yeah. I I made an Upwork profile, I think, a year ago when we maybe even longer ago. Yeah. Yeah. I never finished it. Never gave it a second look. So but, yeah, with without any references or referrals or whatever.
Heidi [00:04:31]:
Okay. And so for reference, we're recording this in April 2025, and I think you landed these opportunities in, like, February or March of twenty twenty five.
Danielle Steman [00:04:39]:
Yeah. Something like that.
Heidi [00:04:41]:
So for people listening, there's still plenty of opportunity to, like, get clients on Upwork even if you're starting from zero zero. It sounds like these are two really great gigs.
Danielle Steman [00:04:51]:
Yeah.
Heidi [00:04:51]:
How much did you update your profile? I know you said you kinda set it up a year ago and kinda forgot about it. Did you update your profile at all?
Danielle Steman [00:04:58]:
Yeah. I I've finished it finished it. So it was kind of a new profile. So I made a good introduction about myself and, the the portfolio.
Heidi [00:05:09]:
Okay.
Danielle Steman [00:05:10]:
So I think yeah. You you should have that. At least one one one or two examples which you can show your your potential customers.
Heidi [00:05:21]:
Yeah. So talk a little bit about tell us a little bit more about your niche and, like, what do you have for your examples on Upwork? And, like, how do you what's your headline? Like, I'd love to hear a little bit more.
Danielle Steman [00:05:35]:
Yeah. Well, my my niche is, actually, latex and made to measure. K. So but but latex, you don't find on, Upwork. I already found it out. That's that's really specific.
Heidi [00:05:47]:
Okay.
Danielle Steman [00:05:54]:
Let let me, get my profile.
Heidi [00:05:56]:
K. So so when you need to measure, like, explain that in a little more detail for people listening who might not I mean, I understand what that means. Like, you're making a garment specifically for someone's exact body measurements. But, like, how are you doing this in a for brands? Like, what, like, what is that actually like, your services?
Danielle Steman [00:06:17]:
Yeah. I use, mobile scanning for that. This is kind of my my pet project I've been working on for for more than two years k. To to get it get it all going. Yeah. So, I do a a mobile scan or the client does it, him or herself. K. And I retrieved the measurements from them.
Danielle Steman [00:06:39]:
And then with my CAD program, I have prepared, the pattern in such a way that it will adapt automatically to those measurements. So and my final goal is to to have a fitted, pattern ready within one hour and with just a few mouse clicks. And then I I also check it, in three d.
Heidi [00:07:08]:
Okay.
Danielle Steman [00:07:08]:
I use that to to, yeah, to to do the final tweaks.
Heidi [00:07:12]:
Okay.
Danielle Steman [00:07:13]:
I know the pattern is already good because, yeah, my base models are are tried and tested before. So, yeah, that that's ensured how that's that that works. So it's really like scan, bit, and wear. Okay. So I sent a made to measure pattern to my, my client, and they the production is their their problem.
Heidi [00:07:41]:
Okay. So the made to match so so did they just give you the measurements via the mobile scanning, and you made the pattern and send them the pattern, and they're gonna do the production? And that's it. Yeah. That's for that. That's the project.
Danielle Steman [00:07:56]:
Yeah. Okay. No. Yeah. But, more more than one product pattern.
Heidi [00:08:04]:
Okay.
Danielle Steman [00:08:05]:
So Project. Yeah. Okay. They want to set up the the product they are selling to offer that also in made to measure. So this is an ongoing ongoing project. So I first have to Go ahead. So I first have to, prepare the pattern, and there are different styles, and, yeah, they put on on their website, okay, if you you buy the the this garments, you get the link with the scanning mobile, with the scanning app, and then, yeah, I I get into play. But their customers don't know me, don't know me, and they don't see me.
Danielle Steman [00:08:47]:
So Okay. It's like they are all every arranging everything.
Heidi [00:08:54]:
I see. Okay. So it's it's you set up the base patterns for all the different silhouettes, and then it it gets on their website for sale. And then when someone goes to purchase it, it says, okay. Click here. Scan your measurements, and they scan their body. It inputs the measurements, sends them back to you. The pattern gets updated with just a few clicks, then you send them back the pattern, then they cut and sew that and send it to the customer.
Danielle Steman [00:09:18]:
Yes. Yes.
Heidi [00:09:19]:
Okay. Gotcha. Oh, very cool.
