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Released every Tuesday, the LOUNGE LIZARDS podcast helps listeners navigate the experience of finding and enjoying premium cigars (both Cuban and non-Cuban) and quality spirits. Episodes are normally around 90 minutes long and feature a variety of different topics including food, travel, life, sports and work.
The podcast features eight members: Rooster, Poobah, Gizmo, Senator, Pagoda, Chef Ricky, Grinder and Bam Bam.
This is not your typical cigar podcast. We’re a group of friends who love sharing cigars, whiskey and a good laugh.
Join us and become a card-carrying lounge lizard yourself! Email us at hello@loungelizardspod.com to join the conversation and be featured on an upcoming episode!
Welcome to the Lounge Lizards podcast presented by Fabric of Five. It's so good to have you here. It's a leisure and lifestyle podcast founded on our love of premium cigars as well as whiskey travel food work and whatever else we feel like getting into. My name is Gizmo. Today, I'm joined by Rooster, Senator, chef Ricky, and Bam Bam.
Gizmo:And our plan is to smoke a cigar, drink some scotch, talk about life, and, of course, have some laughs. So take this as your two hundred and thirty seventh official invitation to join us and become a card carrying lounge lizard. Planet meet us here once a week. We're gonna smoke a Dominican cigar tonight, share our thoughts on it, and give you a formal lizard rating. We share our wide ranging interview with industry legend Ernesto Perez-Carrillo from PCA twenty twenty six, where we discussed his long history in the business, his intentional blending process, and how it all comes back to music, all among a variety of other things for the next two hours.
Gizmo:So sit back, get your favorite drink, write up a cigar, and enjoy as we pair Glenlivet Fusion Cask single malt scotch whiskey with the Perez-Carrillo Pledge Purple. A Dominican Toro on the pod tonight, boys, from Perez-Carrillo, from Casa Carrillo. It's called the Pledge Purple, and it's a 54 ring gauge cigar by six inches long. And, boys, we have a very exciting night tonight because Correct. We are gonna smoke this cigar and we are gonna share and hear our interview with Ernesto Perez-Carrillo that we recorded at PCA, which I'm very, very excited to share tonight.
Bam Bam:That was a great time.
Gizmo:It was awesome. Really, really cool. So we have the new special edition cigar in our hand, the Pledge Purple, and bam, I know you've had the cigar. You really enjoyed it.
Bam Bam:I had four of these. I liked them. They were smooth, creamy, very easy to smoke. Interchangeable with a few other cigars that we'll talk about.
Gizmo:I love the purple detailing on the box
Bam Bam:Me too.
Gizmo:On the bands. I think the purple is such a great look
Gizmo:For cigars. It's really well done. And let's cut this thing, boys. Let's see what we're getting on the cold draw and the wrapper.
Bam Bam:Very nice cold draw.
Gizmo:Cold draw is awesome. Berry forward. It's almost like cakey.
Bam Bam:I'm getting like a raspberry thing. You know what? Like a raspberry scone. Little carbohydrate there, little berry thing happening. Chef, come on.
Chef Ricky:I agree with all of that.
Bam Bam:Give it to me.
Chef Ricky:Really, really intense, berry. There's another note that I'm getting that I can't quite describe just yet. Mint. Mint.
Bam Bam:You guys ain't here mint. Spearmint.
Gizmo:Who gets iron? Coming from the guy who says carbohydrate
Bam Bam:That oh, that's
Gizmo:30% of the
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:like mint.
Chef Ricky:You know, you're not wrong, Rooster. It it leaves a minty sensation on on your palate a little bit.
Bam Bam:I don't know, but senator looks confused right now.
Rooster:It's like a mouth fresher.
Senator:Because I'm getting that weird minty Mhmm. But it almost tastes like Mint?
Rooster:Like
Senator:It's like mint, but there's also like a a leather or something in the background.
Gizmo:Yeah. There's something there. It's very cool. It's leathery mint. I gotta say, these are very, very dark wrappers on this thing.
Bam Bam:They are?
Rooster:Very toothy.
Bam Bam:Yeah. Now senators had this and he said it was okay. You weren't thrilled with
Senator:it. Yeah, I don't know. I didn't have a great experience with my first one. I'm not sure if the humidity was too low, too high, so I'm curious how this one's going to perform because a lot of other people have really loved this cigar.
Chef Ricky:Did you get that minty note on the
Bam Bam:first one?
Senator:I actually did not at all. Only this time.
Bam Bam:No mint for me.
Chef Ricky:No. I'm definitely getting it.
Rooster:No. I'm getting
Gizmo:it here. You're saying it the last time. I'm sorry. I'm not getting mint here.
Senator:No. But the funny thing is why BAM said I look confused, I started smelling my hands did I touch something minty or leathery? It really is the cigar that
Bam Bam:it's coming from? Were you polishing your shoes?
Gizmo:Alright, boys.
Senator:We have people for that, though.
Gizmo:Let's like this thing. Yippeze Carrillo Pledge Purple from Casa Carrillo tonight on the pod. The new special release from Casa Carrillo, and it's a 54 ring gauge Toro by six inches long. The MSRP on this boys is $18, and we got them for $16.50.
Rooster:So
Gizmo:on a special release, special edition, I like that price. Yeah. Especially in a Toro. Correct. I think it's a very good price.
Senator:Sorry. When you say special release, so this isn't gonna be part of the standard proposal?
Gizmo:3,500 boxes only. Wow. 35,000 cigars, that's it. I gotta say it's actually it was actually a little difficult to find them.
Senator:I will note, I'm very proud of myself. I have a perfectly clean palette. I haven't had a cigar or drink prior to this recording.
Gizmo:That might be the first in about 250 episodes.
Bam Bam:Bam, approved activity. Correct. That's correct.
Chef Ricky:I had spaghetti and meatballs about forty five minutes ago.
Senator:Oh my god. I can't wait for the tomato note.
Bam Bam:Ketchup. Okay. Where'd you have that? Home. Good for you.
Bam Bam:Wife made it. Very nice. I haven't had spaghetti and meatballs in ages. So she does this
Senator:I haven't had a wife made it meal and I don't know when's the last time. Also true.
Chef Ricky:Does this thing where she lets the kids pick their crave meal.
Bam Bam:Nice.
Chef Ricky:So my daughter was craving Perfect. Spaghetti and
Gizmo:I like that. That's a cool concept.
Bam Bam:That is cool. Yes.
Gizmo:My mother never did that. No. She said, Here's what we're having.
Bam Bam:Dinner's ready.
Gizmo:And it's called Meatloaf.
Chef Ricky:There are those days too, you know? But earlier in the week, she's a little bit easier, so she likes to have fun with them.
Gizmo:This is off to a nice start.
Rooster:Nice on the light.
Gizmo:Yeah. Very elegant, smooth,
Senator:a little salty. This is already better than the one I had before, which leads me to believe that it was not at the right RH.
Gizmo:This is very refined on the light.
Bam Bam:I agree.
Gizmo:I really like it. I think you're onto something here, Ben.
Rooster:I do too. A little chocolate.
Bam Bam:Yep. Coffee. For me, it's like a sweet coffee.
Chef Ricky:Yeah, I'm getting a lot of espresso notes here.
Bam Bam:With sugar. A sweeter coffee, maybe sweet cream in there. I agree. Yeah.
Senator:It's like a brown sugar,
Bam Bam:which I don't ever put in my coffee ever, but I get it here.
Gizmo:So this cigar was put together by the Perez-Carrillo family, celebrating the fifth anniversary of the cigar, the pledge prequel being the number one cigar of the year with Cigar Aficionados. So what they did is Ernesto went back and did a completely new blend. We talk about this a little bit in our upcoming interview tonight that you're going to hear. It's brand new blend. It is called the prequel, but it's an addition, a special edition addition to the line And it's a completely different blend using the same exact wrapper from a company called Dun and Foster, which is a Havana Seed Connecticut, which is ten years old at this point.
Gizmo:Come on. The wrapper is ten years old at this point. At the time it came out, it was five years old on the original pledge prequel. So the only identical component to this specifically is the rapper is identical. The blend is totally different.
Gizmo:The binder is Mexican and the filler comes from Nicaragua. Esteli, Condega, and Ometepe are the three regions that it's coming from. Coming out of the Dominican Republic factory, the Casa Carrillo factory. And again, 3,500 boxes of this, boxes of 10, suggested retail, 180 a box. So these came out in March of this year and are now being smoked and enjoyed.
Gizmo:I've seen some very nice things about this. So I'm looking forward to trying it.
Bam Bam:They are hard to get.
Chef Ricky:I really like this. Very rich, robust smoke.
Gizmo:So they say on their site here that the strength is full on this cigar. Where would you put that right now?
Bam Bam:I'd say medium to full. Medium full.
Gizmo:This is more medium to me.
Senator:Yeah. I think in terms of strength, but in terms of flavor
Gizmo:Flavor, it's full. There's a lot of flavor. But the body The
Bam Bam:body is Yeah. Firmly medium, which is what makes it smooth and easy to smoke. Very elegant. So there are other cigars that would interchange with this. I had the Espiritu in the lounge the other day.
Bam Bam:I think this, there's some parity with the Espiritu, and slight parity with the Exclusivo from Padron, and even the Orange Banded Aging Room Quattro possibly. These are really four cool cigars that I just love the idea of mixing and matching for a night out. I think they all work beautifully, and it can slot for what you're looking for in I a similar
Senator:love the comparison. I feel like all of those are in the same class in that from a flavor perspective, a strength perspective, they all would kinda slot in at the same moment, and so rotating through them, I think would be fun.
Rooster:Yeah. And it would be
Gizmo:It is nice to have options where in the past, only the Exclusivo or something from that kind of Padron launch We would slot
Bam Bam:could still smoke that every fucking
Rooster:but I'm
Gizmo:saying it is a lot of
Bam Bam:us And we do, correct.
Gizmo:But it's nice that there's other options that kind of satisfy that slot if you want a little bit of variety to your point. So I think that's a great observation.
Rooster:Yeah. I mean, although this is more expensive than an Exclusivo.
Bam Bam:It's slightly higher, yeah.
Rooster:Slightly higher. A little bit. Much higher than the Aspera two.
Gizmo:That's true.
Bam Bam:That is true.
Gizmo:But this also has ten years aged wrapper leaf on it. So there's definitely some expense there.
Bam Bam:That's true.
Senator:It's funny. There's one thing I give Casa Carrillo, I guess I'll say credit for. There's just like a very distinct smoothness to all of their cigars. Like, immediately know, like, even their fuller flavored stuff, like, is full flavor, but the delivery is super smooth, very medium bodied. And I feel like even of the ones that we just named, like, the delivery of this, like, even against the Padron X Lucivo, like, it's a softer, lighter, less heavy delivery, and it's just fascinating.
Senator:It's clearly characteristic of their blending style, and
Bam Bam:I I think there's something to be said for said this months and months ago, the last time we did one of these. I don't know if it's that, but there is this DNA in almost all of their cigars that kinda makes it easy to identify what you're smoking if there's no wrapper on it. It's it could be the that slight box press, which is not ever perfect. I don't know. I can't put my finger on it.
Bam Bam:But there's that similarity from line to line in his
Rooster:It's very balanced. Yeah. There's no one note that's overpowering. You get a little bit of even black pepper, but it's not so much that it dominates the cigar.
Chef Ricky:It's almost like it's not even ground black pepper. It's just the whole peppercorn. And you're getting the floral note of that pepper. And now what I'm getting as well is this like a freshly baked dark chocolate brownie.
Bam Bam:Sounds delicious. What are you guys getting on the retro?
Chef Ricky:I'm getting a little bit of the espresso It's chocolate espresso. Yeah.
Gizmo:Dude. And it's so smooth though.
Bam Bam:Yeah. I couldn't agree more.
Gizmo:Especially There is no pepper for me
Bam Bam:On the retro? Not
Gizmo:on the Not
Chef Ricky:on the retro.
Gizmo:There's nothing
Bam Bam:It's there on the very chocolate forward for me on
Rooster:the retro.
Rooster:Dark chocolate.
Bam Bam:Kind of. It's very pleasant.
Senator:This is very good. I'm so glad that this is not like my prior experience. This is what I would expect from Gurkha Cuban.
Bam Bam:Yeah. So maybe there's merit to this bringing up the humidity on these.
Gizmo:So why did
Senator:you score this at?
Gizmo:So let's shout out Lizard T. If you remember last week on the Davidoff episode, I read an email, kinda the last email of the day. Read an email where Lizard T noted that we she, you know, she heard the pledge prequel coming up on the hey, Lizards, you know, here's what's coming up thing on the front of the episode. And specifically said that she normally would dry box the cigars very similar to what we do, you know, down to 63, 64, Cubans even lower. And that her experience with the pledge specifically, the lower it got in humidity, the worse it got since she's been smoking them over the last two months.
