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In this engaging episode, host Wendy Coulter discusses the profound impact of small innovative changes with Dr. Rebecca Corbin, President and CEO of the National Association for Community College Entrepreneurship (NACCE). The conversation delves into the 'Hummingbird Effect,' where minor tweaks in branding and marketing lead to significant, often surprising results. Dr. Corbin shares insights from her leadership journey, recounts the strategic move to Cary, North Carolina, and talks about how simplifying a mission statement catalyzed NACCE's growth. The episode is rich with practical examples and emphasizes the importance of an entrepreneurial mindset, collaborative leadership, and continuous learning. Concluding with Dr. Corbin's thoughts on gratitude and readiness to seize unexpected opportunities, this conversation offers valuable lessons for leaders and innovators alike.
00:00 Introduction to Brand Power
01:12 Meet the Guest: Dr. Rebecca Corbin
03:52 The Journey to North Carolina
06:02 Testifying Before Congress
07:28 The Buffalo and Hummingbird Effect
12:42 Simplifying the Mission Statement
21:00 Reflecting on Leadership Styles
21:49 Embracing Direct Feedback
22:47 The Hummingbird Effect
23:49 Small Changes, Big Impact
25:18 Adapting Branding and Marketing
28:34 Staying Nimble and Adaptable
29:55 The Power of Facilitated Retreats
32:53 Embracing Change in the Media Industry
35:28 Leadership Journey Recap
39:54 Final Thoughts and Gratitude
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Thanks for listening!
Get Hummingbird Creative Group’s “20 Powerful Reasons To Brand Your Business.”
Schedule a quick 30-minute call with Wendy at https://calendly.com/ideastakeflight/.
Sign up for the Birds of Wisdom newsletter from the Hummingbird Creative Group.
Creators & Guests
Host
What is The Hummingbird Effect with Wendy Coulter?
Welcome to "The Hummingbird Effect," a podcast dedicated to uncovering the subtle yet powerful ways that small innovations can transform your business. Hosted by Wendy Coulter, CEO of Hummingbird Creative Group, this show delves into the stories and strategies behind successful brand building.
For over 25 years, Wendy has helped CEOs and business leaders redefine their brands through innovation and compelling narratives. In this podcast, she shares the insights and lessons learned from her extensive experience, exploring how a strong brand orientation can significantly increase the value of your business.
Each episode features engaging conversations with industry leaders, business advisors, and innovators who have harnessed the power of branding to make a substantial impact. Discover how focusing on core values, mission, and vision can drive your brand beyond mere marketing tactics, fostering a culture that resonates with your audience and enhances your business's reputation.
Inspired by the concept of the Hummingbird Effect—where small, adaptive changes lead to remarkable outcomes—this podcast aims to help you understand and implement the incremental innovations that can elevate your brand and business.
Join Wendy Coulter on "The Hummingbird Effect" and learn how to evolve your brand, attract more customers, and ultimately enhance the value of your business through strategic branding.
Wendy: Hi, I'm Wendy Coulter, and I help CEOs unlock the [00:00:30] hidden power of their brands. For years, business leaders have focused on marketing tactics, but what truly matters is building a strong brand. Think of it like the Hummingbird Effect. Small innovations and branding can lead to surprisingly big results, [00:00:45] increased valuation, a stronger culture and marketing messages that resonate.
Okay, today we have Hannah Jernigan, our show coordinator joining us for the episode. Good morning, Hannah. Good morning. How are you today? I'm
Hanna: good. How are you doing? I'm great. Good. Great. It's
Wendy: a [00:01:00] Monday morning. It is. So right and early well. Not bright and early, but a little early. So great to be here though.
Looking forward to a week in the office. Yes. Yeah. Okay. Today we're gonna dive deeper into the world of [00:01:15] innovation, and I'm thrilled to have with me a local business leader and client. Dr. Rebecca Corbin, she's the president and CEO at nci, which is the National Association for Community College Entrepreneurship, and she serves with me on the [00:01:30] board of the Chamber of Commerce here in Kerry, North Carolina, and you're the incoming chair, so congratulations on that.
I'm really looking forward to your year as the leader of the Chamber.
Dr. Rebecca Corbin: I know, and it starts just in a matter of days. Thank you for inviting me, Wendy. It's great to see you, [00:01:45] Hannah. I'm excited about this conversation.
Wendy: So we are gonna talk with you today about innovation and entrepreneurship and how seemingly small innovations in branding or marketing can lead to [00:02:00] really big results in other areas of an organization.
Nci the way I understand it is the country's largest organization focused on promoting entrepreneurship through the community colleges [00:02:15] with over 3 million students. Am I write about that? Yep. That's correct. Awesome. And while you've been there, the membership has grown to over 400 members.
