Win, Learn, Repeat: Building the Pivot Business Group with Pam Jordan

You don’t lose, you either win or you learn. In this episode, Joey and Drew sit down with Pam Jordan, founder and CEO of Pivot Business Group. Pam shares her inspiring journey from corporate life to launching her financial services firm, where she helps entrepreneurs untangle their finances to maximize profits. From overcoming self-doubt to building a team and creating systems for success, Pam’s story is packed with invaluable lessons for anyone starting or scaling a business. Tune in to learn how to take risks, grow your business, and write your own entrepreneurial story!

The official podcast of Few Will Hunt, the world’s largest community of hard workers and Made in the USA apparel brand. Family-owned and operated and headquartered in Philadelphia. We’re on a mission to restore the dignity of hard work and help others live The Rules of The Few to strengthen ourselves and strengthen society. No entitlement or excuses are allowed here.

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Creators & Guests

Host

Drew Beech

Drew Beech is an entrepreneur and cofounder of Few Will Hunt. He spent several years in the sales and marketing industry, grossing over several million dollars in sales. But his love for the entrepreneurial journey and desire to escape the rate race started with his personal training business in college. Today, Drew leads the Few Will Hunt community alongside his cousin and cofounder, Joey in their mission to restore the dignity of hard work through the highest-quality American-made apparel.

Host

Joey Bowen

Joey Bowen is co-founder of Few Will Hunt.

What is The Few Will Hunt Show?

The official podcast of Few Will Hunt, the world’s largest community of hard workers and 100% Made in the USA apparel brand. We’re on a mission to restore the dignity of hard work and help others live The Rules of The Few to strengthen ourselves and strengthen society. No entitlement or excuses are allowed here.

Pam Jordan: 00:00

Own what your thing is. Like, if you're good at it, you enjoy it, people come to you for it, people ask you advice on it. That's your thing.

Joey Bowen: 00:11

Welcome to the Few Will hunt show. What's going on, Eagles? Welcome to the Few Will Hunt Show. I'm Joey, cofounder of Few Will Hunt. And today, Drew and I are joined by a friend and a colleague of ours, Pam Jordan, founder and CEO of Pivot Business Group.

Joey Bowen: 00:29

Pivot Business Group manages, I think, maybe, like, half a $1,000,000,000 for for entrepreneurs. They help entrepreneurs, and I'm speaking from experience. They help entrepreneurs demystify financials in their business, untangle financials in their business, and then they create financials that entrepreneurs can trust, that really maximize profit and growth. So Pam, we are excited to have you here today. I'm I'm pumped that we started doing virtuals because this is one of our virtual shows.

Joey Bowen: 01:02

I don't know if we would have been able to get together this soon, since we're in different locales. But welcome to the show. We're excited.

Pam Jordan: 01:10

Awesome. Thanks so much, Drew. Thanks so much, Joey. I'm so pumped to talk to you guys today.

Joey Bowen: 01:15

So, let's I'm gonna lay the land out here, set some expectations. I wanna talk about 3 things today. Drew, I don't know if you wanna mix in some other stuff too, but, I wanna talk about the briefly the origin story of Pan. Because in my, reading before this podcast, I learned I knew you're an author, but now I know you're an author in a different vertical too. So, like, I'm interested in the origin story of Pam and how you came to be and how Pivot came to be.

Joey Bowen: 01:44

So that's the first thing. Then, the second thing, many in our community are considering becoming entrepreneurs. So I know in your decades of experience, you'd have some solid advice for where they should start when they wanna become an entrepreneur. And then for the entrepreneurs, third thing, in our community already, what are some of the common mistakes you see entrepreneurs make, and what can they do about them? So selfishly, that's what I would like to talk about, but I'm happy to talk about anything.

Joey Bowen: 02:16

But selfishly, I'd like to cover that stuff because I I know it'll be a lot of, value for our community.

Pam Jordan: 02:21

Awesome. Let's go.

Joey Bowen: 02:23

Alright. So how about how about, the origin story of Pam? What was it like growing up for you? And were there glimmers of starting a financial services firm when you were when you were growing up, or was that something that came later?

Pam Jordan: 02:38

Yeah. So, to start with, I'm an air force brat. So my dad did 27 years in the air force, moved around. So when I moved into college, it was my 9th move. We lived overseas.

Pam Jordan: 02:51

So every 2 to 3 years getting yanked up, you know, transplanted to a new spot, you've gotta make a brand new version of yourself. And I was really lucky that those transitions worked well for my where I was in life. My older sister definitely got shafted. Like, she got pulled out right be after her freshman year, right before her senior year. And, like, the timing for me, it was amazing.

Pam Jordan: 03:14

So whenever I got to a new place, I could remake myself. So what people liked and were drawn to, I would become more of. What people really weren't receptive to, I would just, like, scoot to the side, and I was able to better myself where my sister poor thing. Like, it just tossed her a shit hand. Right?

Pam Jordan: 03:31

She's amazing and survives in life as as a and is a great human, but it it just we both treated it differently. And so what that taught me was what people like, how to respond to people, how to get people like you, and to, like, do what you want quickly. It taught me how to be an achiever. Like, you know, it taught me to be a hunter. Because if I wanted to make friends, if I wanted to make the team, if I wanted to have someone to hang out with on a Friday night in a town that I'd just arrived in on Monday, like, I learned how to go out, connect with people, work a room, and make things happen.

Pam Jordan: 04:07

So that was, you know, childhood, went to college. I thought I was gonna be a social worker because my heart was to helping people. And then I did an internship, short story, met with a little 8 year old girl who's getting abused by her mom's boyfriend, and there wasn't enough paperwork to remove her from the situation. And I was like, I have a dorm room, and she can have my bed. And I quickly learned, like, I would go to jail because I would just shoot him, and, like, I can't steal children to, like, save them.

Pam Jordan: 04:33

So I learned pretty quickly that, like, social work was not gonna work out for me. And so then I was in ministry for a while, which was a fun ride, and then went into corporate, and that's, where I found out that that was really where I wanted to be. I knew I was either gonna be, like, in a hut in Africa or in a corner office. And I tried hut in Africa in the ministry world, and it didn't work. So corner office, we are.

Joey Bowen: 04:56

Yeah. You you mentioned that, you know, you were you were a hunter, and I appreciate you drawing that that parallel because I was gonna do it myself. Like, a lot of the times when we define the hunt or what it means to be a hunter, we say that we're, you know, capturing the best parts of ourselves and killing the worst parts or the lowest parts. Right? So not assuming that you had to kill low parts of yourself as you moved around, but you definitely did that.

Joey Bowen: 05:21

Right?

Pam Jordan: 05:22

I did.

Joey Bowen: 05:22

Okay. Look. Like, these are the things that I'm going to capture and do more of. Like, the best parts of me that people are receptive to. And they probably bring the best out of the people that you were looking to, you know what I mean, befriend or work with.

Joey Bowen: 05:37

So that's, that's super cool. And the the all of the moving and the growth that you described, it's probably a good thing, that you grew as you did because you were self aware enough to know that you'd shoot the guy. Yeah.

Pam Jordan: 05:50

You know

Joey Bowen: 05:51

what I mean? And and, you know, ditch that career path and and go a different direction.

Drew Beech: 05:56

It sounds like too with those moves and I'm not sure how is your sister older or younger

Joey Bowen: 06:00

than you?

Pam Jordan: 06:00

She's older than I am. She's 4 years older than I am.

Drew Beech: 06:03

It's, interesting. I do feel as though a lot of people in sibling relationships handle the trauma, for lack of a better word, like the all those moves were, but handle and overcome and deal with them differently. But it sounds like what you learned a lot about was emotional intelligence through essentially trial by fire, which I don't believe a lot of people take enough time to really study and understand or figure out how it can work for them. But it sounds like you were just focus on working hard and being a good person, and I feel like it's really hard to dislike someone that's doing those things.

