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Released every Tuesday, the LOUNGE LIZARDS podcast helps listeners navigate the experience of finding and enjoying premium cigars (both Cuban and non-Cuban) and quality spirits. Episodes are normally around 90 minutes long and feature a variety of different topics including food, travel, life, sports and work.
The podcast features eight members: Rooster, Poobah, Gizmo, Senator, Pagoda, Chef Ricky, Grinder and Bam Bam.
This is not your typical cigar podcast. We’re a group of friends who love sharing cigars, whiskey and a good laugh.
Join us and become a card-carrying lounge lizard yourself! Email us at hello@loungelizardspod.com to join the conversation and be featured on an upcoming episode!
Welcome to the Lounge Lizards podcast presented by Fabric of Five. It's so good to have you here. It's a leisure and lifestyle podcast founded on our love of premium cigars as well as whiskey travel, food, work, and whatever else we feel like getting into. My name is Gizmo. Tonight, I'm joined by Rooster, Senator, chef Ricky, and Bam Bam that are planning to smoke a cigar, drink some wine, talk about life, and, of course, have some laughs.
Gizmo:So take this as your two hundred and third official invitation to join us and become a card carrying lounge lizard. Plano meets you once a week. We're gonna smoke a New World cigar tonight, share our thoughts on it, and give you a formal lizard rating. We discuss the faults and lavage packaging. We revisit why we smoke the entire cigar, and senator tells us about his trip to the Doctor, all among a variety of other things for the next two hours.
Gizmo:So sit back, get your favorite drink, light up a cigar, and enjoy as we pair Pascal Jolie Bette Sancerre 2023 with the Davodoff chef's edition 2025 in Toro. A Toro from The Dominican Republic on the pod tonight, boys. It's the Davodoff, the chef's edition 2025. It's a 52 ring age cigar by six and one quarter inches long. And, boys, bad news for Davodoff tonight because we have our own cigar smoking chef in the room tonight.
Senator:That's correct.
Gizmo:Now chef Ricky doesn't have any Michelin stars yet. Not yet. But he is flanked by two podcast stars.
Senator:Correct.
Gizmo:Senator and Bambam.
Senator:That's also correct. Giz, how long did you prepare that?
Gizmo:Actually,I just thought of it. I swear to God. Too busy today for you.
Chef:This is great.
Gizmo:But we have been eyeing up and talking about this chef's edition. We actually kind of revealed it last week as it just went up for preorder. I preordered it Right after we talked about it, and then it showed up at my house a few days later. So we called an audible tonight to get the chef's edition in these feel good to me. They didn't feel wet.
Senator:They look beautiful.
Gizmo:They look good. So we're going to try it and be one of the first ones out of the gate.
Senator:Gorgeous wrapper.
Gizmo:With a review of the chef's edition 2025. So it looks great.
Senator:Yeah. Feels like there's a bit of weight there. Yeah.
Chef:Little lighter than the last release, right? Would you say? The wrapper color?
Chef:In color? Oh, definitely lighter. Well, actually, mine is much lighter than Chef's.
Gizmo:I don't think they color match the boxes, honestly.
Senator:Chef's is darker, yeah.
Gizmo:Which I'm fine with. I don't really care about color matching, but I know some folks to the eye, they care about that. Obviously, all Cuban cigars are color matched.
Chef:I do, and the other thing is the wrapper's veiny.
Senator:Mine is.
Gizmo:Mine has a
Chef:You big see vein
Gizmo:Chef's got it right there too. You can see my big vein there.
Chef:11 Michelin stars wasn't enough.
Gizmo:Clearly. Yeah. All right, boys.
Senator:Mine is pretty pristine, I will say, though.
Gizmo:Let's cut this thing. See what we're getting on the cold draw and the wrapper. So yours is not veiny at all, Ben?
Senator:No. Really? Rooster?
Rooster:He was the first one
Gizmo:to pick. Oh, what else is new?
Senator:I was in a wrapper. Plastic.
Gizmo:Great cold draw.
Rooster:My wrapper is not bad. There are some veins, but not so bad.
Senator:Draw is wide open.
Chef:Wide open draw, effortless cut.
Senator:I'm not getting much though.
Gizmo:I'm getting nice flavor.
Senator:What are getting?
Gizmo:I almost want to say like a raspberry, strawberry
Senator:maybe. Very faint berry, I guess.
Chef:I see what you're saying there. Faint.
Senator:Very fresh berry. And a touch of cedar and that's it.
Rooster:A little
Gizmo:creamy on the cold draw.
Chef:We should
Chef:Oat cedar and slightly unripe berry is where I'd go with this
Senator:right I'd agree with that.
Gizmo:All right, boys. Let's light this thing. The Davidoff Chef's Edition 2025. Again, it is a Toro out of The Dominican Republic. 52 ring gauge cigar by six and one quarter inches long.
Gizmo:This is the first limited edition chef's edition since the 2021 version, which we rated. I think it was on episode two or three cigar we all loved. That was in the Churchill format. Tonight we are back to the Toro format for the chef's edition. And we'll talk about the makeup of the cigar, chefs and all that in a little bit.
Gizmo:That's very,
Senator:very good on the light. Wow. It's actually quite sweet.
Gizmo:I was gonna say, is this a little Sobremesa Brule? That first
Senator:draw was very sweet.
Gizmo:I got hit with a mountain of sweetness.
Senator:Me too. On the light. Strange.
Chef:It is that. I get sweetness, but not What did you get? I'm not getting
Chef:sober This thing takes a lot of fuel to light. Yeah.
Chef:Yeah. I'm not getting Sobra Mesa sweetness because that feels somewhat artificial.
Gizmo:No, I was joking. Yeah, I was joking. Is a very natural sweet.
Senator:Honestly, this is a very sweet forward cigar right now for me. It's quite nice.
Rooster:Not for me.
Chef:No? It's not super sweet for me either. I'm with Rooster.
Gizmo:I'm getting hit with a lot of sweetness.
Senator:It's very, very good. It's delicious actually.
Chef:It's leaning sweet and peppery, almost like an espalette pepper. Like it has a numbing sensation on Pepper the tip of your on like
Rooster:the tip of your tongue almost.
Gizmo:Right? You get that.
Senator:So I am getting that, but on my draw and retrohale, more on the traditional draw honestly, I'm getting a pretty sweet forward experience right now. This is excellent so far.
Chef:Combustion is amazing. Great,
Senator:Yeah. How much is
Gizmo:a cigar? Great question, Bam. These cigars come in a box of 10. We'll talk about the packaging in a second. The box of 10 is MSRP, $550.
Gizmo:So $55 a cigar. We got our cigars in our hand tonight for $46 a cigar. Found a little discount code courtesy of a listener. I'll read his name Wow.
Chef:And it was valid
Gizmo:on this. I don't know how he found something that worked, but I was very impressed when it did. Plus, gave me another one for free shipping on the same website. Talk about Global Insider. So Lizard Jared out there, thank you so much for that.
Gizmo:And that's how we ended up with these kind of moments notice smoking them tonight. So see how it does.
Senator:I'm impressed with this cigar. I'm getting that little bit of pepper now and that sweetness, that good balance there for me.
Rooster:The aroma of that cigar Smells great. It's really nice.
Senator:It's almost like a bakery good of some kind you're Yep.
Rooster:Little floral, little baked goods.
Gizmo:It almost has an Upman vibe to it on nose there from Cuba. This is good. The retro is awesome too.
Senator:I'm surprised because I was a little skeptical about this cigar.
Gizmo:Well, we talked about it last week. I mean, we were nervous that it was in the Toro format. We've not loved Davidoff Toros. We actually haven't reviewed. I don't think we've reviewed many of them on the podcast.
Gizmo:And also the fact that the pairing suggestion was a Sauvignon Blanc, which Senator will talk about in a little bit. I would say indicating that the flavor profile was as close to mild as you can get, maybe into medium. And I'm finding the flavor on this to be
Chef:very rich. Everything I read was that this was a fuller experience than the previous chef's edition.
Chef:I'll just say on the light to me is definitely not fuller than the previous edition. To me, this is medium smoke.
Senator:It's a medium smoke. Yeah. Not light at all, don't think.
Gizmo:This is definitely outperforming my expectations.
Senator:Me too.
Gizmo:A couple minutes in.
Chef:I don't know. I'm not as enamored as maybe the group is.
Senator:Really? We can tell.
Chef:I don't dislike it, but I'm not like I'm not yet excited. To me, this hasn't hit its stride for me to get excited about.
Senator:The beginning of this is interesting, though.
Rooster:But you also don't prefer the size, right?
Chef:No, I I smoke other Toroes, like QD54, E2. Don't mind a Toro, I don't reach for it as often as Robusto, but you know, the flavors like, one's mentioned. Like I'm still getting a lot of cedar, which is, like, characteristic of a lot of Davidoff's that are not in the medium full category that are more medium or mild. I get some sweetness, some cream, getting a little spice. To me, they're all things that are very familiar with a number of other Davidoff cigars.
Chef:So, like, I don't know. I remember when I lit that chef's edition, the the previous iteration of this, there was something unique about it, especially because that was fuller. There aren't that many full Davidoffs that, like, immediately grabbed me, and I said, like, oh, wow. I I didn't expect that from Davidoff. This to me has a lot of traditional Davidoff notes in their, like, medium or mild medium cigars.
Senator:I I I can see that. For me, there are a few departures. I don't often call out tapioca, but I'm getting that kind of in the middle of my palate.
Chef:Especially on the retro. It's very creamy.
Senator:Got a beautiful long, very elegant,
Chef:simple finish.
Chef:There's a numbing sensation. I truly feel that this is definitely leaning fuller than the previous Jeff's edition release, because there's a numbing sensation on my palate right now. Ever so late, it's
Gizmo:not I think I'm reading that as like saltiness. I'm not getting it as numb. I
Senator:am experiencing the exact opposite of what just said. For me, it's that there's a lot of creaminess to this that I don't remember on any previous Chef Edition.
Rooster:Yeah, I was going to ask chef, when was the last time you had the previous chefs? They've been
Chef:sitting for a while. Yeah, maybe six weeks ago. I still have three left.
Rooster:From what I remember, that was fuller. That was a fuller smoke right from the beginning.
Chef:I paired that with a full red wine. I have a photo I remember the last one I smoked when I was in Greece, and I had a glass of red wine in that cigar, it paired perfectly. That works. I wouldn't pair a red with this.
Rooster:Think this cigar maybe it's that pepper that's throwing you off that
Senator:you're getting pepper
Rooster:a little bit. And the aroma on this is fuller than the actual smoke coming out of this cigar.
Senator:Also true.
Rooster:When that hits your nose, it's a very full smoke.
Senator:It's a delicious aroma.
Gizmo:It's a
Senator:little nutty. But that pepper is a curveball. You don't expect it in such a medium
Chef:smoke like this. You know what Davinoff just kind of reminds me of? The year of the ox. Man, it's been huge. Do you remember that?
Chef:It was a big ring It was a creamy smoke, like how we're getting here, and it was kind of like this dance of sweet but a little bit of spice. That's the only cigar that this immediately makes me think of.
Chef:Yeah, I'm definitely interpreting the here as strength for me.
Senator:This is settling in very nicely for me.
Gizmo:Yeah, I'm very happy with this right now. I'm honestly very surprised.
Senator:Me too.
Gizmo:I came in incredibly skeptical. I know I said that a few times now but it's really impressing me.
Chef:Yeah. It's elegant. I'm getting there.
Rooster:Oh, it's sophisticated. Very elegant.
Gizmo:It feels like not that I want to be paying $55 for a cigar. You don't. But it does. Correct. But it does feel Worthy of commanding a higher price point.
Gizmo:I don't know if I'm going to get to $55 in that sentence, but it is commanding that kind of higher end.
Senator:Correct.
Gizmo:Feeling in the smoke in the construction, in the combustion, it seems like it's really, they did put their best into this.
Senator:So far.
Rooster:Yeah. Can you taste any age on the tobaccos?
Gizmo:I don't know if I'm explicitly tasting age. What I'm saying is I'm tasting a mature blend.
Senator:Yeah, I guess so. Age, I would kind of associate with, for me, a lot of heavy barnyard, some funkiness, savory and sweet happening altogether. I'm not really getting all that here.
Gizmo:I think explicit age is in mustiness.
Senator:That's what I
Gizmo:mean. Other than that, I really couldn't pick it out here.
Rooster:I mean, is a fresh box. You just got the box and we're smoking it. Usually we let the boxes sit for a while.
Gizmo:This I dry boxed for effectively four days. Yeah, but I
Chef:could have sworn with this release that there's like a pretty significant amount was going to ask. Like ten years or something? Fifteen.
Gizmo:Fifteen. Let's talk about the makeup of the cigar boys. So the wrapper is Ecuadorian, the binder is Mexican, and the filler is from the Dominican Republic. The Dominican Poloto Seco filler tobacco, as they say here on their website, undergoes an artisanal Yagua aging process of five years. This traditional method involves carefully wrapping the tobacco in natural Yagawa palm leaves, a palm tree native to Central And South America.
Gizmo:The fibrous leaves allow for a more refined aging that enhances the cigars smoothness, sweetness and complexity.
Chef:Gives a phenomenal job on the pronunciation.
Gizmo:I'm working on it, Chef. Thank you. Thank you. Every bale requires meticulous hand wrapping and close monitoring. The Chef's Edition twenty twenty five is the only Davidoff cigar featuring Yagawa aged tobacco to date.
Gizmo:So this is the first one, which is surprising given some of those additions that they've put out, other limited additions, talking $100 one is a $500 cigar. For this one to have the first of this kind of tobacco
Senator:in it. It's pretty cool. It's five years of age? Not 15?
