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Talked about Adam's work as an "attachment specialist" helping people with their attachment issues and how that helps every area of their life. He was a psychologist and now just deals with attachment. He gave some practical tips on improving attachment with our own kids. He did offer to link to his course as an affiliate, and it would give people 10% off.
Intentional fatherhood while living a life of purpose. Hosted by Mike Sudyk. www.2centdad.com
[00:00:00] Adam: We believe we're going to be acted upon by other people, so we can't trust them in good faith, but maybe we believe we're going to be abandoned cuz we're the problem. Maybe we believe other people are the problem. There's difficult.
[00:00:13] Mike: To the 2 cent Dad podcast, where we interview dads to discuss their journeys of intentional fatherhood while doing work they care about and living a life of purpose.
[00:00:23] I'm your host, Mike Sudyk.
[00:00:30] It's all about attachment. At least that's what Adam Lane Smith would say, who is a master psychologist, retired psychotherapist, and now attachment specialist. He joins the 2 Cent Dad podcast today to talk about how a lot of issues that we face in our marriages, in our relationships, even with our kids stems from our own attachment issues, often attachment issues that have come up from our childhood. And so he hits on a lot of
[00:01:00] important things and, uh, actually very practical advice about how we can go about fixing our attachment issues, but then also not creating attachment issues with our kids. So let's jump in to the conversation with Adam Lane Smith.
[00:01:14] All right, today on the podcast we have Adam Lane Smith. He is a master in psychology. He's a retired psychotherapist. Um, but more, most importantly, he's a turned, uh, attachment specialist. He's also a father, which qualifies him for this, um, podcast, but he's gonna talk all about attachment. And what he does is he coaches individuals on how to fix relationship issues or personal issues that tend to, most of the time come back to attachment issues that are unresolved. And so I'm real excited to talk about this topic, Adam. So welcome to the podcast,
[00:01:48] Adam: Man. It's fun to be here. Thank you. And I'm glad to be talking to dads who are making a difference in their children's life.
[00:01:54] Mike: So tell me about your background with attachment, Adam, because I know you, you, um,
[00:02:00] I have a lot of questions, obviously, but you, you practiced and then now you're doing individual coaching.
[00:02:05] You've kind of pivoted into doing that and you talk a lot about attachment. And so for someone that maybe is not aware of this, that's, that's listening to this podcast that's like. What does he mean by attachment? You know, that's great, you know, but, but how does it all, maybe someone that doesn't follow you, that is not up on the ties, that attachment has to relationship issues, but maybe someone that's facing something, issues in their marriage, or maybe issues with their kids.
[00:02:32] Talk to us about how it all comes back to attachment.
[00:02:35] Adam: Yeah, absolutely. So attachment is the way that we connect to other people to give and receive love. We either believe we're going to be acted upon by other people so we can't trust them in good faith or, but maybe we believe we're going to be abandoned cuz we're the problem.
[00:02:48] Maybe we believe other people are the problem. There's different attachment styles, but the healthy secure attachment is the one that believes we can cooperate with our family and with the people around us to get our needs met and, and [00:03:00] mutual fulfillment on both sites. That is learnt from parents. So when I say I'm glad fathers are making a difference in their child's life, a father is a huge figure for attachment.
[00:03:09] The way that you treat your kids is going to teach them if they're going to be acted upon by others. So they have to earn approval. They have to earn happiness from other people. They have to stop abandonment and, and prevent themselves from being abandoned by being perfect, or they need to run away and stay safe from people.
[00:03:23] They need to seek leverage on other people. They need to just make people happy, so they'll leave them alone. That would be bad. Bad fathering. Mm-hmm. comes from that and there's a lot of generational issues that go into that, but healthy fathering is one where you bring in healthy attachment with your children and you cooperate with them.
[00:03:40] You teach them, you guide them, you solve problems with them, you solve frustrations with them. You even solve behavior issues with them cooperatively in your family. That's attachment and that's why it's so important to learn about attachment. If you're a father out there taking care of your. Yeah,
[00:03:54] Mike: So, so thank you for that.
