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The Sabbath Life Podcast is about sharing stories from the Abbey of the Heights retreat house in Tulsa—all about finding rhythms of life that make us more human, learning the Christian contemplative tradition, and becoming friends with time.
Welcome to the Sabbath Life Podcast. Here, we share stories about the Abbey of the Heights, the Christian contemplative tradition and rhythms of life that make us more human and friends with time. I'm Peter White. I'm one of hosts of The Abbey of the Heights, a Christian retreat space in Tulsa, Oklahoma. And today, I'm joined by my friend Justin Jones.
Peter:Justin, do you wanna share a little bit about who you are and what it is that brings you here?
Justin:Yeah. So, my official title is senior philanthropy advisor. And that's just a really fancy title to me that's, I work on the advancement team. And that's not for The Life. No.
Justin:No. Not for The Sabbath Life. No. No. No.
Justin:I I work for Wycliffe Bible Translators, and I've been working for them for a little over ten years now. And I've had the great privilege of of serving on the Abbey board for a couple of years now. But for the past ten years, I've been serving with the Bible translators, serving on their advancement team, and just encouraging generosity and telling those challenging others to advocate for those who are Biblists, who don't have God's word in their heart language.
Peter:That sounds like awesome work.
Justin:Amazing. I really enjoy it. Yeah.
Peter:Justin, do you remember the first time you heard about The Sabbath Life?
Justin:I do. I had to ask my wife for some help because I'm I'm terrible with dates. But she helped me to remember she helped remind me the first exposure that I saw about the Sabbath Life and the Abbey of the Heights was probably back in 2021, kinda right right after you guys had launched, just through a mutual friend of mine, Pastor Roger, and we just started following The Abbey on Instagram. And by God's providence, my wife signed up for some raffle to win a free retreat. And so we we got chosen.
Justin:We got we won this raffle. And so as I say, the rest is history. And so that was our kind of first real exposure. And meeting you was just through some mutual friends and just kinda winning this opportunity to come in for a retreat. And so we came in for the retreat.
Justin:I came in for the retreat, October 2022. Yeah.
Peter:Okay. So that's almost three and a half years ago now? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Peter:So what do you what do you remember about that first retreat?
Justin:Yeah. What I remember most about that retreat was just the gift of capacity, just the chance to come in and just kind of breathe and just to kind of just slow down. But what I remember most, and I have I still have this vivid memory of just the gift of hospitality. It was a simple meal. The soup wasn't all that fancy.
Justin:But you and I sharing a meal together of this of this simple soup was just this profound memory of just you and I in our humanity, just like building community and being vulnerable with each other and sharing our stories. And just this that simple act of just care and hospitality and generosity was just one of those kind of moments, those moments for me of what the Abbey was like. It's a place of safe refuge. It's a place of retreat. It's a place of rest and generosity and hospitality.
Justin:And yeah, I just, I have this, I still have this vivid memory burned in my mind of of you and I just sharing this simple soup together. And it was nothing fancy, but it was it meant the world to me. And so yeah. Do you remember the soup? Do you remember the soup, what it was?
Peter:I do. I do. Yeah. I it was a a jar of something from from Aldi.
Justin:So yeah. Yeah. It was like nothing yeah. Nothing fancy. Nothing special.
Peter:Yeah. There's something special about food and hospitality and sharing stories together that that connects us.
Justin:Yeah. Absolutely. Yeah.
Peter:Yeah. And so you were you were here not just for a single day that first time. That was that was a you were here for three nights, if I remember right.
Justin:Yeah. It was three days, two nights. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Justin:That first retreat I took back in October '22 was three full days and two nights. And that came at a really pivotal moment in my family's life. We were in this transition and just really trying to find some discernment about what was next for us and what we needed to do and where we needed to go. And so it was just God's providence that I was given this capacity to really spend some time in prayer. And but also then do some like some, you know, like every day I went for a walk and just that act of just walking, just embodying that prayer practice of this kind of pilgrimage and walking in prayer was just beneficial for me and my soul.
