F*ck Fear with Christine Spratley: Living Like a Head Bitch In Charge | "V" is for Validation - Action-Oriented Acceptance

Fuck Fear with Christine Spratley: Exploring Validation and Emotional Safety

Join Christine Spratley as she delves deep into the concept of validation in this episode of 'Fuck Fear.' Christine shares insights on 'action-oriented acceptance' and how it’s essential for personal and professional relationships. Through engaging discussions and practical examples, Christine outlines six practical validation moves inspired by dialectical behavior therapy and emphasizes the importance of listening, understanding, and acknowledging reality. This episode invites viewers to reflect on their interaction patterns and encourages the practice of genuine validation to foster emotional safety and healthier connections.

00:00 Introduction and Shots
01:44 Understanding Validation
05:16 Personal and Professional Validation
18:48 Practical Validation Techniques
28:13 Solving the Wrong Problem
29:06 The Challenge of Validation
29:47 Understanding Acceptance
31:00 The Impact of Miscommunication
35:22 Personal Reflections on Relationships
46:21 The Importance of Validation in Society
50:13 Practical Validation Exercise

Creators and Guests

Host

Christine (HBIC) Spratley

Dynamic Public Speaker | Change Catalyst | Career Navigation Coach

What is F*ck Fear with Christine Spratley: Living Like a Head Bitch In Charge ?

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My guests and I will share the ingredients that we use—what’s worked and what’s failed—as we say “fuck fear” and take action to live a fulfilled life. We cover real-life hacks and deep philosophical pillars to navigate the chaos of everyday life—where some days, my only accomplishment is having a bra on and my teeth brushed.

We’re tackling the daily shit women navigate, from workplace politics to relationships, raising kids, and building careers, all with humor, audacity, and zero filters.

So, tune in—tell your friends, and even your enemies. This isn’t about aging with grace—it’s about aging with mischief, audacity, and a damn good story to tell.

37 - FFear - V is for Validation: Action-Oriented Acceptance
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Christine Spratley: [00:00:00] Welcome to Fuck Fear with Christine Spratley living like a head bitch in charge. And we are, um, gonna do our shots today.

All right, hold on. I gotta open the Dr. Feelgood and again, I maybe do the longevity one. No, I'm kidding. The immunity one chaser just because it's so good. All [00:01:00] right. This is the one that tastes kinda like Jack Daniels going down. Well, it doesn't taste like it, but it has the burn. Like it. You ready? Yep.

Here we go.

Oh, oh, that was feistier today. That was really good shit. Oh, wow. They have one that just has ginger in it, like straight ginger. Oh my God. Ooh. That'll grow some hair on your chest. All right, ladies and gentlemen. Ah man. I just wanna do the immunity 'cause it tastes so good now. Um, okay, so today we are on the V in love.

LUVE sounded like a euphemism or on the V, the V. [00:02:00] Um, and the V is for validation and, um. Validation is action oriented acceptance. That's what I figured out for me, Joe, that that's what, 'cause I was trying to think of, okay, well what, what are we doing here? You know, what, what the hell is the reason why we're having to validate or we don't have to do anything, but I'm choosing to validate and show this, um.

Because if you remember, excuse me, I'm still, it's still burning. Yeah, me too. Yeah. What does that look like? Action oriented validation? Well, versus just regular, so, or acceptance. Sorry, accept, or, eh. Action oriented acceptance. So in the U we did understanding, right? Mm-hmm. We, we stepped into their logic, and this is something we do kind of mentally.

We go, okay, how the hell did you get there? Oh, okay. This is who, this is your background. This is your history. This is the way that it has worked for you in the past. These are your belief systems. Okay? Now I understand why two plus two equals six [00:03:00] for you. Like, I get it. I get that validation though. And we're gonna go through different, different, um, kind of moves and practice, but validation in action.

Orient acceptance is, first of all, acceptance means to me anyway, is this is the way it's, this is the reality. This is this situation. Um, it isn't right or wrong, it is just, it's. It's literally acknowledging reality as it is. In the other person, it's, you know, acceptance is their emotion, their viewpoint, um, without resisting, without recusing, without even resigning.

And it's not only acknowledging and accepting theirs but ours. And so to me, when I say validation is act action, action-oriented acceptance. It is going from stepping into their logic [00:04:00] to then coming out and verbally. Um, or in other ways physically conveying that you see their reality as is. Their emotion or their viewpoint as is.

And I like that because for a long time I, I couldn't do acceptance because acceptance to me meant that, well, I just was a passive person along this journey. And, um, some things I, I would be like, well, no, that is not acceptable. And, um, if it's not acceptable. Then I change my reality and I remove myself from the situation.

