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Tactical Wealth is the podcast built to empower the military and veteran community to take control of their financial future.
From navigating the military to civilian life transition, to launching businesses, growing your income, and building long-term wealth, each episode brings you real stories and actionable insights from those who’ve gone from boots on the ground to building lasting wealth.
Hosted by Kaj Larsen, former Navy SEAL, award-winning journalist, and mission-driven entrepreneur. Kaj successfully co-founded a financial technology company and sold the company in 2024. The podcast features hard truth conversations with successful veteran entrepreneurs, CEOs, and top financial experts.
Whether you're still in uniform or already charting your next chapter, this podcast gives you the tactical tools to lead with impact in your finances and beyond. Let’s get tactical.
Tactical Wealth is a Gebbia Media production, brought to you by Siebert.Valor, a military-focused initiative from Siebert Financial. The Tactical Wealth podcast is for informational and entertainment purposes only. The views expressed by guests are their own and do not necessarily reflect those of Siebert Financial. This podcast does not constitute investment advice, an offer to sell, or a solicitation to buy any securities. Past performance is not indicative of future results. Listeners should consult a qualified financial professional before making any investment decisions.
For more information and disclosures, please visit siebert.com/disclosures.
00:00:04:10 - 00:00:36:16
Unknown
I would say today that is still a revolutionary idea. It's a revolutionary idea back then and it's still today, but it's absolute truth. That's for any career entrepreneur finance. If you can master those, you can do anything. I think the Seals activated the entrepreneurial entrepreneurial spark. You have to be very entrepreneurial to be even attracted to the seals or to be able to operate in that environment.
00:00:36:18 - 00:00:59:15
Unknown
Yeah, some people wait for opportunity, others fight for it. Welcome to tactical. Well, the show where discipline, service and real world experience become pathways to financial power. I'm your host, Kaj Larsen. On each episode, we bring you the stories and the wisdom of those who have gone from boots on the ground to successful careers, from military to wealth, and how they've done it.
00:00:59:21 - 00:01:10:09
Unknown
So you can apply those insights to your own mission and your own life. This is tactical wealth from military to money.
00:01:10:11 - 00:01:42:15
Unknown
Welcome back to a special San Diego edition of Tactical Wealth, the show where we talk about how venture partners, people who have served and more in the cloth of the country go from military to money. We're coming from we're coming to you from San Diego because San Diego is a hub. It's a central locus of military personnel. And at the very top of the heap, the top of the food chain, there is perhaps my guest today, commander Mark Divine or should I say doctor Mark Divine.
00:01:42:19 - 00:02:06:14
Unknown
Whatever you want to call me. Cyborg, doctor divine. Welcome to the show. It's really an honor to have you, Mark, you you probably don't know this, but I actually think that my, like, first taste of military entrepreneurship came as a young junior officer when I was assigned to Group one, over at under Naval Special Warfare.
00:02:06:18 - 00:02:24:05
Unknown
And you were a reserve officer working at Group one. And I was a young Joe who had just come back from my first deployment. And there was, I think I was a lieutenant at the time. And you're, and you're a commander, and you were just, like, so busy and, like, raring to go. And I was like, who is this guy?
00:02:24:05 - 00:02:41:02
Unknown
And he's, like, so aggressive. And then somebody is like, oh, that's Mark Divine. He owns Navy seals.com. And like he's this great entrepreneur on the outside I was like, what's an entrepreneur? But I like to think that planted the seed for my own entrepreneurship. Cool. Yeah. Yeah, I remember that. Yeah. You were a go getter, too. Yeah, we thought that.
00:02:41:02 - 00:02:58:05
Unknown
Well, we can smell our own. Yeah, because, you know, the reserves are great. I, a lot of seals like me. Did, you know, part time, about ten years active, ten year reserve. Once you get over that ten year mark is kind of hard to walk away. Right. So the reserves provide a nice, opportunity to keep your toe in the game.
00:02:58:07 - 00:03:21:19
Unknown
But the uniform on once the uniform was on and I was operational, it was like I never left. Right. The weekend warrior thing, you know, where you're part of the reserve? That that was kind of hard, man. But. So those times I was at Group one were like long term stints, but did a year there. When I got deployed to Iraq, it was through Group one with Seal Team one.
00:03:21:21 - 00:03:42:13
Unknown
A lot of good stuff in reserves. I thought it was the best part time job in the world. You know, I will say at the time, I like the seal reserves were like barely online at that time. They just barely existed. And but the, the stigma about like, reservists or like, you know, dirtbag reservists or whatever you fit none of that, like, square jawed All-American.
00:03:42:13 - 00:03:55:22
Unknown
I was like, who is this robot in front of me? Like, I'm going to you should say that my nickname insulting three, was cyborg. Was it? That makes sense. Yeah. What was this crazy story you're telling me that you're just dripping orange blood?
00:03:56:00 - 00:04:18:14
Unknown
Why don't we prove to people we thought this what we thought this was a show about wealth building, but it turns out it's really about alien conspiracy theory. Yeah, I had my first major traumatic accident in my life. I made it through 20 years a Seal. I think it's shocking and blown up. I didn't have, like, I had a bad parachute action by a literally just stood up and walked away from it like a complete malfunction midair in.
00:04:18:15 - 00:04:37:05
Unknown
And I finally caught air, like maybe 100ft above ground and is slow me down enough where I just walked away. Not a broken bone right? And then I go on the snowmobile trip and I'm holding on for dear life. Going 80 miles an hour wearing what the hell am I doing? Trying to keep up with this jerk who invited me.
00:04:37:07 - 00:04:56:08
Unknown
And I get run off the trail in this kind of wooded area by another sled. It was like trying to do a head on with me. Then I hit a tree going 40 miles an hour. Oh, I, you know, and I fortunately just glance the side of my head as I went, I think I was it's a lifetime martial artist, kind of aware, like we are like a body positioning is always something that.
00:04:56:10 - 00:05:16:18
Unknown
Right, you're aware of. And so I immediately like went off in a pivot in this segment like so a glance my head and I took the impact on my shoulder, shattered it into 18 pieces. Shoulder blade shattered eight broken ribs, broke your scapula. Right. This the scapula, which is a shoulder blade. Okay. Not the not the collarbone part.
