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Regenerative by Design Podcast where we get to the root of health, climate, economics and food. Host, Joni Kindwall-Moore, is an RN, an Ethnobotanist and the founder of Snacktivist Foods. Join us on this journey as we explore the ideas, stories and personalities behind the regenerative food system movement including climate change, human health, economics and food as well as other deeply interconnected topics.
In this podcast, we will be “going there” and leaning into topics that might make you squirm… just a little. We want to challenge ourselves to think outside of the box and to discover the deeper side of our world’s problems so that we can better understand how to solve them.
We aim to unpack some of the most dynamic issues of our day with some of the most inspiring minds who are pushing the boundaries of our current norms and thinking paradigms.
We have seen incredibly disruptive events in the past few years like pandemics, climate events, disasters and war. These often trigger system changes that are reactionary and have short term gains. When these are practiced over the long term, they often have a degenerative effect on health and the environment.
Regenerative design thinking is the opposite, and is an intentional, premeditated process that involves a high level of observation, analysis, creativity, and looking beyond reductionistic principles while embracing systems thinking and additionality to create regenerative solutions.
Regenerative agriculture has become a powerful force for positive transformation and hope in todays world. And no discussion about agriculture is complete without a conversation about food.
Food is the connection between people and the planet so grab a cup of coffee or your favorite running shoes and get ready to take a mental and philosophical leap into the future of food and our planet.
Hello everyone, you are
listening to the regenerative by
design podcast where we will be
getting to the root of health,
climate, economics and food. I
am your host, Joanie Kenmore.
Join me on this journey as we
explore the stories of
individuals and organizations
who are working to realign our
food system with both human
health and the health of our
planet. So
good morning, everybody and
welcome to the regenerative by
design Podcast. I'm Joanie, your
host. And today we have two
fantastic guests that I've
wanted to interview since I
first started even thinking
about having a podcast. We have
DAX Hanson and Yachty Wang of
the incredible urban farms
project down in Arizona. Not
only are they farmers, but their
food innovators and
entrepreneurs, and truly leading
the way of a new way of thinking
about food and agriculture in
the desert. So welcome, guys.
Thanks for having us, Johnny.
Thank you.
Yeah, I'm so stoked that you're
both here, because I'm familiar
with your stories. And they're
actually really incredible. I'm
so lucky to know many people
across the food and agriculture
space. And I feel like everybody
has a really neat reason or why
that they do what they do. But I
think in your two cases, you
have uniquely distinctive
stories. And I'd like you to
just take a minute to talk about
what your background is, and why
you're working at Oatman farms
today and what your role is
there. So DAX, let's kick off
with you.
So that's handsome, I'm the tone
of oatman flats, ranch and open
farms with my wife, Leslie. And,
Josh, I mean, how they're
described myself, I come from
farming and ranching roots. I'm
an Arizona kid, but I've spent
most of my professional life on
Bainbridge Island and in
Seattle, up in Washington state,
even though come from farming
and ranching roots, my dad
encouraged all of the kids to
become doctors and lawyers and
teachers. So I decided to become
the lawyer. And I've spent most
of my career as a technology
lawyer focused on financial
services, technology, and
digital asset. So I've been
paving the way for a new world,
in, in FinTech in in blockchain
for for many years. And I live
been living with my wife and
kids up on Bainbridge Island
outside of Seattle. But about
six years ago, my aunts and
uncles were at the point where
they were going to sell the
farm, the farm down in Arizona,
because it had been degraded. So
significantly from climate
change, and it was too expensive
to farm. And I caught wind of
that back, they're going to sell
it. And so I asked them to sell
it to me instead of selling to a
third party. And so my wife and
I started our journey, to try to
take an amazing historical piece
of property that has so much of
a legacy associated with it, and
trying to breathe new life back
into it. And so my effort has
been to conserve the land and
the ecosystem around it. I can
remember what it was like when I
was a candidate, that I wanted
it to achieve that, at least
that type of approximate that
status again, and the vehicle
for doing that is regenerative
agriculture. So I know Joni was
looking at your background and
your I looked at the ethnobotany
of Indus discovered that we have
a lot more tools than I thought
we did in the southwest things
that have been domesticated for
hundreds of years that we really
hadn't been growing. And so I
found white or wheat. And we
decided to plant that and some
other small grains in and use
that as the initial vehicle for
restoring the lane on and
actually building a business
that could support the farm. And
that's yeah, into Oatman farms,
the food company where we sell
pancake and waffle mixes,
sourdough bread mixes, a vanilla
extract with the spirit is made
out of the heirloom white store
wheat and other products, baked
products and just some flour. So
that's what we do. And we're
we're hard charging. And we're
seeing a lot of the results
after a lot of success in terms
of the Regeneration which I'm
happy to talk about with you
today. Amazing.