Um, but so validation in this is I am giving to that other person or to myself. Again, we can take this either with ourselves in our relationship and how we talk to ourselves, how we think about ourselves, how we view ourselves or with another person as, okay, this is the way it is for them right now. This is their emotion, this is their [00:05:00] viewpoint, and.

Because I understand how they got there based on who they are and the tools that they have or the experiences that they have. Okay. I'm gonna tell them. Yeah, I, I get it. I see that. I see that in you and why this matters. And I took this from two different standpoints because sometimes we have, obviously, we all have personal interaction.

And when I mean personal, I mean outside of work. Um, but then I also thought it was interesting 'cause I've. Been doing a lot of reading lately. I'm almost done with the book, um, crucial Conversations, which is gonna, I'm gonna follow this series up with a series. On that because it's an amazing book. Um, actually, my therapist asked me to read it.

My counselor asked me to read it. She said, you may well, like this book. I think, I think my therapist asked me to read it too. Yeah. Recommended by therapist everywhere. But it's, but it's funny because it's a, it's on business. A [00:06:00] lot of it is business. And, and it, it just a, again, I'm one of these firm believers that you, you take who you are into business.

And if you can have a crucial conversation in business, it's because you're having 'em at home, you know? Um, so anyway, I, I digress, but so why this matters in, in the personal aspect, um, you, for me, when I'm doing this and I am, um. Validating a person's experience, how they've experienced the situation, whether that be how they've experienced it from a, um, an emotional standpoint or how they've experienced it, um, from the way they enue this particular, um, set of values or something like that.

But basically it allows, [00:07:00] um. Me to switch off the threat mode, and I didn't. And again, I I kind of, we talked about this in the very first episode. Um, it literally validating, literally lowers the heart rate and the cortisol during a conflict levels in, in a person's body. That's like, like happens and so immediately you are deescalating a situation.

You are opening up for more constructive comments and, and critiques and navigations and just dialogue on a personal level. The other thing that I think is really important is the, you're filling the emotional bank account. And by that it's you, you do the, basically you're filling that in where they're seeing this as [00:08:00] I get to have, I'm having a positive experience.

Um, you know, and the, the positive experiences that I get from you, of you seeing who I am, of you validating who I am, that means that it is full. Like I can trust this. I can trust that when I come to you, you're gonna, I, I'm not gonna have to defend my emotions. I'm not gonna have to, you're gonna go, oh yeah, I get this.

I see that. I see that. I see how you can feel that way. I get that. Yeah. I guess I'd be angry too, and I'm not saying I'd be angry because I believe that that's the right thing to do or whatever. It's just given your situation and who you are. Yeah, I get that. And, and then also, um, it gives the, the, um, the burnout buffer.

And this is from Brene Brown. And just the [00:09:00] unresolved threat, the chronic stress cycle, um, and validation kind of closes that. It's, it kind of says, okay, we're you, you, there's no longer a threat here, and we're closing it. And yes. We can move on now in business. I thought this was really good because again, I'm reading the crucial conversations, make it safe first, um, which is in there, um, you get out of that fight or flight mode.

So again, people are learning that they can say what they need, say, Hey, I, I had this air. Um, or I saw, you know, how many times you've been in, in with a partner. And I always say partner because PPMD is in my. Old world were kind of the, the hierarchy. And there was, and there, there was the C-suites, and then the executives, and then the, the PPDs.

Um, and then all, and then everybody else. But you know, you see somebody making a mistake or you see [00:10:00] something happening, and it's like, if you don't say something, if you don't feel comfortable saying something. Um, so validation is the ability for someone kind of in a hierarchical upper lane being able to go down and say, oh yeah, I can see how you see that point of view.

I can see how you get there. It also, when you're managing and you're managing teams, it also allows them to be safe, to be able to come up and say, yeah, I think you're grazing, but you can go, oh, okay, well. You know, again, I'm validating. Yeah. I get how you see that I'm not just putting it down. Um, and then again, I, I think Google has this and um, it's interesting 'cause they, they've got this in their theory, but, um, safety beats, beats talent pay and IQ is kind of their, their deal and, and how they, um.

They go and allow people to say what they need to say [00:11:00] about and criticize or, or say, Hey, I found the fly in the ointment. Um, and then just the psychological safety, you know, and this is, um, Edmondson from MIT and the, the slash Harvard study, um, the field study about higher learning and performance, and again, the higher psychological safety people feel.

And this is what. Validation helps create is, again, it's not, when I say this, I wanna be clear. Validation is not saying you are right. It's not acquisitioning my stance or perspective. It is just saying your perspective is valid. Like, yeah, it's yours. It's what you have. It's, it's the sum of what you came out of that situation or what you're bringing to the situation.

And so I think it's really important when I [00:12:00] have personal and professional kind of what's at stake. And then without it, you people are always stuck in that chronic fight or flight mode. You know, and we've seen this in different, or I've seen this in different books that I've read and stats and figures, especially for women.

