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It takes 10 years sometimes to be an overnight success. Mhmm. And what I think the creative space is creating in terms of bad habits. People think one viral video is going to carry you forward. When reality, you can have a viral video, but you don't have a brand.
Speaker 1:We're here for Carey, for the kickback with Carey.
Speaker 2:I don't know if she's serious or not. This is all classic. I'm glad I got an action recording.
Speaker 3:I know. And I don't know.
Speaker 2:And I'm gonna post this. Like, I don't know if she's playing or not. But I'm not. Hello, everyone. And welcome to the kickback with Carrie podcast.
Speaker 2:I'm your host Carrie Henderson, and I'm super excited for my guest today. I have known her for over 10 years. We grew up as bloggers in our twenties, and now we're out here doing big things. So I'm excited for us to have a conversation. You will leave here laughing and taking some notes, and you will wanna book this person to help you with your marketing because she is the marketing guru on all of our socials.
Speaker 2:Welcome, Eva Pearson. Hi. Welcome to the podcast. Thank you for coming.
Speaker 1:You're welcome. I'll drive for you.
Speaker 2:I appreciate it. And I want you to know, you are my very first guest. Yes. I'm honored.
Speaker 1:I like to thank god of my mama for getting me into this position of being her first guest.
Speaker 2:You are my very first. So I'm honored you took the drive to come out here.
Speaker 1:Carrie, I will do the drive for you. Some folks I will zoom in and they might even get a phone call if we not that cool.
Speaker 2:Well, I appreciate you coming. First of all, I wanna give you your flowers because I saw that you won the Martech Awards for best boutique marketing agency in 2023 in DC. So congratulations to you. Thank you. I I was listen.
Speaker 2:I love your marketing. Was it marketing magic? Yeah. That you your breakdowns that you do on TikTok and Instagram? Because I was like, oh, that's good.
Speaker 2:That's good. So we're gonna talk about that. I know you work with creators, and you be dropping gems, especially the recent TikTok we both were in the comments talking about. But I wanna know, when did you fall in love with marketing?
Speaker 1:You know, we accidentally fell in love like Sierra and Russell. To be honest with you, I to take it back, I was always creative.
Speaker 2:Mhmm.
Speaker 1:Right? But as you know, like, you know, growing up, black or people of color, our creativity is looked at as a hobby. Right? It's not looked at as a career. So growing up, I thought I was gonna be a doctor.
Speaker 1:Like, I was determined. I was gonna be a doctor. I got my, scholarship for school for pre med. Got into school, saw blood for the first time, dropped.
Speaker 2:You were like, no thank you?
Speaker 1:No thank you.
Speaker 2:No thank you. I got it.
Speaker 1:And then, honestly, it kind of found me, like, I took an art history class in romanticism and impressionism. And I sat there in the class and it just the light bulb just turned on
Speaker 2:Mhmm.
Speaker 1:In that moment. And in that light bulb turning on, I was trying to figure out how do I blend this whole art history with, you know, the business side and creativity. So I created my own major. So I did a major. I know.
Speaker 1:Right? Like, mom was a little worried at first, but she graduated on time in 4 years. 4 years. I created, my major in advertising art and marketing. So I took a combo of art history, marketing, and art classes.
Speaker 1:And it wasn't until I directed my college's first ever, what was it, charity fashion show for the Black Student Union, that all of those things came together. I had to direct the photo shoots, I had to do the direct the visuals, do the marketing outreach to, like, different, HBCUs and also, different, like, clubs and organizations. And using that training really made me think, I love being a person behind the scenes who helped move those chest
Speaker 2:pieces forward. You
Speaker 1:know? Like, everyone thinks marketing folks wanna be in front of the camera. Let me tell you something.
Speaker 2:We don't.
Speaker 1:We we don't. Is that my camera? That's your camera. Okay. We don't unless we have
Speaker 2:to. Exactly.
Speaker 1:And a lot of times for those of us who love being behind the scenes, we like pushing others to be in front of it. And what I love about what I do with marketing and when I initially fell in love with it is I get to amplify other people's talent through my creativity and my strategic direction. Yeah. So yeah.
Speaker 2:But how do you since you like to be behind the scenes, how did it feel? Because we met on the blogging scene. And if you're a blogger, it was 2,009, 2,010, 2,011. That was like the sweet spot It was. When a lot of blogs were coming out.
Speaker 2:And so for someone who likes to be behind the scenes and if you were doing that in college, how did you get comfortable being a blog? Because not only are we writing on our platforms, you know, we were around when Instagram first launched.
Speaker 1:Oh my god. Them filters. My god.
Speaker 2:We're all made somewhere. So we're like posting outfit photos, doing all the things, going to all the blogger events in DC. So how did you get comfortable putting yourself out there? Because you even do that now Yeah. With the stuff that you share online.
Speaker 1:Yeah. To be honest with you, it takes a lot of effort for me to do that. Like, the energy I'm giving you right now, when the lights go off, I kinda go back into my regular mode, like, okay. And it's very surprising for people because, like, this is me being myself. But it's very hard for me to, like, put myself out there.
Speaker 1:So even when I do my TikToks, I have to, like,
Speaker 2:hype myself up. Are you introvert? I'm an introvert. Introvert. Yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah. So I do it because of my job. Yeah. But me on a day to day basis, no. Absolutely.
Speaker 1:You're like, but
Speaker 2:you're like, you can't do this all day every day.
Speaker 1:No. And even, like, being a blogger, I actually started my blog because I was having trouble finding a full time job in marketing. Mhmm.
Speaker 2:And
Speaker 1:so I was like, look, I can tell them I mean, I could show them better than I can tell them. So I started the blog to show that I can write, that I could be creative, that I understand different parts of the industry, and that really helped me move in that right space.
Speaker 2:Yeah. Yeah. So how do you bring because I okay. Because not only, I'm looking at both cameras. Both both.
Speaker 2:Not only is she the owner of her own company, Pink Doll House Marketing, but she is also marketing for the American Chemistry Society. Okay? And so how did you so when it comes to marketing, a lot of people think, if I need a marketing job, I wanna be, like, at a agency Oh my god. Or I wanna be at a entertain you know, I'm going with this question. Like, entertainment, you know, entertainment company or a big advertising company.
Speaker 2:So how did you find a position, you know, in chemistry? And what advice would you give someone looking because I know even when I was looking for marketing jobs in the beginning, it was always, like, a more creative space, but we forget everybody needs marketing.