Yeah, decks Do you think that
the fact that you have, you
know, one foot plus firmly
rooted in a very disruptive tech
space, um, gives you a different
perspective on how to approach
management just because you're
always thinking outside of the
box and kind of a rule We'll
breaker or at least working with
a group of rural bakers over in
the blockchain FinTech world. Do
you think that fuels you to
challenge norms?
Oh, absolutely. I mean that I've
been working all of my
professional career with people
who are trying to change the
status quo. And we've been
successful, I've helped them get
there to do it in a way that
complies with the law, but also
develops new laws. And that
brings together disparate parts
of industries together to
collaborate. And so I think it's
that problem solving capability
that I've developed and the fact
that like, you can always get to
a yes, you can, you can find a
way to innovate almost any
problem that I thought, wow,
like, there's something here. So
now when people ask, what's the
next big thing after Bitcoin? I
tell them, It's regenerative
agriculture. I mean, I actually
really do believe it. And I
believe that because I've been
able to identify trends early
on, I've been successful with
them. Before that, I can see
that there really is something
here and regenerative
agriculture, we're talking to be
called regenerative agriculture
in the future, it's just gonna
be called agriculture. It's like
to be called Regeneron. Right?
Foods just can be called food,
right? Because the rest of the
practices are used to grow food
are going to fail. And we're
going to have one solid process
your froze.
I love it. That is fantastic.
Now, how did you and Yanni first
become acquainted because and
then I'd love for Yanni to share
a bit about his past because it
is a fantastic story as well,
you know, so he got he's been
working with me for three years
already, maybe a little bit
more. So about a half year or
using half year so. So my wife
Leslie, and I've been at this
for called six years, almost six
years. And so for the first
time, we just had to work with
I'll call it traditional farmers
down in our area, traditional
farm manager who helped us kind
of recapture the land like it
had been so far abandoned, you
know, there are trees in the
field, the ditches were cracked
and filled up with sand. The
house had been completely
obliterated animals are living
inside of it, right. And so we
just needed some muscle to
gently recapture the farm and
build the infrastructure. So I
had a farm manager will brandy
who was amazing, was from the
region, he helped me do that we
had some farm output, it was
just like brute strength. And we
got our first crop in harvested
our first crop of wheat. But
because we're starting from
scratch, it was even though it
was organic, a lot of our
practices were kind of mimicking
what would be a kind of
traditional conventional farming
practice, because we were
ripping and we were kind of
starting with bare ground. But
we harvested some crops. And
then after we sort of got that
under control, we'll needed to
move on to another project. So I
got in another farm manager.
This time I decided to try to
find somebody who was more of an
environmental scientist,
aerialist Jay who helped us for
about a year. And then for
personal reasons he needed to
move on. And so I asked him who
he knew in his sphere. And he
knew this guy named Yachty Wong.
So he connected us up. least
from my perspective, I talked to
Yachty his wife drove out to the
farm, saw what we're up to. And
then Yachty and I talked, I
think it was that night, or the
next night for like three hours
about our philosophical approach
to farming and what we're trying
to do and, and Indiana, he ended
up telling me he wasn't going to
take this job, he was going to
go take another job. But within
about three weeks, he called me
back and said, I just can't get
open. Last rant out of my head.
I gotta come work with you. So
we've been at it ever since it's
been a really good partnership.
But we'll we'll talk a little
bit more about how we divide and
conquer. You know the effort but
but that's how I met you. It was
really through my former farm
manager who was plugged in at
the University of Arizona
Environmental Science Program.
Yeah. And then you're you were
finishing up your Ph. D. which
is so cool in itself, we can
have a whole show just talking
about your your background and
ethos and how you approach
farming. But what brought you to
Arizona in the first place, I
mean, you're you have a
fantastic story. So please take
a moment to tell our listeners.
Well,
thanks. So
let's do a abbreviated version I
kept thinking about these myself
is because I never really
planned my life. Just let it go
with the flow and figure it out.
