Jill Henderson - October 2024

Aired on 10/17/24 on KOOP Community Radio, 91.7 FM in Austin, Texas

What is Racism on the Levels?

Explore how the social construct of race and racial oppression operates at multiple levels with a rotating focus on different social systems. Connect with Austin-area justice movement organizers and everyday people with relevant lived experience to lay out historical context, current affairs, and creative possibilities for a liberated future.

Soyinka Rahim: 00:35

I gotta love song, I gotta hit song. In this world you only need one song to live in my life.

Stacie Freasier: 00:41

Hey, y'all. This is Stacey Fraser. Pronouns are she and they, and you are listening to Racism on the Levels, a monthly show in the Austin Cooperative Radio Hour Collective that explores how the human design construct of race operates at the internal, interpersonal, cultural, institutional, and or systemic levels. I almost said organizational there because institutional and organizational, are somewhat interchangeable with a steadfast focus on creative possibilities for liberation now and beyond. I am a justice movement weaver, a Kenyan nonviolence conflict reconciliation trainer, a racial healing facilitator, and I'm mom to a 6 year old named Rumi, who is my navigational compass.

Stacie Freasier: 01:32

The views expressed here are not necessarily those of the CO OP board of directors, staff, volunteers, or underwriters. My social location is I am white bodied. I am disabled. I am queer. I'm in the middle of my life.

Stacie Freasier: 01:48

I'm middle class. I'm graduate school educated. I'm a 5th generation Texan, and I am culturally Lutheran and Buddhist practicing. And those are important for, the work that I do, to be aware of and to understand how those differences and characteristics overlap and exacerbate each other. And I give, thanks to Kimberly Crenshaw who coined the term intersectionality as some of my identities are rewarded by dominant society, and some of my identities are subjugated.

Stacie Freasier: 02:27

This show's purpose is to hold space for story sharing and information gathering and resource garnering with greater Austin area folks who are shining their liberatory lights. Be they healers or guides, storytellers, experimenters, frontline responders, visionaries, builders, caregivers, disruptors. There are many ways that you can show up in the social change map, and I give thanks to Deepa Iyer for framing those roles within, the social change map and the building movement project. We are broadcasting and recording on land protected by many indigenous people, including the Sauna, the Humanos, the Tonkawa, the Lipan Apache, the Comanche, the crude, Crudo, many others who have faced attempted erasure via violent settler colonialism, and that includes the actions of of many of my ancestors. So this show centers justice and historical truth.

Stacie Freasier: 03:35

And when we face that truth, it can be such a powerful force for connection and healing. So I invite you to join me in reclamation efforts by visiting native hyphen land dotca and find out who the indigenous people are on the land you are dwelling and working and living on. My guest on today's show is Jill Henderson, and, Jill, I am so excited to sit with you in conversation. Welcome welcome to the show.

Jill Henderson: 04:08

Thanks for having me.

Stacie Freasier: 04:10

So please, share with us, your Austen roots. Let's start there.

Jill Henderson: 04:17

Alright. So my Austin roots, I am originally from Wisconsin. My husband is a Texan. And so once I got married, we originated in Dallas, where he's from, but his job transferred him here to Austin in 1992. So we thought we would be here 5 years because, you know, as young people, we had a 5 year plan, and that 5 year plan has turned into 30 plus years of Austin living.

Jill Henderson: 04:45

So

Stacie Freasier: 04:46

My goodness. So Wisconsin to to Dallas to Austin. Yes. Alright. And since the nineties early nineties.

Stacie Freasier: 04:55

So that's so tell me about your what roots you've planted here.

Jill Henderson: 05:03

I would say all of our roots, really, because I was thinking about it a couple years ago. I've lived in Austin longer than I've lived anywhere in my entire life, so this is home to me. And one person asked me before, if I could live anywhere in the world, where would I live? And I said, you know what, Austin, because it's central in the United States, and it is it's diverse in some aspects, and some it's not. But it's also, it just has that home feeling.

Jill Henderson: 05:32

And the way the community rallied against us, I just wouldn't couldn't see us living anywhere else. So

Stacie Freasier: 05:39

Yeah. So you you mentioned the way the community rallied. So, tell me more about that. Tell me tell me tell me your story.

Jill Henderson: 05:53

Okay. So, my story is we have my husband and I have 3 children. We actually have an older son too. And he was raised in Dallas, and he was 2 when he came into my life as my bonus child. He was actually murdered in Dallas in 2017 due to gun violence.

