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The Transform your Teaching podcast is a service of the Center for Teaching and Learning at Cedarville University in Cedarville, Ohio. Join Dr. Rob McDole and Dr. Jared Pyles as they seek to inspire higher education faculty to adopt innovative teaching and learning practices.
This is the Transform Your Teaching Podcast. The Transform Your Teaching Podcast is a service of the Center for Teaching and Learning at Cedarville University in Cedarville, Ohio.
Jared:Welcome back to the Transform Your Teaching podcast here on the campus of Cedarville University. My name is Jared Pyles, and with me as always is Dr. I guess not always because sometimes, actually, I'm the only one that's missed so far. I think you've been consistent with every episode. Yeah. So Dr.
Jared:Rob McDole.
Rob:It's kind of hard to say I've been with you. Minus that one time.
Jared:You know, sometimes it feels like you're always with me. Oh. Even when I'm not sitting across from you at this table.
Rob:I'm so sorry.
Jared:I feel like there's always a rub on my shoulder.
Jared:Are you should you be doing that?
Rob:Yeah. Well, I get tired of me, so I can only imagine
Jared:Yeah. Well, that tired of we are continuing our series on active learning. We are going to pivot a bit and talk of although we've talked about it kind of off and on as we've gone through this series, but there are specific active learning spaces. Yes. And there are universities and, other schools that are taking existing spaces or some even libraries and they're converting them into these what they're calling active learning spaces.
Jared:So there are certain design principles and considerations that go into designing an active learning space, and that is our plan to talk about today.
Rob:Yes. And and just so our listeners understand, we do have a list of things here to work through today, and it's come through a research. It's come through listening to others. So the three major topics that we're gonna deal with today are and you've already mentioned some of those, the fundamental design principles of of active learning spaces. Now, we're talking about spaces here.
Rob:We're not talking about necessarily designing a course.
Jared:Correct.
Rob:Although, I'm sure there's some of these things you could you could think through and synthesize. The next one is necessary considerations for designing an active learning space. So we have the things that the design principles and then the things that have to be there.
Jared:Yes.
Rob:And then finally, what are those best practices for for active learning spaces in terms of things that you'd have in it? How does it need to be organized, how does it need to be used to get the most out of these spaces?
Jared:Yeah. So I'm gonna start talking about these fundamental design principles, those things that need to be in those active learning spaces. The first one is it's gotta be flexible and adaptable. So one of the things about active learning is that, you know, we've mentioned to several people now we've asked them, you know, what does active learning look like? And it's a bit of collaboration, a bit of, you know, talking with one another and and being able to be flexible and adaptable in a given space.
Rob:So we're talking about rooms that are not bolted down. Is that what you're thinking?
Jared:That's what I'm getting to. Yeah. I remember vividly there's a there's a room here on campus that I used to I'm not sure if it's even still there. But I remember sitting in this chair that was bolted to the table. The table was bolted to the floor and it was in three layers.
Jared:So, you sat in a horseshoe, right? Which is pretty typical. But I remember thinking even then, this is back in 2001, I was like, man, there you literally are stuck in this spot. Sometimes literally stuck. Sometimes you are literally stuck in this spot.
Jared:Sometimes the hinges wouldn't move nearly as much as on the chairs. But I'm like, everyone is facing one thing. It's the podium up front where the instructor is. So, one of the things is having furniture and layout and that can be easily rearranged for different things. And also along with that, along with these design principles, the furniture, but also the technology that's in there.
Jared:Obviously, you can people have done collaboration for decades without current technology. It exists. You can still do it.
Rob:At least a whiteboard.
Jared:At least a whiteboard or Post-It notes could you can very well just stick Post it notes on a wall and do collaboration.