Justin:But then just that chance of just to break away and read and pick through your library and pick three or four books every night and just, you know, read into the night and then sleep in and have rest. And so, yeah, was just a pivotal moment for us just to sit and to pray and for me to consider and for bringing those considerations back to my life and have us kind of launch into the next season of our life. And so, it was two nights, three days, and it was absolutely amazing. It was very life giving, very affirming, very encouraging.
Peter:Mhmm. Had you done any kind of retreat like that before that?
Justin:No. Not really. There was some opportunities. I'm just thinking of my whole journey. We were first really introduced to kind of contemplative practices or the Examen back in 2009.
Justin:My wife and I were considering taking a call to be missionaries and serving in Asia. And a part of that training process, our leadership introduced us to Exalmint and some spiritual formation practices to kind of help us as we live cross culturally and live in Asia. And so, we had kinda done some stuff like that, but never like a two day or a three day thing. I had never done anything that big in the lab before. And so, but just we had practiced Examen off and on for a while, and so sort of knew what know, some of those practices could look like.
Justin:But to really take a three day retreat was something very, very new for me. Yeah.
Peter:And so it was just the the post on Instagram that sparked, oh, I could take a two night retreat.
Justin:Right. It was yeah. Just following the story of The Abbey. I think my wife followed on Facebook and Instagram and maybe I followed on Instagram and just kinda following that story. It's like, oh, there's a place here in town.
Justin:That's great. Like, it's it's we can do this. And then just, yeah, reading that story and reading the opportunity and and then, yeah, the Abbey had posted this raffle like Ply and and we'll give away these free retreats. And so we both got excited and it was like, man, this is amazing. What a what a resource for us to have in our local community.
Justin:I wish everyone could, you know, learn about the Abbey and use this resource. And so, yeah, so we came for that. I came for that retreat and then we just have been following the Abbey ever since. And then, yeah, and that led to me kind of joining the board and serving the board and advocating for others to kind of, you know, ministry leaders and community leaders to use the Abbey as a resource just to kind of help them thrive in their their particular missions or their callings. And so, Sean and I have been a huge advocate for the for the Abbey ever since October 2022.
Peter:And I'm so grateful for that too.
Justin:Oh, we're grateful. Yeah. We're grateful.
Peter:Yeah. So you stayed for a retreat, and then you continue to stay in touch and in contact. And so when I approached you about serving on the board in this behind the scenes capacity, what was it that led you to say yes to that?
Justin:Just that yeah, experiencing experiencing the Abbey in person, to see the authenticity and see the integrity and and see the benefit that it could have led me to say yes. But also that experience of my wife and I being missionaries in the field and and serving Asia. Knowing our own personal exhaustion, knowing our own personal kind of burnout of being quote unquote full time missionaries and and just yeah. So we we saw both sides of the coin. Right?
Justin:We saw the beauty and the benefit and the resource of the Abbey. But then from our own personal experience of of being in a ministry that was cross cultural, we were just we were really burned out. And so yeah. So then to advocate that for others, you know, we my wife and I support missionaries, and and anytime they come home, we want we want them to come experience the Abbey and come experience that that space of retreat and rest and renewal. And so, yeah, so it came from personal experience of knowing kinda both sides of the coin of like what a beautiful place the Abbey is, but then also knowing, you know, there's people that need this, that need this resource that are burned out or are not thriving in any way and need a place to come and rest and find, you know, find rest and find renewal and find purpose again or find identity again.
Justin:And so that's yeah, that's why that's why I said yes. And so, I feel like I could bring something to some value to the table as well. I've I mean, for ten years now, I've been working on the advancement team at Wycliffe, and so just how to encourage generosity in in a relational ministry way, and then use those skills and that value to kind of bring value to the Abbey as well as how can I advocate for the Abbey and advocate for those ministry and community leaders who need who need who need rest, who need a chance for renewal and, and to do it with yeah? To do it with integrity and authenticity and do it because it's it's what I love to do.
Peter:I love that. So you and I have had a lot of conversations around generosity and could you maybe connect some of the dots between generosity and rest and the abbey and like a full life of ministry?
Justin:Oh, wow. That's a that's a big question. It is, isn't it? It's a very big question.
