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The greatest gift you can give your mentee is your time. Mentoring isn't about coming in, teaching somebody some life skills, and moving on. Mentees are not "projects". Mentoring is about relationships. It's about coming in, pouring your wisdom and knowledge into somebody, and continuing to guide them through the next stage of their life. While often that relationship is for a season, the impact of that relationship is for a lifetime; because relationships change lives. The time you spend with your mentee communicates so much more than a life skill or other piece of practical wisdom, and the best way to foster that is by making yourself available. This week, Michael Birkland joins Zach to talk through the power of saying yes to mentoring, how eating a meal together can change your mentoring relationship, and some practicals on how to make yourself available to listen.
Purchase John's Book:
Mephibosheth! The Search for Identity, Purpose, and Community
Purchase John's Book:
Mephibosheth! The Search for Identity, Purpose, and Community
Purchase the You Can Mentor book:
You Can Mentor: How to Impact Your Community, Fulfill the Great Commission, and Break Generational Curses
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Creators and Guests
What is You Can Mentor: A Christian Youth Mentoring Podcast?
You Can Mentor is a network that equips and encourages mentors and mentoring leaders through resources and relationships to love God, love others, and make disciples in their own community. We want to see Christian mentors thrive.
We want to hear from you! Send any mentoring questions to hello@youcanmentor.com, and we'll answer them on our podcast. We want to help you become the best possible mentor you can be. Also, if you are a mentoring organization, church, or non-profit, connect with us to join our mentoring network or to be spotlighted on our show.
Please find out more at www.youcanmentor.com or find us on social media. You will find more resources on our website to help equip and encourage mentors. We have downloadable resources, cohort opportunities, and an opportunity to build relationships with other Christian mentoring leaders.
You can mentor is a network that equips and encourages mentors and mentoring leaders to love God, love others, and make disciples in their own community. Learn more at you can mentor.com or follow us on social media. You can mentor. Why hello there, mentor. We here at You Can Mentor hope to add as much value as we can to mentors and mentoring organizations through resources and relationships.
Speaker 1:We have a bunch of resources that we've created to support you, such as books, learning lab cohorts, conferences, and online downloadable resources. Our goal is for you to use these resources yourself or to share them with your volunteers. The best way to get access to all of these resources is to sign up for our once a week newsletter. To do that, head on over to our website, you can mentor.com, and give us your info. Thanks so much.
Speaker 1:And remember, you can mentor. Welcome to the You Can Mentor podcast. This is your favorite host, Zach, and I'm here with my friend, Michael Burkland. Michael, say hello.
Speaker 2:Hey. How's it going, Zach?
Speaker 1:It's going great. So, Michael, tell me how how do we meet again?
Speaker 2:I think I think Caleb company was a connection Yes. Years ago.
Speaker 1:Yeah. So I have known Michael I mean, I I think I've known you for a decade now.
Speaker 2:Oh my gosh. It probably has been.
Speaker 1:Oh my gosh. We're so old. But me and Michael, we share the same mentor, Steve Allen, and we connected through a nonprofit disoperation school in Nashville, Tennessee. And Michael is doing some cool stuff in regards to mentoring. So we were talking last week, and and I just said, you know what, Michael?
Speaker 1:I think you've got something that you might be able to share with our audiences to help mentor. So here we are. We're doing it. We are. Amen.
Speaker 1:It's amazing. Michael, why don't you tell the audience about yourself, my friend?
Speaker 2:Oh, yes. Well, I'm in my forties. I'm just gonna lead with that just in case anyone's wondering. Yeah. It's it's been a it's been an amazing road.
Speaker 2:I guess I'd say I'm a bit of a pioneer spiritually in my family. I came to the Lord, I think, when I was in junior high, but we didn't go to church as a family. So I didn't really grow up with a very strong influence, but, you know, strong God uses little things. So, you know, we would say grace before meals and that sort of a thing, enough to to go off of and have a have a foundation. But, yeah, I just got serious about the Lord in in in college and had a passion for the arts and entertainment, and that's that's the field that I'm in.
Speaker 2:I'm a content creator, writer, producer. I'm a dad. I'm a husband. My wife and I have been married for 16 years, and I've got 3 kids, a son and 2 daughters. And we live in Nashville, Tennessee, and, yeah, that's that's is that enough?
Speaker 2:Do I need to tell more?
Speaker 1:No, man. I I I do just want the audience to know just give us, like, a 2 minute snippet of the fame that you received on the football field as a high school student?
Speaker 2:Oh, god. I just 2 minutes? Because I might I might need about 15. Let's see. How many honorable mentions did I get?