00:05:16:18 - 00:05:40:22
Unknown
The back part. It's a very hard bone to break. Actually. Has bone in the body to break. But you did it. I did what you always word overachiever. Definitely an overachiever. So eight months later, I'm doing really well. Like, I'm. I haven't fully recovered, but I'm back doing, you know, like, I can do 20 rounds of Cindy in a decent time and pushups have a lot of pain, but I can I can muddle my way through.
00:05:41:00 - 00:06:09:04
Unknown
But I was at my physical therapist, and she was, you know, doing her work, you know, getting range of motion because I'm still not like, I can't quite get the full range. I'm about 80%. And all of a sudden she just stops and she's freaking out. She goes, what the hell? And all this orange fluid was just draining out of my shoulder and the burrowed like a little hole, because this fluid had gotten trapped in there and the lymph system, because of the scar tissue, lymph system wasn't able to drain it.
00:06:09:06 - 00:06:31:06
Unknown
That's my assessment, right? This is like doctor. So you're thicker. Doctor Divine's assessment lymph system basically got corrupted. And this all this fluid got in there and it had to come out. This is the beauty of our our bodies, the healing power bodies. Incredible. So my body knew enough to like, find the weak spot, which is through the scar tissue and board a little hole through like a minor infection.
00:06:31:08 - 00:06:51:23
Unknown
Opened it up and released all that on the floor of the physical structure. So you're dripping this like bright orange blood look like radiator fluid. Yeah. If you. Anyways, more on the net there is my my hardware is being rejected. That hardware has to come out. I mean look I will tell you as as somebody who has looked up to you as a mentor for a long time, you do have this alien like persona.
00:06:51:23 - 00:07:12:14
Unknown
I mean, you're a New York Times bestselling author. You've built multiple businesses, obviously, like your time as commander in the Seal teams. This is extraordinary stuff. And it's legendary even within a community of legendary men. But tell me. Tell me where it all started. How did you get to the Seal teams? You know, that's a fascinating I did I don't know if you know this.
00:07:12:14 - 00:07:31:17
Unknown
I didn't come into the cylinder. I was 25. I did not know that. Right. Most people assume you come in either right after high school. Is this a guy or, right after college, a 21 year old college graduate. I went to Cooley University and military was a million miles away from my mind. That's because it was Colgate that had, I mean, no military.
00:07:31:19 - 00:07:53:06
Unknown
And I went to UC Santa Cruz. I get it. You had to borrow DC is pretty liberal liberal arts school. Yeah, yeah. No, it's upstate New York. In fact, I had a kind of a negative association with the military because my dad was really Pooh poohed it. And, you know, it was one of those kind of East Coast elitist attitudes that military service is like, if you fucked up or if you got no other option.
00:07:53:06 - 00:08:14:04
Unknown
Yeah, go to jail, son, or go to the military. You choose wisely. What happened to my father, right. He was at Union College, was down in Schenectady, New York, and he. And he drove a car drunk and overturned the house there cause all sorts of damage. And so he found himself standing in front of a judge. And the judge is like, dude, you're going to go to jail, or you can join the Army.
00:08:14:06 - 00:08:31:16
Unknown
And my dad's like, I'll take option B. And so he had a negative association when the Army was in Germany in like the 11th airborne. And when it was all like they had very little mission, the peacetime military, a big green machine out of all that shit. Yeah. So military was not something for me. I was going to go in the businesses.
00:08:31:16 - 00:08:57:01
Unknown
My family was a business family. And, so I got this job out of, senior year where it was a cohort with a bunch of, other, like, big eight accounting firms kind of consulting. So I got hired by Coopers and Lybrand. Familiar with that name? Sure. Maybe sweater. I was gonna say you and, they sent me to NYU Stern School of Business, and, of course, I had to get in.
00:08:57:01 - 00:09:16:12
Unknown
I got in on a probation because I was, like, a solid two for an eight GPA because, you know, academics were pretty much third on the list. Yeah. Women, beer, all sports, women beer. And then I guess I was fourth on the West. Yeah. Just got to be in the top six. You would just rotate which one was the most important depending on the week.
00:09:16:14 - 00:09:31:10
Unknown
So there I was. I'm going to this program and I'm thinking, yeah, I'm going to be a CPA, MBA, and then I'm going to go into roles, I'm going to make a lot of money and become a trader or mess maker. You know, we know a lot of guys. So what's unique about that period? So I started going down this road.
00:09:31:11 - 00:09:53:21
Unknown
I didn't question that story at all. I was actually bought into it. I wasn't very happy though. Right now. One thing that always made me happy was hard core training, right? And it was just in my nature. And when I was, growing up, we had a summerhouse in the Adirondacks on Lake Placid. Right. So my front yard is Lake, the backyards, a mountain range.
00:09:53:23 - 00:10:06:06
Unknown
So I'm always in an under the water water skiing barefoot and creating these contraptions where I'd go underwater behind the boat, you know, like, I'm the little Westie, devious.
00:10:06:08 - 00:10:29:09
Unknown
And running up and down the mountain, you know, and just like, just insanely good shape, right? Because I spent all my time outside just banging around and, and so when it got to. And then I was a competitive athlete, a Colgate competitive swimmer, triathlon road crew. So here I am in New York, and I'm looking around, you know, everyone is like, pasty and that unhealthy.
00:10:29:11 - 00:10:53:16
Unknown
And, I was like, there's no way in hell I'm going to be like that right? No way. And I believed at that young age in 1985 that that our bodies could be fit and healthy until the day we dropped. And then aging was a thought problem. A problem with your thinking. And so I would say today, that is still a revolutionary idea.
00:10:53:16 - 00:11:11:17
Unknown
It's a revolutionary idea back then and it's still today, but it's absolute truth, right? You're your body will follow your mind. We used to say that in still training, right. By following the mind to get your mind squared away, right, your body will be there for you. So I decided, well, I'm going to train. I'm going to keep training and I'm just going to squeeze it around this crazy lifestyle.
00:11:11:17 - 00:11:31:07
Unknown
I'm working full time on going to night school, run six miles in the morning, come back to my stretching journaling, go to lunch, everyone go to lunch. I went and did like what we now know as a hit workout here. What I mean, the way I did that is I would like to say I just grab a dumbbell here and a kettlebell there and I take this like fence it off like a dog.
00:11:31:07 - 00:11:53:18
Unknown
I'd like p around the circle. Yeah. So nobody come in here. And then I would just go around. This thing is like sweat flying all over the place. People wouldn't dare, you know, come close for me. And then at night after that, you know, we got off for like 5 to 530 because it's a work study program. No, we have to get down to NYU, blah, blah, blah.