Peter:What do
Justin:all those things mean to you? Yeah. What do they all mean to me? Yeah. Yeah.
Justin:Yeah. Generosity is not always necessarily tie we you know, know, North American Christians automatically tie generosity to, like, finances or to money. And that's not always the case when we look at generosity in the Bible. We look at generosity as as a meal, as land, as authority, as power, as in we see generosity in multiple facets of different ways of just encouraging others and supporting others and bringing others to a fullness of what God has called them to be and to be. Yeah.
Justin:So when we look back at Genesis and we look back to the garden, there is these moments of rest that were built into that activity and creativity and innovation. But we see these moments of rest as well. And then God rested on the seventh day. And in that rest, He claimed authority and lordship over all of creation, all of all. And so, yeah, we see these beautiful depictions of generosity and rest kinda intertwined throughout the entire the entire arc of, you know, of God's love for us through the Bible.
Justin:So yeah. And so as I as I encourage and challenge others in this idea of generosity, like our identity is not tied up into what we can do. We're not called to be human doings. We're called to be human beings. As we exist and be who God has called us to be, that's to be agents of change and agents of rest and agents of hospitality and grace and mercy and all those things that God has given us.
Justin:But it's not about those things that we can do. It's about just being in in relationship with God and being in in His presence and in His presence. I forgot who said it, but our hearts are restless until we find rest in Him. And so He He is the author of generosity and He's the author of rest and and we we find all of those in Him. And so how then do we become those instruments of His mercy and grace and peace and rest?
Justin:And yeah, so so maybe I answer your question. But for me but for me, they're they're intertwined. May my resources meet your need and may your resources meet my need. How can we live in community and encourage each other and be generous and and give each other the gift of capacity and the gift of of rest? Yeah.
Peter:Yeah. Well, isn't that the way that gifts work in God's kingdom that there's this mutual flow of of giving and receiving that, yeah, there's something that I have that that you need, and there's something that you need that I have and this kind of flow of of gifts that goes among really all of us in God's kingdom.
Justin:Yeah.
Peter:Yeah. That's such a beautiful picture.
Justin:It is a beautiful picture. It's a beautiful depiction of community. It's a beautiful depiction of God's grace for us and us showing grace to others. And, and it's a beautiful, it's a beautiful depiction of the gospel. God loves us and we are called to share that love with others.
Peter:Well, you have over the last couple of years experienced a whole bunch of the aspects of the Sabbath Life and the Abbey beyond just staying here for a retreat. So what are some of those that stand out to you and what have you noticed about God and yourself and community through those things?
Justin:Mhmm. Yeah. Yeah. Joining the community of the Abbey and just being around the Abbey, there is such a diverse and unique community that's, kind of around it and participating and learning. And so, yeah, I just, I think of the school of spiritual direction, just training others to be those spiritual directors and to help others.
Justin:It's just not everyone coming to the Abbey just to learn and to receive, but also to learn how to then receive and to give that to others. And so, and so, yeah, that's always been really encouraging and challenging to see, like the cohorts of students that come through and kind of learn about how to be a soul friend, how to be a spiritual director, how to help others pray and to pray well, and to hold that space for capacity and learning and awareness has been really cool. But I think what's really encouraging also encouraging to me is, guess maybe because I'm privy because I'm I'm on the board, but I get to see the thank you cards that retreatants, you know, as they come and stay, they send thank you cards to the Abbey and and get to read those. It's just really encouraging. Like everyone that comes to the Abbey, they just they they realize that this is some of the Desert Fathers kinda wrote this idea about a thin place.
Justin:And it's it's really cool to see that everyone who comes to the Abbey, they have that same they walk away with that same impression that there's something special about the Abbey, that this place has been demarcated and set apart for people to come and to rest. People, all people kind of that come in and see that and experience that they're grateful that that they've been able to experience that and they express gratitude. And it's just really cool to see that everyone who comes to the Abbey kinda has that same sense like, man, this place is special, and I wanna come back. And I I wanna I wanna be a part of this because there there's something beautiful about coming to the Abbey. Even if just for a day or even just for, you know, an events or whatever, but there's something special about about the Abbey.
