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Interesting people, insightful points of view and incredible stories on what’s popping and not popping in marketing, tech, and culture you can use to win immediately. Brands, Beats and Bytes boldly stands at the intersection of brand, tech and culture. DC and Larry are fascinated with stories and people behind some of the best marketing in the business. No matter how dope your product, if your marketing sucks your company may suck too. #dontsuck
DC: What's happening, Brand nerds? You know what it is. Back at you With another Brands, Beats and Bytes podcast. Brand Nerds, myself and my business partners, Larry and Jeff, uh, we know that it was critical for us to make the right selection of our first experience early in the marketing game, and there are a couple of places that if you want to understand brand management at its best. There are a couple of places that you go. One of those places is Proctor and Gamble. You go to Proctor and Gamble early in your career, and you are going to get world-class training as a brand marketer.
So they are one of the best, if not the best in the world at raising up great marketers. So we have someone here in the building that has been raised up early in their career at P&G. But the second thing, and quite frankly, the more interesting thing to me is we have a fellow HBCU grad. Now they may have Larry picked the wrong HBCU possibly. Okay?
LT: That's, that's your opinion.
DC: That's my opinion, but no, no, no, no doubt. Love is still there for all of the HBCUs. Larry, who do we have in the building with us today?
LT: All right, DC We have Ranita Bryant in the house today. Welcome, Renita.
Renita Bryant: Hi guys. Hi DC! Hey LT!
LT: Hey, it's, it's great to have you Renita. So, okay, Brand Nerds. We have another stellar guest in the house today who, as DC alluded to, started in Big Fortune, 50 brand-centric companies and has gone onto forge her own path. So after matriculating and DC started this too at HBCU, Florida A&M, better known as FAMU, earning an undergrad degree in business administration, then an M B A in marketing. Renita joins Johnson and Johnson and works there three years working our way up to manager of sales and marketing analytics. Now then Renita gets tapped on the shoulder, and that's what DC was alluding to, to join arguably the best CPG company in the world. Procter and Gamble in their consumer and knowledge group. Brand Nerds, this is research. At Stellar consumer-centric brand, uh, C P G companies like P&G consumer research is really the backbone, the foundation of the company. In research at P&G Renita gets to work on great brands such as Crest, Tampax, Gain and Cheer. Additionally, while working in laundry brands, she's also selected as the Category's Multicultural Knowledge, SPOC, and that acronym stands for single point of contact.
In this role, Renita identifies $36 million in optimization across marketing plans. Leads to first multicultural marketing mix modeling review, manages an extensive category immersion. That refocuses the organizational priorities and brand strategy. And for all this great work, she has awarded the NACMK Insight Award for driving multicultural insights into category foundation.
So when you earn awards like that at P&G, that's real stuff. Brand nurse. Yeah. So while still at P&G, Renita starts Mynd Matters. And that's M Y N D, a consumer-centric publishing consultancy dedicated to guiding and supporting new and aspiring authors through their book publishing journies. A couple of years later, Renita leaves P&G to start Site Set Consultancy.
Site Set is a team of researchers and strategists specializing in helping clients make meaningful connections with their target audience. Since 2014, Site Set is one of the southeast fastest growing enterprises driven by a passion to give a voice to underserved and often overlooked consumer groups, as well as deliver high quality innovative solutions and less time and at lower cost than traditional firms. With Site Sets Renita is committing, is committed to educating others about the power of insights, strategy, writing, and entrepreneurship. It starts with renita facilitating work workshops, both domestically and abroad. Workshops, help attendees bridge the gap between where they are and where they want to be, in connecting with consumers slash readers and excelling in their businesses, her passion for consumer-centric entrepreneurship makes her the perfect fit for partnering with purpose-driven businesses, organizations, and individuals striving to put consumers at the forefront of their strategy. From writing books to launching household products, Renita ensures our clients are equipped from start to finish to achieve their goals. Lastly, fitting with all the great work Renita's doing in and around publishing, Renita is a board member of the Independent Book Publishers Association. This is really gonna be fun Brand Nerds. Welcome to Brands, Beats and Bytes, Renita Bryant.
Renita Bryant: Thank you. Wow. I thank you so much. You, you reminded me of a lot of, uh, a lot of experiences as well. You know, you, after you go on in your career bit, sometimes you forget about some of those, uh, early moments, right? And those early wins and those early, early learning. So thank you for bringing that to memory for me LT.
LT: Oh, all good. You, you learned it all. And we, we love doing that Renita because, uh, it, it really provides the Brand Nerds to get to know the human that we're, uh, that we have in, in our virtual house. So we, uh, and you've earned all, all of this, so it's a, it's a great place for us to start.
Renita Bryant: Thank you. Thank you.
DC: Yeah. We should rename that, that opening, uh, Renita and, and Larry, uh, flowers, because that's what it really is, right? It's given flowers, uh, to the, to the guest on our, uh, podcast. And as Larry has said, they're earned. They're earned. Renita. This is, this is all you. Very, very impressive. Very impressive.
Renita Bryant: I appreciate it. So, because you can go through, oh, go ahead. Go ahead.
DC: Oh, no, no, you go ahead, Renita. You go ahead.
Renita Bryant: No, I was just thinking about what you were saying and, and, and it's those moments where you're so used to doing, and so sometimes you forget to look up and see what you've done.
And so having moments like that when people do give you the flowers, you know, I think it's, is, it's meaningful. It makes it, uh, makes it count even more. So yeah. Thank you.
DC: Yeah. Someone you're, you're most welcome. Someone who, uh, did a, did a quote. This is, uh, brother Steve Jobs, uh, rest in power, when he did a commencement address at Stanford.
He is famously, um, um, noted for talking about things make sense in your life. You can connect the dots when looking back. Mm-hmm. That's when you connect the dots. It's hard to do that while you're doing the work, to your point, Renita. Yeah. And it's certainly difficult to do that looking forward. And so when Larry does this for our guest, including you today, what we hope is that one, there's an appreciation 'cause you all, you, you have done the work, but secondly, Renita, that there might be some connecting of dots for you, right?
And, uh, and Larry, so thank thank you for doing that, uh, all the time as well as you, you do it. Uh, Renita and Brand Nerds, uh, they'll, they'll remember this, those that were with us from the beginning is that I used to do some of these and Larry used to do some of these and it was pretty clear that Larry was better at doing these than me. So Larry does these things, brother lt. So a couple things.
LT: He's being very modest, uh, Renita and uh, I always get uncomfortable with it because it's our guests who are who that it it, I just say, here's what they've done and that's it.
DC: Alright, LT. So two things before we get to our, uh, our next section. Uh, so Lt, when you talked about Florida A&M, FAMU, for the Brand Nerds that aren't able to visually see the podcast I did, I did the little Rattler sign. So I was holding up the little Rattler sign and Renita was smiling so that this is what they do. LT, you go to a football game, you'll see them all woohoo. With their little Rattler thing. Okay? So let's give respect to the Rattlers and then thank you. Yeah, you're welcome. Jeff's son Justin, who's a Rattler, and then another son Jamie, who is also a, uh, a Rattler.
So respect, respect to the Rattlers. Yep. All right. P&G beginning, that's big early in the career, Renita to get that kind of training. Um, IR irreplaceable, but I wanna go someplace different on the Get Comfy section. Okay. You have written a book. And you are work, you have worked and continue to work in the area of, uh, of independent and, uh, and book publishing and writing.
Renita Bryant: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
DC: And so I wanna point out the difference between Google and Chat GPT. Alright, to frame up this question, okay? In, in, in preparation for this, uh, this podcast, Renita, I was thinking how many people on the planet, what percentage have written books? So I typed this question into Google and what popped up, what was some random article about novels.
And I'm like, this is not really good enough for me. Mm-hmm. So then I went to Chat GPT and I, and I typed in my question, and here's what it, here's what it said. I'm not gonna read the whole thing, but let me just read the last paragraph. It says, however, it is estimated around 2.2 million books are published each year globally.