Danielle Steman [00:09:23]:
Yeah. Where is the company located? Yeah.
Heidi [00:09:28]:
Sorry, you say? Where is the company located?
Danielle Steman [00:09:31]:
They are in The UK.
Heidi [00:09:33]:
Okay. And you're in Amsterdam?
Danielle Steman [00:09:36]:
Well, for for Americans, I'm in Amsterdam. Yeah.
Heidi [00:09:40]:
Oh, okay.
Danielle Steman [00:09:42]:
But I'm, 250 kilometers from Amsterdam.
Heidi [00:09:45]:
Okay. Gotcha. Gotcha. Okay. And so you've done this all completely remotely, completely digitally with them? Yeah. Okay.
Danielle Steman [00:09:55]:
Yeah. I met on a met online with them for Sue. So, yeah, that that that's the the advantage of, being freelancer.
Heidi [00:10:06]:
Yes. And
Danielle Steman [00:10:06]:
especially corona, the pandemic made everything, much easier.
Heidi [00:10:12]:
Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So that's the first client for the made to measure, and they were specifically looking for someone who does made to measure. And you're like, this is what I specialize in. I've already kind of built out the functions within the software. What soft what do you use? What pattern making software do you use to do this?
Danielle Steman [00:10:28]:
I'm using, Graphis.
Heidi [00:10:30]:
Gravis. Okay.
Danielle Steman [00:10:31]:
Yeah. It's a it's a German, cat's, software. So, yeah, it's mainly used here Germany, UK, Europe. I don't think it's very
Heidi [00:10:47]:
much. Yeah. I heard of it.
Danielle Steman [00:10:49]:
Yeah.
Heidi [00:10:50]:
Yeah. Okay. Cool.
Danielle Steman [00:10:53]:
To say something else. What did I want to say? It will pop up.
Heidi [00:11:01]:
Okay. It'll come back. Okay. So talk so, I guess, talk about the other client, which you said was more fitting, and sizing specialization. It wasn't the made to measure.
Danielle Steman [00:11:15]:
No. That that, is somebody, who wants to sell their own patterns. So as a pattern company. And, yeah, she was looking for base blocks. Okay. Base patterns, strokers. I don't know whatever you call them.
Heidi [00:11:33]:
Yeah.
Danielle Steman [00:11:33]:
And a really good, size chart to fit their or her target customer.
Heidi [00:11:41]:
Okay. Gotcha.
Danielle Steman [00:11:43]:
So yeah. And because of all the the, the research I did with the made to measure, I also know a lot about, size charge and sizing and fitting. So that also, yeah, fitted really well with my experience.
Heidi [00:12:03]:
That's great. That's great. Okay. So what do talk about, like, some of the updates that you did to your Upwork profile. I think you just might have pulled it up. I'd love to hear, like, how do you what what do you call yourself? Like, what's your title in there? I think you guys have, like, some type of headline, and then, I'd love to hear a little bit about what you have in your portfolio, etcetera.
Danielle Steman [00:12:25]:
Yeah. My my headline is, freelance pot maker and then, slash, matrix and made to measure made to measure specialist. And, shall I just read it? Maybe that's just Sure. Yeah. Read it to us. It's, unleash your creativity, leave it back to me. I'm here to streamline your workflow, allowing you to save time, money, and headaches. Whether it's it is accelerating the sample sampling process with digital samples, offering size advice, or simply with high quality patterns, I've got you covered.
Danielle Steman [00:13:01]:
I'm a freelance pattern maker for liberating brands who have strong commitments to sustainable practices and inclusiveness. I'm specialized in designs that fit like a cloth, made to measure and latex latex garments. With a solid foundation in engineering and tailoring, I bring a distinctive edge edge to understanding size and fit and body shapes. I take great pride in crafting patterns that embrace natural curves while ensuring both both mobility and comfort. But it's not just my technical expertise that sets me apart. I also have a keen eye for detail and a passion for bringing designers' visions to life. I truly enjoy collaborating closely closely with my clients to ensure that specific needs are met. You can rely on me to be responsive, communicate communicative, and committed to the success of your project.
Danielle Steman [00:13:59]:
Most importantly, I approach each job with a positive can do attitude. I'm not just here to deliver patterns. I'm here to be a creative partner partner you can rely on. If you seek someone who can consistently delivers high quality work while infusing enthusiasm and a personal touch into the process, it would be my honor to collaborate with you. You provide efficient. I'll handle the tech technical details so you can spend more time on doing what you love, creating beautiful clothes. So I love that. The story.