Gizmo:So she specifically said, please do not dry box it like I did. She said, As soon as they came back up in the humidity in the 67, 68 range, they were perfect.
Rooster:So what I did
Gizmo:with these is I kept these at the bottom of my tower. I did not dry box them. They were at the bottom. They were in that 66, 67 range. So I'm thinking that over the couple weeks that I've had them now, that they've probably come down just a little bit from maybe that 70 range where they were.
Gizmo:But I'm glad we did it because this
Senator:This is off to a nice would now make perfect sense because I had gotten that this cigar from someone else. It was wet when I got it, and I put it up high in my tower near my Cubans to let it really come down over we normally do. A decent period of time and then smoked it and did not have the experience I'm having now. So clearly great advice.
Gizmo:Yeah. So thanks to Lizard T for that. Hugely helpful. And I you know, what I wonder and I almost wanna ask Ernesto this. I wonder if it has something to do with that United States rapper that's on this, that Havana Seed, Connecticut from Dun and Foster ten years aged.
Gizmo:I wonder if that has some sort of where you're pulling down the humidity on a 10 year aged rapper as, you know, it was blended intending it to be higher. I don't know, but I'm wondering what it is that the humidity could potentially be affecting that in an opposite way of all those other cigars you listed that would slot here.
Rooster:Correct.
Gizmo:It's the opposite experience for most of those.
Bam Bam:Prefer them lower.
Senator:Yeah. Do we know where in The US the wrapper's from? Connecticut. Connecticut. Gotcha.
Senator:Could be the
Bam Bam:wrapper itself being it looks very durable. It looks like a very thick substantial wrapper. Maybe that Yeah.
Gizmo:Maybe it gets bitter. Maybe it gets bitter when it's dried out.
Bam Bam:Could be.
Gizmo:I don't know. Or just the blend in general. Whatever whatever happened here, thanks to Lizard Tea, I'm very glad because it's it's off to a really nice start.
Bam Bam:We should have asked Ernesto, what humidity percentages do you like
Gizmo:to smoke your cigars at? We talked about it.
Bam Bam:Did we ask him that? Yes. His own personal cigars.
Gizmo:We had a whole thing. He was saying that he preferred Remember I said that retailers keep stuff too high? He agreed. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. He said he brings stuff down.
Bam Bam:That's true.
Gizmo:He lets stuff sit.
Bam Bam:Kind of like we do.
Gizmo:Yeah. Yeah. Which was nice. Yes. To hear that from a manufacturer because we've been preaching that for a long time.
Gizmo:We're off to a great start here, boys. Let's go to some news. We have a lot to get to tonight. We're going to start with Ipi Cigarillo first. This was a cigar we talked about with Ernesto.
Gizmo:The deep blue is now shipping. So you can finally get the Perez-Carrillo deep blue. It's a limited edition cigar. 2,500 boxes of 20. You'll hear in the episode we talked about the amazing Humidor.
Gizmo:If you remember seeing this at PCA boys, beautiful Humidor that they designed. Yeah. Gorgeous. So it has 20 cigars in there. Each of those cigars are $22 and it's a Central American blend of Honduran and Nicaraguan tobaccos.
Gizmo:So it's made at the same factory. These are the Casa Carrillo factory in Santiago and comes in one size, one Vitola called the Hades and it's a 56 ring gauge cigar by six inches long. So look out for the deep blue shipping worldwide thing to note. This has a I would call it like a soft box press. This cigar that we're talking about here, the deep blue is not box pressed.
Senator:I don't know that I've ever seen an EP Creole cigar that is not box pressed.
Bam Bam:That's true.
Gizmo:Yeah. Yeah. These are not box pressed. So let's go to another one now. This one is coming from Habanos.
Gizmo:The Bolivar Generalis is celebrating sixty years of Ligito 1492, which is the Habanos distributor for Belgium, The Netherlands, and Luxembourg. And it's coming in the same exact Fotola as what we would know in Monte Cristo number two or any of the Pyramidis to be in. 52 ring gauge by six and an eighth. It's an Addision Regionale. They are releasing 10,000 numbered boxes of 10 cigars here.
Gizmo:And I like this, BAM. Suggested retail, €25.
Bam Bam:Come on.
Gizmo:I think that's a fair price.
Bam Bam:That's unusual.
Gizmo:Which for this, it has four bands on it.
Bam Bam:It's a bargain.
Gizmo:There's four bands on it for €25, boys. But it is cool. I I don't know. It's cool to see a Bolivar
Bam Bam:It's torpedo top.
Gizmo:With a in a Monte Cristo number two size, that that Pyramidhi. I'm curious how that would smoke. I guess we'll see. But so yeah, this is celebrating the sixtieth anniversary of the distributor there founded in 1965 as Robert Suter S. A, which focused on importing cigars to Belgium and Luxembourg from Switzerland.
Gizmo:In 1992, the company became the official distributor for Cubanos S. A. In the Benelux region. In 2006, the name was changed to Kubasugar Benelux NV, and then five years later in 2011, it was changed finally to Ligito 1492. So sixty years of them and a new Bolivar in the Pyramidus size boys.
Gizmo:Exciting stuff.
Bam Bam:Rooster looked very relaxed over there. So
Gizmo:another big piece of news, Bam, hearing you sniffling and coughing as I'm editing over the last few weeks, is you finally Opened up the Navage correct and used it.
Bam Bam:I used it twice
Gizmo:and I would like as a third endorsement in the room here for you to share your experience because it's a game changer, man. I am fully on this train of Navage.
Rooster:Are they our new sponsor, by the way? No. They should be.
Bam Bam:They should be. K. So I didn't assemble it. I had missus Bam Bam do that for me.
Gizmo:Shocker number one. Correct. It's gotta be so difficult.
Senator:This guy's allegedly a contractor.
Bam Bam:I hire out for that. There's people for that. Oh, boy. Honestly, first time, the first experience having fluid going in one and then out, you feel the fluid actually toward the back of your nasal, it's strange.
Gizmo:It's a
Senator:weird experience. It's unusual. It takes adjusting.
Bam Bam:And it takes a little discipline to kinda keep your nose on the two nozzles there. You wanna kinda pull back a little bit. Kept it there. It was a little difficult initially, but I stayed there for about a minute, just over a minute, circulating through. The amount of Don't even say that.
Gizmo:We'll make some good assumptions about what happened.
Bam Bam:It's unbelievable. We
Gizmo:don't wanna hear about the
Bam Bam:refuse. Unbelievable what came out. We've been telling you that. I couldn't believe it.
Senator:Now Now you know how your poor handkerchief feels.
Bam Bam:Well, they're gonna get a breakdown.
Gizmo:Yeah. You're not gonna need as many of those.
Bam Bam:So the hope is now no more postnasal drip because I do suffer from that greatly, especially now during allergy season. It's terrible. Yep. I'm still congested in the chest, but I'm hoping over after a week of doing the Navage, I'll do it once a day. Yep.
Bam Bam:I'm hoping it passes and I can just manage this because it's been torture. Truly torture.
Rooster:So you're gonna do this just during the allergy season?
Gizmo:No. He's doing it all year round. I'll do it year round. Is that what you guys do? I am I'm doing it twice a day during allergy season.
Gizmo:I know senator thinks I'm crazy, but I'm twice a day right now, normally once a day before bed.
Bam Bam:But can I also comment? I'm a big retrohale guy. I retrohale every cigar, almost every other draw. I actually feel great about having this now, because it'll kinda clean out my passages after a long cigar session. Take a quick shower, put the pajamas on, and go to bed and feel great.
Gizmo:You're gonna sleep better.
Bam Bam:I'm looking forward to that.
Gizmo:You're gonna sleep better. You're not gonna get nearly as many, if any, sinus infections. Your allergies are gonna be totally taken care of. Your post nasal drip, the whole thing for a cigar smoker, with or without allergies, it is
Senator:It's huge.
Gizmo:An unbelievable device that you absolutely need to have.
Bam Bam:It is huge. Now, senator, you do this once a day.
Senator:Now I do. I was doing it once every other day, and then I got one of the worst sinus infections I've ever had.
Gizmo:While traveling, let's make that clear. Didn't
Senator:have While traveling, this was the first time that I brought the Navage with me on this trip. I would not have survived without it.
Rooster:On United?
Senator:Wow. No. On the Acela on the train, which by the way, have any of you been on the brand
Gizmo:new I heard the new Acelas are really nice from Amtrak. They are beautiful. I saw some photos.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Been on
Bam Bam:the older Acelas, not the new one.
Senator:New ones, They're great. Really give them credit. Every detail they thought about, perfect.
Gizmo:So let me ask you a question. Wait a minute.
Bam Bam:Did they have a smoking car?
Gizmo:No. Alright. Done. It's 2026, that's a problem. So what makes you choose Acela over going to Newark and or JFK and jumping on a flight?
Senator:Oh, it's just so much more reliable. I mean, with
Gizmo:the Okay. So it's a timing thing.
Senator:It's a timing thing, and then the fact that, like, it pops you right at Union Station in DC. You're right downtown. You don't need to, you know, come in from Virginia. Same thing, like, you know, coming back. You're not coming from the airport.
Senator:It can be even closer if you get out, like, Park or or even Newark at Penn Station. So it's just much easier.
Gizmo:So back to you. Yeah. Because I texted you this week.
Bam Bam:But I have a question for him.
Gizmo:Oh, go ahead.
Bam Bam:Because you do it twice a day. Yeah. It doesn't apply to you. But if you're doing it once a day, because I've only done it twice, I did it Tuesday morning and this morning. What's the best time to do this?
Bam Bam:Is it nighttime?
Senator:For me, it's nighttime before.
Gizmo:Because you're gonna sleep
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Yeah.
Bam Bam:And actually, like tonight, I'm actually looking forward to doing it tonight. Yeah.
Gizmo:So You're gonna really notice after sitting tonight and having cigars, after pod.
Rooster:Yeah.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Yeah.
Gizmo:You know? You're gonna go home and do that. You're not gonna believe how refreshed you feel going to bed.
Bam Bam:It's crazy.
Gizmo:It's as if your like nose took a shower. Your sinuses took a shower.
Bam Bam:Well, for me, I get a lot of sinus pressure on both sides of my nose and the upper cheeks. That is eliminated. So once all that stuff kinda comes out, I'm breathing better, I'm feeling better from, really, from my nasal passages up. I'm hoping by next week, all this down here will kinda eliminate and, you know, we're right into the sunset.
Gizmo:I am too because I texted you this week as I was editing last week.
Rooster:So were
Bam Bam:begging me to use it.
Gizmo:No. I didn't beg you. I said if you don't use that goddamn Navage this week, I'm gonna kill you.
Bam Bam:Okay. I'm alive.
Gizmo:You guys should hear this coughing that I cut out of these episodes. It's unbelievable.
Bam Bam:But the coughing's well timed. It's between comments.
Gizmo:So, again, very seriously, for any cigar smoker out there who's listening, cigar smoker or not really, but anybody who's listening, I'm telling you the Navage, we're telling you that it is an unbelievable device. It's a life changing device for people but also cigar smokers. So definitely go and check that out. I wish there were a sponsor rooster, but maybe someday.
Bam Bam:I do have this endorsement. One little detail. I have a deviated septum. So I have an opening between I'm gonna get this taken care of between both nasal passages. What's interesting is I when the fluid is cooler and I I I tried it once with the fluid warmer and room temperature.
Bam Bam:So when it's room temperature, it's cooler than your body temperature. Right? So I can feel the water traversing back and forth because there's that constant pressure because I have an opening. It didn't affect anything. The flow of all the product, let's call it, was fantastic, but I could feel that movement.
Bam Bam:So I'm looking forward to getting that taken care of and then having more of a efficient flow, let's call it.
Senator:And just a reminder for the listener, if you get this and you use it, you need to use distilled water. You cannot use tap water.
Gizmo:Correct.
Senator:Correct. Which if you're a cigar smoker, you should have plenty of distilled water.
Bam Bam:Oh, yeah. I overbought once. I still have those bottles.
Gizmo:Good study. It doesn't go bad, so that's All
Rooster:right, boys, I don't want to wait.
Gizmo:Let's go to our pairing. I'm parched. This is an interesting one tonight.
Chef Ricky:I just ordered the lavage.
Gizmo:Thank you. There we go.
Bam Bam:I drank half my drink already.
Gizmo:The Glenlivet Fusion Cask Single Malt Scotch Whiskey. Remember, Bam never tries to the spirit before. Never does.
Bam Bam:Until tonight. Cheers.
Gizmo:Cheers, boys. Cheers. Good to see you. We're drinking out of our Glencairn glasses again. Neat, everyone.
Gizmo:Neat.
Bam Bam:Super smooth and delicious. Excellent spirit. I'm shocked.
Gizmo:So we were turned on to this. We have to shout out Lizard G. O. In the lounge here. Found this at I don't know what store it was like.
Gizmo:I thought
Senator:it was Costco.