Jill Henderson: 06:16

And so, that is still a cold case in unsolved murder. So 10 years later Well, actually, I mean, we were trying to get through that grief and trying to figure out how to navigate all of that and decided, you know what? We have a strong community, strong family ties, our Christian faith. So we just did what we knew how to do, which was to pray our way through and depend on our family and friends. So 10 years later, our son, Bakari, our middle child of the 3 that we have together, was a recent graduate of the University of Arizona where he had attended on a full academic scholarship, went to Greece, 2 months after graduation in order to pursue his dream of launching his clothesline, Bacari Luxury Sportswear.

Jill Henderson: 07:05

And, unfortunately, was in a club waiting on another friend with 2 other friends. And a Serbian woman approached him and took a selfie with him. And there was a Serbian man that did not appreciate that and asked, why are you taking a selfie with a black man and slapped Bakari. And so Bakari, defended himself, and the fight, they thought, ended in the bar. However, once the bar owner sent them outside, they were standing around, and all of a sudden, the gentleman well, I say gentleman lightly, but the person that slapped him, rallied his Serbian friends and Greek friends, and they basically chased Bakari down and beat him to death.

Stacie Freasier: 07:55

How old was he?

Jill Henderson: 07:56

Bakari was 22.

Stacie Freasier: 08:03

Your suffering is impossible for anyone to conceive as you just mentioned in your story losing 2 children.

Jill Henderson: 08:13

Mhmm.

Stacie Freasier: 08:15

How old was your older older son?

Jill Henderson: 08:17

He was 26. Yeah.

Stacie Freasier: 08:23

Well, I appreciate you sharing this deep, deep, deep hardship.

Jill Henderson: 08:31

Thank you.

Stacie Freasier: 08:32

So we may learn some lessons from it and from those sacrifices that your sons made

Jill Henderson: 08:44

Right.

Stacie Freasier: 08:45

In order for us to keep trying something different already.

Jill Henderson: 08:50

Yes. Yes.

Stacie Freasier: 08:52

So, we we have time and space to hold for, for either or both of these tragedies. And I'm curious where in this moment you want to to to take the story next because I think there's probably a lot of content for us in either of those stories.

Jill Henderson: 09:14

Yeah. I guess we can go and talk more about, Bacardi since it's the most recent and the one that we feel we're able to get more attraction on only because the 9 men that were detained were originally arrested. And unfortunately, they are now free, so we're still fighting that fight. And it's very different because it's an international fight. And so it's one that, also looks different depending on who you are and, unfortunately, depending on the color of your skin.

Jill Henderson: 09:55

I remember our attorneys originally telling us, oh, it's a no brainer. It's a it's all on film. It's, you know, gonna be a open and closed case with no questions asked. You know, we're just gonna go in there, and it'll be a slam dunk. And I remember telling him, there's no such thing as a no brainer case when you're dealing with a black man being killed.

Jill Henderson: 10:20

And he didn't understand what I was saying because, of course, he had never tried a case, a murder case with a black man before. So it was just totally he was shocked. But, anyway

Stacie Freasier: 10:32

Did you attend council here locally in in in Austin, or how how did that process

Jill Henderson: 10:38

No. That's a whole another process. So and and let me just say that the United States government does not assist you with this. So let's just put that out there so that people understand we are not getting support. So you have to do your own research and figure this out.

Jill Henderson: 10:54

The only thing that the government does is when they contact you with the worst news of your life, they email you a packet of information to repatriate your loved one home based on a list of people who have signed up to, embalm the person's body, and then they give you a list of attorneys. So because I'm inquisitive, I asked, so how do we determine which of these people is best for our situation, especially with the attorneys? Have they been vetted? What was the vetting process? There was no vetting process.

Jill Henderson: 11:28

Basically, you could just sign up through this application process. So I was like, okay. Well, this is ridiculous. How are we supposed to figure this out? We don't speak the language.

Jill Henderson: 11:39

You know? We just had no clue. So we had to engage one of it's a He's in the political realm, but also he is a minister. And so he's in the Greek community, Greek Orthodox community, father Alex. And thankfully, by the grace of God, someone connected us to him.

Jill Henderson: 12:05

And he connected us with an attorney who was not on the list, and so we ended up using that attorney. And so that's how we were connected. But it, again, it's a process, a very difficult one.

Stacie Freasier: 12:17

So it sounds like the faith community has played an integral part probably in many ways, but even in the the the immediate aftermath

Jill Henderson: 12:31

Yes. Of his murder. Yes. Definitely.

Stacie Freasier: 12:37

Was it the state department? Out of curiosity, like, who who sins like, is the, center of the United States government or what how does that work? Who who what agency is responsible for this very cold and inhumane correspondence?