[00:03:56] So I think like one thing that, all of that
[00:04:00] stuff that you said, maybe people have heard those nuggets, right? Like that if you know they're gonna, they're gonna be seeking attention from other people or, or these sorts of things. What are some of the warning signs? So someone that's like listening to this, that, what are the warning signs, maybe that they personally have attachment issues that maybe they have.
[00:04:21] They have to fix. Right? So one of the things that, you know, I followed you for a little while and um, that you talk about is, you know, unresolved attachment will manifest itself in a certain way, primarily in your relationship with your spouse. You know, if you're thinking about with, if you're a parent of young kids and you're gonna generationally pass that on, Unless you address it.
[00:04:43] So, but if you're saying, oh, I don't, I don't think I have any issues with attachment, Adam. You know, that's, you know, I don't know anything about that, but, oh, by the way, these, these issues keep cropping up my marriage, I'm fighting with my wife about something or, you know, we always have this like crazy cycle.
[00:04:57] What are some of, like with the people you're coaching,
[00:05:00] what are some of the common things that, that really are, um, an indicator of attachment issues?
[00:05:08] Adam: Good question. Yeah. Cause I do a lot of coaching with men and with women who come in and they will say, I'm not sure what's wrong, but I cannot stop fighting with my wife and it feels like we're headed toward divorce.
[00:05:19] Um, or they come in and say, you know, I have this secret, this secret problem that I've been doing and I need to fix it, and it's also impacting my marriage. Or my wife is yelling at me and freaking out all the time and I'm not sure what's going on. But I think it's something with her brain or attachment, I don't know what it is.
[00:05:36] And they come in and I say, okay, let's, let's assess every step, step by step. So I check for approval seeking behaviors, perfectionist behaviors, making people like you, fear of abandonment, fear of rejection, fear of being exposed, fear of being too close to people. So anxious attachment tells us that we are worthless.
[00:05:54] No one will ever love us. And there's something wrong with us on the inside that if other people see it, they cannot
[00:06:00] accept us. So they will reject us and will abandon us for it. So we do anything to PE people please and, and approval, seek and just keep people from leaving us. And then we get codependency often of needing to be needed.
[00:06:11] So we try to do things for other people and especially find people who have problems so that we can help them. They'll never leave us. Because when they eventually learn that we can't be, we're worthless. They can't leave us if they still need us. And then there's avoidance style, which just believes everybody else is the.
[00:06:27] You can never open up and connect to people cuz it will be used against you that nobody really wants to help you. That no one can really be trusted to work in good faith. That's usually the avoidance style, a fearful avoidant of running away or disconnecting. A lot of men come into my practice who've never dated or never dated, successfully, haven't gotten married, and they're in their forties or whatnot.
[00:06:46] Um, and they want to, they just don't, they've never believed that it's possible or understood how. Then there's a manipulative avoidant, which is pushing buttons on other people yelling at their kids. The, the carrot and the stick in combination kind of thing of, well, if
[00:07:00] that didn't help, if if making you happy didn't work, then I'm gonna make you unhappy until you do what I want.
[00:07:04] And many of these men that come in may not have some of these issues themselves, but their wife does, and they're trying to adapt to her and work with her, or work to take care of the kids and help the kids have healthy relationships. But the kids are going through some of these problems and the wife is manipulative, and the kids are becoming anxious and stressed out.
[00:07:21] Kids have eating disorders, kids have anxiety issues, all kinds of problems, and they come in, we do a deep dive on where the attachment issues are and what is happening in that system, and then I build them a custom plan. Here are the steps we need to take together over the next four sessions, over the next eight sessions, whatever.
[00:07:39] It's, I work really fast. Uh, here is how we are going to apply this plan to improve your attachment so that you are feeling better to help your kids so they are feeling better to check your kids and have conversations with them if your kids are approval seeking, if your kids are anxious all the time, if your kids are stressed out all the time, if your kids are detaching, if your kids are having these issues, let's check for those.