Danielle Steman [00:14:41]:
Yeah. It's maybe a bit long, but I haven't had any complaints about it. You hit on a lot
Heidi [00:14:50]:
of great things, though. Like, you're not just like, I can make patterns. You've touched on a lot of the client pain points and a lot of, like, the freelancer challenges. Like, you're like, I'm gonna be reliable. I'm here to deliver. I'm not here to just, like, check it off the list. I'm gonna do a great job. I mean, I can feel in your writing, I could feel your level of commitment to the craft as well as, like, was, like, making you an exceptional job for your client.
Heidi [00:15:14]:
So it's, it's very clear to me why people are, are being drawn to you on the platform.
Danielle Steman [00:15:20]:
Well, that's great to hear. Thank you.
Heidi [00:15:22]:
You're welcome. Yeah. So you mentioned you have, like, an engineering background. Like, what is your background? How long have you been doing fashion?
Danielle Steman [00:15:32]:
Yeah. I've been in in high-tech for for more than twenty years. K. So I, yeah, I have an engineering, degree, and, yeah, fashion was always just a hobby. Oh, okay. I I learned sewing when I was a little girl. I think about eight years old or so, and I always make my own clothing. And at a certain point, I did a a tailors, education.
Danielle Steman [00:16:04]:
I think it was in 02/2008 or something.
Heidi [00:16:08]:
Okay.
Danielle Steman [00:16:08]:
And at that time, it was, yeah, it was still just for fun. But if I had it in the back of my mind, that's, yeah, maybe someday, I'm going to do something with it. And then, it was, I think, 02/2016. I was kind of fed up with my job and yeah, I just decided to give it a try. I I was lucky enough to to have a a financial backup, so I could do it. So I I actually quit my job without anything. Oh, sorry. Without being prepared or whatsoever.
Danielle Steman [00:17:04]:
And I started out as a tailor. And I'm too slow for that. Too too precise and too meticulous. So in the end, Yeah. The the hourly the hourly rate I I earned with it, it was too low to make a a decent living. Mhmm. Okay. And I also like engineering.
Danielle Steman [00:17:35]:
I I found out that suing a address just for fun is totally different than sewing a dress for somebody else, full time. So, at that point, I think it was, I was two or three years down the line. I decided, okay, I am going to focus on on pattern making and then I also invested in in three d. At that time. Because, yeah, I already saw, okay, that's going to be the future. Mhmm. And from there, okay. Then I didn't know, oh, you have to niche and, just pick something specific.
Danielle Steman [00:18:21]:
So, yeah, I I kind of had to start all over with with my with my marketing and networking and pitching and stuff like that. And I was, like you say, the the Rolodex, freelancer.
Heidi [00:18:35]:
Oh, trying to do everything from for everybody.
Danielle Steman [00:18:38]:
Yeah. But also relying too much on on my network.
Heidi [00:18:43]:
Oh, gotcha. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Danielle Steman [00:18:48]:
And it works, but, yeah, it's too uncertain. Yeah. And it always small small projects and often also not the the most exciting projects. So and somehow, my first latex customer came along. And at that time, I I never worked with latex, and I also told them that, okay, I I had no experience at all with latex. And I even said, I know somebody who does, so I referred him to someone else, but he wanted to work with me. And from there, Yeah. This led to my, my niche of, of latex.
Danielle Steman [00:19:34]:
But, yeah, it's it's it requires a certain kind of skill, and it's just a little bit different than normal pattern making. Yeah. And it's, you can combine this with a made to measure very good. Yeah. Because really there's a lot of, made to order, one piece a one off pieces that are made. So that that's where I'm I'm heading. So the the made to measure latex. Yeah.
Danielle Steman [00:20:02]:
I don't think I can cut more much more niche than that.
Heidi [00:20:06]:
No. That's really specific. Like, you are gonna be the person in that space space. Nobody's going to exist there, which is amazing.
Danielle Steman [00:20:16]:
Yeah. So I'm going to to market myself, yeah, in in that that position. So Okay. If you want something made to measure in latex. And we also decided to do commissions, but that's another path to go down.
Heidi [00:20:35]:
Oh, okay. Commissions, how? What do you mean?