Considering the world's population is approximately 7.9 billion people, this suggests that a very small fraction of the population, likely less than 0.03% have written a book that has been published. So that means not, not that many people di minimis de minimus. And so my question to you is, uh, is as you think about looking back and connecting these dots to when you were thinking about writing your first book and then that journey of writing your first book, what advice would you give to the Brand Nerds that are, that are listening?
Because my belief is that while few books have been written, many people have books inside of them right, waiting to come out and be written. What advice would you give to these folks?
Renita Bryant: I think, um, and it's, you know, I talk to people every day, um, when they find out that I have a publishing company or that I sit on a board, believe me, whether it's in a mall or a baby shower or mm-hmm. Uh, birthday party, I get a lot of, I, I get stuck in a lot of corners to hear a lot of, you know, ideas and stories. Um, so, and uh, it's always interesting. Um, what I will say is that, For, for, for me it was, my, my journey was a little bit different, right? So for, I, I have five books now. One children's book, um, three collections of poetry, and then my first book was a novella, um, Yesterday Mourning. And mine was born out of more of an emotional place. Like it was, it was more cathartic for me. My mom had passed away when she was 42. And it was a way for me in my early twenties to really, 'cause I was 24, it was a way for me to write about my feelings about it without having to go through the entire process of talking it out, right? Mm-hmm. Um, and so, so for me, I think getting the book out, it felt like it was more purposeful and more purpose centered. Like I had to do it right? And I've talked to people that. Even though it's a novel, I wanna be clear. It's a novel. It's not, it's not nonfiction. It's, it was a way for me to frame up the story in a way that allowed me to draw some conclusions, um, and some, um, outcomes that I needed to get out of my system, right? As a writer and as just a human being, um, because of that loss. But for a lot of the people that I interact with, that. Know, talk about books. There are a lot of people that haven't published, but they do have stories on their computers, in their notebooks, like they're writing and they're finding ways to get their voice heard or get the, get the words out.
It's really that they just don't know the process. Mm. And so what I would say to those people is, number one, if you're someone who hasn't figured out a way to get the words out, then that's, you know, there are people out there, there are experts out there that can help you. But I, I tell people just sit down and put pen to paper. And even though I'm oversimplifying it, just write. Like you have to just start with writing words and putting yourself on a schedule and making the decision that the outcome that you can achieve is, greater than any excuse that you can make up in the interim to not do it right. Mm-hmm. So if the outcome is, Hey, I really wanna get this book published, I really wanna get my story written. But I'm tired today. Right? I had a long day. I don't feel like writing. Mm-hmm. You're allowing the, the, the short-term situation that you're in to kind of supersede the actual benefit that you can get to the out for the outcome. Right. The outcome is you wanna publish book. So one is, I think that's more functional in terms of, and that's more consistency and motivation and, and you know, people just, um, having their own requirements for themselves in terms of finishing something that they start.
So that's the writing piece. But for people that have already started writing and have their stories out there, they haven't found a way to, they just don't know what to do next. They don't know how to get it published. They don't know how to get it over the finish line. Um, what I would tell them is, first believe in what you've written because a lot of people, the, the fear of people laughing at them. Mm-hmm. Someone, you know, people not wanting to support them. Mm-hmm. Them feeling as though no one will care about what they've written. That keeps a lot of people from crossing that finish line. It keeps a lot of people from taking that next step. So I would say like for them, it's really partnering with somebody that can give them a little bit of that boost of motivation. Um, and provide some, so if you, if you're concerned that your story is not strong enough and what you've written isn't strong, then you need someone that's more of an expert in the space to kind of help you strengthen the story. Right. Get your story over the finish line. But a lot of it is fears, a lot of it is, you know, some people just, they don't have the motivation to make it through to that finish line, and some people do. And when you do, it's really just partnering with the experts to, to help you make it happen. I hope that answered the question in terms of like what people can do. 'cause people, there's so many different stages that people are in with books, right. And people write for, for a lot of different reasons and mm-hmm. For a lot of the, for most of the ones that we come across, The, the folks that have finished putting pens to paper and they're ready to publish, they always talk about this internal motivation. They talk about the fact that they just had to get their story out there. They had to help someone else or provide clarity to someone else.
There's this deeper purpose, and so I if, if, if you feel that way, you know, keep pushing, keep pushing that purpose out until you partner with the right person that can help you bring it to life in the marketplace.
LT: I think that's great advice right there.
DC: That's phenomenal. Um, advice, I have a couple of things I want to do in reaction to it, but, but Larry, did you have anything?
LT: Nope.
DC: Renita, you talked about motivation.
Renita Bryant: Mm-hmm.
DC: Like having the motivation to actually create a book, and then you also talked about fear and how fear can sometimes block one from going forward because you're fearful. Fearful of how people may respond to it.
Renita Bryant: Mm-hmm.
DC: Um, and then you talked about a purpose that may be inside of some folks where they feel like they had to write it.
They had to do this. And I tell my daughters, one of whom is, uh, a producer on this show and is listening to this podcast right now, um, that their gifts are not for them. Their gifts are for other people.
Renita Bryant: Exactly.
DC: That's what, that's, I've been telling them that since they were really little. And I'll use myself, uh, as an example. Um, I've written one book. I wrote that book because of my daughters, Hailey, Sydney, and Lauren. It was at a very difficult time in my life. Um, my former wife at that time, we had, um, we were separated. So it's, we first had a separation and later, um, we were divorced, but first separation. I did not know Renita if my, uh, wife and I would in some way reconcile and my daughters were very young. They were very young, and I was afraid. Uh, in my agony and I was actually living in the basement of, uh, my best friend, Jeff, who, you know, who's also producer here for this podcast and my business partner, and he and his wife and his family's home in the basement. I was in literal and figurative darkness and, uh, I was crying and I did not want my daughters to make some of the same mistakes that I made. So I started writing to them, advice from their father. That became a manuscript, which became a book. So I did not write that book for myself. I wrote that book for my daughters. So it is exactly in line with what you were saying. So Brand Nerds if there's something inside of you that you need to get out, don't do it for yourself. Do it for those whom you believe it will benefit once you get that out. So thank you very much, Renita for giving us some insight into that.
Renita Bryant: No problem. No, that's powerful. It's, that's powerful. It's,
DC: Thank you. Alright, uh, Renita, we have a sponsor on the podcast, uh, a sponsor that we think very highly of, and Larry does the read for, uh, our sponsor. So Larry, would you do the honors.
LT: Love to. So hey, Brand Nerds back here to talk to you about Specificity and Brand Nerds. We know many of you are immersed in digital marketing or simply involved in it. Either way, if you want to optimize your digital marketing to maximize results, we have the solution for you in 2021. An interesting thing happened that forever change the landscape of digital marketing. Apple's iOS update was structured to provide users the opportunity to opt out of ads. With more than 90% of users opting out. Android quickly followed suit with similar opt-out numbers. This situation created complete upheaval for the entire digital marketing infrastructure with engagement rates falling precipitously.
Now you know why you may be a 24 year old single dude playing your favorite game app on your phone, and all of a sudden you're being hit with an in-game ad for Pampers. Serious money down the drain. Here's where Specificity comes in to save the day. Specificity does not track or no user's personal data such as name, social security number, et cetera. Specificity uses device ID numbers similar to a VIN number on a car. So they track what users are doing without knowing their personally identifiable information, working in complete harmony with a post-privacy update. So now with Specificity, both the consumer and the advertiser are happy since consumers see digital ads that are relevant for them and advertisers serve ads to people that are receptive to the message.
So let's give a real life example of Jeff's old brand, Lunchables wanted to use Specificity they can serve ads to only parents. Not just any parent, they can dial into serving ads to only working parents of children six to 12. Additionally, if they wanted to, they could also not serve ads to any parents who are vegetarians or vegans who are consumers not likely prone to buy Lunchables. Bottom line is this would enable Lunchables to be incredibly efficient in serving them. Message. Only to those who would be most receptive and doing in a way that completely respects said consumer's privacy since they do not know or learn any personal information about these people, the bottom line is in 2023, we believe no one else out there can deliver better digital marketing results than Specificity.