Do I have that number right? Yeah, just about
Dr. Rebecca Corbin: 400 colleges and universities.
Wendy: That's [00:02:30] awesome. And generated over $32 million in awards through sponsor programs. Congratulations. Oh, thank you. What a great accomplishment. Yeah,
Dr. Rebecca Corbin: definitely a group effort for sure. But thank you.
Wendy: Yeah, well, tell us more about yourself and how you [00:02:45] found yourself in this role and a little bit more about Macy.
Dr. Rebecca Corbin: Yeah, well, thank you, Wendy. I, you know, this is a big year for me because I'll be finishing up my ninth year at Na c entering my 10th year as the CEO in [00:03:00] January. So I've been doing a lot of reflecting on. My career and, and the things that have been really important to me. So my path has been always in one way or another part of a nonprofit or an [00:03:15] educational setting.
It's, it's where my heart is. I, I love serving others and. What I've really been focusing on the last 15 years is working within the community college system. So I worked for community college in New [00:03:30] Jersey for six years. I was their vice president of advancement, so I worked a lot in workforce and advancement and then took over the reigns of NAC as a president and CEO.
So that was the first time I've really been in that role. And I've just learned so much I every [00:03:45] day. I think, you know, this is a wonderful space to be innovative, which I know is, is something that's important to you.
Wendy: Absolutely. And so nay brought you to North Carolina. Can you talk a little bit about coming to Kerry, North Carolina, because we kind of [00:04:00] consider ourselves a hub of innovation, so do you agree with that?
Dr. Rebecca Corbin: A hundred percent. It's an interesting story and I'll try to keep it brief, but the nay board's made up of community college presidents from across the country, and we knew as [00:04:15] we were growing, to give you context, in 2000, 15, our budget was like $1.2 million and we were right before we moved to Cary, we were just inching up close to $6 million a year in terms of our budget.
So we couldn't operate as sort [00:04:30] of a, a startup anymore, even though we technically weren't a startup. So we went back and forth and some of my board members were interested in a c being in Washington, DC that's where most associ. Associations are, and I knew I did not wanna live in [00:04:45] Washington, DC and I knew the expense of it.
It's more policy driven, which is not the core of what we do. And so the board empowered me. They said, you know, we want you to be the CEO we want you to be happy so. You just decide. And, [00:05:00] and so I went on this kind of quest to try to think about, you know, where would be the best place for naci? Where could I find innovative employees?
Where did my family want to live permanently. And we had lived in Wake Forest back in the early two thousands. So [00:05:15] my husband and I had always talked about this, so. I called Scott Rawls, who's the president of Wake Tech, and he immediately took my call and he said, yeah, we have a spot for you. If you wanna come down, we can talk about it.
So we didn't [00:05:30] just settle on the research triangle area initially. We, we explored Tampa, Florida. We had some invitations in New York. But just meeting some of the leaders and especially the care chamber, which you had mentioned [00:05:45] just welcomed me as a leader with, you know, just a warm, not only welcome, but just services.
I found our attorney, I, I found our insurance agent, so that was kind of the path and I've, I've never looked back and [00:06:00] I'm just so happy to be here.
Wendy: Well, so you also had an opportunity to testify before. The small business and innovation, part of the US [00:06:15] Congressional Committee or something like that.
Can you tell me
Hanna: Yeah. A little bit about
Wendy: that
Dr. Rebecca Corbin: For those who may not be aware, you have to officially get invited. So I had to spend some time, I had some help from a colleague prepare remarks that were entered into the congressional record.
So [00:06:30] it was really all about. How important small business is to regenerating the economy because a couple of years ago, as we all know, we were coming out of Covid, so it was just such a warm reception. It was, honestly, I was scared to death. I, I don't think it [00:06:45] came through in my performance. I hope it didn't.
But I look back at that as really one of the bright lights of, of government and, and you know, as you know, congress and the house should serve the people. And I, I was just so impressed by the, the [00:07:00] conversation. So thank you though. You can Google them. You know, I'm working on a chapter for. And entrepreneurship encyclopedia.
So I referenced them back 'cause they're well footnoted and all of the things that you, you need to do to to make it
Wendy: Fit with the [00:07:15] standards. Well, that's such an, that's such an amazing accomplishment. To, to be able to do that. So thank you. Yeah. Well, thank you for asking about that. Thank you for standing up for entrepreneurship and innovation.
Yeah. For the country. So you really do work [00:07:30] in an innovation, innovative space and we've, we've worked together in, in that capacity in, what I love about that is, that's what the Hummingbird Effect is really about, is how little innovative tweaks along [00:07:45] the way can make. A really big impact on an organization.