Speaker 1:Mhmm. Mhmm. Honestly, again, the universe let me hold on. Let me give props to the universe and the ancestors. Okay.
Speaker 1:The universe always aligns me with where I'm supposed
Speaker 2:to be.
Speaker 1:And even with, like, my career, it seems very untraditional working in marketing from, like, starting, like, that fashion space now to working in chemistry. The job found me,
Speaker 2:to
Speaker 1:be honest. Like, I was searching on, I think it was LinkedIn
Speaker 2:Mhmm.
Speaker 1:And this position pops up. And I said, oh, okay. The American Chemical Society okay. I'm sorry. American ACS, the American Chemistry Society.
Speaker 1:I looked at the role, and I thought to myself, this could be something cool I could do. To be honest with you, Carrie, I thought I was gonna be bored out of my freaking mind. Because I was like, what do I know about chemistry?
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 1:First of all, I barely passed biology when I was pre med. Why do I even wanna care about this job? Right. And I have to say it's one of the best jobs I have ever had.
Speaker 2:And you look like you're having fun. I'm having so much fun. Because you post all the time when you guys are going to different conferences and different conventions. And I'm like, she having a ball with this in her position.
Speaker 1:So much fun. And honestly, I think for those who are looking for roles in marketing and comms, we have kinda broaden ourselves out for what we think are the sexy and the cool jobs. Because sometimes the jobs that don't seem sexy and cool on paper are the dopest jobs that you will ever have.
Speaker 2:Mhmm.
Speaker 1:Like, y'all y'all, hi. Chemistry, and let me break this down for you. Chemistry legit is life. Your nail polish, chemistry, your skin care, chemistry, your hair cares, chemistry. All the things that you love is chemistry down to photography.
Speaker 1:Chemistry is also photography as well, which is a campaign that I have coming up
Speaker 2:Mhmm.
Speaker 1:For, chemist celebrate Earth Week. And what I really realized by taking time to learn the industry I'm in, no matter what industry, I'm able to
Speaker 2:invest myself and find some common
Speaker 1:knowledge that I share I'm able to invest myself and find some common knowledge I share already that allows me to dive full deep into that field and really put my best self forward.
Speaker 2:So what I'm hearing is that everything you've done before Yeah. Has prepared you for where you are right now. So nothing is wasted. No. Nothing.
Speaker 2:Nothing is wasted. Because I think sometimes when we're going through certain situations, we're just like, now how am I gonna use this later? How is it gonna come back? Like, even blogging. Right?
Speaker 2:At the time, we're like, okay. We're doing blogging. We love it. But when you move away from that, you probably think, like, well, how am I ever gonna use that? I know personally, I'm like, oh, I had a newsletter because I was doing the blog.
Speaker 2:Mhmm. I didn't think I'd be writing a newsletter again, but here we are 10 plus years later, and I'm back to doing a newsletter again. Or you're back to posting things even on social. So we've seen the landscape of social change so much from when from when we started. And so even with social, we have to, like, integrate that, and we're using what we learned, you know, when we were first on the platform to now.
Speaker 2:And so I've heard you use the term before, sidepreneur. Do you still refer to yourself as a sidepreneur?
Speaker 1:You know, in a way I do. I am more picky now
Speaker 2:Okay.
Speaker 1:In the projects that I take on because my role in marketing has elevated so much. Like, I'm I'm a senior in my field. And being senior, I don't have the same amount of times I did before when I was, like, a coordinator to take on multiple projects.
Speaker 2:Gotcha.
Speaker 1:Now I take on maybe 1 to 2 projects a year.
Speaker 2:Gotcha.
Speaker 1:You know, I'm very picky. Kinda like how ain't it though?
Speaker 2:Because everybody ain't able. Okay. Only
Speaker 1:do it
Speaker 2:one way.
Speaker 1:Kinda like how, like, I look at and I admire people, like, I know I say I love Beyonce, but I really do love Beyonce. But I admire people like Beyonce who don't just do something just to do it. Mhmm. And that's how I look at my business. Like, even down to my podcast, I wanna make sure whatever I'm putting out there represents me to the fullest.
Speaker 1:Mhmm. And it's not just some half ass work I just slap together just to get some downloads or some views, like, I don't give a fuck. Alright. I know some of y'all wanna sit up there and be, like, you gotta post everyday to stay relevant.
Speaker 2:I don't You do not.
Speaker 1:I don't give a lie.
Speaker 2:You do not.
Speaker 1:To be honest with you, Carrie, and this is why I also admire about you as well. We post content that is relevant to us Yes. That's relevant to our audience, but I also make sure that we're not just posting just to post.
Speaker 2:Absolutely. We're very intentional.
Speaker 1:We are intentional.
Speaker 2:Very intentional.
Speaker 1:And when I look at myself as a sidepreneur, I think about the products I wanna take on and being intentional about being able to give my full self to those projects. Because a lot of times, Carrie, I'm working with, small business owners
Speaker 2:and
Speaker 1:this is why I specify in small business owners, people of color, minority or women owned businesses. They cannot hire a me full time.
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 1:You know, and so when I take these products on, I'm taking on their products that they have poured, their heart, their soul, and their money into. So why am I gonna be a half ass person and just saying, okay, I have 5 clients on my roster, I just want to check. I'll rather take one check and take my time to really dive into what they're doing and to make sure I'm giving them the best results.
Speaker 2:I love that. And so let's talk a little bit about Pinkdoll House. Okay. Okay. So you started in 2017.
Speaker 2:What inspired you to say, hey, you know what? I am in the marketing space Mhmm. Full time, but I also wanna create something on my own.
Speaker 1:I honestly turned my blog into a business because Pink Dollhouse was my blog. Mhmm. And then I noticed that I started getting a lot more requests from, like, nonprofits to be like, hey. Can you help us with this? Can you help us with that?
Speaker 1:And one thing I'll do is money under the table. No. So I actually created my LLC Yes. Legally.
Speaker 2:She's like, she's a legit business.
Speaker 1:Legit. Legit. Legit. Business. Alright.
Speaker 1:They take my money. Right. But, I started the LLC and I had no guideline for that either. But I knew by me starting my business, anything I buy from a computer to a, like, a camera, whatever, is a tax write off.
Speaker 2:Hello.