You know what I want to do next
and then just figure out okay,
that's the location. Regardless,
I've been where I've not been
and I always want to take
Chance, which my family have
giving up on me on that
perspective, because everything
I'm trying to do is give me a
chance. But in reality, my
family with a trip as a
traditional Chinese mindset,
they always want me to be
footing the ground be stepping
forward at one step at a time
and focus on what I can
accomplish sequentially. So
that's in the logical approach.
I'm very grateful for my
reckless decision for my life so
far.
And I do.
In the past particular, half
year to a year during this
period of time, I recognized
that I was, I almost lost myself
if I'd never stepped onto the
land, because I left China and
left the wild in the most
richest the history of humankind
was 9000 years history of lost
my culture and integrity to how
to actually grow food, food as
medicine, how to actually take
him out of the task and be a
pass through person to carry out
for my assistants will to
pushing them to the next
generation before I go peace
out. I lost those all bookings.
So really, coming back because
of a Farber and with the land,
as I call that, in the personal
journey has saved my life saved
my soul, saved my view on what
life is how beautiful it is.
Because prior to that, I was a
financial portfolio. I had my
own startup in China was very
well off and before I decided to
sell everything and get two
suitcases come here to the US,
because I had a walkout
situation to play NCAA Division
two basketball, I took a chance
but man or family were bad.
Like, you didn't even speak
English what our child to do.
And I said, Well, we never know
it you never tried. It ended my
17 year old athletic career with
finishing triathlon at the
University of Arizona was a
chemical process engineer why
got here and elbows into
industry to develop solar fuel
renewable energy. And then met
my wife through a program to
trace her back to Indiana
recognize her family or from
generational farming family, her
dad was a sixth generation, I
decided to stay here in the US
quit the program about I got
accepted near Switzerland, and
asked my previous adviser at a
university said, can you guys
find me a job. So then they gave
me a PhD position at the
University of Arizona. So study
soil water science, watershed
management, and that's how my
relationship with soil water
beds life started, is everything
doesn't seem to have a platter,
but I think something or
somebody, maybe my ancestors,
were guiding me to go through a
route to that, to help me
recover everything that I
potentially could have lost us.
So I personally appreciate all
those things. Appreciate the
life appreciate everything that
happened, he held the land, the
life, I'll be back, that's
actually perspective, I think
it's really, really build who I
am and who I was and how my
culture was. No.
Well, I love how you're very
conscientious about blending
that instinct and listening to
like the voices of the past like
the ancestors and combining it
with like modern rigor and you
know, because you have really a
collision of both worlds both
you and DAX and I think that
that makes you both very
fascinating people that you
know, you've got one foot in
this very modern culture and
then the other foot in literally
in the soil and working to
regenerate a legacy farm it is,
it is fantastic. So how do you
guys make this work together
with your management? Well,
I'll just say like regenerative
agriculture is not for sissies,
right? I mean, like, like, this
is tough work, especially down
in the desert. I like to joke a
little bit my dad was a bull
writer. And so my version of
extreme sports is farming in the
desert, right. It's like, right
now like it's, you know, really,
yeah. 110 It's
an intense environment.
It's very intense, the most
intense environments, right?
And, and so look, I mean, the
reality is, it is because it is
fast then becoming a modern
Dustbowl down in that area.
We've lost most of this, we've
broken cycles, and we've broken
most of the systems. And most of
them, I just don't I mean, it's
not an exaggeration, right? And
yeah. And so we, in this, even
though regenerative agriculture
has these indigenous roots to
it, right like that. We've
forgotten a lot about how once
did farm in that area, right.
And we're taking a farm that had
been once farmed, indigenously
farmed, and really degraded over
time. I mean, like, hindsight is
2020, you can look back and see,
wow, like, we really did start
to destroy it. You might have
tried to farm it conventionally
with with modern practices. And
then we just end up where we
already here. Right? So the
question is, like, Well, how do
you rebuild it. And so, I mean,
where I start, first of all, is
that nobody has the code here. I
mean, Yachty, and I are probably
the closest to figuring it out
of anybody in in the desert. But
like, it is tough. It's, it's
unpredictable. And so even
though Yachty and I are both
pretty smart in our own ways, we
really have to be aligned, we
got to push each other to
question each other, we got to
bring in other help from other
experts. We've got some great on
farm support. I mean, it doesn't
live with the farm. I don't live
with the farm full time, either.