Danielle Steman [00:20:39]:
For people who want their own, design made in labels.
Heidi [00:20:45]:
Oh, you'll, like, actually make it. I see.
Danielle Steman [00:20:49]:
Yeah. Well, I don't I do the pattern, and then my clients or yeah. Right now, it's not not even a client anymore collaborator.
Heidi [00:20:59]:
Okay. Okay.
Danielle Steman [00:21:00]:
That's the manufacturing.
Heidi [00:21:01]:
I see. Okay. Very cool. So you left engineering in 02/2016. You started doing custom tailoring. Were you just, like, was that on a freelance basis? You were just doing it for people you kind of knew? Or Yeah. Okay. And then that didn't pan out well because you you you said you like the engineering component, which sounds like kinda got lost in that, and you the money was not there.
Heidi [00:21:31]:
So you started learning pattern making and and three d, and then just kind of built out a network very organically and started freelancing in that capacity. How did you even build that network out? Like, tell us
Danielle Steman [00:21:49]:
Yeah. Well, the the pattern making, I already learned during the the tailoring, course, of course. K. But, yeah, when I started as a tailor, first, I did everything manual, but after a year, I or so I switched to to, do that digitally. So and, actually, from there, from the the the software course and the people I I met there and also my my previous clients. Yeah, that that kind of grew Okay. Into the pattern making business. So, yeah, as as I said, I was relying on my network.
Heidi [00:22:38]:
Yeah.
Danielle Steman [00:22:39]:
And it it takes it takes a long time to to grow that network, And now it's time to, to take bigger steps.
Heidi [00:22:50]:
Be a little more proactive with your marketing, it sounds like. Yeah.
Danielle Steman [00:22:53]:
Yeah. Yeah. Checking.
Heidi [00:22:55]:
Yeah.
Danielle Steman [00:22:57]:
But even with with, I don't know, three six Instagram posts, it's already working.
Heidi [00:23:05]:
Wow. Tell us more. Six Instagram posts, you said? Yeah.
Danielle Steman [00:23:09]:
Tell us more. What are
Heidi [00:23:10]:
you doing on Instagram?
Danielle Steman [00:23:12]:
Not much. A little.
Heidi [00:23:15]:
But something. I'm gonna open your Instagram up right now.
Danielle Steman [00:23:19]:
No. There there are just some, I have some pics from, from some simulations.
Heidi [00:23:25]:
Uh-huh. I see it. And more.
Danielle Steman [00:23:31]:
And I think the last one is already, I don't know, more than six months old. Oh.
Heidi [00:23:40]:
But you're getting people contacting you through Instagram?
Danielle Steman [00:23:46]:
Mostly through my website, actually.
Heidi [00:23:48]:
Okay. And are they finding you from Instagram and getting to your website?
Danielle Steman [00:23:53]:
Yeah. Oh, wow.
Heidi [00:23:56]:
Okay. So let's see. You don't even have yeah. Your most recent post was fifty nine weeks ago. Yeah. You literally have seven posts and 67 followers.
Danielle Steman [00:24:12]:
That's enough.
Heidi [00:24:14]:
Yeah. You're kinda using some hashtags just made to just some simple hashtags. And so you put this up, haven't really touched it, but people are finding it, then going through to your website, then contacting you off your website for projects. Is that what's happening?
Danielle Steman [00:24:31]:
Yeah.
Heidi [00:24:33]:
Wow. And now are they specifically looking for latex made to measure?
Danielle Steman [00:24:40]:
Not made to measure yet or or latex or made to measure.
Heidi [00:24:44]:
Okay. One or the other. Combination. But the niche is really working, it sounds like. Yeah.
Danielle Steman [00:24:50]:
Yeah. And especially lately, the the made to measure is I since, I don't know, two months, three months, it's like poof. I get a lot of requests, about it.
Heidi [00:25:07]:
Yeah. It's just been growing.
Danielle Steman [00:25:10]:
Yeah. So somehow if people hear about it, not from me, because I'm not posting anything. Yeah. But somehow it yeah. Word get words get out.
Heidi [00:25:20]:
Yeah.
Danielle Steman [00:25:21]:
And, people come to me.
Heidi [00:25:25]:
Okay. And I'm just looking at your website here real quick. It's similar verbiage to what you have on your Upwork. So you were able were able to just date that over?