And so let's talk a little bit about, how that has come to play for you. But before I [00:08:00] do that, I wanna ask you a. A kind of different kind of question, just a icebreaker kind of question to get us started around innovation. And that is if you could invent one gadget or one thing that would make your life as an [00:08:15] innovator easier, what would it be?
Dr. Rebecca Corbin: I love that question. And full disclosure, you gave me a heads up. You were gonna ask it. I only had like 15 minutes to think about it. But I think innovation, the space of innovation requires us to [00:08:30] be able to pivot and, and sort of lean into things that are, can be of discomfort. So I think of what you talked about with hummingbird and the Hummingbird Effect, and I've loved working with you all and how you've helped me.
You've helped our staff. But I wanna [00:08:45] sort of put it in a different realm, which is what is the opposite of a hummingbird would be in my mind, like a buffalo. So that's gonna be my innovative, it'll make sense in a second, but a really good friend of mine who's also a CEO of, of a growing [00:09:00] company in the Philadelphia area.
Talks about the Buffalo effect in terms of leaning into discomfort. And if you know the stories or the abbreviated version is if there's a storm, what buffaloes would do is counterintuitive. They like go into the [00:09:15] storm. A a cow does the opposite. They run away from the storm, so it lasts so much longer.
And so the buffalo knows that if, if it runs in and confronts things. And so my innovative tweak would be. I think it's human nature for [00:09:30] many leaders and I'll put myself in that case, if we had sort of a buffalo meter, because you know, anytime you're sort of wrestling with something, it could be a personnel challenge, it could be a customer challenge, it could be a revenue opportunity.
Even [00:09:45] something really amazing, your instinct sometimes is, oh, I gotta slow down. And I, you know, sometimes kind of wandering off and putting it off. But I think somehow if you had a little. Gadget. It might be an app or it might be something that just reminded [00:10:00] you, you know, you got this, you go forward, you have the hard conversation.
I think that would be a really cool innovation and maybe it would be like a pet rock, right? It's just something that reminds you, like that reset button. Like, [00:10:15] okay, you, you can do this because I think. And I look back over the years on our, you know, our, in some years hockey stick growth, it was because of taking those chances and being the buffalo.
But that being said, I love the hummingbird because I think kind of on a [00:10:30] daily basis, making those small changes has huge results. And that's what I love about what the work that you all do. Yeah.
Wendy: Well, and for the Buffalo Effect, I think about like every day in business there are things that you don't.
[00:10:45] Necessarily wanna tackle, we talk about it in the office. Right. And you just have to, you have to tackle it. Just do it. And things are so much, yeah, so much better. And
Hanna: you've kind of already touched on this, but you have done your Buffalo effect and your Hummingbird effect when [00:11:00] you. Made the decision to not go with status quo and just move to, yeah, DC you took your time, found a different place to go, and you've achieved so much by By doing that, by making that change.
Dr. Rebecca Corbin: Well, thank you for saying that. I mean, some of it was [00:11:15] luck, but I think a lot of it comes honestly down to relationships. I mean, I think, you know, Scott Rawls does a great job running the. Biggest, you know, college in the state. But, you know, we'll take the time to, you know, spend time with [00:11:30] nonprofit leaders, make, make it available for us to have these opportunities.
But I think other nonprofit organizations really kind of paved the way. And I know, Wendy, you operate one, the national women's Business Hall of Fame, which really [00:11:45] honors women. And that's what I love about this community. It's, it's so inclusive. I, you know, from. From many different ways. And it's not just about business, but it's bringing people along.
It's serving people with all kinds of disabilities, including them and, and [00:12:00] the life of the community and businesses. I think that is a very compassionate community. That's where naci wants to be. That is our brand, which we've worked with you on. And, and that's also honestly, what I've learned from working with you is really.[00:12:15]
How to tell your story better. And I think we can all do a better job with that. I know us in particular which is something as you gave me some reflection questions I've, I've thought about as a way that I think your, your firm helps [00:12:30] both business and, and nonprofit clients like ourselves to tell our story better.
And, and that's
Wendy: a challenge for people. It is a challenge. It's a challenge. It's a challenge for any organization that we work with. So let's talk about the Hummingbird [00:12:45] Effect, and I'd love for you to share a specific instance where a seemingly small change in your organization's marketing or branding, strategy led to a significant outcome in the organization in [00:13:00] some other way, right?
Yeah. So think, think about that. What do you, what do you think about that?
Dr. Rebecca Corbin: Yeah, I mean, the example that I wanted to share was. Back in 2022, we had this mission that was written [00:13:15] like eight years prior by a lot of academic people, and all I can think of how to describe it is like word salad. I could never remember it.