[00:08:00] And we run through that plan, and four to eight sessions later, man, people are rocking. They are doing so much better because they understand what emotional intimacy is. They understand how to ask for help. They understand how to work with their kids cooperatively and even difficult lives. They learn how to work with them and build a more harmonious family system that is connected and loving based on more secure attachment.
[00:08:21] That is what it is. That's what you must learn to do. And those are the warning signs that a lot of men are, they're on the fence about, but it can be fixed if you're not sure these things can be fixed.
[00:08:32] Mike: Yeah. I think, um, you, you talked about the like unwillingness to be kind of intimate or like to share kind of feeling like you have to have put up this like front.
[00:08:43] Which I think is even, it's on steroids in today's world with like social media or, you know, you see a lot of this with, um, with, with men, but you hear about it more with like young moms too. Like you have to put up this facade like everything's great and I'm live, you know, even though you're maybe struggling,
[00:09:00] but that's kind of almost a symptom of a deeper issue of fear, of, of being.
[00:09:06] Judged, you know, that not being accepted, but when that is in the relationship with your spouse, that could be really problematic, right? Um, absolutely. So do you, do you feel like that's like. That's gotten worse, like culturally in terms of like attachment, like , obviously it seems to be like put on steroids, right?
[00:09:25] Adam: Absolutely. So our culture has broken down all of the safety nets that we are supposed to have just to, that we can't slip through. So your core nuclear family is supposed to give you that good attachment, but if they can't, you're supposed to have family around you, aunts and uncles and cousins and grandparents who are healthy and would catch those few people who would slip through and would actually cooperate with them and take care of them.
[00:09:46] Then you're supposed to have neighboring families where people can connect and build those bonds and, and have that intimacy and, and fix that attachment. Then you're supposed to have a local environment, like a village, a town. Your local area of people who would help and would and
[00:10:00] would work with you cuz they're cooperative.
[00:10:01] If you're healthy and secure, you're pretty cooperative with everybody. And if you don't have that, then you have an organization around you. You have a religious community, you have a, a business community, something, some sort of organization. That is built on principles of good connectedness and making things work together cooperatively.
[00:10:17] And that's like five different safety nets we are supposed to have. And many of us, the, the culture that we have has dismantled every safety net, including that core nuclear family, so that all five safety nets are now gone. So we're having to rebuild those safety. All over from the ground up. And so many of us are alone out in the world with no safety net.
[00:10:38] And we wonder why we have so much anxiety, fear, terror. We feel like nothing's ever gonna be right and we don't know how to solve problems. That's because we don't have those safety nets. Now we are fixing that. The internet is offering us the chance to build communities, digital communities. I've got one myself.
[00:10:52] The attachment circle where people come in and build those connections and bonds, get the skills they need, the support, the acceptance. They work with me in there.
[00:11:00] Um, But these are things we are building now because we have to, those networks are gone. It is getting worse, but it will only get better when we start making the steps to get it better.
[00:11:09] And, and that's, that is community. That is not individuals pulling on their own. That's communities pulling together.
[00:11:14] Mike: Yeah. So let's talk about, um, so there, there's kind of this. There's this coaching you do for individuals that are, have, have had attachment issues in the past, so they're trying to, trying to fix that so that they can, they can fix their relationships, fix maybe their relationship with their spouse, friends, you know, kids, that sort of thing.
[00:11:35] What are some of the practices as a father with like young kids that. That we can do, um, with our kids for building that proper attachment. Right. Um, so I'm kind of looking for what are some of the, the societally accepted things that are done that are maybe not good for attachment. Um, but some things that, you know, you
[00:12:00] could change or what are some, some habits or especially with kids, right?
[00:12:04] I mean, I, I think there's the whole like spouse thing. I'm not downplaying that, but I think, I think that's a little bit clearer, right? And you can like communicate and once you kind of get to the root of your own issues, you can share intimately of like your needs. That's one thing you talk a lot about, of like being open and honest with your spouse about your needs.
