From a small village in Pakistan to Raleigh

Uzma Miraj, a student from Pakistan, talks about her life in Pakistan and her first trip outside of her hometown to pursue climate change at NC State University. Uzma shares with us stories from her life in Pakistan, lifestyle in in her village and broader society, and her work in clean water and environmental sustainability.

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Creators & Guests

Host

Abdullah Najjar

What is Connecting the Pack?

"Connecting the Pack" is a podcast from WKNC 88.1 FM HD-1/HD-2 that allows international students to share their unique stories and how they have ended up studying at NC State.

Abdullah Najjar 0:00
All right, welcome everybody to another episode of connecting the pack. Today I am joined by Uzma Miraj. Uzma is a student here at NC State University. And she's currently pursuing a master's in climate change and society. She's a student from Pakistan, who recently started her journey here at NC State University. And today, we're going to try to talk about a little bit. We're going to try to tackle her educational journey back in Pakistan, and talk a little bit more about her current involvement with NC State University. So without further ado, who's Mo, welcome to the studio.

Uzma Miraj 0:45
Thank you. Thank you for having me here.

Abdullah Najjar 0:48
Absolutely. So before we talk about this interesting program that you're a part of right now. I would be interested to know more about the, your educational journey back home in Pakistan, which I'm sure was quite different from what you're currently pursuing. So maybe you can walk us through your, your, your, you know, your, your involvement in academia, or in the academic world back in Pakistan? And and what sort of program you were involved in before you started here at NC State?

Uzma Miraj 1:31
Yeah, sure. So my academic background is very different and unique for me and for other people as well. I am from a small village in Pakistan, that is called Passou. My village name is Passou passou. Yeah. And it is in the northern part of Pakistan. And the province, which is not considered province yet. It's called Gilgit Baltistan. Okay. Um, there is a small village there. So I'm basically from there. And we usually have like small villages, and we are like, very closely involved with our family. In the fields. We work in the fields we like. Yeah, we cultivate are on food, like vegetables and all that. And we have a cow's Yeah, we have like domestic animals in our home. So yeah. So I did my schooling from my village till grade eight. Then I moved to the city, which is called Gilgit. Gilgit? Gilgit. Gilgit. Okay. Yes. And then I did my, like my house Camrys study from there, like from my, my college, like my FSU from there. Then I moved to the big cities of Pakistan. For my bachelor's degree. For my four years degree. Yeah.

Abdullah Najjar 3:09
Wow. So you started out in a very small village where you guys grow your own food? Yeah. And have cows and yeah, and then you gradually you you're transitioning into sort of a bigger environment, a bigger city, and you're in a different maybe culture in a way would you consider it? Yeah.

Uzma Miraj 3:33
culture as well as language. I'm not language we have like national language, but mostly cultural. Oh, yeah.

Abdullah Najjar 3:40
So what would you say is something that is very significantly different? When it comes to the culture in the in the city that you moved into, compared to how things were in your in your village? It stands out. Yeah.

Uzma Miraj 3:58
There's a lot of random people are very different. Like in the city, comparative to the village, the village people are very simple. And but when you move to the cities in you, like interact with different different people from different cultural background, so yeah, and yeah, and the thoughts, the behaviors. I mean, everything is different is your culture is different. So I think, yeah, wow. It's kind of tough. From moving from a village to a city. And yeah, interacting with people who are from different background. And

Abdullah Najjar 4:48
yeah, it's hard to make maybe connections in such environments or was it you think, easier now? They were in the city.

Uzma Miraj 4:58
Yeah, from the beginning. It was very, very different for me, like interacting with people from different regions. And I don't know how to explain it.

Abdullah Najjar 5:15
Like maybe the, I guess their upbringing had played a role in sort of, you know, determining how they behave correctly, because they've always lived in a city. So they find it hard to deal with Village People.

Uzma Miraj 5:32
No, that's not a thing. But due to cultural difference. Yeah. There are differences in thoughts, or maybe. And, also.