Pam Jordan: 06:40

Yeah. And what I found is if you're an honest person, if you're a person of integrity and you work hard and you care about people, it goes a long way regardless of what town, city, country you're in.

Drew Beech: 06:52

Mhmm.

Joey Bowen: 06:54

Yeah. Absolute absolutely. Absolutely. You said that your heart initially wanted to be a social worker because you have a servant heart. Right?

Joey Bowen: 07:01

For lack of a like, in short. Right? You like helping other people. It seems like you've you're you're still doing that just in, like, a different vertical. Right?

Joey Bowen: 07:10

So Yeah. Yeah. So you went, so you you went into corporate. How'd corporate go for you?

Pam Jordan: 07:16

It went really well. I was actually working for a general contractor, so I was in the trades industry, landscaping specifically. So I'm actually a North Carolina landscape contractor by, by default because of, whatever. But, I will kill a tree and can't cut grass, but, you know, it's fine.

Joey Bowen: 07:36

Okay.

Pam Jordan: 07:37

But, ultimately, we, helped build that company to multiple millions, 99 employees. My Spanish is amazing. I can hire and fire in Spanish, but my grammar is awful. But, ultimately, the company went bankrupt. The owner stopped paying attention into his numbers.

Pam Jordan: 07:54

And due to some bad sales decisions and some, you know, you you guys know the day in, day out of entrepreneurship. Some days you make a good call and sometimes you don't. And in this instance, there's a couple of bad calls, and we had to file bankruptcy. And, I was able to get my guys jobs. I was able to protect the owner and his assets, and then I worked out of bankruptcy court, and I was like, I had to get a job.

Pam Jordan: 08:18

Like, this is not cool. This is not what I wanna do. And so, all along, I'd had a side hustle, which I think, Joy, you were you were talking to. I'm actually a gluten free influencer. I live gluten free, and so I have, I've traveled, done cooking cooking demonstrations.

Pam Jordan: 08:32

I've got, Amazon bestseller cookbooks, all this kind of stuff. But all along, like, I had a heart to be an entrepreneur. And so at this point, it was like, are you gonna go do another 9 to 5, or is it time for you to build your own legacy? And, my husband is amazing, super supportive, solid solid human. We've been married 22 years this year.

Pam Jordan: 08:54

And I'll you know, I I expressed to him that, like, I wanna build my own thing. And he said, well, what's the worst that can happen? And I said, well, then I have to go get a job. He's like, well, you need a job now, so, you know, see what happens. And so I went out and started doing fractional CFO, chief financial officer work for clients.

Pam Jordan: 09:10

And within 6 months, I was making more money than I'd ever made working for someone else, having a huge impact on my clients. And it just you know how it just clicks? Like, that was the moment that was, like, this is what I was born to do. This is what I was meant to do, and that was 8 years ago. And, now we have 17 people on my team.

Pam Jordan: 09:29

We are helping 100 of entrepreneurs and small businesses know their numbers, increase their profit, reduce their taxes, and grow their wealth, and we love what we do.

Joey Bowen: 09:38

Amazing. Amazing story. And the so you're 8 years in. Right? So you Yeah.

Joey Bowen: 09:42

You've got some you've got some wins. You've got some losses. You've got some stories. You've got some scars. You've got all that stuff.

Joey Bowen: 09:48

In the in the, before we jump into, like, entrepreneurship, as far as the, the other two things that I wanna talk about today. In your early days as an entrepreneur, what were some of the the, hurdles maybe or challenges that you encountered?

Drew Beech: 10:06

Yeah. That's what I was gonna ask too. Because a lot of our listeners are side hustle entrepreneurs. Right? There are a lot of people in the few that want to be their own boss

Joey Bowen: 10:16

Right.

Drew Beech: 10:16

Get like, achieve freedom through financial freedom, freedom of time, freedom of relationships that we always talk about. But yeah. So maybe some tips or, like, things you did to get started, for them would be great.

Pam Jordan: 10:30

Yeah. So let me start with some, you know, blunders that I made early on that I see a lot of people making. 1 is not valuing yourself enough and not charging enough. Early on, my how I charge for my services is comical compared to it is now. Like, comical comical.

Pam Jordan: 10:51

So I just started out and almost was apologizing to people. Be like, hey. I can help you. Do you want help? Sorry.

Pam Jordan: 10:58

It costs a little bit of money. You know? And I see entrepreneurs do that all the time where they're like, oh, by the way, I can I can solve this problem for you? It's, like, $500. Is that okay?

Pam Jordan: 11:08

Like, you're almost apologizing, and so that was something that very early on I had to work through and be like, no. You know what? I know my stuff. I bring value. This is what I'm worth.

Pam Jordan: 11:18

Are you in or out? And so it was an evolution, for me, to be confident in what I was and get a couple wins in under my belt of, like, dude, I just did that. Like, that company's value went up $1,200,000 because of what I did. Like, this matters. So that's a huge mistake that I did early on and also is not having a structure around what I was performing.

Pam Jordan: 11:42

And I know you you guys see this all the time. You you've got buddies that are like, oh, I wanna start my own business. Oh, great. And they just, like, sell this, that, everything. They have no packages.

Pam Jordan: 11:52

They have no clarity. They have no process. They're just selling anything just to put food on the table. Right? And at the get, that's fine, but there's a very short one runway where you need to get your crap together, and you need to figure out, like, this is what I do.

Pam Jordan: 12:05

These are my services. These are my products. This is what it costs, and then rinse and repeat that. Right? Like, it doesn't matter what Chick Fil A you go to.

Pam Jordan: 12:12

The fries are gonna be, like, bomb. Right? Like, it's because there is a one way to make Chick Fil A french fries, and you need to, in your business, figure that out. And early on, I was doing I was trying to be all things to all people. So someone would come to me with a cash flow problem.

Pam Jordan: 12:27

Oh, I can solve that. Oh, you've got a sales problem. I got I can solve that. Oh, you know, profit isn't where you want. Oh, I can figure that out.

Pam Jordan: 12:34

Oh, marketing? Sure. I I can build a funnel. Right? Like, no.

Pam Jordan: 12:37

I can't. You know? And so that was definitely early lessons, for me of, like, really honing in what was my skill set, what was I good and what was my value that I was bringing

Joey Bowen: 12:48

to people. Yeah. That'll, like, that'll really resonate with a few with the members of our community because they're rooted those 2 things are rooted in something everybody 2 things everybody struggles with. I think it's like a bit of a posture syndrome. Right?

Joey Bowen: 12:59

When in the beginning, you're like, you're apologizing for what you're charging or you're undercutting yourself. You know, there's that, am I really that person question that your brain keeps running through. You know? So the imposter syndrome. And then the second thing is really like a a scarcity mindset, which we all kind of battle with.

Joey Bowen: 13:17

Right? Because you don't wanna say no to something that could potentially bring money in to put food on the table. So you find yourself doing everything. And when you do that, you're pretty much good at nothing. Right?

Joey Bowen: 13:30

So

Pam Jordan: 13:30

100%.

Drew Beech: 13:31

We experienced

Joey Bowen: 13:32

that yeah. Kedra.

Drew Beech: 13:33

We experienced a lot of the same things. And when we were starting, we were basically selling our t shirts at the same price we were buying them. And me and Joey were making the sales, and we're like, oh my god. We've got something here. And it's like when we look at the numbers, like, oh my god.

Drew Beech: 13:47

Like, we don't like, you know what I mean? We gotta figure something out. Even to this day, we still struggle with that. I mean, you guys are always telling us to raise our prices. And,

Pam Jordan: 13:57

Yes, please. Yeah.

Drew Beech: 13:58

We're very very reluctant.