And so we have to trust our farm
on site farm manager, Carlos to
take care of a lot of the day to
day. But I guess, the way I
think about it is that Yachty
and I are both trying to keep
the car inside the lines in the
den, that takes us a lot of time
to just, you know, consider that
every day, right? And we're
constantly making making
gyrations. Yachty is the
scientist, but I'm the
businessman, right? Like I'm
funding my wife lately. And so
there is this tension, about
looking like what is what's very
best for the soil and the water.
But there's also the
practicality and if we don't
grow something on this ground,
we don't make any money or in
business. Right? And so yeah,
yeah, yeah, it comes from a
socialist communist background
area of China. I'm very much a
capitalist, right? We've been
finding our way through these,
like these political and
economic philosophies, frankly,
in terms of like, well, what is
the best way to care for the
land and for the people, but
we've come down to, together as
a team, and actually with my
wife, we've come out with some
core principles. And so people
who are curious about what we
really believe they go to open
farms.com and read about our
core beliefs, but we care about
things like community with a
really mean it, we care, I think
that food is medicine. And so
Yachty is responsible for making
sure that the farm does operate.
Well. Okay. You understand to
where other habits to have to be
a salesman, right out there to
help in an educator. And I'm
doing so but
true startup style, you do
everything, you know. And look,
I
I'm involved with a very, very
busy legal practice, right, like
I'm involved. Yeah, it's a
little bit nuts that I'm trying
to do farming in addition to the
legal career. It really is. But
it is so important to do it.
That, you know, we that I helped
set the strategy Yadi make sure
that the soil is healthy.
There's all sorts and there's a
lot of paperwork that we have to
do. Yachty is, is managing most
of the paperwork for things like
grant proposals and just
certifications. I read all that
yeah, a lot of work. Paperwork.
Yeah, but anyway, I'll let you
talk to you but like, like, I'm
not a passive owner Yadi and I
unless they were very much like
on the ground collaborating.
It's it hands on writing, and
fun. Were very hands on. Give me
your Yeah.
Yeah, because you really can't
do regenerative agriculture
without thinking through
regenerative business and we
generative governance, and it
actually is a full paradigm
shift. So you can't, you can't
just do business as usual
without thinking through like
that bigger systems level play.
And that does involve a lot of
things. So how do you how do you
how do you approach this? Well,
I'm gonna pick up one that's
talk about both of us trying to
keep the car in the lane. Yeah,
the whip round and keep the car
in the lane back to answer your
question with two wheels? Yeah.
Yeah, you know, it's, it's rare
for us. That's nice to have a
conversation with without diving
into some kind of arguments. I'd
say argument as you know, good
way, it's a long time people
argument is the bad way. But I
think there's a book called
thank you for arguing I read
through and as like, argument is
actually really good. It's like
the statement is like a
different approach. And then how
can you land respectfully, to be
able to adopt other people what
they believe in? will
compensate? How do you kind of
merge that together? And that,
the bloody fact that is probably
the best unique way, you know,
democratic way that we could
actually want something that
goes towards a better outcome?
Yes. Essentially, you know, I've
been working as an independent
contractor, as far as I know,
here, when I got here in the US.
And so I take other people's
interests very seriously. At the
same time, I take my principal
and philosophy very seriously,
as well. So and the partnership,
I think it come with a lot of
respect, or the respect of what
each other's unique value.
That's, I think that's an I
continue to work together and
try to figure it out how to make
those things happen.
Yeah, but you're advocating for
different sides of the system.
And so it's important to have
that healthy tension there. So
that way, it's not lopsided, I
mean, we do know that a lot of
what's driven our food and ag
system towards problematic norms
is just been solely focused on
efficiency, rather than
effectiveness, you know,
effectiveness being human health
outcome and planetary climate
environment. And in you, really,
it's hard as someone who runs a
business, I understand how hard
it is to look at the whole
system all the time, and not
just the p&l or just the sales
velocities, or just the supply
chain, or, in this case, just
the final outcomes, etc. And
that is, that's a difficult
balance, especially when you're
not just farming and selling
into the commodities market. You
guys are also running a food
brand, which is like a whole
nother layer as well to manage
it, let me say that it's all of
those things journey, but it's
also just like, decisions about
what's happening in the in the
soil. Right, right. Like, we
have invasive species, like
Bermuda grass out there, right,
a lot of it that interferes with
the crops. And then some of the
heirloom varieties are a little
bit more hearty, and they can
bite through, but that some of
the modern varieties don't.