[00:12:23] But when it comes to your kids, it's a little bit, I feel like if you don't have that training or some guidance from your community, like whether it's like extended family or your parents or whatever, you're kind of flying blind, so you tend to acclimate more towards what the culture's doing, and obviously the culture's broken.
[00:12:39] I mean, that's why you have such a great work that needs to be done, right. And what you're doing. So tell me a little bit about, you know, some tips, tricks or tactics of things to build that proper attachment with, with young kids. You know, I'm talking like, you know, as they get from like two to, you know, like Ericsson stages of development,
[00:13:00] which I'm sure you're kind of familiar with, right? It's like, can you talk about that a little bit?
[00:13:04] Adam: Absolutely. So I will share one big tip that I really teach fathers inside my coaching, especially this one. This one, this one hits for a lot of dads. Um, I call it the 10 minute challenge of every single day, spend 10 minutes with your child, 10 minutes with each child that you have.
[00:13:20] Hopefully you don't have 20 of them, but 10 minutes with each child. Sit down with them and get a game. Any game so that you're not just staring at each other. Yeah, get any game or activity, coloring, book, um, a puzzle, a card game play. Go fish. Depending on how old the child is, just get some toys, play with them.
[00:13:38] And as you are playing, you're doing something with your hands and you're looking at the things you're doing, so it's not as confront. And you spend 10 minutes asking questions about your child branching questions. So this is, this could be based on what we call motivational interviewing. Um, but you ask them a question, you know, what is the best thing happening in your life right now?
[00:13:58] What is the most fun thing
[00:14:00] you have? What is your favorite thing right now you're asking, not like, how you doing today? How about them, Nicks? You know, you're talking to 'em and you're gonna say, how are you doing? Talk to me about some things in your life. And the purpose is not to make any statements. The purpose is to gather information and act curious.
[00:14:15] Be curious about your child. Be curious about them, learn about them. Do not use this time to stop and lecture. Don't use this time to teach. Don't use this time to put your own thoughts in. Don't use this time to talk about yourself, and if you make a statement and end on a statement you've already lost.
[00:14:32] So end everything with a question leading back into the child. This does a number of things. Number one, it get gets you interested in your child cuz you're actually curious about them then, cuz you'll learn very quickly that you don't know everything about them, that you've assumed that you know. And number two, it's going to get your child feeling like a priority in your life because you're interested in them.
[00:14:50] You are sharing an interest in them and learning about them. And if you tell them in advance, we're gonna do this every day for 10 minutes, and you uphold.
[00:15:00] 10, 20, 30 days and consistently keep doing it. Even I've seen even teenagers turn around from, I hate this. I don't wanna do it to, this is great. Can we do more?
[00:15:10] Yeah. I've seen a lot of families start bonding this way over 10 minutes a day. As you get to know each other, as you connect, as you build those bonds, that intimacy, it changes the dynamic of the relationship and it just makes the kid feel like a priority and it makes them feel like they can open up to you and receive acceptance and not be judged.
[00:15:28] That, that 10 minute challenge every day, if you just supply that, that would change so much because so many families don't even do this. They'll spend time in the car driving and they'll leave a granola bar on the way to practice, or they hug their kid real quick and then they talk at their kid, or they turn on the TV real quick and there's nothing necessarily wrong with those things.
[00:15:49] but we don't do the deeper dive that makes our child feel like a priority. We don't do the deeper dive that makes our child feel like we care, that we're interested, that we're curious, and we don't do those deeper connections that makes our child
[00:16:00] feel like my parent, my dad, in this case, my dad really wants to know me.
[00:16:05] Mm-hmm. and wants to be around me. That is incredibly important for the health of a child and the health of relationships. So if you wanna give your child a shot at good attachment, that is a great way to do it and many times over. You might start digging into questions as, as you and the child work together, if they have attachment issues, you might find some pieces in there and start get, helping them uncover some of those feelings.