Gizmo:On that specific tobacco.
Senator:On that leaf, yes. Oh, I see, I see.
Gizmo:To achieve a complex blend with tasty notes inspired by the chef's respective cuisines, the master blenders at Davodoff meticulously experimented with a variety of tobaccos from the Doctor, Mexico, and Ecuador. Amongst others, they chose a Dominican San Vicente tobacco that was aged for fifteen years, a Dominican hybrid tobacco for fresh lemon notes, I'm not getting that, and a Dominican Piloto tobacco that they had aged, as we just discussed, in the Agua Bales for five years.
Senator:So it's a mixture of varied ages in there.
Chef:So that equals eighteen years?
Gizmo:Well, twenty years. Davidoff years. Davidoff's an eight, twenty years.
Senator:This is an average of it. It's about seven years.
Gizmo:They just add it all up over there, Bem.
Senator:Correct.
Gizmo:Yeah. I'm loving this. To Rooster's
Chef:question, you would not taste this without hearing that and at all assume that there's fifteen year tobacco in
Gizmo:No. The
Senator:No. And I'm not getting any lemon.
Gizmo:Me neither.
Chef:It's still very early. It's still very early.
Senator:Honestly, I don't need the lemon. I'm really liking what I'm getting.
Gizmo:Yeah. I'm happy with this. Same. Let's talk about the chef's boys who made up this cigar. So hopefully chef Ricky now that we I know we talked about these guys a week ago, but I'm gonna try to nail their names.
Gizmo:Paulo Casagrande, Christian Bao, Kirk Westaway, Nick Brill, and Michael Beltran are the five chefs totaling think you said, what, 11 Michelin stars between them?
Senator:I got a former manager in there.
Rooster:So, I mean, one of the chefs has three Michelin stars? Jesus. Do you know which one?
Senator:I don't remember. I thought you'd have his poster on your wall or something. No. No. I
Chef:don't seek Michelin stars.
Chef:He's got a tattoo of
Senator:them. Correct. No. No. And
Gizmo:the Michelin movie.
Senator:I don't
Gizmo:I don't
Senator:I don't know who
Gizmo:he is.
Chef:He's on phone screensaver here.
Gizmo:It is pretty amazing that the people who make Michelin tires are the people who run the Michelin Guide and give out Michelin stars. That's crazy.
Chef:Well, it's pretty genius because the whole thing was to promote car travel so you could go through tires and they could sell you tires. Yeah, it's actually makes a lot of sense when you think about it. So let's talk about
Gizmo:the packaging boys. We have the packaging right in front of us. You have a box of 10 cigars and it has an incredibly heavy lid on it, which I guess is a serving tray on the backside for 10 cigars. It has 10 kind of grooves for these Toros and on the other side is, I guess, granite or marble or something. What is that?
Senator:That is a marble. It's called Carrera, and it's inset into this Spanish cedar perimeter. And like you said, if you flip it over, it's got
Gizmo:the cigar rest. My whole question is
Chef:what Can you pass that and just flip it over?
Gizmo:What is the point of this?
Senator:No
Gizmo:clue. I think it's just to create weight in the box so you think you're getting something more substantial.
Rooster:It's a cutting board.
Gizmo:Are you serious?
Rooster:Yeah.
Senator:Is that It's
Rooster:a cutting board.
Senator:So I'll cut lemons on that when I'm serving cut lemons.
Rooster:Lemon lemon wedges for Giza Seltzer.
Senator:Correct. Correct.
Gizmo:I think this is a disappointing packaging for $550 given when we paid for the Davodoff Chef's Edition 2021, the packaging that came in was a really nice box with a nice wooden lid, which had even a drink area on it. And then that ashtray, which I still use
Senator:to That this beautiful white ashtray.
Gizmo:Really thin,
Senator:low Textacular, profile very cool.
Gizmo:White square
Senator:Yeah, yeah. That's the best.
Gizmo:So that's already been done. So what are they doing here, Rooster?
Rooster:Stop. I'm saying, what would you prefer? Like, if you if you had to design the packaging for this box
Senator:Rooster's not defending Deborah.
Chef:I want, like, a really nice lacquer, like, beautifully designed box.
Gizmo:I want something I could show off.
Chef:Totally. I mean, at the Padron sixtieth that came out. That box is insane. That's I have it displayed in my outdoor lounge setup. It's stunning.
Chef:This thing looks cheap, honestly. Correct. A serving tray on this side, you're gonna pass around cigars in this? This looks like
Gizmo:I feel like I dropped the cigars off of
Chef:could have made this. I mean, I really hate the packaging.
Gizmo:I'm just so sorry.
Senator:Really hate the
Chef:And what
Gizmo:I'm wondering out of the $55 a cigar or $550 a how much does the cut of the kitchen counter that they put in the lid, how much does that contribute? If you get rid of that, does the price go down $15 on That the piece
Senator:of Carrera probably cost, for that thinness, because you gotta make it thin, probably about 40 to $60 for that piece of stone.
Gizmo:Right there.
Chef:Of that size? Yeah. That little piece?
Senator:$40, easy.
Chef:Oh, fuck that.
Gizmo:That is ridiculous. Ben, would you say this is
Senator:Call any stone supplier, motherfucker. Would you say this
Chef:is They have
Senator:to cut that and fabricate it and polish it. And don't forget the labor. And they engraved the david off on the top of it.
Chef:Yeah. But is this a solid block of wood that was carved out? This doesn't look like I don't know how they made looks it like it was routed and
Senator:There's a seam in there, so they may have joined it and then routed the corners out possibly.
Chef:Hard to know. The green is I mean, compared to
Senator:Oh, there's a seam, right? There's a seam at each corner. These are made out of four pieces.
Chef:I would be shocked if more than 2% of people who purchase these boxes ever use that lid to
Gizmo:service this. Those are going to be in the garbage. Yeah. The end of
Senator:Get in his face.
Gizmo:By the end of the night, that's gonna be in the garbage.
Chef:Kiss is already thinking of throwing that in the dumpster.
Gizmo:I have no utility for that thing. It's gonna be in the garbage.
Rooster:I think other than an ashtray, nothing really gets used. Even when they do those shot glasses or different kinds of stuff, really, the X-ray is the only thing that you would use.
Gizmo:But give me something that has utility is my point. If
Chef:it does, I'm okay if there's no utility.
Gizmo:Or make it look good.
Chef:Yes. Have it be a nice display piece.
Senator:I'm not
Chef:going to display this box.
Senator:Like, wanna get a box of that Padron sixtieth. I want that box. Just I want the box. Fuck the cigars. Box is stunning.
Chef:You could get the box on eBay alone for $100 with no cigars in it.
Rooster:I'll sell these for 90.
Chef:You can have mine for 80. Got it. 75. Done.
Gizmo:Wow, what a great opening here on
Senator:this You're flying through your cigar, dude.
Gizmo:I'm not even trying, by the way. Not hitting think mine's a little lighter. I'm not hitting them really hard, honestly.
Senator:And Senator's creating a bloom over there. Yeah. You see that? Yeah.
Chef:Not ideal, but Strange. The flavor's good.
Senator:It is good.
Gizmo:So this is the tenth Davidoff we've done on the podcast, boys. Like I said, we started with the chef's edition. We've done a ton of other cigars in the line over the years. Good representation. Absolutely.
Gizmo:And, you know, Davidoff has honestly performed among the big boys. One of the best. They've really, really performed very well in the ratings on this podcast despite our continued frustration with their pricing structure, their packaging, the way they've chosen to release things.
Senator:Ridiculous annual releases.
Gizmo:Yeah, it's, you know, despite all that frustration, the cigars we've smoked on this podcast have done very well. So tonight looks like no exception.
Senator:How do you feel about the Chefs Edition strategy?
Gizmo:I love it. You do? I love it. I like, you know, obviously we've talked many times about food with Chef Ricky here.
Senator:I
Gizmo:love the influence of a great food driven palate coming in and trying to give us something different.
Rooster:What do you think about the marketing on the cigar? I think we talked about this.
Gizmo:We talked a little bit about it. They do have on their website. I was just looking. I don't know if you guys saw it, but they do have a video from Eat Chef talking about the cigar now. They have a nice like little micro website there that you can go view everything.
Gizmo:Yeah. There's quite a bit of information there. It's pretty nice. Now, know, what Chef Ricky was talking about last week is wishing for almost like a making of documentary or some sort of capture of
Senator:the
Gizmo:blending in the notes. You know, these guys are just talking about making the cigar and smoking it in this kind of video. It's almost like they put up a green screen behind them and just filmed them at their respective places. Don't know. Looks pretty good.
Gizmo:Feels pretty good. It tastes pretty good right now, so I'm happy.
Senator:This is fucking delicious. I am really liking this. This to me is not typical Davidoff DNA right now. For me, Davidoff is always cedar forward. I'm not always a fan of that.
Senator:I like it in the Millennium Pyramid. That's my cigar, But I don't like it in a lot of other Davittos, which is why I love the late hour, the old version of it. I don't know what happened to it recently, but there wasn't much cedar in that either. The newer version, think there's more cedar, and for me, it makes my mouth dry. This is not like that.
Senator:I'm getting a touch of cedar but it's not overt like a lot of their other cigars.
Rooster:This feels very refined.
Senator:I think it's tasty. The refinement for me is the balance of that savory and sweet but it's just delicious.
Gizmo:Are you still reaching for a lot of Davodoff Millennium Pyramids?
Senator:I brought one tonight. As you smoke?
Gizmo:Oh yeah. I haven't really reached for any Davodoff except the bellicose.
Senator:When I do occasionally like I've had these for a long time. I think the three of us placed that large bulk order. I still have some of those. They're incredibly delicious after how many what, two plus years that we did that. Excellent.
Senator:They're excellent.
Rooster:I think that's their best regular production line.
Senator:I agree. Agree.
Rooster:Across the board with Davodoff.
Senator:Sure. Totally agree.
Gizmo:Yeah. We've also loved the late hour series, but we've talked about we just did the most recent review of the Robusto.
Senator:It's changed.
Gizmo:We talked about our lack of appreciation for you know, some of the newer, larger format late hours that have come out that we haven't liked as much as we did years ago. For me, I've just kind of stepped away from Davidoff's side from on the podcast and the little bellicoso that comes in the tins.
Senator:So the bigger brothers of that bellicoso that have a white label Churchill, it is delicious. I think it's so pod worthy. You're going to wait quite a while now to do another one, but that is such a delicious cigar. Excellent.
Gizmo:So boys, I think it's time to go to our pairing because I'm very excited about what we have in our glass tonight. And Senator, this was prompted by the pairing suggestion that I'm seeing here on the website that you saw that these chefs were suggesting a Sauvignon Blanc with this cigar, which did scare us a little bit coming in.
Chef:Yeah, I mean, that immediately said this is going to be a, at most, medium bodied cigar, maybe even a milder cigar. So I brought a bottle of Pascal Jolabet Sancerre. It's one of my favorite Sancerre's, which is a Sauvignon Blanc from France.
Senator:You're not supposed to take a sip.
Gizmo:I didn't actually.
Senator:All right.
Gizmo:I stopped myself because I saw your eyes locked in.
Chef:Give it a sip and
Senator:then we can talk
Chef:a little bit about the vineyard.
Chef:Cheers, boys.
Gizmo:Cheers. Good to see you all.
Senator:Cheers. There we go.
Gizmo:It's always good to be back. Oh, very nice.
Rooster:Light. Bam is speechless.
Senator:That is the perfect fucking wine to drink with the Davidoff. It's perfect.
Rooster:They nailed it, man. They didn't nail it. Senator nailed it.
Senator:That's correct.
Chef:They nailed the grape. Hopefully I nailed the wine.
Senator:Maybe more of a traditional Davidoff like the Millennium Pyramid would be an exquisite pairing with that because there is a lot of cedar in that. That really brings the cedar out in this in a beautiful way.
Rooster:Bet a champagne would do well with this.
Chef:Agree with that. How much is that bottle, Senator? You can find this anywhere from $30 to 35 a bottle, which is very reasonable, especially for a sans serre. The funny thing about this, so I discovered this, I only know this because the first bottle I bought when I was looking at my wine cellar, I have a 2018 bottle of this, which was the first time I tried it. I was on a British Airways flight flying from London to Boston.
Chef:And I remember being on the flight waiting. I was flying business class waiting for them to serve lunch, and no food is coming. We're like hours in the air. It's like the first thing they're supposed to do is like get drink service and then food. So we all had drinks, and I had a white wine.
Chef:It was a Sancerre, and no food's coming, and they just keep refilling these drinks. I mean, I'm probably like four glasses of wine deep, like an hour into this flight, still no food. And so finally, like, I asked the flight attendant, like, what is going on with the food? She's like, Sir, I'm really sorry, but the heating trays we're having a problem with. So I'm like, So that's why you've just been loading us up with booze basically, so everybody's just real calm about what's So going it took a long time, but I'm drinking this.
Chef:This was early in my white wine journey, and I was just shocked how much I liked this white wine. So I had asked what it was and and found it was Pascal Jolivette. I bought a case when I got home. And the funny thing is maybe two years later, I started seeing this pop up more on restaurant menus, and especially like within the last few years, like tons of places if you look at like a sans sera they'll have by the glass, you'll typically see Pascal Jolabet as an option. So it's really exploded, but for me, it's like for its price point, as good of a sans sera as you're gonna find.
Chef:And even guys in the lounge who love white wine, Lizard Dustin is a great example. I had had him try this. I mean, he loved it. It's really hard not to love this wine if you drink white wine.