Speaker 1:And so
Speaker 2:She's giving all the keys right here. I just want y'all to know that, like, you dropping the you dropping the keys. Okay? So what's what's that girl on 6th? Did you catch it?
Speaker 1:Yeah. Catch it. Catch it. And so, like, by doing, like, starting Pink Dollhouse, I wanted to be able to give the knowledge that I have in these corporate spaces to small minority owned businesses, who no shade, no foul, are being told by these experts online, this is what you have to do. This is what you should be doing.
Speaker 1:And a lot of time, these experts don't have the educational background or have the experience to know what they're actually doing. Like, yeah. That's why.
Speaker 2:So so that point, what should, you know, nonprofits I know you also work with creators. Be looking for marketers because these days, everybody and their mom is a marketer. If you have a large social media account, if you have a large following, you can be a marketing expert. And so and it kinda unfortunately dilutes the industry with people like you
Speaker 1:Preach.
Speaker 2:Who have been doing this work for so long and legitimately wants to help people Mhmm. You know, get their brand voice out there and help them be a great business. So what should somebody what are some things people should be looking for to make sure they're working with someone legit and someone who's just not out here trying to take their money?
Speaker 1:Yeah. That's a great question. Honestly, look for someone who doesn't automatically give you a quick fix.
Speaker 2:Okay.
Speaker 1:A lot of times I do consultation calls. Like, you know, forms are great. I use them as a building block to figure out what the framework of our conversation is. And just have an honest conversation about, okay, you have this business. Why do you feel that you need someone to come in for marketing right now?
Speaker 1:And allow them to talk. And while they're talking, take notes. And then notes don't have to be perfect. But start, when you take your notes, start circling key areas that you notice are coming out repeatedly.
Speaker 2:Mhmm.
Speaker 1:Like, if they're saying, like, oh, no one is paying attention to our content. That might be not just a content thing, but that might be how are you posting? What, campaign copy are you using? What hashtags are you using? What is your voice, essentially?
Speaker 1:And a lot of times, marketers who are new in the space, let me be nice about this, focus solely on the content, but they don't focus on the voice. Yes. And marketers who are actually good at what they do can adjust their voice for different audiences. I can speak in the chemistry field. I can also speak in the creativity field, etcetera.
Speaker 1:Also look for someone who, when they're talking to you, don't just think of social media as the end all be all. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Say that again, please.
Speaker 1:This is Yvonne moment. Don't just look at social media as the end all be all solution for your marketing.
Speaker 2:Thank you.
Speaker 1:Right? Marketing, to me, you had to pull every lever possible to move the needle forward once. You have to get in front of your audience 7 times. 7 times in order for someone to pay attention.
Speaker 2:Mhmm.
Speaker 1:And a lot of times people focus solely on social media thinking that if they do this post, if they put, like, $300 behind it, it's gonna get a bunch of people to do what you want them to do. It won't. So you need to ask them, hey, besides social, how else are you talking to your audience? What else are you doing? And another thing that marketers have to be mindful of is the comfort of the business owner to put themselves in front of the camera.
Speaker 2:I agree a 100%. Because I work with a client on the coaching consulting side, and we he go well, now we record the videos. But before I was having him going live every single week, like, he literally is the face of the brand. And one thing I always tell people too to your point is do not rely solely on social media. Because when those algorithms go down as they have Yes.
Speaker 2:Multiple times Yes. How you gonna communicate with your audience?
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 2:Do you have an email list? Do you have a text message list? Do you have another way? Do you have a website that is SEO, you know, functioning so that people can still find you? So I love that you said that because social media is not the end all be all.
Speaker 1:It's not. And we also forget depending on what your area of marketing is. For example, I just finished working with a festival here in the DMV. And one of the areas that I brought up for opportunity for next year is have you thought about buying a billboard? And a lot of times people forget the old school ways
Speaker 2:still work Yes.
Speaker 1:For a reason. Mhmm. So things like billboard to me are like low, investment ways to have higher impact. A billboard, why you cannot track exactly the clicks, you can get an estimate of how many cars go by per day who may see that billboard and the, return on investment or ROI that that can create.
Speaker 2:That is true. Because they use billboards all the time in LA. They do. When I was looking out there, I'm like, everything if you think about it, every time a movie is coming out, every time a new show is coming out, the big and it's a big deal if you had a billboard. If you're an actor or actress, the first thing they do is try to find their billboard Yep.
Speaker 2:And take a picture in front of it. So it does still work It does. To your point. And so you work with nonprofits. You also work with creators.
Speaker 2:Mhmm. And the creator landscape has changed me as well. So what is some advice would you give to someone who was starting out in the creator space? Because now content creation is becoming, like, a moneymaker for a lot of people. And I actually saw someone post recently, like, you know, a lot of people are wanting to quit their full time job to become a content creator full time, and they were like, don't do that.
Speaker 2:You make this temporary money to build a business. Mhmm. So because you've been in this space, and I know you've seen a lot of good things and bad things, and I know you have an opinion about them both.
Speaker 1:Oh, I gotta pay you.
Speaker 2:What advice would you give to someone in this creator space, you know, that wants to build a brand online?
Speaker 1:Yeah. I'm gonna use 2 examples. The first one I'm gonna use is, Kev on stage. Mhmm. Love KevOnStage.
Speaker 2:Too.
Speaker 1:I love his wife too, Melissa. I listen to her podcast with her sister. And then, I'm gonna also use a smaller content creator who is my put and pop, Jasmine Katrina.
Speaker 2:Okay.
Speaker 1:Or Jasmine Smith is her good nickname. One thing about Kevin on stage I love is Kev was consistent.
Speaker 2:For 10 over 10 years.
Speaker 1:For over 10 years. Say that one more time.
Speaker 2:Over 10 years.
Speaker 1:Over 10 years. It takes 10 years sometimes to be an overnight success.
Speaker 2:Mhmm.
Speaker 1:And what I think the creative space is creating in terms of bad habits, people think one viral video is going to carry you forward. When reality, you can have a viral video, but you don't have a brand.
Speaker 2:That's true.
Speaker 1:People, like, for example, I went viral recently, which I did not.
Speaker 2:I saw that.
Speaker 1:Yes. I did not see
Speaker 2:that. I saw that.
Speaker 1:But in that viral video, I had to make it clear to those new followers, hey, thank you for following me, but this is actually the content that I create. I'm not gonna be out here doing this, you know, all Every time. Yeah. But sometimes what people are looking at being content creators, they're trying to do every single different type of video to find what sticks to make them famous. But that may not be true to you.