It was something about fostering educational ecosystems, blah, blah, blah. And I always like thought about that, [00:13:30] but you know, we had some people on our board that really kind of liked it and it didn't really change what we did. But by really wordsmithing that we, we cut the words like down to just a handful of words.
We put it on the back of our business cards. [00:13:45] So instead of this very long, kind of rambling, couple sentences. We really clarified our mission, which was to foster entrepreneurial mindset and innovative action among our members. And that sounds like a [00:14:00] simple thing, like a little hummingbird thing, but it was really hard.
It took us like a whole, you know. Back and forth on, you know, who are we and all of this. But what that ended up leading to is our first strategic plan. Because believe it or not, even though the [00:14:15] organization is 20 years old, it never really had a strategic plan. It was like, okay, we'll go out and get members and people love us and we'll do good work.
But it led to a strategic plan for 2023 to 2026, which we continue to [00:14:30] refine because we, part of our culture is we wanna lead by example. So I wrote this down. I was thinking back to being in school and when we learned in English class how to write and. My English teacher would always reference [00:14:45] Eby White and, you know, his attribution of the quote, omit, omit needless words, exclamation point, which is such a cool sentence.
And so I've kind of been on that kick for a while. Just because as the world is [00:15:00] so complicated, I think to be good and. And effective in business, you gotta be really clear and you have to be really concise. And again, I think that's really hard too. But I'm, I'm working on it. And, and that just, I think that pivot [00:15:15] to really kind of getting rid of words that don't add anything, you can extend that onto projects.
You can extend it onto anything, like even keeping your house tidy. Like do we really need like 55 T-shirts? No. You know, you just. [00:15:30] Just reduce down the clutter and you can really focus on the message.
Wendy: So if, if I were to say, kind of take me back to that initial situation and the innovations implemented, how would you describe [00:15:45] that as it as it reflects innovation in some way?
Dr. Rebecca Corbin: Yeah, so I would say it was very messy. Just candidly, but I think what it caused us to do is to look at all of the projects and all of [00:16:00] the things we were doing and try to think from an innovative standpoint, how can we do this, you know, more effectively, less expensively, you know but in areas where we need to invest, invest the money to to get the outcome.[00:16:15]
So I think that's really, I think when you're an innovator, it doesn't mean you, you know, throw everything out and start from scratch, but. You really take an honest look at what the situation is, what the opportunities are. So the [00:16:30] way I think of entrepreneurial mindset and, and innovative action working together is really you first have to have the mindset to look at your assets to carefully evaluate who do you wanna partner with, what kind of risk [00:16:45] you're willing to assume.
You know, do, do the, a little bit of research and then once you've kind of really adopted that entrepreneurial mindset, you begin to, to take action. And so even in the example that I gave about the mission, we [00:17:00] didn't just, I just didn't sit down at my desk and rewrite it and email it to people. Like I involve them in the process, which is, that's the messy part, because people are attached to logos, they're attached to missions, they're attached to legacy, even if it's not.
That great. They, they, you know, there's that [00:17:15] human element of being kind of, well, if we change it and nobody likes it or they don't understand it. So I think for me, what innovation means is it means doing the deep work to understand. Both my pluses and minuses as as a leader. [00:17:30] 'cause we all have them. And you know, the other thing is to kind of do a deliberate process.
If you're gonna innovate on something, you'll test things out so you don't bet everything on the first round. You know what you're willing to lose. You learn from it and you [00:17:45] continuously improve things. So how did you measure success of that? Yeah, I mean, I think in part the engagement, so as we started to talk about, well, this is our mission, entrepreneurial mindset and innovative action, [00:18:00] how many people showed up to our webinars?
How many people registered for our annual conference? What was the engagement when we really got clear in the magazine that we published and we started to see our numbers come up. Now the pandemic has kind of. [00:18:15] Thrown everything for a loop. So I think now moving forward we have like more benchmarks.
But in terms of, you know, surveying our members, surveys are hard 'cause nobody really wants to respond. And I put myself in that category. [00:18:30] But thinking innovatively when we have all of our members together, how can we take that opportunity to do the deep surveying while we have them right there?
And how can we engage them to respond to us knowing they are the most engaged members? And that's who we wanna hear from. [00:18:45]
Wendy: So what I think is so cool about the Hummingbird effect and innovation in general is that you can make these, these small changes. And then there's this. Big outcome that might be totally [00:19:00] unexpected.
Can you think of an unexpected outcome that happened that doesn't really, it wasn't something you were trying to measure, but it was something that you just did not expect to happen as the result of the innovations?
Dr. Rebecca Corbin: Yeah, I mean, I think [00:19:15] some, some of the unin unexpected outcomes were. The awareness that it raised, like you mentioned, you know, testifying before the US Congress committee on small business.