Speaker 2:At least 2. No. You know, I was an athlete growing up. That was, like, my identity. I was a football player, a wrestler, a basketball basketball player, and a baseball player, and youngest of 3.
Speaker 2:So I was always kind of the the annoying one that was trying to prove himself his whole life long. And so that that actually served me really, really good on the grid iron and on the wrestling mat and the baseball field. So I've loved sports. I I love sports. It's so much fun to play.
Speaker 2:And now I finally have a healthy relationship with sports, and I'm a little easier to play with, I think, than I used to be.
Speaker 1:Which if you guys are tuning in at home, which you all are, the thing about Michael is this. Michael's just kind of an all around, I'm good at kinda everything kinda guy. And so, I mean, he he's an athlete. He's good looking. He's creative.
Speaker 1:He's an excellent writer. Keep it coming. He's a musician. He can just kinda do everything. He is the quintessential cool kid.
Speaker 1:And so whenever I grew up, I wanna be like Michael Berkland.
Speaker 2:More a jack of all trades, master of none sort of a thing.
Speaker 1:Yeah. Oh, man.
Speaker 2:Good enough to get by.
Speaker 1:Yeah. Right? But yeah. But so why don't you just kinda share your mentoring relationship with Steve? Just kinda how how that happened and what that has meant to you.
Speaker 1:How has mentoring impacted your life?
Speaker 2:Oh goodness. It's funny that I mentored before knowing Steve. It was like DC and AD, honestly, because he put a whole new perspective on mentoring that I had never experienced before. I before Steve, I right before meeting, I knew Steve, but I wasn't being mentored by him. And prior like, the weeks months prior, I was just finding myself in a very difficult place in life, just, you know, hope deferred, things not going my way for, you know, a decade, and, a lot of disappointments.
Speaker 2:And fortuitously, he reached out to me after I had this kind of guttural intercession session with god crossing over the Mississippi River, you know, sort of a when god, why god moment, and and I was at my lowest. And, like, the next day, I get a text from Steve, just quip and essential Steve. Man of god, would you like to do some exchange coaching? Like, yes. Yes.
Speaker 2:I do, actually. I would love to. And, I definitely got the better end of that deal. And it that's what's it's when it started was probably 2020. So we're going on about to be 4 years now, and it's just totally changed my life.
Speaker 2:So we talk on a regular basis, and I'm sure as you've you've covered many, many times before, it's just been that consistency, a consistent voice that has really helped me make traction and progress in all the areas that I said that I care about. So that's kinda my high level 30,000 foot view of me and Steve, but I can go on for sure.
Speaker 1:So just super quickly, the fact that Steve pursued you Mhmm. At the time, I am sure that it didn't really mean a ton, but as you look back, what does his pursuit of you say about you and how kinda you see yourself?
Speaker 2:Oh, gosh. That's a great question, and I don't know if I have a quick answer for it. It's it's the role of a father, and the role that all of us need is is the role of a father, and that that voice is what we all need. And so I was finding myself in a time where I just needed the father's voice. I didn't it was I didn't have that.
Speaker 2:And so it definitely and and it made me feel like I was seen, that I was cared about. And you go through all the things that maybe I I don't know I don't know the mind of, say, an orphan, but, you know, you we we we hear this term orphan spirit and poverty spirit. And so I did, in those early days, definitely go through that season of self doubt. Like, you know, does he even really care about what I'm going through? Does he really wanna see me grow in these areas?
Speaker 2:And and it was that consistency that that won me over and made me realize, gosh. He must he must see something here. And yeah. So it totally changed. That was foundational.
Speaker 1:Yeah. I just think it's so crazy how so often the mentor can play the role of, well, if this is how my mentor sees me, then how much more does god? Right? And so what an what an awesome gift and opportunity we have as mentors to give our mentees that. And Absolutely.
Speaker 1:Man, we just kinda We struggled. Yeah. We just kinda hit the ground running there, didn't we, Michael?
Speaker 2:Oh, yeah. Absolutely. I thought you met with Steve. Yeah.
Speaker 1:Well, yes. Also that too. But, hey. You know, 2 of us didn't hop on this podcast to talk about Steve even though we could. We talked about your mentoring journey, my friend.
Speaker 1:So so yeah. So just take us back to young Michael in his twenties, just sunny California. Tell me how
Speaker 2:3 pounds lighter. Oh, I had long hair. It was down beyond my shoulders. It was wonderful.
Speaker 1:Oh my gosh. Tell me how you stumbled into this mentoring journey.
Speaker 2:It was actually totally accidental. It was actually almost coerced and forced. I was at the small church, and I was, like, one of the few people that went to this church and then one of the few young people that went to this church, and they needed some help with the youth ministry. And I I was I was approached, and there was almost like this expectation that, of course, you're gonna serve here, Michael, and I thought, hold the phone. No.