When we start, when we, when I don't feel validated and I go into silence or I don't say anything and I, I'm in that fight or flight mode, the, the body starts taking a doll and the body starts just. Wreaking habit. 'cause that energy has nowhere else to go but inward. And it just sort of fests and fights on itself.

Um, you know, again, the emotional, the emotional silencing that we take in from not validating. So one of the things that I was thinking back to is our conversation, Joe, about, and [00:13:00] you know, when some, when, when someone's explaining a situation, you're like, well, there's. And you come at it from a technical aspect.

Um, and it's like, well, is that really the point here? And I think for me in all of this love and, you know, LUVE and even the crucial conversations that I'm learning more and more about is what is really the point and. You know, is if, am I dealing with someone I actually care about? Even if it's just a little bit like a colleague, you know, you know just, oh yeah, I care about them.

Okay, well then wouldn't I want there to be a good environment for them, even if they're, I think they're dead ass wrong. Wouldn't, I want them to be in an environment where they can have a better emotional bank account, a higher sense of psychological safety, so that they are not in that fight or [00:14:00] flight mode so that they can, 'cause if you're, if I'm in a fight or flight mode, I don't pivot.

I am too busy defending, you know, to pivot. And so again, it's. It's the psychological cost, but it's also the physiological costs that we have. And then the problem stays the same. You know, the, the physical problems are, are just crazy. I mean, think about, and we've had some conversations about your time as, you know, doing corporate in, in my time and you know, just how much I had migraines.

There were, there were times when I would go. There was a stint for about a year and a half where I had like a migraine at least twice a week where it would take me the F out, you know? Um, and, and just, it just literally, my body would just go through all this stuff. [00:15:00] So what's the point of the conversation?

What's the point of the dialogue? Yeah. It reminds me of this. I mean, you hear it a lot in in relationship counseling kind of stuff. Mm-hmm. You can be right, or you can have a relationship. And that kind of, I think, sums up the idea of like, the know-it-all, who wants it to be technically correct, and it's like, oh, is that really the point of what we're doing?

Yeah. Like to be technically correct Or is it to have a, a friend or a relationship or mm-hmm. A healthy dialogue with somebody. And I, I'll, I'll share this. I remember, um, my, my ex and I, he was, he used to be a. Caddy at Merrifield when he was younger. And um, so he knew a lot about golf and, um, he was, he was good at it.

Um, he was, he was, he could see it. I mean, he was technically, he knew what the hell was going on. And I had come from, when we first started dating, I had come from [00:16:00] Dallas and Jimmy was my golf instructor and I'm not good. I know I'm not good. I, I was so bad when I first started that I gave it up and then I went and saw Jimmy.

And, um, but what was interesting was every time my ex and I would go golf, I would get these lessons. And um, and he would always say to me, well, why are you so resistant? And there were a couple things, and again, it wasn't, would you rather be right or would you rather have a relationship? But it was, it was literally like, I don't see you doing it with any of your guy buds out there.

Like he is not telling Kenny how to fricking line up his drive like he is not telling him, like they may help him read a putt or something, but he's not getting behind. And I, and so I knew that going in, it was that, that whole thing where we kind of talked about. In, in the u of going in and saying, well, you know, um, I need to tell you how it [00:17:00] is.

'cause if I don't, then I have no val, you know, I need to control the situation. I need to tell you, or I need to save you. But either way, I am kind of deval validating you. Um, and so it was interesting 'cause I would literally just, and I couldn't explain to him, I couldn't explain to him why it just bothered me so much.

But it is one of those things where it's like, well, what's the point here? And he'd always say, well, don't you wanna learn be better? And I'm like, no, I just wanna go have fucking fun. I'd take, I'd take like eight, eight fricking sleeves of balls so I can lose 'em. And I don't have to find them. Like, I know I suck, like I just, you know.

Um, but again, it's. For me, it's that what's the point here? And the point of validation is going is, is giving you the verbal, and again, we'll talk about this a little bit more, but the, the, the moves, the way you can practice validation, the, the [00:18:00] outward showing of acceptance of where they're at, not where I'm at, but where they're at in that moment and.

What's funny is that another thing that we talked about the other day was, you know, that's the point. It's not, the point isn't to resolve or come up with. We haven't moved that part of the discussion yet. Yeah. We are just now, we're just dealing with their experience of the discussion, which I think is.

Also had, I had to kind of process. 'cause I was like, well, if we're always just listening, then when the hell do I get to be my side of the story and when do we actually get to resolve shit? But this is a part of laying the foundation to resolve things in the future, to continue on the discussion. And so some of the ways that you can practice this and.

