Lion Counseling Podcast

🎙️ Episode 64 – Oleg Taktarov | UFC Pioneer, Hollywood, Masculinity, and the Cost of Strength

In this episode of the Lion Counseling Podcast, Mark Odland sits down with UFC 6 tournament champion, actor, and UFC pioneer Oleg Taktarov for a deep conversation about masculinity, mindset, identity, suffering, and the psychology of strength.

Far beyond a typical MMA interview, Mark interviews Oleg from his home in Russia. In this wide-ranging conversation, he reflects on growing up in a secret Soviet city during the Cold War, the influence of his parents and teachers, the mentality of the early UFC era, Hollywood, fame, loneliness, personal attacks, the strange experience of becoming a celebrity while still trying to understand yourself, and the unique mentality that made his opponents emotionally submit long before they actually tapped.

0:00 Introducing UFC Hall of Famer and Hollywood Actor, Oleg Tactarov
3:54 What shapes a man’s destiny… nature vs. nurture
7:00 The power of teaching and listening 
10:00 Memories from childhood in the Soviet Union
15:37 Oleg’s journey of creativity both in the cage and on the movie screen
21:05 The learned ability to read the room and discern people’s true intentions
23:14 Celebrity as a threat to peace of mind and creativity
26:40 The painful impact of being misunderstood in Hollywood 
30:09 A ten-year-long recurring nightmare of being stuck in Russia
33:30 The favorite character that Oleg has played as an actor
36:35 Oleg’s autobiographical, sarcastic book
40:53 Firsthand experience of how the power of words can hurt others
42:10 How the Dagestani “hyenas” attacked the “old lion” 
49:03 UFC early days and how different rules prevented defeating Dan Severn
51:14 Reflections on defeating Tank Abbott and the role of fear in fighting
53:35 Mental preparation for fighting

Together, Mark and Oleg explore:
✅ The psychology of early UFC fighters
✅ Genetics vs environment in shaping a man
✅ Soviet culture and masculinity
✅ Martial arts philosophy and discipline
✅ Fear, instinct, and competition
✅ Fame, public criticism, and identity
✅ Hollywood and life after fighting
✅ Why true fighters don’t carry hatred toward opponents
✅ The emotional cost of strength and success
✅ What it means to be a man in the modern world

Oleg also shares stories from the early UFC days, reflections on acting and writing, insights into his legendary fights, and behind-the-scenes thoughts on life in Hollywood.

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💬 Comment below:
What part of Oleg’s story or philosophy stood out to you the most?

About the Lion Counseling Podcast:
The Lion Counseling Podcast explores psychology, masculinity, trauma, relationships, faith, discipline, and the deeper struggles high-performing men face in modern life. Hosted by licensed therapist Mark Odland, the podcast features conversations with athletes, fighters, creators, leaders, and men who have endured adversity and grown through it.

New episodes drop every Tuesday.

Creators and Guests

Host
Mark Odland
Founder of Lion Counseling, Licensed Marriage and Family Therapist, Certified EMDR Therapist

What is Lion Counseling Podcast?

The Lion Counseling Podcast helps men escape the cages that hold them back and become the Lions they were created to be. It exists to help men obtain success, purpose, happiness, and peace in their career and personal lives. The podcast is hosted by the founder of Lion Counseling, Mark Odland (Licensed Marriage and Family Therapist and Certified EMDR Therapist), and Zack Carter (Counselor and Coach with Lion Counseling). In their podcasts, they address a variety of topics relevant to men, including: mental health, relationships, masculinity, faith, success, business, and self-improvement.

Mark Odland:

I'm Mark Odland, and this is the Lion Counseling Podcast. My guest today is Oleg Tactarov, a pioneer of the early UFC, UFC six tournament champion, and someone who went on to build an impressive acting career in Hollywood. And today, I'm honored to have him join me all the way from Russia. Oleg, welcome to the Lion Counseling Podcast.

Oleg Tactarov:

Hi Mark, how are you?

Mark Odland:

I'm doing well. It's a great day because I get to talk with you. So I appreciate it.

Oleg Tactarov:

Where are you at the moment?

Mark Odland:

I am in Minnesota.

Oleg Tactarov:

In Minnesota, okay. So it's got to be early morning.

Mark Odland:

Yeah. Not that too early. It's, yeah, about about 10:30 in the morning, Minnesota. I should have looked on the map to see if what the latitude is between Minnesota and where you are. If it's similar, I wouldn't know.

Mark Odland:

We're not Oh, I

Oleg Tactarov:

would say my I'm I I know I'm a more much, much north of You are. Toronto.

Mark Odland:

Oh, you are. Okay. Yeah. So does the water stay a little a little cold there in the lakes or no?