Speaker 2:No. I don't like high schoolers. So that's isn't that like a pre prerequisite? And so I was I was I was asked if I would serve and kind of on a weekly capacity teaching, Sunday morning services, and then when I'm not teaching, just kind of be in the background. And the the the need was so desperate that I said that I'd pray about it, and, but I didn't want to.
Speaker 2:And so I did pray, and nothing really changed. And the the need didn't change. They still needed somebody to help them. So I finally just said, okay. I'll do it.
Speaker 2:And there was a couple other people that that signed up for it as well, but they didn't last very long. And and I just knew that if I was gonna if I was gonna raise my hand, I was gonna see it through. And so I showed up one Sunday and had some message prepared, and I was teaching these kids, and I'm thinking, did any nobody vetted me. Like, I have no qualifications. I have no I could be anybody here, but they were so desperate.
Speaker 2:They just needed somebody to fill this role. And and so I taught, and in that little 25 minutes, I I just was I was shocked at what was happening in my heart. God deposited his passion for this next generation in that moment. And I was I just I wasn't the same after that Sunday morning. And I realized, oh, I could what do I do with this now?
Speaker 2:You know, he cares about these kids, and they seem to tolerate me. Maybe I need to take this a little bit more seriously. And so as that continued, I spotted a few guys, young guys high like, early high school that were sort of homeschooling before homeschooling was when it was still kinda weird. You know? And so they were doing the whole tutorial thing.
Speaker 2:I'd never heard of that before. And I realized these guys don't have any other friends. This is like Santa Monica, California. I need to connect these guys. So I just said, I'm gonna get these 3 guys together, on a weekly basis, and we're just gonna hang out.
Speaker 2:And and that was the first time that I actively started mentoring somebody.
Speaker 1:Is is there any more dangerous question than when someone asks you, hey. Do you think that you will do you think that you'll pray about doing this? And you're just like, oh, man. Like, now I'm on the hook.
Speaker 2:That's exactly right.
Speaker 1:Jeez. You guys made it spiritual, and so you, like, go into this prayer. You're like, alright, lord. I guess I'm gonna pray to you about doing this.
Speaker 2:Can you even say no to that question, though? I don't think you can say no.
Speaker 1:No. That is the that that is the catch. You can't say no? You can't say no. I won't pray about it?
Speaker 2:It's a golden question.
Speaker 1:It is. Yeah. That's awesome, man. So so tell me, put yourself in the shoes of those dudes that you asked, hey. Is it cool if we spend some more time together?
Speaker 2:I was young enough, and I don't know. Because it could sound creepy once some guys, like, wanting to spend time with you. And I I think I was aware of that, and so I, you know, I talked to the parents. But they were so 2 out of the 3 of them were so hungry for it that they they they were all in. They really, really wanted to to do this and to hang out.
Speaker 2:And the third one, not so much. He he I I wanted him to be more be there more than he wanted to be there. And so then it ended up being just kind of a very small group of the 3 of us. But they were excited. It's something that they look they said that they look forward to every week.
Speaker 2:And we tried to do it as often as as, you know, as weekly as possible. But, you know, life comes up and stuff.
Speaker 1:But I would pick them up. I'd because
Speaker 2:they couldn't drive, so they were probably, like, 10th graders. Pick them up, and then we'd go to Paco's Tacos in in the West LA and just eat. I'd eat a chimichanga every single time, a la carte, and they'd get mole sauce, like, just extra sides of mole sauce and one taco, and we'd just talk about about life. And I remember thinking, I need this to be more spiritual. Like, I need to do I need kind of that that that pressure of do I need to, like, qualify this or make this legit by us going through a book or us, you know, going through workbook book of the bible.
Speaker 2:And at the time, I was a part of a bible study that was really transforming my life. And we call it a bible study, but it was just a men's group. And it was rock rocking my world because these men would get together, and I was one of them, and we would just eat and we'd talk and share and then pray. And we always put somebody in the middle of the beanbag, and we would go around. And as the Lord led, we'd we'd pray for that person.
Speaker 2:And that unstructured but consistent time I mean, it had a structure, but it wasn't kinda what you think of when you think Bible study. That was rocking my world so much that I realized I I wanna kinda replicate that in a high school way. I I I don't want to these kids the relationship with adults is pretty one-sided. You know? When you're a kid, you get talked at.
Speaker 2:You are taught in school, and then you go home and you're talked at by your parents. And adults have this this sort of burden that I've gotta get these kids from a to b. And so to give them a place where they could have a sounding board, where an adult is listening to them, is something that I I didn't even know that I was doing. But in retrospect, I realized I was I was doing that. I was I was sowing interest in their lives.