Gizmo:No. It Buy was Right liquor store. You're not joking. It was like a And Shop Right liquor I found this. It's a little expensive.
Gizmo:$115.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Yikes. What's the age?
Senator:I mean, thing is, there's no age statement, but this drink's like an 18.
Bam Bam:I will say because it's it's delicious and it's so easy to drink, I can kinda justify the price.
Senator:Yeah. For a single malt scotch?
Bam Bam:Honestly, the flavor is outstanding. A little vanilla, a little butterscotch, and it's buttery for me.
Chef Ricky:Yeah. Got a touch of citrus. I think it pairs beautifully well with this.
Bam Bam:Yeah. Didn't get any citrus. I usually do.
Chef Ricky:Getting a little bit of orange wine.
Rooster:It's a Navage.
Gizmo:Yeah. The Navage has ruined your palate.
Bam Bam:Fuck me
Gizmo:up. So I wanna go back to your age statement comment because if you're saying you think it drinks, let's say, somewhere between
Senator:15 and 18.
Gizmo:15 and 18. Right? If that's the case, why not put something on the box?
Senator:Well, I think for them, you know, they have a 15 and they have an 18. And so I think for them, the options are maybe to choose like an odd year, and maybe they couldn't guarantee that everything would be a minimum of 16 or even 14. Maybe there's probably some twelve year even blended into this. So I think just probably what they needed to use to make this
Chef Ricky:the Davidoff aging system. Exactly.
Senator:Well, think about it. The opposite. If Davidoff was running Glenlivet, this would be the Glenlivet 500.
Chef Ricky:On the soil of the Dominican Republic.
Gizmo:Alright. I can't do it.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Loosed
Gizmo:it. This is very good. The fusion cask. So let me read the front of the bottle here. I found this interesting.
Gizmo:So it says it's matured in American and European oak casks and selectively finished in bespoke, recrafted first fill
Rooster:Reminds me of somebody. Alright.
Gizmo:Rum and bourbon casks creating harmonious notes of sweet apricot and rich caramel spice.
Bam Bam:I I I would like to know what it means to recraft a barrel. Are they rebuilding it? Are they re toasting it? Are they recoating it with rum? That's an interesting So
Rooster:by the way,
Gizmo:I went to the website
Bam Bam:to try to get
Gizmo:this information. Yeah. And there's nothing there. It's as if Davidev built the website.
Bam Bam:Correct.
Gizmo:It's just a bunch of beautiful pictures and
Bam Bam:We are mysterious, and we are a Davidev.
Gizmo:Gem from the ground.
Senator:What do you mean there's nothing there? What do you expect him to say?
Gizmo:Like he said, I'd like to know what the process of a What does it mean? What is bespoke, recrafted, first fill cask? What does that mean? I mean, they're just it's just words. What does that mean?
Gizmo:Correct. Bespoke? First. Recrafted, first fill, rum and bourbon cask.
Bam Bam:Chefs doing it every time.
Gizmo:Barrels. They can't be virgin if they have other stuff.
Bam Bam:They're recrafted. No.
Senator:But I it almost sounds like it's a barrel that's been used before but not been used a ton. Recrafted?
Rooster:Used for scotch.
Bam Bam:Well, says rum. It's bourbon and
Senator:rum cask.
Bam Bam:Yeah. Keep up, Brutus dead.
Gizmo:I gotta say, really like the box. So this is a hard it's not even like it's not even like cardboard. It's like Yeah. Really nice. It has a square top that goes on it, pops in.
Gizmo:Really nice presentation on the box. I guess for $115, it should be. But, yeah, it's interesting. So this is part of their fusion casks collection. So I guess they have some other releases or will have some other releases.
Senator:I'm sorry. Whoever said buttery, I mean, this is as buttery a single malt as you are ever gonna find. It's crazy.
Bam Bam:The front, I'm getting a touch of salted buttery experience.
Senator:I just mean how it hits your palate. It's very creamy. It coats like an oil Yeah. Your palate even after you've
Bam Bam:That's correct. You've drank it. It's crazy to me. I'm shocked Geo recommended this.
Gizmo:Lizard Geo. I am shocked. So here's their notes here. I always like reading the notes as you know. On the nose, it says orange, vanilla custard, caramel, coconut, and a zest of lemon.
Gizmo:On the palate, notes of juicy apricot and peach, fresh apples, toffee covered bananas, and subtle cinnamon spice. And then on a finish, sweet and smooth with enduring notes of orange. Those are their notes straight off of the packaging.
Bam Bam:Some of that's pretty accurate.
Senator:Yeah. I agree. Yeah.
Gizmo:I really think it's a great spirit. Now here's the question. Do you think it's worth a $115? Will you buy it at a 115 based on your tasting experience tonight?
Senator:I'm sorry. I I think it's look. The category we're talking about is single malt scotch. So we, I think, immediately have to, you know, put out of our head what rum goes for and even tequila is like it's just as high of a price point, like entry point for the category as exists. Right?
Senator:You have twelve year bottles that are started $80. So it just goes up from there. To me again, this drinks like a minimum fifteen year, which most fifteen years are like a 120, a 150 a bottle. Yeah. Minimum.
Senator:And this is so refined, like there's got to be plenty of eighteen year even in this.
Bam Bam:There isn't a touch of heat.
Gizmo:No, there's no heat.
Bam Bam:No rough edges at all. It
Gizmo:actually feels like it's a lower proof for ABV than 80%. How does that make you feel? 40%.
Bam Bam:Does that affect your
Gizmo:In the room tonight with this cigar, it's pairing brilliant. It is. And I think that this is a scotch that probably would pair well with most of the cigars I we bring in
Rooster:don't know if we'd say that about
Gizmo:a scotch normally that's between 15 and 18 years of age.
Bam Bam:Yeah. I think I can smoke virtually any cigar with this, even a lot of Cubans, I think.
Senator:I I agree a 100%, and that's what's so compelling about it for me is, you know, in the rum category, we have found outrageously smooth, yet delicious and flavorful rums that we would say pair with anything. With single malt scotch, like, it it is a more robust experience normally and with a little bit more heat certainly than most rums that we're drinking. So for those, you're typically saying, like, for medium, full, and above New World's, they pair great, but there aren't all it's not every single cigar, you know, some of these more robust single malts fit with, but this Yeah. This is a smooth and refined like, the reason I said 18, like, this reminds me of just how smooth it is to drink this neat, like Glenlivet sorry.
Gizmo:Glenmorangie?
Senator:Yes. Glenmorangie 18. Mhmm. Smooth, like, that's that's how this drinks, but this is even more flavorful. Like, it's got a kinda richer finish.
Senator:I really love it.
Gizmo:Yeah. You know what's crazy? I mean, this is the fourth Glenlivet that we've done on the pod now. Obviously, the Glenlivet 12, you could find that anywhere. You could find that on probably on the Acela.
Gizmo:That's probably what they have. They have it on airplanes.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:I mean,
Gizmo:it's everywhere. But above the 12, we've done the 14 and the 18 and now this one. And, you know, we'll go through the other two ratings later. I'm I'm already assuming this is gonna rate very well tonight. But it's really brought a renewed sense of how great this brand is.
Bam Bam:Yeah, yeah.
Gizmo:I mean, the 12 is standard issue, whatever. But above that, especially for the price, fourteen's priced very well.
Senator:Even the 12, don't discount it. Well, 12
Gizmo:is, I think there's a lot of other twelves that I would take over that one, but I think
Senator:But at its price point.
Gizmo:At the price point, that's fair.
Bam Bam:And what's that, about $65 less?
Gizmo:No, it's even less
Senator:Probably than 50.
Bam Bam:Really? Even less than that.
Gizmo:Yeah. It gives me a new respect for that, and it only would have come as a product of this podcast. I would have never gotten this bottle, ever.
Bam Bam:There's a ton of utility on that twelve year that they make.
Senator:Large groups, It's so semi unique massive and differentiated. I've started to fall in love with single malt scotch when I was late in college, and Glenlivet 12 was like one of them that did it for me. And what I still to this day appreciate about it, it is one of the lightest twelve year expressions, yet so flavorful, but the flavor notes are like brighter citrus. You get pineapple. Like, I vividly remember the taste of Glenlivet 12.
Senator:You could drink that in 90 degree weather in the summer, and it's enjoyable
Gizmo:Yeah.
Senator:Just as much as you would drink it in the fall.
Bam Bam:It's great on the rocks.
Senator:Totally. So I just think they've carved out a niche with that twelve year where I think a lot of other twelves are trying to do the same thing, and some are great, and others are just mediocre. And the brand, I'm glad to hear you say. I mean, I when I used to live in DC, I went to I got invited to some Glenlivet event that they hosted, like their global brand ambassador was there for it, and we tried, like, every single Glenlivet expression. They went through the history, all that.
Senator:I was super impressed, but that was earlier in my journey. So a part of me has always wondered over the years if my palate was too young at the time to feel as strongly as I did that Glenlivet really does an excellent job. And And then it's like you fast forward till now, and I still feel just as great about Glenlivet. I think they're one of the most underrated brands just for how ubiquitous their product is. You can find it everywhere, but they do an excellent job.
Bam Bam:Chef, what are getting? Are you getting high?
Gizmo:He's having a bespoke experience.
Bam Bam:He is.
Chef Ricky:I'm getting choco flan. What I'm
Rooster:getting flan right now.
Chef Ricky:Is this Mexican dessert where they you have a it's kind of this hybrid of chocolate cake and flan custard. And when you bake them, you just kind of pour them and they mix naturally. When you bake it, because of the density, they separate. So then you have one even layer of this custard and one even layer of this kind of chocolate cake brownie.
Bam Bam:Very nice.
Chef Ricky:And this pairing of this whiskey with this cigar is giving me exactly that, and it is very intense.
Bam Bam:Yeah. I agree. I think the pairing is delicious.
Chef Ricky:It is so delicious. Fantastic thing.
Gizmo:So, boys, we're coming up on the end of the first third here tonight on the Perez-Carrillo Pledge Purple, the new special release from Casa Carrillo. And, of course, this Glenlivet that we're talking about, the fusion cask, single malt scotch whiskey. What's everybody thinking about the pairing? I know chef just commented on it. What's everybody thinking about the cigar at this point?
Gizmo:How's everything ranking for you right now?
Rooster:I think it's a delicious cigar. I mean, very balanced, smooth, a lot of chocolate, a hint of black pepper, like dark chocolate. But it's very balanced. There's no sharp edges. Nothing is really dominating.
Rooster:But everything is super balanced.
Chef Ricky:Just like the whiskey.
Rooster:I wouldn't know.
Senator:No, I agree with that. And just another word I would add to describe the experience of both is refined. Yep. I mean, the delivery of flavor in the cigar is so smooth, so effortless, so easy. Clean.
Senator:Clean.
Rooster:Yep.
Senator:And the same with the spirit. I mean, it is as accessible a delivery of flavor as you're ever gonna get in a single malt. So for me, when you think of, you know, you want a celebratory moment or even after a long day and you just want that, like, refined effortless experience, both this spirit and this cigar, think check those boxes.
Bam Bam:No doubt.
Gizmo:So I'm trying to think of things that I'm not enjoying about the cigar that are disappointing.
Bam Bam:Good luck with that.
Gizmo:There's only one thing that's disappointing me right now, and that it's going to be difficult for us to replicate this experience because it's so little The production's so small.
Bam Bam:That's true.
Gizmo:It's so hard to find
Rooster:these I mean,
Gizmo:a little
Rooster:bit of an issue that I have is maybe the price point. Like at $18 there's a lot of cigars out there, or under $18 that can give you a lot of flavor.
Gizmo:But this is really this is delivering.
Rooster:I mean, is exceptional. This
Gizmo:is excellent.
Bam Bam:I don't really know if that's a demerit.
Rooster:Not a demerit, but you I
Bam Bam:don't think of those terms anymore. I used to, we all did that for a long time. I don't know. I feel like Ben,
Senator:if this was $60 I'm pretty sure that's gonna factor into your rating. Correct.
Gizmo:That's the answer. Think it's a value at 18.
Bam Bam:We got it for 16
Gizmo:We got it for $16.50.
Senator:I'm not complaining because I think 18 is reasonable, but I'm just making the point that if it were 60, we would heavily
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:be That's true.
Bam Bam:Yeah. It it have to be read this is reasonable.
Rooster:Yeah. It's a little bit more palatable because they're coming out with 10 count boxes To spend $180 on a box
Bam Bam:Not bad.
Rooster:It's not bad. But when you have boxes that are like $20 $25 then that kind of adds up. So that's what I mean. Exclusivo, around like $14.15 dollars I mean, even those are going up now. Yeah.
Rooster:Yeah. It's a high quality cigar. It's great construction.
Bam Bam:Oh, you can expense it.
Gizmo:I think this is an exceptional pairing right now.
Bam Bam:Agreed.
