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Join couple-preneur Ruth and Brian Steinmetz as they share their expertise in real estate, design and social activism. As co-founders of “Steinmetz”, a real estate brokerage and interior design firm serving mainly Chittenden County, Vermont, they explore the intersection of wellness and the art of conscious dwelling through what they call dwellness. They’ll cover topics like equity- in all its forms, environmental and social justice, conscious consumption, mental and community health and so much more. Each week, they discover more about dwellness through unfiltered and nuanced conversations with change-makers, dreamweavers, and many more awesome and inspiring people.
Change your life, your home and your community by discovering what dwellness means to you.
Welcome to the Dwellness Podcast. I'm Ruth Steinmetz. And I'm Brian Steinmetz. Join us on our journey to discover the connections between physical and mental well being and our dwellings.
We are back on another rousing episode of the Dwellness Podcast. I hope it's rousing for other people, but because it is for me, um, and today's guest is. Another friend of ours, and his name is Aaron Carroll, and he is, or as we call him, Farmer Aaron. He's the owner of Sowing Roots Farm in Underhill, Vermont.
Which makes clean and free non GMO chemicals or pesticides, produce, eggs, and pasture raised poultry. And we have tried his, uh, His pasture raised poultry? Yes. Ugh. So good. Yeah, so good. Yeah. We also, I don't dunno what you do to those birds, man, but , it's a secret there. , those birds get some love. I mean lot.
We've been at the farm and they are free ranging, just roaming about the farm. That's just the way they do it is very beautiful. Mm-Hmm, in Underhill. And even the drive up there is just gorgeous, you know? Yeah. So those not a bad commute. Those chickens get some good loving . Uh, welcome to. Our show, Aaron.
Yes. Thank you for having me. Oh, we're happy to have you. Yeah. And we're going to get right away into our quote of the week, which was provided to you from someone.
Somebody said this. And he said, that person said something really important, which is nothing is sufficient for the person who finds sufficiency too little. Amen. Yeah, I especially like that since we're coming up on one of the greedier seasons of the, at least in America, uh, that, that speaks a lot about like, um, being content, which is, which is very important, obviously, uh, and, uh, being, you know, being happy with what you've got.
And I like that. I especially like that around the giving holiday, which is. However you want to describe it. I'm talking about Christmas, of course. Yeah. We're a couple months away from that now. Um, and I'm already seeing Christmas trees, even though it's not even Halloween yet or Thanksgiving. All these merchants are ramping up and it seems like it's actually true.
Every year they keep pushing back the buying season. Uh, before it was taboo to even go Christmas shopping before Thanksgiving. And now we have all these sales already going on. As soon as the pumpkin spice drops, it's just, and the pumpkin spice just drops like right after Labor Day. It's like, yeah, pumpkin season, all these basic bitches,
I mean, it's delicious and I love making pumpkin pie, but. I, it's, it's just gone way off the rails here and, um, and, and our kids are getting conditioned to it, to not being, not feeling content with what they have or feeling like they need so many things. When even when you get to the morning of there's only so much you can absorb until it just starts becoming a blur.
So, um, you don't even remember what you got last year for Christmas. I mean, it's ridiculous versus if you get like one important thing that's gonna last a long time, right? Yeah, it's much more You'd be like, Oh yeah, I got that in 2003 for a long time, you've built up that anticipation, you know? So even you and I are thinking of just really, really changing things up this Christmas, aren't we?
Yeah. And it's been a, an adjustment with the kids because Um, we were caught up in the consumerism. Um, it's very easy. I mean, and yeah, I mean, we, we took the kids to Times Square to go back to school shopping. What last year? Yeah. Yeah. I mean, that was, yeah, that was the thing that we did. And we like planned it.
And then while I was there, I was like, we're just in the, in a bigger H and M. Like, there's no reason for us to be here because I think retail therapy is a real thing. It's like it affects you and it feels good. Yeah, it's like gaming. It's addictive. You get those endorphins that instant gratification, but it doesn't last.
And this code really just nails it. You know, it's it's good to be content and to learn contentment. And I think this year I have really learned that lesson deeply. Um, not by choice, but I I'm I'm I'm I am so grateful that that lesson has stuck, you know, just being content with the my wardrobe with the things I have in the house and not really pining for more because it's not gonna it's not gonna feel that.
That desire that yearning that we have in our hearts. Yeah. Well, I was gonna say actually that It's probably been a few years since my wife and I have even exchanged Christmas presents We really don't do that so much. We might get each other one small thing But not not so much. We've really moved away from it So we do still get some things for the kids, but like you said, that's probably the harder side to slow down But but yeah, we've tried to step back from it.
Yeah. Yeah. What was it you were saying earlier before we rolled to? About this season and I can't I just can't remember it verbatim Can you about this season about the season and the quote that we were talking about? Oh, well, just that I think you guys asked me who the quote was credited who was credited with the quote and I said that I know who made or they say made the quote, but I don't really like to give too much credit on quotes because people can say the same thing and they can say it in different ways.
You know, it can be just semantics. So, uh, and then so many quotes have been stolen, like so many other things. Yeah. So when we look at especially older quotes, uh, it's just, you don't know who said that, you know, and I know that there's some, um, Rumors that even a lot of Greek philosophers and people had spent time a lot of time, 20 years plus in Africa, learning from more elders there.