We have introduced Specificity to many clients and everyone is super happy since in each client has been more successful with their digital marketing efforts than they were before. For more information on specificity, please visit the website at specificityinc.com. Again, specificityinc.com, that's S P C I F I C I T Y I N C.com. Their website is also on our show notes. If you wanna approve your digital marketing results, go check them out.
DC: Thank you, LT. Alright, Renita, we're going to what we call five questions. I ask a question, Larry asks a follow up, and we go back and forth until we reach number five. I'm curious, here you are as a, as a marketing person. Uh, you started as already has been covered with P&G early in your career, and I want to go back, I'd like you to think about the first branding experience you had, Renita, that that really captivated you, you were so into this brand or this experience that you didn't even realize how much time you were spending with it or how much money you were spending on it, or maybe your, uh, your family was spending on it. It was almost like a first love, but in this case a brand. What was that brand for you?
Renita Bryant: So it's interesting because then I think about, I think about that, right? I, I think about, okay, so it's interesting my a brand that comes to mind, especially when I was maybe around middle school age, going into high school.
And I think about it more so that it kind of changed my view of how something can make you be perceived. Right. How it can change perception of yourself and others. And so I thought about, um, I'm thinking about the Starter brand. I don't know that if you guys...
LT: Oh yeah.
DC: Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. I remember Starter jackets.
I remember that. Yeah.
Renita Bryant: Okay. So that,
LT: those were really big.
Renita Bryant: So that was the thing. So when I was in, when I was probably around middle, middle school, late middle school, I, um, my dad had two starter jackets and one was for the Miami Hurricanes. So it was the, the orange and green always been my, my colors, I guess, uh, DC So the orange, green, and white. So for the Miami Hurricanes. And then it was the Raiders. It was black, gray, and white. So, and they were the pullover type. I remember going to school one day, and these were my dads. I just wore them probably for comfort and was like, oh, I'll just wear this jacket.
And I wear the jacket and it gets a little bit of attention. It's like, oh, you know, especially from the boys. And not in a romantic kind of way. It was just almost like a cool factor, right? Like, oh, you have this Starter jacket, and these were, this is kind of at the beginning and they were getting more popular, right? And then when I came in the next week with the second starter jacket on, it changed. I realized that it changed the perception almost like, wow, my cool factor went up. And it was also like a, an assumption of like how my, a family wealth, like, oh, you guys must be doing very well because you not only have one, you had two of these jackets, right? And it, it, as for me, it was just from a comfort place. It was functional at first, but then I recognized how other people started perceiving me, my family, like the jackets that now it became the status symbol and that, so when you say it, I'm like, My brand experience. It was interesting because to me that was one of the first times that I realized how having this certain item causes other people to perceive you as a different way, re react to you and, and interact with you differently, but also it can have an effect on how you see yourself and you have to manage that.
DC: Ooh,
LT: that's so good.
DC: What a great, great thing. Alright, LT, what, what you thinking about this brother?
LT: Well, Renita, you've provided something. Quite honestly, we've had over a hundred episodes and we haven't had a conversation like this, so thank
DC: Not like this one. Not like this one.
Renita Bryant: Oh wow. Okay.
LT: I think there, there's so much in the example you provided for at a young age to per, to pick up on that perception.
DC: Yeah.
LT: Says so much about you. Right. So that's my first sort of thought. My follow up question to you is, once that perception, once you did pick up all that, you explained, how did that manifest? Did you wanna buy more starter jackets or did that, did that say, Hmm. The things I wear truly does represent me. So were you more conscious about brands and, and the way you're portraying yourself? Yeah. I think, does that make sense, that question?
Renita Bryant: It does. That's a, that's is, it's interesting 'cause as I'm thinking about it, un like, uh, high tech boots also became big. Oh yeah. Mm-hmm. And so what I did was, at one point I was starting to get wrapped up in, you know, what brands I have on and what other people may believe. Right. But my parents were totally, maybe my dad was more into it, but my mom was very anti brand. She didn't care. It was very, she was about cost effective living.
DC: Yeah. Mm-hmm.
Renita Bryant: And so, I remember thinking about all these things that were on trend and how I wanted to buy these things because of course I'm cool, right? I have these jackets. People are perceiving me a certain way. If I have these things, I'll be perceived a certain way. And I ended up having more conversations with my parents, especially my mom. And it was like, that doesn't matter. Like her focus was, get your grades, you can worry about that later. And I think some of that started to kind of bleed into how I was thinking. Like I was getting caught up in the material and she was so anti the material. And I thought about like, is this really who I wanna be? 'cause again, to be honest, I started thinking that I was not better than other people, but a little bit like, Hey, I'm better than people who don't have two jackets. Like if I'm being honest, right?
LT: Right.
Renita Bryant: I thought I was better by having these things. And so over time it started to feel inauthentic to me, though I'm not somebody who puts a lot of um, weight on material. Possessions. Mm. And so I, to, to answer your question, lt, it was almost like I needed to separate myself because if I kept going down that path, right, I was going to not recognize who I was. So it, so I didn't get the high tech boots. Like I started almost railing against the things that were on trend, right? You know, like, oh, I'm not gonna go on my senior trip. My parents will pay for it, but I'm not, I'm not gonna do that because it's costing them money that's unnecessary. I'm not gonna buy these. I've never had a pair of Jordans. Not that they're not amazing, but it was just certain things that I never even asked for because I felt like, I don't know if it's important. Like that's not what's important to me in my life right now. Right? And I don't wanna get so caught up in thinking that it is that I start making decisions that aren't helpful to me, and I'm starting to lose myself in that. And I, I've actually had a mentor as an adult say something similar about handbags. And I, I made a comment after I started getting some success as an entrepreneur, making a little bit of money. Mm-hmm. And I was around women that all had these designer bags. Right. And they, you know, they were wearing all these labels and I thought, I should get me one.
And I remember her saying to me, and she's somebody who had a, a bunch of them, but she was like, don't, don't start, like, don't take yourself down that path. And it, it kind of took me back to that Starter experience. Ah. It's like, don't get caught up in that because it's not authentic to who you are. You're gonna put too much weight on this material thing. Not that I don't like nice things, it's just I can No, no, no. My identity though. Right. It's not my identity.
LT: I think I'm so struck, like I said, with, and as you've expounded upon it further, even, like for someone at a, at a, a middle schooler to not only pick up on all those things because mo most middle schoolers pick up, oh, I have Jordan's. I'll wear them. I'm cool. But yours is much deeper than that because it got you to actually think about. Oh, what's going on here and how am I going to then take that in and what, how am I going to convey who I am going forward? Like consciously. Deep.
Renita Bryant: Yeah. Maybe it links to what I do now, like Right. With the market research company that you, DC and, and lt, you guys were saying in the intro about linking it together, being able to look back based on that Steve Jobs quote, because from that age, you know, I have been asking those deeper questions and trying to get down to the root of things.
DC: Yeah. No, uh, no Renita it's not, maybe, it's definitely, yeah, definitely a connection here. Uh, yep. Your example of the Starter jacket, classically and elegantly outline something that most people miss, and that's this, that which starts functional, can become emotional. That which starts functional can become emotional. That's what happened to you. Mm-hmm. You were not thinking about the Starter jacket as cool. You were not thinking about these colors as the vibrant colors. You were like, it's cold up in here. Exactly. I need to put on the jacket and then that functional comfort benefit. 'cause that's a benefit. Being warm is a functional benefit that then led to the emotional of, whoa, wait a minute. Now it's, it's kind of popping around here, kind of popping around here. Which leads me to three Cs that happen afterwards. One cool. People considered you to be cool. Mm-hmm. And you started kind of thinking a little bit at yourself. Uh, uh, Deandre Jordan, who is a basketball player, he used to play for the, uh, Los Angeles Clippers. And he was slamming the ball, all these different kind of ways. Uh, Renita when he, when Chris Paul was his point guard, They got off to a roaring start in the season and Deandre Jordan said, you know, I, I think we're kinda smelling ourselves a little, little bit here. So you, you, you cool. The second C is conversation. You had a conversation with your mother. Mm-hmm. And the third C is congruency. You then begin to think about what's congruent with my soul? What's congruent with my values? Yes. So I think that's super, super dope. LT, you wanna hit the next question?