Danielle Steman [00:25:38]:
Yeah. Just copy paste.
Heidi [00:25:40]:
Yeah. Okay.
Danielle Steman [00:25:44]:
And and things like that should take me a long time to come up with. So
Heidi [00:25:49]:
Yeah. But now you can just kinda set it and forget it. Yeah. I love this. This would not happen if you were a general maker.
Danielle Steman [00:26:02]:
No. No. No.
Heidi [00:26:04]:
It's because you're so specifically niche.
Danielle Steman [00:26:08]:
Yeah. I was, scared about this, and I still sometimes look at other projects and then I have to say to myself, okay, no. That's not your niche. You're not going to do that.
Heidi [00:26:26]:
Even though you could?
Danielle Steman [00:26:28]:
Yeah.
Heidi [00:26:30]:
What feels scary about that?
Danielle Steman [00:26:34]:
Yeah. Kind of fear of missing out. Mhmm. So because that's yeah, what what I already noticed is that the, there's quite a huge, latex community, and especially in Germany and in The UK, it's really big. And there are a lot of brands, but I think 70%, eighty % are just one one people businesses. So I thought there would be more bigger brands who needed the help. But, yeah, just one or two is enough. I'm also a one person business.
Danielle Steman [00:27:28]:
So Yeah. And I even got cut I got contact contacted by yeah. I think it's the biggest brand in The Netherlands and maybe even the biggest brand in Europe. So
Heidi [00:27:43]:
How did they find you?
Danielle Steman [00:27:44]:
That's from it. That was through, referral.
Heidi [00:27:48]:
Through what? A referral. A referral. Okay. Gotcha.
Danielle Steman [00:27:52]:
Yeah.
Heidi [00:27:53]:
Okay.
Danielle Steman [00:27:55]:
So Are
Heidi [00:27:55]:
you doing a project for them?
Danielle Steman [00:27:57]:
Not yet. But Okay. We agreed that we would start with something small.
Heidi [00:28:03]:
Okay.
Danielle Steman [00:28:03]:
But we were both busy, so we, yeah, we we just had to set an arrangements for for this week or next week. So Okay. It's time to follow-up.
Heidi [00:28:13]:
That's great.
Danielle Steman [00:28:15]:
Yeah. Because I I didn't expect those two kinds to come so soon. I still have some some unfinished business. So right now, it's, I really have to work hard to get everything everything done.
Heidi [00:28:28]:
The clients from Upwork?
Danielle Steman [00:28:30]:
Yeah.
Heidi [00:28:31]:
Yeah.
Danielle Steman [00:28:33]:
I didn't expect, two projects from that within, I don't know, two months or so.
Heidi [00:28:39]:
Yeah. That's amazing. So these other clients these other people that have contacted you, the referral and the people who have contacted you through Instagram and then your website, are those all people you're talking to about potentially doing stuff with?
Danielle Steman [00:28:58]:
Yeah. Potential.
Heidi [00:29:00]:
Okay.
Danielle Steman [00:29:01]:
But, there is only yeah. One, I sent a proposal
Heidi [00:29:11]:
last week. Okay.
Danielle Steman [00:29:13]:
And, yeah, I got a verbal agreement, but nothing's signed yet. And the other one, yeah, it's just going back and forth. What what do you want? What what can I do for you? Yeah. Still oh, I'm not sure.
Heidi [00:29:33]:
Figuring out the details.
Danielle Steman [00:29:34]:
So yeah. Also, starting brands, I can't afford that much. So
Heidi [00:29:40]:
Oh, gotcha. Yeah.
Danielle Steman [00:29:43]:
How are you pricing?
Heidi [00:29:45]:
Yeah. Sorry. Go ahead. Go ahead.
Danielle Steman [00:29:47]:
Need to keep that, warm Yeah. Those contacts.
Heidi [00:29:52]:
Yeah. Absolutely. How are you pricing your services? Like, how did you price these these projects work?
Danielle Steman [00:30:01]:
By project.
Heidi [00:30:02]:
Flat based. Okay.
Danielle Steman [00:30:04]:
Yeah. Flat based. How did
Heidi [00:30:05]:
you calculate that?
Danielle Steman [00:30:12]:
Yeah. It's also experience, of course.
Heidi [00:30:15]:
Okay.