00:11:53:20 - 00:12:10:05
Unknown
And, so most of my peers would go home and, you know, eat and get ready for school. And I was like, oh my God, I got 2.5 hours. That's another training block. And I'm thinking, what am I going to do in that time frame? And I didn't really have an answer because I didn't want to go to the gym again and want to go for a run.
00:12:10:10 - 00:12:29:12
Unknown
It was too complicated to go rowing. You know, there's a lot of things I could have done that just didn't quite fit. And I walked home one day on 23rd Street and I was on 22nd, and I walked past this martial arts studio, which was completely random. And it wasn't just any martial arts is the global headquarters of something called Sado Karate.
00:12:29:13 - 00:12:48:21
Unknown
And I just stopped and I heard it first of all, and I looked up, I saw the sign, and I was like, that's it. This is what I'm going to do. And I went upstairs to check it out. And there I met like what I would consider to be my first real mentor, Tadashi Nakamura. He was a grandmaster, founder of the Hull's, style.
00:12:48:21 - 00:13:10:03
Unknown
Literally had 300,000 students worldwide back then. Already. And what was unique about him, I could tell right away and I couldn't put words to it. But he was a master, not just master of the physical arts, but a of the mental and spiritual arts. Like he was an enlightened man. And I only know that now because I've studied it so much.
00:13:10:09 - 00:13:38:07
Unknown
Right? The qualities, the spontaneity, the lack of ego, abject humility. Like, he would be intense like you. There's not a person in that call. Like if all of them attacked him, they would all lose. That's how freaking powerful he was. And at the same time, he'd be, like, giggling like a schoolgirl at the stupidest jokes. Yeah, and I was like, just smitten by this guy.
00:13:38:07 - 00:14:02:19
Unknown
Like, holy shit. Like whatever that is. Like, I've never seen that. And I really want a piece of that because I didn't feel confident inside and feel really good. And part of my backstory is a lot of alcohol in my family, a lot of rage in my father. And so, you know, my coping mechanisms from that was really to like, get myself walled off and then put points on the board to try to prove myself, you know.
00:14:02:19 - 00:14:25:17
Unknown
So already you can see this play in Backpay, right? Blah, blah, blah. And so I started training there and and one Thursday night, after a few weeks, I stayed to watch the black belt class, and after the black mark, I was very impressed. I was like, wow, someday maybe that'll be me. Right after the class, I see the lights go down and they're like shuffling people out and they're asking me to leave.
00:14:25:17 - 00:14:45:14
Unknown
I'm like, what's going on? And this small group of black belts were taking these little wooden benches over in his corner. One of them got a key and allowed him at the candle, and I asked the guy at the front desk said, what the hell are they doing? Oh, that's the Zen class. Like Zen. What's that?
00:14:45:16 - 00:15:08:22
Unknown
21 year old Mark to mind the 1980 five Watts Zen. Right. And they said, well, it's it's a Japanese meditation, right? I'm like, what's meditation? It's like, well, it's training. Training. The mind was like, oh, I want to train my mind. So do you think a white belt can try this as well? Maybe. You know, you got to ask, you know, kata, which is Grandmaster.
00:15:09:00 - 00:15:31:11
Unknown
So I saw him the next time and I said, show, that meditation class on Thursday night. Could I join it? It's like, of course, of course. I mean, hundreds of students and only like ten of them were doing this class. So I started I joined the class and, and I tell you, coach, within a few months, I started to experience some radical transformations.
00:15:31:13 - 00:15:52:04
Unknown
Now, part of this is because I was only 21 right in the in the brain is not fully developed right into your mid to late 20s. And so I was experiencing like accelerated, transformation of how my brain was growing. If I hadn't done this, it would have developed the same patterns that along the path that I was on.
00:15:52:06 - 00:16:18:15
Unknown
Academic, intellectual things fed all the content of society and culture and says, oh, that's that's good and that's bad. But suddenly I was just sitting there and sitting in absolute silence and learning how to control my mind and concentrate attention, control. And then I would drop off. That started happening about 3 to 6 months into the practice round, literally just drop off and lose complete sense of self and time and space.
00:16:18:17 - 00:16:37:12
Unknown
But I was completely aware. But a true Zen state. It was a true Zen state. Yeah. And I would come out of those things and wow, sometimes it felt like I was there for hours, sometimes for seconds. But everything would have like this really rich, thick feeling, almost like static electricity. Everything was slower. I would walk down the street to the subway.
00:16:37:12 - 00:17:11:21
Unknown
I felt like I was walking a couple inches above the, sidewalk. Everything looked beautiful. I'm talking about Manhattan and everything was beautiful. And I was like, oh my God, I love this stuff. And then I started to get like, intuition, right? Like inner insight, insight, feelings, knowingness. And one of the dominant, thoughts that kept coming to me was that I'm a warrior.
00:17:11:22 - 00:17:28:01
Unknown
I had never had that thought before. I mean, I was barreling down the path to be a CPA merchant, you know what I mean? If you want to categorize it as like, some themes, you know, I was a merchant. I was going to go make money, but I every time I meditated, I come back with a sense, and I'm a warrior.
00:17:28:03 - 00:17:44:22
Unknown
And then I started to have this kind of existential angst be like, If I'm a warrior, what the hell am I doing over here? So I started to ask different kind of questions, like, if I'm meant to be aware how and why can I be a warrior as a CPA? I'm sure you could. But is that the way I'm meant to be a warrior?
00:17:45:04 - 00:18:05:18
Unknown
And that answer came back no, in fact, going, I got a really strong sense of that. The whole path that I had chosen was not the right path. I chosen the wrong story to live because I was spoon fed me. And because you're a product of your influences. So I call us 100%, but I how many people are so karma?
00:18:05:18 - 00:18:25:16
Unknown
How many people are living a story that they think is theirs? But it's really not. It's part of their conditioning family, you know, cultures, social media, these things. So I had the great privilege of being able to stare at myself in these moments of silence. Right. And to see that the story that I was leaving was not the right story for me.
00:18:25:18 - 00:18:38:02
Unknown
And then if I kept going down that path, I probably would have a lot of money and the kind of outward success, but I would be missing my entire purpose for being here.