Gizmo:The cigar, every draw is exquisite. This every sip, I'm I'm I have to slow down on the whiskey because by the time we get out of this interview, I'm gonna be tuned up.
Bam Bam:Oh, I was pounding
Gizmo:it earlier. I mean, it's on it's so drinkable. It's so easily drinkable. I would argue, and we'll talk about this later again, but I think this is we talk about gateway sometimes. I think this is a brilliant higher end gateway, you know, scotch for someone.
Bam Bam:Very much so a higher end gateway.
Gizmo:So if you wanna turn someone on to single malt scotch very quickly, I think this is an excellent option. Even at that higher price point, I think it's a very, very nice experience.
Rooster:The tobaccos on this, you know, not only I mean, the wrapper has ten years of age, but even the tobacco seem like they have some age. Oh, definitely. There's absolutely no youth.
Bam Bam:Oh, yeah. Yeah.
Gizmo:So boys, it's time now to go to our interview of the man who blended this cigar and so many others from Casa Carrillo and the Perez Carrillo line that we're smoking right now. I gotta say, as as we set this interview up, I am so excited to share this with our listeners and for us to hear it again. I just was blown away by his transparency and his willing to share and the depth that he was willing to go in blending. And he was comparing music to blending, being a drummer.
Bam Bam:Cooking.
Gizmo:I mean, so much of this interview, I think there's so many little tidbits in here that you can pick out. It's definitely relisten worthy. I'm really, really excited
Rooster:to Looking be forward to it because Chef and I weren't there. This is our this is our first time Yeah. Listening to, you know, Koreans speak. Yeah.
Senator:I mean, you'll see the guy is like an encyclopedia. I mean, just the decades that he's been So much experience. Blending in this industry. It is crazy how much knowledge this guy has, and I think we were so grateful that he took so much time to share so much of it.
Bam Bam:And a true gentleman. A sweetheart, well spoken. He's the kind of guy you can spend hours with.
Gizmo:I'd love to have I'd love to have dinner. You better believe it. Yeah. He'd be awesome.
Bam Bam:Oh, yeah.
Rooster:Phenomenal. Godfather of tobacco.
Bam Bam:Correct.
Gizmo:Yeah. 56. Yeah. Alright, boys. Let's go now to our interview from PCA twenty twenty six in New Orleans with the legend, the tobacco master Ernesto Perez-Carrillo from Casa Carrillo, and we'll be back to you at the end of the second third.
Gizmo:Live from PCA 2026. Gentlemen, we are sitting here with a legend. Correct. An absolute master of tobacco.
Bam Bam:Correct again.
Gizmo:He's been in this business fifty six years, you just told
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:us. Unbelievable. I knew
Rooster:it was
Gizmo:in the fifties, but I I wasn't exactly sure. Fifty six years.
Bam Bam:Makes me feel young.
Gizmo:We are sitting with mister Ernesto Perez-Carrillo.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Oh, thank
Gizmo:you. Thank you so much for joining us.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Well, thank you for having me. It's really a pleasure and an honor to, you know, to be doing this with you guys here at the PCA, New Orleans. We had a
Gizmo:wonderful conversation last year with Lisette. Fantastic. And we were talking with her last year, she said, You gotta interview my dad. So here we are. We're very excited to have you on.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Well, this is gonna be my I started coming to, at that time, the RTDA back in 1982. Wow. So, it's gonna be my, what, my forty fourth year? Yeah. And I think I've missed two.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:I've missed two.
Bam Bam:It's It's a good track record.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:But I've come to basically almost all of them.
Rooster:Wow. That's really impressive. No, that's fantastic.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:And it's incredible. The changes that this organization has gone through in all those years, it's amazing.
Gizmo:Even what it went through a couple of years ago during COVID, kind of at its lowest point, and now where it's at, it's pretty amazing.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:It is, it is.
Gizmo:And to be here in New Orleans is fantastic too. What do you think of New Orleans?
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:I like New Orleans. I like it because it's a smaller city, you can get around, I guess, easier, and it's just fun, this is a fun city. I like Vegas also, don't get me wrong, but this is more like, you have the old architecture, it's really nice. Great food. Great food.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Great food. Oh, That's for sure. Yeah.
Gizmo:You've been in this business fifty six years. You're a master with tobacco. You're a legend. You've been doing this so long. I'm curious about your blending philosophy in the early days, in the eighties, let's say in the nineties during the cigar boom and now.
Gizmo:Who were you blending for then and who are you blending for now? What kind of palette? How do you think about that as you're blending? And what has When
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:I blend, I guess you could say my philosophy has always been, I gotta satisfy myself first. I gotta like what I'm doing. I gotta be proud that if I hand out a cigar to anyone, I have to feel proud. And it's very much like, I guess you could say it's very much like there's two things I compare it with. One is the fashion, not that I'm a fashion expert, but you look at people like Giorgio Armani, Valentino, whoever, and they come up with an idea that, I'm not saying they necessarily do it just for themselves, but you gotta be proud of what you're doing, and hopefully you'll get people that will think or see into your vision and enjoy what it is.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Or like a cook, like a chef, he's going to make his food a certain way, and he's gonna ask everybody, you like this, you like that, he's never gonna be able to do anything. And with cigars, it's the same thing. You gotta come up with something that, first of all, you like, you enjoy, and then hopefully, there'll be people that will also have a similar taste than what you have, and will enjoy also what you make, what you blend. To try to blend for the consumer, There's so many cigar smokers, they have so many different taste profiles that if you try to blend for every one of them, it's almost impossible. So you have to have this trust in what you do, and hopefully that people will enjoy it also.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:And the thing is, ever since I started early, I really started because in 1970 I started working, my father, God bless him, he was still alive, and 1980 when he passed away was when really I had to start developing and seeing which way I wanted to go and what I wanted to do. And of course there's always been mentors, there's always been certain cigars that you tried, and you tried to, you you like them, so you try to somehow bring some of those characters into what one does.
Senator:So, you mentioned that you blend for your palate first and hope obviously others will follow.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Yes, yes.
Senator:How would you describe what your palate seeks? What you look for in a really great blend in a cigar in terms of flavor profile, things like that, how would you describe that?
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:One of the things that gave me, that I enjoy, I don't drink anymore, many years ago I used to drink bourbon. And I used to, when you drink, this particular one, I drank two, Blanton's. And- Very nice. And what was the other one? I remember the name of the other one, which was 103 proof.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:So, when you drank those, you felt a certain heat. But at the same time, you felt sort of like the woodsy naughtiness of a Blanton. I don't wanna promote them. So, I say, I really enjoy this, I really enjoy this. So, when I blend a cigar, I try in some ways to bring that experience back to the person that's smoking our cigars.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:So, it's not only about smoking cigars and smoking other people's cigars, of course you learn from that also, but that particular taste profile is what I try to do with the blends that I do. And this has taken me many years, you know, when started in 1980, needless to say, you smoke a Cuban cigars, or you smoke a Punch Rosh Chaw, or smoke whatever, you try to, but it takes years to really understand, learn about tobacco, learn about how each tobacco works together. So, it's not something that's time, I'm sorry, it's not something that's done right away, it takes time to really develop that philosophy, I guess you could say.
Bam Bam:Can you tell us about your blending team that works with you? We all know you're the master blender. Do you have a team with you that blends, does testing, how does that work in your field?
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Yes, yes, I've always said, for instance, we have in Dominican, we have about three people that I work with. I shouldn't say three, there's really like five, six of us. Have the other person, two persons have been with me now over, I would say close to thirty years. Wow, excellent. I trust their palate very much.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:I have a young gentleman working with me also that's very good, Jose Manuel. Then we have also Mikey. So, in Dominican, I work basically with that team. And then when I come to The United States, have my son Celine, sometimes Lisa will get involved. So, it's a question of hearing their feedback.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:And some of the feedback that you hear, you say, Yes, this has got to be changed because of this or that. And then also, one thing that we do also, we get our sales team involved. So, every time we make a blend, we send it to them.
Bam Bam:Oh, that's smart.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Yeah. Because they're the ones out there that are gonna be selling the cereal.
Bam Bam:That's interesting.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:They also have to have a certain, how do you say? Maybe a marketed mind? Yeah, they have to a certain they have to feel good about the cigar also.
Bam Bam:What's the typical timeline when you start to create a cigar, from the idea to a final recipe?
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:It can take anywhere from Well, this particular acorn that we made took about It started back in August, September.
Bam Bam:Is that the purple?
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:No, the Ascend. Ascend, The purple, usually when we do a project like that, we start like six, eight months before, because it takes time, it takes an average of about sixty days to really get a blend and know what that blend is going to be like throughout the whole time that we're producing it, putting it out in the market, and all that type
Gizmo:of stuff.
Bam Bam:That seems very quick, sixty days. But you're taking notes from your entire team, right? Yeah. Over that time period.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:But you have to understand is that what we do, what I do, is that we're constantly making blends. So it's not a one time thing that, okay, have a new project, let's do this blend. No, this is constantly going on.
Bam Bam:I see, I see.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:It's an ongoing process that I enjoy. That's why mostly I get more people involved because I want them to do that also, be making blends, work with different tobaccos. I'll have supervisors come and give me a cigar and I'll try it.
Bam Bam:It's like they're auditioning for you.
Gizmo:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:But this is something that I
Bam Bam:encourage- That's what we do for him, by the way. I'm constantly auditioning for him.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Okay. I encourage them to, okay, start working with tobacco, because it's important, you want them to feel part of it. You want them to also feel that they're part of something more than just getting a salary or paycheck for doing their job. And it's very exciting because some of those brands that they come up with are actually very good. Now, needless to say, we can't come up with everything.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:We can only come up with maybe one, two, three things out of the year. But you'd be surprised how many, you know, like for instance, the Ascend, we had about 17 blends. And so, I started looking, I said, Wait a minute, I gave you, I think I gave him like 14, no, like 12 blends. There were four more or five more there that they had worked on themselves. Now, you have to tell them, Look, this is not really what we're looking for.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:But like I tell them, Look, you know how many times I failed at making blends? I mean, it's been
Gizmo:Hey, a baseball player that bats 300 is a Hall of Fame. Exactly. 30%.
Bam Bam:So you're fostering that creative culture. Exactly. Interesting.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:When I started and I worked with General for ten years, there was my mindset, but at that time, we were so busy just making the cigars that we were making, like Gloria, the CBR, that you really didn't have too much time to experiment with other tobaccos. And one thing that had happened also is that there's so many new tobacco, so many new seeds that are coming into the market in the past ten years, that there's always something to work on. Really exciting times in that sense. It sounds
Senator:like you're your toughest critic in some ways, and always in pursuit of perfection. I remember we were chatting with Lisette. We were talking about the first release of the Pledge of Allegiance, which we fell in love with a few years ago when that came out, and she told us very funny that right before you released it, she said, My father had some doubt, maybe the blend's not just perfect. That was one of our highest scoring cigars that year. We absolutely loved it.
Senator:So you're a tough man to please.
Gizmo:Hoarded those boxes, we're still smoking. Yeah,
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:I am. I am very hard to please, you know? Because I feel that, at the end of the day, you know when something is right and when something's not right. Like I said before, if I'm gonna offer a cigar to a customer, like I said, he may say, Look, he may not like it, but at least I know I did my best to please that customer. But to please that customer, I have to please myself first.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Absolutely. So, that's why so time is so difficult when we're coming out with a plan and then, wait a minute, it's gonna take another month. Know it's tough on her and my son because they wanna work on things, and it's just the way I am. It's been like that forever.
Senator:I'll also say, I think there's something to be said for a brand like yours that you're trying to please yourself first, and there's a common thread in DNA in all of your cigars. You know, we could almost blind light up any one of your cigars and know it's a Carrillo cigar. I think for some other brands, when you try to be something for everyone, you kind of lose your You
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:lose, yes. Now, that doesn't mean that there are other cigars out there that are great, but for me, it's gotta have that signature, I guess you could say. And I think also for people that smoke our brands, to a certain degree, they wanna feel that. It's made a private label or whatever, but there's that Perez-Carrillo signature with that cigar. That's what people are smoking.
Bam Bam:How do you feel about your purple that you've put out recently?
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:My purple, let me tell you, I was really surprised.
Bam Bam:In what way?
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:I'll be frank, I was really surprised. I mean, I love the cigar, I like the cigar very much, but the response has been really incredible. And the reason I'm surprised, because I thought that most people would say, Well, this is just another Purple that is made of different size. And I made an effort to make sure that didn't happen. So we used some different tobaccos, we used a different binder, and surprisingly people really
Senator:love that He's your biggest fan right
Bam Bam:I love that cigar. I had it for the first time, not too long ago, maybe a week ago, and I'm in hot pursuit of as many of those I can find. Fantastic.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Yeah. Like I said, I was surprised because
Bam Bam:You have my approval.
Gizmo:Oh, thank you very much.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Thank you. Originally, I thought, know, lot of people they're gonna say, well, it's the same purple, whatever, you know? But the effort was made to make it different, but to keep that profile where people could say, yes, I can see where there's why it's called Pledge Purple.