Speaker 1:Mhmm. And people can smell, like, someone who's being inauthentic or being, like, bullshitting them a mile away.
Speaker 2:Yes. People are very smart these days. Like, they're not falling for the okeydoke that people used to fall for. Like, that is out the window.
Speaker 1:No. So KevOnStage, what he has done very well is he started out as a comedian. Mhmm.
Speaker 2:And
Speaker 1:then from there and y'all, I'm gonna be honest with you. You can use your base platform to evolve your brand.
Speaker 2:Yes.
Speaker 1:KevOnStage started as a comedian. Then he created an app for other content creators. Then he had also the YouTube channel. Then he had the, the church tours that turned into other comedy tours like the Ball Brothers. Mhmm.
Speaker 1:He also had the social distance tour. And he's
Speaker 2:on and he's on the one with all women comedians. That's all the comedians.
Speaker 1:Then he took that brand and expounded even further. He noticed his wife was getting a lot of attention on social. So now missus Kevin on stage, which was brilliant, and using that as her handle, now she has a podcast with her sister. And the brand is evolving, but the base was Kev being a comedian. He found his base and he built on it.
Speaker 1:He didn't just start as comedian to DIY to this, to this, to this, to this, and then, oh, this one popped off. This is this is now my lane. He stuck to his lane and evolved from there. That's what I think a lot of creators have to accept. If this is your lane and you are naturally good at it, it's okay to stick to it.
Speaker 1:Just because you only got 500 views, girl, you better applaud yourself in the
Speaker 2:500 views. Because in real life, 500 people looking at yourself is a lot.
Speaker 1:Hello?
Speaker 2:Even 10 people. Because people be like, oh, I only had 10 likes, but do you get in front of 10 people on a regular basis?
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:So you gotta put things in perspective.
Speaker 1:And another thing I wanna mention too, the other example I brought up Jasmine Smith, my put and pop. I've known Jasmine since her before her, like, really blogging days.
Speaker 2:Mhmm.
Speaker 1:And to see her evolve as now a content creator on YouTube who has built a community space on TikTok. Jasmine didn't start out with, like, a bajillion followers. She started out with, like, maybe 10 subscribers to her YouTube channel, but the girl was consistent. Mhmm. And she found her lane which, talks about, like, her love of makeup, fashion, and faith.
Speaker 1:She found her lane. She found her audience. And now is getting more brand opportunities because she is being authentic. And consistency. And consistency.
Speaker 2:Key word is consistency.
Speaker 1:And and also too, Cara, and other people forget, you don't have to just be consistent on one platform.
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 1:Like social media is really great. But if you wanna be consistent in terms of maybe your podcast or consistent maybe in, like, you know, doing speaking engagements or, you know, in person interactions. That's okay too. Social media doesn't have to be the only way that you broadcast yourself.
Speaker 2:I agree. I I'm so glad you said that. Because I think I think we've gotten this, not even generation, just a culturally, we've gotten so consumed with social media be end all be all that people forget, like, there are people building businesses off this platform. Like, they are never on social media, and they are $1,000,000 businesses, or they or you only see a tenth of all the things that they're doing on the platform. Exactly.
Speaker 2:Like, you only see but that people can think that's all of it. I'm like, no. You only see a snippet. So when it comes to creators, though, because you brought you mentioned, you know, brand sponsorships, and I know that's one thing a lot of us Yeah. Would like to have.
Speaker 2:Right? Like, if we're doing a podcast, if you're doing social media content, even if you have an email list
Speaker 1:Mhmm.
Speaker 2:You wanna get brand sponsorships to grow to as a, you know, way to make money. So what advice would you give to us creators out here who are looking to tap into brand sponsorships? Listen, you the marketing guru. So I'm asking all the I'm asking for the people and I'm asking for myself. No.
Speaker 2:It's okay. I
Speaker 1:think one thing we forget is, you you miss a 100% of the shots you do not take. So it's one thing to shoot your shot. I would recommend putting together a template email, right Okay. Of then this is just at the base of just regular copy, pitching the why, the how, and the possible results.
Speaker 2:Okay.
Speaker 1:So the why. Why should we partner with you? How do how do I align with your brand? The how. How am I gonna put that out there on the channels?
Speaker 1:Is it gonna be via social media, my podcast? You know, how is this gonna be done? And then the results. What am I gonna share with you as proof of performance? For those who do not know, proof of performance means you actually did the work.
Speaker 1:Now you just took the stuff and ran. Proof of performance is like, hey. These are the links to the post in which I mentioned your, your business or your brand. And then here's a package up so you can repurpose it however you want to. That's just at the baseline.
Speaker 1:At the higher level, I would repress recommend having a media kit. Okay. A media kit takes out why, the how, and the results, and it takes it even further. And it's about roughly and I'm not PR, so I'm not gonna, cap you with that. But it's about roughly 4 ish pages Mhmm.
Speaker 1:Of high level, who is Carrie, what does Carrie do, what are Carrie's numbers, and what are Carrie's areas of specialty. And you can patch that up and have it with your, pitch email and then say in the link below, here is, my media kit and it also outlines your rates or what you're looking for. Yeah. So for some creators, they think because they only have 300 followers, they can't get paid. Guess what?
Speaker 1:You can.
Speaker 2:Oh, then let me go send some emails then. Because I've got more than 300. Girl, go ahead and send some emails. I got over 2,000. Let me send some emails.
Speaker 2:Go ahead and send some emails.
Speaker 1:And then I'm a huge believer of sliding into people's DM's.
Speaker 2:Uh-huh.
Speaker 1:I will, you know, go
Speaker 2:ahead and slide to the
Speaker 1:DM to try to figure out, like, you know, what can we do to partner together? Like, honestly, there are times, like, when I slid into DMs, nothing I was gonna get a response at, but a boom, got one. Yeah. So I think having a template email that is clean, please check your grandma.
Speaker 2:Grammarly? Is it Grammarly the
Speaker 1:It's Grammarly. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Grammarly. Install Grammarly on your computer. It is a lifesaver.
Speaker 1:Grammarly. Another thing too, having that template email saved and having it possibly for different audiences. Right? So you have one maybe for, like, brand or product partnerships.
Speaker 2:Okay.