00:18:38:04 - 00:18:58:13
Unknown
And, I mean, ego did not want to hear that, right? Because then I stopped when I started. That's well, how can I be a warrior that like, then I had to play like, I had to play a little game with imagery. Right. So this is where visualization and imagination is so powerful. So I had to imagine myself as warriors doing different kind of things.
00:18:58:15 - 00:19:20:07
Unknown
And so I tried them one at a time. So like, what if I fly jets for the Marine Corps? Then I would visualize that for days and days. And at first it was really exciting. And then it got routine and then I got bored. Yes. Okay. I guess maybe that's not it, you know, and I say I envision myself being, like a longshoreman on a on a on a rig.
00:19:20:09 - 00:19:35:11
Unknown
Like that would be pretty cool, you know what I mean? You can you see out there, just bang it up in the nasty for a while. It's a gritty, gnarly work. And I got bored. Was essentially you imagined the world's most dangerous jobs until you honed in on the one that was right for you. The worst of the dangerous.
00:19:35:11 - 00:19:57:19
Unknown
Yeah. Oh, by the way, the most miserable. Ted, this is so fascinating because on a bunch of different levels, like just, I think for historical context, like 1985 was sort of a moment when America was like just realizing and waking up to, like, Japanese business culture. And there was a romance, I mean, sushi, I was actually living in Manhattan.
00:19:57:19 - 00:20:13:00
Unknown
I was I was young, but I was living in Manhattan because my parents had split and my mom had moved back to New York. I was living in Manhattan at that time, and I remember the first time in early 1980s, mid 1980s, when she brought sushi back to the house. And it was this novel thing and, you know, young kids.
00:20:13:00 - 00:20:36:09
Unknown
And we're like, eating sushi, and like, and I had sushi for lunch today, like, you know, what's what's past is Prolog. Right. And I think so much of, of what you're saying now is foreshadowing for the rest of your life. I mean, without a doubt. And you've built businesses around this concept, like your mastery of the mental battle space has been one of your keys to success.
00:20:36:14 - 00:20:55:15
Unknown
And it seems like this is the genesis. That's where it started. Not only the tools, right? So think about this. We talk about now when we teach through Seal Fit. Now the teaching of Bud's big four skills. Right. Breath control. Well, guess what I was doing with Nakamura. And when I was sitting on the bench, I was box breathing.
00:20:55:17 - 00:21:22:16
Unknown
Nobody taught me, but I did learn how to control my breathing. And I knew I felt an experience that that controlled breathing nostril breathing led to, arousal control, attention control, and automated the ability to concentrate deeper. It was having a profound effect on how my mind worked. And so I learned that at that ripe age of 21, that the breath is a link between your physiology and your psychology and your emotions.
00:21:22:17 - 00:21:44:04
Unknown
And then if you control the breathing, then you control all of those. Wow. Right. Academics and science still hasn't caught up to that insight, right? Second was I talked about visualization right now when I understood, like I wanted to be a warrior and I started to do this kind of visual, you know, like what what type of warrior I didn't really know much of.
00:21:44:04 - 00:22:04:14
Unknown
I heard about the seals, but didn't really know anything about them. And one day I was walking home. It was all Delta Force. Back then. Everybody was talking about Job Force. Nobody was talking about Seals are still the secret. Quiet. Yeah. There were no movies or TV shows about it. And I walked past the recruiting office and I saw a poster on the wall facing out, and it said, be someone special.
00:22:04:16 - 00:22:20:12
Unknown
And it was seals doing cool shit. Didn't say anything about the seals. It was just sizzle in the steak. Come in and we'll sell you on the submarine force. You know, which they tried to do to me. And they're like, you don't want to be that. They're like, those guys are weird. You know? You'll never make it to blah.
00:22:20:14 - 00:22:40:17
Unknown
You don't want to be an officer. Those guys are cake eaters. Like I heard all of it. But I was like, that's how I'm supposed to be a warrior. That's it. And they had a video. Recruiting video, same title. You can find it on YouTube. Be some special. Still buy this. Even though it's super old, it's one of the best videos ever done.
00:22:40:18 - 00:23:10:13
Unknown
I watched that thing like 30 times and then I put my self into it and every morning after my run, I would visualize the condensed version of that show with me in it, crushing it, doing everything. And I kid you not, college. Nine months of that practice. None of this stuff is like, you know, instant manifestation. But if you if you visualize and hold the positive expectation that this is going to happen, it will happen, right?
00:23:10:13 - 00:23:30:19
Unknown
If if it's the right thing for you, this was the right thing for me. I believed it was going to happen. I visualize every day. Nine months into that practice, I had this overwhelming sense of of absolute certainty wash over me like I had already accomplished it in the matrix. And two days later my recruiter calls me is like Mark, his name is Nick Filippone.
00:23:30:21 - 00:23:53:22
Unknown
Mark, I can't believe it. You got one of the bullets to go to Officer Cannon School with a guarantee. Follow on the buds and they only do like 1 or 2 a year. Those. Statistically, it's very hard to get. So visualization breath control and then mental management right. So like I had to learn because my dialog in my family was very negative.
00:23:54:00 - 00:24:15:20
Unknown
It was the meditation that opened up the space. And I could study. I could see my thoughts in real time. And this is profound because I had I had at 21, most people wait their whole life for this. I had the profound realization that I was not my thoughts. I mean, this sounds so simple now, but think about it.
00:24:15:20 - 00:24:39:18
Unknown
Most people are completely merger zero. Like there's zero discernible time between having a thought and then getting captured by their thought. And the meditative practice opened up the space to where I could have a thought, and then I could decide what to do with that thought. Then I got to watch it, and what I saw was, wow, that's negative.
00:24:39:21 - 00:25:06:14
Unknown
Oh, oh, that's even more negative. Right? And these thoughts are making me feel good about myself or about my path or whatever. So how about if I just stop those and insert something else. So mental management, these three skills right there. Right. That's for any career entrepreneur finance. Like if you can master those you can do anything. Yeah.
00:25:06:14 - 00:25:31:22
Unknown
It's what's amazing is that you came to them at such an early stage before they were part of the mainstream discourse. Right. And I think that's a lot of the theme of the arc of your story, is that you have been an early pioneer, especially in the mental battle space, right? In the mental game of finding innovative ideas or innovative practices and then being one of those people who, frankly, helped bring them into the mainstream.