Senator:I love this wine. There's a very, very faint tartness to this, which I love. It's very faint though, so it like puckers up your palate a little. It's a little sweet, but not too sweet, and it's a beautiful, kind of a dry, long finish, which is great, and it grills great with this cigar. Very complementary.
Chef:That's the key for the listener that's wondering, what is sans serre or how is that compared to other types of Sauvignon Blanc? So Sauvignon Blanc is extremely popular out of New Zealand. A New Zealand Sauvignon Blanc is super, super fruit forward and funky. Is that
Gizmo:the yellowtail people make that?
Chef:The most famous the best selling Sauvignon Blanc out of New Zealand is Kim Crawford. Kim Crawford? Yeah. This woman, Kim Crawford, made an absolute killing on this business. Like it is the best selling Sauvignon Blanc in the world.
Chef:Wow. In California and in The US, there's a lot of Sauvignon Blancs, but those are also sweeter. A French Sauvignon Blanc, which is typically made in Sancerre, which is in the Loire Valley, is drier but not super dry. It's like a very balanced. You get like minerality with some of like the the sweetness from some fruit notes that you'll get.
Chef:And for my palate, just the kinds of spirits and wines I pursue, I like something balanced. I don't like anything overly sweet. This is like perfect. It kind of like Assertico is when we did that Greek white on here. It's like very balanced.
Chef:It's not too sweet. So that's really the difference.
Gizmo:What's interesting about the Assertico that we did when we paired that, that definitely had more body to it, I think, than this does. Correct. But it's surprising how well this
Senator:is pairing with the cigar. It's extremely complimentary.
Chef:Senator, quit your day job and just go and become a sommelier. I'm speechless. I've, you know, like Come
Senator:on, chef.
Chef:I'm no wine expert here.
Senator:Go on, chef.
Chef:Sorry. My wire here is Oh, there we go. So I'm no wine expert here, but I've had a few Sauvignon Blancs. I I do like them especially in the warmer months because they're fruitier, they're a little they're somewhat refreshing, but I've always found them to be sort of okay, you know, not that they don't there's not a lot of complexity to them. And here you bring this Sauvignon Blanc that, you know, I get that that familiar nose on a Sauvignon Blanc of some pear and green apple and some citrus notes and maybe grass or whatnot.
Chef:And then I you know, the midpoint of my palate gets the Sauvignon Blanc and then the finish on this thing is insane. It's like creamy and mineral and a little bit of gooseberry and just like I'm like, what the fuck is this?
Senator:Gooseberry. What's a gooseberry?
Chef:Oh, they're amazing, they're delicious.
Chef:It's a very common note in Sauvignon Blanc, he's spot on.
Gizmo:So what does it taste like?
Chef:It's it Never heard of it.
Rooster:Finished of mine. Do
Gizmo:strawberry, raspberry, blueberry, blackberry.
Senator:Have you
Gizmo:had have you It's called normality.
Chef:Have you you tried elderflower or a lychee? It's it's Look at me. It's parallel Just look at me. To
Senator:you had lychee?
Gizmo:Big lychee guy. Yeah.
Chef:So they they look like they're tomatillos. They they
Gizmo:Oh, heck. Know tomatillos. Oh, my god. There's no way of these. When did
Senator:you have a tomatillos?
Gizmo:I'm so locked in with him right now on this. Man, I know exactly what you're
Chef:talking about. So they're called gooseberries or husk cherries because they have a a little paper husk around them. And that note, you'll see them at some point in the market when you see them buy the freaking thing.
Gizmo:He's talking to me, Ben. We know
Senator:you don't go to the store.
Chef:That's right. Yeah.
Senator:I can't shop.
Chef:Yeah. When you see when you see a pint, grab a pint or pop one in your mouth and you'll find the snow. It's I just the way this drinks, the complexity, it's so interesting. It makes you want more. It it it first sips stole the show for me for a second.
Gizmo:Was like,
Chef:you know, because I wasn't expecting that. So thank you. That's that truly, truly memorable Sauvignon Blanc experience.
Senator:I do love that touch of tartness there.
Gizmo:Yeah. Yeah.
Senator:Nice. That's really unique.
Gizmo:And for me, the sweetness in the cigar is actually balancing It's very faint.
Chef:I say that because there's a lot of New Zealand Sauvignon Blancs that are so tart, you literally feel like you just bit into a lime. That's awful. And it's just too much. Yeah. Like, my problem with a lot of Sauvignon Blancs, it's not the flavor notes, it's that they're imbalanced.
Senator:Mhmm.
Chef:It's like it's either so aggressively tart that you feel like you just bit into a lime or a lemon, or it's so sweet, and not in like a traditional sweet way, in like this funky sweet way, but it's imbalanced. It's just too much. Mhmm. And then, you know, my fear is you could have a wine that would be like there are some whites that are super dry where you're gonna completely lose the fruit. And for me, like, Sancerre is just like that perfect marriage of the two.
Chef:Now not all Sancerres are gonna drink as balanced as I think this one is. There are some Sancerres that are actually bone dry where it's more buttery and and mineral forward, almost like a kind of like a chardonnay, and that's too far. That's not really what I'm looking for. But for when you want kind of sweet and the minerality, like to me, it doesn't get any more balance than this.
Chef:Yeah. Is this quiche? At all?
Chef:No. So this is and it's funny that you mentioned that, so we should definitely talk about this.
Gizmo:This bottle I love an unintended segue.
Chef:Yeah. Can we try another glass of wine? Please? So this bottle is 2023, which is a perfect time to drink this because most white wines and sans sera is no different, they peak in two to three years from bottling.
Gizmo:Unlike red for the listener, which can go on twenty years.
Chef:And can peak at, you know, year ten. So you have to be very careful with white wines. And I was worried when we did the Assertico on another prior episode, that was a 2020 bottle I had, which had five years of age. So that's like beyond the traditional two to three year peak period. What I had read, thankfully, with Assertico is that that grape for whatever reason just has more aging potential than most white wines, if not or white grapes, if not all of them.
Chef:And so we drank that, I mean, think at a perfect 10, it was outstanding. Now this has so this is I just picked this up today, 2023. I had one bottle left in my cellar from 2018. Nice. Now that's got seven years on it.
Chef:I was worried about how this would drink. This is definitely past what is the typical peak period for any white wine. I wanted to see if maybe this is an outlier. For fun, we're gonna taste it because I do think it's instructive if anyone who has wine in their home looks at some of the bottles they have, unquestionably, there are things you forget about that you leave a long time. I've I've talked to so many guys about this recently, and then you pick up the bottle and you're like, oh, boy.
Chef:I wonder if this is still okay. And with white wine, you do have to be careful because this has seven years on it. So now you're tasting 2023, what it should taste like at its peak. We have a little bit to try from the 2018 bottle where you'll see what with seven years what that does. It's not gonna be the same, so I'm curious for everybody to try it.
Chef:Can we try it now? Yeah.
Gizmo:Cheers to 2018.
Senator:Cheers to 2018.
Gizmo:It was a good year.
Chef:Oh, wow. Night and day. Totally different.
Senator:Oh, yeah. This does feel there's a bit it's a bit fuller. Correct. A bit saltier. Correct.
Senator:And actually more butter on this one. Correct.
Chef:Right? So it loses the fruit notes.
Gizmo:Yeah. What butt? It's out of balance to me.
Senator:Oh, I don't know. I I like it too.
Chef:It's still good. It's still drinkable.
Senator:But can I just say go ahead?
Chef:But it has one part of the equation that it has dialed up, and my problem is it has completely lost the other side of the equation.
Senator:It has lost its sweetness and its fruit. It's not as dry as the twenty twenty three. I would probably have that with a meal, the twenty eighteen, because it's savior and has more minerality. The
Gizmo:twenty three.
Senator:Yeah, the twenty three I can drink all day, any day, with or without food. But that twenty eighteen, I'd probably hold that back for a meal with shellfish likely.
Chef:My takeaway from doing this, we did that Greek Assertigo that had five years of age, which is beyond what is traditionally the peak. A Certico is supposed to age longer or supposed to be able to, and that performed still at its peak level. I think from this, you know, experiment, I would not advise holding most white wines beyond anywhere beyond five years.
Senator:Oh, okay. I was gonna say
Chef:I two or three think two or three is a definite safe bet. Mhmm. Four, you're probably okay, and I think five is pushing it, and that's where you need like an Assertico or a white grape that is known to be able to hold longer. But this proves, you know, there's a reason why white is not really meant to be kept and aged for that much longer.
Senator:Interesting. That's great knowledge.
Gizmo:Alright, boys. We're coming to the end of the first third here on the Davenuve chef's edition 2025, the Toro. What's everybody thinking right now as we talk about
Rooster:the wine? It is so good. I'm actually getting a floral note now.
Gizmo:It's got floral
Senator:A touch of floral? Yeah. Pepper
Rooster:is kinda gone.
Senator:Zero cedar
Rooster:for me. Sweetness is still there.
Gizmo:And I'm thankful for that.
Senator:Me too. I'm not getting any of that typical cedar that you get in a lot of Davodos.
Rooster:Yeah. It's a little woody also.
Chef:Pepper's totally bowed down, very creamy. That tapioca note that Ben mentioned is coming through even more.
Senator:Instead of woody, I would replace that word with nutty. It's more nutty.
Rooster:Nutty, Like a
Senator:walnut, not almond, walnut cashew because that gets still that kind of creaminess Outstanding. In a
Gizmo:I love this blend. Me too. Excellent choice.
Senator:With the 2023 vintage that we're drinking,
Rooster:home run. I do feel like the cigar is a bit lightly packed.
Gizmo:I agree. Mine's burning pretty quick.
Rooster:It's burning a little quicker than I would like it to.
Senator:It's pretty, I think, spot on comment.
Gizmo:So going back to the wine, specifically the 2023, this is a two part question for you, senator. Food and chef what food would you guys, for a listener let's say a listener is gonna sit down for dinner with the sans serre, couple bottles with the, you know, significant other or some family, and then it's gonna move into smoking. This Davodoff chef's edition 2025, for example, what food would you put on the table before you had your cigar?
Chef:So sans ser is so well known for pairing amazingly with seafood. You can have this with oysters, you can have this with a nice, you know, white flaky fish.
Senator:Dozen oysters?
Chef:Sure. No
Senator:doubt about it.
Chef:Lobster, I mean, any seafood would pair perfectly with a sans ser.
Chef:Mhmm. I'm going to go in the I don't disagree. I agree with you a thousand percent, but I'm going to go in the other direction here. So maybe ten years ago, I entered a competition for wine enthusiasts where I did a french fry pairing, know, it was like fries and Pop sweetness.
Senator:Little pedigree in the room
Chef:right here.
Chef:There we go. That's how I got my Michelin star. But, right. And there were chefs there and doing amazing things, frying things in beef, fat and duck fat. You know, I went the complete Latin route and I chose a yucca fry, right?
Chef:Because yucca tapioca, the tapioca is derived from yucca cassava. It has a very creamy texture to it and flavor. Right. The way we we find creamy flavor in a cigar, it has that sort of lingering lasting note on the palate. And I had carnitas, so I had some slow braised pork shoulder that I braised in lard with, you know, after curing for twenty four hours, bunch of other stuff.
Chef:Spare the details. But I paired that dish with a Sauvignon Blanc. And the reason I did that were because in my braise, I made sure to use different citrus ruins, pull them out early so they don't get bitter. But I felt the fat, the creaminess of the of the yucca fry, the fattiness of the pork, the citrus notes that were found paired really well with the Sauvignon Blanc. So I won.
Chef:Right. But this was, know, I remember the judge looking really just like pretentious French guys. So, oh, what the fuck are you doing here? Right. Like, I just I felt out of place because I didn't have a French fry per se.
Chef:Right. These yuca fries are a little clunkier. They're harder to get into that sort of uniform shape of like a beautiful shoestring cut.
Gizmo:Like McDonald's?
Chef:No, no. Even thinner than that. But long story short, you made
Chef:a yuca fry thinner than a McDonald's fry.
Chef:I did not. I did not.
Gizmo:Oh, I was going say,
Chef:holy crap.
Chef:That's why I thought I was going to lose. If I go too thin or if you go too thin on that, you'll lose that, you know, whatever what I was aiming for. So, yeah, I won that competition pairing it with a Sauvignon Blanc and it was so I've and where you're going somewhat of a lighter route, you know, with the shellfish, I think something that's a little even heavier and a little more fat forward in pork and the yuca, the creaminess of the yuca fry, that also paired well with Sauvignon Blanc. So I'll go in that direction.
Senator:No, it's true.
Chef:I mean, there's acidity in this. Know, with anything like that, even cheeses could pair really well with this. I think Chef's spot on there.
Senator:How about a light barbecue to cut through all that? Would that work?
Chef:That's too far from I
Chef:think the smoke is going to
Senator:take overwhelm a direction. All
Gizmo:right, so the second part of my question. We've only done very little white wine. We've obviously done a lot of champagne, which is the bubbly white wine. We did the Assertico. We have this tonight for listeners out there say who don't love red wine or have white wine as their preference when they eat Out of those three those three types of white wine, obviously we've done champagne with I think everything really.
Gizmo:Where would you what kind of cigars would you ideally pair an Assertica with? What kind of cigars would you ideally pair this with? Let's say this Davodoff chef's edition doesn't exist. What kind of cigars are you going to pair this with? Those I was
Senator:going to make a pretty controversial statement, but go ahead.
Chef:I'll answer that. I definitely want to hear this. Yeah. So I would actually pair a sans serre and an Assertico with the exact same types of cigars. I I genuinely have had these interchangeably with the same cigar types of cigars I'm gonna name, and I think they're similar in profile.