Peter:Yeah. I just keep coming back to the word community. And what what kind of community have you noticed and and witnessed around the Abbey? I I would like to think we're trying to experiment with something a little different than what most people experience at church. And so what what are you seeing in that?
Justin:Yeah. Back to the story about, the bowl of soup. I think, many of the ways that we find community at the Abbey is just through hospitality, just through potlucks, just through just coming together for a meal is to share a meal with no other agenda other than just to share stories and to get to know people. And so in some ways we do get to experience each other's, know, through that act of hospitality and to join the potluck is always is just, is just fun. It's just, it's beautiful.
Justin:It's people coming together who love Jesus and everyone brings something and everyone shares something. And so there's that simple act of just hospitality that is building to that, that DNA or that culture of community of just one of service and one of sharing. And so that's one thing that we've experienced in the community around the alley, but then also just my family and I have joined the Eucharist on Sunday afternoons. And so this is really cool to be a part of that experience and to kind of be introduced to some of those ancient rhythms and ancient practices for prayer and for communion. And my wife and I weren't really exposed to growing up.
Justin:And so being overseas and being challenged to other expressions of liturgy like that, we wanted to come back and learn more about what our own Christian faith, what our own liturgy could look like. And so coming to the Eucharist service on Sunday afternoons is really beautiful, really simple. There's no lights. There's no fog. There's no sound machines.
Justin:There's no, you know, there's none of those big grandiose, you know, production of church. It's just a simple community around communion, around just people around the living room, and it's beautiful and simple and life giving. And so, we've enjoyed attending the Eucharist service on on Sunday, and it's, yeah, it's beautiful. And, we we've enjoyed it. And my daughter is absolutely in love with some of your staff that's there.
Justin:And so, whenever we say we're going to the Abbey, she wants to make sure that Laurel is also also there because apparently my daughter's best friends with Laurel now.
Peter:That's what we like to hear.
Justin:Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Peter:The Abbey makes best friends of people.
Justin:It makes best friends of people. That's right. Yeah.
Peter:Well, I love that you bring up both, the potlucks and and, and the contemplative community, because, well, for one, like the I feel like the potluck is such a perfect illustration of what we had just mentioned about gift giving and that everybody has something to contribute and everybody gets to receive the the bounty of bringing all these gifts together at the same time. Pollock is such a perfect illustration of that. I I feel like so. Yeah. When we do those monthly, it's just a simple time to be together and connect with people and there's really no other agenda but to meet people that maybe have walked into the Abbey from some other door than, than you have.
Peter:Whether it was retreat or spiritual direction or one of the cohorts or the Ignatian groups to meet other people that are experiencing very similar things and make new best friends.
Justin:Yeah. Make new best friends.
Peter:Yeah. But I also see the potluck as a as an extension of of the table from the table that is Jesus's table in our contemplative community where we celebrate the Eucharist and how that that table really is the the center of everything that that happens here at the Abbey and everything kind of spirals out from that that generosity of God there. But then we get to extend that table to a table that we invite others to and, and share together. These, these tables are really connected to each other and it's just, yeah, there's life giving community that comes around these tables.
Justin:Yeah. Yeah. You're so right. Yeah. And so and so, Peter, let me ask you a question too.
Justin:As you facilitate these experiences, what joy do you have in kind of facilitating this? What brings you the most joy in kind of stepping back and seeing these experiences, seeing these this community kind of growing?
Peter:There's a famous prayer that gets talked about every once in a while here that has this line about trusting in the slow work of God. And I think it because it resonates with so many of us so much because it takes kind of a slow work to see some of these gifts and these graces and joys kind of come forth because we're so like, we want everything right now or at least I do. Yeah. Like even imagining this conversation that it started around a bowl of soup like four years ago. And here we are now.
Peter:And the way that you're, you've come alongside the work. And I love hearing yeah, about your daughters making a best friend here and just the other ways that that that happens. So our, we recently hosted our, our year one school of spiritual direction cohort finished their first year. And to watch that group of 14 people that nine months ago were all strangers and didn't know if they wanted to be in the same room together to then there being, you know, bittersweet tears of like, oh, what are we going get together again next and see each other and be in this space next? And the depth of what, what God does in those relationships is just so beautiful.