[00:16:28] And you can work together on those things, but you won't find them unless you ask those questions.
[00:16:32] Mike: Yeah, that's, I think that's great advice. That's a good challenge. It's, it's kind of, it's simple, but. And easy to understand, but you know, takes discipline to execute. Right. You know? Yeah. And I think, so besides busyness, what would be the barrier to why people aren't doing that right now, would you say?
[00:16:51] Adam: A lot of dads, a lot of families don't know the good things we are supposed to do to build bonds. We know the bad things we're not supposed to do. Many of 'em, our parents are [00:17:00] good examples of that. Sometimes our parents are good examples of, of missing the good things and many people have have attachment issues.
[00:17:07] Even if they would say, I, I had a good family. I don't understand why I'm this stressed out. Missing the good things is exactly part of the problem. Learning those good things is why, why you hire a coach. It's why you do parenting trainings. It's why you learn about attachment is because you need to add those good things back into your family's generational system so that you do them for your kids and your kids will do them better for their kids.
[00:17:30] Yeah. The good things are missing. That's why people don't know that this is important. So hearing it on a podcast like, dang, that's a good idea. Yes it is. This is what parents have done though for thousands and thousands and thousands of years to show interest in their children. We're just reinstituting things that are missing.
[00:17:44] Mike: Thank you for listening to the 2 Cent Dad podcast. I wanted to take just one minute to tell you how this show is possible, and that is through my Business EC group. We help software companies get more done by building them amazing developer teams.
[00:18:00] Now, those teams come alongside their in-house developers to help them build more and build faster.
[00:18:06] We are a purpose driven company, which means that we use our profits to help support non-profit work in the locations that we operate. We operate in the US, in Michigan, and also in Chennai India. You can check us out teamwithec.com. Again, that's teamwithec.com. So if you're hiring software developers or you know someone that's hiring software developers, check us out. Love to talk to you,
[00:18:33] The, so you talk about like they, you know, they know the things to do or what, how, how is, how is the understanding around attachment? Changed or stayed the same. You know, I was talking to my wife about this before and she's like, she's like, you gotta ask them about Mary Ainsworth and like, some of the past studies with, you know, modern studies versus like classic studies on like attachment and, and how that's changed.
[00:18:57] And you know, there's things tied in with that, like the
[00:19:00] cried out method versus not doing the cry out method when they're so young. Mm-hmm. and, you know, Some of that is driven culturally, like I think by, you know, there's just people like, oh, you know, they need to be tough and you need to just know, you know, cry it out and then like they scrape their knee, you're fine.
[00:19:15] You know, or distract 'em or like things like that that are almost cultural but are also baked into a family circle, right. That are gonna gonna. Sway you one way or the other, but can you tell, can you talk about like kind of how the, the some of the studies on attachment or things have, you know, changed or stayed the same, you know, the last like let's just say even 50, 50 to 60 years?
[00:19:38] Adam: Sure. Uh, attachment has got worse in 50 to 60 years and people are trying to rediscover the good, but people are becoming very obsessed over the. Specifics as if one wrong move is going to destroy your child's attachment. Um, having your child cry things out because they got hurt one time and you support them and love them and care for
[00:20:00] them and nurture them, but one time they have to cry something out on their own, it's not gonna destroy the child.
[00:20:06] Parents think this a lot. Um, Now, I will say the first six months of life, you don't wanna leave your child to cry things out, . You wanna give them the belief that someone will come and care for their needs. Someone will nurture them, and the research bears that out, especially, especially the first six months are big for not making them just go through things on their own.
[00:20:23] Um, after that, there's, there's a sequence of things you can do. Um, you don't just dump the, the kid off in the woods at six months old, but there's a number of ways to go about this. But the purpose. The purpose here is not to do everything perfect. That, again, comes from anxious parents usually who are terrified they're gonna do something wrong, and they don't know the good things to do.