Chef:Like, you know, I think the way I described it and even Ben was talking about the Assertico, like, there's some of those fruit notes, a lot of minerality, and it's really well balanced, and that's characteristic of both of those. So for me, I think any Cuban cigar that is mild or medium pairs amazingly with these. I think any Cuban that pushes like medium full is is a bit too much for a wine like this. I think in the New World space, you know, similarly, a lot of the milder Davinoss would be great with this. Like, I immediately think of and there are some elements of this in this cigar.
Chef:The Davinoff signature number two, that limited edition they put out, that would pair awesomely with
Chef:both of
Senator:those wines. I agree with that.
Chef:I think like Aladino eighty fifth anniversary.
Senator:That would also work very well.
Chef:There's like a little citrus note and cream that you get in that cigar. But not the Cameroon. Not the Cameroon.
Rooster:Correct. Even maybe the Cutie Corona Sclaro.
Chef:Oh, that would be incredible.
Rooster:That's got a citrus
Gizmo:muscisher. For those
Senator:lighter Cubans like you noted.
Rooster:I think all the QDs would do well.
Chef:All QDs would do well. QD54 last night I think would go great with this.
Gizmo:Schwab Supreme I think would go great with this.
Senator:Know one thing I was going to say earlier, this is a very specific profile that you're drinking. I don't think every Cuban would go well with this and I think that New World category is very limited as far as the New Worlds are concerned.
Chef:I agree with
Rooster:that. I don't know. You could do a Honduran.
Senator:Would you do an exquisite with this bottle?
Gizmo:No. That's what were saying.
Chef:But that's a medium That's correct. Yeah. So I'm saying anything that is mild and most things that are medium would be good candidates to pair with white wines like these. You think of the classic Elagante and Eladino. That
Senator:would also do well.
Chef:The fabric of five Trini Robusto would do well with Yeah,
Gizmo:I agree with you.
Senator:We have to try it. I think that's worth trying.
Chef:And you know, the Schwa Supreme, I know you hesitated, but with the Schwa Supreme, you get tons of those berry fruit notes.
Senator:We do.
Chef:But I think what's nice about this is because it has a lot of minerality, it'll help, I think, even balance out that cigar and, like, bring out some of the mineral notes that are there that are so faint you probably don't really get much of because it's so much fruit. So I think there's a lot of utility, but I would just steer completely away from anything that's medium full or full. That's it. That's not what white wine
Senator:is producing. You have to kind of stay in that category, but I would not have a Ramon Alonus with this.
Chef:Oh, I would.
Senator:I don't know if I would. I may not have an E2 with this Or d four.
Chef:D four, I agree with.
Chef:Don't four, I'm with you, but
Gizmo:an e two? That's a creamy cigar. Smooth, creamy cigar.
Senator:Yeah. But it's got some body. It's just I don't know. I'd have to try it.
Gizmo:The ones I would carve out of the Cuban catalog, I would carve out the Bellicosos Finos from Bolivar.
Senator:Yeah. That's correct.
Gizmo:I would carve out the Partigus p two.
Senator:The p two E2D four for me. Would probably The Ramona I
Gizmo:would carve out is the small one, the small Club Corona. I would carve that
Senator:Oh, I would have that with this. But I think the RAS. I think it
Gizmo:would not. I would carve that out. I think a RAS
Senator:would You would the wrasse? Really?
Gizmo:Yeah. The wrasse would. I think the little the the full the little one, I don't think would work.
Senator:Yeah. I don't know. I feel the opposite, but that's interesting.
Chef:Any of the Oyos and Epi two
Senator:and Epi's
Gizmo:Oh, special
Senator:no doubt
Gizmo:about Sometimes you get an Oyo and it has no flavor, this wine will go great with that.
Senator:You gotta dip it in there.
Chef:This would've been great with the Sir Winston that
Chef:we had
Gizmo:the other week.
Senator:Oh fuck yeah, absolutely.
Chef:I think super mild Connecticut, you know?
Senator:I think the Aladino eighty fifth is a great call out for this. I had that last week. It is delicious, and I think it'd be beautiful with this guy.
Gizmo:I'm loving this pairing right now. I can't believe it. And the cigar is developing in a way at this halfway point now where it's like Through the retrohale? It's awesome. Well, can retro every draw now.
Senator:Absolutely. Just continue to go through that whole cycle and just envelop yourself
Gizmo:and
Senator:stomp Delicious. Delicious.
Chef:I love the combustion on this cigar.
Gizmo:Tons of smoke in here.
Rooster:Yeah. I mean, that's one thing about Davidoff. You have to give it They smoke flawless. They do. I mean, I've never had a a
Senator:Does it leave you wanting just a touch more body and strength?
Chef:Just a
Senator:touch, right?
Chef:Yes. This is my one complaint.
Senator:Yeah. That would be the only demerit, if it's a demerit at all, because it's so good. But it does leave me wanting just a little bit more body, some savoriness to it.
Gizmo:But is that
Senator:because As it is.
Gizmo:But is that because of where you are in your night right now where you'd normally be smoking in a rotation? Is it I I guess my question is, is it a blend problem or is it an expectation problem?
Senator:Well, no. I don't have any expectations because I'm rating this for what it is right now, not for what I did last night or what I'm gonna do tomorrow night.
Chef:So I I have a different answer to this. Yeah. Go ahead. So I could not agree more with what Bam said. That is my only complaint.
Chef:I like everything I'm getting. I just want a bit more And concentration of the reason that I have an expectation for for that, it's not even about a time of day, it's the price point of this cigar.
Gizmo:That's fair.
Chef:So when I shell out, you know, 50, $60.70 dollars
Gizmo:But you're getting a little tray that
Chef:you can cut on. Yeah. I'm getting a cutting board.
Senator:Tomorrow's salami on that tomorrow.
Gizmo:You can make senator junior's lunch on
Senator:that. Correct.
Chef:When I'm gonna spend that amount of money on one cigar, I'm expecting an immersive, totally complete experience. Like, there cannot be an ounce of me wanting more at that price point. If this cigar were, you know, $10.15 dollars, I'm not gonna complain about that. At $10.15 bucks, I'd buy many boxes of this. But at that price point, it's gotta deliver everything.
Chef:It's gotta be firing on all cylinders, and that's my only complaint is I just want some more concentration of these flavors I'm getting.
Rooster:Yeah. So I think that might change with some age. If these boxes maybe sat for a while, maybe even like six months, maybe those flavors might develop. But I think the previous chef's edition was definitely
Senator:It fuller was than early on in experience, but we may, in practical terms, you may get it as we go down
Chef:That's what I was going say. We hope it may change. I
Rooster:mean I like the flavors from this but
Senator:this is also
Rooster:a different group of chefs. It's their input. The previous chefs was a different group of chefs. Maybe they preferred that profile. Who knows?
Chef:Exquisite though, an exquisite cigar. And I think the only non European chef on this panel was from Miami. I'd say I thought he was from Newark.
Chef:Patterson. Correct.
Rooster:Does he own a restaurant that begins with A? Arete,
Chef:yes. Yes.
Gizmo:Rooster.
Chef:A rooster. You know, I feel like Michelin star Relax.
Chef:The pagoda's here.
Chef:I feel like Michelin star chefs in general, I'm not shocked by how the flavor is delivered here because nothing is overpowering, nothing not to say nothing stands out because there are some standout flavors here. But
Gizmo:I think
Rooster:They're not
Chef:bold, especially in this sector when you're dealing and you're producing food at that high a level, they're so sensitive about their palate and just
Senator:It's what we were talking about just a few moments ago, about wanting just a little bit more.
Chef:Many don't even smoke you know, because they're afraid of what it's going to do to the palate or how it will affect their palate. So I'm not surprised that this is maybe something you can smoke and you're not, you know, hit over the head or your palate's not totally shot afterwards in the way it's delivering its flavor.
Gizmo:I don't trust a chef who doesn't smoke cigars.
Rooster:That's correct.
Chef:Yeah. Neither do I.
Gizmo:So, Senator, you got back from the Doctor a couple weeks ago. Obviously, we've had a busy few weeks on this podcast, episode 200. We've had a lot going on, interviews and whatnot. But you had a great experience in the Doctor, and I wanted you to share that with the audience, what you shared with us.
Chef:Yeah, I really was blown away. Mean, candidly, you know, now having been in, it's like I'm embarrassed to admit I've spent a ton of time in The Caribbean, visited many places in Doctor for whatever reason. It's like you hear about, you know, not being as safe, things like that. So it's always kind of fallen to the bottom of the list, even despite obviously, you know, how much I love the tobacco out of Doctor. The family and I went.
Chef:We stayed in Cap Cana, which is like fifteen minutes away from Punta Cana. That's where you fly into. Cap Cana is stunningly beautiful. It's like this huge kind of gated community with the resort we stayed at is Eden Rock there. Amazing place.
Chef:There's a St. Regis they just built there. Carlito Fuente actually built a cigar lounge in the St. Regis there. Cool.
Chef:There's maybe two other like really nice high end hotels there. There's a Jack Nicholas golf course in Cap Cana that literally runs through the Eden Rock property, the resort that I was staying at. And, you know, I appreciate golf. I'm not a golfer. I don't golf myself.
Chef:I watch plenty of it. I was completely blown away how beautiful this golf course was. I'm very lucky. I've been to Augusta National for the Masters three times. That's as beautiful a course as you'll ever see.
Chef:This course was stunning, and I'm just so confused. Like, how is this just in the middle of Doctor? I've never heard of this. I'm googling it. The last ten straight years, it's won best golf course in The Caribbean, and it's Golf Digest has it as one of the 50 best courses in the world.
Senator:No shit.
Chef:Right in Doctor. Wow. The hospitality, you know, I think one of the things that had us fall in love with Cuba as much as we did is Cuban hospitality is like really special. Mean, you know Second to none. Exactly.
Senator:Correct.
Chef:People are just so kind, so generous. It doesn't matter how awful their day's been or their living situation is. They would do anything to help you if you needed it. And my experience in Doctor was very similar. I mean, incredible hospitality.
Chef:They love children. Like we went to Italy last year, took my son when he was two. And in Italy, you know, same thing like they adore children. Doctor, oh my goodness, every single member of that staff knew my son by name, He had the time of his life. The beach was beautiful.
Chef:Pools were awesome. Funnily enough, so they have a kids club there, which most kids clubs you have to be four years old to go in.
Senator:Do they have a humidor in there?
Chef:They have they So have Chocolate cigars. Correct. They have three humidors there. No.
Senator:In the kids club.
Chef:Not in the kids club. My son's humidor was in my room. Correct. But as you can imagine, the cigar culture, this is another huge thing I love about Doctor. And I say this because I was in Mexico in January, and we've talked about how Mexico has gotten more and more restrictive with tobacco.
Chef:No smoking on beaches and in public areas. The hotels. They have
Gizmo:their priorities straight down there.
Chef:It's crazy. In Doctor, you and this is a five star resort. You can smoke anywhere you want. You're dining outside, it doesn't matter if the whole if every table's full, you light up your cigar, you enjoy yourself, they have specific ashtrays for cigars, like they do cigarettes, you're by
Chef:That the
Senator:puts a huge fucking smile on my face.
Gizmo:Yeah, man.
Chef:I love that.
Rooster:Makes you wanna go.
Senator:Well, correct, but it's it's just that's great to hear.
Chef:It does. I mean, my routine basically, every morning, the family, we'd have breakfast. We drop my son at the kids club. I'd go work out, then have a cigar on the beach. My wife would ride horses or do a yoga class.
Chef:We'd have lunch, bring them back to the kids club in the afternoon, I'd have another cigar by the pool with my wife. We'd have dinner. And then I basically they have this really cool cigar lounge and bar. It's set right over like one of the pools that's like nicely lit up at night. This great guy I made friends with there who works there and was a bummer because the whole time he was serving me, I was there most nights at this hotel, he was just very formal, bring me a drink, he asked me if he wants me to cut the cigar, stuff like that.
Chef:But finally, he's like, know, it seems you're really into cigars. I said, Yeah, I mentioned the podcast. And this guy loves cigars. And he was talking about how he has been really wanting to visit Cuba, and he's hoping to go next year. So obviously, I was giving him a little bit of a heads up.
Chef:It's a tough time, but, you know, it's definitely worth visiting. He was actually talking about how he's been to the La Aurora factory in Doctor many times. He's like, Oh, I know Don Guillermo. Big, big cigar guy. So the funny thing was, I felt bad.
Chef:My last night, I had no Cubans on me at that moment, I would have happily given him a Cuban cigar. I So had a Padron ex Uxivo and I said, know, I'd love to give you a cigar. He's like, oh, a Padron. Thank you so much. And he goes, there's a strict no gifts policy with the staff at the hotel.
Chef:So if you'd be willing, he's like, If you write a little note to my boss, I'd have to bring him and he can decide if I can accept this.
Gizmo:I was
Chef:like, This is wild.
Senator:That is quite formal.
Chef:Wild. So I literally gave a pad and paper.
Senator:Good thing we don't have that here.
Gizmo:Senator got out his quill. Correct.
Senator:Let me write you a letter, EDF.
Gizmo:Dear sir. Dear idiom. I hope my home is well.
Senator:Oh, yeah.
Gizmo:Please cut the grass.
Chef:I literally had to write, like, the exact, name of the cigar that I was giving, said this guy provides amazing service. And then his boss actually came out, very nice guy, and he's like, Absolutely, he can accept it. Thank you so much. But it's a very formal culture and the service was really top notch. I can't recommend Doctor enough.
Chef:I would absolutely go back. My son, every week since we've been home, has asked to go back. And my wife even just the other night talked about retiring possibly to Doctor. What? So I was like, wow.