Jill Henderson: 12:52

It is the state department.

Stacie Freasier: 12:53

Okay.

Jill Henderson: 12:54

But let me just say that the embassy in Greece, I mean, they have been amazing. Those are Americans, of course. Some are Greek that, you know, work all time. But they have always been amazing and very compassionate, but their hands are tied by the state department. And so in this journey, we have been trying to educate the legislators because most of them didn't even realize what little they do in helping citizens.

Jill Henderson: 13:19

They just assume, Oh, it's an American citizen. We've got laws in place to help you. And that's not the

Stacie Freasier: 13:25

case. Right. So this is a great example of, how systems

Stacie Freasier: 13:37

designed

Stacie Freasier: 13:40

and we I walk around with a lot of assumptions about what the systems that are in place exist for. And it certainly has been a dehumanizing experience, especially me navigating a disability, and and that's kicking up for me a little bit of what you're describing is okay. So when in the moment, I need it. Now I'm asking for it, and I'm getting nothing but the runaround. And, also, how important it is for us to be in relationship with one another as people and to look out for each other and to cultivate our own tapestry of support for each other in the absence of systems that were not designed to benefit us individually.

Jill Henderson: 14:33

Correct.

Stacie Freasier: 14:33

Does that resonate with you as well?

Jill Henderson: 14:35

Oh, yeah. Definitely.

Stacie Freasier: 14:38

So that original attorney, that you had reached out to, I'm curious as to their social location. Were they white bodied?

Jill Henderson: 14:47

Oh, yeah.

Stacie Freasier: 14:47

Racialized as white.

Jill Henderson: 14:49

Oh, yeah.

Stacie Freasier: 14:49

Thus, the naive question or the naive, this will be a no brainer. I think that that's a you know, speaking as, a white bodied person, I have a lot of blind spots, and, and I'm not I haven't been required to to to to even seek and grow and learn and obtain other perspectives unless I do it of my own volition as I have discovered on my journey to be become free. Mhmm. And our, our intrinsic connectedness in that is that I am not free until everybody is free. Mhmm.

Stacie Freasier: 15:31

And, also, these systems, benefit from me subscribing to them, believing to them, and in them and maintaining those blind spots.

Jill Henderson: 15:40

Right. Well, and the other blind spot is he's Greek. So, you know, that's his country. He lives in Greece. Those are his people.

Jill Henderson: 15:49

Even though I told him, I said, you know, this is still not a no brainer because they were Serbians and Greeks that killed him. He's a black American, so where do we play in this politically, logistically, relationally? I said, It's like your first cousin killing a stranger. What are you gonna do? And then so he was like, Oh, because then I asked, If these guys get away, will your government extradite them back and make sure that they are held accountable?

Jill Henderson: 16:23

They couldn't respond to that. So

Stacie Freasier: 16:27

If you are just joining us, you are listening to racism on the levels. I am your host, Stacey Fraser. I am sitting, in deep and meaningful conversation with Jill Henderson, and, we will be back momentarily.

Stacie Freasier: 17:54

I give thanks for the earth. I give thanks for the water.

Stacie Freasier: 23:27

Thank you for tuning in. You are listening to Racism on the Levels. I am your host, Stacey Fraser. Pronouns are she, they. I am joined by Jill Henderson, the founder of the Bakari Foundation.

Stacie Freasier: 23:39

And we are if you're just tuning in, we are talking about Jill's experience at navigating through and, trying to find justice, and I imagine healing for her family. Her son was murdered. Bakari is, was his is his name. Bakari was murdered, in Greece by a Serbian man or people. And where is it at now?

Stacie Freasier: 24:19

Where where is from a a the case standpoint, where are we?

Jill Henderson: 24:23

Yeah. So where we are, it was 9. So it's 9 Serbian and Greeks, And, the bar owner and a couple of his employees were also involved, and that's a whole separate lawsuit. So anyway, right now, we have had two trials. So we have been to Greece 8 times.

Jill Henderson: 24:42

And the first trial so the way their system works is you have to have a unanimous vote. And, there are 3 judges and 4 citizens, and so the but they all have equal votes. And so the first time, it was unanimous that it was not murder. They called it something much less like maybe manslaughter. And so the prosecutor appealed because he was outraged because all the evidence showed that, you know, it was murder.

Jill Henderson: 25:12

They had beat him to death, stomped him, kicked him. I mean, it was just it was brutal. And so he immediately requested an appeal, which was granted, which is unheard of also that the prosecutor would do it immediately. But this prosecutor had been prosecuting for 40 years and had never had his decision overturned. And so the appeal, we went in, and we were optimistic.