Oleg Tactarov:

No. It was wonderful. We got a few days just so hot people. They're barely surviving here. Okay.

Oleg Tactarov:

All over Europe.

Mark Odland:

Okay. Yeah, I'm lucky enough to live on Lake Superior, which is kind of like a mini ocean, right?

Oleg Tactarov:

Yeah, I've been there.

Mark Odland:

Yeah. We get this lake effect. So near my home, it's about 15 degrees cooler than it is up on the hill, is which is kind

Oleg Tactarov:

Yeah. Of

Mark Odland:

Yeah. Yeah. Well, okay. So one of the things that we talk about on on this podcast, Oleg, is the theme the three themes that keep coming up, right, are psychology, masculinity, right, and kind of philosophy, belief systems. Right?

Mark Odland:

And so a lot of our listeners are are interested in question big questions. Right? Like what does it mean to be a man? Right? How do I find purpose in all this?

Mark Odland:

Right? What are my goals? All these things, right? And I see you smiling, so I'm curious.

Oleg Tactarov:

I do not know. I have no answer. Well, you're Well,

Mark Odland:

then you can join the club, right? Because we're all trying to figure it out. Work in progress, right? One of the things that I find fascinating is thinking about how the forces that shape us as men, and of course in psychology, right, there's that age old debate that maybe doesn't have a real answer, but the nature, like our genetics that we're born with versus the nurture, how we're raised, our experiences. Do you have an opinion on that?

Mark Odland:

What shapes us more? If it's both, if it's more one than the other?

Oleg Tactarov:

I think that if you are born with bad genetics, if you're born to be a criminal, doesn't matter what kind of teacher you're going to have. You're going to flop. You're going to take the road. You're supposed to go according to genetics. I didn't see much exceptions in this slide.

Oleg Tactarov:

Once you say yourself, oh, wow, that's an exception. Then you see a couple of years. It's not person goes the road belonged to. It goes both ways, of course. So if you are a genius, it doesn't matter where you were born and even the teacher and which I value the most to have a this is like a kiss of God when you have a teacher.

Oleg Tactarov:

It doesn't matter discipline, but, most important teacher who can help me. We can give you the the real knowledge, not those that everybody is saying. It's something personal. Yeah. So I consider myself a good teacher because I had good teachers.

Oleg Tactarov:

Yeah. It's a lot. Lot. Yeah. Good good genetics and a and a teacher.

Oleg Tactarov:

And you have a good chance to be somebody, something in this life.

Mark Odland:

Yeah. Well, I've in preparation for talking with you today, I, of course, went to YouTube and looked at old interviews and tried to learn more more about you. And I saw that you had mentioned having some very influential martial arts teachers, sambo, judo. Did you think of your parents did you think of your parents as as teachers growing up in the Soviet Union? Did was was or or was that how did how did you see that?

Oleg Tactarov:

I think that by by watching, you you catch something. But, yeah, I mean, they give me genetic. That's the most they've done. So I guess I'm very similar to my parents. I don't really I'm not a preacher.

Oleg Tactarov:

If I teach, I rather just do it. Give an example of doing. And a smart student will notice. He will learn more just because I I get aggravated. I get annoyed when people just lecture.

Mark Odland:

Yeah.

Oleg Tactarov:

Looking patronizing. Not teaching. It's something that's more probably about your your ego. So some people just wanna be somebody. When when you when you you go on a baseball game, you see somebody talking loud, never played baseball at any high level.

Oleg Tactarov:

Probably never played baseball low, but he would teach every single kid on on the pit. Yeah. Same thing with martial arts. You have someone talking loud, you just wanna probably make a u-turn and just go opposite direction.

Mark Odland:

Yes. Yeah. So it it sounds like you really value people who lead by example, who teach by example, and who make it personal to the student, not just a lecture to everyone, but yeah.

Oleg Tactarov:

Most important is that, yeah, when you have a personal conversation, just one word, just a great teacher can watch you and then come and quietly whisper in your ear. Can you try it this way? My friends.

Mark Odland:

Yes. Yes. No problem.

Oleg Tactarov:

Just help me with the Q2. I got the yard, garden, got some, like I said, some park, some old cars and some people help me.

Mark Odland:

That's good. That's very good. Now thinking about growing up, did you did you come from a big family, or was it

Oleg Tactarov:

I was a single child. Oh, you were? Okay. I got sister with mother and got married.

Mark Odland:

Interesting. And your father was in the military and

Oleg Tactarov:

Well, he was not. No, wasn't. I don't know. It's just he was working just building. Building?

Oleg Tactarov:

Constructions. So I've never been to army because, like I said, we are from a city similar to Los Alamos. Used to be it was completely shut from the environment, from from outside. Right now, of course, you can travel back and forth, but, it's really make make yourself safe these days.

Mark Odland:

Mhmm.