Bam Bam:It's interesting what Senator said. There's a true similarity across his portfolio. You never escape it. You know when you're having one of your cigars, which I find interesting. Have a lot of respect for that.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Well, thank you. And whether they be a Connecticut, a Broadleaf, Havana Connecticut, or whatever, there's always something there. Maybe it's a pepper, maybe it's a creaminess, maybe it's the different notes. Because when I make a blend, and this is something that my kids tell me, Dad, everybody doesn't smoke like you smoke. And I can understand that, but what can I do about that?
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:And I do notice that maybe sometimes I always try to over perfect things, but I have to feel good about what I'm doing. If I don't go through that routine, it just doesn't
Bam Bam:It seem to doesn't work for you.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:It doesn't work for me, that's right. Yeah.
Rooster:So, what's your favorite cigar among the many you've rolled so many?
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Well, one of my favorites of all time is the Encore.
Rooster:Encore, The Majestic or?
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:I like the Primero.
Gizmo:All right,
Rooster:Primero, yeah. Yeah.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:And the Valiento, which is a Tempur. Of course, the Majestic, because I feel that's a cigar that you can smoke anytime, and you're always gonna have that complexity. It's always gonna be, whatever time of the day you're smoking, it's gonna say something different, you're gonna feel something different in the blend. I smoked one the other day, I was in the factory, I was like, Shit, this is
Rooster:No, it's excellent. This
Rooster:is really
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:good. You know? This is really good. So, that cigar always seems to be, you know?
Rooster:We fell in love with the Encore quite a few years ago, and it was grip of us trying a lot of different cigars. But that's why, like, when your pledge came out, I thought that was very, very different. Yes. You know, because the pledge, like, you know, we went and bought boxes of the pledge, and it was really, I thought, very, very different from, especially coming from the encore.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Yeah, Well, what makes the difference in a lot of these cigars, in the Perez-Carrillo series, the concept was using different wrappers. For instance, with Astoria we used a Mexican wrapper, which I never used before.
Rooster:Oh, the San Andres, yeah.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Yeah, for our And then for the Encore, it was a Habano from Jalapa. And then we had the Habano, the Pledge, which is Habano, Connecticut. And that particular wrapper I used back in the early '80s when I was in Miami. We used to make the full monster, know, the short filler cigars, and that was one of the wrappers that I used. So when that came available I said, you know, let's use this wrapper for the pledge.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Now the Habano refused, but for the Ascent, I wanted to blend it in such a way because there's so many Habano cigars out there, and I wanted to blend this differently so it would be different than what's out there now. Because Habano wrappers is, right now, it's being used pretty much by everybody in the industry because of the availability, how nice it looks, and the smoke. So with this particular one, I wanted to do a different blend that would stand on its own, seeing how much Habanos there are out there.
Rooster:By the way, that's a beautiful label. Looking The forward to
Bam Bam:rapper's gorgeous. So
Gizmo:I wanna ask you a little bit about blending, like really getting into it a little bit, because I have some You've been doing this a very long time, And I'm curious, when you smoke a leaf for the first time, you're as you get into the blending, can you predict what with what accuracy can you predict how time, age, rest is gonna affect that tobacco? And then the domino effect of how is that gonna affect the blend you put that tobacco in over six months, a year, two years, five years? How does time factor into your blending when you taste a new tobacco?
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Well, one of the first things that you have to have is, needless to say, you have to have aged tobacco. So when we make our blends, we use tobaccos that are at least minimum two to three years old. That will give you a certain consistency. So that's very important. The tobacco has got to be aged, it's got to be from certain areas, whether it's Nicaragua, Honduras, Dominican Republic, Ecuador, whatever, and also the seed.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Because that will give you a better indication of what that cigar is going to taste like six months from now or a year or whatever. But I think the most important part of blending, like I said before, give it sixty days and then from there you have a more accurate idea what that cigar is going to be like, smoke like in the next few years or whatever. Now, saying that, tobacco cigars, what I tell people a lot, look, a cigar is a living organism. So when you buy a box of cigars, if you're going to put it in your car, in the trunk or whatever, you're not gonna get what you're looking for as far as the taste profile and the strength or whatever. So, it's very important that when you get that box of cigar, you either put it in your Humidor, or you get that box, you put it somewhere, and you let it sit at least for two or three weeks to have that cigar, how do you say, acclimated?
Senator:Yeah, exactly.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:It's different when you smoke a cigar in the store, you're smoking a cigar, you're enjoying it and all that, that's fine. But if you really wanna get what the blender was
Bam Bam:The essence of it, yeah.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:The essence of the cigar, then you need to have that cigar rest. Like I said, a Humidor, a box, whatever, just somewhere where you'll feel at home. And of course you can't let it be too dry or too moist because then the tobacco flavors and strengths are not gonna come out the way that the blender intended it to be.
Gizmo:You're talking our language.
Bam Bam:Oh yeah.
Gizmo:Yeah. I'm a humidity nut.
Bam Bam:Yes, you have.
Gizmo:I'm not. And honestly, it brings up an interesting point in that I believe that most retailers keep their cigars too wet, and I think that it distracts from what you're talking about, what the intention was of the blender, keeping it at seventy, seventy one, 72, ultimately not calibrating, not watching it. Someone picks that cigar up, sits down in the shop and smokes it, it's tasting different than what you intended.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Exactly, 100%. 100%. And that's something that, you know, at one time I used to go in cigar shops and used to have the humidifying system. That, to a certain degree, if it's a very dry, let's say Arizona or something, I can see where that might work, but there are places where you can't have that type of humidity, excess time
Gizmo:that door is opening, there's plenty of humidity coming in.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Exactly.
Gizmo:You can never extract the humidity from the room. It's just constantly pumping it in, you know? Yeah. Yeah. We're crazy about humidity.
Gizmo:Oh, yeah.
Bam Bam:So you're in Miami. Yeah?
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Yes, man.
Bam Bam:How do you store your cigars at home? This is a very private question, by the way, apparently, RH levels in this group is like giving away your social security number. So, I want to know how you store your cigars, how you condition them, and what do you do to step them down or up before you smoke?
Gizmo:Well,
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:I have in Miami, let's say I make a blend. Okay? So, routine, I come in from Dominican, I have 50 cigars, whatever. And then what I do, I have, you know those, what do you call those, Cigar or-
Bam Bam:Oh, Cigar boxes.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Yeah. So, I put them in their on cello. I leave them there for, I would say, probably a week, two weeks.
Bam Bam:Any Boveda in there or anything?
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:No, no, just like that. I want that foam to absorb some of the humidity. And then from there, I have a bunch of empty boxes and I put the different blends in each box.
Bam Bam:So,
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:takes about fifteen, twenty one, thirty days before the cigars dry out. The humidity that I want to smoke it in. Now, if the case is where it's too dry, then what I'll do, I'll put them in, let's say I buy cigars, competitive cigars, those go right into the humidor. I'll leave some cello and some un cello, because they have a different effect when you smoke a cello cigar in a humidor and an un cello one. But I'm talking about blends now mostly.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:So, I'll do that and then if the cigar I find is too dry, then what I'll do, I have a bunch of this many, like plastic. You've seen those pencil things that kids put there?
Rooster:Oh my Lord, you're talking kids' language, Yeah.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:So, I'll put there and I'll put like a small bubble right there.
Bam Bam:Oh, okay.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:So, it'll bring back some of the humidity, but it's gotta be in plastic.
Bam Bam:Right.
Gizmo:Yeah. With like a rubber seal.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Yeah, yeah. Oh
Rooster:no. Come on.
Rooster:Oh no. You feel validated. We're
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:locked in. You do that, see? You know what I used to do in the old days? I used to put an apple, a piece of apple. Really?
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Yeah. Wow.
Gizmo:Didn't that impart flavor at all?
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:No, no. I'm We expect that humidity.
Bam Bam:I'm trying that.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Yeah. Obviously. In a plastic, one of those Yeah,
Bam Bam:I like it.
Gizmo:Cool.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Just like a slice of apple.
Bam Bam:Interesting.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Not too big, and that'll bring back some of the humidity.
Bam Bam:So, you don't use an Oasis or anything like that? Any humidification devices that adds moisture to the ambient Just
Rooster:the vulvita?
Bam Bam:Other than Yeah,
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:just the You know what? Realistically, when you put a cigar in the humidor, the space is so- Tight. So tight, because you've got so many cigars in here. So, it takes a while for all that humidity to come into the cigar. And we're looking for a humidity level of about maybe 14% for the cigar, where I think it's optimal to be smoked.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:So, you gotta play around with that,
Gizmo:you know?
Bam Bam:Yeah, interesting.
Gizmo:So, you're a musician.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:I used to.
Gizmo:You love jazz, right?
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Yes.
Gizmo:How does being a musician and thinking like a musician, I'm a musician, how does thinking like that, what are the parallels to blending and thinking about tobacco the way that you have for as long as you have? Does that come into those 200100%.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:And this is why I go through so many blends. It's like if you have a job, you go through a job eight to nine, or eight to five, or whatever. When I was a musician I used to practice constantly, four, five, six, seven hours. So that was something that with cigar blending, it's the same thing. It doesn't necessarily mean that you're going to make a brand out of that blend, but you're practicing with the different tobaccos, seeing how each tobacco works, how each tobacco works together, which is very important.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Because one thing that people don't understand about blending, half a leaf can change a blend dramatically. So this is where the practice comes in. I used to play the drums, I get home from school and start banging away, the neighbors would get upset, my mother and my father.
Gizmo:My mom kicked me to the garage.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Yeah, well, I didn't have a garage, so I had to do it in the house that we had. So, this is kind of the thing where the music came in, also the improvisational.
Gizmo:Oh, okay.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Yeah, you're always improvising when you're playing music. When you're blending cigars, you make a blend and you say, Okay, if instead of this leaf from this particular area or this particular seed, I use this one? So, it's a type of improvisational also. Right. Binders, let's use different wrappers.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:So, it's an ongoing process where it's like playing music. Yeah.
Gizmo:All right, boys. We will return to our interview with Ernesto Perez-Carrillo in a moment, but we've come to the end of the second third here on the Perez Carrillo Pledge Purple, the special release Toro, and our Glenlivet Fusion Cask pairing tonight. What's everybody thinking about the cigar and the drink?
Bam Bam:Perfect. I think it's exquisite.
Gizmo:I'm blown
Bam Bam:away. It's delicious, man.
Senator:The thing that stands out to me with this cigar is it starts to build in the second third, which I really like. You know, we were talking about, oh, this is a medium strength cigar. I think the second third hits medium full, which I really like.
Bam Bam:I love the aroma. I'm getting right now dark chocolate and coffee on the aroma.
Rooster:Yeah. There's also I don't know if you're getting this, but there's a floral note that I'm getting now, which is kind of in the background, but it's a good addition to the chocolate espresso note with a hint pepper there.
Bam Bam:Interesting.
Rooster:But there's that floral element that's there. It's kind of in the background, but it's just a hint.
Senator:It's floral or fruit?
Rooster:Either Could one be fruity. Could be a little bit of fruit.
Bam Bam:I don't know if it's But
Senator:what you're talking about, I think it's a nice counterbalance to all of richer dessert notes that you're getting.
Bam Bam:If it's anything for me, it's a raisin that I'm getting on the finish on a traditional draw.
Rooster:It's a little brighter.
Senator:Yeah. I'm the same.
Gizmo:I am blown away by this cigar right now. Honestly, I I came in with no expectations tonight. I had no idea how this was gonna perform. I didn't love the pledge the pledge prequel that when we originally did that. I've loved a lot of the other, you know, Perez-Carrillo cigars we've done since.
Gizmo:But that first one, which this is celebrating, I didn't love that cigar. I don't think we love that cigar. This is like night and day. This is an unbelievable experience right now. I'm completely blown away by the flavor.
Gizmo:I've not had a single draw that has been lackluster or uninteresting or has lost my attention. Every single draw has been Yep. And with this Glenlivet tonight
Bam Bam:Great pairing.
Gizmo:This is why we do this for moments like this. The pairing tonight is just exquisite. Exquisite. Where is all so I know
Senator:the rapper obviously is from The US. You said the binder and filler are
Gizmo:from what country? So the binder is Mexican, and there are three types of Nicaraguan filler in this from Esteli, Condega, and Ometepe.
Senator:Okay. This makes sense. Because right now, this is so Nicaraguan, you'd almost you could think blind you're having a padrone like Yeah.
Gizmo:It's very padrone esque
Rooster:right now.
Bam Bam:At the moment, yes.
Senator:In the second, third.
Bam Bam:I agree.
Gizmo:But I think it does have a little bit. There's a couple more elements that aren't in the Padron that are here. Think a lot of those notes you're calling out. I mean, this is definitely, right now it's been a two act play so far.
Senator:Sure. Yeah. For sure.