Um, dialectical behavior therapy. Um, this came out in the 1990s, [00:19:00] um, but there's six practical validation moves of that. And this is used in VA hospitals to, you know, fortune 100 coaching. Um, but there's six moves. One, be present, undivided attention. You can validate someone. By showing them physically that you're present, that means not on your phone.

That means not to me. One of the biggest things is that, is eye contact. And, um, I don't know if you've ever, it'll be interesting if women, if, if you, I would love to hear your thoughts on this from my women listeners, but if you've ever talked, been talking with somebody, a, a partner, and. You get the sense that they're done listening, they're done, and they're, they're doing a little, they're still laying right next to you.

Sitting next to you, but they're looking around. They're looking at their [00:20:00] watch, they're looking at the tv, you know, they're, they're done. It's not that present, that undivided attention and that undercuts validation. So accurate reflection, paraphrase, everybody that's had any sort of counseling, couples counseling understands that mode.

You know, I hear you. You know, if I hear you saying, you know, this is what I hear. And then read, you know, read the emotions, speak what they. The unspoken feeling, Hey, are you angry? It's, you know, I hear that you're angry. Is that right? And then ask for the comment, you know, but, but put it out there. Name it.

Um, understand causes, um, link feelings to triggers and history. Again, this kind of goes back and if I don't do, if I'm not listening. And I'm not understanding and stepping into their logic, the you, there's no way I can under, I can link the feeling to the trigger or [00:21:00] the history because I haven't done, I haven't stepped into and given them the consideration.

Okay. And then I normalize that anyone in that spot would feel that way. And in that spot means with their history, with the tools that they have at the ability to access them. I get it. Anyone? Yeah, anyone would do that. And then the, the sixth one is called radical genuineness. I'd probably feel the same way.

And again, this is really hard and that's like, oh, moments where you're like, okay, all my defenses are down and I don't need to defend any of my points of view. But yeah, I could, I'd probably feel the same way again, given that person's situation history. And tools and wisdom that they have to that point.

Um, I don't know. I just thought those were, so those are ways to put that in practice. [00:22:00] And I, I think why this, why this fits for the, the validate is that in the, in the love and how it fits is. When you are going from a listen where you're capturing the data, you're understanding, you're building that mental map, and then you go into that acceptance of their reality, but it's going to be you speak that map back to them.

Think of how far that conversation has taken place. You haven't even got, I mean you, you haven't come at them, you haven't. You've just basically said, this is where you're at, like you've heard them. And I think that is one of the, um, for me, [00:23:00] hardest things to do when I'm in a conversation or when I'm, um, in a flight or fight mode.

And that tells me a lot about the relationships that I have. If I feel. Defensive. It's really hard for me to love if I'm always defensive, and again, sometimes that can be triggers from the past that I'm re-experiencing in the relationship that I have, but I don't. I may, I may do one and two, I may do, I may listen.

I may capture that data and nod or say, tell me more. You know, and, and give, you know, their my presence there. I may understand them where I'm cognitively, cognitively aligned. But if I am in a defensive relationship or a relationship that doesn't feel safe, and I don't mean just physically [00:24:00] safe, I mean all of that other stuff,

it is extremely hard for me. To verbally convey validation of your point of view, because typically I view that as it's a me or them because again, all this other stuff I'm doing here, I'm doing internally. You know, there's, but when I actually sit there and tell you, I can see how you, how you feel, that way, I'm trusting that other person.

Goes, okay. That's how I feel that way and may give that back to me, but if I don't trust that other person, me, yeah, eh, I don't know. Maybe I'll just keep that little nugget to myself. 'cause you may take that as well. That means you're right because you damn sure ain't right. And again, you know, I look at the last [00:25:00] part of my.

You know, relationship, um, with my ex. And it got to a point where it literally was like I, and I told him, I said, listen, you think I'm full of shit? I think you're full of shit. Like we, like, we ain't given, we no matter, like we are just not given. So we need an umpire in here. I don't care. It could be a priest, it could be a counselor, it could be your a friend that we both mutually trust, but we're not there because that's what it leads to.

Is this point of I am no longer willing to voice what you need, which is validation that where you're at is, is the reality. Because I see even voicing it as a threat and it's, it. It's just something that, again, again, I'm learning this in, in crucial conversation. The more lag time you have [00:26:00] between addressing something like this, um, the harder it becomes and the more buildup, you know, it's like, it's harder, you know, when they go in there and they scrape your teeth, you know, if you don't do it and you don't take care of it on a regular basis and brush your teeth and floss and go to your dentist, they can spend a lot of time in there and it can suck.

Um, but again, validation is about action oriented acceptance of their reality to them speaking the map back to them. It isn't concession, it isn't. It's the ramp on to sometimes persuasion, but definitely problem solving.