Abdullah Najjar 5:46
Yeah. Wow. And that would be what's the name of that city again, that you were in?

Uzma Miraj 5:53
That's Rawalpindi. And it's, it's in the province of Punjab. So we have like provinces in Pakistan. Yeah.

Abdullah Najjar 6:02
Wow. And you spent, you spent your university years there? Yeah.

Uzma Miraj 6:08
I spend my university there. And it was my first time moving to a big city. And living alone, from, like, far from my family from my mother, my father.

Abdullah Najjar 6:22
Gosh, so that must have been maybe hard, not just for you, but for them to let you go into like a big city and to move out and to spend your college years.

Uzma Miraj 6:33
Yeah, our parents are, I think, used to have that because we have no choice. But we have to move from our family from our hometown, because for our education, they are very supportive regarding our education. So yeah, I think it's now not hard for them to do sending their children far away from them. Yeah.

Abdullah Najjar 6:59
Oh, that is very nice, actually, to have, I guess. Parents that are maybe accustomed to the idea of letting their child pursue education outside and to kind of become more independent. Yeah. So that would, so you would spend four years or there or would you maybe into summer visit? Yeah.

Uzma Miraj 7:26
I used to visit in the summer as well as in the winter. We used to have winter breaks as well. And for the summer, we used to have three months breaks. It was a lot. I mean, yeah. And we used to have the bricks from the start of June, and it goes on till 15th of August. Yeah. Yeah. And at that time, there, the temperature used to be very hot in the cities. So it was good to go to the village. Yeah. Wow. That time was the best time used to be the best time for me, because the the weather in the village used to be very cool and very, very chilly.

Abdullah Najjar 8:15
So you, you spent four years kind of living on your own without maybe the presence of your family. What do you think? I mean, that was that led to tremendous growth, or maybe kind of shaped the person that you are today? I mean, how would you describe that?

Uzma Miraj 8:41
Yeah, I have. I've seen a lot of transition in myself. I mean, that was not just for your I think that was that was eight year old two years. I lived without my family, but I used to visit them during the summers or like, yeah, in the winters, but I used to live alone a lot because I had to move to the city for my studies. And then for my Bachelor's, I had to move to the big city. So I did was a lot of crawl. I've seen a lot of like, difference in myself. I I was observing like I was growing during because I was learning things. And I was interacting with people. And I think yeah, I was seeing changes in myself.

Abdullah Najjar 9:35
Wow. And you said for eight years does that mean that even in your high school years, you had to move out? Yes. Wow. So that's very I think, I don't know if that many people experience such a thing like a lot of people would first experience being independent when they move you know when they when they start their college years but I Think you've experienced it at an early age, you know, high school years.

Uzma Miraj 10:03
Yeah, it's very common for people from my region. Because everyone moves to the cities, and they leave your parents behind. They live their hometown, and they they visit your family in the summers or the winters.

Abdullah Najjar 10:22
So that would mean, you guys would be staying. Would you consider it a boarding school? Like you guys have like dorms and

Uzma Miraj 10:31
yeah, we used to live I used to live in a dorm. I mean, we call it hostels. Okay. But yeah, they call it dorms.

Abdullah Najjar 10:39
Wow. So that during those years in your high school years, just that when you discovered your passion for, you know, climate change, or, or the, you know, environmental science, or when did you first discover that that's something you liked.

Uzma Miraj 10:58
when I did my second year of education, like the FSC. My brother suggested me, because there's a lot of a lot of carrier counseling in our pod. So yeah, my brother suggested me to go to this field, because that was different. And I had my second year in pre medical. I mean, that was, I had a science background. So we decided to go to a science doing something science. And I'd also thought about it that I think that is a good idea because I am from a mountainous region where there is a lot of closures. And I can I can do some kind of work for my region for my community in the future. And from there, I decided to do my do my bachelor's in environmental sciences. And I've done my bachelor's from a woman University Fatma Gina woman University in Pakistan. And yeah.