Chef Ricky:Chef? For me, I think really what's built up here is a ton of bittersweet chocolate, almost tannic like, but I don't mind it because it's adding complexity to the pairing and it really just harmonizes beautifully. I'm really, really enjoying this and I love what it's given.
Bam Bam:I'm not getting much floral. Yeah, neither am I.
Chef Ricky:Yeah, I'm not getting a
Gizmo:whole lot
Senator:of floral. Little bit of fruit in the second, third.
Chef Ricky:I'm getting some fruit, but mostly for me, it's I would say nuttiness and bittersweet chocolate is where I'm at right now.
Bam Bam:Also delicious. Yes. Yeah.
Gizmo:Alright, boys. Let's go now to the second half of our interview with Ernesto Perez-Carrillo from PCA twenty twenty six, and we'll be back with you at the end of the second third.
Bam Bam:So I'm curious, you have so many cigars, and you're continuing to blend all of them, or roll them, I should say, because the recipes are in place.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Right.
Bam Bam:As new crops are planted and harvested and there are usually fluctuations in the leaf, how do you adjust existing blends to continue to deliver that flavor profile when you have organic fluctuations in your product?
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:That's a very good question because it does happen. One year you may get a crop that's very heavy because it hasn't rained that much. Another year you may get a crop that's lighter because there's been a lot of rain. So you definitely have to be working. Another thing that you have to understand, you have to make a blend based on the plant.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:What does that mean? That means that fifteen years ago, the plant, let's say in a place like an El Dominican Republic, would give you 25% Rijero, 35% Viso, and whatever the rest in Seco and binder. What I've seen as time goes on, that that percentage has come down. That may have given you 25% ahead or may not be 20 or 15. So you have to see that and you have to say, okay, if I only have 15% of the head or 20, whatever, how do I adjust that blend to make it the same, right?
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:So, you have to look for other tobaccos in a way like another type of rijero, where you're getting another 15% to 20%, where instead of putting one leaf, you would put half and half a leaf, because you don't want to run out of the aljero.
Bam Bam:That must require enormous testing. It does. Right? Blends, testing the cigar, taking notes and making adjustments.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:And seeing ahead. Because you know from one year to the next, more or less, what the crop is going to be like. And there's also some growers that, let's say, some growers they plant a seed, let's say a Criollo 98, and they want to get 18 leaves. Well, you know with a Criollo 98, if you get 18 leaves, you're going to have a thinner tobacco because the nutrients have to be, how do you say?
Rooster:Distributed, yeah.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Right, distributed amount of 18 leaves. Now, what others would do is instead of 18, they would grow fourteen, sixteen leaves, But you don't know that when you buy a tobacco. So what we do, what I do, that is to say is, sometimes I'll go to the fields and see what they're growing. And I don't say anything, just see and I kinda know where that tobacco is heading. So
Gizmo:have to- To bring it with your eyes is helping inform your palate in the future- Exactly. Of how that's gonna affect the blend. That is incredible.
Bam Bam:Only a master can do and that, years and years of experience. This is gonna be the most difficult part of this business.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:It is, but it's also the most fun, you
Bam Bam:know? Okay.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Because you're challenged. You're challenged to What that means is in the future, have to change your way of blending cigars, knowing that, look, in the future, this is gonna be the case, so how do I make new blends now that are not going to really change five, six, ten years down the road?
Rooster:It's very creative and reiterative. You're not only creating, but you're going through the process over and over
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:and Yes, over it's something that you have to stay on top of.
Bam Bam:Yeah. Have you ever had to discontinue a cigar due to supply issues?
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Exactly.
Bam Bam:You have?
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Well, I'm blessed because I've been in this business so long, I have so many great relationships that I've had issues at times where there's been a lot of demand that maybe the industry as a whole wasn't expecting. So, you run into little issues here and there. But the people that I've worked with, like I said, it's been so many years, like the Placencia, Oliva, you know, so many guys that really have said to me, Whatever you need, we're here for you.
Bam Bam:Wow, that's
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:amazing. Because we don't own farms. So that makes it a little bit more difficult, but thank God we have these people that through the years have helped us a lot.
Bam Bam:That's incredible.
Gizmo:Yeah. I think there's a lot of inspiration in knowing how you work, knowing the business as we do. And for as long as you've been doing this, I think there's a real real wonderful story there that you've been in this business for fifty six years, and you still have a passion for it as if you fell in love with it yesterday. It's and I find that to be really inspiring. You know, for our listeners out there, for us, we're in business.
Gizmo:We all have things, you know, careers. Our listeners out there are committing their lives to a career. You've committed your life to this leaf, and you still have this incredible passion for it. Where does that come from?
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Tobacco, cigars, when I was playing the drums, I remember my father passed away in 1980, and I thought the drums were my passion, which they were, but when I got into cigars, it just became not a passion, but an obsession to trying to be the best at it. Not only for people to say that I was the best at it or not, because I felt that I had to be the best or try to be the best at doing this. And when you're working with tobacco, you just get involved in it, and you see all the different things that you can do with a leaf. When you give a cigar to a person and they're enjoying this cigar, and they come to you and they say, Munoz, this is great, man, I really enjoy it, thank you, whatever, that's really important for me also. Like I said before, I'll try to satisfy myself first, but when a person comes to you and they say, you know, I've connected with this person somehow, because tobacco is always changing, always.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:It's interesting too, because as a musician, when you
Gizmo:get up on that stage and you perform, if they love it, you immediately feel it.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:And if they Immediately.
Gizmo:And if they don't love it, you immediately feel it.
Bam Bam:Oh, yeah.
Gizmo:Or a comedian or anybody who's performing. It seems exactly like that because you can tell as soon as someone lights that cigar, if their eyes pop out, Wow, this is amazing. Or if they're you know, they kinda get a little smaller.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Exactly. You know,
Gizmo:you do have that a very similar type of feedback loop happening there.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:And I do that. Sometimes I'll give a cigar to push, Oh man, this cigar is great. And know it's not. I mean, they're just trying to make me feel good.
Gizmo:It's like the control.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Oh yes, it's great. Actually, happened to me back in January. I gave a cigar to the sales group and some guys were saying, Yeah, it's great, man. But you could tell, they weren't really into
Bam Bam:it. Thrilled with it.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:So this last blend, I gave it to everybody. Everybody is, Fuck, man, this is great. So, you know you have something good there. Yeah. And like you said, musician, it's the same thing.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:When you're up on stage and you're playing, you can tell right away, man, if people are-
Rooster:Responding or not.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Responding, yes. And that adrenaline hit, it feeds Exactly.
Gizmo:You know? Exactly. It makes the insanity, the insane amount of practice, or in your case, blending, iterating, loving some stuff, not loving most of it, of course, right? Yeah. It makes that all worth it when get that adrenaline
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:hit, Yes. I'd Very unique, very special feeling.
Gizmo:So let's talk about the new releases that have at come this PCA show at this time of year. Of course, we talked about the Pledge Purple, we talked about the Ascend, and there's also the Deep Blue. Tell us the genesis of the Deep Blue.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Okay, the Deep Blue, we've been working with this gentleman who does a lot of our humidors and some of the designs and that type of stuff. And he had this humidor, which we have, if you guys go by, you'll see it down there. It's beautiful. So he came up with this humidor, Actually, came out with four or five. There's one more that I love, hopefully we can do something with that.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:And then somehow, I don't know why, the idea of making a limited cigar with this humidor, or with this pattern, and what you would name it, what the concept was, And I don't know if it was Ernie, Lizard, who it was that came up with that name. But when they came to me and said, okay, this is what we're going to do, how do you blend a cigar that would give that, I don't know, being out in the ocean, being in the darkness of the ocean or whatever. So, started working on the blend, a blend that I had worked on before, we never did anything with it, but what I did, I changed the binder, that first blend we used, I think it was a Esteli binder, for this one I used a Hamasran blind.
Gizmo:Yeah, you went to Honduras on the binder.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Right, Honduras. And we use also Olmettepe tobacco, which is very unique tobacco, because I wanted to give it that complexity that I think you feel in the ocean, if you go, I've never gone do you say-
Bam Bam:Deep sea diving?
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Deep sea diving, by the way, I can imagine what it's like. So, I wanted to give it that darkness, that mystery in that particular blend. And I think we kind of achieved it.
Gizmo:And that's a limited, right? Only 2,500 boxes?
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:2,500 boxes, yes.
Bam Bam:We often call out salt, like a salty finish in cigars that we have. Is there something reminiscent of that in this new line?
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:This one has, now that you mentioned this, I'm not gonna say it's salty, but it does have like
Bam Bam:A minerality? Can't wait to try
Gizmo:it.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:And I think that was the combination of the Ome Tepe and the Honduran binder. So, we also have to talk, of
Gizmo:course, about the Pledge of Allegiance two hundred and fiftieth. First off, that Humidor is gorgeous.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Ain't that? Oh yeah. That was made by the same gentleman.
Gizmo:Are two blends in that humidor.
Rooster:Can you tell us a little bit about that?
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Okay, the two blends, there's a Maduro blend and then there's a Connecticut blend. So, the idea was to make a 100% American tobacco.
Gizmo:Oh, cool.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:It's 100% American cigars. Wow. So, one of the blends, the Maduro blends, use a Pennsylvania broadleaf, we use a broadleaf fillers, we use another Pennsylvania broad leaf called P41, and we use another filler called One Succord that's also from Pennsylvania, I think it's at Connecticut Valley. So that blend has those tobaccos, and it has also a binder that's also from Pennsylvania. So, on the lighter blend, the natural blends I should say, it's all American Tobacco, so so.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:We kind of changed up the blend a little bit because of the wrapper, which is a Connecticut shade from The United States. That tobacco I was able to get from my friends at General Cigar. They had this old, old tobacco wrapper from the Connecticut Valley, and so we're using that for that.
Bam Bam:Wow, sounds incredible.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:So, it's gonna be an interesting, very interesting smoke.
Rooster:Wow. And so, for this year, is that all you're doing, or are you also carrying on the Pledge of Allegiance?
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:And then the Pledge of Allegiance,
Gizmo:yes.
Rooster:Which will also be, alright. Yes, yes.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:That will also have some American tobacco in it, but mostly, it's gonna be
Gizmo:a blend of different tobaccos. Is American Tobacco hard to work with?
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Let me tell you something. I was really surprised. When I started on this project, I was really surprised, man. Because, I mean, it's amazing. Really?
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:It's amazing. Yeah, it's amazing. I would say that- surprised to
Gizmo:hear that because so few people look to The Americas for tobacco and premium handmade cigars. Obviously, the Newman's do it a lot. You've incorporated American tobacco before, but to have an American puro for this release-
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:It's an American puro. And that's why I'm amazed because, you know, America in The US is known for rappers, and of course, when you grow rapper, you're gonna get fillers, you're gonna get binders, you're gonna get everything. Working with the different American Tobacco's that I was working with, I said to myself, This could be Nicaraguan tobacco, it could be a Honduran tobacco, it could be a Dominican tobacco. I'm really surprised
Rooster:to hear this.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Yeah, so glad, really.
Gizmo:I'm surprised
Rooster:to hear that.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:And I came to the conclusion, tobacco, wherever it's grown, if it's done right- You can work with it.
Rooster:You can work
Gizmo:with it.
Bam Bam:Wow. It's amazing.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:So, I was really surprised, I said, man, you know, the strength, for instance, on the Maduro, it has strength, it has flavor, it has complexity, the natural the same, naturally it's a little bit milder, but it's great, man, it's great to work with that tobacco. And I'm gonna start incorporating a lot of, in the future, a lot more of it. So think about it, you have American tobacco from Pennsylvania, from Connecticut, from Kentucky, I'm looking into that.
Bam Bam:Wow, that's fascinating.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:You have Dominican tobacco, you have Honduran tobacco, you have Nicaraguan tobacco, you have tobacco from Peru. I mean, a lot of options.
Senator:Endless, endless, man. I'm really curious, from our perspective as a consumer, it seems like now there's more experimentation with different types of tobacco than we've at least ever seen. I'm curious, from your seat, as a blender, do you feel that that's the case when you look at what your peers are doing, when you think of what you're even doing in the blends that you're producing now? Do you feel there's greater experimentation, and do you think that that's because folks are just more curious and looking to find some new, different, innovative things, or there's greater availability of some different and unique types of tobacco. I'm curious how you view that and what you think is kind of driving what we feel right now.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Yeah, I think these are very exciting times for cigars now and for tobacco. But you have to see also that there is some type of climate change. So, what that means is maybe in some areas you can grow a Criollo, you can grow a Corojo, you can grow a Corojo twenty twelve, and Habano 2,000, and it will give you better yields in certain areas than May if you grow it in another area. So, think, to a certain degree, that has been part of the reason why this has happened. But saying that also because people want to experiment with new seeds, new areas, where they were trying to get different flavor profiles, different strengths.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:So, it's a combination of, I think of those two things.