LT: I sure do. So Renita, who has had or is having the most influence on your career?
Renita Bryant: So had, um, I would definitely say the first person that comes to mind, I know she's impacted my, especially the research business the most is, uh, Teneshia Jackson Warner. She's actually the CEO of the EGAMI Consulting Group based out of New York. Mm-hmm. And the impact that she had was, I didn't have, you know, a a a, a big portfolio of, of clients and experiences. Right. I was, I had P&G on my resume, Johnson and Johnson on my resume. I, I interned at Goldman Sachs and Oracle and, and different things, but I didn't necessarily have a bunch of clients on our roster as an entrepreneur. And, um, early on, Teneshia and her husband Mike, who's the COO of the company, took a chance and they had big, you know, big name clients, like P&G was actually one of their clients.
And so they have an advertising agency, and one of the things that they needed was the consumer insights portion. Right. They had these great creative ideas, but we understand in marketing, like you need to be able to actually validate that. You need to talk to consumers and understand what they need and what they're thinking.
Mm-hmm. And so you can come with a creative idea, but a, a brand is gonna say, okay, well what is this stemming from? Like, What's the insight here? Right. And they were missing the insight. And so, um, she, she saw the value and, you know, took us, took me along for the journey, took the company along. We grew, um, exponentially due to that relationship.
I mean, we were a part of, um, some major shakeups, like with the Aunt Jemima name change. We did, we did the, the research Site Set led wow sites program. Wow. Wow. That work. And so whether regardless of how people, you know, if they love it or, or don't love it, but yeah. Yeah. Yeah. The outcome of it. But yeah, we were doing the quals and the, and we were doing the studies and, and working with the leadership based on the work that, um, through the partnership and the relationship with EGAMI Consulting Group who had PepsiCo and Quaker, um, as a client. And so, I mean, there's, it's a lot of things you're seeing on TV and on shelves that we've impacted because of that relationship with Teneshia and EGAMI and she's just a great leader and she taught me so much. Um, and she also partnered me with another mentor that's Michelle G, who when I met her was a, a Senior Vice President at BET. And um, then she went on to be c CEO of Ebony and Jet and now she's a President of Byron Allen Group. Um, but Michelle was more like a big sister to me.
DC: This, I'm sorry, is this Michelle Garner?
Renita Bryant: Michelle, G Michelle, Thornton, G. Oh, okay. Okay. Alright, G. Okay. Alright, got it. Oh, keep going. I thought this G in. Yeah, go ahead. And she's, she's, she's phenomenal people. If you ever have a chance to talk to her meet, she's phenomenal. But I mean, she was someone that, so Teneshia gave the company that opportunity, but, um, Teneshia introduced me to Michelle and Michelle really for both of my businesses. Kind of just catapulted them as well, like in terms of openly, um, allowing me access to her network.
And so I, every time anybody ever asks me in any interview about anybody that's had influence or anybody that you know, and has significantly impacted me in business, Michelle's name's always gonna be mentioned. We published all three of her books, right? Like, she just always speaks my name in rooms even when I'm not there. Mm-hmm. Um, and she doesn't hesitate to support me. We're doing a venture together now. Like she's trying to make sure that not only is she securing her future, she's helping me secure mine and I value that. You know, she saw something in me years ago and, and she's made sure to tap into that and make sure other people know about that. And I appreciate that.
LT: Wow. Props to Teneshia and Michelle and, and props to you also for, you know, when you, when you find a mentor sometimes, uh, the mentor's right there and, and people don't take advantage of it. And so that, that's something that we, brand nerds. Make sure that you, you, not only when you, you have an opportunity to have a great mentor like Renita does, seize it.
DC: Mm-hmm.
Renita Bryant: Lemme tell you. So I'll tell you. Can I tell you guys what happened? Like how Michelle became
LT: Please!
Renita Bryant: Okay, so, so the, the, the reason that Michelle, the way that Michelle became a publishing client was because I did what you just said, Larry, in terms of seizing that moment. Teneshia was, um, connecting us for me to work with Michelle on a survey and she said, Hey, this is my friend.
I just need you to kind of do this work for her. I know you have a research company, you don't really do this, but can you put together like a just quick survey? She's trying to talk to women in leadership and in business about strategy. And so I, I, I worked with Michelle, did the survey. We talked a little bit, and then I recognized like she's doing this for a book.
So I asked the question, well who are you getting to publish it? Like, what are you doing next with this? Mm-hmm. And she said, I have no idea. Do you know what I should do? Do you know how I can publish it? And in that moment I said, I do, I have a publishing company because I was already set up and I was only publishing my books at the time.
I hadn't really opened it up to clients 'cause it was still so new. And she ended up saying, okay, I'll work with you. I trust you. Because we had just worked together for, you know, a couple of months on that survey. And that's how, I mean, again, she was a Senior Vice President at BET and she just, she was like, yep, let's do it. And, you know, she was speaking all over the country and she just opened up her network and, you know, we've worked together and that's, I, I seized upon that opportunity. You don't, you don't have a publisher. I can publish it. Let's do it. And we've been working together ever since.
LT: That's awesome.
Renita Bryant: Yeah. But I can, I can understand how people hesitate in those moments. 'cause you also don't wanna, you don't want to make the relationship look like you're the only one getting benefit from it.
LT: Right.
Renita Bryant: So people have to remind themselves what I would say to your Brand Nerds and just anyone listening is. The other person is still getting value. They're still extracting value too, right? Like she was getting her books published. She's still getting, you know, she has my ear, she has someone who understands consumer insights and publishing as an industry. But, you know, so I was getting value. Of course there was an exchange of funds. She's paying me to do this work, and also I'm learning from her as an executive, but I was also providing value. And I didn't, early on I didn't realize because I thought, I'm young, right? I'm, I'm new to some of these things. You know, what, could somebody at that level really learn from me? And I quickly recognized that we all have value, right? We all know something. We all have knowledge within us. And instead of holding that in and being so fearful of. You know that the other person's not going to derive any value from it. You'd be surprised at how many people are waiting for somebody to share with them. They're just wait. They don't, just because she's at that level doesn't mean she knows everything. And I've had a lot of, at this point, CEOs and executives say, you know, they want people to tell them the truth. They want people to push back and, and offer them insight because they're expected to know everything when they walk into a room and they realize they don't.
LT: Mm-hmm. Awesome.
Renita Bryant: Sorry, I went on a tangent there.
LT: No, this is, the podcast is about tangents. That was, that story is awesome.
DC: Yeah. Renita, you're doing what, what we need you to do and we're thankful that you're doing it. Right. Uh, back back to the story with, uh, Michelle G mm-hmm. This value exchange. Crucial. Crucial. Yeah. Yep. A lot of times Brand Nerds in the, in the whole mentor mentee game, mentees all want the same ment mentor. 'cause the mentors are typically very successful. Which means that they don't have time to be mentoring everyone. If they, if they were attempting to mentor everyone, they wouldn't be mentor material. 'cause they just don't, they just, they just doing other things in order to be successful at whatever they do. So when you do find yourself a mentor, find a way to be valuable to them. And that's what you did, uh, Renita. Mm-hmm. And the other thing is more than value Brand Nerds be worthy of trust. Mm-hmm. Because Renita just said what, what Michelle G said to you, Renita was, huh, I trust you. So let's give this a shot. Yeah. That trust is what opened the door for you all to do what you all have done in the, uh, in the area of publishing. So with that, I'll go to the next question. Okay. Alright. Renita, you've had a lot of successes. Many, many things have happened in this world, and you are either behind it or in front of it. And to all of that with the flowers that LT provided earlier. I say congratulations and salute. But this third question, I wanna know anything about those things, okay? I wanna know, Renita, I wanna know about your biggest F Up one that you made your thinking you were just wrong, just wrong, and you learned something from it. You made an F Up, and then what'd you learn from it?