Justin:Yeah. Yeah.
Peter:Yeah. That's a, that's a favorite thing is seeing, seeing people find community like genuine community in this space because it, it is such a deep longing that we all have for and the the ways the ways we look for it and don't find it in the ways that we hope we do. Yeah.
Justin:And in small ways, how we kind of stumble upon it and realize, yeah, that was awesome. And then, we we try and look for it and we miss it. But then, yeah, it's that simple. Yeah. That simple awareness of community.
Justin:Being at the Abbey and finding community and it's been life giving for my family. So, that's great.
Peter:Makes me think of this line from Dietrich Bonhoeffer where he says that community is always a gift from God. And so that just makes me think about how we don't find community by like getting everything right. Like just being in control of everything in our lives and getting getting everything just right. Like it's just simply a gift from God that we receive.
Justin:Yeah. That's good. Yeah.
Peter:Yeah. Well, Justin, in the place that you serve behind the scenes on the board of directors for the Sabbath Life, what do you hope people experience here and find here?
Justin:Yeah. I've thoroughly enjoyed serving on the board. It's it's been really great to meet the other board members and see more people who, you know, are advocating for the and are passionate about the mission and vision of the Abbey. But my hope, yeah, for anyone to, a ministry leader, a community leader, that they would be renewed, that they would return to their work thriving, that they wouldn't burn out, that they wouldn't kind of lose lose faith or lose like their direction or like lose hope, that they can come to a place like the Abbey and find hope and find renewal, and that they can return to their nonprofit work or their church work or their civic work or their business work or whatever they're doing, but they can return to that work just kind of renewed and have a new sense of hope to continue on and to not give up, you know, what they're doing. And so, yeah, I think my my hope for the Abbey is that people would find hope, that they would find renewal, that they would find hope.
Peter:Hope. I love that. Yeah. Yeah. I hope I do I do hope that we're a place of hope for people.
Justin:Yeah. Yeah. So if
Peter:there was somebody that was listening to this thinking about, Hey, I've never done a retreat before, but that sounds intriguing. How would you encourage them or what would you invite them to do on a retreat?
Justin:Goodness. I would say yes, you need to do it. It's great. It's wonderful. Don't put it off.
Justin:Don't yeah, don't don't not not do it. But I'd say like what's worked really well for me is having some structured time of like maybe creativity, like bringing some pencils or bringing some paints and just having some structured time of creativity, having a structured time of of maybe walking, some structured time of absolutely rest of like literally sleeping, like taking a nap. Structured times of prayer, but then also just kind of structured times of just flexibility. And, I think, going into a treat and not having a plan, it just kind of feels weird or reactionary. And so if you go in with a plan to say, I want to spend time with God and I want to be creative.
Justin:And then you spend an hour or two doing that. I wanna spend some time with God and go on a prayer walk and you spend an hour doing that, just going in with an intentional plan. And I appreciate Peter that even the last time that I came in for a retreat, you had kinda left some materials on the desk for me to encounter and to kinda process some of that stuff of kinda my hopes and what I wanted to accomplish while I was there. And so I think you providing some of those materials is great and kinda help people and lead people. But I remember calling some conversation, of another retransit that came on tree, and, you had mentioned to them like, hey, why don't you just take a nap?
Justin:And they said, I can do that. I was like, yeah, you can take a nap if you want to. I'm like, yes. Thank you. I would love to take a nap.
Justin:Well, then go take a nap. It was just like this really funny like, hey, you can have permission to go take a nap. Like, this place is for like literal rest. And they were just like, that was just like the best gift to them that they have permission to go take a nap. And so that was just really funny and beautiful to me.
Justin:And so, yeah, for me, just coming into the retreat is just having a plan and it and hope we hold our plans loosely and we leave room for the Holy Spirit to lead us and guide us. Absolutely. But I do wanna come in with like at least some structure of a plan of like, I'm gonna spend a couple hours just reading a book. I'm gonna bring a book that I've been really wanting to read. I'm gonna bring some canvases and some paints and just spend some time in painting and creativity or yeah.