[00:20:43] So they're trying really hard. They're defaulting really hard to not doing the wrong things. Instead, we need to focus on doing more of the right things. That leads to creating something I call a self-correcting family system. A self-correcting family system is one that can absorb little
[00:21:00] mistakes because the child can come to you and check in with you and get reassured that the love and connection and bonding is there and the acceptance is there.
[00:21:09] That's the 10 minute challenge leads more to a self-correcting family system. Because as you accept the child, give them warmth and care and nurturing. It can overcome some of the smaller mistakes you might make because you can talk about them later, and the child could say, you know, you could say, do you ever feel like you're not accepted?
[00:21:28] Do you ever feel like you're lonely? Do you ever have a hard time believing people love you? And if they say yes, You can say, well, like, well, like why, what, what are you thinking there? And they can bring it up. They can bring up things that you did wrong. Yeah. And as a loving parent, you can go in and say, okay, you know what?
[00:21:43] I hear you. Um, that hurts. But here's what we can do to talk about that. Let me provide context. Let me teach you there. Let me explain what's happening. Let me, and, and let me apologize. Let me get acceptance from you. Let's accept each other. Let's cooperate to solve this problem. And if you raise your child to
[00:22:00] cooperate with you to solve problems rather than that's on you, man.
[00:22:03] You're on your own over and over and over. You're doing the good things. So I encourage people, a lot of people do like attachment parenting and, and the, the, the research and all of that stuff they dive into and, and it's good to know. Do not worry about being a perfect. Build a self-correcting family system.
[00:22:22] That's what I teach because that is what will carry the day for the next 80 years of your family. The, you know that that's what will do. It is building a self-correcting family system that gets better and better as it goes on instead of just trying not to do the wrong things.
[00:22:36] Mike: Yeah, I think that's great advice cuz I think you becoming obsessed and then consequently anxious about avoiding mistakes is a worse place to be than like, let's at least do these positive habits and that's gonna help us identify areas that we screwed up or whatever. Right? Yeah. But I think that's, as I think about that personally, and I think about dads that are probably in the same
[00:23:00] boat, it's kinda like, well, the 10 minute challenge is actually really easy.
[00:23:03] But it's like those, those positive things, they could be intimidating. Cause it's like, well, I don't know what they're gonna say. I don't know what, how to respond to that. But it's like, that's the whole point. You just kind of gotta dive into that and deal with it. Right? It's like you don't, what's the, the, the, if you don't do it, then it's, you're worse off.
[00:23:23] Right? I mean, it's like the same with your spouse. Right. You know, you need to confront some of the issues. And, um, I think that's one thing that you had a tweet a while ago that said, like, you talked about shining your knees with your spouse and it's like, I think there was like a, there was a thought experiment.
[00:23:38] It's like, imagine if someone didn't tell you anything that they wanted and then just blew up whenever you didn't give them what they wanted. It's like, wouldn't you rather have someone clearly communicated their genuine desires and what they want and then you can meet them? It's like, well, when you put it that way.
[00:23:52] Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. Even though there's a lot of people that operate that way that they don't share, you know? Very intimately
[00:24:00] what they want. And it's like similar with kids, right? It's like you, you need to, you need to be able to be vulnerable with them. Ask them, Hey, where were your needs not met?
[00:24:10] Like you said just a second ago, Hey, where did you ever feel not loved or, you know, not cared for, not watched out by, you know, me and mom or whoever, you know, and then be like, okay, that's, you know, I can do better this time. I'm sorry. You know, maybe there was a circumstance that that drove that, but it's like, That's why I think, you know, when I talk with my wife about parenting, it's like it's this weird.
[00:24:33] At the extreme is bad either if you're just like completely neglecting of a child, like, you know, cry it out, whatever. Or if you're like, treat 'em like an adult too fast, right? Like, oh, we're just gonna do everything. Like, we're just like equals, right? Like that's not a healthy balance either with kids as they grow.