Joey Bowen: 14:00

We've we've come we've come we've come a long way since

Pam Jordan: 14:02

I've been in the past. I'm so proud of you.

Joey Bowen: 14:05

We've come we've come away. Yeah. Okay. But we will come a long way soon. So, yeah, there are 2 things I think everybody, struggles with really on the daily even outside of whether they're an entrepreneur or not.

Joey Bowen: 14:16

You know? Yeah. Yeah. So, definitely, was there in in that moment, it sounded like if we look at the first thing when you were charging much less than you should be charging for your services. Right?

Joey Bowen: 14:28

There was a moment, I think, where you had to step back and look at yourself and say, like, here, I have proof that I'm this person. Right? Yeah. You know what I mean? Like, I I my work has translated into proof, and you had to kind of step back and focus in on that and say, okay.

Joey Bowen: 14:43

Like, I'm gonna do this. Like, this is who I am. I can do this for other people too. You know?

Pam Jordan: 14:48

For sure. Yeah. Once you get one of those wins, you just gotta look at yourself in the mirror. And I think, actually, mine was driving. And I was looking in the rearview mirror, and I was driving back from a client that I had no business being at anymore because, like, they I just outgrown what they were.

Pam Jordan: 15:03

And I'm like, what what am I doing? Like, I just did this amazing thing for this client, and I'm just leaving like, I I wanted that view in my rear view from now on. Right? Like, it was literally a visualization of, like, this is not where I'm going anymore. I'm done with that.

Pam Jordan: 15:20

This is where I'm going. And I think we all have that moment, you know, in the shower when we wake up, driving, like, gut check of, like, what the crap? Like, this is this isn't in alignment with me and what I want anymore.

Joey Bowen: 15:33

Yeah. I think that there there's a certain amount of chaos that starts to bring clarity too. And then in that, like, you have that moment. It's either like a shower thought or you're brushing your teeth looking at yourself in the mirror, and you're like, wait a sec. What is going on here?

Joey Bowen: 15:46

You know what I mean? Like, I need to make a change. I need to make a change. Was there, on the second thing, it sounded like, you know, you had to learn how to say no. Yeah.

Joey Bowen: 15:56

Right? If somebody because now, you know, you have a rep a reputation of being somebody who gets the job done. So now, naturally, people are gonna come to you and say, hey. Can you build my marketing funnel? Can you do this?

Joey Bowen: 16:08

Can you do that? Because they trust your work ethic and who you are and your talent. So how did you how did you learn how to say no to the things that weren't within your zone of genius? Was there another, like, moment? Or

Pam Jordan: 16:21

It's a so part of it was just being fed up with doing things that weren't I wasn't good at. What I found out is, like, the things that I was procrastinating on and delaying doing were the things that were outside of what I was good at. And as soon as I stopped doing those things, I was hungry again. Right? Like, it's you've gotta be hungry to go out and kill and get it done.

Pam Jordan: 16:46

And so by letting go of those clients that were requiring things of me that were outside of what I wanted to be doing, I then had capacity to go be hungry and be like, dang. I got 2 days a week I can fill. Like, let's go. Let me go talk to some people. Let's go make some things happen.

Pam Jordan: 17:02

And I wouldn't have had that capacity, and I wouldn't have been hungry had I not gotten rid of what I didn't need to be doing.

Drew Beech: 17:10

You're like, kill kill on the darlings for what what betters calls it.

Joey Bowen: 17:15

That is what you said is super, super wise because sometimes Drew and I use, especially in Rise, the term zone of genius.

Pam Jordan: 17:22

Yeah.

Joey Bowen: 17:22

And some of our community members are like, why? I don't really know what my zone of genius is. Like, is there an indicator? And you said something very wise, the things you were that that you were procrastinating on were the things that you found were outside of your zone of genius.

Pam Jordan: 17:37

Yeah.

Joey Bowen: 17:37

You know, in other words, like, you're procrastinating on them because you really weren't passionate about them.

Pam Jordan: 17:42

No. They weren't things that I wanted to be doing anymore.

Joey Bowen: 17:45

Yeah. In that zone of genius, like, yes, there's a technical aspect to it, but there's also, like, a passion part of it as well. You know what I mean? So

Drew Beech: 17:53

The one thing I wanna touch on that with that is, was there a point in time when you decided it was time to start focusing more on your zone of genius or filtering off or killing off some of those clients or or people that were kind of holding you back from what you actually wanted to do. Because a lot of the time when people start, they always wanna do their they wanna work on their passion. Right? They're like they wanna be fulfilled in their work, but we all know the 3 of us know that with entrepreneurship for a long time, there's a there's a lot of times you're doing things you don't necessarily wanna do. Still to this day, there are things that might like, I don't wanna talk to

Joey Bowen: 18:32

Pam sexy stuff.

Drew Beech: 18:33

I don't wanna talk to Pam every day for for to be honest, but unfortunately, I do.

Pam Jordan: 18:37

I'm fine.

Joey Bowen: 18:38

But that has nothing to do with Pam.

Drew Beech: 18:40

That's just, you know

Pam Jordan: 18:41

Right. What? You don't wanna look at your p and l and talk to her tamed early? Yeah. No.

Pam Jordan: 18:46

I think that's a great point. And I think for me, what it was is it became an, the eye opener that I needed to grow my team. And those things that I was good at but was procrastinating weren't my zone of genius because I to your to use your term, Joey, I wasn't passionate about doing those. But there were amazing humans that are passionate about reconciling. So do you know what I did?

Pam Jordan: 19:08

I went out and found me one that hired her. Right? Like and so my clients still needed those tasks. Could I do them? Yes.

Pam Jordan: 19:16

Was I good at them? Yes. Did I want to do them? Hell, no. So then it was a matter of, oh, we got balloons.

Pam Jordan: 19:22

Now let

Joey Bowen: 19:23

me spiders.

Pam Jordan: 19:24

Let me build a team of people who that is their zone of genius. They don't wanna be front and center. They don't wanna be client facing. They just wanna sit in their corner, be number ninjas, knock it out, and then go on with their life. And so for me, it was a matter of expanding my team, which then for a lot of strong minded people becomes a problem of delegation.

Pam Jordan: 19:45

And I'm it I struggled with that for about a month, and I'm like, this is dumb. Done is better than perfect. If someone else can do it 70% as good as I can, it is now their job.

Joey Bowen: 19:57

Sounds like you put it you put those things through that GWC filter, if you're familiar with EOS. Like, you know, they get it, want it, or you're capable of it. You know, you got it, and you're capable of it, but you did not want it. Right? You know, that's the passion thing.

Joey Bowen: 20:10

So, I mean, we went through a similar moment here, and that's how we got hooked up. Yeah. You know? Because we we we needed to delegate and outsource some of the financial, aspects of our business to someone who's super passionate about it, and that's you and Pivot.

Pam Jordan: 20:28

Yeah. Because we like looking at numbers all day. It's fine that you don't. And that's perfectly you know, that's cool. That's why we all have jobs.

Joey Bowen: 20:35

Yeah. Exactly. We just

Drew Beech: 20:36

wanna make cool t shirts all day and and roll jujitsu out of our house.

Joey Bowen: 20:41

Yeah. Yeah.

Drew Beech: 20:43

What did you run into any hurdles or roadblocks when it came to delegating? Like, did people not work out or think balls dropped or

Pam Jordan: 20:52

Of course. Yeah. I fired someone yesterday. Like, yes.

Joey Bowen: 20:55

Okay. Yeah.

Pam Jordan: 20:56

Right? Like, what what I find as an entrepreneur is no one is you.

Drew Beech: 21:01

That's the one thing I say a lot is no one's gonna care as much about your dream or your business as you do.