Justin:I think just those chances just to really lean into who I think God has called me to be and really lean into that and just allow that that capacity to kind of help shape me and lead my thoughts and lead my prayers and and lead into a way that, yeah, God has called me to be.
Peter:That's perfect. Yeah.
Justin:Just I'm thinking back thinking back to, you know, for our my wife and I's kind of first introduction into the Examen and into some of those contemplative prayer practices. That that first kind of gift of capacity that I truly experienced in my life was just going through that that training to be missionaries. When you were given the capacity of just time and space, I had been so kind of spun up and wound up to accomplish this or accomplish that. And so to come into this training to really have the capacity of just like of space, of just like opportunity. And it was because of that gift, like I had been really challenged in a particular prayer practice of just reading God's word.
Justin:And so in 02/2009, I was given really that capacity just to start reading God's word on a daily basis. And it's something that I've been challenged for for a really long time. And so I took up that practice of just daily, daily reading of God's Word. So since 2009, like every year I've done that. I've read God's Word from cover to cover, from Genesis to Revelation every year since 2009.
Justin:And that simple practice, that simple gift of capacity to do that has brought so much life and and rhythm to my own life. And so when I think of, you know, these rhythms of spiritual formation, these rhythms of practices and prayer, that journey began for me just like, you know, back in 2009. And so to come off the mission field and then to encounter the Abbey has just been this continuation of this journey of just rhythms for my life and rhythms for rest and prayer and and rhythms for hospitality and generosity and rhythms for mission and rhythms for learning. And I'm just so grateful for the Abbey and the Sabbath Life and so grateful to consider you a friend and and just, yeah, just grateful for the Abbey and and the opportunity to to continue that journey of just trying to be aware of God's grace and mercy for me.
Peter:Thank you, Justin. I'm thinking too about just thinking about some of your story and some of the we have some common just life experiences, but I'm thinking too about, like, especially as a young person, hearing people say to me when I was wanting to respond to a call to ministry of like, just go ahead and burn yourself out because you have all of eternity to, you know, to rest. Right. Did that was that something that you encountered too as a younger person or as a missionary?
Justin:Yeah. There was this there was yeah. There was a little bit of this cowboy guns blazing, just, you know, go full tilt and yeah. That didn't work.
Peter:Yeah. It doesn't work.
Justin:It doesn't work. No, it didn't work. And so, we we were, you know, about a year and a half into our our missionary service and like quickly realized like, man, this is not sustainable. Like, we need to we need to take a step back. And so, we we took a little bit of a break and and and we left the country for a little bit.
Justin:But just, yeah, in conversations with our leadership and our missions agency and coming back and and, yeah, there's just been a long journey of just like, man, we just can't we can't run at a 110% and think that it's sustainable. Yeah. And so I would encourage any young leaders, any young person that's thinking about getting into ministry or some sort of community service in some way. And just like, there are rhythms of service and there are rhythms of rest, and there's rhythms of prayer and retreat and renewal. And those will sustain you for a very long career and, just not being some, yeah, cowboy or whatever.
Justin:Just, you know, burning the candle at both ends. Like, that's not sustainable. Like, there there are seasons of, yes, of service, but there are there are seasons of rest. And and that's how God that's how he does.
Peter:Yeah. Yeah. God rests. That's the whole that's the creation story in Genesis one. Yeah.
Peter:Yeah. Yeah. Well, Justin, I've got a handful of questions that I've been asking all of our all of our guests. And so these are just, top of mind first thought that comes into your your mind kind of questions. So do you do you feel like playing along with us?
Peter:Sure. Yeah. Let's go. Alright. So what's the last book that you read?
Justin:Oh gosh. The current book that I'm reading, it's on my shelf right here. I am reading Richard Roar's The Tears of Things.
Peter:Tears
Justin:of That's a very good book. Yeah. And it's a book about, some of the Old Testament prophets and it's just really great. Yeah. I really enjoyed it.
Justin:Yeah. Richard Rohr, The Tears of Things. Yeah.
Peter:Awesome. If your job was something different than it is now, what would it be? Wow. Anything.