[00:24:50] You have to like almost treat them like, like equals, but still like you're a coach to them, right? And you're still guiding them and it's. That interplay is, is kind of a delicate
[00:25:00] balance, but you have to be vulnerable and honest with them to say, Hey, I screwed up and actually need a, I need, I need to ask career forgiveness in this situation.
[00:25:08] That's hard for parents. I think They feel if, especially if they don't have confidence, right? They feel like, oh, I can't do that, or else I'll be, I'll look bad or something. It's like, What, who cares?
[00:25:21] Adam: Losing control over the situation by apologizing and cooperating with your child. Yes. Now I call a childhood, uh, especially when they're 12 years and up.
[00:25:30] It's apprentice adulthood is what it is. You should be cooperating with them and they're your apprentice and you are teaching them toward the direction of them eventually becoming a journeyman adult on their own and then a master adult on their own. It's master and apprentice is what it is, and, and it should be loving and kind.
[00:25:46] And guided and explained and taught to them, that is crucial that they'd be able to cooperate you with, with you during those years. If they can't. That's where so many people are right now, and, and teens are, and, and adults are now. If
[00:26:00] they came out of childhood, like with no cooperation at all, then they turned 18 and all of a sudden they were adults and, and they just didn't know what to do.
[00:26:08] Sometimes they go crazy, sometimes they go wild. Sometimes they just buckle down and collapse. It's because they weren't trained and taught and apprenticed and cooperated with, now they think everyone in the world is going to act upon them with no love. Bad place to be.
[00:26:23] Mike: Bad place to be. Yeah. And and the, the notion of even having, having a set of values as a family and, and kind of a mission as a family and having like a, a sense of family identity.
[00:26:37] I spoke with a guy recently on the podcast and he talks about seeing the family as a team as opposed to a nest that you're just gonna launch people out of and it will be empty, you know, someday. It's like, I kind of like that analogy and it's like, this is where, this is where you're at in this whole process.
[00:26:53] You're part of this, this generational, you know, Family, and this is what you're gonna do someday. And it's like,
[00:27:00] and we're, but we're here to support you. I mean, attachments at the root of that because it's like, we are, we are behind you we're for you. That sort of thing, you know? Mm-hmm. .
[00:27:11] Adam: Exactly right. So it is a generational system that is supposed to build on itself with each passing generation.
[00:27:17] It has been broken, and again, that goes back to the safety nets that have been shattered. We are rebuilding them parents who are fixing their attachment now and then training their children in attachment. Hopefully we get the worst end of the stick and every child and every descendant who comes after us will have a family system built in.
[00:27:33] If you do it right, if you build that self-correcting family system, it's not just for you and your kids, it's for the next five
[00:27:39] generations.
[00:27:40] Mike: Yeah, that's a great perspective to have. Um, I wanna ask one more thing. I wanna shift gears a little bit. So we talked about you, you gave us a, a nice tactic for kids, but let's talk about marriages a little bit and like how, you know, especially as, as husbands, as men, What are some of the things, what are some of the common things
[00:28:00] that you see with attachment issues or relationship issues between a husband and a spouse, especially when they're raising young kids and that's a high, high, you know, stressful, like new territory.
[00:28:09] What are some of the tactics you give them to kind of, you know, maybe. Bring to light some of the issues that need to be addressed or like a, like this 10 minute, you know, tactic with kids. Like what's an equivalent for how couples can strengthen their, their relationship and their marriage in the midst of raising kids so that they can model that and they can have a strong foundation for
[00:28:30] the family.
[00:28:31] Adam: I will tell you this, I wrote a book called Exhausted Wives, bewildered Husbands about women who have anxious attachment style, and men who have avoided an attachment style. And the women come in very anxious and the men are a little bit more emotionally detached and they're pulling back and that works okay as the woman seeks his approval and he kind of runs things.
[00:28:48] It works okay until you have kids, and then she starts focusing so strongly on the emotional wellbeing of the children. While you are not used to focusing on emotional wellbeing at all, for you, it's very matter of
[00:29:00] fact, get the kids through the survival to 18, launch 'em out kind of thing. And you love your kids, but you don't know how to emotionally connect with them or with your wife.