Pam Jordan: 21:06

Exactly. So what I had to do was create a system and a process that was replicated how I would do it, but I needed to acknowledge that not everyone is me. And so they approach the system and the process differently than I do. But if the client is still getting the results and if we're still doing the same process, it's a win. And so for me, it was having a system of, like, this is how Pivot is a fractional CFO.

Pam Jordan: 21:34

This is how Pivot does bookkeeping. This is how Pivot does tax strategy. This is what the expectation is from the client and from the team. If you meet those expectations, everybody wins and makes money. If you don't, there's the door.

Pam Jordan: 21:45

And so that was what I had to build. And, unfortunately, really articulated. And so I had some crazy good, talented people that didn't have a playbook to run and guardrails to stay within, and so they just bombed. And it it as the leader, it was a 100% on me because I didn't do my job to set the parameters of what the expectations are. And so now we have very clear processes.

Pam Jordan: 22:15

I've got a certification that all of my CFOs go through that says, look. This is how we CFO. This is what I expect. This is what the client client engagement looks like. And if you can't play ball, there's the door.

Joey Bowen: 22:26

I was I was actually gonna ask you that question. As you were essentially learning how to delegate, like, retraining yourself on done is better than perfect. Did you lose good people? Because that's one thing I hear from all of my friends that are entrepreneurs. They say like, if I could go back in time and I learned how to delegate properly and build systems, I I would have been able to keep some people on the team that were, like, really, like, superstars or studs.

Joey Bowen: 22:52

You know? It's kind of, you know, it's like the shrapnel sometimes as you're learning as a leader. You know?

Pam Jordan: 22:58

Well, it's it's the collateral damage of us learning as leaders. And, unfortunately, for them, they were rock stars, but I wasn't ready for them yet. And

Joey Bowen: 23:08

Yeah. You

Pam Jordan: 23:09

know, now that I've got my systems, I'm attracting the right people. And it's bringing me the good people that are wanting to play play ball with me and run the playbooks. But I I hate it for those people because, you know, they definitely lost out. And I lost out of doing this you know, doing life with them because I just wasn't ready as a leader, and that's on me.

Drew Beech: 23:29

That being said, Cody Sanchez has a great quote, that she said she got from her dad. But it's if you haven't spent a night with your head in your hands wondering how you're gonna work it all out or figure things out, then you're not actually doing entrepreneurship. Like, you're not actually in the game. So did you ever have any nights like that in business or, like and if so, do you mind sharing them? If not, no worries.

Drew Beech: 23:54

But

Joey Bowen: 23:54

Oh, my god. Yeah.

Drew Beech: 23:56

How did you how did you get through them?

Pam Jordan: 23:58

I mean, I like bourbon. That's how we got through them.

Joey Bowen: 24:02

That helps. Yeah. That helps.

Pam Jordan: 24:04

Bourbon and red wine, just being clear. But, yeah, like, as entrepreneurs, there's definitely risks that I took, decisions that I made as the leader of, like, hey. We're gonna do this and made significant investments, like tens of 1,000 of dollars to go down this path. And then, like, boop. It didn't work.

Pam Jordan: 24:25

And so, I mean, I've I've

Joey Bowen: 24:31

so much, like much time do we have? Yeah. How much time

Pam Jordan: 24:33

do we have? Like, I I built entire companies that no longer exist. I've built courses that I didn't sell a single one, and I'm easily 50 k into. Right? Like, I've built, paid webinars.

Pam Jordan: 24:47

I have funnels. I've built, you know, all kinds of things that didn't pan out that cost me where it's like, okay. Well, that was an expensive tuition on how to not be a business owner, but buy $20,000. Let's try something different next time. But as an entrepreneur, it's all in my opinion, it's about you have to be the you have to be able to to take risks and suffer the consequences and learn from them.

Pam Jordan: 25:15

I tell people I don't lose. I either win or I learn. And sometimes the learning costs more than others. And, unfortunately, that's part of this journey, but if I wasn't willing to take those risks and drop the 50 k for this or the 20 k for that or the 15,000 for the stupid thing that I thought was gonna be life changing, I wouldn't be where sitting where I am with the team that I have, but I was willing to take those risks because other risks that I took did work, and here we are.

Drew Beech: 25:43

It sounds like with all those ups and downs, what you did was you always figured it out. And that's the one thing I I made mistakes in the past of trying to get like, I'm telling you, I always say getting other people to be an entrepreneur. Right? It's almost impossible. And entrepreneurs don't always necessarily have the best plans or make the best calls or take the best risk, but they literally always figure it out.

Drew Beech: 26:06

And that's something that I believe separates the 3 of us and also the few from the many. Right? The ones that are gonna start the businesses, win in business are just the ones that figure it out when shit hits the fan.

Pam Jordan: 26:18

And that's the difference. That's the difference in your community. You know? They're the ones that wake up early and do the work. They do they're the ones that get kicked in the face on purpose, pick up a 50 pound bag, and go up a mountain for fun.

Pam Jordan: 26:30

Right? Like, that's what being an entrepreneur is, is, like, getting kicked in the face, that hurt. Next time, I'm gonna block it. Right? Like, that's what business is.

Pam Jordan: 26:40

And Mhmm. The other guys are sitting at a desk in a cubicle now.

Joey Bowen: 26:45

I love yeah. I love that quote. You know, you don't lose. You either win or you learn. I think that if you haven't had that night where you've had your head in your hands, yet, you think that the learning is kind of like classroom learning where you're sitting in a desk and you have a marble notebook and you just write some great shit down that you learned, but it's not.

Joey Bowen: 27:04

It's like painful. It is painful. It's like getting kicked in the mouth. You know what I mean? And it it leaves it leaves you either in a spot where you're gonna quit or you're gonna continue much smarter.

Joey Bowen: 27:16

You know what I mean? And that's, that's definitely what we that's definitely what we do as the few. You you had something, Drew?

Drew Beech: 27:23

No. No. I just wrote something down. I wrote

Joey Bowen: 27:26

something down for the end. I got you. I got you. So, entrepreneurs in the few that thank you for 1st and foremost, thank you for being vulnerable and honest about some of the mistakes you've made. Because many times when we introduce someone like you, founder and CEO, profitable, thriving business, right, we're a client of it's natural human nature for people to think that you are in some way special Or not to say you're not.

Joey Bowen: 27:56

We love you to death. You have great energy. We love you to death. Super talented. But you know what I mean.

Joey Bowen: 28:01

People start to think that you have something special. Like, you have some kind of special sauce that let you just turn the heat up really fast, bake the cake, and now you're just loving life. You know? You being vulnerable and explaining some of those mistakes grounds you and gives people the real story. You know?

Joey Bowen: 28:19

So we, we appreciate that. Yeah.

Pam Jordan: 28:21

Very, very much. Absolutely. There's hiding hiding that doesn't help the next woman or or man that wants to build their own empire. Like, if if we all just put it out there and share who we are, like,

Joey Bowen: 28:35

let me tell you my mistakes so you don't do it. Right?

Pam Jordan: 28:35

And this year really has mistakes so you don't do it. Right? And this year really has been our best year for multiple metrics, and everyone's like, oh, what'd you do different? I'm like, we're the overnight success that took 8 years, and I just put my head down and worked every day. Like, there is nothing that I did this year that was, like, the thing that solved all of my problems.

Pam Jordan: 28:57

I just worked hard for 8 years, and here we are.

Joey Bowen: 29:01

And it it compounded. It compounded. During during this year, when you put your head down and you worked, did you find yourself focusing more on the work that was directly in front of you or more on the goals that you had for the year? Like, what was there was there a balance between the 2? Like, what what do you think?

Pam Jordan: 29:21

So I, so it's a great question, Joey. So I think first part is I really got clarity on what I want and what my future looks like. My husband and I, like, sat down, and we're really intentional at the start of the year of what does success look like for us as a couple? What does success look like for us as a family? We have 3 kids.