Speaker 1:Then you have one for maybe, like, conferences. Like, if you wanna do a speaking engagement or something like that. And then maybe you have one just for, you know, if you wanna attend, like, a a big, like, premier or event. Like, different audiences need different things. Another thing you could do too is not just reaching out to the brand, but finding out who their marketing or PR contact is.
Speaker 1:LinkedIn is your friend.
Speaker 2:It is.
Speaker 1:If you want to, you could go on the website and you can find out who the standard email is. It's probably like marketing at blah blah blah dot com. But if you take it a step further, go in and hit that LinkedIn because if you type in the company, it'll pull up every person who works there. Mhmm. And you could find out if they're open to, like, you know, reaching out or something like that.
Speaker 1:And you can reach out to them that way too.
Speaker 2:Oh, well, listen. I'm a take
Speaker 1:these notes.
Speaker 2:I got, like, I got homework to
Speaker 1:do this fall. We all got homework.
Speaker 2:Girl, the list the list is always long. I'm like, was there something there's always something to do. Yes. Always. Yes.
Speaker 2:And so one of the things I love that you do on socials is your marketing magic. Oh, yeah. I love the breakdown. So you've done Usher.
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 2:Of course, you did Beyonce. I did. Did you do Rihanna? No. Who what's that for?
Speaker 2:Why not?
Speaker 1:I'll tell you later.
Speaker 2:Okay. Okay. Right. I'm gonna put that in my chest. I'm like, is that a is that a offline conversation?
Speaker 1:It's I can say it I can say it out loud.
Speaker 2:Oh, why
Speaker 1:don't why would you wanna prefer? Rihanna, it started to become the Kim Kardashian effect for
Speaker 2:me. Gotcha.
Speaker 1:There's too many products.
Speaker 2:But I feel like they're all aligned though because it's the beauty They are. Skin yes. Beauty skin hair.
Speaker 1:Yes. To me, it's they're all online, but after a while, it's like, now she has the the Fenty hair.
Speaker 2:Yes.
Speaker 1:Right? And in my opinion, I didn't see a full rollout for that. I saw the teasers, but I didn't see the consistency
Speaker 2:Of the rollout.
Speaker 1:Of the rollout. So I think what Riri does well is she uses her platform to get people to buy the products. But then after that, we don't see a consistent rollouts on that end.
Speaker 2:Do you feel that way about Beyonce and her products? I'm curious. As a Beyonce fan.
Speaker 1:I I feel with Sacred, she got it right.
Speaker 2:I feel like she got it right with Sacred too because we saw it after it was launched.
Speaker 1:Yes. She got it right with Sacred with with Sierra Noir or the fragrance. I have I have I
Speaker 2:haven't seen it after.
Speaker 1:She didn't get it right from me.
Speaker 2:Okay. I didn't because I've, does she even have the fragrance still?
Speaker 1:She she does. She's only online, but I haven't seen anything really with that. But Sacred, she got right. I agree. I do.
Speaker 1:But I think that her as a person, she's a smart businesswoman, but I don't think b feels very comfortable being in front of the camera, which is where the connectivity may lack Yeah. For some audiences. But Sacred was done correctly because mama Tina was also involved, and her being a hairstylist and they leveraged that knowledge
Speaker 2:Mhmm.
Speaker 1:To really push the brand. That's just my opinion.
Speaker 2:Maybe that's why I decided to buy it. Yeah. That's right. I was
Speaker 1:like, mama Tina in it? Maybe that's why.
Speaker 2:And then I like because then they had other people that they were she would be in the salon with and doing it. And I was like, well, maybe I shouldn't give it a try. Mhmm. Who else do you think has done has had a marketing magic moment that has been really good?
Speaker 1:You know, not to get too political. Can can we do it? Yeah. We can do it. Listen.
Speaker 1:VP, auntie ComCom.
Speaker 2:Mhmm. Well, I mean, you didn't you did your video about her went viral. So yes, we can talk about it.
Speaker 1:But I really wanna do a marketing magic about this so well. I think because it because I could
Speaker 2:tell you right now when that video dropped, I
Speaker 1:said, oh, am I getting shoes?
Speaker 2:And then freedom was playing in the background. I said, oh, and she got the and she got the sign I was like, yeah. She got the sign off on the song. And so this is so good. Give I'm like, give their marketing person a raise.
Speaker 1:Oh my gosh. Like, the content is giving for me. Like, VP Auntie Com Com. I know I know her name is Kamala. Alright.
Speaker 1:But VP Auntie Com Com, whoever she got on her team, the way that they're doing these videos I agree.
Speaker 2:The way that they
Speaker 1:are breaking it down to relatable kinda like language that's not using political jargon all the time. It works so well.
Speaker 2:They're getting at the emotion.
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 2:They are getting at the emotion, and that's the feeling I don't think we have felt in a is to be honest, I was like, this is giving me Obama error. Same. Because when Michelle Obama was talking about, you know, there's this feeling that, you know, that's familiar that we haven't had about. I was like, oh, just come out and say it.
Speaker 1:Just say it's your husband.
Speaker 2:It's your husband's. It was that same era. It was so when I saw that video, I said, oh, I'm feeling like, I feel something.
Speaker 1:I legit was like, you know, you know how you get that feeling in that throat and you try to, like, keep it together? Because I was like, between me, it look feel like yours is no fun. I I'm with freedom. I feel it. I feel like
Speaker 2:and then
Speaker 1:when she dropped that video talking about how her mom as a single parent Mhmm. They lived in apartments and that she her mom saved us about a house. I felt that to my core because, like, my mom did the same thing, single parent. Yep. And she waited until I was finished with college to buy her home, but she was, like, progressively making those steps.
Speaker 1:Like, it's the relatability and the storytelling that they're doing that is so good. But TikTok could be a very divisive space. I've kinda, like, stayed away from that one a bit. But I would say VP, auntie Com Coms.
Speaker 2:Her team is her team is
Speaker 1:They're give the Coms team a raise.
Speaker 2:They deserve it. They just They definitely deserve it.
Speaker 1:And y'all mixing GIFs too? How how, Sway? Like, y'all just this is some of the best Because that I have seen.
Speaker 2:Because you know the team is millennials and Gen Z. That's why. Because that's all we that's how we all communicate.
Speaker 1:Did you see the one she did with Lance Bass?
Speaker 2:I haven't seen that one.