Abdullah Najjar 12:09
wow. So that was when you said Fatima Janine? Women University mentioned no. Oh, Fatima, Jana women University, would that be considered? Like a women's college similar to some of the colleges, women's colleges here in the US? Wow. So and you, you pursued environmental science there? And I mean, during that time, in college, was that your first exposure to environmental science? Or did you have a little bit of a background? I mean, you had a scientific background, but maybe not specifically, when it comes to environment?

Uzma Miraj 12:49
Yeah, it was my first first time studying Environmental Sciences. But we used to have a one chapter of, like, environment in our science books, but but not specifically a major book for the environmental science. So yeah, it was my first time. Oh, getting that.

Abdullah Najjar 13:09
Wow. And for people, like myself, who are not very aware of what you guys would probably study environmental science, what is something major that you guys look into? Or perhaps you've explored extensively throughout your four years of pursuing environmental science?

Uzma Miraj 13:32
For the environmental science, I majorly worked on water quality, water quality, yeah. Oh, I, I looked into the drinking water quality in my region. I did a field visit there. And I collected samples. And I tested those samples, whether they are they aren't clean enough for drinking purpose or not? Yeah. So I majorly worked on water. And I collected water samples from glaciers, streams, and even spraying water, because people in my region are directly consumed the spring water. And yeah, my major focus was on studying that in the field.

Abdullah Najjar 14:26
So you've done maybe, would it be would I can I say a lot of field work in terms of water quality testing.

Uzma Miraj 14:34
That was just for my thesis work in my final year. But before that, in my four years, I studied and about like hydrology, environmental management, environmental policies, and what kind of laws are there for the environment in specifically in Pakistan, and how are they implemented and about the environmental impact assessments, where we study about, like, if there is some kind of development, how is that going to impact the environment? So yeah, there's a before developing some things like before doing some kind of construction, there is a kind of assessment Environmental Assessment, which is submitted to the developers who are going to construct something or doing some kind of work yeah how they can how that project can impact the environment, and whether the people should develop, construct something or not in a place.

Abdullah Najjar 15:41
Wow. Which Which part of your maybe field work or practical work? Did you enjoy the most? Was it the water quality testing part? Or this this particular route that you just just highlighted?

Uzma Miraj 15:59
Yeah, I've did a lot of work. After my bachelor's degree, I did an internship with a government organization, which is, which is called forest welfare, and why wildlife and Environment Department. And there I worked on tree plantation activities. Wow. Yeah, it was a project called the 10 billion tree tsunami, where, like, we were supposed to motivate people to plant more and more trees in their areas. Because trees are very important. And it's a kind of mitigation process. Where like, yeah,

Abdullah Najjar 16:46
you'd encourage them to kind of Yeah.

Uzma Miraj 16:47
we, we encourage people to plant more and more trees, and even the organization donated trees to the people to plant them. And yeah, to take care of them. And I used to go to the fields, I used to inspect, like, I used to count how many trees Yeah, how many have survived and how many not. And wow, I used to report that to my supervisor. And I also worked with women empowerment. Like, I mean, yeah. Motivating woman to get more involved into climate issues. Wow. So though, I enjoyed that a lot.

Abdullah Najjar 17:34
Yeah. And that was done for how long? How long did you do is

Uzma Miraj 17:38
I. That was a six months project. Yeah, I was selected for six months after that the project ended and yeah, I was hoping to that that will be explained, expand, like, extend for longer time period. But yeah, it did not.

Abdullah Najjar 17:58
Oh, gosh, I'm sorry to hear that. I'm sure you really, really enjoyed. I enjoyed it a lot. Wow. That was, that would probably be after he graduated. And he said, Okay, so you pursued that for a while? And then when did you start your education here at NC State? And why did you transition?

Uzma Miraj 18:21
Yeah, I came here in August 2023. And I was selected on a project. This is a master's in research. And this is a one year program. I'm doing a one year program in climate change in society. At the Department of Marine art, atmospheric science department, and North Carolina has a collaborative project with the female, woman, I mean, woman universities in Pakistan. Okay, so they have like, their purpose is to train woman from Pakistan in the environmental field. So that is why this master's program has been initiated. And this is funded by the State Department.