Oleg Tactarov:

A lot of people in The United States would dream to live in a city like this. I don't lock the doors. I don't have any crank here. So but before it was even more strict, all the scientists, world level, universal level scientists that live here and they walk without any guards. So that was my childhood.

Mark Odland:

Okay. So very safe. And

Oleg Tactarov:

Yeah. I found The United States quite safe for the first decade when I, when I interned from 1995 to 2005, then things kind of start falling apart. Even my neighborhood, it's a valley, quite valley area. And we got synagogue. And, one day, I come and I got a bomb with the cars for filled with junk for probably hundred hundred meters, 100 yards long with all of those cars tied one to another.

Oleg Tactarov:

Oh. And and and then we have a liquor store. It gets dropped every week. Every week, we got the helicopter filming, and every week, we get dropped. It's amazing.

Mark Odland:

Yeah. It's it's sad sad to see things deteriorate. And

Oleg Tactarov:

I think the world is gonna go like this all. It's it's but, you know, I don't wanna wait until it gets better.

Mark Odland:

Yeah. No, that's that's right. You you'll be always waiting. Right? And

Oleg Tactarov:

Yeah.

Mark Odland:

Yeah. Okay. Well, interesting. Do you so it sounds like overall, it was a it was a good childhood. And were there certain things from your your parents that you I mean, looking back, that you admired about them that you feel like are part of you, that you've kind of taken with you, as part of your character?

Oleg Tactarov:

Or do you feel like Yeah. My father never never talked much.

Mark Odland:

Yeah.

Oleg Tactarov:

He would say something or done something that would be straight to the point. So to me, his behavior was very similar to some Buddhist monk in the Tibet Mountains. Interesting. Yeah. My mother is a Virgo with the old, like my I'm Virgo myself, but she's like, she's a, she's a 100% Virgo, like example of being a varga.

Oleg Tactarov:

She had her own opinion and, or she had the knowledge and taste, but she was very, very strict Mhmm. Certain things. So Mhmm. Little boss. Yeah.

Mark Odland:

Yeah. So they balanced each other out. It sounds like dad was I very

Oleg Tactarov:

guess Yeah. Guess so. Was a great team. Yeah, you can't have two, two leaders in the one team. You gotta be one.

Mark Odland:

Yeah, exactly. Okay. And do you now you it sounds like you've always been from what I've read or heard, you've always had that kind of creative side of you and that that side that was imagining things, thinking about adventures, thinking about I mean, is that part of your parents too? Or your father or your mother, were they creative? Would they dream about big things like you?

Oleg Tactarov:

I hope not. Yeah. I wouldn't touch the subject anymore because Yeah. I think my personality is just it's been created because, like I said, there was the genetics, and then we got the different genetics.

Mark Odland:

Yeah. So Yeah, just a different person.

Oleg Tactarov:

Different person, yes. And I got the, like I said, great teachers and I think I value the most I could listen. I could listen and think over and over about trying to compare things. And I said, Listen more than talk.

Mark Odland:

Yeah. Yeah. And how young were you when you knew you wanted to be an actor?

Oleg Tactarov:

I do not remember, honestly. Someone told me at the age of 22 at my college. It was a university. It's the right translation. Yeah.

Oleg Tactarov:

People would ask me, are you doing? I would get an answer. I'm doing fine. I was writing a script and I got the script. I mean, I think it's a great script because when I go to Hollywood, that would be just the perfect script.

Oleg Tactarov:

We've never seen anything like that. And, action script should be done for real. So it should not be staged. And people look at me like, just think about where the Hollywood and where we are. So even in Minnesota when somebody would talk like this, sounds strange.

Oleg Tactarov:

Yeah. In Russia, I place one night on a train from Moscow, it sounds more than strange. It's just But people, yeah, people, I don't remember myself, but I mean, people don't know the stories.

Mark Odland:

Did you have I mean, did people around you at that time when you started thinking big, thinking about getting your screenplay into the hands of someone in Hollywood, did they act like you were crazy for having that dream or did they were they supportive?

Oleg Tactarov:

I don't remember any supportive person because, I had a big business in a year or so after all those cases, me talking about the script in Hollywood, I was involved in the business till age 27. It was pretty big. I couldn't invest my money in my own film. I make it happen just by myself. The good thing I, when I came to United States, I understood you have to study, you have to learn things.

Oleg Tactarov:

You can't just jump there. And, I spent over four years in a playhouse and then things changed completely. Well, what I what I thought was great, I found horrible. What I didn't know anything about, I found, genius. So it was everything went up and down.

Mark Odland:

Wow. So is it no. Is it true that I mean, it's complicated. Right? You're so gifted as a fighter and as a grappler.

Mark Odland:

Was your first love always acting? Was that the ultimate goal? Did it No.