So whether it be semantics or verbatim, I'm sure a lot of those ideas and concepts and quotes and things came out of that, that time. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Especially like Africa is just a huge, um, It's based on oral tradition, so, and, and it, uh, the culture is not really around, like, who said that it's all about, like, how are we interpreting it in this generation and what kind of new flavor are we giving it, but, you know, it's still the same concept, right?
Like take the wisdom, not the credit. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. That's much nicer. Yeah. I have to say, because then, I mean. When you credit somebody, you're right, uh, pride and ego gets in the way of things. And we were talking on the way over here. We were like, I'm not sure we want to keep quoting presidents and stuff like that.
Um, because you know, they have libraries for themselves. You work for four years and get a library named after you. It's like, well, what is the quote? Whoever controls. Something controls history. Yeah, the narrative or something. The history is written by the winners of wars. Yeah, so I mean, that's what we're really living.
Or who's right, or who's left, not who's right. Yeah, yeah, who's left, who's left, behind. Sure, sure. The survivor is the winner. Yeah, exactly. And that's the person that writes history and they're always like, I had a glorious victory. Definitely. So it's a funny thing. Yeah. You know, quotes and words and, and, and history and who said what.
Yeah. And who should be credited. I think we should take up the wisdom and walk with it. Not worry so much about who, who said it. Yeah. So pride and greed. Yeah. Yeah. Ego. Yeah. Yeah. Things we should watch out for. And she looks at me when she says watch out,
Brian. No, no, no. I mean, I agree with you. It's, it's been a, you know, I've, we're all culpable. Yeah, that's true. But I'm willing to admit that I've had a long history of being bullied. Prideful and selfish and, but, uh, working on it and, and, you know, admitting that there was a problem was the first step to recovery.
So we're all a work in progress. I think there was something else that I read that, uh, even the horoscope, it was really meant to point us to our tendencies so that we could work on those. It wasn't so much that we could look at it and say, look. That's who I am. That's how I am. And here we are worshiping the stars and planets and, you know, just losing the point.
So always a work in progress. I know I'm always a work in progress. Oh yeah, me too. Absolutely. Anyway, I'm going in the right direction, so I'm happy about to ask the question? I was about to, yeah. Yeah. The big question? The big one, yeah. The one that's most on theme here. Farmer Aaron, how do you find your dwellness?
Ooh, how do I find my dwellness? Um, for the most part, a quiet place, because I believe heavily in minimalism and, uh, so I think that it's always the, the most quiet place that I can find. Uh, you guys have kids, you know, it's not easy to find, although our kids are older until the next one comes, but, uh, they, they tend to be more quiet these days with the exception of when they have friends over and then it's a madhouse, right?
Definitely. So, yeah, but no, finding a quiet place, finding a place that isn't so interrupted by technology and. And, uh, futuristic type stuff. So, for me, obviously, I value farming, land, and plants, and trees, and all those types of things. So, for me, it's finding a nice, quiet place with nice, natural noises. Uh, that's as far away from, call it man made, people made, human made as possible.
Yeah. True that. Although some birds can be really noisy. Oh, I was about to say we were, we were in Kenya, Malindi, Kenya, and we were staying at, and it's really hot there. So like the windows aren't windows. They're not made of glass. They're just like screens with like slats in them. So no sound protection whatsoever.
And there was a tree outside, I forget what kind of tree it was. Yeah, outside our window. Right outside our window with the loudest frigging bird you've ever heard in your life. Every morning at like 5 a. m. just yelling at us. Goodness. I was worse than a rooster. Oh, I don't know. I wouldn't be so sure about that.
I mean, I've heard roosters usually in the distance, though. These were like right there, you know? Yeah, they were like 10 feet from our bed. Right, right.
I've walked out the door and confronted the rooster in the morning before so it can be a pretty bad feeling. Hey rooster. Hey. You shut your face. That's enough. That's it. I wish I could have done that with this guy. He didn't listen. Right. I would yell at him from the bed. Just be like, shut up. He'd be like, rah.
Dialogue, but I'll take that any day, any day to, you know, like 4 a. m. today being woken up by this, uh, cause there's construction happening, there's construction right out our door. Yeah. So it with lights. No manners with that. Who
said you could start at five in the afternoon? Yeah, they start with the bright lights like shining right in our window. Oh my goodness. Yeah. Yeah. So birds any day. Any day. Any day. Absolutely. Yes. At least there's a pause between it. Like with, uh, with the lights. I mean, they're always on. Yeah. Until the sun comes up.
Sure. Yeah. Yep. Those blackout drapes. Oh, yeah. Yeah. So, uh, tell us more about your minimalist life. I mean, you just said that, you know, you're not buying gifts as, uh, as you used to, uh, during the holiday season. How do you live? How do you survive? I mean, I don't know if I would call it a minimalist, minimalist life as much as maybe, uh, minimalist aspirations, you know, we all live in still what is a very capitalistic society.
We live here in the States. So people buy things. I buy things. Um, and I buy things that you don't need. I think everybody does, but it's just about the focus on trying to do less, trying to buy less. Yeah. Yeah. I was thinking about that as we were talking earlier, actually, and like, you can't even go three or four years without having to buy a new, new smartphone because they make them to break or the planned obsolescence software.