Gizmo:I like how that sounds.
Senator:That's a big
Chef:That's as ringing of an endorsement as it gets for Doctor. We had such a spectacular time.
Rooster:I guess you didn't go out of the resort.
Chef:No. Well, no. Actually, no. No. No.
Chef:My wife did. So my wife went horse riding. There's a stable, maybe a fifteen minute drive from the resort, and she's got a high bar for horse riding. She's done it in Patagonia, Africa, Ireland, all over the world. And she had an awesome ride there, which I think also helped with the retirement plan there.
Chef:She can ride horses, I can smoke cigars, we both love the beach, all that. So it really has everything. And the amount of money that's been pouring into Doctor, I mean,
Gizmo:I think
Chef:This St. Regis just opened up this year. There's, I think I read something like a couple billion dollars in investment happening in Dominican Republic, like right in Cap Cana and that Punta Cana area. So I think it's only gonna get better and and we had an amazing time.
Senator:It's not just the resort development that's growing. It's the residential community development and the town and village concept that's like building there. I have a few friends that live there. They go back and forth. I know one guy that's in the construction business and they're actually rebuilding towns to create this central business district feeling like we have in some of the towns where we live at and beautiful residences around it.
Senator:So, I think if that takes hold, I think Doctor will transform itself within the next ten years, if it continues.
Gizmo:It seems like it's well on its way. I agree. When I went to Doctor, I didn't go to a resort type beach area. I was in Santiago where, you know, the
Senator:You were at Bob's Beach Resort.
Chef:It is tie dye tank top. Correct.
Gizmo:Hey, that tank top plate. That was Oh yeah.
Senator:Oh yeah.
Gizmo:But I was really impressed with the infrastructure. I was impressed with the hospitality, as Senator's saying. And most importantly for me, I was shocked how welcoming even a closed room restaurant with no windows was with us smoking inside.
Senator:Yeah. It's incredible.
Gizmo:I couldn't believe it. It was honestly, in some cases, more smoke friendly than Cuba.
Senator:Yeah, think so.
Gizmo:In some cases, right?
Chef:I wasn't going that far.
Senator:The both of you had great experiences down there. I've only been there once. I went for a wedding. It was fantastic, but we stayed on property. Didn't get a chance to explore, but you guys sound like you had a great time, both of you.
Chef:Like, no joke, the most cigar friendly places I've been, it's Doctor and Greece. Greece was the exact same way. You can smoke anywhere you want, which was awesome. The one thing I did not mention, I I can't believe I have to, the food was A plus. Wow.
Chef:Excellent. There was this restaurant there, which you can visit a lot of these resorts even if you're not staying there to eat at. So if any listener visits Cap Cana, I highly recommend going. It's called Palapa. Oh my god, the food.
Chef:I mean, everything from like, you know, fancier dishes, the the fish there, the quality. I mean, the tuna, like, they've even had sushi. Outstanding. Nice. I had this.
Chef:I'm forgetting the name of the fish now, it's a white fish in like this coconut, maybe tomato broth, tostones, rice. Amazing.
Gizmo:Come on, chef. This is the chef's edition episode. Nail? Correct.
Chef:Oh, I mean, flaky fish.
Gizmo:Well done. Exactly.
Chef:And even just very traditional Dominican dishes, like the rice and beans and this stewed beef, it reminded me, honestly, the beef was super tender, melt in your mouth. When you have even the kind of this gravy that it was in, it was very much like like oxtail you would get like in in The Caribbean. Incredible. Incredible.
Senator:Love me some oxtail, baby.
Chef:And the rice and beans is different because, like, you know, Cuban rice and beans familiar with is usually, you know, black beans and rice. The beans there, they're not like red beans. They're like brown. I was talking to our friend Lizard Johnny about this. I'm forgetting the name now for the specific types of beans, but outstanding.
Chef:I mean, wife, kid, everybody loved the food there. So it really it just checks every box. Like, I I can't think of one weakness. It's so easy to get in and out of there. It's awesome.
Chef:I can't recommend it enough. So I am we have to do a cigar trip there. Is I've been saying
Gizmo:that since I went, but now that he went, we have to do it. Correct.
Chef:Check. Check mark. Gizmo would have us on Frontier there.
Senator:Correct. I've got a question. So did you say
Gizmo:I understand the implication. Never flown Frontier once, not once.
Chef:Oh, sorry. United's much different.
Senator:I got airline snobs in the room. But did you say there were three humidors on the property?
Chef:Yeah. So three of the restaurants had full tower humidors Really? Stocked with cigars.
Senator:So did you check out what they had?
Chef:Oh, yeah. It was about half Dominican, half Cuban.
Gizmo:So fake Cuban and half Dominican.
Senator:You think?
Gizmo:Yes. There's no distributor for Habanos on the island.
Rooster:That's true. There's no LCDH. That
Chef:I know.
Gizmo:Even LCDH, forget the retail, there's no distribution for Habanos to the Dominican Republic.
Senator:So what Dominican cigars did they have?
Chef:Do you remember? I mean, lot of Fuente. Of course. Opus. Opus.
Chef:K.
Gizmo:Aurora. Aurora. How many Opus cigars did you charge to the room?
Chef:Zero. Correct. Some Davidoff.
Senator:Oh, there you go. So in a pinch, had something pretty decent.
Chef:Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Is Aleva out of Doctor?
Gizmo:No. That's the Nicaragua. Okay.
Rooster:Do they have any pod drones or no?
Senator:No, mostly Doctor. Doctor, yeah. Makes sense. That's cool.
Gizmo:So for you, what was your, let's say, average lineup? We've done this segment on the pod recently, like a day in lizard life as far as your rotation. So what what did a day look like for you as far as your smoking?
Chef:I'll use my birthday as that. So I was there celebrating my birthday and my son were were six days apart. The morning of my birthday, I had a La Gloracubana Turquinos That's right. On the beach,
Gizmo:which was How did that taste, by the way, since we it's been a little while since we smoked to give it a great rating. Has it matured?
Chef:Honestly, just as good. Really? I wouldn't say it's any better, I wouldn't say it's any worse, like, just as good.
Senator:At least it hasn't gone down, so that's a good sign.
Chef:Really enjoyed that. In the afternoon, I had a d four, unsurprisingly. I'm forgetting in the oh, man. In the evening, I'm forgetting what cigar I had slotted there, but I know what I closed with, and man, it stole the show. I lit at that cigar lounge I was telling you about, you know, overlooking the the two of the pools there.
Chef:This the Padron sixtieth anniversary. Oh, In Maduro. I mean, we obviously smoked it. We did on the pod, right? Yeah.
Chef:Yeah. We obviously smoked it on the pod.
Gizmo:Rated a perfect 10.
Chef:Mhmm. I remember Gizmo and I had the first ones together here at the lounge before that. With oysters. Correct. Bastards.
Chef:Correct. Yeah. Use airline snobs. I bring oysters. That's not fair.
Chef:And I brought champagne that day too. Both those experience prior were awesome. I mean, I think that cigar probably got a 10.
Gizmo:Yep.
Chef:If the just letting that sit for however many months it had been, it was sublime. I honestly it wiped the floor with everything I smoked that day.
Chef:Mhmm.
Chef:So damn good.
Senator:Yeah. Here's a question. So when I travel, I like to see if there are other guests on premises that are smoking cigars. I do like to see that. And it's it's I relish opportunities to talk to these people from wherever they're from about their cigar that they're smoking.
Senator:So When you were there, were there other guests smoking daytime, nighttime? Did you see any of that?
Chef:I only saw one other guy light a cigar when I was there.
Senator:The whole time.
Chef:Keep in mind, my secret, I love going to The Caribbean in the off Mhmm.
Gizmo:Oh, Yeah. Went the in depths of August. Wow.
Chef:Yeah. Late August.
Senator:So I agree with that. I was in Turks. Off season, it was phenomenal.
Chef:It's amazing. The the hotel had to be no more than 20% of its capacity. I like that. And in on season, that place is totally sold out. I mean, they're already if you look at like the first several months of next year, they're completely booked up.
Chef:Any given moment, there were no more than like seven, at most 10 people on the entire beach. That's amazing. It was incredible.
Gizmo:My type of beach. I'm not looking for friends, man.
Senator:Yeah. Especially your tie dye. You gotta hide that thing.
Chef:Unreal. So I think, you know, that's definitely a product of why I didn't see as many. So just one other guy saw smoke a cigar when I was there, and then of course, there were a few people having cigarettes every now and then.
Senator:Sure. Okay. Do you like
Rooster:smoking on the beach? Because I don't.
Chef:Really? So for me, if there's wind, absolutely not. Too windy. It's usually too But this is the Caribbean, so like there's very little wind there. I mean, you're on the Atlantic Ocean, you're always gonna get wind from the ocean.
Chef:But if you're in the Caribbean Sea, it's usually super tranquil, like ideal smoking conditions. I never fought wind the entire time.
Chef:It was great.
Senator:No kidding
Gizmo:at all. Wow. No. That's awesome.
Chef:I mean, at night, it is like so Subtle. Still, like nothing moves at night. It's unbelievable.
Senator:Especially on the shore? That's a great experience.
Gizmo:And listen, we've gotten lucky too here in the Northeast. Obviously, you're talking about, you know, going in the in the the off season to Doctor. But here in the Northeast, August was like the nicest August I I think I've ever experienced.
Senator:Agree.
Rooster:Absolutely.
Senator:And and
Gizmo:at night, the temperature, the lack of wind, it was perfect.
Rooster:Yeah. It's been perfect. Correct.
Gizmo:Alright, boys. We're coming to the end of the second third now in the Davidoff chef's edition 2025. How's the cigar? How's the sincere? Sincere?
Gizmo:Since
Rooster:sincerely. Sincerely good.
Chef:No. I give Davidoff credit. I mean, I I was honestly very shocked to see a Sauvignon Blanc pairing just because there's not many Davidoffs I think about pairing a white wine with. I mean, that's probably a product of the ones that we picked and choose to smoke, but they they were definitely right. But I'm just glad that this is not like a New Zealand Sauvignon Blanc.
Chef:Way too sweet or way too fruity would have totally messed this up for me.
Senator:How are you guys finding the cigar right now? Senator, you're a bit ahead of me. You've got a little bit more chefs ahead of me, but the rest of us are kind of
Chef:I think you're ahead of me.
Senator:I am ahead of you. Yeah, you're kind of behind a little bit. So where are you guys what are you experiencing right now?
Gizmo:Mine's picked up a little bit. A little more salty, which I really enjoy. It's taking me on a journey. I think that nuttiness you were talking about is there. Total absence absence of wood.
Gizmo:The sweetness has died down. I'd go more savory in my description of it right now. Loving how it's pairing with the wine. I love the journey so far. The only complaint I have right now is for me in this format, this size, this price, it's burning
Senator:too fast. Yeah, you mentioned that earlier. How about you, Brewster?
Rooster:I'm enjoying it. I think maybe it has picked up in strength, but not a lot. Just a touch. Yeah, very little. It's still in that medium range.
Rooster:But a note that I wasn't getting earlier, I'm getting like a little bit of coffee cocoa type of thing happening with some floral, which is still there. It's still creamy, has picked up a little bit in strength. It has gotten a little saltier.
Senator:Yeah, I've lost the sweetness Me too. For the time.
Gizmo:But I'm Okay with it. Yeah. I'm not missing the sweetness right now because the wine the pairing for me
Senator:The pairing, well,
Gizmo:still really performing nicely.
Senator:Yeah. The Sensera's then propping up the cigar at the moment for me. It is. And I'm I'm gonna say that that's true. I wish I had some cocoa.
Senator:Chef?
Chef:Yeah. For me, it's continuing to be creamy. I get little pockets or sparkles of pepper that are starting to return just a bit.
Gizmo:I agree with that, especially through the retrohale. Getting a little bit of pepper in the
Senator:retrohale.
Chef:Me too. But it's nowhere near as intense as it was early on. It's smoking beautifully. It's burning great. Yeah, it's definitely burning.
Chef:I just looked at the clock and it's definitely burning faster and I'd like for it to for sure. But outside of that the flavor is phenomenal.
Rooster:I wonder what the decision is behind making this a Toro. If you're going to charge more than the previous chefs, why not make it a Churchill? You know, it's a longer cigar.
Senator:Correct.
Rooster:And pack it a little bit more. This is a bit loosely packed.
Gizmo:I got to imagine that the argument for Davidoff is they're looking at the market and I think most folks are reaching for Toros. I mean, I know that us in this room and our type of listenership likes to see a Churchill because the lack of Churchills in the Cuban catalog, the lack of great Churchills even in the non Cuban catalogs. You know, seeing that Churchill come out and it being so amazing, you want them to repeat that, but from a consumer buying preference standpoint, I understand, Davidev, going with the Toro because that is probably the number one selling Vitola,
Rooster:at least in The United States. This is such an elegant cigar, and I think Churchill is such an elegant size that it would complement that. Sure.
Chef:No, I agree with that. I mean, the cigar, it it looks nice. It's not necessarily a Churchill. My only thing with the Toro, the ash is not very pretty. No.
Chef:Yeah. Like, I've smoked plenty of of Toros. We
Rooster:were So talking about it's
Gizmo:a flaky.
Chef:It's a little flaky.
Senator:Correct.
Chef:And I just don't really know why that's the case. I think
Rooster:it's just loosely packed. Yeah, that's probably it.
Senator:That's definitely the reason.
Chef:But that's a shame because that Churchill, I remember the construction, it performed beautifully.
Gizmo:And it lasted a long time.