00:25:31:22 - 00:25:50:09
Unknown
Because, you know, now there's meditation apps on your phone. But in 1985, right, you had to travel to either India or Japan to find in real deal. Right? I found one of them right in the middle of New York. Yeah, well, it's the melting pot theory, right? Yeah. It's innovative because I laugh because there are people making millions of dollars selling breath control.
00:25:50:09 - 00:26:12:16
Unknown
Yeah. You know, apps are selling breath certification. I'm like, I've been teaching breathwork since 2006, starting with sales. Yeah. So but it makes me think that, like, there is something in your nature that is over the horizon looking that you are attracted to, you know, to ideas that ultimately can become disruptive ideas doesn't mean you bat a thousand.
00:26:12:16 - 00:26:35:11
Unknown
Nobody bats a thousand, right? But there's something in your nature that is attracted. I always say part of the key to being an entrepreneur is that you, have to see the world not as it is, but as how it could be. That's right. And so. Okay. So what I mean, so I'm interested in next in, in worrying you did you did your time on active do your time in the Seal teams.
00:26:35:15 - 00:26:57:13
Unknown
Did it enhance these ideas. Did you apply them to to be effective in the Seal teams? Because ultimately what I really want to talk about is, is how we got to this sort of entrepreneurial. But it sounds to me like that entrepreneurial spark existed like already within you. I think the Seals activated the extra entrepreneurial spark. Okay, right.
00:26:57:13 - 00:27:22:17
Unknown
I think that you have to be very entrepreneurial to be even attracted to the Seals or to be able to operate in that environment, you know, very small teams, like an intense reliance on each other to get a common mission dynamic. These are entrepreneurial qualities, right? A lot of trust right now about authenticity, like emotional maturity. You wouldn't you know, most people think, well, military guys don't have that seals actually do the good ones.
00:27:22:19 - 00:27:54:12
Unknown
Right. But back to your the first part of your question, when I got the Seal training, that's the skills were like money. I mean, day one, right? It's going crazy. Zinke, you know, who's in Congress is, you know, is just lording over this noon red meat on a beach. People are dropping like flies. And I'm just sitting there with a shit eating grin on my face, going like, yeah, this is good, right?
00:27:54:12 - 00:28:15:14
Unknown
This is fun. Is I hit the beach and the buddy. I went to Officer Kenneth Gill with turns and runs to ring the bell. And I'm running down the beach saying, man, I'm getting paid to do this. And the instructors are like throwing all these spears at us, and they're just bouncing off me because I'm just like, this is all just a show, and none of it can affect me unless I allow it to.
00:28:15:16 - 00:28:33:20
Unknown
Yeah. And you had you had already developed the mental body armor up that body armor, right. That mental that mental shield wall. Right. That they couldn't penetrate and inside was positive, right? I was like, oh, this is easy. So I taught this to my boat crew. Guess who was standing with me on graduation day? Every single one of them.
00:28:34:00 - 00:28:54:12
Unknown
Yeah, because of these simple skills, which it just led to like moment to moment, greater presence, a greater, trust because we were all, like, in control. And so we could look at each other. Hey, you know, let me help you out here. Right. So we were, like, helping each other out. We talked about success, not about failure.
00:28:54:14 - 00:29:17:01
Unknown
We had a vision, but then talking about things just like a Seal brief, right? You talk about it in the end. State. This is what it looks like when we win. We don't really care how we're going to get there. We know it's going to be a soup sandwich now, right? But this is what victory looks like. So we're using our visualization I was teaching in the breath control.
00:29:17:01 - 00:29:38:16
Unknown
And a lot of that was just through, you know like coaching like okay hey Bob, get yourself under control. Close your mouth, breathe your nose. Calm down. We've got this, you know, stuff like that. And oh, my God, everyone's like, yeah, we got this. And just day in and day out relentlessly until suddenly, like, they were then coaching each other and right.
00:29:38:18 - 00:29:56:01
Unknown
Oh, I'm crazy. I if you didn't say it, I was going to say, I know what it is. I know it's true. Through seal legend and lore. How extraordinary you were as a young junior officer. Many people who are close to you. I'll tell you, no, seals sometimes can be like, there's, like, a little sewing circle within me.
00:29:56:01 - 00:30:26:13
Unknown
Like a bunch of high school girls talking shit about each other, or startles idea of the whole person. Right, Rob? Spec ops training, I know, which is limited to Seals. Spec ops training is probably the only training in the world that, except for things that we're now trying to do right through innovation in a civilian sense, through like seal fit and what you guys are that develops the whole person physically, mentally, emotionally, spiritually, intuition, even, I call those the five mountains.
00:30:26:13 - 00:30:47:12
Unknown
We literally call five mountain training. And and so you end up with this very diverse, really interesting character set, like someone who's willing to lay their life down for their teammate while at the same time they're super spiritual. They're going to be you can be sitting next to me in church on Sunday, not even know it.
00:30:47:14 - 00:31:14:20
Unknown
And they're always in service, right. The challenge is that the, that Seals and Spec Ops guys tend to. And why we're good at entrepreneurship is we tend to, really thrive on a lot of variety, and we get bored really quickly. Right. And so like talking about transition and you have you know, I know this is a tactical wealth podcast.
00:31:14:22 - 00:31:31:08
Unknown
You have to be really thoughtful when you transition out of the spec ops. Right. Because you get find yourself in a grind and beheading it. And I've seen a lot of guys kind of like, especially if they haven't dealt with their post-traumatic stress issues. They get into this grind, they hate it. And they're like, my life is over.
00:31:31:10 - 00:31:49:02
Unknown
Yeah, right. I used to have all this adventure and all this excitement, all this variety, and now I'm doing the same fricking Groundhog Day revenant, and you clink something. So what was the first business that you built? Coronado Brewing Company. Okay, yeah. So I launched that on active duty. I think I have supported that business. Yeah, sure you have.
00:31:49:04 - 00:32:06:12
Unknown
So I drank a lot of free beer. Right? You drank all the profits, so I, I, you know, I saw the back to like, why in the why behind starting a business. So for me that there wasn't a strong why for me it was I wanted to be an entrepreneur. I didn't want to go back in the corporate America.
00:32:06:14 - 00:32:25:04
Unknown
I didn't see myself doing some sort of alphabet soup thing, you know, that was for other guys. And so I wanted to do something on cereal and free beer sounded really good to me. Part of what I think the most important thing for entrepreneurs is to do, like to really get clear about where your blind spots are, right?