Yeah. That's the term I was looking for. Yeah. Planned obsolescence. Smart lady. I always forget stuff and I've only got one language and she's anyway, but uh, yeah, the, the planned obsolescence to where like. Um, I was, I was talking about, uh, my car with the mechanic just the other day and he's like, I was like, do they even make like steel cars that are easy to fix like four cylinder Jeeps or anything like that anymore?
He's like, no, they're all plastic and you're basically buying a computer on four wheels and that's why they all cost. 50 grand. Right. And I was like, really? My laptop didn't cost 50 grand. Like what? right? Yeah. It can't be that much more sophisticated, you know? Yeah. Part of the, the cycle of things, right?
The cycle of things used to be, you know, things that went around and came back around and, Mm-Hmm. . Now the cycle is, it goes around, then it dies. Dies, and then have to buy a new one. You buy a new one. Yeah, totally. Yeah. I tell you, I'm, I'm trying to get more into, like, reusing my clothing, reusing things in the house.
Mm-Hmm. , you know, if something gets. It's too big or too small whipping out the sewing machine, you know, and just refraining from, you know, getting on that app and seeing, cause there's always something on sale, which is just a lie. It's just to get you to buy more because you're like, Oh, I got this on deals on a deal.
So that means I can buy a little bit more, but then you're spending more than you wanted to do in the first place. So I feel like it's easier here in Vermont. You know, you go to the city or we, my wife and I have joked about, you get out of the plane in like Miami or something and you're like, Oh, just bombarded with consumers.
Oh, look, look at me. What am I doing?
But here, you know, you can, you can move about pretty easily and pretty modestly. So, so I think minimalism is. funny in the sense that a lot of it is driven by social pressures, you know, social pressure to buy or to drive the right car, wear the right clothes. So, um, that's where it can be something that is easier if you're in the right environment, you know what I mean?
So I think even for, for me in Vermont, that's one of the things I like about being here is that it is a place where you can kind of be whatever you can be as flashy as you want to be. You can be as modest as you want to be. Um, the flashy people like I find that, uh, when I wear a suit, more eyes are on me than when I don't.
Yeah. Yeah. The culture here is very, you know, utilitarian, you know, yeah. Dressing for the environment and, uh, well, you guys have taken flights back. There's the other joke about, you can always see your, your gate. You're like, Oh, that's
all those functional shoes.
It definitely keeps life simple. And, uh, I think a big part of it is being so in tune with nature because it makes you just. I just want to keep it simple because, um, as long as you're dressed right, at least that's one thing. You gotta be dressed right. In Vermont is as long as you're dressed right, you got all the right layers and the right gear and you don't need much because all you need is maybe one hiking boot, uh, three flannels and yeah, one for every day.
Yeah, you got a rotator and they're going to get broken in or you're not going to look good anyway, you really don't need much and, uh, you don't need to. Whip out the latest trends because even with those kinds of outfits, they don't really change that much over the years. You can wear one from the eighties and still be, they don't go out of style.
Yeah. Yeah. Always for the timeless style. It's nice raising kids in this environment too. Uh, cause it's not as consumerist driven. And luckily we don't have like the uh, Saturday morning cartoons the way they used to. Where like every kid would want the same toy because it's been so heavily advertised.
And if that kid didn't get it... I remember this from my own childhood, if you didn't get it and everybody else in your class did, like you felt like the odd person out. So if that's kind of that social pressure, that social pressure, yeah, that's for real engineered pressure, maybe, but yeah, pressure. Yeah.
We're having another baby soon and we're talking about like, congratulations. Thank you. Thank you. And we're talking about like how many toys we want to get them because, and things like that, because like my first daughter with another, my ex wife, uh, we had a thousand toys for her and she. She didn't even pay attention to, except for maybe five of them.
Yeah. So I might as well just get her the five. And that's the thing. Like we forget that we can only pay attention to so much, you know, even though we want to accumulate a lot of things, there's only so much that we can absorb and appreciate. So teaching ourselves to really get back to that, you know, what's your, what's your sufficient level and sticking to that level, because The rest is just superfluous.
You're just gonna waste money, waste resources, kill the planet while you're at it. Yeah, I was gonna say, everything's made of plastic. Yeah, so how do you get to that point where you you just scale back to that point where you feel like this is sufficient for me? And if you really think about it for It's really a recent thing that people have so much.
Exactly, yeah. Because for thousands of years people could carry everything they owned on their back. I always think about that. Yeah. Particular thought. Yeah. Can you, can you even imagine having to go into your house and say, okay, you get a backpack full of stuff. Clothes, trinkets, you know, tools, anything you can think of.
It all has to fit in that backpack and that's all you're gonna have. So, but that was the standard for Basically ever. Yeah. And they didn't usually pack food there either. Cause they just find it off the earth. Yeah. Yeah. Uh, which is the way, you know, so we got intended really even thinking about tools.
I'm like, Oh, how many, like, I want a trunk full of tools, no kidding. Guess who's carrying that. But taking it back to that quote from the beginning, yeah. Is if sufficiency isn't enough, then you're gonna feel you need 10 bags, you need 15 bags. Yeah. Well if you have 10, you feel like you need five more. So, um, but when it is enough, then one is enough, or none is enough, you know?