Pam Jordan: 29:40

What does financial success down the road looks like? And, like, I know what our true north is. I know what I'm building for our family and the role that I'm playing in that. And so this year, all of the decisions I'm making are for that end. So, like, hire this person.

Pam Jordan: 29:56

Does it get it does it get me closer or further from that? Yes. Build the software. Does it get me closer further further? No.

Pam Jordan: 30:03

Right? And so I just have a more honed in lens of where I'm going and being able to make decisions based on that. Because I know where I wanna go, and I'm vetting decisions based on that true north of what I want. And I think that has been something that I have more clarity on, that I didn't before, and I've also like, I I thought I knew what I wanted, but I also was kind of apologizing for it. And now I'm just owning it.

Pam Jordan: 30:34

Like, no. This is what I want, and I'm sore I'm sorry if that offends you, but this is what I'm building. You can either cheer me on, help, or get out of the way.

Joey Bowen: 30:44

Makes sense.

Drew Beech: 30:45

We always say whether you whether you push us, support us, or doubt us, thank you.

Joey Bowen: 30:50

It's It's gonna happen it's gonna happen anyway.

Drew Beech: 30:53

Things for me in life really started to unlock when I stopped, like you said, being sorry for what I wanted and what I was doing and having success with. Right? Like, I would always, like, wanna hide any of my wins because I didn't want people to think I was doing better than them. But, when you stop being apologetic for making decisions based on where you wanna go in life, things really start to unlock and life just gets better. Right?

Drew Beech: 31:21

Like, you don't live in constant fear of being judged, which I know being free thinkers and entrepreneurs and leaders like we are, like, that back to imposter syndrome can start to creep in.

Pam Jordan: 31:37

Yeah. 100%.

Joey Bowen: 31:39

For sure. For sure. So for the, we took a little bit of a turn there, but it was a good one. For the members of the few, for the members of our community that are considering starting a business, considering taking the wild roller coaster ride of entrepreneurship, where do you recommend they start?

Pam Jordan: 32:00

Sure. So what I would consider people do is find a quiet spot, pour a glass of something, and then start writing down or thinking about what do people come and ask you advice on? What are people come to you as the expert in? What are you known for? And if those three things align with what you wanna do, you just found your thing.

Drew Beech: 32:25

Mhmm.

Pam Jordan: 32:26

Because so often, people will be like, oh, I wanna start a PR agency or some off the wall thing. And I'm like, okay. Well, what do you know about PR? Oh, I just think it'd be fun to learn. No.

Pam Jordan: 32:36

Like, well, it turns out you're really good at making logos. Like, so own like, own what your thing is. Like, if you're good at it, you enjoy it, people come to you for it, people ask you advice on it. That's your thing.

Joey Bowen: 32:54

And

Pam Jordan: 32:55

then it's just about figuring out how you can monetize it and start hustling. Like, get a client, even if it's your uncle, and he pays you to with beer. Right? Now you have a client and you are in business. Because the next time you can start speaking in plural, I have clients.

Pam Jordan: 33:11

Right? And it's just like, get now you're working for your neighbor. Right? And now you're doing a logo for the, you know, pizza place that you order from. Right?

Pam Jordan: 33:20

And so it just rolls. And then once you get a couple wins under your belt, pour a glass of something, get a piece of paper out, and just reassess, like, what do you want this to look like? What is success look like for you in this? And a lot of times, it comes down to freedom of time and freedom of money. But define that.

Pam Jordan: 33:41

Figure out what that is, and then build a business that allows you to do that. Having an LLC, s corp as even as a w two is one of the best tax strategies that you can have. I have a lot of a lot of friends that work w twos, even teachers, and I'm like, sweetie. Like, here's how we're gonna save you $10 in taxes this year. You're gonna open an LLC, and all these cookies that everyone's asking you to bake for their parties and you're decorating beautifully is now an LLC, and you're gonna counteract your w two income, and you're gonna get a refund.

Pam Jordan: 34:13

Right? Like, let's go. So

Drew Beech: 34:16

Yeah.

Pam Jordan: 34:16

Figure out what you're good at, what you're passionate at, what people ask you about, and then start hustling for it, see how the market responds to it, and then start a company and start doing it. Because

Joey Bowen: 34:28

That's right.

Pam Jordan: 34:28

I talk to high paid w two people that are wanting to start entrepreneurship. I mean, I talked to a freaking guy that works at Apple, and he's making 4:30 a year. But he's really passionate about the med spa space and, healing, like, athletes and and cold plunging, hot plunging red lights and, like, all the modalities. And he's like, just you know, I'm dipping my toes in the water. I'm like, quit your job.

Pam Jordan: 34:52

Go hustle. Like, if you're hungry, you will go find the business. You will go make it happen. But if you're sitting fat and cushy in your w two, you're not gonna do the sales call. You're not gonna go to the bar, to the coffee shop, to the chamber event, d and I, like, whatever the thing is to go find clients.

Pam Jordan: 35:11

Like

Joey Bowen: 35:11

Yeah.

Pam Jordan: 35:12

If this is what you're meant to do, go out and hunt. Like, using your terms, like, go make it happen. Sitting fat and happy is not gonna make your dreams come true of freedom and time and money. Otherwise, you're gonna just keep clicking the time clock and retire when you're 65 with nothing to that you've built.

Joey Bowen: 35:29

To to to live the time of your life or the time of your dreams, it requires a full time effort. And that was one of the things even, you know, when we hooked up with Bea and he came on as a partner at Few Will Hunt, that was one of the stipulations. He was like, guys, you gotta quit your jobs. You know? Because up until that time, we knew what we needed to do.

Joey Bowen: 35:47

We just didn't do it yet. You know, we had to make that leap, you know, and burn burn the boats as they say.

Pam Jordan: 35:52

Oh, for sure.

Joey Bowen: 35:52

You mentioned you mentioned something you mentioned an example about, the PR firm. You know, like, really? Because it'd be fun to learn. Blah blah blah. I I in in RISE and in some of our coaching calls, we hear that all the time.

Joey Bowen: 36:06

Right? People, I believe, are busy living the lives of other people because they're spectating on enjoyable, profitable that someone else is doing that's like tertiary to their thing. And they say, well, that's my that would be fine. I should go, you know, do that. But it's not the truth.

Joey Bowen: 36:32

I think that's where your, your recommendation of, like, sitting down and going through those three questions, very similar to there's Japanese process of, like, finding, Sitting down and going through those 3 questions to really, like, dial in your awareness and, like, find your thing. Because otherwise, you're gonna go off and do some other thing and it's gonna entrepreneurship is hard enough when you're doing something that's outside of your zone of genius. You know what I mean? You got really spoiled entrepreneurship for yourself. Good.

Pam Jordan: 37:02

Yeah. Yeah. Joe. Go ahead, Joe.

Drew Beech: 37:05

Back back to when giving advice to people that are looking to start, a bit of advice I give the people, and I'm curious for your where where you stand on this because your initial statement of needing to charge, the right price from the beginning. I advise people to get their first few clients, like, do it for free because you did mention that doing it for your uncle in beer. Do you also agree that when you're getting started, like, we gave away our first 50 shirts for free. Right? Like and I'd say, for instance, my friend who started a personal training company, and I was like, dude, train people for free.

Drew Beech: 37:42

Meal plans for free. Do what other people are doing and and charge it for, and you're doing it for free. Do you also agree with that until you find the right time to start charging your the right price?

Pam Jordan: 37:54

So I agree a 100% for 99% of scenarios. So for the most part, most entrepreneurs just need to know that they can do it. So talking about the imposter syndrome, Joy, that you you brought up earlier, like, you just need to believe that you can do this thing and you bring value to the marketplace. And once you know that you bring value to the marketplace, start charging. So, like, for the personal trainer.