LT: That's the key. What'd you learn from it?
DC: What'd you learn from it? Thank you, Larry.
Renita Bryant: Can it be a combination of F ups?
DC: Oh yeah, absolutely.
Renita Bryant: Because I, I've made the, I made the mistake multiple times. So let me, let me first say that. That's okay. So, uh, first thing is stop making the, the same mistake, Renita. Um, any, so even when I think about that, any, they all relate to hiring. So you know how they say you should hire slowly, but you've hire slow fire fast.
Yep. I was going the complete opposite for years. I was hiring quickly. I wanted, you know, I want my tribe to win, right? I wanted everybody on the team to win, and I was, I realized as a leader I was doing a disservice to the business, to the other person, to those people, to myself. And I'm thinking about one specific example too. Even though I've done this a couple of times. Is that I was, I was overpaying people that were underqualified. So they did X really well, and I thought and assumed, oh, you do X really well. Of course you'll do a Y very well. Of course that translates to Y. And so you can come into my business, right? Come into this company and I want you to do Y, and I'm gonna pay you probably twice as much as I would pay someone else that's competent and capable of doing, Y, because they've studied for it. But you're my friend. Right. And so I'm, I, I would, I would hire people quickly and just make that dec that rash decision. 'cause I just assumed that they could do the work. I was bringing them in too fast. I was paying them too much money. Um, and then I, I was finding myself stressed out because I was still having to do work that I shouldn't have been doing.
LT: Right.
Renita Bryant: Or having other team members having to do work that they shouldn't have been doing so they're stressed out. Um, and it was just not good for the business and it wasn't good for the person either, right? So I had relationships that, um, didn't work out and that, you know, I no longer have relationship with some of those people, unfortunately because of those types of situations. So I think the lesson for me was number one, slow down. Right? Slow down and really think about the impact of these decisions to the company from a financial standpoint to just the, the emotional, relational standpoint, right? Of you have a team and you're, that's messing with team dynamics when you bring people in that aren't capable and aren't competent and are gonna drain so much of the resources, right? Time, energy, and money. Um, So to me, I, like I said, I don't wanna get I, because it's human capital. I wanna say any one person. Yep. But I do see that I've made that, that mistake a, a couple of times. Um, and it just, it took me a while to realize what was happening. And when you, when you lose friendships and relationships off of that decision, you have to learn from it, right? Because you don't wanna go through life just continuing to lose people that matter to you because you're making rash decisions in business, right? You're, you're kind of graying that area of friendship and, um, of, of business. And so, I, I definitely don't wanna do that again.
LT: Oh, D, this is a good one, isn't it?
DC: Mm-hmm.
LT: This is a good one. So, Renita, thank you for sharing that. Uh, and what's interesting about this, you, we alluded to before that, uh, you with, uh, the first question, you came up with a completely original answer that we haven't heard in, in, in all the many podcasts. This one we've heard, a lot of times, and we can't keep hearing it enough, quite honestly. Yep. Uh, because it is something, and again, it pops to mind. DC you remember Ellen Stone who runs marketing for Bravo? Oh, yeah, yeah. Talked about this in a huge way. And, and Ellen went on to talk about how, um, there was one person in particular who was really good at what they did, but was a completely toxic from a human being standpoint to the whole team. And she did what you, she said, oh, the person's really valuable and, and she should have fired this person way earlier. And everybody on our team came to and said, what took you so long? Mm-hmm. Right. That's the fire fast part. And so this, what you've just talked about is so huge. Yeah. For everyone. Of course, it affects marketing folks, but affects everyone. It impacts everyone. So thank you for sharing that.
Renita Bryant: No problem. Yeah, I totally, you know, it's, it's one of those things that you, you, you hear about, you know, 'cause we've read a lot of books, right? Sure. We've read business books, we hear about it, I've heard interviews, but then not until you're in it, right?
And you realize like, oh, I am, am I paying someone, I'm just deciding to pay someone a hundred thousand dollars that I can pay someone $40,000 to do the same work. And it, like, it's, you realize like, what am I doing? Right? Like, not just the pay part, but also, like you said, the toxicity that you're creating within the environment. Because there are people who are doing their job and doing it well, but now they're feeling as though, you know, am I really valued? Because me being here doesn't seem to be as important as you keeping this person around that is draining the team's energy, right? And isn't doing their fair share, so to speak. So I, I think that's a great point.
DC: I'll simply say this, Renita and Larry, many of us in the, uh, hiring space, Have been seduced into thinking that bringing someone onto a team is like buying a fine bottle of wine. We think we're buying a fine bottle of wine, and the longer we keep it, so long as it's kept at the right temperature, it's going to get better. When the converse is true. Mm-hmm. Yep. It, when you, when you're doing a a, a, a human resource situation, it does not get better with time. It gets worse. It, it gets worse. Yep. I've learned it. It, it's like we all have, uh, Renita, we all have, and we, and we all still, uh, uh, many of us are still learning that, so It's okay. It's, oh, thank you.
Renita Bryant: Thank you. It's okay. I think that's one of the first things we have to learn is that perfectionism, like you don't have to be a perfectionist, right? No. Like, it's okay to get it wrong every now and then, you know.
DC: Not, not at all. Yeah, not at all. Larry,
LT: You know, Renita before I go to the next question, which I will do, um, the i, I've said this on the podcast a few times. Uh, I have, uh, somebody who I have great respect for Howard Moskowitz, who's a mar marketing research guru, by the way. And Howard used to say, don't let perfection get in the way of progress. So, mm-hmm. I think that's aptt. Here
DC: It is. Exactly. That's good when I forgot about that one there.
LT: Yeah. Okay. So, uh, Renita, regarding technology and marketing, can you tell us where you think marketers should lean in or best leverage tech? Or you can talk about areas you think that they should be leery about and avoid.
Renita Bryant: That's a, that's a good one. Um, I think even with, um, DC mentioning, uh, Chat GPT earlier, so on the publishing side of my world, right?
When I think about mind matters, and I think about where I sit, we're having a lot of conversations regarding technology and AI tools and how people need to think about it. Because, you know, you can have someone use Chat GPT to write a book, they put a nice cover on it, and then they start publishing it and they don't realize, you know, there are content integrity rules that are being established now that will kick that out and, you know, they can be banned from certain, uh, retailer sites. Um, but people are, people want to use technology, right, for efficiency's sake and for even accuracy's sake. In the example that DC gave earlier Chat GPT gave a much more accurate response. Mm-hmm. Um, so I think when I think about it on that side of the business, I'm like, it's, I think we're still trying to figure that out from a, from a regulation standpoint.
Um, and in terms of, you know, of course you can use it for social media and you should leverage it in order to streamline your process, make your life easy. I mean, you know, make life easier. I would say from a research standpoint with technology, both pre pandemic. We didn't really rely, like we, we thought that you had to be able to have human contact in person, right?
You like, in order to get real human emotions and get human insights, you had to stand in front of someone, ask them questions, learn from them, take a shopping trip with them, right? But then Covid changed all of that. I. And so I say when I think about technology and the impact to the business and, and ways that it's making it better, I think it's re is, is causing us to recognize that just like we're doing right now, we're not sitting in the same room, but we can still have a meaningful conversation.
LT: Right.
Renita Bryant: You know, using technology and it's recognizing that you can, you can decrease your cost, you know, your overall expenses, your team doesn't have to travel all over the world and you can still get to great deep learning without having to be right in front of someone. Um, so we're seeing that, we're leveraging that more in research. We're actually leveraging on the go being in the pocket of, of consumers, right? They have apps and technology where. You know, you can go shopping with people, people can take pictures and they can upload those pictures and give descriptions. They can do, uh, digital diaries. And so we're seeing technology more in the business, you know, both of the businesses that I'm in.