[00:27:00] Joe, what do you, what do you think of that? Because I, I know you are very technical in that regard, but I think doing it like that sounds to me like almost a technical framework. It's just, again, are you solving the right challenge or you know? Yeah. I mean, thinking back all the way to listen, you know, you just think about whatever situation you find yourself mm-hmm.

In like take it with you playing husband or golf with your ex. He, if you skip that first step, I think that's what came to mind. If you skip that first step, you're never gonna get here because you were planning to have fun and he was Yeah. Thinking he was [00:28:00] correcting your, helping by correcting your lack of technical progress as a gap, as a, as a golfer, like you were training to join the.

The, the golf league there. And that's not at all what was happening. So, you know, I think that's what I keep thinking about, like how many times I'm solving the wrong problem. Mm-hmm. And then I, I think, I don't know if these were intentionally put in this order, but it seems like they are because if you skip that first one, yeah.

Oh, you're screwed. They're all built to me. They're all built on each, on the other one, because again, I'm getting data, well, what data am I getting for the, what problem? And then two, if I am sitting here going, okay, am I'm trying to understand it. Well, if you're looking at it from a, just a pure, okay, she wants to get better and just not out here to have fun and be spend time with me and share this time with me and we can laugh and joke and blah, blah, blah, blah.

Then again, I'm understanding it differently. I'm reading the room [00:29:00] differently and I'm sure as hell not gonna validate. I can't validate that 'cause I don't have the first two. Yeah. I think another thing that I was thinking, um, was how difficult validation is for us, where we are as a society. Because I think our misunderstanding with acceptance, you know, anytime you have anybody talk about acceptance, they always gotta say that Doesn't mean you agree with them.

And I wonder when, like, we lost that, like, like when that was common sense and it didn't need a qualifier. Yeah. But it seems like that's just where we are. We can't, we can't possibly accept somebody. Without sharing our vast knowledge about how we might have a better understanding of whatever topic we're talking about with the person, I think it's, it's so amazing because that's one of the reasons why I started, I started doing this.

Probably about three and a half years ago and, and I've done it throughout my life, but really three and a half years ago, and now I do it a ton when I write my speeches and I go speak, and that is, I [00:30:00] look up the actual definition of words and where the hell they come from. Like I do, I go to the Oxford Dictionary and I look up and I go, okay, and I don't assume that I know the actual definition of the word.

It's like playing telephone. For those of you that don't know what telephone is, it is when back in the day, we didn't have anything except our imagination. One person, you'd have a group of friends and you'll be sitting in a circle or somewhere and one person would whisper something into the ear of the another person.

Like five people later or six people later, whatever, the person at the end would say, this is what you said. And it would have all of this different. Like you're like, what the hell? How did that get there? But again, it's like we've taken things and we again passed on from generation to generation or communication or, or I just let read the cliff notes of somebody else's opinion.[00:31:00]

Um, and that's how I've gotten this word acceptance. And to me, um, part of it for me was what acceptance meant in our family. That's where my, my definition came from, was 'cause I get, I grew up in a really messed up family, so acceptance meant shut up, we're not gonna talk about this. And we're like, we're just like, you better just go along.

Like that's what acceptance meant. And so. It was really great for me when I learned that. It just means it's reality. Like it just means that's, that's that's their reality. Yeah. And I think it's awesome when I can do that with myself, not just with other people, but just with myself, because if I'm not.

Accepting my reality. Again, if I'm not listening and I'm not checking out the right challenge, what is the true challenge? And if I'm not trying to understand my logic and how I, and I'm not stepping into that [00:32:00] and I'm fighting it, or I'm just giving my advice, monster, then I don't validate myself and I don't accept that.

And again, if I can't accept that, if I can't do that, I'm not dealing with reality. So what the hell's gonna change? Yeah. I think also the idea of how healthy it is versus the opposite approach of saying, you know, I might not agree with you, but I still value you and helping somebody feel that way more than just saying that.

'cause that even sounded sarcastic the way I was saying it, but it made me think of a, of a quote, like, it's, it's an old theologian, Leonard Ravenhill, you know? Mm-hmm. Background being a pastor, but a man with an experience is never at the mercy of a man with an argument. Mm-hmm. And I think that. I don't think he was saying that in the terms of like an apologetic, like trying to convince people or proselytize people.

I think it was more like just that's the way it is. Like you're never going to argue somebody out of their experience, which I think why it's so important when you're having a conversation and [00:33:00] validating to start by saying things like. I mean, you can disagree with them, but you can say, like, in my experience, without saying like, your experience is wrong, dummy.

Mm-hmm. You know, there's, there's gentle ways. Gentle's the wrong word. There's, there's healthier ways, constructive ways, validating ways to disagree with people versus the normal. What feels like normal in our society right now is, oh, you're wrong, or, well, again, it's that whole. It's that whole, we talked about this in, I think it was maybe the first episode where we were talking, we kind of talked about the political perspectives and I mean, and we got some shit going on.