00:32:25:04 - 00:32:44:11
Unknown
Your emotional shadow, your traumas, your biases, because you're going to drag that stuff into the business. And one of my blind spots was I was pretty severe codependence from growing up with a family like that, an alcoholic family. And so when my brother Rick came and said, hey, we're going to bring Ron and my brother Ron into the business as an equal partner.
00:32:44:11 - 00:33:05:08
Unknown
And, oh, he's going to be marketing like, there's no chance in hell I would ever say yes to that today, but I just fucking said yes. Okay? And so suddenly I got diluted and now I'm one of three founders and he didn't bring anything. Now I put all my money into the business. I raised all the money.
00:33:05:08 - 00:33:28:14
Unknown
And this guy Rick, and now his brother didn't put a diamond in the business. And now there's right it's. Things go wrong. It's two against one. Guess what? How long is it going to take before things go wrong? Yeah, right now, very long. We could do a whole show on founders divorce. It's awful. Yeah. So, you know, basically knowing who you partnering with is one of the first and most important things for, for a, starting a business.
00:33:28:14 - 00:33:53:11
Unknown
Like, make sure you're getting that with a, worthy and trustworthy partner. And with the sales, like, we had this massive assessment, selection and training program is so vetted or even then, some people didn't make it out of the team. Right. But you knew what you were getting when you formed a team and went out the door. You know, I mean, in a civilian situation, you don't know.
00:33:53:12 - 00:34:11:15
Unknown
Yeah, it's the wild, wild West. It's wild, wild West. And you got to expect that you're going to get all sorts of cats from, from the greatest to the most naive. So that's like that turned out be a revolution. Right. But we learned hard right from those from those failures. But and Mark, there's always this, this rumor like.
00:34:11:17 - 00:34:32:17
Unknown
Well, I know it's true, actually, but, but I don't know what the exact story you bought Navy seals.com, right? Yes. You're right. When the Navy was like, what's this, like, interwebs thing? You know, I bought the domain for 35 bucks. I still have it, right? Hey, Navy, if you want Navy seal.com. Come on, just offer me some money for sure.
00:34:32:23 - 00:34:49:23
Unknown
And I done more free recruiting to that thing than anybody in the world. Right? You know, in fact, that's the foundation. For a lot of the work I've done. So I was doing the brewery and, you know, this in 1996, and like, the internet was just so nascent. But I looked at that and I said, you know what?
00:34:49:23 - 00:35:17:00
Unknown
Someone's going to do the sales and it should be a seal. I thought, right. And so I bought Navy seal.com and I put up a website, initially with the help of a friend, and it was actually pretty cool at first. Website was really neat. And then I started to sell stuff. Right. This is before Amazon. And so we were selling like, cool guy stuff, build a couple million dollars, e-commerce business there.
00:35:17:00 - 00:35:34:02
Unknown
And then of course, we had the three themes were get Seal fit. And so I was training people to get seal fit. That's spun out to be its own business. Yep. Get Seal Smart. That was all the mental toughness stuff. I'm innovating and that spun out to become unbeatable. Mind and then get seal gear. That was the e-commerce.
00:35:34:04 - 00:35:56:22
Unknown
And I grew that thing to a few million dollars in revenue and two things happen. This is really cool. This is how I talk about pivoting. Right? So 2008 comes around. I really went hard in the e-commerce 2001 and launched the site in 1997, but it wasn't until 2001, before it was a revenue generating business. The bottom dropped out of the market in 2008, right?
00:35:56:22 - 00:36:24:02
Unknown
Financial crisis, the GFC and then right then Walmart.com and Amazon.com were just like coming to their own. And so everybody just started going to buy the low priced options. And suddenly everything that we sold the Navy Seal, the. Com you could find Amazon for cheaper. And 90% of our business evaporated within months. Now you're right. And so fortunately that was a that seems like a negative thing but actually was really positive.
00:36:24:02 - 00:36:52:18
Unknown
So prior to that, the two years for three years prior to that, because of the the, get seal fit component of Seal Fit, we were training a lot of Spec Ops candidates through forums, through local meet ups, you know, and we were having great success with that. Right? Demonstrable success. It makes sense, right? If someone's really hungry enough, they want to be a seal, hungry enough to seek out mentorship and to form these training groups, there's a good chance that they're going to make it right and ensure you give that to your.
00:36:52:18 - 00:37:14:10
Unknown
Sure. And so that was right around the time 2004 or 5 when, now we're 3 or 4 years after 911 and Congress is saying we need 500 new seals. You remember that we need a 500 nukes. Yeah. And the seals are like in the Special Forces. They literally put like, a thousand guys. Yeah, but it takes us two and a half years to grow.
00:37:14:11 - 00:37:42:01
Unknown
To grow. So five years to grow, you know, special. There's not mass produced. Yeah. Right. And so we had to go testify I didn't do this. But you know, the inner went to Congress is like this is not how it works. You would destroy the force if you just throw 500 people into it. We're not mass produced, but what we can do, one of the ideas was, what if we put a program together, to mentor and train candidates at the front end so that when they go to boot camp and then does Seal training, they'll be better qualified?
00:37:42:01 - 00:38:04:06
Unknown
And also, let's insert another training program in between boot camp and Buzz know we call that Seal Prep training. And so by the time all these candidates get the buds, we're gonna have a much higher quality candidate, which will improve the assessment rate or the throughput rate, which will get your 500 men, but it'll take five years. And so Congress said, okay, well, we'll buy that.
00:38:04:08 - 00:38:27:03
Unknown
So, Navy recruitment put out a contract bid. And they did it through a prime contractor they were already working with to stand up nationwide mentoring program for Navy Seals. Guess who bid on it. Yeah. And guess who won, right? Why? Because I was already doing it. Yeah. Then you had a track on this. Who was really pissed that I won that Erik Prince?
00:38:27:03 - 00:38:44:00
Unknown
Oh, yeah. Blackwater. Because they were trying to get it. They went after it too. So you had this billion dollar company thinking they were a shoo in. And then we have this company, this like brand new off the street. I change my name to US tactical to make it sound like a bigger company. It was really just Navy seal.com and we won.
00:38:44:00 - 00:39:04:12
Unknown
This contract is like a $10 million contract five years. Right? So we stand up this program. I have 36, former team guys put them out and all the recruiting districts I visit, every single recruiting district myself, like on this grand tour. I heard up a bullfrog, Bill Cheatham. Reed. Yeah. To be my kind of program director. Guy's badass.