Jill Henderson: 25:35

We switched attorneys, and we ended up having, decision that we lost by one vote this time. So now it sits with the Supreme Court, and, actually, October 15th, they're supposed to hear the case, and we'll see if they decide that we can have a third trial. So one thing about the Greek system is that there's no, double jeopardy, so you can have another trial if they say so.

Stacie Freasier: 26:05

It is so difficult to understand and navigate the legal system within the United States, let alone another country. Jill, this is harrowing. Understatement. Yeah. 8 8 trips.

Stacie Freasier: 26:31

8 trips. Who, has supported you through all this? Who who have your supports been?

Jill Henderson: 26:42

I will say that we do have, 2 attorneys in New York who've been working pro bono, who have been amazing in helping us to navigate. Because a lot of times, the Greek attorneys have been male, and so they have a different mindset as well. And so they feel like they need to talk to someone that understands their profession. And so having them on our side has been good so that we can say, you know, even if I'm the one doing the research, as long as it comes from them, it's received better. Otherwise, it's just like this American woman doesn't know what she's talking about.

Stacie Freasier: 27:22

So the intersectionality again. Right. Patriarchy.

Jill Henderson: 27:25

Yes. Exactly. Yeah. So it's it's it's very, very different. But thank God we've had them.

Jill Henderson: 27:32

We've had our church community, our family, friends, the Austin community. And so and then it's interesting. People reach out every so often from different parts of the world who knew Bacardi. So that's been amazing as well.

Soyinka Rahim: 29:31

The spirits are here with us. The spirits

Soyinka Rahim: 29:41

are here with us.

Stacie Freasier: 29:46

The spirits are here with us. The spirit are here with us.

Soyinka Rahim: 30:14

Healing spirits. The spirits

Stacie Freasier: 30:22

Are here with

Soyinka Rahim: 30:24

us, loving spirits. The

Stacie Freasier: 30:29

spirits

Soyinka Rahim: 30:34

are here with us.

Soyinka Rahim: 30:40

The spirits

Soyinka Rahim: 30:46

are here with

Stacie Freasier: 30:53

us. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Stacie Freasier: 30:58

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Stacie Freasier: 31:02

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Stacie Freasier: 31:07

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Stacie Freasier: 31:08

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Stacie Freasier: 31:08

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Stacie Freasier: 31:09

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Stacie Freasier: 31:10

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Stacie Freasier: 31:11

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Stacie Freasier: 31:12

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Stacie Freasier: 31:13

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Stacie Freasier: 31:13

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Stacie Freasier: 31:13

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Stacie Freasier: 31:13

Yeah. Yeah.

Stacie Freasier: 31:26

What did, Bakari, you mentioned, had created a a sports luxury line. Is that right?

Jill Henderson: 31:32

Yes. Yes. And so he went to school, and he was a finance major. And he had entrepreneurship as a minor. And so we were thinking, oh, great.

Jill Henderson: 31:42

I mean, he had interviewed with Goldman Sachs, BlackRock. So we're thinking, oh, good. He's gonna, you know, get a good job, make good money, and be on his way. Well, when he got home, he told us that he wanted to pursue his clothesline. And my husband and I were like, oh, well, what does that mean?

Jill Henderson: 31:57

And so he said, Well, I'm gonna do it full time. And we said, Well, why don't you do it part time and see how it goes? And he said, Well, you can't do something like this part time. He said, And plus, it's basically, it's my if you have a plan a, you don't have a need for plan b, and this is my plan a. So plan a is for those who don't have no.

Jill Henderson: 32:22

Plan b is for those who aren't confident in their plan b. Plan a. I'm so sorry. Oh my gosh.

Stacie Freasier: 32:28

So to to sum it up, he was quite confident in his path.

Jill Henderson: 32:32

His plan

Stacie Freasier: 32:32

a. He's like, this is my path.

Stacie Freasier: 32:34

Yes.

Jill Henderson: 32:35

Even though his mom has now messed up the quote. But

Stacie Freasier: 32:37

he also

Stacie Freasier: 32:37

Also, in the back of his mind, it must have been that he had you as a mom who is obviously a mountain mover in your solidity and resilience. So maybe that

Jill Henderson: 32:48

was a part b in the back. Really appreciated that as much as his own self confidence, because he always had confidence growing up. And, I mean, he traveled to China, when he was in high school, like his senior year in high school, the last year. No. He was going into his freshman year, and he went over to China with other MBA students.

Jill Henderson: 33:11

It was a pre MBA student program. And he was the youngest. Everybody else was in their thirties. And so they were, you know, working, trying to figure out if they wanted to do it. And so, I mean, he always did big things.