Oleg Tactarov:

I I it just came to me. I have no idea why. Mean, just probably at age 17, maybe, maybe when I start winning the all all those trophies. At that time, it was popular that everything goes in competitions. Although it was a little bit different than in United States, we had the gi.

Oleg Tactarov:

Mhmm. So you could punch. You can do anything but in the gi. So it was easier for me once I get the grip done, I win. I created my own, at that time, I didn't have any features in this field, so I created my own ideas how the fight should go.

Oleg Tactarov:

So later, of course, it became well known. So we started this. We made the mistakes, but, we started it. Some stuff still no one can repeat.

Mark Odland:

Do you have students who do you feel like they're they're carrying on that knowledge, or do you feel like it's being lost?

Oleg Tactarov:

I had students which have been seen every day. It was in Los Angeles. And of course, they would care those knowledges. Some guys have studios themselves. Some person became a Hollywood writer, film writer.

Oleg Tactarov:

And, so I'm pretty sure they will share some knowledge to other people. But, I value more traveling around the world, teaching seminar, performing seminars. Russia later, but before it was, United States. I think I've been in every single state except North Dakota, Nebraska. And I was, in Montana at the border.

Oleg Tactarov:

So I didn't do any business in Montana. But four states I have never visited. Rest, If I was not filming, I'd probably fight there or do seminar, which most likely was a great experience. It was an amazing experience and helpful to understand people without understanding what they are saying, just to watch their behavior, understand sometimes more than they would say. And you don't need much time.

Oleg Tactarov:

Like, when you have 200 students, you got to understand them at the moment, right? You see them. So you just look at the 200 people and you know where the problem is going to be, who am going to be the most supportive and who's here really learn, who's here just because you are star and they just basically want a picture. Get diploma that I presented to the Oleg seminar. You see those people right away.

Oleg Tactarov:

You you mentioned time. A couple of minutes. It was a great quality. I didn't see much many people with this quality. I don't think it's given to you.

Oleg Tactarov:

You have to obtain it by teaching, by seeing new people. And, my English was quite poor at that time. Vocabulary was the lowest level. So I had to find a way to explain things that people would not make a mistake. Otherwise it would be too exhausting for me.

Oleg Tactarov:

So I put people in the position of explaining things the way that they wouldn't make mistake. So I have some certain know how some, something I have developed. I didn't see much with other people.

Mark Odland:

Yeah. Yeah. It's interesting being someone who has multiple talents. I mean, do you find it, I don't know if frustrating is the right word, but like say you're at a party and someone has never met you and people so often they say, Oh, what do you do? Right?

Mark Odland:

And here you are, you've been a successful fighter, a successful actor, and teacher. Do you find that it's easy to answer that question? What do you do or who you are? Or how do you see that?

Oleg Tactarov:

I kind of like those questions. I mean, I enjoy when people don't tell me. You can be yourself. I was a really fun person before I became quite celebrity. Yeah.

Oleg Tactarov:

Quite famous. It was I hated that time when I was up to crime.

Mark Odland:

Really?

Oleg Tactarov:

For first two, three years, it was, it was too much for me because I didn't have a lifestyle to kinda cover myself Mhmm. Surround myself with anything. So I had to still live the same life. But, every visit to the grocery store or bar become like, I just hated myself at that time. I hated everything that was happening.

Oleg Tactarov:

I, I want to study. I want to live the same life. I wanna walk the same same way. I wanna but I had to change it.

Mark Odland:

And

Oleg Tactarov:

like I said, I didn't have money at that time in The United States. I didn't have an understanding of this life. 99% of my time, it's, you go with a girl and you get people screaming, oh, Lick Tactarov Russian beer sometimes. And, that would happen when I would go for an audition for my films. So for example, there was once a story.

Oleg Tactarov:

I was at audition of film fifteen minutes, and that there was a callback. Fifth, fourth, where he got the part. And there was a one one actor, one up, and there was the producers and the director. Hey, what's what's the UC champion doing on the, on the, down there? Producer was a great man.

Oleg Tactarov:

He said, you know what? This UC person got a great job reading his part, and he's already got the part. But you need to work hard to get your part. So I think you should focus on your business. So he did a great acting job.

Oleg Tactarov:

No, I mean, he was talking about me. Yeah, yeah. And later they told me this story, but that's very typical. Sometimes I would not get the roles because of somebody would talk too much. People are like, oh, is he a C champ?

Oleg Tactarov:

Or should I, you know, oh, he can be a doctor. He can be a lawyer. He can be a nice guy. Yeah. We should share yeah.

Oleg Tactarov:

Like, for example, right now, I'm experiencing something, for example, Charlie Chaplin has experienced. So because of, because of, because of I'm in Russia, not in LA at the moment. I would not get any job for almost three years. Three years. And then, how I know it?