Jared:But current technology definitely helps with that. Interactive whiteboards, laptops, WiFI , power outlets, something people never think about, or the power outlets that people need sometimes for that as well. You also have to consider your students, you know, comfortable seating if you want them to be able to move around, make sure that the furniture actually is comfortable to sit in and not like, well, this is ridiculous. I'm not gonna just so you're having me sit in this chair, then you want me to move somewhere else in that same chair and my legs are killing me in this thing or I'm I'm over six feet tall. So sometimes these desks that you're wanting me sitting on, I'm like, I don't wanna sit in.
Rob:You're talking about those ones that you have to slide into
Jared:the next slide in ones? Yeah. Those are always great. But also students with, you know, accessibility as far as disabilities and stuff like that as well. Another part of it is the visibility and acoustics of it.
Jared:So when, when students and instructors can see, this seems like it's self explanatory, but you won't be able to see and hear your
Rob:So good lighting.
Jared:Good lighting is If if you don't have, natural lighting, make sure that it's it seems so make sure your room is well lit. You know what I mean? I mean, I feel like this is these are the fundamental design principles of this. But but also something that they don't consider a lot is is is soundproofing. When you have an active learning space, you've got things that are on wheels.
Jared:Well, things work better on wheels when you have a hard surface to put them on. But sometimes with that hard surface comes a lot of reverb in the room.
Jared:And Mr. L will account that the most important thing is getting rid of those standing waves that exist in corners of these rooms because that that's a distraction to the ear, and you can't focus on your subject. So make sure you find ways
Rob:Mhmm.
Jared:Of fixing the acoustics of your room. So those are your fundamental design principles. You know what? What about necessary considerations? Well, Rob McDole?
Rob:Well, I'm so glad you asked, Jared. Oh, good. It kinda goes along with flexibility and adaptability, and it it really goes to considering the needs of our students. And we've talked about some of those things already, But I think one of the things that I think about you talked about visibility, but but lighting. I think lighting is so important.
Rob:Mhmm. Being able to have lighting that is is activating the brain so we know the different wavelengths of light do different things.
Jared:Different colors of light.
Rob:And I and and I think we also know that daylight, God's light from the sun, if I may, really is what we're designed for. And we know that people who live in dark places end up with what's called seasonal affective disorder. A lot of a lot of folks do. So just having natural lighting, if at all possible, you need to consider those things if you want your students to perform well. It's amazing if you walk into a room and you're going to be teaching in that room and you look at the lighting and if you feel sleepy, maybe you should think about putting in a work order or talking with some about getting different color lights Yeah.
Rob:Put in the room.
Jared:If you can't do that, at least take that in consideration when you're teaching your course.
Rob:Or get one of those big sunlight lamps and put it over the front. No. I'm talking
Jared:The giant halogen lamp just ping.
Rob:Yeah. But there are simple things that you can do, and and and and that you you just need to think of your learner's needs. And sometimes just taking kids outside for five, ten minutes.
Jared:Yeah.
Rob:You know?
Rob:I know that sounds it sounds more like kindergarten. Right? Time to go out to recess. But but, no, seriously, I think instructors and students all like to go outside when it's really nice here at at Cedarville. We see a lot of
Jared:It happens all the time.
Rob:We see a lot of classes go outside because people enjoy the light. The other considerations when you're talking about designing these active learning spaces, obviously, is budget and resources.
Jared:That's so boring.
Rob:I know, but it's it is a limiting factor
Jared:Yeah, I know.
Rob:Obviously. And that's kinda what we're talking about is some of these things that are are that will limit you.
Jared:Yeah.
Rob:And and you just have to take those into consideration.
Rob:You may not have a budget. You know, you may have to be creative
Jared:Yeah.
Rob:With what what you can do. If you are in that classroom that we talked about a little bit ago where the seat is bolted to the desk, which is bolted to the ground. And, you know, you want your students to do collaboration. You gotta think ahead. You gotta think ahead and figure out how do I do collaboration in this room.
Rob:Well, maybe you just make them stand up and go to corners or sit in the floor up in the front. You just you need to think about those things ahead of time, you know, just to think, oh, collaboration. We'll do collaboration in this room. I think you can make those things happen, but it it takes a little bit more
Jared:Yeah.