Yeah. Enough to get by is enough. Um, and I think that we are either gonna choose to kind of return to that mentality, um, and dependent upon where you are, there's a lot going on in the news right now. People get. Returned to that mentality. So I think it's easier to choose that mentality today for ourselves than it is probably to find yourself in an uncomfortable position of being put in that position.
Yeah, and it's mentality, like I said, because I buy things, you said, what do I do in my minimalist lifestyle? I don't know if I call it that, but because we're all going to buy things, but it's more reconfiguring your mentality to want. You know, to say, no, I don't need whatever it is in multiples, but to just have one of something and have it be enough or have, you know, one coat or one flannel that's a little beat up, but it lasts a little longer, you know, that type of that type of thing in your thought.
Yeah, it definitely takes some thoughtfulness, some mindfulness, some stopping yourself like, Oh, do I really, you know, it helps to have this set of questions to ask yourself. Because. The culture is trying, you're kind of going against the, the, the, the current. Yeah, yeah, you're going against the current. So it takes a little bit of effort to, to be able to swim against this current.
But then the question arises is, is this a desire that's inside of me? You know what I mean? Or is this desire being pushed on me? Because like you said, if the, if generally the culture, everybody is moving that way. And you're moving the opposite direction, that can be weird, right? Yeah. But, but I, I, I think we should ask, is it, is it a internal thing to want so much?
Or, or is it an external thing that's being, you know, put, put on us? Yeah. Because there's that peer pressure, even for parents, you know, you're like, what will people think that I'm not buying all these things for my kids? Or that I'm not, you know, that my house isn't stuffed with stuff to the brim with stuff.
Um, or buying so much food, um, it's, it's a pressure because you feel like people will judge you will look down on you will, you know, and then you'll be ostracized in some way because they'll think you're weird. Um, but it's, uh, people thinking you're weird. Sorry to jump in. I just have people, my nickname in middle school was weirdo.
So it's like, yeah, nothing new to me, but I hear you. Um, what were you saying? I'm sorry. Yeah, but it's, it's good. It's okay for people to think you're weird for the right reasons if you have these things kind of like your values and things that define who you are, because you know that they help you become a better person.
Yeah. Um, it's better to. Not care to some degree. If you know that this is this is actually good for me not to be so caught up in that kind of life. I mean, like using the term weird or outside the box or, you know, going against this stream or what? It's always the best. thing anyway. I mean, you know, guys know I'm into business and entrepreneurship.
So whenever you think about a great business arising, it was always something that was weird to people, you know, like let's put a battery in my car and get rid of the gas. That's weird. Who's going to do that? And now everybody's doing that, right? They tried to, you know, bury Tesla when they started. Uh, for lack of a better word.
And now, what is everybody doing? What they were doing. So, I think that it's often the, the person who's going the opposite direction. Even Warren Buffet says, Well, when everybody is going left, don't go left, go right. You know, when everybody is selling off, you buy. So, I think that that idea of being weird or going the opposite direction, it is culturally seen as something that is bad in certain ways.
But, let's be honest. It's good in many ways and it's how Many of the greatest the things that we love we got we got them because somebody went the other way we got them because Somebody said that's weird idea, but they pushed forward anyway So I don't think there's anything wrong with being weird or yeah, we're going against the grain But if anything it's probably necessary for us to get to where we need to get to which is away from where we're at Yeah.
I like to think about the Wright brothers in that situation, like how ostracized must they have been like, you're going to fly. Yeah, right. That's crazy. Yeah. Don't hang out with those guys. They're nuts. Totally. Exactly. And then they did it. And now we all fly to Paris or wherever, uh, daily, I mean thousands of flights a day.
And probably don't even give them the, the due. The, yeah, the credit. Yeah. But they're due for amazing. I mean, I've never heard of the right airline, have you? No. Great, great point. Yeah. Right. Absolutely. Now, now some billionaire's gonna Yep. Elon's like dinging . That's right, that's right. Uh, and you said you're an entrepreneur, but right now you main, your main economic entrepreneurial enterprise.
Yeah. Economic endeavor is being a farmer. How did you get to that and what drives you to do that? Uh, how did I get to be a farmer? Well, I went to college for business. So I graduated in 2008. So I graduated during the economic crisis. It was just terrible time to try to find a job. And I hadn't done all the right things.
You know, internships and all those things. I kind of just wanted to get it and be done with it and move on. So when I graduated, it was tough to find a place, you know, and somehow, again, God, I don't know, I landed working at a John Deere dealership, doing some accounting type work there, and just noticed something on the men, mainly men, who were coming through the door, and just that they had a different brand.
demeanor, way of being, uh, it definitely weren't the suit and tie. Let's hustle to get everything that we can get. But they seem to be hardworking to the point where it hurt, you know, but, but there was a stronger sense of contentment on them than you would see sometimes I think in other people. So I think that made me wonder.
And then I did a few other jobs that. We're morally questionable not not not by social standards though No, yeah, but by my own my own personal standards. I mean we're talking about Elon and Warren. Totally. Yeah, what are these guys done? I to get there, right? Yeah, you know the wrapper bag on the table type of the thing.
Yeah But because of that, I started landscaping, which was something I always grew up doing with my dad, and I knew I could do it. And I knew I could work harder than most people could physically, um, so, yeah, I did that. And then I became a master gardener volunteer in order to help support that work that I was doing.