Speaker 1:So Lance Bass said, something about what are we gonna do on election day? We're gonna make, you know, Trump go Doesn't
Speaker 2:say bye bye bye.
Speaker 1:And if she came on camera, she went,
Speaker 2:bye bye bye. So they're definitely speaking
Speaker 1:to us with that one.
Speaker 2:They are. They're definitely speaking to us with that. Well, no. I have now I have to go find that one.
Speaker 1:It's one of my favorites. Because I
Speaker 2:haven't seen that one.
Speaker 1:She got on TikTok just because we bully well, not bullied her. We we convince auntie v pcomcom to get
Speaker 2:on TikTok.
Speaker 1:To though. You do. You do.
Speaker 2:Like, if you wanna reach the next generation, you have to be where they are. You have to meet people, and you're gonna be marketing and reading your audience. You have to meet them where they are. So if they're on TikTok, you need to be on TikTok.
Speaker 1:TikTok is one of my honestly, learning something, one of my favorite platforms. But getting into, like, TV show watching, it'll always be Twitter. I'm not calling it x. It'll always be Twitter for me.
Speaker 2:It's Twitter. I have a I yeah. I was on Twitter actually last night watching something, and then sometimes I'm like, I just wanna deactivate my account because it's a cesspool of Same. Foolishness.
Speaker 1:Same. Twitter is like that one cousin who comes to the cookout
Speaker 2:Is a mess.
Speaker 1:Who's a mess, but you love them. You know, you let them sit with you at the table. You may put your purse in the trunk because you don't know. You know? You know what I'm saying?
Speaker 1:You you ain't put your purse in the trunk,
Speaker 2:but you love your best. Are you speaking from personal experience?
Speaker 1:I ain't calling nobody else today.
Speaker 2:Wait. Because that sounded a little personal.
Speaker 1:I ain't calling nobody else today. You're more producer behind you. It's cracking up.
Speaker 2:It's he's trying to be quiet right now. He's trying real hard. He's trying real hard to be quiet right now. But getting back to your point,
Speaker 1:in terms of campaigns, I think that being done very well, I would say the Olympics did a great job.
Speaker 2:Yes. I loved it.
Speaker 1:The Olympics did awesome. And then also, I've seen some really great, beauty campaigns recently that are incorporating AI
Speaker 2:Mhmm.
Speaker 1:Into what they're doing. And I have a love hate relationship with AI.
Speaker 2:How do you feel about using AI for marketing?
Speaker 1:I have a love
Speaker 2:hate relationship with AI.
Speaker 1:I think there's nothing wrong with AI as long as you're being ethical about
Speaker 2:it.
Speaker 1:And I think and I have had this discussion. I think in the marketing field, there's gonna be a new lane built that merges legal and AI together because legal legal and marketing together because there's going to be someone who wants to use AI, but there's gonna need to be checks and balances for how it's used. Like, language, I know everyone wants to use AAVE.
Speaker 2:But they can't.
Speaker 1:But you can't. And then also, like, how are people's images being used? Like, this whole transfusion of people's faces over other videos or fake videos that are not real. Like, someone from marketing is gonna need to be the checks and balances behind these automation tools.
Speaker 2:I because it's scary.
Speaker 1:It's very scary.
Speaker 2:Some of the people carry, you go, oh, that's not real.
Speaker 1:It's not.
Speaker 2:It looks way too real to not know the difference. And we're
Speaker 1:in the early stages.
Speaker 2:Exactly. It's still very early.
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 2:Even though it's been it's going at a speed. I don't think any of us could ever imagine. It's still very, very early. So it's scary to think, like, you you know, what a year from now, I could be like, oh, this whole ad marketing campaign was created with AI.
Speaker 1:Can we talk about that? I understand using AI to auto generate text and copy. However, I can I honestly can tell when it's been written by AI?
Speaker 2:Yes.
Speaker 1:I could tell when the voice is not authentic and was a computerized voice.
Speaker 2:Because most people just copy and paste and but you should be using AI as, like, a if you're gonna use it, I think, for copy, like, start as a base Yes. To give you a foundation. Because I use that even for clients like, okay. Let me get a foundation going, and then I'm gonna change it and tweak things to write in our voice because some stuff you have spit out. I was like, we don't talk like this.
Speaker 2:Or it's a little too a lot of times, it's a little too formal. And I'm like, we don't we don't talk like this on a regular basis.
Speaker 1:Exactly. To our clients. And I think what I've noticed about younger marketers coming up, they're leaning too much on these automation tools to build their foundation. Eventually, someone's gonna catch you in your bullshit. That is true.
Speaker 1:Honest with you. When you're asked to write a marketing campaign and they're wondering why your grandma not correct, connected, They're wondering why you don't know how to build a strategic plan because you lean on AI for your entire career. Guess what, baby? Guess what's gonna happen? You're gonna get fired.
Speaker 1:Oh, I'm sorry. Put on a PIP. Perform a improvement plan because eventually, it's gonna catch up to you. And AI, again, what I think is a great tool to have, it should not be the foundation of your educational knowledge in this field and also your professional knowledge and your growth.
Speaker 2:Agreed. Agreed. So I, as you know, am a new podcaster. Yay. I'm stepping outside of my comfort zone into this space to grow the kickback with Carrie brand.
Speaker 2:And as a
Speaker 1:Yes, brand. A. A.
Speaker 2:A. You got multiple things going on. But as someone who has her own podcast Yeah. Who has over 10,000 downloads, who's on multiple seasons. Let's listen.
Speaker 2:Brag listen. We gonna brag on you. Okay? She's I'm gonna brag. Multiple seasons and multiple downloads.
Speaker 2:What advice would you give to new podcasters? Because on one side, you hear people say, like, oh, this space is oversaturated now. Like, we don't need any more podcast. Mhmm. And then on the other side, you hear people say, well, no.
Speaker 2:There's still room. There's still space. And if you're someone new, you may not really know, like, best practices or things to do to, 1, be consistent and to get a steady growth in your podcast. So what advice would you give me and those watching?
Speaker 1:Yeah. So let's go back to that oversaturated part. So Carrie, when you go to Target
Speaker 2:Yes. How many lipsticks do you
Speaker 1:see in the lipstick aisle?
Speaker 2:A 1,000.
Speaker 1:Yes. But each lipstick has what? A different formula. Right? Correct.
Speaker 1:And different, shades for different people.