Chef:For sure. Flavor wise for me, you know, I think it was Giz who said like it's gotten a lot more savory. As we've gotten further with this cigar, I completely agree. I it's picked up a little bit in strength, which I like because my complaint before was I wanted a little more. But the only thing I do wish is like, I wish it picked up when it also had the sweetness.
Chef:Me too. Like I wanted that that flavor, just that melding of sweet and savory was like so enjoyable. That's really where I hoped it would dial up and deliver that in a more concentrated way. So I'm happy it's picked up. I just feel like it's a little too late that it's picked up, so that's like my only
Senator:complaint at the moment. Are you liking it now?
Gizmo:I really like it right now.
Senator:You do?
Gizmo:I'm enjoying Alright, wanna hear this better. I think you're enjoying it. Something's falling off for you.
Senator:Yeah, no, I mean, I think everything you've all said is true. Again, noted it earlier. I lost the sweetness completely. I don't know where Rooster's getting that cocoa from. I wish I had a little bit of that.
Rooster:It's very slight. Maybe it could even be coffee.
Senator:I wish I had coffee. It's okay right now. It knocked my socks off the first two thirds now that we're entering that final third. I'm hoping that something changes. It's good.
Senator:It's good. It's not incredible now like it was.
Chef:I do agree with Bam on that. Me, the final third right now is my least getting into the final Yeah. Third is my least you guys tasting youth? In the finals as we're getting in the final third, a little bit. Yeah.
Senator:How long have you had these?
Gizmo:Less than a week.
Senator:Okay. So they're pretty new.
Gizmo:Yeah. But I mean, the reason why I brought them and suggested we do this tonight was because they felt good, I know that as soon as the retailer got them, they didn't have an opportunity to over Correct. Humidify So they didn't even have that chance. Davodaux sent it to him. They turned it right around.
Gizmo:I had it in a few days after we talked about it that last episode. So I felt feel really good about It it. Felt good. And to me, if Davodoff is shipping it like this, the retailer hasn't had a chance to screw it up, I'm fine to smoke it and review it as is. And it doesn't feel wet to me.
Gizmo:Doesn't taste No, no, It's burning well. The lines are good. Ash is a little flaky, but I think it's a construction thing there.
Chef:I
Gizmo:don't think we have a cigar that is not performing well because of humidity. I think what we have is an under filled Toro and potentially a little bit of youth happening right now for me as we're talking.
Chef:Do you think the decision to not do the Churchill has anything to do with the form factor of the leaf, of the leaves that are being used here, that 15 old leaf? Is it not a leaf that yields a lot, so maybe it's tough to use in a longer cigar?
Rooster:I don't know, it's possible. But I think Davidoff has huge amounts of tobacco in stock that they can literally make any size they want.
Gizmo:And the biggest concern with a seven inch cigar like a Churchill is the wrapper leaf, which on this is not something that they're really celebrating or talking about. So this might be a standard white label Davidoff wrapper leaf, and what's underneath that is the special stuff. I'm just feeling that it's a choice for sales. Push out a Toro and hope that more folks will buy the Toro than bought the Davidoff. Would be curious how
Rooster:this cigar performs in about six months. Let it sit for a while and see how it does.
Chef:I'll just say I'm not expecting it to perform much differently. I only say that because the last chef's edition we had, we loved it when we first tried it. We all bought boxes of them. They sat for a while, and I can't say that even eight months, a year, maybe even I would have held that for, that it was any different. They were all just great.
Chef:So I'm not sure. And and again, to Gizmo's point, there's nothing about this cigar that felt an ounce spongy or like humidity is playing a factor. No. I think we're getting this cigar as it's intended to be. So I don't know.
Chef:I'm not expecting much to be different.
Rooster:Great. So these are good, and these might get great.
Chef:Talking Well, you know what? I'm hoping.
Senator:I'm hoping.
Chef:You're talking yourself into it.
Rooster:You can only hope. Right?
Senator:Correct. All
Gizmo:right, boys. Let's go down to some listener email with a bunch of stuff to talk about, some international emails and whatnot. Let's go first to Lizard Enrique. The subject is wellness check. It says, hello, Lizards.
Gizmo:Episode 200 was pitch perfect, but I felt it necessary to make sure that chef Ricky is okay. Specifically, was chef concussed or on hallucinogenics or perhaps under duress when he compared Bam Bam to Jesus Christ? As lizards, you owe it to him and the audience to immediately seek medical attention or verify that he was not being blackmailed somehow.
Senator:That's correct.
Gizmo:Again, a great show. Cheers, lizard Enrique.
Senator:Yeah. I don't think that comparison's actually gonna be happening.
Gizmo:Alright. Here's another one. This one is unsigned, and it came in through a weird email, so I have no idea who this is from. I think it's purposefully anonymous. Hi.
Gizmo:Big fan of the podcast was wondering what humidor do you prefer? A traditional cedar humidor or the new electric versions? Also, I love your bourbon pairing episodes. Oh. So what do you guys think on humidors?
Gizmo:Do you prefer a traditional cedar humidor? Could be lizard Henry
Senator:dialing in there. Is he is
Rooster:he talking about a desktop or
Chef:a tower? What does that mean?
Gizmo:What I would think it's probably A wineador type thing. Either a wineador, coolador, or even those low the the small format ones you can get on Amazon. They're they're effectively wine refrigerators repurposed for cigars. Yeah. I think the answer in this room is always going to be a cedar lined humidor with, I think, a separate out of body, you know, out of frame humidification unit.
Gizmo:That's correct. You know, something like the cigar oasis, choosing the right one for the size of your humidor. Or if you're in something small, tupper door or a small desktop, going to boat. Certainly throw away any of those things, those little green things that you soak in distilled water and throw in the humidor, the thing they use at plant, you know, when you get flowers for the bride, the same green
Senator:That's no good.
Gizmo:Spongy thing. Throw that out, get some bovita and protect your stuff. So that's the answer there. Okay. So let's go now to Lizard Peter from Nottingham.
Gizmo:We hear from Lizard Peter a lot. He wrote us a nice email here. He says, Dear lizards, I am hoping to travel to New York next month with my daughter for a few days. It's my first trip, but she has been a few times and loves the city alongside Paris and London where she lives and wants to introduce New York City to me. I'm planning to take her and an old university friend of hers who now lives and works in New York to lunch.
Gizmo:Whilst they go shopping, sightseeing her to a gallery, etcetera, I'm hoping to slip away for a post lunch cigar. Are you able to recommend one or two lounges in the city? I've heard Pagoda mention the Carnegie Club once or twice, but is this for members only? So Carnegie club is not members only.
Senator:That's correct.
Gizmo:You know, if you find Pagoda there, you might, you know, get a free drink or something He's like kinda like the manager of the place He's
Senator:the mayor of the place, doesn't
Gizmo:He's the mayor for sure. But, yeah, Carnegie Club, I think, is definitely on the list. Are there any other lounges in the city that you guys would recommend?
Rooster:Club Club Macanuto, maybe?
Chef:Yeah. I'll I'll just start by saying none of the lounges that are left in New York are members only. That's true.
Gizmo:None of them.
Chef:So he can go literally visit any and all of them. Carnegie obviously is a big favorite of Pagoda. It's not a bad place to have
Gizmo:a cigar. He runs his office out of there now, right? He does.
Chef:He does.
Rooster:You'll find him there from noon to six p. M.
Chef:Yeah. The challenge in New York, there's advantages and disadvantages with all of them. There's not like just one spot that checks every single box. So like Macanuto is Club Macanuto is another great option. The the difference is so, you know, at Carnegie, they have lounge seating.
Chef:A lot of it is not comfortable. It's some of it a huge portion of it is like cloth seating, which to me has no place in a cigar lounge. It Like, needs to be leather.
Gizmo:It's like straight out of a car from the seventies or Yeah.
Chef:So you're getting lounge style seating, but it's not particularly comfortable. It is what I would describe as a pretty informal experience. The staff is nice, but not particularly experienced. They're not knowledgeable.
Gizmo:Well said.
Chef:They're not knowledgeable. Well said. It's not always the easiest to get a drink. Club Macanuto on the other hand, the advantage is the service is much better. I mean, you you walk up to Club Macanuto.
Chef:They have a doorman that literally opens the doors for you. They have a co check when you walk in like a formal members club would have. It's a beautiful place. They have a restaurant. They have a full restaurant.
Chef:So at Carnegie Club, can just get light bites. You can have a full dinner or steaks, anything you want at Club Macanuto. The downside of Club Macanuto is that they don't really have much lounge style seating. It's you're basically sitting at like a dining table and smoking. Now, the chairs at least are comfortable for dining chairs, but obviously you do miss kind of having like a nice leather, you know, couch.
Chef:Again, you don't even get that at at Carnegie anyway, but it is more lounge style. So there's pros and cons of each, but I would just say of those two, if you want like a more casual, like just pop in and have a smoke, go to Carnegie. If you want a more formal experience
Gizmo:And a meal.
Chef:And a meal, I would go to Club Macanuto.
Senator:There aren't many options.
Gizmo:What is the other one that's down a little further? Is that Soho?
Rooster:Soho. Soho cigar. Right.
Chef:Ventilation there is Tough. Is tough.
Senator:Very smoky in there.
Chef:It is somewhat comfortable, but like Club Mac, it is also dining style seating with the exception of the perimeter that has single arm chairs. You have Barclay Rex in the financial District that's more
Gizmo:Can you smoke there?
Chef:Yes. They have a lounge upstairs.
Senator:It's small.
Chef:It's small, if you're in that area during lunch,
Senator:probably a big space. If you can get in there early afternoon, you're okay, But once like 03:00 to five or six, it's awful. And then after that, everything around there closes and everyone goes home.
Chef:And it's a ghost town.
Rooster:I would suggest take a half an hour Uber ride and come to ten eighty six.
Gizmo:There you go.
Rooster:And meet the lizards.
Senator:That's an idea. You could go to Brooklyn where we had But
Gizmo:also don't forget that the Davidoff flagship is now reopened in Manhattan. That's on Madison?
Chef:I think they close early is the problem.
Gizmo:They close early, and I believe actually their lounge area might be members only, actually, senator.
Chef:I think they split it. Did they split it off? I think like half of it is for members and half is for people who walk in and buy a cigar
Senator:and sit down.
Gizmo:But that place honestly is a little hoity toity. Like, you walk in and they treat you like you're in a Rolex dealership or buying like a Maserati or something. It's like, I just want to buy my cigar and you got to get escorted and then they got to you can't touch it. They put the white gloves on. You know, it's a whole thing.
Gizmo:Then you'd want to sit down and smoke and they tell you you can't. Yeah. At least that was my experience.
Chef:But,
Gizmo:you know, I don't I don't love what I've experienced with Davidoff in Manhattan. But the one in Brooklyn that you and I went to, Ben, was pretty nice.
Senator:That's pretty nice. It's wide open, great seating.
Chef:I thought you had to buy some crazy day pass you said there now.
Senator:No, I think it's $10.
Rooster:You're talking about the one by the Hudson shops.
Senator:Some place
Chef:you were teeing off where you're like, it's like $100
Senator:Which is now closed, by the way.
Gizmo:Can't imagine why.
Senator:Yeah. Before they instituted that Brookfield Place. So I was there many times prior to this, and parking's tough unless you're Ubering down and getting dropped off. That was an incredible, beautiful little lounge. It had maybe 25 seats in it.
Senator:Nice humidor, all dab it off and other things. But it's unfortunately closed and honestly, there aren't great options in Manhattan. There just aren't.
Chef:You have the Casa de Monte Cristo on Second Avenue. Again, it's really just buy a cigar and sit down. There's no food there. There's no drinks there, but it does give you some place to smoke.
Gizmo:Can you BYO there, or it a retail shop where you can smoke?
Chef:Think you can. When I lived in Manhattan, I used to go exactly where Chef's talking about. It's BYO, people even bring food in. It's kind of like what we have here, But very casual, but a solid spot to just go sit and have a cigar.
Senator:Yeah. I think out of everything we just Carnegie's probably the easiest. Yeah. Yeah.
Gizmo:And You I think you're gonna get the most New York City experience
Senator:at Yeah.
Gizmo:Yeah. It's The only caveat I would say for any listener, including Lizard Peter here, Saturday evenings is very difficult to get into Carnegie for only the purpose of smoking a cigar because every Saturday night they have Sinatra night, so they actually bring in a Sinatra cover band with a ton of instruments.
Senator:And you kinda wanna avoid that.
Gizmo:It's a high price ticket. Yeah. You wanna avoid And Senator's been there
Chef:and he's not
Gizmo:enjoying it.
Senator:That's not good.
Gizmo:So let's continue on with Lizard Peter's email. It says, on a separate note, I've often heard on the podcast your high praise of the Vegas, Romania, Classico from Cuba and how difficult it is now to come by. None of the main retailers in The UK have it in stock, but I visited a London club last week simply because it was on the cigar menu. There were just five left in a dress box, and I attached a photo I took of the bottom box from the year February, gentlemen. What?
Gizmo:The year February. I googled it, it said the box code was for a Romeo and Julietta factory, and the date was September 2007.
Senator:Senator's about to book he's about to book a flight.
Gizmo:Is that correct, do you think?
Chef:How easy.
Gizmo:So in fact, it is from the year February. The factory name is OSU. I'm assuming he got it at the Sahockey in shop or something similar to that. He says the cigar was very enjoyable, but it was not quite in the same class as the ones you reviewed. Was not as distinct or as varied or subtle in flavor, but it was still very good.
Chef:Sounds like it needed some water protocol
Chef:on that one.