Um, but I would say, you know, I would tell people as marketers that lean into all of that technology, lean into being where consumers are, lean into, you know, where they want to give you their insight and their feedback, and they wanna tell you about their experiences, go to the experience with them, right? Be in their pocket. They're on their cell phone. Be on their phone. Um, and don't necessarily rely on the older, um, uh, more traditional ways of connecting with people, because those ways don't always create the level of engagement that they can. Uh, excuse me. That the new ways Can, I like that, that answer your question.
LT: Okay. Oh yeah. What do you think D?
Love the,
DC: uh, love the answer and the subject. Renita, I'm gonna, Revisit a, uh, former guest, uh, that we've had a recent former guest here on the podcast. His name is Abe Smith and he's Head of International for Zoom. And, uh, so he's in this space that you're talking about, uh, like for example, virtually being somewhere rather, rather than physically being somewhere when the pandemic hit. I thought that our business was going to be, uh, kaputt and our business partner, uh, Jeff, Jeff Shirley, went into the area of, uh, video conferencing and helped save what we did, uh, as a business that we used to always do on site by finding a way for us to do it virtually. And we have had very little degradation of experience with regard to the way we do our work virtually versus, uh, physically. And that technology has been like lifesaving to us. Like we are heavy, heavy Zoom users for this reason. So that's one thing to support what you said. But the other thing, so that's, that's the more functional, going back to what we talked about earlier, functional. Then there's an emotional part of this. So, uh, Abe mentioned the CEO of Zoom. Eric. Abe mentioned what Eric said during one of their meetings and one of the meetings they had a Zoom meeting. I, I, I presume, yeah. It was a Zoom meeting. He was like, are we doing the right thing? Like when we, if we look, we go 20 years out, when we look back, Have we have, we, are we doing the right thing? Did the decisions we're making in our business, are they the right things for humanity? Mm-hmm. And I think that's what's really important, and that's the connection I'm making to your answer. So thank you.
Renita Bryant: That's powerful. Because even as I hear that too, and I, I'm sure you guys went deeper into that, or, or when you were talking to Abe about, um, that conversation that they'd had, um, on the Zoom team, you know, even from a research standpoint, right?
We, we talk about human connection, we talk about even with younger generations being so disconnected Yeah. From other people, right. And, and you can sit in the same room and it's like we're talking through our phone or game and not necessarily having conversation anymore. Mm-hmm. And so, you know, that is a, it is a powerful thought to try to understand, you know, why technology with all of its great benefits and how it can make you more efficient and lower your cost as a business.
DC: Mm-hmm.
Renita Bryant: It causing us to not be able to connect. And I think we still can't connect functionally. Like, and, and not even just functionally, I'm saying functionally because of, I have a research company, so the function is the market research aspect or asking the questions and getting answers. But I do believe that nothing, I wanna just say this as just a human being.
I don't think any, anything from a technology standpoint comes close to having someone put their arm around you, right?
LT: Yeah.
Renita Bryant: Or you sitting in a space with someone talking to them, you know, you having an emotional moment and them putting their hand on top of yours or them looking at you in the eyes. And when you are, like you talked about DC when you were, you were, what caused you to write your book? Having someone be there with you to where you don't feel isolated and alone and, you know, in that space, um, really just alone with your thoughts, but have someone that can say, I see you, I hear you. I, I understand you. Do that right in your proximity. I think there's nothing that beats that. So technology is great. Love it with business, but also, you know, we do have to manage, manage some of those other things and, and value the, uh, level of connection that we can have with other people. And don't, don't, um, don't diminish that, you know, as much as we can.
DC: Mm. Good. Good. Larry, anymore, before I go to the final question,
LT: Let's do last question.
DC: Renita, what are you most proud of?
Renita Bryant: Ooh, I'm most proud of. Um, you know, it's, it is, I know this is gonna sound probably a little bit deeper than it needs to be, but in trying to build a business, I can try to build something. I am proud that I haven't lost myself while trying to build and create something from scratch, right?
DC: Mm-hmm.
Renita Bryant: You know, I'm, I'm proud that I've been able to help other people have a certain quality of life and, and, uh, pay for their, you know, support their families and do things that I, I didn't know I would be doing, you know, at a young age. But it's really, business can be tough, you know, even being in corporate America can be tough. And sometimes you, you question yourself, you question your, your own skills and abilities, but trying to build something from scratch on your own, um, is, is more than a notion. So the fact that I'm still standing and still saying, Hey, I still know who I am authentically and at my core. Um, and I haven't lost that in, in, in the world where a lot of times, you know, being inauthentic is what people want you to be. Um, that's, I'm proud of that. I'm still my mama's daughter and my daddy's daughter, and I love that.
LT: Oh, Renita. You are amazing. I, I have to tell you again, we haven't had an answer like that either. In the most proud section. We haven't. And what I'm struck with is that middle school girl wa knew who she was, and you've known who you are for your entire path. And for you to be really conscious of that and to build this really successful business, but not lose sight of that, that is an, that's something to be incredibly proud of. Because let's face it, there's been a lot of what the world sees as successful people, you know, the billionaires and whatnot. And they sure don't seem like they're grounded and, you know, at least from my vision, uh, uh, uh, have a, have a good view of, uh, of who they really are. They're into the ego stuff of it all. Um, like one Elon Musk, but that's a whole other story, right? Like, but, but, so you should be really proud of that. That's amazing.
Renita Bryant: Thank you. Thank you.
DC: Um, Renita, as Larry said, we've done a lot of these podcasts and, um, it's not very often that in one podcast there are multiple answers that we hear that are nothing like anything else. We've heard, heard. Very rare. Is it, is it in, in every segment you have offered something to the Brand Nerds and to me that's been like, whoa, okay. Hadn't thought about it like that before. Mm-hmm. Hadn't heard that before. So I'm, I'm just giddy 'cause I'm having a good time listening to you, sister and learning from you that this is, this is fantastic. Fantastic. Thank you.
Renita Bryant: No, thank you guys. Thank you. I'm, I'm enjoying this conversation like
LT: We are too.
Renita Bryant: You guys are making me think, you know, and it, it is, but I'm. Not, it is not that difficult. And I don't say that with ego. I say like, I, I feel like this is an environment where it's just like talk, you know, be yourself. Mm-hmm. Be open and, you know, so that's what I'm doing.
LT: Yes, you are. Mm. D, anything to add or should we
DC: Uh, no, none for me, brother. I'm good.
LT: Alright. So now, uh, Renita, we've, uh, we've hit you with the five questions. So now this is our next segment. So What's Popping? This is our chance to shout out, shout down, or simply air something happening in and around marketing today that we think is good fodder for discussion. And Renita, we know you've got something.
DC: What's, what's popping, Renita? What's popping?
Renita Bryant: Okay. Okay. So what, what I think is one of the things that's popping, um, especially over the last couple of days, has been the situation with Lizzo. So for any, any brand nerds who's not aware, Lizzo, um, there were, there are three dancers that have filed a lawsuit against Lizzo who said that they were, uh, sexually harassed, that they'd been fat shamed, and just a, a few other things, um, in the complaint, um, that they filed. And Lizzo,
LT: It's not good. Let's face it. Not good. The complaint is pretty bad.
DC: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Renita Bryant: With the details. And they actually did it. Two of them have done interviews. Maybe all three have done interviews at this point, detailing, you know, a little bit of what they were thinking, what they've experienced.
And so more of that is getting out. But, but Lizzo has issued a statement, um, uh, Saying that this is categorically false and that, you know, she's being, um, this is being, uh, what sensationalized and, you know, a lot of this is untrue. The dancers were fired for a lack of professionalism. So she's kind of giving her side of the story too, which we have to share.
I'm not, so, my, the reason I say this, what's popping is not necessarily to talk about whether or not Lizzo did this or didn't do this. Right. That's for the lawsuit and the courts to decide. Mm-hmm. It's really about the marketing piece, because the thing is, I thought about when I saw this story, I thought it, it crushed me because I'm a Lizzo fan and it was really about when they said the fat shaming piece and Right. The, I was like, Lizzo is all about body positivity. That is so incongruent with her positioning as a brand, almost right. As a human brand. It was crazy to me. What do you guys, so you guys are the, the brand experts as well. What do you think?