Pam Jordan: 38:17

Yeah. Go hustle. Find someone who's influential, who has a decent following. Be like, look. Can I train you and you do a testimonial video?

Pam Jordan: 38:25

Right? Can I put you in my social media? Your buddy would be like, yeah. Absolutely. You know, here's my before.

Pam Jordan: 38:30

Here's my after. You know, all that. Well, all you need is 4 or 5 of those, and now you feel confident that you know what's up. You have proven stories of success, and now you can go charge, you know, 100 of dollars for your training. So definitely, yes.

Pam Jordan: 38:47

You know? Because most of us need to know that we can do it. You know? When you made that first shirt and you guys got together as cousins and had this dream and the frustration in in in the marketplace and had an idea to fix it, like, you kinda needed to, like, make the shirt and give it to someone and be like, wow. This is dope.

Pam Jordan: 39:07

Like, I love this. Right? And then you're like, oh, we've got something. And so most of us need that, to just get that endorphin and that confidence of, like, oh, this is gonna work. I could do this.

Pam Jordan: 39:21

Right? But there needs to be a very short runway of okay. The marketplace is excited about it. They're receiving it well. I'm making a difference.

Pam Jordan: 39:30

I feel good about it. Let's go kill it and raise the prices and charge for the value that we're bringing.

Drew Beech: 39:37

Exactly. For sure.

Joey Bowen: 39:38

Anything else on that, Drew?

Drew Beech: 39:39

I'll tell you. No. That was that's All good. That completely answered my question.

Joey Bowen: 39:43

So, for the for the few for the members of our community that are already entrepreneurs at any stage in the game. Right? Because, you've pointed out some mistakes that I I've made and I'm years into the game. Right? Like, even now that I had to correct.

Joey Bowen: 39:59

So for the for the entrepreneurs that are new or have been in the game for a little while, what are some of the common mistakes that you see them make, in business?

Pam Jordan: 40:09

Yeah. So the first thing is you are not your business, and your business bank account is not your piggy bank. So you are an individual and your business is a business, so treat it like one. Right? Have a set it up as a legal entity, LLC Inc, C Corp, S Corp.

Pam Jordan: 40:29

Pick 1. There's pluses and minuses for all of them. Set it up. It needs its own bank account, its own credit card, and then don't swipe, you know, your groceries with your business credit card. Keep them separate because I have clients that come to me that are doing multiple 1,000,000 of dollars.

Pam Jordan: 40:46

I literally just had one this week, to over $2,000,000, and she's using her personal credit card for business expenses and Nordstrom. And I'm like, sweetie, can't do it. Like, there's Yeah. There's a veil between the 2, and once you cross it, the IRS has a field day. So, like, just be really clear about this is my business.

Pam Jordan: 41:08

This is my business money. This is me. This is my personal. So as your business is growing, you wanna pay yourself, set yourself up on payroll, or write a check, or transfer from your business account to your personal account, and then pay your rent. Don't have the business, pay your apartment.

Pam Jordan: 41:22

Like, separate them.

Joey Bowen: 41:25

Yeah.

Drew Beech: 41:25

But don't pay yourself on, payroll if you're an LLC, though. Right?

Pam Jordan: 41:31

Unless you have an s election. Correct?

Drew Beech: 41:33

Yeah. Not I

Joey Bowen: 41:36

I yeah. Yes.

Drew Beech: 41:39

Asking for asking for a friend.

Pam Jordan: 41:41

I understand how you're set up and how the IRS sees you before you just start paying yourself through w 2, just as a word of caution. It may have happened.

Joey Bowen: 41:51

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So that's a great point of advice.

Joey Bowen: 41:55

How about some other or, great, call out on that mistake. How about some others that you see entrepreneurs make?

Pam Jordan: 42:02

Yeah. You need to take time to be the CEO of your business. Even if you're bringing in a couple grand a month, you still need to be working on your business and not just in it. Drew, you you talked about this. Like, you don't wanna meet with me every day because you don't wanna stare at numbers and budgets and forecast and cash flow and blah blah blah.

Pam Jordan: 42:22

I get it. But as the CEO, at some point, you need to put on that hat. And even when people are just starting out or been in business for a while, it's you need to like me, myself, like Mondays are my CEO days. That's when I do what I need to do to work on my business. That's when I meet with my leadership team.

Pam Jordan: 42:40

That's when I check-in with my department heads. That's when I make sure invoices have been paid. That's when I make sure invoices have been sent. This is why I make sure my sales team is meeting their metrics. This is when I make sure my social media is scheduled out.

Pam Jordan: 42:53

Right? Like, I need to work on my business, and, otherwise, that stuff's not fun. Like, I don't wanna go to all those meetings. I love my team, but I don't wanna sit there on Zoom for 4 hours. But that's what's required of being the CEO.

Pam Jordan: 43:08

Right? And so a big mistake is I see people are so busy hustling in their business and doing the the work of their company that they forget that they're the leader of their company. And so it doesn't matter if you have 0zeros or 8zeros. You still need to lead the business and spend time working on it and looking at the big picture of where your business is going. Otherwise, your team's gonna be like, what are we doing?

Pam Jordan: 43:35

Where are we going? Why are we making this decision? Blah blah blah blah blah. Like, you know what it is to lead for people to follow you. You have to cash vision.

Pam Jordan: 43:44

You have to be clear on what's going, where you're taking this business. Otherwise, people are gonna be like, you don't know what's up. I'm out.

Drew Beech: 43:50

And that's a great point. We like to say all the time. One of our mantras is no one owes you and no one owns you. You gotta own own your shit. Right?

Drew Beech: 43:56

Like, own everything in your life, every variable. It's the same with fitness, health, jujitsu. Like, you can only do you can only do half the work. Right? Like, you can show up every day and swing the hammer and service your customers, but if you're not doing the hard work in the kitchen, right, or getting your mind right or studying film, you're never gonna progress.

Drew Beech: 44:18

So I do believe that that concept of extreme ownership applies to any and all areas of life and business.

Pam Jordan: 44:25

Absolutely.

Joey Bowen: 44:26

Yeah. Working, working in your business and working on your business, very important delineation. I feel like the working on your business also has a counterpart of working on yourself, and I think that's what Drew was kinda hitting on. Because it's very easy to distract yourself by working in the business. There's typically things that need to be worked on the business that you're procrastinating on, and maybe those things would be tackled if you worked on yourself a little bit.

Joey Bowen: 44:56

There's like a link there. You know what I mean?

Drew Beech: 44:58

And I think that's why a lot

Joey Bowen: 45:00

a lot

Drew Beech: 45:00

of people, especially especially contractors too, Pam, and you can testify to this maybe, but they that's how you don't go from being Pam the accountant to Pam the CEO of Pivot Business Group. Right? Like, you never really build real wealth or freedom of time, money, and relationships because these but I I draw back to contractors a lot because I just you see them. Right? They get they'd line up the jobs for the week, and that's the jobs they do for the week.

Drew Beech: 45:27

They have maybe one person that comes in and helps them out and they never really think of looking at this picture or what they actually want to see their business become.

Pam Jordan: 45:36

Yeah.

Drew Beech: 45:37

So they just created a they created a job for themselves. A hard job.

Pam Jordan: 45:41

Yeah. A lot of times sure. I see people darting out, and you're right. Like, they they started the business because they think they could do it better than their boss, so they wanted to make more money. And really, in fact, they're because they're not playing the game of business and not working on their company, They're just a glorified employee of their own job, and they suck as a boss.

Pam Jordan: 46:01

Like, their boss is an idiot because they're not leading the charge for the for for the business. And that's what a lot of 1099 like, oh, I'm gonna be a contractor. I'm gonna make more money. Okay. But then you need a you hire an assistant or some 10 9 nines.

Pam Jordan: 46:14

Well, you're just a bad boss for yourself.