00:39:04:14 - 00:39:26:07
Unknown
And we took the pass. Right? So what was happening is, all the Seals coming through the, regular recruiting districts supposed to be able to pass the screening tests and all the other measures. Right? And they would get to boot camp. And 80% of them, they just some percent were failing. So they're conducting it. Right. So we took that to an 87% pass rate within one year.
00:39:26:07 - 00:39:48:21
Unknown
And guess what? Blackwater challenged this contract. Yeah. And got it thrown out. Yeah. And they reissued it to Blackwater. And so he stole it from me after year one. What's interesting to me about your business, is it like as a from like a, a 360 approach is that almost all of them seem to have this kind of flywheel effect.
00:39:48:21 - 00:40:09:05
Unknown
Now that I really like. It's really amazing insight to understand the origin and the genesis of them, but they really do push on each other and work together in interesting ways every year. Like, I mean, look here, you wrote a book called Unbeatable Mind, and that helped power some of the seal set components, which drove audience back to the book.
00:40:09:05 - 00:40:32:22
Unknown
Right. Do you think of your businesses that way as having, like, synergies that work together? I did, and you're right. So, and there's a challenge there, right? So I think if you have a lot of scale and you can feed multiple divisions that kind of mutually support each other to create a multi, you know, multiple flywheel supporting each other, that's awesome.
00:40:32:22 - 00:40:57:01
Unknown
Each one of those silos though, or components needs to be self-sustaining or should be self-sustaining, right. You're not doing a loss leader on one in order to power another problem. My head was I had I kind of, had a loss leader on. I'm doing too many things. And, I was 100% owner. I got so spooked by the Coronado Brewing Company where I had 45 investors.
00:40:57:01 - 00:41:23:03
Unknown
And you know, all this that I just controlled dealership. So I learned the hard way that it actually the right partners are actually really good. Bad partners can be devastating. But you need peer level, brain power. And I didn't have that peer level. Brain power is all just me trying to figure shit out. And I'm. And I'm so creative that once I got some, like, silted up and running, great, this team can run it and I'm going to go off and launch unbeatable.
00:41:23:03 - 00:41:46:23
Unknown
And then I'm going to launch. Right. So whatever is next. Yeah. And I didn't stick with it long enough and finance it enough to make, you know, to get the foundation like rock solid. Right. So I, you know, I've had to kind of pivot and simplify. So that's the kind of the, the corollary is that's a great model.
00:41:46:23 - 00:42:08:18
Unknown
If you have scale. But when you're starting out you need to be really focused. Yeah. Yeah. First you concentrate, then you can try. You got to be a sniper in the beginning. And then you can bring out the 16, you know, the other guns. I, I hope that resonates with our audience. Awesome. Mark, we like to do this little section that we call rapid fire.
00:42:08:18 - 00:42:29:05
Unknown
I say it's like shooting steel, right? You get instant feedback. And so, let's let's take a stab at it. You have so much wisdom and so much experience contained, that we're always trying to do these, like, pragmatic takeaways for people. And like I said, best lessons I learned when we when we fall. What do you think the best investment you ever made was?
00:42:29:07 - 00:42:53:14
Unknown
The Khan. Yeah. So good, so good. That is buying it in 2013. Right. Okay. So again like to go back to your theme, right. Like you discovered meditation earlier than most, right. You were big on the web before other people were. And now I learned for the first time here. We've been friends for 15 years. And now I learned for the first time that you bought Bitcoin in 2013.
00:42:53:20 - 00:43:11:06
Unknown
What convinced you to do that? I was just fascinated by the technology. And, it's just like it it look like the future to me. Dumbest financial mistake selling bitcoin. Yeah. Fair.
00:43:11:08 - 00:43:34:16
Unknown
In fact, I could guarantee it's probably selling every investment I've ever had. Right. Bought a house and I'd be in Farrell Beach for 100 grand. Sold over a hundred grand. It's worth about, you know, 1.5 right now. I bought 100 Bitcoin. I sold almost all of them. I had to buy the rest back at a much higher price, you know what I mean?
00:43:34:22 - 00:43:56:07
Unknown
I had probably, 3 or 4000 Doge or maybe even a million doge. You know, one of the things I often tell entrepreneurs is. And just like, just respond like, I don't know who's right. I don't know who's wrong. You're probably right. But, like, what I often say is it's never bad to the cash register. Sell early, sell often.
00:43:56:07 - 00:44:28:02
Unknown
If you've built something once, you can build it again. This is true. Yeah, I'm not disagreeing with you, but there's a lot of times when, we just we sell too early, right? So my version of that is take some off the top. Yeah, but leave the holdings there. Yeah, right. Can I just say that this is like a great cognitive lesson in that we're often especially in today's, like, high velocity world reduced to this like zero sum thinking.
00:44:28:04 - 00:44:48:09
Unknown
Do you do a or do you do B. And part of unbeatable mind right. Is that there's often a third way. There's always a third way. And the pause breathe. Think about it before you act. And you know, I gotta eat my own dog food because when it comes to investing, I yeah, I could, you know, get into the FUD on occasion.
00:44:48:09 - 00:45:13:21
Unknown
Great fear, uncertainty and doubt. And I if I had not sold any of my digital assets, any of my real estate, I mean, yeah, I wouldn't be retired because I love what I do. But I'd probably be a lot like it. This is my favorite question. I actually did write this question by, producer Angie wrote this question, but it's it's almost hilarious to ask you this.
00:45:13:23 - 00:45:31:18
Unknown
A book that changed your mindset. I'll tell you a book that changed my set so you can't use the same word. It's called unbeatable Mineable mind by this guy, Mark divider. That's a really good one. Yeah, that one's all right. Yeah, yeah, everybody should check it out. The first book that I ever read that that is in this kind of same vein was thinking Rich Napoleon Hill.
00:45:31:20 - 00:45:54:18
Unknown
And I read that when I was 21 and I was like, blown away for one chapter and visualization. Well, in America, like, we don't like to talk about money or class. Yeah. But these, like you said, money's currency and it it powers the life that we want to live. And it's also body armor against the inevitable snowmobile accidents of life.