I owned my own business and and then ended up just being a land worker in a sense, which I say land worker. When I worked landscaping week, a lot of people called them land scrapers, you know, almost meaning like they, they worked the land scrape by for a living. I think that's what that term meant, I guess.
But what I really recognize over years of working through gardening and landscaping and working with the land is that now, actually, it's like the highest form of living, you know, um, it's the highest honor, you know, I believe to work with soil and work with land and work with the plant. So I think the gardening led me to its deepest form, which is farming, you know, um, not just growing things that are aesthetically pleasing, but growing, learning to grow things, raise things that are nourishing, uh, and not just pleasing, you know, but, but nourishing.
I really think it's the world's oldest profession. Absolutely. Yeah. A great book called Edible History of Humanity, uh, that I'm reading right now. And I encourage anybody who's watching to read that book is. Uh, wide spanning history of food, and it definitely points to food just being the, the origin of all, I mean, if you think about it, there's nothing you can do.
Yeah. If you're starving, you're in trouble. Yeah. If you're starving, you're not going to be a good lawyer, doctor, police officer. There's nothing that you can do. Yeah. You know, so, but that, that goes, speaks again to people's kind of lack of appreciation for really, really core things like, did you wake up this morning and go, this air so good and I'm so appreciate, appreciative of it.
We didn't, you know, you woke up, you got onto something else. You appreciated the coffee more than we did the air. Yeah. The fact that you even woke up in the first place. That too, you know, but without the oxygen, without waking up, there is no coffee. So we really lose sight of those core things that are most important.
And like you said, no question, working with the land, working on the land, dealing with the elements, um, is the core of it all. Yeah. It becomes really abstracted in our minds, especially going, you know, getting your food from the supermarket. It's so removed from even where it came from, how it was made, and I really admire the way you run your farm, you know, you, you tend to the chickens, you make sure that they're enjoying the outdoors too, and not stuffed in, you know, really cramped situations and, um, Fed till they explode.
Sure. Uh, get better, right? Well, the status quo, right? Yeah, yeah. And, uh, and we just consume it. We don't think, hey, you know, was this chicken happy before it came to this plate or, um, was it traumatized, um, the whole way. So our disconnection to our food also. I think in a way perpetuates even the illnesses we have because we, we just were consuming without the awareness of what exactly we're consuming.
And I think farming really helps you to appreciate, you know, how that produce came up, what it went through, what you did to intervene if there was some. Pests or, uh, or, um, you know, we had the floods that really affected our crop this year. Oh, yeah, big time. Um, so, you know intimately what all the, the things you produce went through to get to that point where it's on your plate.
Yeah. And, I think that, that raises even your, your, your ability to... Absorb the nutrients because you're just so connected to the the product. That's a good point. Well, thank you. That was a lot of nice Am I experience and all that I I think I think definitely being connected with the land is so important for everyone and that's why 95 percent people I think we talked about this in the past they go on vacation Stick their feet in the sand all of a sudden there.
I feel great, you know, and I mean you feel the breeze well People living in such manufactured environments for so long and no access to these things that are really just natural for your body to feel. Um, yeah, it automatically just catapults you to a better place. But the more that we can do that in our daily lives and or even just live in it, you know.
Yeah. Um, then the, the, the... The better our lives will be, you know, even somebody like, uh, Frank Lloyd Wright, you know, who was designing buildings clearly understood that your connection, even when in the building to the outside of the building and to everything that's going on outside of that building really.
Uh, transformed your experience inside the building, but then speaking to him or that person again, minimalism was kind of, he didn't, I don't know if he said that explicitly, but it was kind of one of the same tenants of his design philosophies, right? Because when we talk about what's needed, uh, it's very little.
And when we think about the, um, the, the torrent of things that we're thinking about and dealing with and scheduling and arriving to, it's like, it's really taking away from us, you know, because how do we sit and contemplate how important it is to. To care for the these animals that we eat or the vegetables that we grow.
Nobody has time to think about that. Do you know what I mean? So it's like, can we blame them entirely? Because most people just don't have time to think about that. It's a real privilege for me to be able to think about that. Um, but when we speak about minimalism and we speak about our dwellness and we speak about.
We're, you know, when I think about the dwellness, it's like putting yourself in the right place, right? How do you put yourself in your dwellness? You asked me, how do you find your dwellness? And that's why I point again to minimalism and just shutting everything down because it's really about finding your way back to that core Of things that are most important and I think that what most people will find is that it's very few things like there's so few and it's actually easier probably than we think once we can shut everything down.
Yeah, that's true. I really admire his architecture and you know, being an interior design and all that he really lets nature do the talking, you know, just pare back. The structure to really allow nature to do what it needs to do for us. And, you know, because that's that's really what is healing us. And that's really what we need to connect to to.
To live more content lives, um, you know, having bigger windows, having more skylights, you know, I'm like, why do we have all these big roofs and haven't found ways to just add more windows to our roof so we can enjoy the sky? You know, it's so dark when we get into our homes and then we have all these artificial lights.
It's really nice to see the sky, the windows up here, you know, we can see the sky, which is so nourishing. You don't realize it until you are in an environment where you're more connected to nature, just what you are missing. And so just being more intentional about finding those spaces and also understanding that, yeah, it is a privilege, but it also takes a little bit of.