And, um, just that whole thing of how do you sit across, 'cause I, I've had these conversations and how do you sit across from people? Um, when you're like, oh my gosh, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. And it's really hard. But [00:34:00] if I do, if I sit there and I go, okay, this is where they're coming from, and I go and I look at what is their, what is the real challenge that they're having?

What is the real issue that they're having? Um, I had a friend yesterday we were talking and um, and I said, I don't know why this came outta my mouth. We were talking about the president. And, um, I said, yeah, we've got a, we've got a 60-year-old, we've got a 60-year-old man being 60 as president or a 60-year-old, 60-year-old man being six.

You know, at, at as president and it's just like, okay, that's the real issue. Please go to therapy. Um, but, and that's, and not just that, but there's a lot of people, you know, that, that I think that about, but it's, and probably, um, me included at times. But it's like, again, if I don't approach this from what is the real challenge for them here and what is, what is their challenge and then what [00:35:00] is.

How do I listen? How do I get that data and how do I see it from their logic? And then how do I go, okay? Because if I don't validate them, they are going to be in that flight or flight response. I'm going to be in that fight or flight response. I'm going to take you to the fricking mat and I'll tell you this happened.

This is when I knew, I mean, I knew I had, I knew it was time for, for me to move on from my relationship, um, for my ex. But I'll never forget this. This was a day we went, um, we were going to lunch and I didn't wanna go lunch, and I used to go pick him up at lunch and we'd go to lunch and, um, we, and I, I told a friend of mine, I said, I don't wanna, I don't wanna do this.

I wanna go lunch, I wanna sit across from the table from this person, let alone go act like we like each other. Like I don't, you know, it's just, what's the point? So we went to lunch and we came back and I was getting ready to drop him off and [00:36:00] he said something and was making a point about something and I was like, God, that's like, I just didn't understand what this I had missed.

There was something missing in the underneath the floor mat of my car. And I, um. And he just wouldn't let it go. And I was like, what do you, what? Okay, what's the point? Like, no, you know, like, I don't care. Like it's a 10-year-old car, I'm gonna run it. It's got 120, you know, 110,000 miles on it. I'm gonna run it till it's 130, you know, and it drives, you know, and, and it just round and round and round around.

And finally, and this is what happened, and this is where there was no love. Yeah, there was no validation. There was no, like, I didn't understand, I, I, I didn't understand the issue. I didn't understand, I didn't understand anything. I wasn't listening. Um, I was listening definitely to respond. I was not seeing where his logic was coming from and there was no way in [00:37:00] hell is gonna validate anything.

But what happened? So I'm sitting here, sitting here, and this is where it turns, I literally flipped on. My debate negotiating corporate mode, where I was like, I'm gonna take you down and I'm gonna logically take you down in everything that you say. Now, I didn't verbally tell him he was a dumb ass or anything like that.

I didn't go out, but I literally was like every, like, I have this mode in me when I get into a, a. Kind of a mean hostile negotiation where it's like I get real fine tuned and I'm like picking apart everything from a logic perspective, and it has nothing to do with meeting them at where they're at. It is everything to do with, I'm going to make you feel as small as possible from a logical standpoint.

Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And that immediately, I mean, I didn't even, he got, he got outta the [00:38:00] car, slammed the door, got outta the car, and I got to the light and I just broke down because I had done that to somebody that I professed that I loved. And I immediately was like, I've got to remove my, remove myself from the situation.

Um, if I want to love and cherish this person, the only option to do that is to not be in the same house with this person. I just can't do it. And, but I, I, I say that because that is this disconnect from another person that I feel like in a lot of ways our society has gotten to, um, where it's, I'm just gonna take you down my point of view, my whatever.

I'm just gonna take you down. Whether it be based on logic, whether it be just on insults, whether it's, you know, whatever it is, my goal is to take you down. And the reason why I get like that, or the reason is, is I feel so [00:39:00] threatened that it's like I'm struggling for my own air. And that's a really, I mean, that is fight or flight mode and I'll be damned, I'm going down swinging, you know.

I, and, and, and I don't know. It's, it's that that's not a real, that's not my finest moment as a person, but it was something that I immediately went, oh yeah, we're not gonna do that anymore. No, no, no, no, no, no, no. Um, and, and I knew I had to change. I had to change things. But again, when we're talking about validation and I get to a point where I am not willing.

To validate somebody else's reality.

Why? Why doesn't mean they're right. They're wrong. Like, no, that's just their reality at that particular moment, and it's like, [00:40:00] hmm, what's that about, Christine? Yeah. I think one of the things that complicates. It when you're talking about somebody that you know really well, like a spouse or a partner mm-hmm.