Abdullah Najjar 19:13
Oh. Wow. That's a prestigious opportunity.

Uzma Miraj 19:17
Yeah. So I I applied through my previous university for this program, and I got selected for it. Yep.

Abdullah Najjar 19:30
Wow. And this is your experience here at NC State. Would you say that was the first experience abroad or did you have

Uzma Miraj 19:40
No this? This is the first experience.

Abdullah Najjar 19:43
Wow. So you've never left Pakistan?

Uzma Miraj 19:48
This is my first time.

Abdullah Najjar 19:49
Gosh, this is this is really fascinating. I mean, what was that like? I mean, when you got in like you received the letter, and you know you left

Uzma Miraj 19:59
I was very happy that I'm because I wanted to. I wanted to do my study abroad. And that was a great opportunity for me. I mean, I was very glad. And I did not. I was graduated in Pakistan. I did my bachelor's I completed in 2020. But I did not pursue my further education in my masters, because I was waiting for. Yeah, I was, I was trying to apply International, international universities. So my family used to tell me that, wow, how long will you wait like, my mother's face? I mean, are you I mean, when will you go like, and I was like, I will go one day, don't worry. Yeah, I got it. And when I shared that with my mother, she was very proud.

Abdullah Najjar 20:58
I'm sure she was. Yeah.

Uzma Miraj 21:00
And she told me that you used to tell me that you will go there and you will do it. Congratulations. This is great. Yeah, that was a great moment for me. And yeah

Abdullah Najjar 21:12
and you left in August 2023. Yeah. So. So that was you said, your first journey outside of Pakistan? Yes. So first time on a plane first.

Uzma Miraj 21:27
No, it was not first on a plane.

Abdullah Najjar 21:31
Okay, I thought that was first time outside of Yeah. So how were you feeling at that time? I mean, it must have been just, you know,

Uzma Miraj 21:41
when I was coming, I was very tense. Because I was leaving my country. And I was going very far. When I was thinking about that, I was very tense, like, Oh, my God. That's very far. No, I cannot go to my home town. Some words, there was some kind of very tense but I was cleared from inside that. Yeah, I'm going what I want to do I'm doing it now.

Abdullah Najjar 22:15
Wow, that is no, it must have been really? I mean, did you? Did you, you know, take pictures, things you write in a journal. What was your approach? Try to document that?

Uzma Miraj 22:29
I'm taking pictures. Like, yeah, I'm not so used to after writing journal. Yeah, I took pictures. And I think that will be a great memory for me. Yeah.

Abdullah Najjar 22:42
Yeah. And so this is, I'm sure. There's a very different, I guess, culture and different people and everything, just so

Uzma Miraj 22:53
everything is so different. Everything like we have. I mean, I was not very shocked, because I, I already made my mind that I am going to experience all these things. So I will not be shocked.

Abdullah Najjar 23:12
That's a good approach.

Uzma Miraj 23:14
So I will assume that that's normal. Everything is normal here. I mean, we have so much different we are so different in culture, like our dressing code. Our food. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Especially our dressing code is very different. Yeah, I mean, these dressing codes are not normal for us.

Abdullah Najjar 23:38
Oh I would imagine they're very different.

Uzma Miraj 23:41
So yeah, that was there was something different for me. And yeah, the food is also different, but I usually cook by myself at my apartment. So yeah, that's not a problem for me.

Abdullah Najjar 23:58
No, it's very good. I'm sure you would know even how to cook your own. Like, the food that you like, you, know.

Uzma Miraj 24:08
I'm used to that. I still do all my things myself. So

Abdullah Najjar 24:14
that's that's really interesting that you would say that you know, it's it's a you would you would never call something abnormal. You would just consider it normal because that's the way

Uzma Miraj 24:28
Yeah, yeah, that is that is life. I just wild let's call it love diversity.