[00:29:09] And emotional vulnerability is scary and it's hard and you push back on it cuz it's just weird and you don't know how to do it. And she starts seeing you as an enemy who is hurting the kids emotionally by not bonding with them. And it gets worse and worse and worse as the years go on. This is a big reason that women file for divorce, a 70% statistic that women file for 70% of of divorces.
[00:29:32] This is a big reason why, and you fix that. Any men out there who are living in that right now, you fix her resentment, not by repairing things with her. You fix the marriage by repairing of the attachment bonds with your children first and it dismantles in her brain the fear that you are now an. And it changes you into a loving partner and an asset for the family.
[00:29:56] As the children become more healthy and secure and
[00:30:00] bonded and safe with you and their anxiety and stress goes down, she will then disarm a lot of that resentment against you. Not all of it, but a lot of it. And it will become easier for the two of you to bond and build your connection back. That is very important, that step right there.
[00:30:13] So any husband out there who's in that? State. That's how you do it. Fix things with the kids. Learn about attachment. Sign up with me, work with me, whatever you wanna do, but learn about attachment. Build those bonds with your kids and that will help your marriage first. That's the, that's the proper order.
[00:30:29] Mike: Boom. There you go. Thanks, . I appreciate it, Adam.
[00:30:34] Adam: Absolutely.
[00:30:34] Mike: Hey, thanks for being on, man. I really, I really appreciate, um, just hearing about this issue. I, I feel like it's not talked about enough. I'm sure you feel like it's not talked about enough, but, um, tell people where they can find you and kind of what's a good next step, you know, to kind of consuming your content or maybe even working with you.
[00:30:51] Adam: Sure, yeah. I've got three big places to find me. First is Instagram, so I'm @attachmentadam on Instagram. You can DM me straight on there. I've got a ton of written
[00:31:00] resources that you can look at and really cool pictures, things like that on there. But you can find all those resources on my Instagram page @attachmentadam.
[00:31:07] Number two, and this is a funny one. TikTok, I'm @attachmentbro on TikTok. I almost hit 200,000 followers. Wow. I do live streams six times a week. I know. I did seven, I think seven live streams last week. Um, TikTok of all places Yeah. Is blowing up with attachment and relationships and love and learning about all this.
[00:31:27] The new generations are eating it up, so if you wanna see me talk, I don't dance, but if you wanna see short video clips you could share with your wife. Friends, you wanna find cool things over there. I'm @attachmentbro. And then number three is my website, adamlanesmith.com. On there you're gonna find my Attachment Bootcamp video course.
[00:31:44] A lot of husbands go through this together with their wife, and it teaches you a shared language about attachment, about relationships, teaches you how she's going to bond, how her bedroom drive works, and how yours works, and how you can bond and how to co-parent effectively to build healthy, collaborative
[00:32:00] generational family systems.
[00:32:01] The, the Self-Correcting System, the bootcamp course will show. Um, my coaching is on there. I'll work one on one with anyone. The biggest thing I teach right now I'm looking at is my Attachment Circle community. You can come in and work with me in there, in the group setting, but you can meet other people who are focused on fixing this attachment and building healthy families.
[00:32:19] And like I said, we are all meant to have a community surrounding us on building that private community. The attachment circle that's on my website, Adam Lane smith.com. Awesome.
[00:32:28] Thank you Adam. I appreciate it, man.
[00:32:30] Absolutely. Thank you for having me on. This was good, and I hope every father out there, the last thing I wanna leave you with is this can be fixed.
[00:32:39] You don't have to get it perfect. All of this can be fixed. It's just skills. You gotta learn, things you gotta practice and connections you gotta make, but it can all be learned and it can all be fixed.
[00:32:49] Mike: That's awesome. That's, that's highly encouraging. So thank you.
[00:32:53] Thank you for listening to the 2 Cent Dad podcast. If you enjoyed this podcast, please share it with
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[00:33:41] Thanks.