Accessible effort on your part to be able to like walk outside or appreciate the outdoors a little bit more because that's really what we need to be. To be more alive and not just existing. And if we're, I mean, I'm always, I'll take us completely off task here, but Uhhuh talking about things. 'cause it's the momentum of those things too, you know?
Right. Like when you're never going outside, you don't get the momentum to do it. And it's like the more you do it, then the more you want to do it. Oh yeah, that's true. Yeah. Putting your toes in the sand. , put your toes in the sand or the grass anywhere. Something. Yes. Get grounded. Yeah. That's true. Totally.
Yeah. All righty. What else should we talk about you guys? I've just took your agenda.
I love it. No, I wanted to actually bring it back a little bit to the holiday season and stuff. There was something that I have done with, with my daughter for years now. Um, even before I met you and that was to like, go through her toys every year and kind of get, clean it up a little bit. Yeah. Purge. So I'm not just going to keep adding stuff on top of that mountain.
I want to trim it down some and then, uh, so we used to just go to the toys for tots thing and, and, uh, uh, toss them in there. or donate them in some other way, uh, right before the holiday season. So I could teach her to give and receive. Uh, but now it's just about giving. She's like, she's gotten enough.
It's over. No, I'm kidding. Of course. Uh, but I am, I really do like the idea of just getting like one or two things that are meaningful, uh, like per person I used to do, uh, and still kind of do, uh, like gift baskets for extended family where like, you just kind of. Piling a bunch of stuff. Oh, yeah, they might like it.
We do that. Yeah, especially some some Vermont stuff
Okay, the gift baskets a grocery bag that's totally fun My dad never wrapped anything. Everything came in the bag. Yeah go I used to do newspaper. That was my favorite. That's, that's extra. Well, what's a newspaper, right?
Yeah, so, uh, what kinds of things can people really shift their mindset on around giving, especially thinking about our consumption and food? Um, kind of, kinds of tips do you have? Uh, tips for, I, I don't know. Giving and receiving. Yeah, I mean, um, I think it's funny because you look at, You hear people who have the most, um, celebrities and, you know, world leaders and people, they always point to giving more than they do to receiving.
It's like once you've amassed so much, not that I have, but, um, there's just so much more impact in giving, you know? So yeah, I, I encourage people to, to give over the holidays, maybe. Um, give a sewing roots box or Oh yeah. Give um, give food, um, give, give core things though I think that's the other, we talked about the consumerism about around the holidays.
Giving isn't is obviously good. Yeah. Giving is the best thing. Maybe the question is sometimes it's like what we're giving, you know? Yeah. Giving people something that's nourishing or giving people something that they can use throughout the year. I think that's important. The, the bigger issue is I think we've just been giving stuff that has, you know, no value.
Like you said, with the kids, there's one, two toys that are going to be, yeah, meaningful, meaningful. And like my son has started playing, uh, piano, you know, or keyboard or whatever. So that's like one gift I know he's going to use, or I encourage him to use, you know, continually versus those other things that just.
You use them for a week, they lose, they lose interest in them, they don't really have value. So I guess that's again, going back to things that have true intrinsic value versus this new capitalistic kind of value, you know, yeah, I definitely encourage people to give things that are core food, education, books, uh, experiences, you know, experiences.
Yeah. Totally. What am I, what am I favorite? Like. Christmas parables, I suppose, around gift giving would be like when you buy a kid some expensive toy and they open it and they're like, wow, gee, thanks. And then they set it aside and play in the box for the rest of the day. Totally. Like, that's my son. Yeah.
So just give them a box for like 30 cents and not bother spending the other, which, yeah, it's just. You want to get deep and philosophical on that though, it's like you gave them something that's so boxed in versus giving them possibility, you know, the box is like endless possibilities, infinite imaginative.
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Totally. It can be a spaceship. It can be a totally anything, whatever. Yeah. Yeah. Sorry. Yeah. Another thing that we're not touching on is, It's giving our time and attention because, um, you know, being focused on go, go, go by, you know, show, uh, giving someone your undivided attention can be so valuable, especially to our Children and the people we love, because that's something that we all crave, and it's nourishing on both ways.
You know, you you get something from it. The other person gets something from it, and it's just that moment in time where you can you. Like even time is suspended for a while because you're just immersed in this other human being and it's, it's very, it's invaluable. And I think, um, we forget that sometimes.
We forget a lot. Oh, yeah. This podcast actually has helped me remember that, uh, because we get like, we have our earbuds in and we can hear ourselves and we like zone in on what we're doing. Uh, for like an hour to 90 minutes. And like, before you know it, all that time has gone by, it feels like five minutes and you're totally right.
And that like time just flies by cause we're just actually focused on something instead of like fidgeting on our phones or waiting for the next thing or what have you. Right. And I think in our culture that kind of like go, go, go what's next. Edd kind of, um, mindset, um, is, is kind of what leads to the, uh, the.
I want to play with the box because, okay, I got that thing that I wanted. Now I check that off. Now I need to actually entertain myself. My imagination is and has been the greatest thing that I've got. Um, let's go. And that, that same quote that we had at the beginning, uh, about sufficiency. Can you help me with it?
It was, uh, nothing is sufficient for the person who finds sufficiency too little.