That was a totally unexpected outcome. [00:19:30] But by having a clear mission and vision and, and materials that would sort of back that up, I think NCI became more on the national stage. You know, we would get contacted by the Office of the Small Business [00:19:45] Administration. You know, we would get invited you know, speaking before, you know, large national conferences, you know, contributing to articles and things like that, and.
That, you know, the intention of it was really to be clear on what we're doing so we can better serve the [00:20:00] members. But what was unexpected is that the message you know, resonated with an audience really outside of our members. And, and that's what caused us to think, how can we really, you know, capitalize on this and really kind of go [00:20:15] big.
'cause if, you know, my board talks about this a lot and our leadership team is. You know, I think a lot of us are at that stage of our career where we really wanna do work that makes a difference on at scale, because that's where we are as a national organization. [00:20:30] So that means we're gonna have to continue to innovate.
You know, it could be next year we gotta re-look at those words, and maybe we can omit more words next, next year.
Wendy: Who knows? I, I love that. I love the, the omission of [00:20:45] words. It's, it's, it's, we always say it's, it's so hard to come to the simplest, you know, solution when it comes to a message. And so that's a great, that's a great lesson learned.
Take that [00:21:00] one with you for sure.
Dr. Rebecca Corbin: And I would say, Wendy, like a lot of the reflection that I've done about myself as a leader, I realized. My own style is being very collaborative. Like I'm a really collaborative leader. If the three of us work together, I wanna hear what you think. I wanna hear what you think.[00:21:15]
I'll, I'll say what I think and then hopefully we can come to the best decision. But in that kind of a context, you're not always clear. And, and I think sometimes as the leader, we just have to say. Yes. No, we're going [00:21:30] right, we're going left after you've taken in information and I realized, you know, somewhat the hard way sometimes the way I would communicate with people was more trying to pull out the best in them and, and trying to kind of meet them where they are and, and [00:21:45] running a larger organization or a growing organization, I should say.
You know, sometimes you've gotta give like really hard feedback. The Buffalo Effect, right? You know, there's gonna be blow back. But you have to be, and I'm saying this to myself and anyone who might be [00:22:00] listening, you know, even if you are a collaborative, empathetic person, the best thing you can do for other people is give them very direct feedback.
So that's been sort of my own personal innovation that I've been working on in 2024.
Wendy: That's
Dr. Rebecca Corbin: awesome.
Wendy: That's [00:22:15] awesome. [00:22:30] [00:22:45] , how do you, feel like you've learned from this hummingbird effect that you've been talking about today? What things have
Dr. Rebecca Corbin: learned? Yeah. Well, I think I saw a hummingbird over the weekend, by the way, [00:23:00] my beautiful house in the, the wooded area of, of this beautiful place.
I see hummingbirds as interesting because they're beautiful and they kind of pop outta nowhere. So life is filled with surprises and, and I think [00:23:15] sometimes if you don't. Take action. First of all, you gotta be looking out the window or you're never gonna see one. 'cause there's, they're little and they buzz in and they buzz out.
But I think we have to be ready. And I've been trying to like get myself ready in the morning. Like what kind of. [00:23:30] Unexpected opportunity is gonna happen today. Maybe it's to have this difficult conversation that I'm working on, and, and anytime that something comes up where something needs to be said, I'm not gonna just lean into, well, you know, I'm not sure and you might hurt the person's feelings.
I'm [00:23:45] gonna just go right in there and, and address that and have a, a deep conversation about it. But I think you know, big successes oftentimes come from very small little changes. I mean, I think about toothpaste, the adoption of toothpaste. If you ever [00:24:00] looked at that, like in the early 1920s, people, believe it or not, did not brush their teeth.
And they try to campaign saying, you know, you could literally die from a toothache because your tooth gets infected, it goes into your lungs and it can kill you. And so they tried that [00:24:15] approach. Well, that didn't really work. So they came up with these jingles and they wanna have a, a white, you know, white bright smile.
And that's what caused the change. And now you think, you know, especially people in other countries are like, Americans are obsessed with their teeth. They all have to be white and [00:24:30] straight. And I, I think in our own world and our own, you know, organizations, there are little things that we can do that can make a a tremendous difference.
I, I know that with nay. Another example I can think of is we got [00:24:45] invited to write a book a couple of years ago. And so that was like, I was like, oh, that won't be that hard. Well, it was very hard. I don't, you know, I, I, that's a whole other podcast. But anyway. By saying yes to something and, and really, you know, slowly every day [00:25:00] thinking about who can I involved in the project can make a big difference.
I, I hope people think about the hummingbird and realize that, you know, that they are out there, but you have to look for them and you have to really seize the moment. Sometimes doing something small makes a [00:25:15] big difference. Absolutely. Absolutely.