Rob:Concerns about resources.
Rob:And then sometimes you can just go ask. If you don't like your room and it doesn't work, there might be an option, but you won't know unless you ask.
Jared:Yeah.
Rob:So thinking about those budgets and resources, talking to those that that, you know, prioritize those needs based on your course and based on what what you're trying to accomplish, I think, is is necessary. Obviously, sustainability, can we do this long term?
Jared:Yeah.
Rob:You know, it's great if you've got fancy stuff in the room, all the latest equipment.
Jared:Right.
Rob:But if it's not going to last when you've
Jared:Yeah.
Jared:What's the shelf life on that SMART Board that you're using? Or Or our Owls. Yeah. That's a great example. We should talk about that a little bit.
Rob:So when we switched in COVID, right, and everybody went home
Jared:Mhmm.
Rob:One of the things that we found were the the Owl 360 cameras.
Jared:Mhmm.
Rob:And that allowed us and allowed many instructors to to, you know, pivot and do so really well. Well, the problem was they really weren't designed for classroom use. They were designed for small, you know, conference room use.
Jared:Right.
Rob:And they weren't expecting kids to knock the things over. Or or for that matter, for faculty to take them who didn't like them and place them down on the floor where they get kicked or knocked around or you know? And so we ended up with I think right now, I talked to IT. There's, like, 30 some broken
Jared:Wow.
Rob:Owls, and we can't replace those.
Rob:So sustainability with buying those, you know, looking back, well, maybe we should have thought about something different, but it did perform what it needed to for the task that we had. And there are still some that are being used today, but, obviously, they didn't they didn't last. And I know you talk to your physical plant people, talk to your professionals in these areas, wherever it is. They know the stuff that works and how it holds up over time, the furniture that's going to work, you know, past a semester or two. You want it to last a little bit longer.
Rob:So Yeah. That's one. Obviously, safety, comfort, we you talked about that a little bit.
Jared:Mhmm.
Rob:It needs to meet safety standards.
Rob:It needs to, you know, don't have what do you call those things? The plugs that people like, the household extension cords, you know, the brown ones that have, like, four on one end. Yeah. Please, please, please, please, please don't bring those in. Or for that matter, you know, have your own surge protectors sticking out of walls, tripping hazards, those kinds of things.
Jared:You're saying I can't, like, daisy chain a bunch together.
Rob:Don't think, yeah. Don't do that. Okay. I think we'd actually
Jared:This goes back to my first point about outlets. We need lots of outlets.
Rob:Those need to be thought of. If you're designing a room and you get the chance to have input, yes. Please do that. If you gotta deal with these other things, then you just you have to realize that these limitations and considerations
Jared:Yeah.
Rob:Especially with accessibility as well.
Rob:Yeah. You can't have this great idea for collaboration. Right? And totally not pay attention to someone who has a disability of some sort Yeah. And not prepare for that.
Rob:Yeah. We could spend a lot of time on that. I don't think there's a need to, but we need to make sure that all students can access the space that we're using.
Jared:Right.
Rob:I think those are the major ones that I can think of.
Rob:Can you think of any other necessary considerations as we're designing? I mean, we've talked about safety, we've talked about accessibility, obviously budget. I think time is one that kinda is implicit that we haven't really
Jared:Explain.
Rob:Well, you only have so much time in an area. And depending on the building, you may also be limited by time, how much time you can actually spend in an area. So for instance, if you really love collaboration spaces, probably one of the best ones we already know about here, like on campus is a library. Yeah. But the time that you get to use it or that you might be able to use it with your class is is probably fairly limited because reality is there's tons of people already using it.
Rob:So, you know, it goes kinda back to resources probably.
Jared:Sure.
Rob:Why don't we, transition now to best practices?