Jill Henderson: 33:24

And one of my friends said, you know, it's like he's trying to check off his bucket list before 25. And so because he traveled to 13 countries on his own dime, you know, worked and had a little business, him and another friend at a different university, and they did, different ventures together. So it was just that was just him. He always told me that he was gonna retire me in 5 years and that I was gonna work for him. And I could be his chef, but I would have to interview for the position.

Jill Henderson: 34:00

So so yeah.

Stacie Freasier: 34:01

So what lessons, does he leave us?

Jill Henderson: 34:07

I would say to definitely live life fearlessly and live it to the fullest because you never know when it ends. I mean, we would always think, Slow down. Take a breath. And he was always he was calm about it, but you could see he was so intense. He was just always on a 100 in his mind.

Jill Henderson: 34:29

And so a lot of things that people would say was that he was always listening to them also, checking ins, motivating people to reach their goals, and never really flaunting what he was doing. So a lot of them never even thought to check and see, you know, what is it that you're going through or what do you need because he was there as their support. And so I think that's what reenergized him and gave him the motivation to move, you know, quickly and as fast as he could, as hard as he could. So yeah. So I would say loving people, listening to people, encouraging people, and humbling yourself so that you can really be present with them.

Stacie Freasier: 35:14

Mhmm. Thank you, Bakari, for those lessons. So with let's let's shift a little bit to creating the foundation.

Soyinka Rahim: 35:29

Mhmm.

Stacie Freasier: 35:29

So when in this ongoing adversity did you decide to create the foundation, and and what is its purpose?

Jill Henderson: 35:40

So interesting enough, I, had always, in my spirit, felt like I was gonna have a foundation, but just never knew exactly what I'd, I'd have sparks in moments of, I'm gonna do young girls. I'm gonna do this. I'm gonna do that. So I knew it was something that was embedded in me, but when we lost Bakari so tragically and because he also was on a mission to create a legacy through this close line and other ventures that he had mapped out, we thought, okay. Well, we cannot let that die for sure.

Jill Henderson: 36:14

And so I said, well, in parallel, he had this list the checklist of things we needed to do when we got back. And one was to create his LLC. So immediately, January 2018, I created the LLC. And my husband and my family, we decided, you know what? We wanted to be a cause brand, not just a regular brand.

Jill Henderson: 36:34

And so that's when we decided to do the foundation. So we filed the paperwork for both together in 2018. And one of his friends, dear friend who he met in kindergarten, who he started the business with, who went to UT, came over, and he actually kinda pitched an idea of how to make what we wanted to do into something viable because his brother had been the recipient of the Ronald McDonald no. I'm sorry. Make A Wish Foundation.

Jill Henderson: 37:10

And so, basically and we wanted ours to be about travel. And so he said, well, why don't we do something similar in concept? People can make a wish on where they wanna go. However, it kinda transitioned because the first time we did the Make A Wish concept, you only are touching one family. And it's very difficult for families that have been impacted by homicide to make decisions.

Jill Henderson: 37:34

It's very difficult, especially together. And so, you know, you have to figure out where you wanna go, when you wanna go, you know, all this stuff. And then it was just too much logistically. So then the next year, we changed the model to the retreats. And so it's now a family retreat.

Jill Henderson: 37:49

We tell them when we're going. We tell them how long you're gonna be there, what to bring. You know? It's just a mindless process. The only thing they have to do is have a passport.

Jill Henderson: 37:57

So that's how we transitioned.

Stacie Freasier: 38:00

And how many, times have you held the retreats?

Jill Henderson: 38:04

We have gone 3 times so far.

Stacie Freasier: 38:06

Amazing. And do you go to the same place?

Jill Henderson: 38:09

We do because life is about relationships, and we have built that's another thing Bakari loved too. So but we have made this wonderful relationship with this boutique location, and it's actually 2 properties kind of connected. And so, the families And usually, it's just us there. And so one of the other properties will have a few other people there. But they have been amazing.

Jill Henderson: 38:35

I mean, it's remote. It's you're look overlooking the ocean, but you're in the mountains.

Stacie Freasier: 38:41

We have a Pacific or Atlantic side?

Jill Henderson: 38:43

Oh, I don't know. I know you're

Stacie Freasier: 38:44

asking that.

Jill Henderson: 38:44

I don't know that part, Stacy. I don't know. I'm talk

Stacie Freasier: 38:47

you're grabbing a little bit. A a traveler.

Jill Henderson: 38:51

Okay. Well, I travel, but I just go. Like, I don't know where I'm going.

Stacie Freasier: 38:54

You got other things going on too.