Is that we don't, we don't just argue with them. We're arguing our entire history. Oh, wow. Yeah. When we, when we have a conversation. And so there's always that the element of like, oh, we're not actually talking about the thing, like the context and the, and the actual text of the conversation are two different things.

I would even say that that's every argument. Whether it be, and, and I'll do it from both a, um, a physiological and a, um, psychological every, going back to your comment about experience, everybody brings their experience. Sure. So not only are you typically arguing that history with that one person, but you're arguing the past shit that you didn't work through, or that you didn't bring up, and that you haven't, you know, and they are too.[00:41:00]

And then in business. We're arguing the past stuff. Yeah. Or the past five times. And again, going to crucial conversations. And I, we'll, we'll talk more about this later, but you know, the whole fact of the first time you hear it, you're like, Ooh, maybe they're, maybe, maybe they just an oversight. Ooh, the second time.

Oh yeah. They were definitely mans spanking, you know, like, and, and this lag goes on this leg, and then like the fifth time you're like, Ooh, that mother, you know, that's exactly what he's doing. That son of a, you know. And again, by then you are arguing this whole history along with everything else. And I think one of the great things about putting this in your pantry is it gets me to slow down and go, Hmm, maybe the conversation I thought I had really wasn't the conversation I had.

Maybe my challenge. Is not really the challenge. I think I had [00:42:00] maybe my thought about not wanting to validate this person and make verbal, their reality is not so much about them and their shit, but about me and my shit, and about how I feel insecure. And you know, again, going back to that advice monster, if that's my real challenge is how I feel insecure, that has nothing to do with that person's reality.

Because it has everything to do with, okay, well then what do I, what do I want to do and what am I willing to do to make me feel less insecure? And that typically doesn't have a whole lot to do with me validating their reality. It has a lot to do with me. So again, I just, I don't know. I, I think that. When I go and I am less defensive and more open and show my humanity, [00:43:00] because when I'm, when I'm more open, less defensive, show my humanity, I am actually stronger than when I am on the defense.

And the best thing that I can think of is when I, and you've heard me say this before, when I used to box, I used to hold my breath. And I never knew I was doing that. I would hold my breath and I'd come back and Richard would be like in the, he'd be like, breathe, girl. Breathe. Don't breathe through your mouth, either.

Breathe through your nose, but breathe. And that's what it's like when I'm, when I'm holding this in and I'm, and I'm not listening and I'm not showing that understanding, and I'm refusing to get into your logic and to step into that and to give you that presence. And I'm refusing to validate. You know, it's because I'm not breathing.

I'm refusing what is reality. Their reality, and then I don't have the [00:44:00] ability for me to pivot and to change perspectives. But I certainly don't have, they don't, I don't give them the ability. I mean, one of the, and I love, you know, I love sports, but one of the, the, the. Guys, it just drives me as Stephen a ugh.

Just that whole crass, you know, I mean, just don't, don't, I don't like it. I miss, this sounds so bad. I miss Tim Russer. And, you know, and, and just those kind of conversations and, and just, you know, again, it's just the whole conversation to learn. And when I'm like that they soften, now I can negotiate. Now we can have Pivot, [00:45:00] now we can have the dialogue.

And again, going back to the first episode with Wooden, you know, listen, if you want to be heard and you know if I want to. Love and be loved, then I need to love. And if I want things to change, then I need to at, you know, I need to start seeing that. And I'm not saying that no, you never bring a hammer. No.

Sometimes you bring a fricking hammer. Okay. Um, and, and we'll go into. Crucial conversations because I think that's a great way, especially in business and talking politics and stuff. But in relationships, part of that understanding to your point, was that logic of you're bring, they're bringing everything from the, your relationship with them, their relationship with others [00:46:00] that are in that moment, and that's how they got there and go, oh yeah.

Yeah, I guess I can really see, I guess I might react that same way or feel that same way. I don't, but I might if I had that experience, so. Right. And I think that that little, that what you just summed up could be like the balm that we need to our political culture right now. Because if you think about it, like everything we're talking about with, you know, the V for validation, I don't think it's a silver bullet or anything, but I really think it could help.

'cause the other, this is, if you think about it, people are feeling unseen, unheard, unimportant, which makes 'em struggle with trust. They don't feel safe, they don't feel respected. And then they've, if it happens for a long time now, there's this patterns of resentment and neglect and emotional disconnection that's adding to everybody's fire.

And it seems [00:47:00] like. Politics right now in the us. For us, we care way more about being right than having a relationship with the other half of the country that disagrees with us, I think. I think our politics is a manifestation of our lives and I think that way more in our private and our personal lives.