Jared:Yeah. Best practices. So based on what we've talked about, I mean, the first thing is modular furniture. So lightweight, movable furniture, but also sustainable, which is kind of a weird in between there because you can have something that's it's almost like that triangle where it's like you can have two of these, which is lightweight, movable, and sustainable. You can only have two of them.
Jared:Which one do you want kind of a thing? So but I think there is a so you gotta play that game a little bit to figure out
Rob:Like cheap, good, and fast?
Jared:Yeah. Cheap, good, and fast. It's it's the thing. You can have two. You can't have all three.
Jared:Right? Yeah. I feel like that's the same thing with modular furniture sometimes is that, yes, this can move and it's light, but if you put anything over 200 pounds on it, it's going to break in half kind of a thing.
Rob:So don't don't get flat pack furniture for your classroom?
Jared:Is that just something? Something else is, this is great because we we just came back from a center for teaching and learning, I don't what you would call it, festival or a meeting with other CTLs in
Rob:the
Jared:in the immediate area.
Rob:In Columbus.
Jared:Yes. And the the the room that they sat us in had these incredible collaborative workstations Right. Where we were I'm gonna I took a picture of it, and I think we should put it in the description so people can see it. But it had these tables and then it had a computer, on the end with a, what looked like an interactive smart board. Right.
Jared:Which had a webcam on it as well. So there was maybe 15 of those broken up. It was completely open space.
Rob:Could handle about nine people, right?
Jared:Yeah, it was roughly
Rob:Nine to 12, somewhere
Jared:in there? Yeah, something like that. And at the front of the room, the instructor had all these controls where they could control what was coming up on the screens. Like when we were there, the, slide presentation that the speaker was doing was also mirrored onto ours. But there was a way we couldn't figure it out because we didn't wanna break anything.
Jared:They could swap out what was on those displays. I think there was also a way of turning on those webcams to have collaboration or conferences with others, either outside or inside of the room they're in. So, like, collaborative workstations like that, that's an example of something that you could use to have your students break into small groups. Now obviously, there are some disadvantages of those because if they're sitting around the table, half of them are not facing you. So you have to keep that in mind.
Jared:You've got the majority of the not the majority, but a percentage of the class is going to be facing away from you as you lecture up front. So but stuff like that.
Rob:And I think that's the key is these these designs are probably not if you're just intending to do straight lecture the entire time, these designs are not for you.
Jared:That's true.
Rob:They're collaborative in nature. I mean, again, I go back to this idea. I think when we talk about active learning, at least as far as I'm concerned, is getting the most effective learning out of the environment and out of the opportunity, the educational opportunity that you can.
Jared:Yeah.
Rob:That could mean lecture, but oftentimes it means a back and forth. It's that feedback loop, making sure you've got this intake, reflection, synthesis, this analysis and synthesis loop. And you go through that loop as many times as you possibly can. And we know that we do that through collaboration, much like you and I do back and forth when we have conversations. I offer something up, and your discerning mind says that's dumb.
Rob:You know? Or you say, wow. That's great. And so It
Jared:it for full disclosure, it happens more often than I say, wow. That's great.
Rob:I appreciate that.
Jared:Yeah. You're welcome.
Rob:I wasn't trying
Jared:to Sometimes it's a humor you, but most of time, it's genuine.
Rob:You know, and this goes into and you were talking about it, collaboration, the technology having technology rich environments. But it's not just technology for technology's sake. It's having technology that will actually undergird the process that you're trying to accomplish. It needs to be usable. If you spend five to ten minutes standing up there in front of everyone trying to figure out how to unmute your screen, you know, it could be because of the technology or it could be, you know, obviously you need to to make sure that you've practiced it.
Rob:We have faculty here who do a pretty good job of going in
Jared:Oh, yeah.
Rob:Making sure of that they can do exactly what they want it to do before any of the students get in there. Yeah. Now with that being said, we have technology failures all the time.
Jared:Mhmm.
Rob:It's going to happen.
Rob:So
Jared:The WiFi is not going to work all the time.