Jill Henderson: 38:58

So but it is I think it's the Pacific side, if I'm not mistaken. But it's, it's in the rainforest, and the staff, the owners are just amazing. So they become like extended family. And so, I mean, they get excited when we're coming. We they help us figure out volunteer stuff to do with school that we've adopted there in elementary school because we wanna be immersed in the culture.

Jill Henderson: 39:21

So that's another thing that we're doing. It's not just it is a healing retreat, but it's healing. It's learning about other people because we believe that that breaks down those barriers that create hate. You have to know other people and know about other cultures. You can't just look at somebody from the outside and assume because of what you've seen on TV or what you've read that you know about them.

Stacie Freasier: 39:42

I appreciate that. Cultural fluency. And there are tourists and there are travelers.

Jill Henderson: 39:47

Yes.

Stacie Freasier: 39:48

And, there is

Stacie Freasier: 39:49

extraction, which is a tool of capitalism and

Stacie Freasier: 39:49

imperialism, and then there is appreciation. Yes. Capitalism and imperialism, and then there is appreciation. Yes. And so I appreciate you lifting up that Oh, yeah.

Stacie Freasier: 39:59

In

Jill Henderson: 39:59

this, story.

Stacie Freasier: 40:00

If you're just joining us, you are tuned in to racism on the levels. I am your host, Stacey Fraser. I am joined with by Janelle Henderson of the Bakari Foundation, who has created such a lovely program for healing for self and others simultaneously through, senseless tragedy, that befell her family and her son, Bakari. So, Jill, you mentioned, in the, you know, workup for this program, justice. And what is the role how does justice play in or what is the role of justice in your creation?

Jill Henderson: 40:51

I would say the role of justice is to not try to play God, first of all, because we know that God will ultimately get justice in the way that he sees fit. So trying to keep that at the forefront of my mind, but also helping others to learn how to advocate for themselves to get the justice that they desire, and not only desire, but deserve, but, also, making sure that it's not only a punitive thing, but that it's a healing process

Stacie Freasier: 41:28

for,

Jill Henderson: 41:30

dare I say, both parties involved. So I would say that's what it is to me.

Stacie Freasier: 41:39

I I really love that. Justice is often the connotation is punishment.

Jill Henderson: 41:48

Mhmm. But

Stacie Freasier: 41:51

justice is it can be healing. Yes. And reconciliation is beautiful. Mhmm. And justice is love is Oh, yeah.

Stacie Freasier: 42:04

The first

Jill Henderson: 42:05

Yes.

Stacie Freasier: 42:06

Word that I use if I was described. Like, what it justice is love. Mhmm. And the agape sense of love is, you know, doctor King says, but also in, you know, the levels of filial love

Stacie Freasier: 42:24

Mhmm.

Stacie Freasier: 42:26

Brotherly. There goes the patriarchy again. Mhmm. Sisterly love, all people.

Soyinka Rahim: 42:31

That's true.

Stacie Freasier: 42:32

And, yeah, and and and sometimes the most beautiful things come out of the most broken

Stacie Freasier: 42:37

Yes.

Stacie Freasier: 42:38

Places.

Jill Henderson: 42:39

Yes. That's true. Yeah. It's funny because, one of your questions was about values, and that's my value is love. Because I do believe that without love, all else fails.

Jill Henderson: 42:51

So, I mean, love is the key to everything, really.

Stacie Freasier: 42:55

Yeah. So It's the way, and it's the solution.

Jill Henderson: 42:58

Mhmm. Exactly. Exactly.

Stacie Freasier: 43:00

So turning back to, closer to your to to our Austin community that we're both in, and

Stacie Freasier: 43:07

Mhmm.

Stacie Freasier: 43:08

We have a kazillion other, common connections. But the common thread is this, like, tightly woven community Right. Of lovers and supporters. Mhmm. And, and I think that's really beautiful about Austen.

Stacie Freasier: 43:24

And, I had left Austen for 20 years, and I came back in 2021 Okay. And, and fell into a community having developed racial consciousness anti black racism, and racial consciousness living a decade in in the northeast. Okay. Okay. So that really developed my praxis and,

Stacie Freasier: 43:46

you

Stacie Freasier: 43:46

know, part of why I have this show today. And what what healing do you think is possible? What racial healing is possible here in Austin, Jill?

Jill Henderson: 44:02

I would say it's limitless, really, because Austin is such a unique place. You have so many different people. You have your business sectors sectors and your creatives and your religious groups and organizations. And so what I think would help to make this a more unified approach is if people started talking together that are truly on the other end of the spectrum. Because a lot of us are close, but then we have some that are really far apart still.