Oleg Tactarov:

I was hard on myself. I thought maybe my additions are not good enough. Maybe the way I look not good enough, not right for the part. And then my friends who I study with call me, hey, Oleg, you know, I work for production. There was just, talking about you because you're supposed to get the second lead.

Oleg Tactarov:

And they say, let's go to another way. Although he is the best, He's he's much better than other guys, and, if more valuable, he can bring more to the film because he's well known, and and he he's just perfect for the part. But we can't risk because, we don't know if we'll let him play. Maybe somebody gonna ban the film because of, his nationality. So that's that was not something pleasant.

Oleg Tactarov:

Now I'm more relaxed about it because of I'm doing well in Russia. I'm working on a different, you know, good parts, good projects, I'm making decent money probably twice more than, let's say, a year ago. One got but it's still kind of unfair. It hurts.

Mark Odland:

Yeah.

Oleg Tactarov:

Yeah. So

Mark Odland:

Yeah. Well, that's that's I imagine that's very frustrating. And to to I don't know. I mean, it sounds like it's more than I mean, there's the practical side of just the income, the money, the the livelihood, the career trajectory. But then I imagine, it does it feel personal too?

Mark Odland:

Like, does it feel like a re like a rejection that I mean, I I don't know. I put myself in your shoes. No.

Oleg Tactarov:

It's not. I I I find just that those those people are very narrow minded and I'm pretty sure those projects will never make big.

Mark Odland:

Yeah. Okay.

Oleg Tactarov:

But you gotta have both to create something that you would be proud of. I think those those projects, they would be just a just paycheck for me. So it's not not a big deal. Okay.

Mark Odland:

Yeah. Do you, has when you were in The United States, did that did it ever feel did it feel like home to you? Did Russia always feel like your real home? How do you see that?

Oleg Tactarov:

I, for first ten years, I had a dream. Actually, I was called nightmare. I would wake up in in The United States. I would wake up with a, with a, with a dream of me being in Russia and not have a paperwork to come back. I was devastated.

Oleg Tactarov:

It was, it was so horrible. It's like the city, you know, my life is over. I can't, can't perform in the films anymore. And, that's it. My dream is over.

Oleg Tactarov:

So I would wake up like realize, okay, I mean, I'm in The United States, everything is fine. So just go sleep again. And it would be over and over. That was the most horrible dream I had at that time for the first ten, fifteen years probably.

Mark Odland:

Wow. Did that keep you from visiting Russia? Did you did you ever fly back or did you just stay?

Oleg Tactarov:

I fly quite often. Did? Okay. Right now, I'm too lazy to fly because you have to make, several stops, and flight becomes quite dangerous. Okay.

Oleg Tactarov:

Airport airport get attacked by flying saucers. You've got to fly through Dubai or Turkey or some other places. It's this trip becomes too long. You travel for a whole day, sometimes day and a half. Yeah.

Oleg Tactarov:

Used to was fun. Just so many planes. You go to LA, it's eleven, twelve hours. You get a couple drinks. I would buy some Olanderberg, a little bottles with the alcohol 44 degrees with the herbs, with the 44 herbs.

Mark Odland:

Okay.

Oleg Tactarov:

So once the plane starts shaking, you just have one and the plane gets fly smoother. And then you fall asleep and you wake up. Holy shit. Magic happens, man.

Mark Odland:

Oh, that's good. So do you, do you see yourself just staying in Russia for the foreseeable future? Do you feel like this season will No?

Oleg Tactarov:

I'm pretty sure by fall, I will find some job. And of course I have to travel for this because people are afraid that I'm not going to be able to leave the country. Yeah. But you know, I have a passport of The United States so I can travel. Okay.

Oleg Tactarov:

It's not a problem, but I don't know why people would just make make big deal of it.

Mark Odland:

Yeah. Okay. Do you, Oleg, do you have, you've done so much work, how it had so many different parts. Is there a particular role that you've played that was your favorite or that you feel particularly proud of, as far as the different roles you've taken?

Oleg Tactarov:

I I do feel like three roles have done better than others, but that's Russian films.

Mark Odland:

Russian films. Okay.

Oleg Tactarov:

Russian films. Yeah. One film I did in Syria, the Russian film was done, half it's basically documentary. Not sure. It's a it's a real story of a spy.

Oleg Tactarov:

In 1980s. Oh. Some, era that because of his work, South Africa has, during the apartheid time was denied. I mean, just to quit on, possessing nuclear weapons because my guy who played got the proof that they possessed atomic bomb, nuclear weapons. And because of his work, there was, I guess, just the whole world put request, and he was having it.