Abdullah Najjar 24:37
Yeah. And I mean, when did you start learning? I mean, you're now using obviously English on a daily basis. But back home. I'm sure you you didn't and I'm wondering when did you start learning English?

Uzma Miraj 24:54
We I started from my childhood. We used to have English medium education. So yeah, but we usually don't like, focus a lot on speaking English. Right? Yes. We have like, I speak three. Now I speak three different languages. Oh, first is my native language? And then my national language which is called Urdu, Urdu. Yeah. And then this English language I can try. I tried to speak. Well,

Abdullah Najjar 25:25
no, you speak well.

Uzma Miraj 25:28
So yeah, I usually don't speak in English in my country, or in my region we have at home. We used to speak in our native language. And, yeah, when I went to the University for my college and university, I used to speak in Urdu. Wow. And sometimes English. Very rare. That

Abdullah Najjar 25:51
is writing. Oh, really? And you said, you are doing this for years. So you must be you must be like, working so hard to make this experience memorable, and, you know, meaningful in a way?

Uzma Miraj 26:05
Yeah. I'm trying to enjoy everything, like whatever I'm learning in class or interacting with people. Yeah, I want to make everything memorable. And I have no time for traveling. So

Abdullah Najjar 26:23
oh, gosh, you can't, like you didn't have an opportunity to sort of explore the US.

Uzma Miraj 26:29
I went to DC in the winter break. That's amazing. Yeah. But I want to I want to explore more, but I have no time for that. I have a lot of course, load. I took five courses in my fall. And now I'm taking five courses.

Abdullah Najjar 26:54
Gosh, I like a graduate level. Yeah. Whoa,

Uzma Miraj 26:58
because this program is for one year, so I have to complete like 30 credit hours.

Abdullah Najjar 27:05
So yeah, 30 credit hours in one year. Wow. That's the probably the equivalent of maybe 60 credits in undergraduate level courses. Gosh, that's so you have? Until May? Yeah. You're graduating May? Wow. Are you? How are you feeling about? Are you excited? Are you? What's? How,

Uzma Miraj 27:31
um, I don't know, how am I feeling? I have to go back to Pakistan, because I have no choice. But I'm planning to do my PhD. Oh, wow. Here? Because I want to live here. I want to learn more. Here. So yeah, I'm planning to do my PhD.

Abdullah Najjar 27:52
Well, I really hope that plan works. And you get to, you know, study, spend more years here in the States? And do you think you're going to do it here at NC State? Or maybe somewhere else?

Uzma Miraj 28:02
Yeah, I'm right now I'm planning at NC State. But if I'll not get it, I will then try another universities.

Abdullah Najjar 28:15
Yeah. Well, I'm sure you're going to do a wonderful job. I mean, this is the you know, the path you have chosen and these different transitions that you experienced. This is just just marvelous. Really? I mean, this is incredible. I never. Yeah, I mean, I don't know if you see it the same way I see it. But for someone like you came from a very small town from, you know, small village, and now doing a master's here at NC State. That's that's a huge deal coming from a different part of the world. Yeah, that's, that's incredible. Do you ever, you know, do you ever think about it? Are you just too busy studying? Really?

Uzma Miraj 28:51
No, I think about it. And I, when I think about it, I feel very confident and very proud of myself, I'd say because, yeah, it's very hard for a girl from Pakistan to to do all this. And yeah, yeah. But I did it.

Abdullah Najjar 29:13
And that's incredible. Now, sure, your role model to many of, I guess, your peers in Pakistan and inspiration to them?

Uzma Miraj 29:22
I think so. Yeah.

Abdullah Najjar 29:26
Well, that was yeah, I'm glad we had this conversation. And I'm glad we got to know a little bit more about, you know, your life back then and your life right now. This this is it's an incredible transition. And I'm glad you you gave us the opportunity to you know, to learn more about that from you. So thank you. Thank you for thanks for showing up.

Uzma Miraj 29:45
Thank you for having Thank you.

Abdullah Najjar 29:47
Absolutely.

Transcribed by https://otter.ai