Speaker 2:And then in those moments when the holy spirit would drop something on my mind to teach them or say to them, I would reap their interest in what I had to say. So that was kind of the structure. We'd hang out. We'd pick them up. We'd get some food.
Speaker 2:We'd talk about whatever, the whatever video game they're into. Yeah. I had no idea what they were talking about, but I just nod. Oh, cool. You know?
Speaker 2:And then and then at the end, we'd pray. We'd get in the car. I'd drop them home, and we'd pray. And then we'd do it again the next week.
Speaker 1:Okay. So you did this for how long?
Speaker 2:With those kids, it was, like, 3 years.
Speaker 1:Okay. So give me just a memory that you can just pick up from those 3 years. Like, was there any funny story? Was there anything crazy that happened? Was there anything that, like whenever you start talking about this in that season, you think of that event or that conversation?
Speaker 2:You know what? I don't. I I I that that was so boring. It was just like we did in terms of, like, there wasn't any huge And I was expecting that, I think, maybe 2 years in, I was expecting to have some sort of moment where, like, it was raining outside and where the car, they just break down and it wasn't any of that. It was it was years later when I when one of the kids has grown up, and he he sends me a a picture thanking me for all the years that I poured into him, and he's it's a picture of him baptizing somebody else.
Speaker 2:And it's just like, woah. That works. Like, that's the power. That's the that's the moment. This you know, it's not a quick fix.
Speaker 2:You don't it's not fast food. You know? You see the fruit over time. So that was probably the most impactful for me in in that group of kids with that group of kids.
Speaker 1:So, like, was there ever ever a time whenever you were like, man, I'm discouraged. This isn't working. They're not talking to me about, you know, 2nd Timothy 2:2. They're not quoting scripture. You know?
Speaker 1:Like, was there any kind of you being like, lord, I don't even know if this is working. And if so, tell me how you persevered through that. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 2:I I I didn't know what I was what I was doing back then, and I I definitely felt at times like, is this even getting through to these kids? Because I was hoping over, you know, time that they would they would maybe instigate some conversations about the Lord or and they the growth that I saw was was their comfort ministering to each other, talking to each other, praying for each other. When it when it went lateral, I think that's when I I started to be thankful, because I'm like, oh, that that's fruit. It's different than I was expecting. But they're they're they're maturing because they're becoming men, And men are able to communicate.
Speaker 2:Healthy men are able to communicate with one with another, not be threatened by each other. And, gosh, high school can be a threatening time. You know? It's it's all the pecking order. And so seeing them comfortable in their own skin was was the fruit that I wasn't expecting.
Speaker 2:I think I was looking over here for some sort of growth, and it didn't happen. But when I saw that, I'm like, oh, okay. That's cool.
Speaker 1:So whenever that kid reached out, what was it like? 1 year later, 5 years later, 10 years later?
Speaker 2:Yeah. It was, like, 10 years later. 10 years later.
Speaker 1:Yeah. And he sent you that that text. Yep. Tell me tell me what was going through your heart.
Speaker 2:Oh, gosh. I just you know, we we talk about the stories, but the old grandma who prayed and prayed and prayed, and then she gets to heaven, and she she she sees the big impact of her simple prayers or, you know, the selfless acts. And we don't always see on this side of the veil, like, the fruit of our labor. And so getting that that message, it was first heartwarming. And then when I saw that picture and I realized and he started telling me stories, and he's ministering in the same area that we used to meet at.
Speaker 2:He started a church in that same area. I thought, gosh. That's that's a big deal. Like, he he wanted to go this kid in particular wanted to go a different route and kind of go in the marketplace, and which is fine because I I'm in the marketplace and many people are. But, you know, I'm not saying that my, you know, dinners at Taco's Tacos made him a minister, but, you know, who knows what role that played?
Speaker 2:And it seemed to have played some role when I saw that message. But those were the first that was the first time and that I that I ministered, and and then years went by, and I kinda went through the the dark ages as it were of parenting babies. And so then I had my own kids to mentor and raise at at at young ages. And and then about 5 years ago, I I started a new batch of kids here in Tennessee in Nashville. And, that was supposed to be a 6 week long journey, and it ended up being we're going on 5 plus years now.
Speaker 1:So just so I'm getting this straight, unqualified, young, inexperienced dude who didn't even like high school kids
Speaker 2:With long hair. Yes.
Speaker 1:With long hair who was once good at football Yep. Gets possibly coerced into doing high school ministry, and then because you said yes Yes. The lord transformed your life. Yep. And not only did he transform your life, but we know for certain that he used you to make some kind of impact in at least one other person's life.