Oleg Tactarov:

And he had to spend two years in prison, and he was he's been tortured several times. He get he's been threatened. Killing him the the threat killing him. And, the real person when he watched the film Wow. Said Oleg understood exactly how I felt.

Oleg Tactarov:

So he did wonderful works. It was probably most valuable Wow. Better better than paycheck. Yeah. For for you for you your work.

Mark Odland:

Well, what a compliment for the the real man to tell you that he he felt like you got it. You understood. Yeah. Does That's

Oleg Tactarov:

the way. But

Mark Odland:

Interesting. Does does does that movie, is that, have they subtitled that? Is that available to watch in The United I

Oleg Tactarov:

think so too. I I think so. There was a not sure how you translate it. Should be I will check. Maybe there was a translation that's been ready officially.

Mark Odland:

Well, it sounds sounds great. I'd I'd love to watch it. And you is And am I right that you wrote, an autobiography where you wrote a book, Jason?

Oleg Tactarov:

Two books, and it's it's more you can call it. Yeah.

Mark Odland:

Yeah.

Oleg Tactarov:

Biography. But, I made basically I put three scripts in this book.

Mark Odland:

Oh, you did?

Oleg Tactarov:

Potential scripts. Yeah. And I tried to make a, a, make a fan of stories, which they were pretty dreadful, pretty scary, it's barely survived. But, I tried to say it in a sarcastic way over yourself. Really?

Oleg Tactarov:

Like Okay. The I, had to rewrite it to make certain people pass away, and I don't want be too sarcastic when I talk about them. So I haven't changed some few pages.

Mark Odland:

Okay. Now when you say sarcastic, do you mean in the stories you exaggerate or you, like, change the change change the details of the story a little bit to make it more like a a legend or a myth, or is it more reality?

Oleg Tactarov:

A different way, but, you know you know, the English dark humor. Yeah. That was that was the way. Okay. How how I would describe certain people or certain ideas and that.

Mark Odland:

Well, that's that's that's very cool. Do you do you continue to enjoy writing? Is that something that you make time for with your other obligations?

Oleg Tactarov:

I, was hoping I, yeah, get published. I would call it, it's not just a book, it's an Is there a word like that?

Mark Odland:

Yeah.

Oleg Tactarov:

It's a motivational book on your training, on your eating, on your way of life. And with one subject, I had to stop for a while because it was not well accepted in Russia.

Mark Odland:

Oh.

Oleg Tactarov:

Because I also talk about the people with the longevity life over 95 year years.

Mark Odland:

Yeah.

Oleg Tactarov:

And they all have the similarity. So they all first, they all had the gold. They all have friends. They all have a they never work too hard, but they always work. And they would eat one egg, for example, each of them.

Oleg Tactarov:

They would eat, the bones, like we call it hash in Russia, when you boil the bones for over eight hours and you get all the nutrients which you buy in the store. It doesn't help. And all of them eat this, so it preserves the strong bones. And, they all have a shot of something. Cognac, biscuit, cachaca, seventy, eighty milligrams.

Oleg Tactarov:

Once you start talking about in Russia, people forget about saying that eighty, seventy, not even not even hundred milligrams, they will just talk about the the the idea of drinking. Say, excuse me, guys. I mean, it's it's completely different. Yeah. We're not talking about poison.

Oleg Tactarov:

We're talking about the thing that helped many, many generations of healthy people. So I don't know why. I mean, just I'm just saying, just how that similarity. Because when you talk when you when when you get annoyed by by stupidity like yours, for example, talking to the people. Yeah.

Oleg Tactarov:

Yeah. Of course, you get tired, and, it's better to come home and have a shot of whiskey and forget about it and then then then take it too close to the heart and die from nervous breakdown.

Mark Odland:

Oh, man. There's some there's something to be said for the way that resentment and bitterness and that can that can really be like a poison for people when they just stew with those those feelings.

Oleg Tactarov:

Yeah. The the worst the the the wart hurts the most. The bad bad time. People are nobodies and that they're criticizing you in a personal way. I mean, it hurts.

Oleg Tactarov:

It It's it's impossible to let it go. It's impossible to say, Hey, I'm not tracking. I'm not paying attention. It's impossible. You're to pay attention anyways.

Oleg Tactarov:

Yeah. Like, for example, for six years, because I don't know why, because I was a celebrity.

Mark Odland:

Yeah.

Oleg Tactarov:

Old line, when we had, always get bitten by hyenas, get slower, slower. So we had the people from South Of Russia just attacking me. Oh, Oleg is, this Oleg bad. He's a Nazi. He doesn't like people from our people of our religion, Muslims.

Oleg Tactarov:

He doesn't like the the people from Caucasian mountains. He's not the first champion. He's a nobody. He would just, you know, come up with stories, and it's been for almost five, six years. Now it's all gone, but, you know, it's hard not to pay attention to them.