Rob:Have a plan b.
Rob:Yes.
Rob:Always be prepared. That's one of my best practices, I would say. Be ready when the technology fails.
Rob:Use the technology, but make sure that you can accomplish what you're trying to accomplish without it as much as possible. Yeah. And then then, you know, I think there are proper boundaries for inside of a learning space. And and I think you can create those with your furniture. I think you can especially if you have a modular design, you can you've got a lot more flexibility.
Rob:But when you don't have that flexibility, you need to be more precise about where you're gonna have collaboration. Like I said earlier, right, if you're gonna do this in one of those fixed rooms where you can't unbolt anything
Jared:Right. Yeah.
Rob:Then I think you've gotta think a little bit more strategically about areas of the room where you can have students gather, where you can try to minimize the the design of the room that's gonna keep you from having the kind of collaboration that you want. And you're gonna need to set up those boundaries with the students early on so that they understand those areas. So things like, okay, here's where we're gonna have a discussion. This is where we'll do discussion groups. You'll be in this corner, this corner.
Rob:Yes. You're gonna have to stand, but it's only gonna be for a certain period of time. You know? Does that make sense?
Jared:Yeah. I'm just trying to think of it practically from a higher ed instructor perspective. Like, are you expecting me to go in early and put signs up and say, discussion's happening here, collaboration's happening here.
Rob:Well, I think you could do at least a slide. Okay. You know? It's think of it like think of it like an an exit panel or exit placard
Jared:Yeah.
Rob:In in rooms for showing you where you're at
Jared:Mhmm.
Rob:And how to get out in case of a fire.
Jared:Right.
Rob:Not that anybody ever looks at those, but the reality is they can be quite helpful. It's just a matter of putting that up. I was in a a mixer at a conference here recently, and one of the things the presenter did, which actually happened to be a faculty member from here at Cedarville. Oh, cool. And she put this thing up.
Rob:I'm not gonna say her name because I didn't get her permission to say her name ahead of time.
Jared:Fair enough.
Rob:But she put a slide up and she basically showed the outline of the room and the tables and how everything was and she had it numbered. And that way you could understand where you needed to go with the slip of paper that, you know, you had that said, okay, you need to mix with all these different people. So I think it's that kind of thing that we're talking about is defining, you know, being able to put meta, if I will.
Jared:Yeah.
Rob:If you will. Meta boundaries.
Jared:It also helps develop a room. Routines and stuff for students.
Rob:Exactly. Which is very helpful.
Jared:Here's my big takeaway with this though. And I wanna ask some people that we come up because we're gonna talk with some people that either help design or are teaching in active learning spaces. Jim Stephenson's coming on.
Rob:Right.
Jared:Dr. Jody Penrod, we've had on before.
Jared:Other people are going to come on and talk about these active learning spaces. But here's the question that it's also guiding me through these discussions we're having with these people. Is it possible to do active learning without these design spaces that we just talked about? So that's my big question. How much of it is there a sliding scale between instructor and space?
Jared:How much does the space influence the active learning? How much is the instructor like, is or is it straight down the middle? Do you can or can you, as an instructor, develop an active learning environment without the cool technology and the smart boards and stuff.
Rob:I would say yes.
Jared:Here here's the story that I use to talk about this. So I was in the market for a new guitar. This was like 2006 or whatever because my parents bought me a real cheap guitar when I was in high school and my mom after I got married said, I'm gonna buy you an actual guitar. So I want you to go and do your research. She said, it it's a blank check.
Jared:Whatever you want is fine. Woah. So I had my eyes on this Fender Stratocaster that was an American Deluxe. It had two single coils and then a humbucker in the tail. And it was like, this is the coolest thing.
Jared:It had a red body, black pickguard, and it had a five way switch on it. It was the cool it was I would never have to buy another guitar after this. So I'd go up to Guitar Center, which is a story in itself. Guitar Center is its own world, I feel like.
Rob:Yes.