Gizmo:Well, think too, the other problem you have is the scars from the year February, looking at the box code, and that's just the black period of Cuban cigars. So 'ninety nine to like 'one is a very bad period for Cuban cigars. So what you have is a cigar from that period, unfortunately, probably well past its peak, you know, over 25 years of age at this point. You know? So, you know, you you wanna find something that's in the 2,000 ish if you
Senator:can. Coming from The UK, I'd be curious what new world cigars he likes. Because that's all he's gonna get in Manhattan. Yeah. Interested Good to see what he picks.
Gizmo:Or he could bring his own as well.
Senator:That's also true.
Gizmo:So he says, finally, congratulations on episode 200. The pod really did it justice, and it was very amusing and entertaining as well as showcasing a great cigar and champagne. As a listener, it really does feel like being the member of an exclusive but welcoming club. It was just a shame Pooba could not be there too. I love it when he gets in into his stride and riffs on some ever more absurd construct.
Gizmo:But you did allude to it. Very best wishes for the next 200, lizard Peter from Nottingham. Nice email. Good email. Another one here, boys, from Lizard Max from Australia.
Gizmo:He writes us all the time. He's one of the OG listeners of the pod. I think he started writing us, like, in the single digit episodes. So he says, Lizard G Unit, I pushed through a box of Liga Pravada h 99 and maybe four of the box performed at a high level. The blend is great, but the construction, I e, the easy draw, going out too easily, and the wrapper issues cause problems.
Senator:Yeah. It was a
Gizmo:And he says, Jeremiah Mirepfel, the Mirepfel company we talked about who supplies Cameroon, and if you remember Arturo Fuente has split off from them as their international distributor. He says, Mirafele started supplying JC Newman with a Cameroon for a line they made. Did Arturo Fuente get pissed off? So the answer to your first question there is no because JC Newman distributes Arturo Fuente in The United States. And quite literally at PCA, the booths are on the same footprint.
Gizmo:They're literally
Senator:Every year.
Gizmo:Every year they're at the same place, the same time. They probably book it together. Yeah. They are very much in a healthy business relationship. They're very happy together, and they show that off every year.
Gizmo:Jeremiah Mirafele would be an amazing guest on the Lounge Lizards podcast. He would just work with you guys. Reach out to him. His family's experience moving and blending Cuban and Cameroon tobacco is unheard of. The interviews I have seen are amazing.
Gizmo:Make sure you have good show notes. You could get eaten alive. Sorry for the spelling on my Spotify posts, but it is the best platform to comment. By the way, I love Spotify comments. Great work.
Gizmo:Lizard Max from Australia. Please get Jeremiah Mirepfel on. I'm off now to check out the cigar scene in Vietnam. I'll let you know what I find. Wow.
Gizmo:Lizard Max.
Senator:Very exotic.
Gizmo:So this one is from Lizard Luigi. We were talking about Rodriguez. I think, senator, you mentioned you had heard about Rodriguez cigars, and we've had another a couple few of we've had a couple folks reach out to us and he says, I can attest that Rodriguez is legitimate. The Reserva Pravada and Series 84 are both great options. So I'm gonna add one of those to the upcoming lineup of what we're gonna be smoking.
Gizmo:So we will get to Rodriguez very soon. And now, boys, it's time for our lizard of the week. As you know, any lizard out there can win lizard of the week. All you have to do is send us an email, a voice memo, a comment on YouTube, Instagram, as Lizard Max does on Spotify, whatever you choose on FOH.
Senator:Call Gizmo as much as you want
Gizmo:Correct. Directly. And you can win lizard of the week. This one is from Lizard Ronnie. It says greetings from Sweden.
Gizmo:Hey, Lizards. Ronnie the Lizard here reporting in from Sweden. I've been hooked on your pod for the last three months. So hooked that waiting a whole week for a new episode is painful. I've even started relistening, and, honestly, I don't think I've ever laughed this much during work hours or at home while trying to, quote, smoke along with you.
Gizmo:One of my new non Cuban favorites is the Liva Siri V Figurado. And when it comes to Cuban, I love the Partagas Lusitanias all the way. What can I say? I love smoking big sausages. Bam, every comment.
Gizmo:Right. Yes. Cuban prices are up, but apart from Cohiba and Trinidad, which just feel painful at those levels, I still think it's manageable to enjoy the good stuff. Thanks for existing. You guys make my days lighter and puffier.
Gizmo:I'm wishing you a wonderful life and many more perfect smoking moments together. Much love from Sweden, Ronnie the lizard.
Senator:Very nice email.
Gizmo:How cool is that?
Chef:Very cool.
Gizmo:Partagasus. That's the story tonight. He loves Partagasus.
Senator:Wow. Okay.
Gizmo:How about it?
Rooster:It's a very sweetest name. Ronnie, r a n I. Oh, Ronnie.
Gizmo:Yeah. Alright, boys. I can't believe that we are saying this at only ninety minutes into this episode, but we have come to the end of our evening here with the Davodoff chef's edition 2025 and the Pascal Jolivette sans serif from 2023. What's everybody thinking of the pairing right now?
Chef:Say it, Bam. Well
Gizmo:Bam's not happy. And by the way, Bam is always the most optimistic one in the room.
Senator:I'm
Gizmo:alright. You are not enjoying this cigar
Senator:right now. I'm okay.
Rooster:But you asked him about the pairing.
Senator:So the pairing, honestly, right now the cigar is so dry, I need this Sensair that we're drinking. So it's really helping it along. I'm at a point now where it's this super bitter dark chocolate, which I do like, but it's just the cigar is just too dry, and I'm not getting anything that I got early on in the first two thirds. Nothing. But with that said, the retrohale is still quite nice, I have to admit, but the traditional draw and the way it's kinda giving me that dryness, it's a little tough.
Senator:Just a touch.
Gizmo:I don't think any of the five chefs who made this thing smoked it past the second third. Probably not. I think the last third performing as it's done tonight is a major disappointment right now. I really am not liking this cigar. I enjoyed it up till about ten, fifteen minutes ago.
Gizmo:Now, I'm getting exactly what you're saying. Bam, my mouth is dry.
Senator:If it was in a larger format, like a Churchill, with a slightly different blend, I would have a longer experience at least. This has gone very quickly.
Gizmo:It's ninety minutes in, and we're in the last third here, and the last ten minutes have been not great for me. What about you, Senator?
Chef:I'm in the same camp. I I hate the last third. I'm not gonna sugarcoat it. Like both of you said, it's dry, it's bitter, it it lacks distinct flavor notes, It lacks most of the notes that this cigar had, the first two thirds. It's incredibly disappointing.
Chef:And, I mean, the only thing I'm enjoying right now is the the sans ser. I mean, that's sad. At this price point, I can't believe this much of the cigar. I'm totally disinterested. If it started like this the first third, I would have put it down.
Chef:Wouldn't even smoke it.
Senator:Agreed. And if it continued all the way through the way we had it early on,
Gizmo:then it would have
Senator:been a home run. Did
Rooster:get much drier.
Chef:Final third for me fell off a cliff.
Senator:Oh yeah. You're roach clipping it though, I could say.
Chef:Know, at this price point, you better smell better. That's correct.
Senator:I ain't putting this down.
Chef:Exactly. Yeah. It fell off a cliff for me. Really dry at the finish. It's actually because of it.
Chef:I'm enjoying the 2018 sense here a little bit more with
Gizmo:Actually, I just said that too. It was actually working with the kind of It was, yeah. Yucky bitterness I was getting there as I just put mine down.
Senator:It is propping it up.
Chef:So maybe it has a little bit to do with the youth, especially for this final third. But yeah, you know, to your point about the chefs probably not smoking it past the second third, understanding chefs attention spans, I'm not surprised. But yeah, it's unfortunate. It started really delicious and balanced and now it's just kind of falling flat. Although the smoke still smells amazing.
Gizmo:Yeah, the burn line I think was the only thing that continued the whole way
Senator:through. But
Gizmo:you know, for this price point cigar, and I think it'll reflect in the ratings tonight, like, to have the first 75% even, let's be gracious and say 75% of the cigar performing well, to have that last 25 fall off a cliff, as chef Ricky just said, it it really taints your feeling about the entire cigar. And for it to smoke at such a short length
Senator:Mhmm.
Gizmo:Tonight is very disappointing in this format. Alright, boys. It's time now to move into the formal liquor rating tonight on the Pascal Jolivette Sancerre from 2023. Bam Bam, you're up.
Senator:So this is a 10 for me. Missus Bam Bam and I are often she loves whites. I don't know enough about the white category. But this is something for $30, $35, when we're going out to dinner, and we can pick this up if it's a BYOB place, and she'll love it. I love it.
Senator:I like how long that finishes and as it actually comes down in temperature, it becomes richer. It's actually the flavor actually increases in body, which is really unusual. I like that there's no minerality there, so it's a very unique white for me and I'm at a 10. I think it drinks beautifully.
Gizmo:All right, Chef Ricky.
Chef:I'm also at a 10. I was blown away at first sip beer. You know, the nose was very traditionally Sauvignon Blanc, but the finish on this was so much more butterier than what I so much more buttery than what I would have expected. I did find some minerality here, but it wasn't so much so that it took away from the the blueprint of what a Sauvignon Blanc should be. But I did appreciate that depth that it brought, that it delivered.
Chef:And I love how it paired, especially early on with the cigar. And that
Senator:touch of tartness too.
Chef:Yeah.
Senator:It was really unique. And that's kind of what perked my taste buds up the entire time drinking it. It's very good.
Gizmo:So for me, it's also a 10. I think this is one of the most obvious tens for me from that first sip. I'm just really impressed how light it is, but it's not basic or boring.
Senator:Let me ask you a question. So what do when you go out to dinner, what does missus Giz like to drink?
Gizmo:She loves a Sauvignon Blanc.
Senator:She likes a white.
Gizmo:She loves the champagne now that I've introduced to her champagne. This could
Senator:be a great thing for her.
Gizmo:She loves a martini.
Senator:Okay.
Gizmo:You know?
Senator:There you go.
Gizmo:But as far as whites go, she would flip over the Sauvignon Blanc. My wife too. And and she's generally buying stuff that's in the 20 to, you know, twenties and $30 price point. This coming in at a $30 price point is beyond a home run. If this was $50, I'd still be at a 10.
Senator:I would like to try this with the Millennium Pyramid, the Davodolf Millennium Pyramid. I think it'll be delicious, spot on, beautiful pairing.
Gizmo:It was a perfect pairing for that great part of the cigar we were talking about from the light on. I really loved it, so it's a 10 for me. Senator.
Chef:So I'm thrilled to hear this. This is easily one of my favorite sansaires. It's always been a 10. It's still a 10, and I haven't had the twenty twenty three vintage, so it's actually fun for me to try this. It's excellent.
Chef:Lives up to all the others. For me, it's perfectly balanced. It has just enough sweetness, just enough minerality. It's so unbelievably versatile. Like, the occasions in which you pull this out.
Chef:You know, I think when chef was talking about Sauvignon Blanc, he mentioned, you know, it's a wine that he pulls for in the summer, which is exactly the case for most people. What I love about French Sauvignon Blanc
Senator:This I would
Chef:have that's sincere.
Gizmo:I would
Senator:have this all year round.
Chef:Year round.
Gizmo:Yep.
Senator:That's it. At dinner in the middle of winter,
Chef:a New Zealand Sauvignon Blanc, a California Sauvignon Blanc, those are ideal for summer. This stuff, sans sera, you can drink any day of the year, any time of the day, and it it's really cool. The one thing I'll just mention, and I didn't know this, I had only found this when I was just looking up a little bit more about kind of the style of Pascal Jolabet and how they make their wines. So most wines or even most San Sares, the grapes used would be from a single estate, and so they're in one type of soil. Pascal Jolivette, when he started this vineyard, he actually initially worked in the champagne business for Pommery in Champagne in France, and he wanted to create a really distinct style.
Chef:Like that is what he loved about champagne. You have all these champagne houses so close together, yet each has its own defining distinct style. And so what he did is instead of a single vineyard sans sera, he blends Sauvignon Blanc grapes from three different types of soil.
Gizmo:So it's the same grape, three different soils.
Chef:Exactly. One of them is limestone, which says provides finesse and minerality. Another soil, clay limestone, contributes fruit and richness. And the last one is flint adds structure and a distinct minerality. Interesting.
Chef:And I think like it's worked brilliantly because we've talked about like there's a complexity about this, and the balance that we're talking about you get because I think of that intentional decision to blend the same grape, but from different types of soil, which is what really makes a difference in wine just like with cigars. And I think they've done something brilliant.
Gizmo:Davittum also used all three of those ingredients for the packaging tonight. On the lid here, which is a cutting
Senator:board. Correct. And that marble that marble
Gizmo:Marble marble marble noot seeps into the cigar.
Rooster:Limestone. Did it impart any minerality?
Senator:You know, honestly, I didn't get much minerality until the temperature came down.
Chef:I'm shocked. Get a lot in this.
Senator:Not when it's on the cooler side, which I love. I love the way I drank earlier.
Chef:Mean, your point, you do get more fruit when it's cooler than you do minerality. The minerality definitely picks up when it comes down in temperature, but to me it's definitely present throughout, And the price point at 30 to $35, I've had a range of sansaires. Very elegant for that price. Dollar for dollar, I have not found anything that beats it. And I say that because you can buy a $60 sansaire, and I'm telling you I'd put this up right with any of them.
Chef:It's a tremendous value for what it delivers.
Senator:Can we get this anywhere?
Chef:Yeah. So the funny thing is, I mean, Total Wine carries us at $30 a bottle. I went to a smaller wine shop that I don't love in the area, so I won't name it, but you can guess it's in our town.
Senator:Correct.