Speaker 2:Yeah. Who also did the same in others.
Speaker 1:Kinda sounds like that second Timothy 22 thing.
Speaker 2:That's right. But
Speaker 1:Good day. It's better to
Speaker 2:do it than to quote it, maybe.
Speaker 1:But for a long time, you had no idea if what you were doing would bear fruit. Correct. But instead, focusing in on being faithful, not producing fruit, ultimately led to you playing a part, whether it's a small part, whether it's a big part. When this young man who's planning a church, getting to baptize some people, when he talks about his testimony, he's talking about Michael Berkland. And now he might talk about Michael Berkland for 10 seconds, or he might talk about Michael Berkland for 5 minutes.
Speaker 1:But you were a part of this kid's story all because, number 1, someone pursued you and gave you an opportunity. Mhmm. And number 2, because you said yes to praying about it. And then number 3, whenever the lord said, hey. I think I want you to do this, you said, okay, lord.
Speaker 1:I'll be obedient and do what you want me to do.
Speaker 2:Yeah. I kinda wanna do a pitch and then and then dispel a myth. I I think that a lot of us, everyone wants to know what their purpose is. They wanna they wanna matter. You know?
Speaker 2:People listening to this want to their lives to matter. And and and a lot oftentimes, those big sort of chapter headings in our lives, they they may not be what we think. They may be introduced to us in the form of an offense or an infringement on my freedoms, and it's I don't wanna say yes to this. But that becomes the invitation. I see myself now as somebody who's gonna mentor my whole life, but I didn't want to first.
Speaker 2:But because I said yes, then God gave me the heart. And then then the to dispel the myth, it's not hard if does it take time? Yeah. Should you be intentional? Yes.
Speaker 2:But there's such a need. You know, the harvest is plentiful, and it can be as simple as going to a Mexican restaurant, which, hey, it blesses it blessed me too. I love Mexican food. So it was a mutual thing. But it's not hard is what I'm saying.
Speaker 2:It's not like this big there was so much grace. I mean, I had when I started this last round, when I started with them, I was newly married, about to get married. And then when I started with this round, I had a a a newborn, but there was grace.
Speaker 1:It's simple, but simple doesn't always mean easy.
Speaker 2:Exactly. Exactly.
Speaker 1:And I think, you know, for us, one thing that we say here is, you know, 85% of mentoring is just showing up. Yep. If you can just show up, and you're doing your best to try to be like Jesus, and if you're doing your best to be intentional with these kids and to let them know that they're loved and let them know that they're accepted, then what do you know? The Lord just tends to show up and work. It's Mhmm.
Speaker 1:The craziest thing. So
Speaker 2:It's amazing.
Speaker 1:Alright, man. So tell me about this new crew. Tell tell me we covered mentoring in Cali. Yeah. Paco's Tacos.
Speaker 1:You know? Yep. You've got that got that Paco's Tacos tattoo on your chest.
Speaker 2:It's on my it's a little bit lower end behind me, but I'm not gonna say exactly where.
Speaker 1:So tell me how you're mentoring, and I want all the details because hearing it from Steve, it sounds like you're just like you're mentoring every kid in the entire state of Tennessee.
Speaker 2:See, that's a true mentor right there. He believes in me.
Speaker 1:But I wanna hear it from you. How did it start? What's going on?
Speaker 2:Okay. So it started with my bud also in in invitation. Somebody came to me. It was a friend of mine whose oldest son was in 8th grade, and he e and this is worth telling. He he's told this story many times to me and other people in my hearing.
Speaker 2:He had identified this one family who had a a bunch of kids, but their youngest was very different than the others, just mature, godly, making great decisions. And he asked this parent, this mom, he said, did you do anything differently with that with your youngest? And she said, actually, we did. We we basically set him up for community, and and we found other solid people and whose, you know, parents we kind of knew and trusted. We sort of created friends out of these people, and we we were intentional about who he was gonna grow amongst.
Speaker 2:And I think they also had maybe them led by a a spiritual leader or something. And so that was sort of his his, impetus for reaching out to me and saying, Michael, will will you be that spiritual leader for my son and his friends? And he he and I never talked about this before. I think we had been in a mutual sort of bible study type thing together. And at one point, he saw me talking to kids, and I he he he and his wife said, I'd love for Michael to to kind of lead our our oldest and his friends.
Speaker 2:And so that's how it started. He thought I'd I'd say, let me pray about it, but I actually said yes because unbeknownst to him at the time, I was feeling from the Lord like it's time to jump back into to discipleship and mentoring. And I actually went to my local church and said, hey. Do you got do you have any needs? And they they were such a small church, they didn't even have a youth program yet.