Jill Henderson: 44:47

And so I think if we started having those, those more complex conversations in an authentic, loving environment where you can speak your truth but with respect, I think that would help us to get there even quicker. But I think it's limitless. We just have to be open to it.

Stacie Freasier: 45:07

What type of space here in town would be conducive to that?

Jill Henderson: 45:12

That's a good question. So I recently went to a, gathering with women, all women of faith, different faith, and it was, Republicans, Independents, and Democrats so that we could have some of these authentic conversations. And so, that was in a church, but I think it could be anywhere, anywhere that can hold the amount of people. And I don't think you need tons of people because then people shut down also. So I think it, even in homes, I think homes would be the best place, because it's more of a safe environment.

Jill Henderson: 45:52

So that's what I would say.

Stacie Freasier: 45:55

There is a a palpable and has been since master plan, then the highway, I 35, and now economic development, private developing just further and further and further, you know, causing accelerated displacement of black and brown families Mhmm. From Austin Central. Where do you see that this is a vision question, but where do you see where does that end, or what does that look like? And and how do we reconcile that? How do we do this work given that dynamic?

Jill Henderson: 46:38

That's hard. That's really hard, and it's one that I think at least Austin is well, everybody's aware of it when it's happening in their city, but I think Austin is aware of it, and they have advocates that are trying to navigate that. I think people shouldn't be pushed out for any reason. And so, you know, economics plays a lot of that too, and there's that huge economic divide, which is another program that we offer at the Bacardi Foundation is financial literacy and entrepreneurship because we recognize the wealth gap. And the way to help our communities also is to give them more knowledge about financial situations so that they can uplift themselves and their communities.

Jill Henderson: 47:32

So many people won't be working for corporate. They need to know how to manage their own life and their own businesses and how to make ends meet without depending only on, the government because that may not be there either. So I don't know if that was helpful. But

Stacie Freasier: 47:50

Absolutely. And I appreciate tying it back to, to what Bakaria's foundation is focused on. So, how do how do how do you find the families in need, or how do they find you? Like, what how did how has it gone so far? Mhmm.

Jill Henderson: 48:07

It's both it's mostly been word-of-mouth. Like, if we do a news segment, we might get a few flood ins that way, but mostly word-of-mouth because I will tell you it's such an incredible experience that a lot of people, I don't believe, think it's true. And so

Stacie Freasier: 48:25

It doesn't seem true. Right.

Jill Henderson: 48:27

And they've been harmed. You know? And they're traumatized, trying to recover, and they're like, that's one less thing that I'm gonna be you know, I'm not gonna get taken again. And so the trust factor is there. And so because it is such an intimate group and we take 2 licensed therapists with us I mean, it's hard work also, and so I think people also have to be at a stage where they're ready to commit to that level because you're gonna be vulnerable with other people.

Jill Henderson: 48:58

But it's mostly word-of-mouth. You can go on to our website. The application is there. It's no application fee. It takes probably 10 minutes.

Jill Henderson: 49:08

Everything we are doing is intentional because families need to learn to heal together. Right now, the way American society is set up, you go to your therapist by yourself. A husband may go by his self. A wife may go by herself. Maybe they'll do couples together occasionally.

Jill Henderson: 49:24

You don't have the family going together. And so it's a very unique opportunity for us to start to understand each other, identify each other's triggers, and, you know, what matters to you so that we aren't continuing to harm each other inadvertently. So

Stacie Freasier: 49:43

When the so the family travels together

Stacie Freasier: 49:46

Mhmm.

Stacie Freasier: 49:46

Is that multigenerational? It's like, how many

Jill Henderson: 49:50

how many people? Yeah. That's a good question too. So on the because

Stacie Freasier: 49:55

my family reunions growing up were, like, 70 people. Right. It was, like, all 70 people. No.

Jill Henderson: 50:01

And is your immediate family and immediate looks different for different communities. I appreciate

Stacie Freasier: 50:05

you giving voice to that.

Jill Henderson: 50:06

Yeah. So it's, you know, so it's different. And so it's not one like, you don't say, oh, it can be 2 parents and 2 children because maybe you're a stepdad and a stepmom and, you know, a cousin that lives in the house that was living there the whole time that's family but not really legally. And that's what we say on the application to tell us what your household looks like, and then we go from there. And we make sure that we merge the families accordingly.