Joey Bowen: 46:18

How about another mistake? Let's keep let's keep it rolling. How about another mistake? I know you got another one.

Pam Jordan: 46:22

I sure do. Not building to sell.

Drew Beech: 46:26

Yeah.

Pam Jordan: 46:28

Every business needs to be built with the end in mind. Even if you never want to sell it, you wanna create turn it into an ESOP where, you know, that it turns into employee owned or you wanna pass it down to the next generation. Every business needs to be built to sell because then you need the right people, you need the right processes, you need to have profit, and you need to have all of the structure of that so that you can have freedom of time and money. Because if you are the business, you don't have freedom of time and money. Because if Joey goes on vacation, sales goes on vacation.

Pam Jordan: 47:02

If Joey goes on vacation, operations goes on vacation. But if Joey wants to go on a 2 week ruck through the, I don't know, Peru, like, you've gotta have your business built to sell so that those systems, the teams, and the profit are in place so that you can live that life. Mhmm. And too often I see entrepreneurs where they are everything to the business, and they are not building it to sell. They are by definition, every invoice has to be approved by them.

Pam Jordan: 47:29

Every proposal has to be approved by them. Every decision that everyone makes, and you are knocking your team at the knees if that's how you're running the show because you can't go on vacation. Everyone's relying on you, and no one feels empowered to take ownership of what they're doing within your business. So build your company to sell so that if someone comes in and says, hey, Drew. I'm private equity.

Pam Jordan: 47:53

We love what you're doing. We love your brand. The community, we align a 100% with here's a big fat check. You and Joey go off ride off in the sunset. If you don't have your house in order, you can't accept that check.

Pam Jordan: 48:04

And I've had conversations with clients who've had an offer on the table, and I looked at the offer and I looked at them as a business, and I'm like, you won't make it through due diligence because due diligence is what comes after you get a LOI or a letter of intent. So someone wants to come by you, you get an LOI. And we help companies do this. You get an LOI. They're like, you're beautiful.

Pam Jordan: 48:22

We love you. We want your business. It's $2,000,000. We just need to look under the hood, and this check is yours. Well, then we go into due diligence, and they look under the hood and be like, oh, well, why is there jet ski on this?

Pam Jordan: 48:34

Why is your girlfriend on payroll? Why is this? And where did this $40,000 go? And there's no you know, you're behind on taxes for 3 years, and, oh, everything has to be signed off by you. Thanks, but no.

Pam Jordan: 48:47

And they walk out slowly.

Joey Bowen: 48:48

Yeah. What about, in those instances, how about systems? Doing that due diligence, they're also looking for systems. Right? Because they're saying, okay.

Joey Bowen: 48:55

Like, we're not we're not gonna we're we're gonna have to install new people to do all this manual stuff or pray that this person doesn't go doesn't leave when, you know, this acquisition happens or this buyout happens. So they're looking for systems as well. Right? Yeah. And that's where the processes come in.

Joey Bowen: 49:07

Like, you've gotta have your processes in place of this is how

Pam Jordan: 49:09

our client journey goes. This is how fulfillment looks. This is what our email marketing how it goes. Because if you can show to someone coming in, this is repeatable because it's the process of the system that we're following. They're like, boom.

Pam Jordan: 49:28

Here's the money.

Joey Bowen: 49:29

Do you do you find that so that's all absolute truth. Right? But it's also a it's a it's a growing process. Right? Like, when the business is born and it first starts out, everybody's wearing all the hats, you know, and it's crazy town, you know, and then maybe there's not a calendar set up for promotion or things like that.

Joey Bowen: 49:48

But as the business matures and as the business grows, it's, you know, our responsibility as entrepreneurs to install those systems and that organization into the business, like you're saying, so that you can prepare it for eventual sale. Even if that's not a goal.

Pam Jordan: 50:03

Exactly. You

Joey Bowen: 50:04

never know what what the future could hold.

Pam Jordan: 50:06

And then you need to be prepared to look at those processes and systems and re tweak them. Because Mhmm. For for me, like, the systems that I built at 6 figures were beautiful and worked, and we are breaking all of those at 7 figures. But just straightforward, like

Joey Bowen: 50:22

For sure.

Pam Jordan: 50:23

What worked when we were doing 6 figures is not working at scale, so we're having to rework our systems. And the same thing with your team, the people that get you here aren't the people that are gonna get you there. And so as we've grown, my team has changed because people because people were comfortable with us at this size, aren't comfortable with us at this size, and aren't part of the journey, and that's perfectly fine. Right? They they were there for a season.

Pam Jordan: 50:51

And if you're building your business to sell, building focusing on your people, focusing on your systems and your processes, and focusing on your profit, every time you hit another level, you've gotta reevaluate all of that. Because, you know, if you've got an amazing operator who knows how to run a half $1,000,000 company, that doesn't mean Queen knows how to run a $3,000,000 company. And if you're at 3,000,000, you need to uplevel your your team. And then your systems are gonna break, and your are gonna go low because you gotta take over overhead, and so you gotta re tweak the whole system. So it's a continual growth process, but you're never done as an entrepreneur.

Pam Jordan: 51:25

You're never done as a business until you're in the ground or you get a check and walk out the door.

Joey Bowen: 51:30

Yeah. Yeah. It's a it's a it's a life cycle. There's, like, growing and dying throughout the entire process. And we talk a lot about business growth and growing and scaling and all this, but we don't often talk about the things that need to die in order to to to grow, you know, and scale.

Joey Bowen: 51:46

So, yeah, very important point. Got some, Drew?

Drew Beech: 51:49

No. Some for the end, but I mean, I'm yeah. The,

Joey Bowen: 51:53

You wanna bless us? That was 3. You wanna bless us with another mistake, Pam, that, that you see entrepreneurs make?

Pam Jordan: 52:00

Oh, my gosh. There's so many.

Joey Bowen: 52:04

How about, how about when Good. No. Take a tape. Yeah.

Pam Jordan: 52:10

Not paying attention to your numbers is something that I see. Because I talk to entrepreneurs and they're like, oh, I have people for that. Oh, I have a bookkeeper. Oh, I have an accountant. Dude, it's your money.

Pam Jordan: 52:25

No one's gonna care about your numbers the way that you do. And just because it's being handled by somebody, it's your numbers. It's your money. Like, you guys know this. Shit goes south.

Pam Jordan: 52:38

They're coming after your house. You signed on those loans. Yeah. Not, you know, the person in the warehouse that's packing boxes. And that's what a lot of people as entrepreneurs, they think, oh, well, I'm big enough now that I don't have to worry about my numbers.

Pam Jordan: 52:51

So, you know, I'm I'll meet with my account at the end of the year. That's too late. Like, you need to pay attention to the cash flow. You need to pay attention to your money. Numbers tell a story, and if you don't listen to that story, you're gonna make bad decisions, you're gonna make bad hiring choices, and you're gonna take risks that you shouldn't have taken because the money the story was not allowing you to make that decision.

Pam Jordan: 53:14

And all of us, I mean, all of us have those stories, you know, Drew, to your point. Like, head in the hands, it's up all night because you can't make payroll because you made a call and it was a bad one. Well, a lot of times it's because you weren't paying attention to numbers that would've told you don't freaking do that. You don't have the cash for it.

Drew Beech: 53:29

And a lot of that goes back to doing the hard work in business and in life too because a lot of the times those numbers aren't telling the story that you want them to tell. So you have to choose action over avoidance and actually look under those those metaphorical rocks and see what's under there, even if it's not what you hope is there. Right?

Joey Bowen: 53:47

Yeah. For sure.

Pam Jordan: 53:48

Definitely.

Joey Bowen: 53:49

For sure. So one one thing that, I was as we bring this in for a landing here this was great. This was great. I can't even believe almost an hour went by. One thing that I think I failed to mention in the beginning was that you're an author.