Speaker 2:So I was seeking so it went from me being sought out to me now seeking because the Lord was stirring that in my heart, and in that in that seeking, I was sought out. And and so it was gonna be an I think an 8 week sort of commitment. There was 6 of these kids that were friends, and we met at Nashville Pizza Company in Brentwood, Tennessee. And I found myself looking at these parents and and just telling them what the plan was. We're just gonna get together.
Speaker 2:I'm gonna we're gonna have meals. We're gonna eat together, and we're gonna share, and we're gonna talk about middle school stuff. And we're gonna pray for each other. And they were all they were all in.
Speaker 1:So there's a couple of things here that I wanna spend some time on. Mentoring organizations. The reason why, 1, Michael's life has been changed, and 2, multiple kids have been impacted because of Michael's decision to mentor was because someone approached him and invited him into the mentoring process. Mhmm. So I know for me, I'm always trying to find more mentors, and I also know that sometimes I get filled with shame.
Speaker 1:I get filled with doubt. I get filled with the, man, no one wants to do this. They're all busy. They've got kids of their own. But what I am taking away from your testimony, Michael, is don't be afraid to ask and just ask over and over and over and over because you have no idea what the lord will do with your ask.
Speaker 1:Absolutely. So mentoring executives, mentoring leaders, if you are trying to find mentors, go and just toss those seeds as wide as you can because you you have no idea what can happen because of that sowing.
Speaker 2:And and the person that you approach may not have any idea that they've got this in them. And that was my case the first time. And then the second time, when John approached me, he didn't know what I was gonna say. He had no idea what was going on underneath the the water. So, yeah, I totally say amen to that.
Speaker 1:Alright. So you sat down with these kids for 8 weeks, and it turned into turned into what? 5 years. 5 years. Yeah.
Speaker 1:Yep. So just tell me tell me how you facilitated this, and tell me what the lord did.
Speaker 2:Well, you know, I I will say that at this time, I was already mentoring them for a couple years before I got before Steve and I started started our mentoring relationship where he was mentoring me. And and I really mean it. That his he he signaled this out, because, of course, when you're mentoring being mentored, you're kind of sharing everything. This is these are the things in my life that I care about. This is what where I wanna grow.
Speaker 2:And he saw this piece, this mentoring piece, me mentoring these kids, and he he threw gasoline on it. He said that is probably one of the biggest roles that you have going on right now in your life. Aside from, of course, being a a husband and a father, but that is huge. And so he helped me to look at that in a new way. I wish I could say that I I had I had I had everything planned out weeks in advance every single time.
Speaker 2:There were definitely times when I, like you said, I was just showing up, and I was I had the worst day, and I had felt so unspiritual, so ill prepared, so unworthy. And I'm driving here desperately saying, god, I I have nothing to give these kids, but I'm still driving to their to to the house. And wouldn't you know it? Those are the times when, like these kids, they just get rocked, and they still talk about those those those Thursday nights or that one in particular Thursday night. I think early on, the kids were in 8th grade, so I was doing a lot of teaching and fun games, trying to keep it fun.
Speaker 2:Again, trying to build relationship with with them them with each other because they're still kind of feeling awkward, and then them with me. And so I did a lot of games up front, and I didn't I just kinda god gave me some ideas. You know? And they still talk about some of those games that we did. And then as they got older and more comfortable in their own skin, then it was less of that and more, okay.
Speaker 2:Let's talk. Let's let's go deep on some of these issues. And, yeah, we walked through some stuff.
Speaker 1:So you would meet every Thursday for what? 2 hours? Yeah. Yeah. And you had someone's mom bring dinner.
Speaker 2:Mhmm.
Speaker 1:And then tell me about the process of what you would have that son do to their mom whenever they dropped off dinner.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So that was a kind of a tradition is that the mom we'd all and that's big. Having that that at least without this community, the the parents' buy in was was really, really big. And so, man, incredible, incredible people. But a mom would volunteer to either buy food or make food, and when it was ready, we'd all stand up, and the son of that house would stand next to their mom and bless their mom and pray for the meal.
Speaker 2:And we would all just hold hands. Simple tradition, but, yeah, they got used to blessing their their parents, which was cool. So I think that there's a
Speaker 1:couple of things here that I feel like we can kinda grab hold of. 1, a parent's engagement is paramount to any mentoring relationships in any context. Mhmm. I always say, if mom's bought in and the kid's not, it's only a matter of time before the kid is. Yeah.
Speaker 1:But if but if the kid's bought in and mom's not, it's only a matter of time before the kid's not.
Speaker 2:Oh, wow. That's good.