Right. And so Yachty and I are
always trying to make decisions
about like, are we going to do
any tillage here? Right? Do we
bring the animals in how many
animals do we bring in? How
much? You know, biodiversity do
we bring onto the field? Which
varieties do we bring in all the
time. And so these are like it,
each one of our fields has a
different profile. And so we're
having to make decisions. And
that's what it really is reading
the tea leaves. It's like
looking into the future looking
backwards. I mean, I've been at
the farm, you know, for longer
than the Adi has been, and I
know what that ground was like
when I was a kid. Right? And so
yeah, so you got he's got a lot
of science and patent crown. And
he can see things that I can't
but but there's no no, that's
it's that we are, we're having
to make decisions about what to
do on the ground. Yeah, yes.
It's that level in addition to
well, which crops should we
grow? And which How much should
we market? And what's the market
right like which finished
products which value added
products should we create and
how do we sell them? And and
then you know, how much we focus
on wholesale distribution or
direct to consumer do we do
Farmers Market rarely do we all
have 24 hours in a day and by
the way, Yachty and I and my
wife Leslie and our whole team,
we We burn more hours than most
people probably would on this
right, like, module endeavor.
Like you're just out of hours.
And so like we're Yeah. And so
those are the things that we go
back and forth on and we're
trying to figure out the best
strategy. Sometimes it has been
for me, and sometimes I've been
writing and, and, but but that's
for me, that's it, we're
figuring it out. Our hope is
bigger. For right, like, we're
trying to make all the mistakes,
so that other people don't have
to. Yeah, yeah, cuz
it is such a unique environment.
And, you know, I always look at
the principles of regenerative
agriculture, like through this
lens that I call the three B's.
First one, being biomimicry and
being respectful and responsive
to the context of in which your
firm is like, whether that's
climate or soil type or access
to water, etc, etc. And you
guys, when it comes to the
biomimicry part, are in a very
unique situation? And I'm really
curious, like, how much water do
you guys have access to? What is
the actual rainfall there?
Versus like irrigation? And and
how many crops are you able to
grow? They're like how many
crops are in your rotation?
I think biomimicry is less
important for us versus
biodiversity. I would say that.
So currently, our marketable
crops are our area. That's where
we have been working with a lot
of chefs bakers, and not only
just on the local scale, and but
also across states at scale,
trying to figure out what are
those can bring those
nutritional value to people's
diet. And in terms of that
nutrition, which is really
coming from everything else, how
we facilitate on the land, not
just managing but facilitating a
man, we got to recognize the
biodiversity part is all the
other AIS is actually the
cohesive and the food chain
together within the soil
ecosystem or ecological system
as a whole. So, in terms of
that, we have covered crop right
now we have done quite a lot of
different extensive approach. We
have warm season summer crops
cover crop to kind of offset and
then rotate with our winter
wheat crop, which has up to 14
or 16 species on the land. And
we also try to relate cropping,
which is warm season plus cool
season when we have a rotational
grazing drought and get the land
to rest. That has been up to 33
species. what that's all about,
like him and I are closest to
figure this out. If you asked
me, every single time you asked
me, I will always shake my head.
No, I have no idea what I'm
doing. I'm still trying to
figure it out. Yeah, it's
certainly evolving a learning
curve. But what we know is the
biological succession is it
doesn't take one year or two
year it take probably software
work in order to bring some of
the species back on the land
that thriving as suppress those
things. Unwanted. Yeah, that is
based on microbiological, macro
biological approaches, through
this vegetation density planting
schedule. How do we facilitate?
Just want to come up with what
node is at this point that twice
part of the season he drew
Arizona, we got a low rainfall,
you know, running through
humidity in the aerobic
environment. Typically, this
landscape is seven to 10%. Wow.
Yeah, it's a lot of different.
We have size that to show why we
are different as we can see
dragonflies? Yeah, it's very
important as a super predator as
the bio indicator for the
humidity. And so I want to leave
that right there. The quality
the drives the environment, you
can see the dragon fly thriving
in the field that tells us
something that you can change
the system is not just mimicry.
It is the facilitation. Exactly.