Danielle Steman [00:30:16]:
And I have a quite expensive, Excel sheet where I can fill in all the the things I have to do. And then with an estimation, I think, how long it will take and an hourly, rate. So in the end, there there will be the number.
Heidi [00:30:33]:
Okay. Gotcha. And you said that one brand stands in The UK, and then where's the other brand located? In The US. Okay. Gotcha.
Danielle Steman [00:30:42]:
Yep.
Heidi [00:30:43]:
Cool.
Danielle Steman [00:30:44]:
So that's an even more time bigger time difference, I think. That's a nine hour time difference.
Heidi [00:30:50]:
Yeah. But you're making it work. Are you guys just doing Zooms, like, their morning, your afternoon, and you're making it work?
Danielle Steman [00:30:57]:
Yeah.
Heidi [00:31:00]:
Just because people ask a lot, like, how are you doing, any of the fitting stuff remotely? Or are you not doing any of the fitting? You're just doing the patterns and thens and then. Do they do a Zoom with you with the proto, or how is that working?
Danielle Steman [00:31:16]:
Yeah. Mostly, they they make make the proto themselves.
Heidi [00:31:20]:
Okay.
Danielle Steman [00:31:21]:
Then, yeah, they they do the fitting, and sometimes we do Zoom, Indeed, or they send me the pictures. Okay. And, yeah, most of the time, I say, okay, that can be done better. It's often that they don't even see it.
Heidi [00:31:41]:
Okay.
Danielle Steman [00:31:42]:
So and and today is, the first, made to measure suit is is made. So I'm really curious, about that one.
Heidi [00:31:51]:
Oh, that's exciting that, like, a customer went to the website, ordered it, and they just made it now.
Danielle Steman [00:31:57]:
Yeah. Oh, that's Okay. And this is still the this customer knows that this is still the trial. Okay. So Yeah. If it's not right, they they know that it it can happen that there's a mistake or something, but I'm really, excited to see that, that you're now.
Heidi [00:32:17]:
That's so cool. So how are you pricing that? Because, like, there's the the rate to build it out in the first place, but then every time somebody orders one, you have to do a little bit of work in the background. Right? Yeah. So Yeah. So so I'll price per piece?
Danielle Steman [00:32:35]:
Yeah. That's a per piece. So I'll price the projects, so the the pattern developments, and then next, yeah, every order is a per item,
Heidi [00:32:48]:
Okay. Gotcha.
Danielle Steman [00:32:49]:
Great.
Heidi [00:32:50]:
Okay. Gotcha. That's really cool. So you'll have the opportunity to grow with them as they keep getting more orders.
Danielle Steman [00:32:58]:
Yeah. And they they said, when we first start, they they expect, around 200, orders per year. So
Heidi [00:33:06]:
Yeah.
Danielle Steman [00:33:07]:
That's quite big. Yeah. So That's amazing. Already also, investing in automation, of this stuff. So
Heidi [00:33:20]:
Yeah. Because that would be, like, four orders a week. Yeah. About
Danielle Steman [00:33:26]:
Yeah. Yeah. And right now, that that will take me a whole day. Okay. It's still still good money. Okay. But yeah. Well, the the goal is to do it in less than an hour.
Heidi [00:33:40]:
Okay. But right now, it still takes a couple hours per
Danielle Steman [00:33:45]:
Yeah. Yeah. Especially with with with with downloading the measurements and converting them and putting them in into my my card system. It's all manual, so it's a lot of just stupid. Click click. Copy paste. Yeah. Copy paste.
Danielle Steman [00:34:01]:
Yeah.
Heidi [00:34:02]:
Okay. Well, your engineering brain, I'm sure, can automate that somehow.
Danielle Steman [00:34:07]:
Yeah. I I I think I can, but I I said somebody else on it.
Heidi [00:34:13]:
Okay. Good. Good. Your time is better spent elsewhere. That's really smart to outsource that.
Danielle Steman [00:34:20]:
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Otherwise, I I have to learn a new get some new knowledge, and it takes me three times as long if I do it myself than if somebody else does it.
Heidi [00:34:36]:
Gotcha.
Danielle Steman [00:34:38]:
And with $200 per year
Heidi [00:34:42]:
That's a lot.
Danielle Steman [00:34:42]:
It's worth Yeah. Spending some money on it.
Heidi [00:34:46]:
Totally. That's really smart to invest in that. This is so exciting, Danielle. I am pumped for you. I feel like you have built this really amazing foundation. You've planted a bunch of seeds and and are grow. And, your niche is so amazing. I love how specific it is.