Wendy: So how do you think, I mean, you've mentioned, you know, simplifying a message and I love white, bright smile, right?
Like, that's a perfect example of such a simple message that makes a big impact. [00:25:30] But how do you feel like you as an organization have adapted your branding and marketing as the result of what you've seen happen with these kinds of small tweaks?
Dr. Rebecca Corbin: Yeah, I mean, I, I don't think we're quite [00:25:45] there yet. I mean.
You know, as you know, 'cause you all helped us with this project, we acquired a tech platform at the end of last year through a charitable donation. So it's a wonderful thing and we're, we're still working on sort of integrating the [00:26:00] message and we're not there yet. That was what I was thinking about last night when I woke up at one o'clock in the morning, is, thinking of the clarity, because we're not a tech company.
The tech company now is part of a nonprofit. But how do we say that in such a [00:26:15] way that's simple, that people are like, oh, I get it. I understand. And I think as leaders we have to be, take that time to sort of sit in the stew a little bit and, and really think about that and get good input, you know, from other people.
[00:26:30] Seek outside. Council. So I, I think we've done a, a good job initially on the NACI brand. I think we have some work to do, but trying to figure out how do we describe this tech platform? Is it our flagship tool and resource? [00:26:45] And then with our, our staff, since we've added four full-time staff members, how do we make sure that we're all using the same language?
You know, we're all saying the same thing when we talk about this thing because that'll reinforce it. It'll amplify it. So through our email [00:27:00] messages, through conversations like this any articles or speaking that we do, I mean, we all have our own style and our own brand, but really thinking about how do we talk about it and how do we keep.
Like the passion going. [00:27:15] 'cause I really think that it's like the sizzle and the steak, right? Like you gotta eat. But you know, it's fun if you eat something that's really delicious and yummy and people are excited about it. And I think, you know, to me it's also the hummingbird effect. Like we have to [00:27:30] take care of ourselves and our staff as leaders.
And if things. If you start to feel like you're losing that sizzle or that excitement or you stop looking for the hummingbirds, you really have to kind of come to terms with that. And I think if we're all honest, we've all been there at one time or another. 'cause [00:27:45] there's just part of work life and community life and family life.
That's, you know, you just gotta get through it. And so I, I think about that a lot too, is applying it in our, our own lives as a way to, to kind of grow and live our best lives.
Wendy: I [00:28:00] know for us Hannah and I worked with you on the skill point kind of launch and the PR that was associated with that.
And don't you agree, Hannah, I feel like that has its own hummingbird effect that will [00:28:15] impact this organization? Oh, over time, definitely. I think again, from the sense of awareness. Like, I think it can be, I think it can be really, really helpful to have this platform. And [00:28:30] we've just gotta figure out those, those simple words.
Hanna: Those simple words, right? Yeah,
Wendy: in this fast-paced environment that we're in today how do you believe that companies and organizations can stay nimble and adaptable enough to capitalize on [00:28:45] the hummingbird effects?
Dr. Rebecca Corbin: Oh, wow. That's a, that's a big question. I, I wish I knew the answer to that, but I think that there are some directions that we can point to.
And I, I'll go back to the retreat that you [00:29:00] facilitated for my team in December of last year. And one of the things that you did using an online tool is. Having us better understand ourselves, because I think that's where it starts, right? You have to understand [00:29:15] is if we're gonna pivot as an organization, whether we are a nonprofit, a for-profit company, a school, anything, we've gotta kind of be working together as a team.
So I think understanding the team dynamics, and that was really a [00:29:30] powerful thing that you did, Wendy, as, as a facilitator, is you made. The learning fun and you made it safe. And, and like intentionally mix people up into groups so that there was a little bit of discomfort. Like I, I don't know, like I [00:29:45] might not relate to the accounting person as well as, you know, the person who's running the communications or whatever, or vice versa.
So I think people investing that time. If, if you haven't ever had a facilitated retreat, I, I [00:30:00] would strongly encourage people to do it. But you know, get somebody to facilitate that kind of gets the audience. And I think you were absolutely. Brilliant in the work you did for the staff. In fact, you uncovered some issues that we, [00:30:15] we, I didn't expect to have to deal with, but they were, you know, it was like unearthing some things that we needed to really address and I, I thought that was really powerful and the staff still talk about it.
So I think sometimes those, those little [00:30:30] things, but sometimes you've gotta make an investment in, in those things and you don't sometimes know what the outcome would be. You know, it could be sometimes people have retreats and it's like, ah, that was nice. But I'm a big believer in that, you know, you start with yourself, you work on the team, you [00:30:45] know, you don't try to change everything.
It's like if you've ever helped an older family member, somebody like that, clean out a house that is so overwhelming, but you, what do you do? You start with a kitchen drawer. You start with a closet, and then you start to get a sense of how, what's the [00:31:00] timeline? How are we gonna, how are we gonna do this sort of renovation?