Speaker 1:Because if you've got mom who sees the benefit of this kid spending time with you, it's just going to create a relationship that is more healthy and that could last longer. But 2, having parents and I think that this is really hard for me because I don't want to put anything else on their plate. I don't want to offend them. I don't want to ask the parents to do anything. In fact, I wanna say, hey.
Speaker 1:Let me help you by taking your kid and serving them for 2 hours. But when you give them a a way to join into the relationship, even if it's as simple as, hey. Can mom, can you provide dinner? Or mom, can you bring a bag of chips? Or mom, can you bring one, you know, one thing of soda, it does something.
Speaker 1:It it kinda gives mom an opportunity to become a part of the team. Mhmm.
Speaker 2:And
Speaker 1:I think that's a really big deal, and it doesn't have to cost a bunch of money. It doesn't have to be dinner, but just is there anything that they have that can help you as you invest into their kiddo? I think that that's huge.
Speaker 2:Yeah. That was huge. And they they they took all the administrative burden off of me, and I just basically showed up. And and they'd feed I mean, that was just so sweet. I'd some of those LBs that I'm talking about were related to those dinners.
Speaker 2:So so it's gotta be food.
Speaker 1:Yeah. Right.
Speaker 2:There is something about there is something about eating, even if it like you said, it's chips and and water. There's something about that. You know? Paul talks about that.
Speaker 1:Yeah. So so talk about the power of meals.
Speaker 2:Oh gosh. For me, personally, I love something with dessert. No. You know, it's it's just you're you're you're hanging out. You're relaxed.
Speaker 2:You're it's it creates a dynamic where you're all you're all equal. You're all you're all friendly. This is, like, the most casual activity in America. You know? It's sitting around and eating eating food together, and it's it's it's enjoyable.
Speaker 2:So it just it creates an an atmosphere of of of relaxation. And that then, I think, is a a great great soil for for trust and kind of anticipating having deeper relationships. I mean, that's the unseen stuff, but, you know, you're you're talking about anything, you know, when you're eating. You're just having a a fun time. And I I think that there's there's power in that.
Speaker 2:It there's a lot of power in just having a fun time. Man, tell me so dangerous statement, but you know what I mean. It's it's not all about that, but it creates that setting where you can then lun launch off from there and and and
Speaker 1:go go and go places. So so talk about and this is obviously just your opinion, but I Yeah. I think I know you to know that you kinda think like this. What are the unseen things? What are the things that you really can't put down on paper that create an environment where a kid's heart can be open to whatever the lord has for him.
Speaker 1:Like, I mean, we've talked a lot about car rides. We talked about meals. We've talked about teachings.
Speaker 2:Yeah. Yeah. You know, so I'll give you some specifics. So we would oftentimes, I'd have a after we ate, we'd kinda transition. Sometimes we'd play, you know, a game, ultimate Frisbee, then we'd eat, and and then inevitably, we transition into, okay, now let's have this the the time where we go a little deeper.
Speaker 2:And I would oftentimes have a message, but I almost always make sure that we had time of sharing. And so if a kid was going through something and I recognized it, I oftentimes would, and I don't tell me if I'm not answering your question, but I I I would I guess my radar was up to those sharing times. And if if the kid was if I heard something or something bleeped on my radar, like, this is the kid's going through something, I would usually, afterwards, I'd kinda pull them aside and say, hey, man. What's you know, you wanna talk more about this? And I just would make myself available.
Speaker 2:I wouldn't force them to share, but and oftentimes, they would. They would just pour their hearts out. Or if they didn't, they would call me in the middle of the week and say, hey, Michael. I'm going through a really tough decision right now. I've always been, you know, soccer player, and I I'm thinking about quitting.
Speaker 2:Like, is that the right decision? I but my coach wants me to keep playing. I I I I wanna kinda wanna keep playing, but I don't know what what do you think I should do? It's like, oh my gosh. Like, hold on.
Speaker 2:Let me step outside, talk to the wife, go outside. And and I don't know the answer to this, but I think me intentionally being aware of of those sense like like, when I hear something and then asking them about it, it would open up opportunities later on e either then or later on for them to approach me when they needed when they needed some real guidance.
Speaker 1:Well, it is my belief that anytime a kid says something that kinda lets you in on their insides. Right? Like, anytime that they just give a little sentence or just give a little blurb about things aren't good at home or things aren't good with the girlfriend or things aren't good with, you know, the parents or at school, they're they're giving you a clue. Yep. They want you.
Speaker 1:It's almost like they're testing you to be like, can he pick up on this? Do they really care about me? Mhmm. And more times than not, that is an offer. Like, they are tossing over a bid Totally.