Heidi [00:35:06]:
How does it feel to be, like, building this this business out for yourself?
Danielle Steman [00:35:13]:
Yeah. That feels good. Finally. Finally, it's yeah. It's gaining traction. And, yeah, I get rewarded for the work I put into all those years. So
Heidi [00:35:26]:
Yeah. Good.
Danielle Steman [00:35:27]:
It's a good feeling.
Heidi [00:35:28]:
Good. I'm so happy for you. I'd love to end with asking you the question I ask everybody, and then that is is one thing people never ask you about being a freelance fashion designer or freelance, made to measure latex pattern pattern maker, that you wish they would?
Danielle Steman [00:35:49]:
Yeah. I knew this question was coming before I was thinking about it. But, like, it it just popped up when we were talking about it. When I just quit my job, nobody asked how that was for me. So it, yeah, it was scary as Yeah. As hell, of course.
Heidi [00:36:14]:
Yeah.
Danielle Steman [00:36:15]:
So but if you ask me ten years ago if I would have done things like this, definitely not. I always lived on the safe side. Did everything. You can buy the book, so to say. But, yeah, if if you want to move forward, you have to take, some scary actions. Otherwise, yeah, you get stuck in the same place and you're you're not going anywhere. Yeah. So sometimes you just have to dive in and, learn how to swim.
Heidi [00:36:50]:
Yeah. Was there a specific, like, tipping point? I know you said you were you were interested in fashion and you were just kind of, like, wanted to change from engineering. But was there, like, a really specific thing that made you, like, actually take the leap to quit?
Danielle Steman [00:37:10]:
Yeah. I was recovering from from a depression, and it was time to to choose for myself. Mhmm. So the yeah. That was actually the the tipping point.
Heidi [00:37:25]:
Good for you. You chose yourself. That's amazing.
Danielle Steman [00:37:27]:
Yeah. Yeah. I can recommend that to everybody.
Heidi [00:37:32]:
Yeah.
Danielle Steman [00:37:33]:
Even if it's scary.
Heidi [00:37:37]:
There's, have you ever heard of James Altucher?
Danielle Steman [00:37:41]:
No. I don't think so.
Heidi [00:37:43]:
I don't know how big of how big of an internal audience he has. He's he's fairly big in The States. He wrote a book called Choose Yourself.
Danielle Steman [00:37:52]:
And That sounds familiar.
Heidi [00:37:56]:
I my dad gave it to me. It was thousand and fourteen. I wanna say we were living in New York City and my dad gave me that book. And I was freelancing at the time, and I was I I read it on the subway. I I vividly remember reading it. And I was like, freelancing was great, but I also was like, there's something more for me to choose for myself than this. And that was it was like a switch was flipped. That's when I started, like, taking my courses and putting them online and building this whole thing out.
Heidi [00:38:32]:
And I, it was a big moment of, like, yeah, choose yourself. You only get to do this once. You have to choose yourself. Nobody else will really choose you. You are the one that has to do it. So, it's a pretty short read if I remember correctly. I think you might find I find it, enjoyable.
Danielle Steman [00:38:49]:
I will look it up. Yeah. You you can better be sorry about a a failure than sorry for not trying.
Heidi [00:38:57]:
Yes. A % that. Well, I'm really glad you chose yourself, Danielle. That's amazing.
Danielle Steman [00:39:04]:
Yeah. I'm
Heidi [00:39:04]:
so excited to have you part of our community. Where can everybody connect with you and find you online?
Danielle Steman [00:39:12]:
Yeah. I think my websites, maybe. Yeah. It's daniellesteman.nl.
Heidi [00:39:19]:
Yeah. We'll link to that.
Danielle Steman [00:39:21]:
How how how do you pronounce it in in English? Stemmen? Stemmen?
Heidi [00:39:25]:
I guess Stemmen. Yeah. Yeah. We'll put it in
Danielle Steman [00:39:27]:
the show notes.
Heidi [00:39:28]:
Yeah. Okay. Awesome. We'll put both of those in the show notes. Well, it was so great to chat with you chat with you. I'm really excited about your trajectory. And, I know this is just the beginning of so many great things to keep coming for you. Great job on it.
Danielle Steman [00:39:42]:
Thank you. It was nice to be here.