Joey Bowen: 54:01

Right? I I I think I failed to mention that. So you're an author on the finance side. Right? So you do have a guide for entrepreneurs, right, to help them.

Joey Bowen: 54:11

What what's the name of that book and where can people find it? Yeah.

Pam Jordan: 54:14

Absolutely. It's called Start With Profit. And you can just go to pamjordan.combook, and it's right there. It's a free download. It's on Amazon.

Pam Jordan: 54:23

It's, like, 60 pages, so pour beer, pour bourbon. You can get through it. It's easy read. But it's got a lot of nuggets, and it talks a lot about the the things I talked about, the team, the processes, the profit, all those things, understanding what your goal is. So to you can build the foundation for your business.

Joey Bowen: 54:40

Got you. Got you. And then I have a closing a fun closing question for you, but let's talk about the other the other books because there are other books as well. There's there are Kirk books. Right?

Joey Bowen: 54:50

Yes. That, so why don't why don't you just, like, 1 or 2 minutes, just tell us a little bit about that because that intrigued

Pam Jordan: 54:57

me. Yeah. So I live gluten free because I have an autoimmune disease called celiac disease. So, I woke up, and one day was told I could never eat wheat flour, rye, or barley again. And I don't know about you, but that's, like, in darn near everything.

Pam Jordan: 55:11

Right? Like, everything that's good. Pasta, bread, seafood, like, breading, anything fried, beer. And so I was like, what am I gonna do with my life, and how am I gonna survive? And, this was 12 years ago now, and they're just and I was a busy mom with toddlers.

Pam Jordan: 55:29

Like, I did not have time to bake from scratch. And so I learned how to adapt my normal cooking into gluten free and created a blog, and now 6 cookbooks on how to live this way, and have, like I said, traveled the country speaking at conferences, doing cooking demos, teaching people how to live gluten free. And I do that because this is how I have to live my life. And I found that there was a lot of busy busy moms out there who were trying to feed their families. They were like, how do I make pasta and lasagna in a way that a toddler's gonna eat it, and it doesn't taste like crap?

Pam Jordan: 56:05

Right? And so that's that's what it what I did, and I I still do it not as actively just because COVID's taking up so much of my time, but, the social media is still out there. So if I'm traveling, I'm showing people where to eat, when I'm cooking, and all those kind of things.

Joey Bowen: 56:18

Very cool. I I know some of those moms, so I'm gonna share some of your your books with them.

Pam Jordan: 56:23

I love it.

Joey Bowen: 56:24

They're both.

Drew Beech: 56:24

Well, fun fact. I mean, as you know, Joey, I'm super into the health and fitness, the biohacking space, but we're I it is to my belief in reading that none of us are supposed to be eating gluten actually as a a human species. It's actually a man made thing, not like a natural food, but that that's for a different pop. We'll bring you back on for a health Yeah.

Joey Bowen: 56:44

We'll bring you back off

Pam Jordan: 56:45

for We can do a bio hacking and, nutrition talk. I love it.

Drew Beech: 56:49

I love it. I do. I do. So we've been on a few podcasts, and people have asked us these, like, lightning round questions. Yeah.

Drew Beech: 56:56

So I did

Joey Bowen: 56:57

I

Drew Beech: 56:57

was on 1, like, a couple weeks ago, and they asked me these questions. I wanted to for them along to you. That would be a good thing to add to our podcast. So I have 3 questions 3 questions and then a a bonus question.

Joey Bowen: 57:09

Add, add I haven't seen your questions, but add another question because I have a fun question too.

Drew Beech: 57:14

I'll make

Pam Jordan: 57:14

you have questions.

Drew Beech: 57:14

So do 5 questions. So the first one, Pam, what is your favorite quote?

Pam Jordan: 57:20

Oh, so you're gonna love it. So I'm not supposed to tell a story. I learned it from an army general. You can't soar with the eagles if you're running with the Turks.

Drew Beech: 57:32

Wow. That is applicable. We we spun that to eagles don't fly with pigeons. So, I mean, it's definitely in alignment. A lot of the members of the few are readers because great readers are great leaders.

Drew Beech: 57:47

What is your number one book recommendation?

Pam Jordan: 57:50

10 x is easier than 2 x.

Drew Beech: 57:53

I have that one right here. Great great recommendation. Great read. Great read. What does Few hunt mean to you?

Pam Jordan: 58:03

Not everyone's willing to do the work. Being an entrepreneur, being a leader, being impactful in your home, being impactful in your marriage takes work. And there's a lot of people that make excuses instead of get up and hustle and make it happen.

Joey Bowen: 58:20

Period.

Drew Beech: 58:21

We're gonna have to have Dane clip that one.

Joey Bowen: 58:23

Yep.

Drew Beech: 58:24

And then the my bonus question is, what is your favorite and or go to gluten free meal?

Pam Jordan: 58:35

I mean, I just use gluten free ingredients. So I really love pasta. So I've been doing a lot with quinoa pasta and brown rice pasta, and then I make, like, baked ziti is probably my favorite. I love baked ziti. I just use the big pasta.

Drew Beech: 58:48

You ever do a chickpea pasta, like gluten free, I think it

Joey Bowen: 58:51

is?

Pam Jordan: 58:51

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Like the bonanza? Yeah.

Pam Jordan: 58:53

Chickpea?

Drew Beech: 58:53

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Drew Beech: 58:55

Alright. Because what's your question? You're like So my

Joey Bowen: 58:58

my bonus question's in line. What is your favorite bourbon? I heard you mentioned bourbon a couple times.

Pam Jordan: 59:03

Yeah. So for, like, weekday drinker is buffalo trace, but super hard to get. Right? So if if not, then I really like Woodford Reserve. Like, if we're gonna go, like, let's pour some blends, but, you know, that's that's, like, special occasion.

Pam Jordan: 59:24

Yeah.

Joey Bowen: 59:24

Got you. Got you. Yeah. My bourbon my bourbon days are behind me, but I was, I was a big fan for a long time. So I, I respect those answers for sure.

Joey Bowen: 59:36

Good. Good. Got this was amazing. I have fun. Is, we talked about, Pam Jordan book dot com, was it?

Pam Jordan: 59:44

Just Pam Jordan dot com, and that will direct them to my book, to pivot business group, to learn more about

Joey Bowen: 59:52

my team, all of our

Pam Jordan: 59:52

services, pamjordan.com. Super easy.

Joey Bowen: 59:54

Excellent. Excellent. Thank you for joining us today on the show. Thank you for all of the hard work that you do with us and through us and on us, at Few Hunt. I just literally had a coaching call last night, and I recommended you and, yes, and your group, to her, because I know that, you will be able to help them, like I said, untangle, demystify their numbers, and help them grow.

Joey Bowen: 01:00:19

So keep a lookout for that recommendation coming in.

Pam Jordan: 01:00:22

I love it. This has been so much fun. Yeah. It's this has been a great hour. Great conversation.

Pam Jordan: 01:00:26

Appreciate y'all.

Drew Beech: 01:00:27

Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah.

Joey Bowen: 01:00:28

Well, we're gonna bring it we're gonna bring you back for the health and wellness for the health and wellness episode version of, version of the episode.

Drew Beech: 01:00:34

So Yeah.

Joey Bowen: 01:00:35

You'll be back.

Drew Beech: 01:00:36

The Steelhead influenced the version of Pam, not the pivot Pam.

Pam Jordan: 01:00:39

Yep. I love it. Let's do it.

Joey Bowen: 01:00:41

Exactly. Alright. I'm gonna leave the few with a reminder. Always choose hard work over handouts. Always choose effort over entitlement.

Joey Bowen: 01:00:48

Remember, no one owns you. No one owes you. You're one of the few. Now let's hunt.