LT: Do you wanna take crack?
DC: No, you, you go ahead brother.
LT: It's so funny, Renita, that was exactly my first impression. Like, you know, she is led with, um, I'm gonna use a little, uh, y vernacular from, uh, being of Jewish heritage. She's not spelt, let's just put it that way, right? And, and she's been proud about that and that's really cool. And so for then this to happen, like you said, it's so incongruent with what she's done. And what I'm struck with is if I'm her or her, her folks around her, you gotta be cognizant of that. And again, if this did happen, it's awful. Let's, you know, I feel terrible for her dancers. But, um, no matter what happens, the last thing you want to do is for this to hit the light of day. Let's be honest, this is where if you understand your brand, you, even if you didn't do it again, like you said, we're not judging. We don't know what happened. You settled this and this, this doesn't hit the light of day, in my opinion, because of the, of what I can be, what I see is, can be really detrimental to her brand. So that's my thoughts.
DC: I'm in violent agreement. Larry, of all of the things that Lizzo is known for, we, we understand. She is an incredible mc. Yep. She is a singer. She can really sing, sing, sang, she's an actor. All of these things about Lizzo and what she does and her talent, they are undeniable. Individually and an aggregate. She is a powerhouse. Those are the functional things that Lizzo does. But the emotional thing that Lizzo does is she stands for a community that says if you're judged on anything, her thing happens to be, shaming a body like, nope, don't do that. But she has cascaded that to more broadly, all of us should be accepted no matter what we have going down and we should proudly be ourselves. Mm-hmm. That is Lizzo's brand. Yeah. That is it Singularly. So because of that, this thing cannot go on. It, it, it must end. I, I don't know what's going on with it. I don't know what's true and what's, what's false. But what I do know, and you're, this is why you bring it up, Renita, is every minute this thing continues Yep. Is chipping away at the Liz O brand, and she and her folks cannot have that. Yep. So, settle this thing, uh, uh, very quickly. Let me give an example. Um, uh, I have worked with many, uh, celebrities over the course of my career. I've been blessed. Um, I have, I am not, uh, uh, in any way enamored with celebrities. I have never, um, I have never done a, uh, an autograph. Never requested one. I have had one person, uh, ask for an autograph for me. I have had a person offer to give me an autograph, and I have asked for an autograph for another person. Those are the only three times that I have been involved in an autograph. The first time my mother asked this person to give me an autograph when I was a kid. The second time this person said to me, I want to give you an autograph. And the third time, I, I, I asked this person for an autograph to give to someone else. That person's Muhammad Ali. Okay? That's the only one. Muhammad Ali. And the person who I asked, uh, uh, um, uh, Muhammad to do an autograph for was for Kobe Bryant. Rest in power. Both of these men. Okay. Both of these men. Alright, so now, um, the brand of of Muhammad Ali is global humanitarian. That is his brand. That was his, that's why he was lighting up the, the, the torch in 1996 Olympics because he is the global humanitarian. No one will ever eclipse what that man was when he was on his planet or posthumously. There's only one Muhammad Ali. Now privately. Uh, when I, I happened to be with him, these are the things that I saw him do with my own eyes. We are walking through, um, uh, some public area. People start to swarm. Literally swarm the man. If he were not truly a global humanitarian, he quickly says to them, get outta here. Or his or his security. Does what happened with Mr. Victor Wembanyama and, and Brittany Spears his update, ah, get la Okay. That's not what happened. Muhammad stopped. Looked around, smiled. Now this man is sick. Now he's physically, uh, he's physically sick. He looks around, uh, Renita and Larry, and then he starts doing magic tricks for the crowd right in front of everybody. More and more crowds are gathering, okay? That's what he did. Second thing, uh, uh, we land at, uh, at the airport, uh, Charlie Brown Airport in, uh, here, in here in Atlanta. We are, we are in a, uh, motorcade going from the airport to Coca-Cola. And so as we're going, I'm noticing people start coming out of the, of the buildings onto the street like a parade. Why are they doing that? Because every time we stopped the limo, he would let his window down, look straight ahead, and, and, and people are like, what? And then he, he'd look over, ah, and then let it up. And people started calling other folks to say, Muhammad Ali is coming in. Okay. Uh, and then, and then last, last story about Muhammad Ali. Um, we were in an elevator myself, uh, his wife, Lonnie, um, his manager, um, um, um, Bernie Yuman, and his photographer, um, gosh, Howard Bingham. How? Yeah. Howard Bingham. So what the, the, the, the five of us are on an elevator, so we're going down and the champ is leaning against the, uh, the back of the, uh, elevator, like, like leaning down, kind of sitting down on the railing. His eyes are closed, and I could tell this brother's tired. He's, he's, he's tired. And so we know what's gonna happen when he comes off that elevator. 'cause everybody's gonna be on him. Ding the elevator's beginning to open and, and, um, this probably is more private than, um, the Ali family would, would like, but I'm gonna share it 'cause it's just about his strength. So what, what the, the people closest to him would do when it's showtime is they would click, they would click. That was that. Let him know, okay, it's showtime. So the clicking started doors open. He stands up and bolts out of the elevator. Okay. That's a global humanitarian. Yeah. If I'd seen him shouting at people, throwing shit at people, that kind of thing, I would've thought, oh man, this can never be known because that will com That will damage his brand. That's what Lizzo has gotta do now in this thing. Okay. I know I went, I know i d droned on there, but that's, that's,
LT: No, you didn't, that was a, I, I've heard parts of that story. I'm glad you shared the whole thing, D, that was awesome.
DC: Thank you.
Renita Bryant: Yeah, that was good. I mean, that was, yeah. 'cause I was waiting to your point, I didn't know if you were gonna go in a direction and say, oh, what we know about Muhammad Ali is, I know false. I know. I was like, please don't crush that. But I'm glad that what you actually communicated was No. What you saw on the outside of what you saw externally was actually what was happening behind the scenes. And you're right. So often that's not the case. Right. Unfortunately, it, you know, people have this persona because, so let's talk about that from a marketing standpoint. Sometimes we're, we're, you know, people are saying that they're told that you need to be a brand that has a positioning, right? Yeah. This needs to be what you stand for and when those things are inauthentic, okay, Larry, I get it. Now I'm going back to the middle school meeting. I see now how I'm, because it's always in my mind right when that's not authentically who you are. The problem is being, staying true to that. Yeah. Behind the scenes and in like, in front of the camera and behind, behind it. And again, I'm not saying Lizzo did these things. Yep. But I will say we didn't, if you don't hear, like for Muhammad Ali, it's not like we heard stories saying, Hey, he was in this, in this moment. Like behind the scenes people were saying he was throwing chairs and cussing people out. Right? Like it wasn't that we are hearing those things, which causes us to believe that what we were seeing was true. And when you start hearing those stories, to your point, Larry, you have to, you have to just go ahead and get rid of that, you know, in that quickly. Because if not, this is gonna damage a brand. And now she has products, you know, there's, there's the whole Itty that's associated with her and the whole body positivity and be who you are type of positioning as well.
LT: So, no, no, I'm, I'm struck with many people, especially a lot of younger Brand Nerds, you don't fall into the trap of really being too concerned about being right. Sometimes you can be right. And then you're so strident about wanting to convey that, that ultimately you hurt yourself. Yeah. So sometimes even if she didn't, whether she didn't do it or not, again, we're not, we're not judging that, but you've gotta be thinking of the bigger picture here. That's what the three of us are really saying. Yeah. And um, sometimes, uh, it is not about what's, whether you're right in that micro situation. It's what's best for your brand. That's what we're talking about here. Yeah.
DC: Let, lemme just say this one final thing about Muhammad Ali. You brought up this congruency, Renita between external brand and then, uh, internal who the human is and behind the scenes and, and whether that is in fact, uh, congruent or not. Muhammad Ali was even better privately than his brand publicly.