Speaker 2:Yes. All the reds are not the same.
Speaker 1:All the reds are not the same. The lip bars, which auntie is my favorite though?
Speaker 2:Yeah. No. I do Boss Lady. Oh, you like Boss Lady? I'll do Boss Lady.
Speaker 1:I'll let you have that. Okay. So so thinking about the number of reds you see Mhmm. In the Cosmic Out is a way that I think about podcast. Every podcast is not for every person.
Speaker 1:Right. Right? So understanding what you're listening audience may want and being true to yourself, it's hard to come across authentic just with a mic. Yeah. Like, people can sense in your voice if you are faking it just for a chick or this is how you actually are
Speaker 2:in real life.
Speaker 1:So that's number 1. Please be authentic and making sure the platform that you're building, like the kickback with Carey, is who Carey is. You know, don't come on as a political commentator when all you do is read the Shade Room comments. Okay. That's one thing.
Speaker 1:Number 2, I would say when you're reaching out, make sure that you have I use, Excel spreadsheets. I I'm a little bit of a creative asshole, to be honest with you. I use Excel spreadsheets to organize my seasons.
Speaker 2:Mhmm.
Speaker 1:So I have the theme or what episode I wanna talk about, and then I have the people I have in mind for that potential episode. Then I take a template email and I reach out to them via email, and ask them if they will be interested in being on my show. And then I provide examples of past episodes of my shows that could get a feel for the kind of content I create. Because nobody wanna be on a podcast with brothers who just have mics, and you know what I'm talking about. Girl.
Speaker 1:Girl.
Speaker 2:That could be a conversation
Speaker 1:for another day. Girl. So so giving people an idea that you're not gonna put them in some mess and have, like, an like, you know, switch a room moment out there is really important. Once you have them confirmed, provide a run of show. A run of show organizes the show for what people should expect.
Speaker 1:You know, you have an overview, the question that you're gonna ask, x, y, and z, and then you make clear to them, this is a part that we'll actually be doing together. Just to let you know, this is just to let you know what the format is. But here is where we're actually going to be engaging. Gotcha. And then from there, once it's done, I like to provide for them, just the audio clip itself, so they could put it on their website, you know, however they wanna do it, share with their mom and them, and also the, the artwork for social media.
Speaker 2:Mhmm.
Speaker 1:You know, like, with their pictures that they provided to approve before it goes live because no one likes a surprise. Right. But I don't want you using a picture I have from 2013. Like, that's not
Speaker 2:You're like, I don't look like that now.
Speaker 1:I don't look like that now. Why are you using that? That's not me. I'm 37. Don't use no picture when I was in my twenties, but, that's just some of the recommendations I have.
Speaker 1:And then when you start your podcast, it's okay to be on maybe, like, a couple platforms at first Yeah. And evolve from there. Everyone wants to grow quickly, but sometimes, Spotify may not be where your audience is. I'm surprised, I talk about Samsung users all day long.
Speaker 2:And are they the most listeners?
Speaker 1:The most listeners I have are on that Samsung podcast app. And I am very shocked by that because I'm a Apple girlie all day. Right. But that's where most of my audience is. So and then the final thing I would recommend is if you have a website, create, like, a landing page on your website where all your episodes live.
Speaker 1:Okay. Because as we know, the world can go crashing down like we saw a few weeks ago with the airline thing, and you want your content to live somewhere where if Apple were to crash tomorrow, your podcast is still alive. Gotcha. Those are my recommendations.
Speaker 2:Well, I appreciate it. Thank you. Listen. I'm a watch this episode again, take all my notes. As I build this out, I'm like, I'm taking all my notes.
Speaker 2:Look. That's why he's laughing over there, the producer, because he knows. He was like, we talked about this. I'm like, listen.
Speaker 1:Kyle, was that right, Kyle?
Speaker 2:Yeah. Is it so one final question. Are we done? One final no. But this is a good one.
Speaker 2:Oh, okay. You're gonna like this one. Beyonce's renaissance
Speaker 1:Oh, no.
Speaker 2:Or cowboy Carter.
Speaker 1:I'm sorry. I gotta go Renaissance. I even was You know I had to
Speaker 2:ask you because you're her biggest fan, so I had to ask you.
Speaker 1:I was even listening to Renaissance on the way over here, and I still listen to it in chronological order. I cannot listen to it mixed up.
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 1:That album from top to bottom is still one of my favorites out of her entire body of work. Cowboy Carter, I I like me some Cowboy Carter, but sometimes I'll be crying because, you know, when I hear Protector, when I hear, like, 16 characters, like, in that first half of the album, I need to call my therapist.
Speaker 2:Gotcha.
Speaker 1:For the final half of the album, I wanna throw it back into a circle. Like, I don't know who I wanna be. But with Renaissance, I start off with, like, empowerment when I hear these motherfuckers ain't stopping me.
Speaker 2:I'm like, yes. Just send my iced coffee on the way to the office.
Speaker 1:I pull up in these clothes, looks so good. Because I'm in that home.
Speaker 2:Like, I enjoy it.
Speaker 1:Right? Down to when we get down to Summer Renaissance, I'm like, literally You
Speaker 2:and that fan.
Speaker 1:Okay. You I broke it.
Speaker 2:Listen. You and okay. Here's a question. Renaissance Oh, no. Or
Speaker 1:Oh, no. Lemonade. Carey, why are you doing this to me? I still pick
Speaker 2:You still pick renaissance?
Speaker 1:I still pick renaissance. However, Lemonade's visuals, besides Black is King
Speaker 2:Visuals?
Speaker 1:Lemonade as a visual album
Speaker 2:Amazing.
Speaker 1:Will win over Renaissance.
Speaker 2:Amazing. Because we got the visuals. Absolutely.
Speaker 1:You all visuals, honey. We know b, but we still want something. But Lemonade visually was cinematic.
Speaker 2:I agree.
Speaker 1:However, if we were to compare Lemonade and Black is King, I know that was not a traditional Beyonce album. It's Black is King
Speaker 2:Like a for me.
Speaker 1:What that was amazing album.
Speaker 2:Uh-uh. Listen.
Speaker 1:I was
Speaker 2:you know how to ask you.
Speaker 1:I know. Because I
Speaker 2:was like, she she you do you're the president of the Beyhive, so I had to ask.
Speaker 1:You know, I'm an affiliate member, code 9481
Speaker 2:Not a code 4.