Oleg Tactarov:

When you have a 6,000 people blocked in your Instagram. They talk about mother and father insult your way of life and say certain things that never existed. Just that, you know, what was what's the difference between those people and my normal people? Mean, those guys know how to lie and they lie first. Yeah.

Oleg Tactarov:

And a person who lies first, who knows how to do it, who perform it in a professional way, of course, be trusted. Yeah. For what? Sometimes for years. And when you have a question for normal intelligent intelligent people, because they listen to all this, like, oh, like, it is it true for you?

Oleg Tactarov:

Of course not. I mean, you are you're a bright person. You're smart. You should you should ask yourself, would it be truth? And sometimes people just just listen.

Oleg Tactarov:

So, yeah. I mean, yeah, I ask myself, of course, I think it's not true. But when you hear there, you hear there, they're talking too loud that they write too much. It's, Instagram. Now it's, it's over.

Oleg Tactarov:

It's been probably for a year. I didn't hear maybe two years. I didn't hear anything about it. There was no nothing. Wow.

Mark Odland:

Well, that's a lot. I mean, it's good to know that it passed, but that's a long time to endure those insults and lies.

Oleg Tactarov:

Yeah. Once we got people became champions, like, the and the company, things have started. Bob Myers said, you know, you can, the first the founder of UEC, you can, of course, treat your your guy as a king, but don't take it.

Mark Odland:

Just

Oleg Tactarov:

not how he will say it? Just just well, you can say anything new people, about new celebrities. Just, don't take anything from Oleg. I mean Yeah. Because, give him leave him, give him credit.

Oleg Tactarov:

He was the first, and that's it. You don't have to, put him down to bring you guys up. I mean, it's a it's another nice way of, choosing your stars.

Mark Odland:

That's yeah. I mean, it's it's so frustrating because factually, just just just history historically, you were the first Russian UFC champ. Right? UFC six. Correct?

Oleg Tactarov:

Right. Yeah. I was the first, not not American

Mark Odland:

champion. First foreign Yeah.

Oleg Tactarov:

First foreign, not foreign. I mean, it was Gracie. It was from South Yeah. And, rest of the guys were from North America.

Mark Odland:

I see. Yep.

Oleg Tactarov:

So then seven, Steve Genome. Well, that's it. And, yeah, of course, Gracie won three times. Yeah. And then sixth sixth person was me.

Oleg Tactarov:

So it's not just the Russian or not Russian. It's the first, not American. Person from

Mark Odland:

Yeah. That's yeah. Yeah. I I don't know why that's so hard for people to admit. I mean, saw I saw an old clip where Dana White was up on in front of the mic, and he's like, was he?

Mark Odland:

Did he oh, I guess. I mean, he was it's like do do you feel like do you feel like that was about ultimately about money trying to sell the fights for the I forgot.

Oleg Tactarov:

Or For for them, anything what was what was before the purchase you've seen.

Mark Odland:

I see. Okay.

Oleg Tactarov:

They they they were kinda narrow minded at that time. Mhmm. I think now now like, for example, if you have a whiskey of 1982, and you have a whiskey 1898, I mean, I think that's more valuable. The The older, the more valuable. If you say UFC started not when you guys purchased, UFC, I think what it was year 2002, if you say UFC had started at 1993, it has more value.

Oleg Tactarov:

It has more history. Well, yes, you did great as a new owner, but you have to give a credit to Bob Myers in the company and our day, everybody who was before you. They've done something great. Otherwise, you would not purchase the company. You would not believe in this.

Oleg Tactarov:

So I think they did something correct. So you have to wipe the history. Yeah. Was Grace he was the first fourth champion and the sixth sixth UFC been conquered by me.

Mark Odland:

Yeah, that's right. That's right.

Oleg Tactarov:

Live the history along. Yeah.

Mark Odland:

Yeah. Well, and for those who don't know, the early UFC UFC days were kind of like the Wild West. Right? There was very few rules and no no rounds. It would be a long a long or a longer time limit.

Mark Odland:

And you would fight in a tournament multiple times in one day to get to the championship.

Oleg Tactarov:

Yeah. You have to fight three fights a night to become a champion, and, there was, for a while, no time limitation. It was only two rules. No biting and no eye gouging. Everything else was allowed.

Oleg Tactarov:

If I would fight modern rules, I would probably become a UFC five champion because, I would not be able to perform my arm lot to then Severin because he was, holding the fence and because, he hit me with a knee on the ground in my forehead. So both of those are not allowed anymore, and he would not be able to do it. So probably would become a UFC five champion, but it's okay.

Mark Odland:

Yeah. Yeah. And do you think the referee missed it or just let it go?