LT: Wow. And that's saying something,
Renita Bryant: Saying a lot.
DC: Yeah. He was even better. That's all I gotta say. Okay. Say, say less.
LT: That's, uh, I think that's a mic drop de for, uh, what's popping. And Renita, we, this is when we have such a great podcast with, with, uh, an incredible guest like you. I'm always bummed when we're at the show close here. Oh, yeah. And so, right. Yeah. So the show close the way this works, Renita, uh, I'll posit my learnings and, uh, DC will, uh, do his, he does an incredible job of, uh, of just pulling things all together. And then if you have some closing thoughts at the end, we'd love to hear those.
But here are my learnings. And, and, and, man, there were so many, but I've called them down to, uh, to five and a bonus to, to make Jeff happy. So number one, like Renita does the way you portray yourself, the question branders, does the way you portray yourself match who you really are? Ask yourself that question number two, like Renita did for Teneshia, you never know when, if you do a favor for a mentor, how that may help you like Renita did for Michelle, which led to some great things for Renita. And like Renita with Michelle. Don't be shy about asking questions to anyone. No one if, and if anybody gets mad at you for asking questions, you don't want to be around them anyway.
DC: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah.
LT: That's number three. Number four, as Renita learned, poor hiring decisions have exponential, unintended bad consequences. Mm-hmm. So truly listen to what Renita said in hire slow and fire fast. Yeah. Uh, . The fifth one is with tech lean, into where consumers are and here's the bonus ones, brand nerds, which I think is so just wraps up so much of who Renita is. So in all facets of your life, Brand Nerds be you. Those are mine.
DC: Those are great, Larry. Renita, I'm, I'm the father of three daughters, one of whom is listening right now because she helps to produce this podcast. Um, I'm going to ask my other two daughters, Lauren and Sydney to listen to this 'cause they need to hear you.
In fact, uh, for all of the Brand nerds out there, listen to this multiple times because yes, you are getting, you are getting jew-els that are, are, are rarely dropped, rarely dropped. So Renita as a, as a human and as a, uh, uh, and also as a Black person, um, I am incredibly proud of you. Incredibly proud of you and your journey and, um, and what you have built.
And what you have built. I'm incredibly proud of you. Uh, Oftentimes, uh, at the, at the end of the podcast, Renita, I make an attempt to describe the, the human in front of me. What is it that, the gift from my perspective, that they are bringing to the world. And most of the time, Renita. It takes until the very end for me to figure that out.
This is the first time we're in, the first five minutes it came to me. Wow. And then, and then the rest of it, of the time together, which has been marvelous. It has been a reinforcement. So allow me to do that, attempt to do that. Now on the question about, uh, what was your biggest F up during, what's popping?
You talked about this thing of, there's a saying, higher, higher, slow, and fire fast, and then you did the opposite. You hired fast and fired slow, and you said you've done this more than once. And then you talked about, uh, you, you, you, you, in some cases you would have a friend who's in this position. You need to make a move.
You were stressed. It wasn't good for the business. It wasn't good for them. And then you talked about not only from a business standpoint, but also from an emotional, relational standpoint. These were your words. My question is Renita, do you know why, why you at times hire fast and fire slow? This is a rhetorical question.
I'm going to attempt to tell you why. Why is it that you do that? So, in the first five minutes and been reinforced here is what I think is Renita Bryant's gift to the world. Who are you? Who are you? At your essence when you are giving something to the world, and I think you are an analytical searcher of the soul, an analytical searcher of the soul.
I say that Renita because you have the ability to quantitatively analyze as well as qualitatively analyze, and you are always seeking to go from the functional to the emotional. Okay? So this is what I think is your role. Second thing is your role in your gift allows you to see things that might be different.
They seem different Renita, but they're actually one. They seem like they're two things, but it's actually one thing. You can find that bridge and that is why. Functionally, when you were a kid in middle school, you put on that starter jacket and it seemed like it was one thing, functional. It ended up being two things, functional and emotional.
And through your conversation with your mother, you found congruency one thing. So this is the, this has been happening with you for a while now. Finally, uh, behind you is a picture, and it is a picture of the first book that you wrote called Yesterday's Mourning. And Mourning is spelled mourning as in I'm feeling mournful.
And this was a book that you said, uh, you did in order to, in some way cope with the passing of your, your mother and Brand Nerds, you may, you can't see, some of you all can't see this right now, but then on, on this book, Um, the image is of a woman's eye and a teardrop, and in this teardrop is a profile, and inside of the teardrop is a house.
And I suspect that this is the home that you shared with your mother. Okay. Got it. Okay, got it. All right. So what, what this, so this, this is a highly emotional thing, uh, for you, Renita, highly emotional, uh, thing for you, which then brings me to this. Um, how old did you say your mother was when she passed?
Renita Bryant: 42.
DC: 42.
LT: She was a baby?
DC: Yeah. Okay, so 42, and how old did you say you were when she passed?
Renita Bryant: 24.
DC: Right? That's, that's what I thought I heard. Okay. Stick with me here, Renita and Brand Nerds. Your mother gave you this gift. To see two things is one, and it, it was so much of a thing for her that when she passed away, she was saying, Renita, I'm 42 and you are 24. Flip 'em is one thing. Renita is one thing, and that is the gift that you are giving to the world, and we are better for it.
LT: How about that Renita?
Renita Bryant: I know, I don't, I'm like, I'm like, I need a second with, with that. Um, take your time. Don't start crying on this podcast. Um, because I'm also about to be 40, my mom's birthday is four days before mine in October, so I'm actually about to be 42. Oh, wow. Yeah. So even the, just the, the, the fact that you brought that to light DC and how you, how you actually put that just hit me. Like, it hit me my, in my spirit. Um, sure, I hear you. I receive what you're saying. I hear you. Um, thank you. Thank you. You're welcome.
DC: You're welcome. Keep using the gift, uh, Renita, uh, my encouragement to you. Make it bigger. Whatever's in your mind. Now that you are doing and you have done great things, make it bigger.
LT: Yes.
DC: Find two, two things that seem different, that are gigantic independently. You Renita, bring them together as one. Make 'em bigger. That's all.
LT: No limits.
DC: Yeah.
Renita Bryant: Oh my goodness. This has blessed me. Oh, my, I need, I needed this more than, yeah. Wow. I didn't expect this. Thank you. Thank you. Can I do this again next week?
Can we just keep doing, I just, maybe I just need to talk to you guys off, uh, outside of the podcast.
LT: Hey, Renita, all kidding aside, we have, um, we have some of our podcasts that are just what's Poppins that we did with you, and we'll bring back. So we're, we'll definitely bring you back for, uh, for what, for sure.
Renita Bryant: Perfect. Okay.
DC: A hundred percent.
Renita Bryant: Perfect. I need me some more of this. Yes. This is, this is, thank you so much. Wow. Wow.
LT: Any closing thoughts? Um, um, I, wow. Um, I think that the conversation has been amazing, but just
Renita Bryant: The, the questions, uh, you guys just talking to you, it felt very comfortable. Um, no, this has been, I told you, I already told you my closing statement. I need to come back. I need more of this in my life. This has, this has been great. Thank you. Thank you. I'm truly appreciative. Sincerely.
LT: Well, this was awesome. We loved having you and this is truly the, the show. Close that, uh, we'll segue to, uh, Brand Nerd, thanks for listening to Brands, Beats, & Bytes.
Recorded virtually on Zoom in a production of KZSU Stanford 90.1 FM radio and worldwide at kzsu.org. The executive producers are Jeff Shirley, Darryl "DC" Cobbin, Larry Taman, Hailey Cobbin, Jade Tate, and Tom Dioro.
DC: The pod fatha.
LT: That's him and if you are listening to us via podcast, it would be great if you can please rate and review us. Additionally, if you do like the show, please subscribe and share. We hope you enjoyed this podcast and we look forward to next time where we will have more insightful and enlightening talk about marketing.