Senator:Fascinating.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:So it happened because of a reason, but it turned out to work in many ways to benefit the production of tobacco, only, but also the different blends that one can make out there.
Bam Bam:And it sounds like you're embarking on a new set of potential blends with American tobacco Yes, for the
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:yes. As a matter of fact, my son is working on something now that it won't be all American tobacco, but we'll have a lot of American tobacco.
Bam Bam:Can't wait. Can't wait.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:It's exciting. It's exciting times, let me tell you.
Senator:And just going back to the Pledge of Allegiance for a second, you had mentioned there's the two blends, the Maduro and the Connecticut, that are going to be in that ornate Humidor. Right. And then the regular Pledge of Allegiance release will also be an American Pure like those, or
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:will No, be different that one we're to use some We're going to use probably 50% American tobaccos and the other one will be probably Dominican and Nicaragua.
Senator:Okay, excellent.
Gizmo:I'm curious because your name is so attached to the famous cigar boom of the '90s, right? I feel, and we've talked about, it almost feels like there's and you just touched on this, that there's a cigar boom now, not so much in volume or crazy amounts of new entrants to the market, but in quality and creativity.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Yes. Innovation,
Gizmo:And creativity, I feel like overall, you know, rising tides raise all ships. I feel overall this industry is doing a better job putting out better product. Yes. And I'm calling that a cigar boomer, a quality boom, right? Versus the nineties, which was just a volume play, get the cigars on the shelves, get the cigars out, right?
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Yes.
Gizmo:How are those two things different? What do you think about the comment that this is a quality improvement?
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:It definitely is. The amount of work that's going on, not only in making cigars, but also the growing of tobacco. And like I said, I've seen over the past ten years, it's not just growing tobacco to make cigars, it's growing tobacco with a purpose to make special cigars. And I think that's just what we're seeing. And we've seen that not only here in The United States, but also in Dominican Republic, Honduran, the amount of investment that's going on in growing tobacco nowadays, so we can get those special seeds, those special tobaccos that everybody's looking for, it's really been, like I said, in the past ten years, it's taken a really big jump.
Gizmo:What do you think is driving that?
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:I want to say because people I think it's pride. People have a real strong pride. When you have something when we had the boom, like back in the early nineties, know, just making cigars with whatever you could get. They were growing tobaccos anywhere because there was a demand. I think once that demand died down, people started seeing this and they say, you know what, let's really start looking at this very differently than during that period.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:You gotta remember, before 1992 when Cigar Aficionero came out, this was a small industry.
Gizmo:Sure.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:I mean, there was not the investment. You couldn't make the investment because there was not the demand for cigars.
Gizmo:It was hard to get a return.
Bam Bam:Cash flow was low.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Cash flow was right. So after this, after the boom, sales went up tremendously. I remember when I started, I think the sales might have been, I'm talking about 1980 when I was on my own, maybe the sales were like 750,000, a million cigars, or a 100 words of it. I think it was something like 50 or 75,000,000 worldwide. What is it up now just in The United States?
Gizmo:Four fifty, 500,000,000?
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Yeah. So, if you're looking at the fact that the boom died, that we had COVID, that also gave it a big Big boost. Yeah, because people were staying home, they weren't spending money, so they could buy cigars. But it's kept the sails, And you'll find that in spite of everything that goes on, you know, the S ship, the Users fleet, now the terrorists, people keep smoking. So, they're gonna smoke something, they're gonna smoke quality.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:And I think what everybody's seeing, what we're all seeing is you have to give your consumers, your smokers out there, you have to give them a quality product. You just can't make a cigar and say, Okay, you'll sell. No, it has to be half quality.
Gizmo:It's it's almost like the consumers are more discerning. They're more educated Yes. On the I mean, certainly guys like us, we're obsessed with this stuff. Yes. You know, so talking with someone like you, really in the weeds on this process, this is like, this is we're into it for, you know?
Gizmo:So, I mean, it's great to hear that perspective from you. And you've been through all these waves, ups and the downs over all these years. So it's really fascinating to hear that.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:No, listen, like I said, when you're in whatever business it is in fifty six years, and you see all the changes. What I see now is smokers are more educated, it's a lifestyle, people really enjoy it, they can tell you if you like a cigar or don't like a cigar, and they want to know, they want to know why this cigar was made. Why are you making this cigar? Why is it special? Why should I buy you a cigar when there's so many other great cigars out there?
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:So, it's challenging, it's challenging for everybody that's making cigars out there, That's why you see there's so much effort in making the best possible cigars that anybody that one can make.
Gizmo:So, just teed up a great question. What is your why today?
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Why is my why? Okay, first of all, because I enjoy this, I love what I do so much. It's like part of me, it's like part of why I'm alive, why I live. Needless to say also, this industry has been very good, not only to me, to my family. I want this to continue when I'm not around, but I want to leave a foundation whereby, because let's face it, I've been doing this for so many years, I don't expect anybody that comes after me to spend this amount of years to have to do something that's And what I find is that I want to leave a foundation, I want to make it easier in certain ways for my children, for my grandchildren.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:If they want to continue this, at least they have that foundation where they can build on it. But for selfish reasons also, enjoy it. Yeah, I'm not gonna stop doing this now.
Rooster:So, as you see, transition to the next generation. Yes. And I see that your daughter is very, very involved in the business.
Senator:Yes.
Rooster:What do you think? It was really interesting because just day before yesterday, I think Rocky Patel, no, sorry, it was Padron who talked about, whether genders matter or not, it's all about the passion. What are your views on gender? The market for women is growing. You see a lot of women leadership in cigars.
Rooster:They're coming up with their own cigars. I've seen a lot of women start their own lounges. What's your view and what's your thoughts, especially because you have joy?
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Well, listen, it's incredible. During the boom there were a lot of women that got involved in the cigars, but I think that was more of a fad type of thing, an era. Now I see that there's more, how do you say, focus. Women are focusing more, not only on retail stores, but just in cigars in general.
Rooster:Yeah, they're getting more involved from the-
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:They're getting more involved.
Rooster:With more passion and more belief.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Exactly, they're getting more passionate. You see in the case of my daughter, Lizard, where she's more passionate about She
Rooster:was very passionate about Now
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:she's helping me out in the factory, so that's taking a great load off of me. My granddaughter, my granddaughter, she goes to the factory and she likes to make cigars.
Bam Bam:That's amazing.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Where is she learning this?
Gizmo:Are you adopting, by the way? Move, we'll move.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:So, yes, you do see more women getting involved in the business. There's some great women retailers. Mean, fantastic And women
Bam Bam:you see a lot of consumption by women at clubs, we are, when we travel. I think it's interesting to combine both genders in this cigar habit, which is a really rare thing. I didn't see that ten years ago smoking cigars, but it's great to develop that. And are you I know Lizette's focusing on, is she focusing on specific products? Are you focusing on products or lines of cigars for ladies?
Bam Bam:Is there a separate effort there?
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Not really. I don't think, yeah, don't think ladies really want to say, okay, this is a cigar for ladies.
Bam Bam:That's a great point.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Want a cigar, they're not into this, this is made for women, is Very good point, yeah. So, this is what we're focusing on. The way that works is, she'll do, we'll have product development. For instance, my son is involved in product development and she's involved in the marketing of that product. And then I'm involved in the blending of that product.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:So what's happening now is now they're being part of the blending also, and they're doing their own blends and they're working on different projects on their own. Sure.
Rooster:So, no, but that shows passion, right? So you're not just driven by just one area, you're driven by everything.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:But that's the thing, they're passionate about it. It's not like they're doing this because they're they want to do it, which is a guarantee that you're gonna have a big chance of being successful.
Rooster:Successful, absolutely. For sure.
Bam Bam:And as a father, you don't want to squash that? No. It's important to follow-up.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Sometimes it's hard to say, This is not really
Bam Bam:For us, let's say.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Sometimes it's hard to say, This is not really what I think, what you're looking for, but look, go ahead and do it. If that's what you feel good about, go through that because you have to have that experience also.
Senator:So, while we're on products, there's one product that I have to ask about, the El Senador, which my namesake on this podcast is Senador, El Senador. Yes. So, if there was ever a product just made for me,
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:it is that cigar. Yes,
Bam Bam:Senator. It was made for you. Well,
Gizmo:I would love
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:to What was
Gizmo:it like making a cigar for him?
Bam Bam:How was he as a client?
Senator:I would love to hear, besides myself, what was some of the inspiration behind that specific?
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Okay, that was the first la historia. So, we had El Senador, my father in Cuba, he was a little bit shorter than I am. So, he was a senator. Oh, wow. He was a senator of Pinar Del Rio in 'fifty four, in 'fifty eight.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:So, when I made the cigar, I named it Senador and honored to him. It's beautiful. And then we have the
Rooster:Big shoes to fill, senator.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Sorry, you probably thought it was
Gizmo:for you, but I didn't know you at
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:the time, so I apologize for that. And then we have the Dona Elena, which is after my wife's name, her name is Elena. Regalia Cecilia, which is for my wife's grandmother. And what's the other one? Senador any three, which is for Ernie.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:So each of those, up to the encore, I named those, after that, my daughter and my son named the other names.
Senator:It's great.
Gizmo:This has been a fantastic conversation.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Well, you. Thank you
Bam Bam:very much.
Rooster:Thank very appreciate
Gizmo:your time. I think we could talk for another six hours. I mean, really fantastic. Thank you so much.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Thank you.
Gizmo:It's an honor to
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:speak You guys make it easy and I really enjoyed it, And hopefully we can do this again next year.
Gizmo:I hope so.
Bam Bam:I look forward to it.
Gizmo:A lot more to talk about, but thank you so much for coming on and-
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Thank you. We'll see later, Mike.
Gizmo:Thanks so much. All right, boys. What a great conversation with Ernesto Perez-Carrillo-
Bam Bam:Of course.
Gizmo:Of Casa Carrillo. I'm so proud of that conversation. I'm so happy that we got to sit with him. So thankful that he spent as much time with us as he did. So for the listener, you know, that was an hour long split two parts for you here tonight.
Gizmo:But after that, we walked around PCA with him for like twenty five, thirty minutes.
Bam Bam:Felt like royalty.
Gizmo:Busting balls. Like we're talking about insider industry stories that we had questions about.
Rooster:Correct.
Gizmo:It was a phenomenal day and a phenomenal experience with Ernesto. So we're very, very grateful to him and his daughter, Lisette, for teeing that up for us. It was really, really a phenomenal experience. And again, I can't wait to continue that because I think, like we said in there, I think we could talk to him for another six hours.
Bam Bam:Oh, yeah.
Gizmo:If we wanted to. He's such a wealth of knowledge. So boys, with that, we've come to the end of the Perez-Carrillo Pledge Purple and the Glenlivet Fusion Cask pairing, and that bottle is almost empty at this point. That's correct. What's everybody thinking of the cigar and the pairing?
Bam Bam:I want more.
Senator:Me too. We don't want either to go to waste. Correct? Doing our jobs.
Bam Bam:And I don't want anyone in the club drinking that shit.
Gizmo:I don't think it's gonna make it over there. I'll be honest.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:It might. What do you
Gizmo:guys think of the cigar right now?
Rooster:Cigar is excellent. Even on the last third, it has actually picked up in strength. And at this point, there is a hint of citrus that I'm getting What? On top of the chocolate, the dark espresso, there's a little hint of citrus in the background. The pepper has kind of dissipated.
Bam Bam:Yeah, no pepper at all.
Chef Ricky:I'm getting mineral. Getting some minerality here.
Bam Bam:It's earthy for you now.
Rooster:Maybe it's the I'm getting like a leathery note. Maybe that's, you know.
Gizmo:You called that out in the The cold draw.
Senator:Cold draw.
Gizmo:Yeah. I think this, even in the last third now, has stepped up again, and it's a little differentiated from where it was in the first and second third. Like you're saying, I think it's leathery. I think the chocolate and espresso has kind of There's like this amalgamation of these three core flavors, maybe with a touch of floral with citrus There's flavors flavoring out
Rooster:there, but it's like an addition to that. It's another layer has been added on. And I
Gizmo:think it's still what's shocking me is how refined it is. Like, it's a really elegant experience tonight.
Bam Bam:Yeah. I think that it's it's still super easy to smoke even at this point. I'm about an inch and a half down from the end. I am getting a little bit of earthiness, some minerality. The leather's definitely there, but I am still really getting that, for me, that sweet coffee is consistent for me all the way through.
Chef Ricky:Lots of espresso.
Bam Bam:Yeah. And it's kind of balancing that earthiness beautifully.
Senator:Yeah. So, I mean, for me, I got the sweet coffee early. I think this is now like dark espresso.
Gizmo:Yeah.
Senator:As you get into the final third, I now think this is a full bodied cigar.
Gizmo:Sure. I agree with you.