Chef:And they had it for 33 or $34 a bottle, so you can find it from small wine shops to the big guys like Total Wine. It's at this point now very readily available. Again, when I first had it, Bottle King actually carried it, but a lot of other places did not. But now you can find it most places. Suck into my cigar.
Gizmo:We all heard it. Alright, boys. The formal liquor rating tonight on the Pascal Jolivette Sancerre from 2023 is a perfect 10. Awesome pairing for our cigar tonight. And now it is time to move into the formal lizard rating on the Davidoff chef's edition from 2025, the Toro Rooster Europe.
Gizmo:A little disappointed.
Rooster:I was really looking forward to this new edition of the Chefs. Mean, we have all had, I think, all the chefs edition cigars, and this is the fourth cigar.
Chef:No, only you were alive for all four. We've only had the last two.
Senator:That's correct.
Rooster:The last three, I think.
Gizmo:I didn't have the one. You didn't have the first one?
Senator:How was the 1910 vintage?
Rooster:Delicious. So this cigar, it started out really nice. It had a little bit of pepper on the front, And then it kind of developed into there was creaminess. There was a floral note. There was maybe a little hint of chocolate that I got towards maybe about the halfway point.
Rooster:But at $55 for a cigar, it needs to be perfect. And especially a chef's edition that only comes out every four to five years, they need to hit a home run with this. So 70% of the cigar was probably a 9%. And I think, as Senator mentioned, you wanted a little bit a fuller experience that you didn't get
Senator:out this It left you wanting a
Rooster:little more. It left you wanting a
Gizmo:little bit.
Rooster:Because you end up kind of comparing to the previous chefs' edition cigars. Rightfully. Rightfully so. And the prices are starting to creep up like anything else. And the other thing was the cigar was definitely not rolled.
Rooster:I mean, it needed a little bit more tobacco. It was a little bit loose. The ash was a bit flaky. We really burned through it rather quick. I mean, this should be at least a two hour.
Gizmo:I was totally thinking tonight at this format, this would have been a two and a half hour episode. Totally agreed. Like even if we got to two hours, ten minutes, then did the ratings, that's where I thought we'd be. The fact that this is probably gonna top out at just under two hours is shocking for the price size of
Rooster:the It went through rather quick.
Senator:Correct.
Rooster:And then towards the end, it really got very disappointed by the ending of the cigar. The last third really got dry. All that sweetness was completely gone. That pepper dissipated. Most of the flavor notes that we were getting throughout, they were completely gone.
Rooster:I cringe to give this an eight, but that's where I am. All right. Senator.
Chef:So I think your eight was more than fair. I'm at a seven. Oh wow. I'm at a seven.
Gizmo:I'm surprised.
Chef:Yeah. And I there was no doubt as I've been in the final third of this cigar.
Gizmo:I'm shocked you're still smoking it.
Chef:No, because I really I'm like hoping that in some way I'm gonna get some semblance of what I got early in this cigar.
Gizmo:Winston Churchill himself is gonna come down and
Chef:fix it. Gonna You're get it.
Chef:No. It's long gone. It's really frustrating. For me, the first inch, I think I had said I wasn't really enamored. It was a lot of very very traditional Davidoff notes for me.
Chef:After that first inch, all of a sudden, the flavor really started to come together.
Gizmo:Yeah.
Chef:There was complexity there. It was elegant. A lot of different distinct notes. There was so much to like. My complaint though at that time was just I wanted it delivered in a more concentrated way.
Chef:I want a complete experience at a $55 price point. The last third to me is close to unsmokable. It's like just hot tobacco. Like you're really not getting much flavor. $5 hot tobacco.
Chef:It's absurd. I mean, the fact that we've reviewed countless $10.12 dollar cigars that we would even say the final third was the best part of the cigar, and at $55, I'm saying the last third is practically unsmokable. For me, it's a 7 in the sense that, you know, if you're a Davinoff fan and you wanna try the new release, is it worth trying to have the experience and to, you know, know what the chefs, you know, pulled together this time? Sure. But are you gonna leave completely satisfied?
Chef:It's impossible. No. I really hope that whenever the next one of these comes out, they pump this up a little bit in body and deliver a really rich, full experience. I mean, the excitement for me about the chef's edition is these are chefs who every day, like Ricky, are pursuing delivering a ton of flavor to stimulate someone's palate. I never in my wildest dreams imagined that a cigar called the chef's edition would leave me wanting more flavor and have a final third where I think flavor is practically absent.
Chef:That's a huge disappointment. So for me it's a seven, I won't smoke this again. But again, if you you know, really want to try it, sure, there are some elements of it that are really great, but it doesn't carry all the way through. True.
Gizmo:So I'm at an eight. I mean, what a brilliant first two thirds of a cigar. It was. I mean, I really thought that we were going to be in the mid to high nines, close to 10 with the way that the five of us were raving about it. It had sweetness, the balance was there, it was elegant, it was classy, brilliant flavor, it felt good smoking it.
Gizmo:You felt like high class smoking this cigar. You knew it was a high dollar cigar, but it tasted like you were having an elevated experience. Class. High class, man. Really, I'm not going to repeat everything that Rooster and Senator just said, but this is why we smoke the whole cigar.
Gizmo:The entire Of course. I can't wait for Cigar Aficionado to give this cigar a 97 Scargi. After they smoke twenty minutes of it. I will not be visiting any of these chefs' restaurants. I don't care how many Michelin stars they have.
Gizmo:I think number one, based on the performance, these guys are trying to rush us out of the restaurant so they could turn the table over. And I think it's time next time for Davidoff to bring in some cigar smoking chefs.
Senator:Correct.
Gizmo:Okay. Not Michelin star chefs. I don't give a shit about Michelin stars. I want cigar smoking chefs to put together a cigar for cigar smokers.
Senator:Great commentary.
Gizmo:Don't care how many stars you have from the tire company at Michelin. I don't care. I want an excellent cigar. If you're gonna put this in this dopey box for $55 a cigar and you're going to give us this last third experience tonight, I think it's ridiculous. But I have to rate it for what it was.
Gizmo:Those first two thirds were brilliant. The last third was atrocious. With all that being said, I'm in an eight. Chef Ricky.
Chef:Giz, you deserve an Emmy for that monologue.
Senator:A very good commentary. Yeah.
Chef:I'm right there with you guys. It started amazingly, but the reality is $17 worth of the cigar smoke like hot tobacco. There wasn't much there for flavor. There wasn't much there for experience. And it was a rather quick smoke with a very flaky ash, as Senator pointed out.
Chef:But, you know, being a chef and kind of a fanboy of what these chefs edition cigars mean, I would probably buy a box and just let it sit. What?
Chef:That will be the worst money you spend all Yeah,
Gizmo:don't do that, please.
Chef:I really want that cutting board. Here, take it tonight.
Gizmo:It's going in my dumpster so you can
Chef:have Bam can make you a cutting board.
Senator:That's correct for $75
Gizmo:for cheaper. We'll even sign it for
Rooster:you. 7. 7. It home. More like $7.50.
Gizmo:Let me call
Senator:my stone fabricator right now. I'll get a quote right now.
Chef:So, you know, as much as as excited as I was early on thinking this was going to be a sure nine, I'm going to give it an eight. Although that is somewhat of a generous eight for sure. But, you know, if we were doing decimals, I'd probably be at a 7.4 or 7.5, but a seven feels just a little too low for me, so I'm gonna stick with the eight.
Gizmo:All right, Bam.
Chef:Please don't hold back, Bam. Yeah, no.
Senator:Calculating, trying to get that composite rating.
Rooster:You were gushing about
Senator:first two thirds were fantastic. First two thirds were great.
Gizmo:I don't think I've ever seen you go from ecstatic euphoric to as down in the dumps as you were in that
Chef:last night.
Senator:I was actually very deflated. I wasn't happy. Didn't feel good about smoking it. I do like the seven rating. I don't think they deserve an eight.
Senator:That's a pretty high level score. That's a strong recommend. Would you actually recommend this cigar to anyone else?
Gizmo:I'd recommend them smoke the first two thirds and then stop.
Senator:Well, that's a big Which is
Chef:why it's not an eight.
Senator:That's big perch that's a big, you know.
Gizmo:But the flavor you were getting was so brilliant. Did It did toy with the seven.
Senator:I did That's
Gizmo:why I stated to you.
Senator:I did say early on that it does leave you regardless of how good the first two thirds were, it did leave you wanting
Gizmo:Wanting more.
Senator:Just a little bit more. And that coupled with how it performed, actually was a little depressed. So I'm at I'm at
Gizmo:a strong seven. Alright, boys. The formal lizard rating tonight on the Davidoff chef's edition from 2025 is a 7.6.
Senator:Good. Good.
Gizmo:Yeah. I think that's a perfect score
Senator:for everybody. It is. In this, they deserve that rating. They deserve for what they did.
Chef:And Do know how many $12 cigars are more satisfying in totality than that experience?
Senator:But it's not just that. All the chefs we've had, we've loved. And so for them to do this, it's a it's a flop. Yeah.
Gizmo:Frustrating thing to not do They're
Senator:care of their their their patrons.
Gizmo:And you can't I wish that we could sit here, all ball busting aside.
Senator:And everything you've said, like your commentary, I'm surprised you gave it an eight.
Chef:Me too?
Gizmo:I am. The first two thirds were brilliant, I know that. It really gave me
Senator:Me too.
Gizmo:I was close to feeling like this was a perfect Davidoff cigar, because I don't reach for Davidoff a lot, and then it fell off so badly
Senator:Can I tell you the signature one that I happen to love, and I have I don't
Gizmo:have that cigar?
Senator:I love that cigar. I would rather have that than this cigar. Easily. Easily. I'd rather have my Millennium Pyramid
Chef:than this sorry. On the first two thirds, as much as you described them as perfect, they weren't perfect in the sense that even you admitted, you wanted a little The concentration of those flavor notes could have been amped up a bit more.
Gizmo:But I think for what it was, I think it was intended to be what it was at those first two thirds, and it delivered that. It was balanced, and it was elegant and it was effortless.
Senator:But if it gave you what you wanted, if you gave me that punch in the first two thirds, I probably would have given it an eight.
Gizmo:Same. And I probably would have been maybe a nine. Okay. But that last third was a disaster. Yeah.
Gizmo:A disaster. All right, boys. So let's compare this to the other Davidoff cigars we've done on the pod. We're going go in reverse order because we started with the chef's edition on episode two. So we'll finish with that.
Gizmo:Most recently, we did the late hour Winston Churchill series in Robusto on on episode one sixty five, scored an 8.5. And it only goes up from there, boys. On episode 138, we did the Maduro in Robusto scored a 9.9. On episode 132 on a short smoke special, we did the Winston Churchill series, the Bellicoso in the tins. Rick, you just lit one of those.
Gizmo:Mhmm. Scored a perfect 10. On episode 79, the Millennium Lancero, Addision Limitada scored a 9.1. On episode 45, the Millennium in Robusto scored a nine point zero. On episode 33, Bam Bam cigar, the Millennium in Pyramidis scored a nine point zero.
Gizmo:On episode 27, the Late Hour, the Winston Churchill series in Churchill scored a 9.2. On episode eight, the Dominicana in Robusto. That's Pagoda's favorite song.
Senator:Oh, yeah.
Gizmo:Scored a 9.2. And finally, the chef's edition from 2021 on episode two scored a 9.2. So this is a 16 swing from the chef's edition in 2021.
Senator:That was a delicious To
Gizmo:the chef's edition in 2025. Yeah. And again, all ball busting aside, I almost wish we could sit here and point to the problems in that last third being humidity, improper, you know, travel care, whatever you want Nothing to call factor. There is none of that. Even the last third, as I put it down, wasn't spongy.
Gizmo:It wasn't. There was no tar there. That is even making it worse for me that I can't even point to a reason that that last third was bad. Correct. Now, do.
Gizmo:Like when you guys bust my balls about humidity. No. But I almost wish in this case that that was there because it
Senator:would have given you a reason.
Gizmo:Would have given us a reason because there is no reason that it fell off like that.
Senator:And it should not have.
Gizmo:Well, boys, a disappointing night on the cigar and a great night on the pairing, the sensor from 2023. Let's go through our ratings one more time. The Pascal Jolivette sensor from 2023 scored a perfect 10, and the Davidoff Chefs edition from 2025 scored a 7.6. We, of course, have to thank all of the lizards who wrote in tonight. We love hearing from them and our lizard of the week, Ronnie the lizard from Sweden.
Gizmo:We always appreciate hearing from our friends overseas, our Lizard listeners around the world. We love hearing from you and anybody out there. Everybody can win Lizard of the Week. So please do write us in. We have to, of course, thank as we close, boys, our sponsor, Fabrica Five.
Gizmo:They are a great partner to us. They give great flavor, great value, effortless smoke. I keep using that word. That is my new word, effortless. Every one of those is effortless at a great price.
Gizmo:So please
Senator:check those And delicious.
Chef:Every third of this cigar is flavorful.
Gizmo:That's exactly right.
Senator:Break down to the bloody end.
Gizmo:Under $12 for most of those cigars.
Senator:Yeah.
Gizmo:So check those out, boys, and, we'll see everybody next week. Hope you enjoyed this episode. Thanks for joining us. You could find our merch store and ratings archive at our brand new website, loungelizardspod.com. That's loungelizardsp0d.com.
Gizmo:Don't forget to leave us a rating and subscribe on your favorite podcast platform. If you have any comments, questions, do you wanna reach out, say hello, tell us what you're smoking, email us. Hello at loungelizardspod.com. You can also find us on Instagram at lounge lizards pod. We really appreciate your time, and we'll, we'll see you next week.