That's like my real heart. I mean, I carry that quote with me, but it's to say that it, it, it also, it's a very deep quote because it also speaks to non destinational living. Like you see the, the, for the person who's sufficient, they're sufficient with the now, with this moment, it's not about trying to get to the next moment.
So, you know, I forget what it was you were saying there, but it made me think about that, about our, this other cultural tendency that we have for this destinational living where we're never really content with sitting on this chair right here, but it's more what's going to happen later this afternoon that I'm holding my whole day for, or what's going to happen next week or next month, or when I get that job or when, you know, the baby is born or.
But it's really about now. It's, it's about being, um, happy and, and, and content with now. And here I am saying this, like I'm some kind of guru or something, I'm not. No, because it's just, but they're things that I guess I've come to understand. It doesn't mean that they're necessarily easy to live. You know, but yeah, that destinational living is tearing us up.
Yeah. We gotta be content with today. Reminds me of the title. Cause that's all you have anyway. That's it. Yeah. All we'll ever have is now. That's it. But that reminds me, that quote again reminds me of the title of... That book about Trump by his niece too much and never enough. I mean, that really just sums it right up.
That's the hustle billionaire lifestyle like, okay, I got that thing. Now I want this other thing. Now I want this other thing. Now I want this other thing. And it's like, okay, well, when is enough enough? Never, never, never. How many, how many yachts can you water ski behind? Yeah. That's a quote from wall street.
I can remember movie quotes all day, but when it comes to philosophical ones like this, it's like, I think it was Tecumseh or somebody said, I don't know what these white people want. He's like, I think they're crazy because no, because the nature of them, even at that time was just. More and more and more.
It was like you have so much. You have a fleet. You have, I mean, a country, an army. Like, what do you want? What is it like? Yeah. So it's, it's something that's been in us for a really long time. Right? Yeah. Yeah. That reminds me too of the Lone Ranger. He had that, uh, that Native American sidekick whose name is escaping me right now.
Anybody remember? Tonto. Tonto. That's it. Thank you. I was going to tell people to comment it to us, but, um, but. It was a wild guess. That was a good guess. The Lone Ranger and Tonto were like, uh, getting surrounded by Native Americans and Lone Ranger leads, leans over to Tonto and he goes, we're in trouble, Tonto.
And he goes. Who's this wee white man?
I'm not. I mean, it's good. I guess we're a team. It's real easy. Alright, so. Yeah, we got to that point now. We did, yeah. We got all the way to the Lone Ranger once again.
So, let's uh, it's about that time to start wrapping up the show with our final three questions, which you forget. Oh boy. Except for one of them has to do a Star Trek, we'll let the Star Trek, uh, the Trekkie do it. Yeah, ask that one, but I'll start us off with, I think the answer is going to be a lot, but I'll start us off with this question.
Uh, what domestic tasks do you do well or do you enjoy doing? Is it all of them? I bet it's all of them. Domestic tasks. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, farming is essentially all of the domestic tasks, right? Yeah. I do it all well. People don't know, but I do it all well. No, no, I mean, really, because I've been a stable dad before I was farming, even when I had my landscape company, my wife has been an executive for many years.
So it's, I've always been supportive of her. So maybe that's partially what's also led me into this. No fear of supporting other people. I go to church. I support many people in my church. I'll be. Moving desks and bookshelves and I really heavily believe in supporting the people around us so so, you know I mean, I really do I I cut the grass.
I you know, I farm I clean I do dishes I clean bathrooms clean toilets. I care for kids emotionally physically like Yeah, I do all that like I'm the true Renaissance Man, you know, like, shut up Aaron . Make me look bad here on putting all the man to task. Yeah. Yeah. I love it. I'm ready. Come on, bring 'em.
Because yeah, I do it all at home. Everything. There's nothing I don't do. I, yeah. So what do you enjoy most? Enjoy most? Um, I just enjoy helping people really, like, honestly, I, I get the most. Fulfillment from that and it's weird because it could be gone. I've started to realize it could be a selfish thing actually though It's almost am I putting other people in debt, you know by doing for them.
Is it like a subconscious thing? I'm doing inside. I don't know like a favor debt You mean kind of like a favor debt because I it's gotten to the point where I do it so much That I'm wondering am I doing this for them or am I doing this? Yeah. Yeah. I don't know. I think that's okay. Okay. Yeah. There's worse things to do for people.
At least like, you know, chopping people up doesn't make you feel good. No, no, that does not. So always just doing for people, helping people from church and the family and the community, um, and just giving as much as I can brought you guys some chicken today. I'll send you an invoice through email later.
I'm joking. Well, I think that that's, uh, that's. Very Christlike. I think that's the you understood the assignment, man. Yeah, totally. Yeah. So it's a great assignment. Not just a good one. All right, let's get working with the land. Don't forget that. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. Um, okay. So for the next question.
Imagine you're a Starfleet officer. Oh, there we go. Send on a mission, maybe to go farming somewhere. Or, yeah, you'll definitely be helping people for an indeterminate period of time. And you can only take three things. Three things. Three personal things. Speaking of, yeah, the minimalism has come back to haunt me, this question.