Oleg Tactarov:

They apologize. They say there was a first of all, there was a wrong stoppage because he didn't give up. There was a you become a winner by, submissions, knockout, or if the person taps out. So I didn't tap out. I was able to perform.

Oleg Tactarov:

Yes. It was kinda horrible to watch because I was on my back and, all my eyes were, in the in the blood, so people the referee could not understand big job what happened. So he just was pretty scared, I guess. He stopped the fight. But, you know, there was a wrong.

Oleg Tactarov:

There was a according to those rules or exception of the rules.

Mark Odland:

Yeah. It's

Oleg Tactarov:

okay. I won the next one. That's why it was even more fun. The tank habitat were much more fun as an appointment, appointment, and I think it was, it was his best night. He just destroyed two big, huge guys before our fight.

Oleg Tactarov:

So everybody thought I'm gonna lose. They will do send thing to me that what he did to those guys. It's okay.

Mark Odland:

Turned out a different way. Yeah. I mean, that's, I think I saw in one of your interviews talking about fear and how you saw it as a good thing as long as you could control it, and that it was kind of a a fuel a fuel for you. Do you, so you felt that going into that Tank Abbott fight? You felt some some healthy fear?

Oleg Tactarov:

I didn't have any fear.

Mark Odland:

No fear of that one. Okay.

Oleg Tactarov:

I was too tired to fear. It was a hard fight. I was I

Mark Odland:

was just too tired. Exhausted.

Oleg Tactarov:

Exhausted? I, didn't watch him. I didn't see what he'd done, what he he has done to to the previous opponents. But, he was just some stranger. So I'm gonna face him in a few seconds.

Oleg Tactarov:

Couple of minutes, I will find out what's the what's the guy this guy all about. Well, that's okay. He was, when you come to the first fight. Sometimes it's you have to fight this fear because it makes you makes your head just go well. Sometimes you have to even before the fight, I would turn around just to calm myself down.

Oleg Tactarov:

I would be over prepared. Say, I feel like I wanna like I'm about to lose my conscience. Wow. Because I was over prepared. Too ready for the fight.

Mark Odland:

Interesting. And I thought, yeah, so you've had so many hours of preparation too. There's thousands upon thousands of hours training Sambo before that, too.

Oleg Tactarov:

Right. Yeah. So that's why I was, I used to have several fights at night. I used to play mental games. I used to read my opponent in a a few seconds of the beginning.

Oleg Tactarov:

Like I said, I used to fight the guys I've never seen before. Didn't have any idea what they're capable of. That helped. And also, like I said, I was an unstoppable machine. You my idea was you're gonna die first.

Oleg Tactarov:

We're both gonna die, but you're die first. You're gonna tap out. And then my man, then my guy gonna pass out, but you're gonna die first. No one people receive this message. Say it, but they feel it.

Mark Odland:

They could feel it.

Oleg Tactarov:

Yeah. And, the strange, strange things can happen. And they start looking for a way to lose, find a great, not shameful, way to lose the fight once they sense it. So you're just like a honey badger. Nobody wants to play with you.

Mark Odland:

Would would that happen for people deep into the fight, like ten, fifteen minutes, or would would would it happen quickly? Would they feel that from you and you could sense it?

Oleg Tactarov:

I would say probably from in three minutes up to fifteen, twenty minutes, people would, would understand, would read.

Mark Odland:

They could feel your confidence, and they could feel that you were willing you were willing you would you were willing to endure more than they would. Yeah.

Oleg Tactarov:

Just like animals. Just know that certain people, they don't have it. They don't have it. You can wake up and can be hungry, out of shape, but you're still going to win. It just stays in The U.

Oleg Tactarov:

S. On the level of ancient people.

Mark Odland:

Yes. Yes, exactly. Very, very instinctual.

Oleg Tactarov:

Instinctual. Yeah. Ancient people and understanding. If you don't mind, we can continue maybe other day because I have to do some stuff tonight.

Mark Odland:

Oh, understandable. Like I would love to do that, to continue the conversation another time. Right. Thank you so much for, I know we could talk for hours about the psychology and the mindset that you have, but it's fascinating. I really appreciate you sharing what you did today.

Oleg Tactarov:

Yeah, you come up with some more questions and I will, since I haven't been practicing my English, over, read a couple of books.

Mark Odland:

You sound great. You sound great. And if it'd be helpful too, could I don't know if you like being surprised or if it'd be helpful to send a few questions ahead of time for you to.

Oleg Tactarov:

Yeah. You can. It would be nice because, like I said, I I a few words I still couldn't recall. I knew them before, and I forgot. Oh,

Mark Odland:

okay. That's okay. That's okay, Oleg. Well, until next time, Bless you, and we'll talk we'll talk soon. Thank you so much.

Oleg Tactarov:

Cheers. Thank you. Alright. Bye.