Jared:So I'd go up and I'd play this thing because they had one in stock. It wasn't the color that I wanted, but it was the same thing.
Rob:Did it have a humbucker?
Jared:It did have a humbucker. Yes. It had one on the tailpiece, which by the way, you don't know, it's two single coils wrapped together so that the is bucked. You don't hear the if you do a single coil.
Rob:Uh-huh.
Jared:But I would go up and play it and the guy, he see me come up several times and finally he sat down and said, you know what? You could play anything you wanted to out of this guitar. You could also play anything you wanted to out of that $300 guitar or that $150 guitar that's over there in the rack. He goes, it's not necessarily about the tool, it's how you use it.
Rob:Right.
Jared:And I was like, wow, that's really deep. It's like, okay, then I guess I won't buy this. And then he proceeded to try to sell me the $1,200 guitar. And I was like, nah, I'm good right now. He's like, I've, you know, But I I think about that a lot when I think about this series.
Jared:I'm like, you know, Eddie Van Halen and a $100 guitar is gonna sound so much better than anyone who picks up a $1,200 guitar. You know what I mean? Oh, yeah. It does it's not nearly the tool, it's the person that's using the tool. So how much to me, this is something I'm thinking about as I go through this, how much of it is the instructor vs. the space you put them in or the technology you give them.
Rob:Right. I think it comes down to at some point and you use music, so it's something I'm also acquainted with myself, having played trumpet since I was, you know, in second grade up through high school, and then I quit.
Jared:Mhmm.
Rob:But I got to a point where my music teacher said, you've played past this trumpet. You've got to get a professional trumpet.
Jared:Oh, wow.
Rob:You know, and that was in eighth grade.
Jared:Wow.
Rob:There is a difference. So there's a certain point at which you get really good with anything where quality of what you have is you can you can access it, you can use it where others may not.
Rob:And I'd say there's probably one of those lines as well when it comes to classroom modularity, those kinds of things. For most folks, it's probably they can probably do just fine in a room that's not fully decked out. You've got to be able to to have all of that, I think, before. In other words, if you come to it and you you don't have those leanings, you're not thinking about design, you're not thinking about collaboration, you're not really trying to push those envelopes, you're just gonna deal with the room that you've got and that's just all you've got, and then, yeah, you can still have active learning take place. Yeah.
Rob:You really can.
Jared:That that that's what I'm trying to explore with this and and come back to. And I plan on asking all of our guests that as well.
Rob:And I guess that's probably what we're talking about. And I I I'm I'm not trying to create some sort of, like, hierarchy here where people think I'm a, you know, saying that there are those who are rock stars out there who can really use a room. But I think it's just like anything else. Those who are professional with a tool, yes, they can use a cheap guitar and make it sound great. Yeah.
Rob:But they can take a phenomenal quality guitar and make it sound like something out of this world.
Jared:Yep. Right.
Rob:You know?
Jared:Right.
Rob:And you're right. It comes down to the the person wielding the tool. And and all we're talking about here with these spaces is maybe there's like a bottom line, which would be nice. I think we're saying we're essentially saying this would be nice if you think about these things. If you have an opportunity to ever speak into the design of a room or think through the design of a room, here's some of the things you should consider.
Rob:And I think that's really all we're we're talking about.
Jared:Maybe that's something we can revisit at the end of the series too.
Rob:Yeah. Because we're not saying if you don't have this, then you're just terrible and there's no way active learning could happen. And that because that's just not the case.
Jared:Right. Right.
Rob:I don't want our listeners to feel like because I think it really comes down to your creativity. It comes down to your willingness to try, you know? Yeah. And all we're trying to do is provide some here's some things to think about.
Jared:So that's gonna do it for this episode of the Transform Your Teaching Podcast. If you have any questions, please email us at CTLPodcastcedarville.edu Be sure to also check out our blog at cedarville.edu/focusblog, and be sure to like and subscribe on your favorite podcast platforms. Thanks for listening.