Oh, yes, what are those things? Okay, so three things. Mm hmm. One more time. I on an island you said? No, no, no, no. Island. You are going Star Trek. You're Star Trek. Yeah. You're becoming a, in a space. Yeah. In a space. In a space. So all of your basic needs are, are taken care of. You got food, you got shelter. You got clothing.
Oh, okay. Great. Yeah. Okay. You're just taking three personal items. Wow. Communication too. So don't think about bringing your phone. Okay? Okay. Huh? Yeah. So I'm gonna need the Bible. Yeah, cuz that's like intergalactic. Yeah, you haven't memorized the whole thing
Definitely take the Bible I would take some seeds
Yeah, and Objects not people right? I mean now you can't really take people. Yeah, can't stuff your Then I would take a digital recorder Also, to record something that hope somebody messages home or something like a black messages home or yeah for somebody to find like a black box. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Captain's log. Yeah. That's it. Farmer space log. Space farmer. Yeah. That's what I meant to say. Oh, that's a good one. Yeah. Everything died.
That sounds like a good one. Makes me think of Matt Damon, that movie where He's in. Yeah, the Martian. Yeah, the Martian. Yeah, he's got potatoes potatoes. Oh yeah, that was bad when he ran out of ketchup though. It was like, Oh no, sucks. So, um, our final question is, uh, what is one thing that can make instantly make your day better?
Is
it farming? Uh, just like on a bad day, you know, like, or today or any day, uh, but whoever you want to interpret it, yeah. If you're having a bad day, what's the thing that will cheer you up? The thing that will cheer me up on a bad day? Yeah, just walking in nature. Yeah, I think that, that would be it. That seems to be a common theme actually, like a lot.
You're I think the second or third person that has said that or something to that effect. Yeah, because it's that powerful and it's just that innate in us and it's a shame that more people... Haven't experienced it, you know? You know, maybe it's because we live in such a hippie state. We do . It's about as crunchy as it gets
It's, it's beautiful pre like sometimes I feel like, wow. For me, oh yeah, yeah. I get to enjoy this. I know. It's so good. Especially in the fall, the little, oh yeah. It's so good. Yeah. It's good. Walking in the forest. Yeah. Mm-Hmm. . I went on a nature walk with, with. Uh, my daughter just the other day, uh, and, uh, she was all like, I don't want to get off my phone.
I was like, you're coming and she felt great when we were done. She can tell you that. So, as happens so many times before he's just in a bad way. And I tell him, you know, like, just take a walk for a few minutes and he's real emotional like me. But, and he'll come back and say, like, that worked. Like, I feel better and it's true.
It just does. I don't care who you are. I don't care how tough you are, what you've been through, what you're going through. All you have to do is step outside. Step outside your door. Yeah. It's true. That's probably what, uh... Or move however you can move, you know? Keep moving. Yeah. Keep moving. Yeah. That's probably what, um, Lloyd...
The architect understood right. Thank you. Thank you. I knew it was right, but we had mentioned the Wright Brothers too. So many Wrights in this. They got it right. He understood it. Yeah, he understood it totally. And that's why, you know, and, and even here at Hula, we've got plants on every desk and stuff like that.
And sure. Ever since living with this lady, who's a crazy plant lady. I'm a plant mama. I mean, my, my mental health has skyrocketed just because I happen to have plants in my house that are producing oxygen. Yes. You know, it's incredible. You don't even think about it. We'll plug a book called Breathe, also, and plug a book, uh, the...
Edible History of Humanity. I read a lot, but the Edible History of Humanity and that Breathe book is really good. From our errands reading list. And we're heading into winter, so I'm getting about to be back into the reading. I'll have more for you next year. So how do you read? We could make a blog post with your reading list.
Oh, I should. That's a good idea, yeah. How do you get your books? I love Audible. Yeah, I love Audible books. Not to plug a billionaire or anything. What? Yeah, I know. You can't escape it, though. I mean, he's not ready. He hasn't had gotten enough. Yeah, he's not. He's got to be Elon to Mars. This is what they're.
But no, I love audible books. And sometimes if you can read along with the physical book, but mainly it's audible because it's just, you know, you can do it anywhere. You can be working, working out, driving and just let you Get that info in there, you know, I have found that to be very true as well as I hate to plug it myself.
I know it's it's such a used to be able to go library and get them, but that's like too hard. Kids don't even know what the Dewey Decimal System is anymore. No idea. Lost. Don't even know what it is. Yeah, that's okay. Biblioteca.
Well, Farmer Aaron, it has been such a pleasure. It's such a pleasure. If anyone is local and you want to get something yummy, uh, consider a sowing roots box at sowing roots, farm. com or get, get one for your neighbor and support your local farmers and have yourselves a feast this holiday season. Instead of giving all those gifts, invite your neighbors and do stuff.
I'm telling you how to live or anything, but that's what I'm going to do. Yes. Give, give, give, give some more. If we all do that, it'll be all good. Yeah. Yep. Awesome. Thank you guys for having me. Well, yeah, our pleasure. Our pleasure. Give give give. Amen. Yes. Yeah. Amen. And we're out
The Dwellness podcast is produced by Steinmetz and recorded at Dialed Studio at Hula Our audio and video production is handled by Syntax in Motion Our audio engineers are Wesley Davis and Will Davis. Our show producer is Intro music is by Sam Barsh and outro by Ian Koloski. Artwork and promotions by Snicket's Public Relations.
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