And that would be, I think, a hummingbird approach.
Wendy: Yeah. Well, and I think you know, change is hard. It is hard. We talk about that all the time in business and, and how hard change is. And [00:31:15] I think as leaders, like you said, embracing that change and just kind of going for it is what we, we have to do. And then I identifying like we did in the retreat not necessarily strengths and weaknesses, but [00:31:30] what makes us different, where we can.
Work with each other in ways that we really take things to the next level by understanding personalities and how we need to act with each other [00:31:45] in order to innovate even better and faster. Right. I think I think you did that so well by having the foresight to have a retreat to begin with. And I [00:32:00] really enjoyed getting to know the, the people there and starting to see like who was really going to, embrace what we were trying to do.
And I think we were surprised in a couple of instances. Mm-Hmm. By people who we [00:32:15] thought might not embrace it actually. Really stepped out of their comfort zone which I was really proud of as the facilitator to see these people being willing because we knew going in when they took the assessments initially [00:32:30] there was at least one or two people that I knew it was gonna be hard to get them out of a comfort zone.
And they actually became leaders during the Yeah. Activities, which I thought was really awesome. And you know
Dr. Rebecca Corbin: what's interesting about that? Some of those individuals [00:32:45] have really stepped up since that time. You know, and if I could share an example, it just popped into my head from earlier in my career.
So I, I worked for a number of years at NJN, the New Jersey network. It was public television radio [00:33:00] station, and this is before public media happened. Really, you know, there was HDTV, you know, probably a lot of people think, oh, it's always been HDTV. Well, it wasn't so. It was there was a lot of change in the industry and I worked on the foundation [00:33:15] side, the development side, where we would do documentaries and things like that.
And there was discussion at that time. This is probably like 17 years ago. Okay, the world's changing. HD TV is coming, people are gonna end up with these little phones and they're [00:33:30] gonna be able to report the news from their phone. And there was such resistance within. And jn. They didn't, and they said, well, if you know you don't change, then you know, there's no way that we're gonna be able to keep this license.
And so they brought in some consultants to [00:33:45] talk to the, the folks. And some of the people were unionized, so there was that whole dynamic. But I remember the, the facilitator said, you know, in a couple of years, half of you are not gonna be here. And it was like, this [00:34:00] gasp, you know, like what? How could she say that?
How could she bring somebody in? She said, because if you don't embrace the change, then it's gonna, you know, if you're a director and you're sitting in a chair and you're directing a cooking show or a [00:34:15] public policy show, you know people like you, Hannah, you can now start your own show tomorrow and produce it and get it online.
And it was just, there were people that couldn't get there. And it was interesting 'cause I could sort of see the [00:34:30] dynamic and. What happened For me personally, I kept getting promoted because people kept on like not being able to adapt and I'd literally do anything in this job. They're like, can you write a script?
And I'm like, sure. And I'd like Google Google it back then. And I'd be like, okay, how do you write a script for this, that, or the other [00:34:45] thing? But it was seizing on opportunity and I think to me, that's the way that AI in the world is changing now. Like there's not that consultant sitting there in the room saying.
Half of you might not be here, but I think sometimes people need to hear that and [00:35:00] then maybe they migrate to doing something different or they look within themselves. So I, I just was thinking about that story 'cause I'd kind of forgotten about it. But ultimately working at that station led me to the community college because there was a very innovative [00:35:15] college president that said, wait a minute, students should have more agency.
And so we think about our career paths and, and how, you know, industry changes and, and sort of the opportunities that we have.
Hanna: Hannah, you got a question? Oh, well, mine's not a question, but just wanted [00:35:30] to kind of recap your leadership journey. That's kind of what I've attached to as you've been talking about.
The whole thing is you are such a collaborative leader within yourself, within your team. You know when to make the changes. You accept other people's [00:35:45] changes, and you're even changing yourself now by. Going head on, which that sounds like that's not something you've always done. So it really has led into having this retreat and making this change and bringing EB White's words in [00:36:00] and just cutting some words out have made this huge impact by you just accepting, accepting little changes and being a better leader.
So that's really awesome to hear. Yeah.
Dr. Rebecca Corbin: Yeah. And I think about you, Hannah. I think my daughter's just a few years younger than you are. I think [00:36:15] of. All the opportunities that you're gonna have. 'cause I think, and Wendy and I have chatted about this before, just being, you know, a little later in our careers and you know, I didn't.
Speak up as much as I should have or could have. I just wasn't conditioned that way. And I [00:36:30] think, you know, you are who you are, but I think you know where I am now. It's sometimes it's, you know, you don't have to say everything, but when you're given the platform and the opportunity in your own voice in a, you know, thoughtful way, you, you [00:36:45] have to express what you really think.