Jill Henderson: 50:37

So

Stacie Freasier: 50:38

The, you mentioned having 2 therapists, and I've you know, my I've I've my family has been in crisis more than one time. And, and they think about how crisis, yeah, shuts you down in terms of ability, maybe even to brush your teeth and get up and shower in the morning. So I think it's incredibly, it's a testament to to what you are creating for this to even for someone to even take that leap of faith to go. Mhmm. And it's also incredibly brave and admirable for these families in crisis who have who have answered the call and gone.

Jill Henderson: 51:22

Yes. I agree. I always applaud them because it's hard to get your whole family committed to do something like this. Yeah. So

Stacie Freasier: 51:31

So you mentioned your website is how folks can find you. Mhmm. What is on the horizon, for Bacardi Foundation?

Jill Henderson: 51:40

I would say what's on the horizon is we have our annual event that's in April every year intentionally because Bacardi's birthday is in April, so it's a celebration of life. And we bring in the families that, are going to be awarded the following that summer so that people can meet who's going so they can kinda knock off the cobwebs and meet each other too. But, also, families that have come in the past come. And so it's it's really a good time for everybody to come together and celebrate and commune together. But, also, we're doing a lot of advocacy work as well.

Jill Henderson: 52:17

As a matter of fact, we're heading to DC Sunday for the first ever crime survivors for safety and justice march on DC, where there'll be 2,000 survivors there. And so, Phil and I will stay Phil's my husband. We'll stay after and talk to legislators about what we're trying to do also. But those are the key things is that our advocacy work, because we want equitable policies for families in every aspect and especially in mental health because black and brown families are just getting to the table. And so, we're trying to create an atmosphere where we're that voice to help them get to the table so that we're not the menu, because in so many situations, we're just talked about and not talked

Stacie Freasier: 53:05

to. And if you are gonna be at that table, which is absolutely worthy, Make sure that table is culturally responsive because, you know, that's meant the mental health complex is rife with notions of bias. Mhmm. And, that that I have to give a shout out to the board. I'm on real queens fix each other's crowns for a second here because we're trying to offer that

Stacie Freasier: 53:36

Right.

Stacie Freasier: 53:37

Culturally, responsive and and access accessible mental health and wellness, experiences for primarily BIPOC girls and women. And so Yep. I I've haven't done this conversation mapping conversation with you yet about who who in the real Queens world you're connected into, but we certainly have overlap. They're an interest.

Jill Henderson: 54:03

Yes. Definitely. Definitely.

Stacie Freasier: 54:06

Well, we are wrapping up on our time here together, Jill. So, anything on your heart and or your head for that you want to to share for our listeners today?

Jill Henderson: 54:20

I would just say, you know, life is so short and life is so unexpected, but there are things that we can do in the midst of it, and that is to honor each other, honor ourselves, and do our best to love unconditionally. I know that's a hard ask, even for me, even as I say it, but, we have to love and forgive, and then, really, we have to I mean, I have a quote. It says, love I'm not gonna tell you my quote. But, anyway, it's it's it's I just think that life is so short and so complex, and so I really just want people to focus on love. That's why I'm not gonna say the quote, because I think love intertwines all of it, the forgiveness, the reconciliation, everything, and it teaches us how to deal with one another because it gives you that compassionate heart and that empathy for others because right now our world is it's in turmoil.

Jill Henderson: 55:30

It's upside down everywhere. So it's a global concern.

Stacie Freasier: 55:33

Bound. Mhmm.

Jill Henderson: 55:35

Yep. Yep.

Stacie Freasier: 55:37

Well, thank you again and again and again.

Jill Henderson: 55:42

Thank you.

Stacie Freasier: 55:42

Thank you, Bakari

Jill Henderson: 55:44

Oh, yeah.

Stacie Freasier: 55:44

Who's with us.

Jill Henderson: 55:47

For sure.

Stacie Freasier: 55:48

And, that that that I'm gonna bring us home here. You, you have been listening to racism on the levels, and I really appreciate y'all being on this journey with me. And the music you just heard was generously gifted from my comrade, Shoyinka Rahim, and appears on the 2016 album Bebo Love. Let's be in community for real, for real, for real. So please reach out to me with things you loved, things you would like to see differently, guest ideas, show ideas, healing ideas, ideas on racism, actions on anti racism.

Stacie Freasier: 56:34

My email is stacie, [e-mail]. Up next is democracy now. And remember, in all things and all ways, love is the highest level.

Soyinka Rahim: 56:59

I got a love song. I got a hit song. In this world, you only need one song. To live your life like you visualize a philanthropist, I take it nothing. Never giving up on the love to, and let your light shine like the sunshine.

Soyinka Rahim: 57:14

A celebration, no separation. Travel the world, sharing your time with the young and the old and the rich and the poor. The conversation, let them move your soul.