00:45:54:18 - 00:46:19:20
Unknown
That's right. And of course, the key point was the think part, right? He was teaching how to think and wealth is just a byproduct of of good thinking. Great. A great, sometimes this is kind of a throw away, but, I think for you, I, I think people really, really are attracted to how you have organized your life in such a rich cognitive way.
00:46:19:23 - 00:46:38:12
Unknown
But what is your sort of daily routine? What's your morning routine that that sets your tone? There's a lot of talk about this in entrepreneurial circles, and I think a lot of bullshit. But I think with you, it's real. Okay. So I, first preface it by saying that, I've been in business for a while now, and I can totally dictate my schedule.
00:46:38:14 - 00:46:59:20
Unknown
I don't let anyone dictate my schedule. And so I don't take any meetings before ten in the morning unless it's really important. Right. And sometimes there are things that I have to do that are important. But so what that means is I've got I protect that time for winning in my mind before I step foot in the battle of the day.
00:46:59:22 - 00:47:23:07
Unknown
As Sun Tzu said, victorious warriors win in their mind and then go to battle. So, my morning ritual is, you know, I wake up between 530 and 6 and training starts immediately. Soon as I regain conscious, I go back in and begin to prune the mind and curate thoughts. Right? First words, first thoughts. And so the mantras will start, the appreciation will start.
00:47:23:07 - 00:47:44:01
Unknown
The gratitude. This is while I'm still laying in bed. The box breathing starts and I just get myself into a state of feeling really good about myself. You feeling good about this day? I know that this day is the most important day of my life, because the only day I have yesterday, only easy day, was yesterday and yesterday's if I can over and tomorrow is a hope and a fantasy.
00:47:44:03 - 00:48:03:17
Unknown
Right. So, what you got is today. So then I will, you know, do some other things, but mostly like, get a cup of coffee, which I use to drink a few, just a few sips of and then I go into, like structured practice. Structured practice for me is journaling. And then, breathing in meditation practice.
00:48:03:19 - 00:48:23:14
Unknown
Right. Which is got different steps to it. Right. So that's training different part of your mind. And then ends with visualization and, and visualizing my future self, which is me accomplishing my, my big mission vision. And then my day. It's like dirt diving the day all of that takes me from 6 to 730. Then I make a smoothie.
00:48:23:14 - 00:48:45:03
Unknown
My wife, by the way, does this training with me. So a couple that that can practice together, right? It's going to have a powerful relationship. We both get a smoothie. I go down to my training center, which is a different location. I've got the whole set up. My rogue rig and everything, 20 minutes of yoga and a 20 minute hit workout, a sauna and a cold plunge.
00:48:45:05 - 00:49:02:15
Unknown
That's my morning. And during the day, and this is something I teach in my own build program, is like, I really focused on, like, the most important things that I'm going to do, like, today was I had a podcast. So that's it. I will try to get some of the stuff done, but they're not important. What's important is this.
00:49:02:15 - 00:49:19:23
Unknown
So I focus a lot and I prep for it like there's a pre-event ritual again, prepping in my mind it's, you know, setting expectations, the outcomes post-event ritual is the debrief what I learn. But then during the day I have, little drills just like we in the Seal team, you know, and we walk by a pull up.
00:49:19:23 - 00:49:43:03
Unknown
Are you not going to just let's you're not just going to ignore that said pull apart. It wants a little attention. Yeah, right. So you're going to jump on and bang out ten or 15 or 20 pull ups and burpees. You know, breathing, walking around the block with the dogs. Like there's things that you do just to stay on, stay energetically and mentally positive and and charged and otherwise you just get depleted throughout the day.
00:49:43:03 - 00:50:22:10
Unknown
And then we hit the wall. Yeah. People drink coffee or you know, and they do unhealthy things. It's actually a it's an amazing little reminder. Right, that there are these little micro hits that you can do during the day. Mark. There's been incredible. I mean, I think for our audience, you know, you've done everything from building by Navy seals.com to starting Seal fit to training and mentoring thousands, you know, tens of thousands at this point of, aspiring Seal candidates, just regular civilians who want to be successful in their life in these kind of techniques to help them achieve their highest assignment.
00:50:22:12 - 00:50:49:06
Unknown
Your, a PhD, New York Times bestselling author. I mean, I think for a for an actual human being that's made up of flesh and blood and not titanium and, you know, radiator fluid, not an alien. Yeah. I think for any normal being, doing 10% of what you have accomplished in your life would be extraordinary. And I cannot thank you enough for being here and sharing your wisdom with us.
00:50:49:08 - 00:51:05:20
Unknown
And I will add on a personal note, you have always been an extraordinary mentor to me. You helped, like, see that spark of inspiration for my own journey. And, it's an honor to have you here to share your wisdom. That's awesome. I spend a lot of fun. I appreciate it, but before I let you go, I know you've already influenced tens of thousands of people.
00:51:05:20 - 00:51:24:08
Unknown
If people are interested in diving deeper, how how can they connect with you? How do they learn more? How do they continue to glean wisdom from you? Reading my books is a great place to start, first of all, in Amazon. So the way the Seal men deal minor to perennial favorites, my my latest is called Uncommon.
00:51:24:10 - 00:51:46:01
Unknown
We're pretty active now. And social media. I've got my peeps who do that who help me out. But it's me on their, mark mine official is Instagram. Facebook. Like, find me on LinkedIn website. Unbeatable. Mine.com is kind of like the really good slate to go. It's like the hub. And we have a new challenge for, busy leaders like entrepreneurs.
00:51:46:01 - 00:52:01:14
Unknown
This is great. It's a three day virtual challenge. It's just two hours a day. And this is where I go in and I give like kind of like really deep training over a narrow band of topics. And I do it every month now, three days. And you can learn about that at Unbeatable leader.com. It's super easy entry.
00:52:01:14 - 00:52:17:09
Unknown
You know what I mean? Like 49 bucks or $170 to attend. That's part of the kind of the new model, the new flywheel we're building to bring, bring a new generation of people into our training. Yeah. Well, Mark, thank you again for being here from there. It's great to see you. All right. Thanks for walking in with us today.
00:52:17:12 - 00:52:39:12
Unknown
Shout out to Siebert Top Hour and Siebert Financial for supporting our journey. We'll be back next week with another powerhouse conversation. More founders, more builders and leaders who are playing offense in life and in business. Make sure you're subscribed to our YouTube channel for exclusive content and extended cuts of your favorite episodes. Until next week. Stay tactical, stay driven.