And I, and I see people like you and. Other young professionals doing that, and I'm just really proud of you being part of this. Oh, thank you. And you were part of the retreat, you're part of the press conference. So hummingbird's definitely been a blessing to [00:37:00] nay and I, I'm just very grateful to both of you.
Wendy: So do you feel like innovation and experimentation, have played a role in leadership for you [00:37:15] outside of NACI as well?
Dr. Rebecca Corbin: I think so. I mean, I think I, I think we're just never quite. Done learning and growing. I mean, I think you can kind of get to that point where you're sort of done with school. Like I, [00:37:30] one day I am going to take a culinary course at Wake Tech that's on my list, but I don't want a degree, I don't want a grade.
I just love to learn like pastry cooking or something different. But I think, you know, for me, I enjoy people and I enjoy, like [00:37:45] tackling problems and so. You know, being innovative is the only way that you can really survive through like a pandemic or some of the challenges that we confront. You know, whether it's, you know, revenue wise or what's happening, the demographics of, you know, [00:38:00] whatever students, you have to have that kind of a mindset.
So when I learned about entrepreneurial mindset. It, it like changed everything for me, you know, as, as a professional. And I still to this day, even with my family and some of the [00:38:15] challenges that we have when I stopped being entrepreneurial, it's easier for me to do it in my professional life than in my personal life.
But also in community life, like you had mentioned the chamber, and I just love the chamber. I love the people. I love the mission. I love. [00:38:30] How everyone is just trying to make the community better. It just means a lot to me. So when I'm given the opportunity to serve, you know, in a volunteer role, I, I just, I was thinking about this 'cause I'm actually meeting with the chamber [00:38:45] president later this morning.
I, I write down like, how, how can I be most effective in my role? And I think sometimes. As we plan new things or do things, it's, it's allowing like other people to step up. Like the Women's conference. Yes. Like I've planned so many [00:39:00] conferences, but I'm like, I, I feel like my role is to be supportive. It's not to like come in there and say, well, you know, I do this and blah, blah, blah.
And it's really to try to, you know, people are open to it. I'm happy to share with them some of the things that [00:39:15] I've learned or share resources that I might have. Our learnings, but I, I think people should you know, should do those things. I also admire greatly people that run for political office.
That is something I honestly would never do, just 'cause I, it just doesn't fit [00:39:30] with who I am. But I feel like I can serve in different ways. Like I've served on many boards and chaired boards and, and things like that. So I think you have to find your space and. Discomfort, but you don't, don't wanna go so far out of your comfort zone that you're like, oh my gosh, I am totally in the wrong [00:39:45] pond.
Like, I gotta get outta here. And I don't feel like that. I just feel like, oh, you're in the right
Wendy: pond. Well, thank you for inviting me into the pond. Most definitely. Most definitely. Well, do you have any other final thoughts as we wrap up?
Dr. Rebecca Corbin: Yeah, I just wanna say [00:40:00] Wendy, you told me, I think you and I have known each other now for a couple, well, probably four years since I've been here.
And you always have a word of the year, and I know yours was joy and you just like embrace it. And my word for this year is gratitude. So I've been listening to different. [00:40:15] Podcasts about the brain. We were talking about, you know, steps. So when I, I always try to get a lot of steps into, I've been listening to reflections on gratitude and it really does spark creativity in, in your brain.
So it's like if you're thinking, oh, I don't wanna write a gratitude [00:40:30] journal or whatever, it can help you get unstuck. But it really helps activate that entrepreneurial mindset because if you can write down. A few things every day, you're grateful for, it sets your mind in a place of abundance. And so I wanna thank [00:40:45] you for, for sharing that practice.
So I, I have to think of a word for next year, but I kind of have gratitude for having you help me get gratitude.
Wendy: Oh, I love that. That's part of my world. Oh, well, and. This has been a fantastic conversation. Thank [00:41:00] you so much for being here today. Huge thanks to everyone who's tuning into this fabulous episode.
I just always enjoy speaking with you. We have so much fun in our conversations. Your insights on innovation, whether [00:41:15] it's you know, around design thinking, 'cause I know we've talked about design thinking and entrepreneurial mindset really tie into the hummingbird effect in such a phenomenal way.
So we've really learned a lot from you [00:41:30] today, Becky and I know our listeners did too. If you enjoyed this episode, please consider leaving us a review and sharing it with your friends. We love hearing from you, and it helps us grow the show. And thanks again [00:41:45] for joining us on the Hummingbird Effect Podcast.
We'll be back next time. Until then, stay innovative and go find your hummingbird effect. [00:42:00] [00:42:15]