We want to be right because I think we. As a society, feel distrust, not heard, unseen. And and for me, I believe that yes, I wanna take that into politics, but unless I have practiced it. In my daily life, in my personal relationships, in my business relationships where I am building up my character and my strength to be brave in that they ain't gonna happen in politics.

Yeah, that makes sense. Don't start with politics to practice V No start in your life. Start in your life. [00:48:00] It's, it's. It's like I say, if you don't practice it in the bedroom, you won't practice it in business. You know, if you don't practice voicing, if you don't practice being seen, if I don't do it in private, I will never do it in public.

And again, last time I checked, we elect people. You know, we are, these are, you know, this is who we are. So it's like, and I, again, I was having this great conversation with Preston yesterday and we're like, this is, you know, I, I, and I came back from overseas and everybody's like, yeah, this is America. And, and I kept wanting to go, no, it's not, but it is.

And this is a representation of not all of us, but a good portion of us. And until that happens, until we can sit down and start doing that, until we're sitting down with husbands and wives and families and, and friends, I mean, I've had to do this last week and the week before, deal with this on a very personal level.

But if I don't do that. [00:49:00] One relationship, whether it be the relationship with myself or one relationship with someone that just kind of sends me sideways. If I'm not willing to do it, then where am I? It doesn't get easy. I mean, yeah, it gets easy in relationships where it don't mean anything. You know?

That's why I say fuck fair, doing it scared is still doing it. That's courageous. Like, practice this because. That's when you have the most meaning, that's when you build something with somebody and you build something with yourself. So, I don't know, I don't know that it's a big bomb or anything, but it, it's, to me, it's really simple.

I can't get, I can't go a a, you hear it all the time. And again, I know I'm not supposed to say a, a whatever. Um, you can't transmit some, you haven't got, if I'm not willing to, to show this. And to be this towards myself, I should [00:50:00] typically don't have it with others. And if I'm not willing to do it on a personal level, on a private level, when am I gonna do that in public?

You know? So, ladies, gentlemen, um, this is the, the v go and validate. See if you've got the courage to validate. Someone you disagree with, like not just like, okay, this is, this is what I want. All right, this is your assignment, and then I'll let y'all go. This is your assignment, so one morning. And for me, my, my, I got up early.

I'm an early riser and my, my husband, my ex was in bed and for some reason he was saying shit to me and it was, I know it was shit because of my reaction. Of course, you know. Well, and um, I'm being sarcastic. It was probably being nice and lovely. I. But basically I walk out [00:51:00] of the bedroom and I, and you've heard me say, give grace, right?

And I, I'm like, crotch and go, I've got your grace right here. And so, and right then I was like, whoa, girl, wait a minute. Oh, trigger. Um, you know, and I didn't say it loud enough for him to hear, but boy, I said it till I could hear. And I just, I remember that feeling. I've got your grace right here. And I was like, all right, we need to start our day over girl.

Um, because it was like, like six or seven, like, 'cause I already, I get up early. So this is your assignment. All right. Someone where you're like, I got your grace right here. You know, I got your grace right here. Whether, and it could be yourself, you know, someone that's like that. See if you can validate them, see if you can get and listen without really responding and just gather the data.

See, and then go through the you and and understand, step into their logic and see if [00:52:00] you can map their logic based on their history and that history could be pre you, it could be, it could be their family, it could be their business, it could be whatever. It could be societal norms. Okay. And then if you can just verbalize that and go through and go, okay.

Well, all right. Lemme see. How can I, how can I validate that? Well, you can be present, you can paraphrase. Oh, is this what you're saying? Okay. Read the, you know, read the emotions. Say it out loud. Oh, you're, you're angry. You know, is that what you're, I'm hearing, oh, I see how you could feel that way based on some of these.

History and the triggers that I'm probab, you know, the buttons that are pushed or whatever. And yeah, anybody in that spot might feel that way. And then can you get to, I'd probably feel the same, then say I feel the same way. I'd probably feel the same. [00:53:00] I mean, test it out. And even if you're not willing to do it, pick somebody.

Pick somebody. Pick a situation, and then if you're not willing to do it, ask yourself why. And what, what's at risk for you? All you're doing is letting them be who they already are anyway, and you're just stating it, you know? And again, if that's someone who's in a, in an abusive relationship where they're, you know, and there's something physically at risk for you or emotionally at risk for you.

Maybe that tells you a little bit about that situation. If it's not, then what about it is holding you back? Because whether you give it validation or not, that's the way it is. Right? Isn't that kind of it, Joe? I think that's what acceptance is. Yeah. I mean, I don't know. [00:54:00] So we're almost done. We got one more, one of these puppies, and then we're gonna go on to some other fun stuff and, um, and we're gonna do some more shots.

And so until next time, ladies, gentlemen, thank you, everybody in between tubs.