Justin:If I had a different job, what would I be? Well, lots of things come to mind because I have a lot of interests. But one in particular is if I didn't have to worry about finances for my family or a risk of failure, I would love, absolutely love to operate and own a brewery. I just think that, yeah, I would open a brewery. Yeah.
Justin:I would make beer and make people happy and give all the proceeds away and to support my community and have fun and drink beer and and, yeah, that's what I would do. I'd I'd become a brewer. Yeah.
Peter:Fantastic. What what's a place that you would wanna travel to that you've never been before?
Justin:Oh, never been before. Goodness. Never been to before. I would love to tour kinda Ireland, The UK, kinda Scotland. I've never been to those places, and I would just love to tour.
Justin:And even maybe go a little further east and, like, maybe hit up, like Austria and Germany and kind of that European kind of area. Never spent much time in any of any of those places. But yeah, I'd love to go visit UK and Ireland and Scotland and have a grand adventure.
Peter:Awesome. Do you have a comfort food movie? Like a movie you can watch a 100 times and it never gets old for you.
Justin:A comfort movie. Well, again, several come to mind, but I think probably a toss-up between either Nacho Libre or Dumb and Dumber. I think I can watch those movies just on repeat anytime and they just, they crack me up and they bring me so much joy. So yeah.
Peter:Those are perfect. We were just so good. Yeah. We watched both of those with our kids for family movie night in the last year or so. So those are they were both winners too.
Justin:Very good. Very good. That's good to hear.
Peter:What's a favorite place to eat a meal for you?
Justin:A favorite place to eat a meal? Man.
Peter:Besides The Abbey?
Justin:Besides The Abbey. Yeah. Yeah. That's a good question. My favorite place to eat a meal?
Justin:I would probably say a Hideaway Pizza. I am a huge fan of pizza and the pizza is great and it's great for my family because my daughter can also order some meatballs and spaghetti, which she loves and so everyone's happy.
Peter:Yeah. Table where everybody's happy. That's a good place to eat.
Justin:A table where everyone's happy.
Peter:Yeah. If you and I were going out for karaoke, what's what's your song? Oh my gosh.
Justin:Are you serious? Wow. That's a great question. I'm gonna I'm gonna hold on to that one. That's a great question.
Justin:If you and I were going karaoke, my song would be pretty much anything that Eddie Vedder sings on. So like any of like the old like Pearl Jam records, just put any any song from Pearl Jam on and I will sing it, to the best of my ability. Yeah.
Peter:Perfect. Yeah. Those first three Pearl Jam albums, I think particularly would be the ones.
Justin:Yeah. Pretty great. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Justin:Absolutely.
Peter:And then last question here. What is it that makes you laugh the hardest?
Justin:What makes me laugh the hardest? My daughter is 13 and she's just kind of coming into her own kind of sense of humor. And she, she, the other day just got in this, this really quirky, funny mood and was just being a goofball. And my wife and I were just like we were just slapping so hard because she was just being this, you know, clown or whatever. And so I'd have to say like, in those moments, like, yeah, just my daughter being a clown, like, being a goofball, like, really brings me joy and, like, really makes me laugh pretty hard.
Justin:She's yeah. She's super sweet. And to see her coming into her own personality, and it's yeah. She's pretty funny. Yeah.
Justin:My daughter.
Peter:Awesome. Yeah. She is pretty great.
Justin:She is pretty great. I love her very much.
Peter:Well, Justin, thank you so much for taking the time to be with us today. And thank you listeners for being with us too. You can learn more about the ministry of the Sabbath Life on our website, thesabbathlife.com. You can find information there about booking a personal retreat for you or for a group at the Abbey Of The Heights. And if you would like to make a financial gift to support the ministry of the Sabbath Life, you can also do that on the website at thesabbathlife.com/give because we exist because of the generosity of people just like you.
Peter:And then very last thing, be sure that you're subscribing to the podcast so that you're able to to catch the next stories that we share. And if you like what you're hearing, please also leave us a review so that others can more easily discover us. You can help us spread the word about the Abbey Of The Heights and a life of rest. So until next time, may you know in the deepest parts of your soul that you are God's beloved.