Speaker 1:87. How you doing? How you doing? Level 6. I just got promoted.
Speaker 1:But I I love I love Beyonce, and not just from her music. I respect her as a businesswoman and a creative. And that's the line that I like to live on. Like, the hill I will die on. Let me say that.
Speaker 1:Because, creatively, she has pushed the envelope. Creatively, she challenges a lot of us not just to think about the product we're putting out, but the work that it takes to get that great product. And I think there are some creatives out there, not like the ones I named, who just want to put a product out and are not thinking about the total results.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Right? Like for you, for example, when you do your kickback with Carrie's on TikTok, it is well thought out. I pay attention to that.
Speaker 2:Well, thank you, friend.
Speaker 1:You're welcome. Like, first of all, you're brilliant.
Speaker 2:Well, thank you.
Speaker 1:Let's just let's give you your flowers. You're brilliant. The fact that you have, in my opinion, pivoted in a way that takes you being a stylist at the core when you start out in this industry to now shifting the marketing is a path that I don't think a lot of people realize you can take.
Speaker 2:Mhmm.
Speaker 1:You don't have to live in one creative space forever. You can pivot to others if there's connected tissue between them.
Speaker 2:And I'm in a space I am by accident. Like, I didn't even seek it out.
Speaker 1:That's what I'm saying.
Speaker 2:Yeah. It was like, my friends who I were, they're my clients. They were like, yeah. So we need help with our social media marketing and that's gonna be you. And I was like, okay.
Speaker 2:But think about it
Speaker 1:too, Carrie. You're a stylist, so you know how to visually put things together. It makes sense that you're working in that content space because content are visuals. And you have to be able to build the building blocks to create that output result whether it's on social, whether it's, through a newsletter, whatever. You have the ability to create a voice through clothing, through styling that has now translated into this field.
Speaker 1:Appreciate it. Connects.
Speaker 2:Thank you.
Speaker 1:I see it. Some folks don't know how to do that.
Speaker 2:That was shady.
Speaker 1:Was it? It was. Was it shady?
Speaker 2:It was.
Speaker 1:I'm just sick of somebody going viral or saying, here here are my 10 ways to build your blah blah blah. Click my newsletter, link in bio, and then now there's a paywall. The fuck?
Speaker 2:Well, you know people doing the most.
Speaker 1:They are. But as someone who doesn't weaponize their knowledge for the benefit of of monetary gain
Speaker 2:Yes.
Speaker 1:I do find issue with that. I agree. Because in our communities especially, a lot of us need help. Mhmm. And if we're gonna be about our communities, be about your community.
Speaker 2:Which is one of the reasons why I have the newsletter because I'm like, at the at minimum, we could at least shop a brand Yes. Know a brand Yes. Be introduced to something new to keep that dollar circulating in our communities because we all need help.
Speaker 1:We do. We all need help. If you tell me click the link in bio or download my ecourse, that to me is not helping. To me, that's not authentic.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:If I'm looking to you for real help, give me the real help. Don't put as asterisk next to it in order for me to help you.
Speaker 2:And I think sometimes people are afraid to give too much information online, and I'm like, at the end of the day, you give people the what. You don't necessarily have to always give the how, but you wanna give them enough information that they feel like they can walk away and take action.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:And or at least get to one step. And then the next step is, hey, reaching out to you. Right? Mhmm. So someone could watch us and say, hey, I wanna, you know, send pictures or I wanna work on my storytelling for my brand.
Speaker 2:They may get to step 1 and be like, okay. To get to step 2, 3, and 4, I know I need to reach out to Yvonne. Mhmm. But at least you gave them enough information upfront that they don't feel like they have to always pay for something to be able to take action and do something. Because I think that's what we're finding a lot now in the space is everything you gotta pay for everything.
Speaker 2:Yes. And it's like, give people enough to feel grounded, at least get started. You know everyone's not even if all the free information, everyone is not gonna take action.
Speaker 1:Exactly.
Speaker 2:We know that. Everyone is not taking action. But at least when I get people something Yes. So they feel like, okay. I can get started.
Speaker 1:And I look at I look at marketing, like, in terms of giving that advice like Costco samples. Right? Yeah. You know how we go to Costco?
Speaker 2:Gotta go to a lunchtime.
Speaker 1:Oh, really? Okay.
Speaker 2:Yeah. Go to lunchtime to get samples. That's that's lunch.
Speaker 1:True. Right. You smart. Uh-huh. But you know how when you go to Costco, you got to tray samples out.
Speaker 1:Right? You don't just get one sample. You come, you get the one sample, you eat it, and you're like, oh, that was good.
Speaker 2:Take another one as You
Speaker 1:try to be shot and come back. Right? So that's essentially how I look at, like, you know, building relationships. I can give you the tea. I can give you the information.
Speaker 1:I know eventually you're gonna come back. And then you're gonna keep me in the back of your mind when you are ready to bring me on board to work with you. So essentially, you're getting your Costco samples from me, but you know that it's good information. So when you are ready, you're ready to purchase. You're ready to work with me.
Speaker 1:And a lot of times when I work with clients, the first thing they say to me is, I don't have a whole lot of money to, you know, to work with you, this and the other. I'm like, did I did I put that up front? Mm-mm. Like, tell me what your needs are and we can meet in the middle and find a solution. Because I don't want people to think that my price is a barrier for them to work with me.
Speaker 1:Again, I'm in a corporate space. That's the space I'm in, but I am choosing to do this to work with you. I'm not looking to be rich to work with you. I'm looking to make sure that you are successful. That's the main goal.
Speaker 2:And where can people find you?
Speaker 1:You can find me on the socials. Duh. You can find me on Instagram at pinkdawstyle and also my business page at pinkdawhousemarketing. You can find me on TikTok, aka the clock app, at pinkycreates. And then, of course, I have a website y'all.
Speaker 1:It's pink dollhousemarketing.com for all the things. Feel free to slide into my DMs. That's cool. But if you're weird, I will block you. Okay?
Speaker 1:But that's where you can find me, Carrie.
Speaker 2:Awesome. Y'all make sure y'all follow Yvonne. We'll also put all her information in the notes of today's episode. Thank you so much for being here. Welcome.
Speaker 2:I appreciate you coming and being my guest.
Speaker 1:Yay. Until
Speaker 2:next time, guys. Thanks for watching. Bye.