Yes. And that leads us to the
other the other B's and the
three B's of regeneration. But
um, you know, it's we'll have
Alejandro Kareo on the show here
later this season. And, you
know, when you talk about
restoring small water cycles and
how intentional management
drives, you know, systems to be
restored in cycles to be
restored. And it's a it's a
fascinating thing, because
biodiversity is the second B and
then it focused on biological An
implementation of biological
screening the third. So those
three drivers work together to
restore cycles and restore, you
know, the more nature framework
in a cultivation system. So, I
think it's fascinating that you
guys even cycled through that
many, because a lot of the
farmers that I work with maybe
have like 12 different
rotations. You know, and they,
compared to their conventional
counterparts are extreme when it
comes to biodiversity, which
when you look at a national
system, I mean, it's a
fascinating thing. That's where
the biomimicry piece comes in is
when you're like, Okay, what is
the species density in this area
normal normally, you know, in
some areas, like in the tropics,
that's extremely high. You know,
if you go to the tundra in
Alaska, it's quite limited, you
know, in those kind of indices,
and where you try to find that
optimum sweet spot where you're
working with nature to optimize
that. regenerations. So I love
that you guys are really that
hardcore about it. It's amazing.
You briefly Joanie, like a
couple of just like stats,
right? Like the we actually, we
paused in this last month, to
catch our breath and to say,
Well, wait, what did we
accomplish in college? years?
Right? Like, what? If you're
going to measure it? What have
we done? And applying, you know,
some science to this, we
concluded that we have conserved
in our aquifer, over a billion
gallons, based on amazing what
normally would have been a lot
for conventional crops like
alfalfa, right? And corn, yes,
we've got the water infiltration
rate in the soil, like 50 times
faster. We're storing in the
soil, almost nine tonnes of co2
per acre. Right. We brought back
to the land that we've we've now
documented, like 90 Plus species
of plants and animals that
weren't there when we started,
right. Yeah, we've planted four
and 50 threes. We've planted
150, agave, you know, we've
harvested almost a million
pounds of regenerative organic
certified wheat, right, we've
built with a partner, really
cleaning grade storage facility.
Right. So we've accomplished
quite a bit. Yeah, a lot. With
it is a lot. And we're only
getting started right like that.
The speed at which the
improvements going to happen, I
think is is also accelerated.
Yeah.
Yeah. No, that's wonderful. And
as far as like, your outcomes
reporting, what do you guys do
as far as like? What are your
annual measurements? How do you
capture and communicate that
information to your
stakeholders, consumers,
partners, etc.
Honestly, that's what we are
much better at doing the work
than promoting and marketing to
people, right. But we have a lot
of people that come to the farm,
we have a lot of farm tours, we
bring a lot of people to to see
what we're doing. And in so
we're hoping that we can start
educating better, like, for
instance, like with this report,
we will publish this on our
website, and we'll put on our
social media, essentially, have
an open call to other people to
come scrutinize it, give us
feedback, and honestly, to ask
them to do the same thing.
Right, like, let's not just talk
in realities, let's actually put
our money where our mouth is,
and demonstrate that we can
achieve through our practices.
And if the farming practices
other people are not engaged in
our, our, they're engaging, if
those are destructive, or
they're not improving the land,
then I think there's to be a
real question, at least
consumers and chefs and others
should ask, which is where's the
food coming from? And what's the
impact that is being made
through their purchasing
decisions? Yeah, they
do have anything to add to that.
Here's my 15 seconds out of
eight or pitch to the customer
will buy our product. We grow
heirloom wheat, using no
chemicals, no synthetic
fertilizer, and no preservative
in any of our beta product. To
preserve the ecosystem in your
gut health, essentially, that's
what we're doing and
regenerative as a term organic
as a term. I've never heard of
Qi calm here to the US. And it
has been done for odor culture.
For a long, long time. It has
always been the way why goodwill
Hunka Mexico and when we talk
about organic they're square
from their head.
They want to go to a small
village in China go visit. And I
can see them going to the field.
And then here's what we're going
to cook for you today. They just
pick from their garden. And
yeah, back. So those are the
fundamental importance for us as
people who eat after recognize
is growing food is part of the
responsibility.
Yeah, you're part of the system.