Speaker 1:And seeing if, you know, you will cash it in. So that's awesome. So you mentor these kids from 8th grade all the way through high school. Right?
Speaker 2:Yeah. Yeah. They're all in they're all in their 1st year their 1st semester at colleges.
Speaker 1:Okay. So so as you think back about that 5 year journey Mhmm. Any stories, any times whenever you're like, oh, man?
Speaker 2:So so many. So many. I mean, it's, you know? I it was God's gift to me because my oldest is now in 8th grade, and so I didn't have a clue. You know, you know how to parent your oldest kid.
Speaker 2:A day beyond that, you're clueless. So the whole teenage years were were just were new to me, and so God helped me to see what teenage boy I mean, it's one thing to go through yourself, but then it's another to be a parent or be a mentor. So to see that was really, really helpful. And through that, of course, you've got, you know, you've got your who am I? Do I am I accepted?
Speaker 2:Where do I fit in? How do I deal with girls? How do I deal with sex? How do I deal with with with everything, my changing body, my my gifts, what I what I suck at, like, all of those insecurities. And so in that, there was some kids that were going through some real dark dark places, and sometimes I knew about it.
Speaker 2:There's you know, sometimes where I'd get a call in with a parent and have to have a tough conversation about what what the kid was looking at on the phone and, to have a conversation about what the you know, how to navigate this, talk about purity, talk about how to be open and honest with you. And in that case, I'm just kind of a third party with the parents, and they they would bring me into that. And, again, I don't have a degree in this at all. No degree. I just said yes.
Speaker 2:And then there's other times where, like, I remember one of the kids were was really testing his faith and, like, doing, I mean, doing some stuff to someone's like I mean, I won't get into specifics, but, like, breaking the law, and and, like, how do I how far can I push? And, gosh, what do you do in that case? You know? The parents were aware of it. It's not like I was, you know, finding this out on my own, but oftentimes, I had built that trust with the parents to where I was kind of their backup.
Speaker 2:And if they needed somebody that could maybe get through to their kid in the way that they couldn't, I'd get called in. And and oftentimes, the solution was wasn't anything more than listening, going to dinner. And that oftentimes I mean, that's the that's the intangible. In this point case in particular, me not even bringing it up, just reaching out to this kid saying, hey. Can I take you to dinner?
Speaker 2:And having dinner, and how what's going on? And then he spills it all. I don't say a thing, and then he walks away saying, man, I really, really needed that. Thanks. I'm I'm coming back.
Speaker 2:I'm I'm I'm gonna come back to the Lord. Yeah. He didn't use those words, but and it was dinner. It was dinner and questions.
Speaker 1:It's awesome, man. Super powerful.
Speaker 2:Super powerful.
Speaker 1:Alright, Burkland. To close this off, man, if someone out there is listening and they're either mentoring or they're about to start their mentoring journey, just what is the advice that you would give the 24 year old, long haired Michael, as he embarked on this mentoring journey? What's a piece of wisdom?
Speaker 2:I'd say that I think Papadon says walk in your clout. There's a lot for me, there's kind of a lot of sort of the impostor syndrome that wants to come up. Like, who am I to mentor? What have I done where I can actually speak into another person's life? And, you know, don't underestimate the power of God in you.
Speaker 2:So go with boldness and and and go with confidence and not presumption, but but go knowing that your consistency your consistency is gonna be used to do things that you could never do, you couldn't even imagine doing. He's gonna show up in ways that you could imagine at times when you feel like you're at your lowest. So so if you've if you're feeling like, do I do this? Absolutely jump in. If you're feeling like, gosh, how can I commit to 5 years?
Speaker 2:Don't. Don't worry about that. Just take it one day at a time. He'll give you grace, and it might only be for 8 weeks. And that 8 weeks could change a life, or it could turn into something else.
Speaker 2:But don't I would just say, get out of your head, get into your feet, and jump in.
Speaker 1:Get out of your head. Get into your feet. Sounds like a lyric, doesn't it? Sounds like a nineties song.
Speaker 2:It does. Get out of our head.
Speaker 1:Alright, man. Well, thanks so much for your time, Berkland. As always, just spouting out wisdom. Hey. And how how much honor well, that's not gonna make sense.
Speaker 1:But how cool is it that that guy said, hey. Who do we want to invest into our kid? And they chose you.
Speaker 2:Wow. Oh my gosh.
Speaker 1:That that says something about you, bro. Wow. It's all God.
Speaker 2:Thank you so much.
Speaker 1:Yeah. Alright. Well, thanks again to Michael Berkland for giving us his time and his wisdom and his experiences today. If you guys missed out on this episode, well, I'm sorry. But remember this, you can mentor.