Every time you eat, you're part
of the cycle. People forget that
part. It's really convenient to
forget. Now for those who are
listening, how can they find
your products and buy them and
use them at home? What's the
best
way? So we are in some local
stores in in Arizona, we are on
the menu at some restaurants,
some amazing restaurants like
Arizona wilderness brewery, you
can go taste the food there and
actually drink some of our
products there at Arizona
wilderness brewery, we've
partnered up with choppies, one
of the the leading Brooklyn,
delis in in Arizona been there
for a long time. They're one of
our bakery partners. You can
find our products at open
farms.com. And they, we did have
them accessible on other
platforms, national platforms
and some national grocery
chains. But we reached the
conclusion that at least with
where we're focused right now,
that that was actually maybe not
the highest priority that that,
like, I'm trying to get more of
the food dollar into the hands
of the farmers, right? Like the
the stats that I like to tell
people is that out of every
dollar that's spent on food,
about 78 cents goes back to the
farmer. Yeah. So in under those
conditions, we have degraded
landscapes and poor human
health. And so if we want to
change the dynamic, start by
getting more of the food dollar,
into the hands of the farmer.
And so we've tested some of
these other platforms. And, and
I really do have to build
bridges from where we are to
where we need to be. But a lot
of the existing infrastructure
does not help the farmer, maybe
they haven't science gets back
into the hands of the farmer.
And so we've we don't know
exactly what that model is gonna
look like. But back to the first
one's conversation about
building alternative systems.
We're trying to build on July
like our partnership with
Arizona wilderness brewery and
some other amazing chefs.
They're not charging us money to
get a product out there. Like
they're not Yeah, or cost of
goods, right? If people right,
so if it is the opposite
of CPG. And like broadline,
retail, you're paying to do
business. It's it's crazy. No
wonder that farmers and
everybody in the value chain
gets shortchanged, like the
economics are broken.
And CPG economics are broken.
That's a whole nother
conversation, but also just the
manufacturing process, right,
like dragging food across the
country, just because you try to
get to a certified facility like
that's, that's kind of going
backwards, honestly. And so
we're leaning into local system,
like we want to, we want to grow
a harvest, clean store, package
and distribute our food all
within a 50 mile radius like
that. That's our goal. Consumers
will make it available
nationally as well. But, but
honestly, people should be
buying products close to where
they live, meanwhile, construct
this distribution system. I
mean, honestly, just right now,
just just to grab it for just a
second. We've been trying for
like two weeks, just send some
wheat to our mill, milling
partner in Austin, Texas, the
logistics are so messed up, that
what should just be like a few
days of transportation take like
two weeks to get there. And
that's only right. So like, I
want to dial way back and have
it be more local. But we live
with 6 million people in
Phoenix, and a million or so. If
we need company, work in our own
community, then we need to keep
going back and improving the
products and improving the story
and the message rather than
trying to just go into some
national chain and expect that
they're going to help sell Yeah,
right. So so those are all
things that were evolving with
that Currently too, but, but
people could most readily find
us at omen farms.com Send us an
email eat fearlessly at don't
wind farms.com And we'll hook
them up. Eat fearlessly.
I love that. Well, on that note,
I think it's a great time to
wrap it up. I know our listeners
have learned a ton today, you
guys, I really have such a cool
story and are doing such
incredibly impactful work for
Regenerative food systems and
regenerative agriculture. And I
love that you're taking a
scientific approach. I mean,
it's just definitely takes it to
another level where we can learn
and quantify and scale faster
when we have that kind of
scientific rigor combined with,
you know, instinct and great
culture. So I'm just excited to
see where things go for wind
farms and the team and just keep
up the good work. Is there
anything you'd like to leave for
final closing for our listeners?
Well, I'd say just hashtag regem
works, you know, like, keep keep
adding, or any farmers, or
anybody in the value chain that
feels like this is the right
answer. But it feels hard. Don't
give up. We're growing in, in
numbers. I think regenerative is
something that people are
finally starting to understand.
They're looking forward to that
one of the fastest growing
labels in in grocery stores. So
it's hard. But it's supposed to
be hard, because we're, you
know, we're improving the land
so, so stay positive. Keep up
the good work.
I love it. Yeah. For me, as you
know, I always encourage people
to purchasing better product
that has no chemical that is
organic. That is a investment
for your own health portfolio.
Yeah. Wallet rather than vote
with your bullet. Yeah.
I agree. That's awesome. Well,
thank you so much, everybody for
listening. And I'm Joni, your
host. And if you'd like to learn
more about men farms, we'll make
sure we put some links. So you
can follow both DAX and Yachty
out there in the world of
LinkedIn or wherever they are.
And Oatman farms work as well.
So, thank you so much for
listening. And if you enjoyed
this session, please make sure
to share it with your friends.
When you're going to go pick up
some open farms. Delicious
pancake mix. All right, thank
you so much.
Thank you for having us.
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