Rooster:This is
Gizmo:a It's definitely
Senator:picked up. Yeah. It goes from medium to medium full to I think now this is firmly a full bodied cigar. Any notes you're getting? Yeah, like dark espresso.
Senator:Like no sugar. No memory, you're
Chef Ricky:picking up a lot of tannins. I feel like I'm picking up a very tannic quality to this.
Bam Bam:Yeah, I agree with that. But no sweetness for you guys now? No. No. Really?
Gizmo:No. The sweetness is, but not in a bad way, Bam. The sweetness for me has kind of diminished.
Chef Ricky:It's like 100% cocoa right now.
Rooster:Yeah, it's like a bitter sweet chocolate.
Gizmo:It's almost like my palate has had enough of the sweetness, It's totally cool with where it is right now. It's kind
Bam Bam:of think for
Gizmo:me the
Bam Bam:comment of bittersweet chocolate's very accurate right
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:now for me.
Gizmo:Yeah. How is the Glenlivet for you guys with this?
Bam Bam:Still spectacular. Great.
Gizmo:I think this is a, I'll say, and I'll say this during the ratings as well, I think this is a perfect cigar scotch. Yeah. I think if they said this was the cigar single malt from Glenlivet, I think that'd be a perfect way to label Yeah. I It's a perfect pairing.
Bam Bam:Like I said earlier, is there any Cuban that you wouldn't have with this?
Chef Ricky:No. It's beautiful. I
Gizmo:think the lightest of Cubans, if you think about like Just a consider
Bam Bam:that, the versatility of that. Like an oil.
Gizmo:Yeah. Or a la flor de cano eleguidos, which is like the lightest cigar we've smoked on this podcast from Cuba. It would still go well with this.
Bam Bam:Exactly right.
Gizmo:It's crazy. Or a por loranaga, a Corona.
Senator:R and J.
Gizmo:R and J.
Bam Bam:Look at it from that perspective. That whole catalog of very light, beautiful, creamy Cuban cigars all the way through to Padron's and everything else we're smoking now, you can have it with any cigar. It's pretty
Gizmo:incredible. Amazing. Yeah. Alright, boys. Let's go through some listener email now before we go into our ratings tonight.
Gizmo:This one is actually not an email. This one was physically sent to me by our friend Lizard Luigi, and there's a reason why.
Rooster:Is it handwritten?
Gizmo:It is. Wow. With a computer. It says, Lizards, I'm listening to the Perdomo Legacy episode, and I'm hearing the dreaded Gurkha brand mentioned. I thought I would try to provide some clarity and hopefully shed some light on the history of Gurkha and the bad and where the bad reputation came from.
Gizmo:In the early to mid two thousands due to the popularity that Gurkha held at the time, they started licensing out their name to the catalog retailers, Cigars International, etcetera, and they would slap Gurkha bans on reject cigars. This is where the Gurkha hate originated as well as their over the top packaging and questionable MSRPs. As far as I know, with new leadership at the helm, this practice has now stopped. This is not me advocating for Gurkha.
Bam Bam:Oh, it sounds like it is.
Gizmo:This is not me. Really?
Bam Bam:Sounds like it is. Gurkha.
Gizmo:This is me simply trying to explain and help people understand where the hate has stemmed from, Bam. Enclosed is a box of Gurkha. What? That I believe best represents the brand now and the direction that they are trying to go.
Bam Bam:Oh my lord.
Gizmo:So we have a 10 count box of Gurkha Nicaragua series in Toro that Lizard Luigi has sent us to review
Bam Bam:I guess we gotta review it.
Gizmo:On the pod. Correct.
Senator:That's tomorrow, and that is it for today. We will leave you with a
Gizmo:I can't do it. 100% Aganorsa tobacco for the wrapper, binder, and filler, and made at Aganorsa, which is where many, many big time brands have their cigars made, including Alucion, Warped, Viage, etcetera. Aganorsa is the premier grower of Nicaraguan Nicaragua tobacco. I don't know if I'd agree with that. What about Placencia?
Gizmo:Yeah. And some others. In my opinion, over the last five years, Gurkha has decided to finally get serious about making cigars, and I believe the Nicaragua series was the start of that. Other cigars that I can personally vouch for from Gurkha that are worth a try include the ghost, the ghost gold, any of the Volition Americas, the collection Especial, and the revenant in both Corojo and Maduro. They are working with Sirius factories now as well.
Gizmo:In addition to Aganorsa, have recently made cigars with Ho Chi Blanco, AJ Fernandez, Oliva, Ernesto. Talked about him tonight, of course, for smoking one hand cigars, and Oscar Valladares. In conclusion, I ask that you try these cigars as I think this specific line represents a turning point for for Gurkha. And please let me know what you think. It doesn't have to be on an episode.
Gizmo:However, I do think it would provide some memorable commentary. Best regard, Lizard Luigi. And as a little gift, PS for senator, since I heard him talk about the sampler pack on more than one occasion, he sent an Aladino box press collection, 10 cigars Wow. For senator.
Chef Ricky:Okay, senator. I guess now we have to
Gizmo:do the We're doing the Gurkha. Alright.
Senator:You can't believe what I was about to say before, but after this sampler pack, god bless Lizard Luigi.
Bam Bam:Wow. Box Aladinos.
Gizmo:Box pressed Aladinos, a 10 count of those, and he sent us a box of Gurkha's as well, the Nicaragua series.
Bam Bam:Very, very generous.
Gizmo:Boys, I think we have to vote. I think it's time to do a Gurkha on the pod after I'm 200 and in. I'm
Bam Bam:out until I get one of those.
Rooster:You couldn't have just said he sent that box to Cher, right?
Gizmo:No. I had a I'm listen. I'm I'm about accuracy here.
Rooster:He's not gonna read that.
Senator:About the truth.
Gizmo:He said it's for a wizard center.
Chef Ricky:Listen. There's been a lot of surprises on this podcast. You know, now we're all smoking monies, new world monies. I don't you know, a year ago. Shit.
Chef Ricky:Two months ago that no one none of
Rooster:us would
Chef Ricky:have happened. None of us would have thought this would have happened.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:So I
Senator:can't wait for a box pressed Gurkha.
Chef Ricky:I definitely don't wanna become Gurkha advocates, but I'm
Rooster:Hey.
Gizmo:We might be. We might be Gurkha advocates after that box. We might be with Mike Tyson.
Bam Bam:Careful now.
Gizmo:Alright, boys. Let's go to another one now. This one is from Lizard Marcus. He says, hey, Giz. I have really been enjoying the pod lately.
Gizmo:I wanted to send along some thoughts and questions I've been developing over the past couple of weeks. I just received my first order from small batch. Wow. They are world class. I'm super excited to try some Aladino and Stoic, my first bouts with both brands.
Gizmo:This incoming order, however, exaggerates a larger issue I've been experiencing and thinking about the last couple of weeks. I have totally run out of room. When is the right time to get a larger tower style Humidor? Now. At what point I knew that was the answer.
Gizmo:At what point in each of your journeys did you get one? I have a smaller I have a smaller Nedone. I don't know what that is. As many as well as many tupper doors that are getting quite full. At some point, I would love to get a tower, though the barrier to entry is quite high when it comes to price.
Gizmo:What tower do you all recommend? What are some important features one should factor in when making such a big decision? I figured you have talked about this at some point in the past, but I wasn't able to track down which episode. Thanks again for all your time creating such an entertaining product. Best, Lizard Marcus.
Gizmo:So first off, the time to get a tower if you are a cigar smoker. And I always, you know, distinguish cigar smokers from people who smoke cigars. If you are in the cigar smoking category and not in the someone who smokes cigars category, the time to get a tower is now Correct. As Rooster said. And the reason for that answer is very simple.
Gizmo:Number one, it's a piece of furniture that you're gonna have in your home, and I promise you, you're gonna fill it. That's number one
Rooster:for me. Especially if you have boxes and Tupperware and you have multiple Tupperwares. How hard is it to find boxes and cigars out of the Tupperware? Very. And this is a tower where you can beautifully see every single shelf, every single box.
Rooster:You know exactly where it is. You don't have to physically open and the Tupperware is sort of stacked up. You don't know where the boxes are. This is right in front of you. And as far as the cost goes, if you have like four or five Tupperwares, I mean, a decent tower, it's gonna cost you less than 10% off your
Gizmo:Your collection. Of collection.
Rooster:Correct.
Gizmo:Yeah. It's an investment. And also, by the way, the price of the tower right now is lower than it's gonna be in two years. Also true. Lower than it's gonna be in five years.
Gizmo:Lower than it's gonna be in ten
Rooster:years. So
Gizmo:as far as if you think about the long game of this, it's never been a better time to buy than today. Forget about yesterday, than today because that price isn't going down. I mean, we're talking about three to four boxes of Padron exclusivos and you can buy a tower. Correct? Right.
Gizmo:Correct. True.
Senator:Look. It's no different than buying cigars themselves. The price of everything goes up. So the longer you wait, the more you're gonna pay, and the more you're gonna regret that you didn't pull the trigger sooner when it was cheaper. So I think from storage to even procuring boxes of cigars, you'd you'd be a fool not to if you can.
Senator:Just invest the money now, and that's gonna last you forever. Yeah. I mean, it's not like a tower, you know, goes bad. It it doesn't age out. You're gonna have that for decades.
Senator:So I hope that lizard takes the plunge. And I'll also express the reality that even getting a tower is not gonna permanently solve their storage issue. Also correct. They're gonna get a tower, they're gonna fill it, but at least once you have a tower, you know, ceilings are only so high, you've maximized that one unit. And at that point, you're going to find yourself using some Tupperware as every one of us in this room, even though we have towers
Gizmo:After we said we wouldn't.
Bam Bam:Correct. That's right.
Senator:So at least just take the plunge because you're gonna need that. And then once you start to outgrow it and need more space, sure Tupperware is gonna be right there, but it sounds like he'll already have some other options to store stuff, but you gotta take the plunge.
Gizmo:So a couple options now as far as brands and types of towers that we have. So first up, I know that a couple of you guys have the
Chef Ricky:Your Elegant Bar. Your Elegant Bar. I have That's what I have.
Gizmo:Tower of Power. The Tower of Power, which has now been replaced by the one that Chef got, which has a fan system in it, has lights built in, has better sealant than the one that Bam, Senator
Bam Bam:and It's Pledge larger,
Gizmo:yeah? It's larger too.
Rooster:No, it's about
Gizmo:the same size. It just has a little bit a couple more features. And there's also a plug in the bottom so that you don't have to go out for power. There's a plug in the bottom for your oasis.
Bam Bam:Right. The silicone at it.
Gizmo:Exactly right. So you don't have to do any silicone, lighting, anything. It's all there.
Chef Ricky:And I just checked. Right now we're looking at $14.88 So if you throw That's
Gizmo:a great price,
Bam Bam:it's not bad at all.
Chef Ricky:If you throw in a cigar oasis, you know, a couple hygrometers, maybe $18.50, something around there.
Gizmo:It's every dollar. It's worth every dollar.
Senator:Yep. We're going to be having this same conversation five years from now, and that tower's going to be $3.
Gizmo:Correct.
Senator:Yeah. I say that because I was the first to get that tower of power during COVID. How much? 700? It was 6 something.
Gizmo:No way. Wow. So now it's 15.
Senator:Yeah. It's 15. That's six years ago.
Bam Bam:That's crazy. So
Gizmo:Rooster and I have the Vigilant Vault 2,000. Each of us have that. So that is a
Chef Ricky:Sounds like Jimmy Neutron.
Bam Bam:Sounds like an ACME on a Roadrunner. Cartoon.
Gizmo:So that is a made to order piece from Vigilant Humidors up in the Northeast. I think they're in Vermont or something. New Hampshire. New Hampshire. And so you can pick on that one.
Gizmo:You can pick every finish. You can pick if it's glass doors or cedar. So that takes I think the lead time on that rooster was what, six months, eight months? So that's also something if you're interested in getting something custom, that's what we have.
Bam Bam:What do you think they're going for now? The two that
Gizmo:you Oh, I don't even know.
Rooster:I can sell you mine for $10.
Bam Bam:No. Thank you. With the cigars in it? Done. Done.
Gizmo:Hey, that's a good deal. Correct. That ain't bad. I'm in. I'm for steal.
Gizmo:Correct.
Bam Bam:Kidding. With the cigars, I'm all in on that.
Rooster:Get out of here. Correct. I mean, really get out here.
Bam Bam:I'll be at your house in
Gizmo:the back. Should I should I turn his mic off? So as far as the timing of when all of us got it, I I think mine, I got probably two years or into the podcast. My first one, I probably got two years into the podcast and then
Bam Bam:The Remington you had.
Gizmo:The Remington. And then about a year after that, year and a half after that, I ended up getting the vault. Rooster was in the same position I was. I think, senator, you had yours before I did. Well before.
Senator:Yeah. I got mine in 2020.
Gizmo:2020 during COVID?
Bam Bam:I got mine during COVID as well.
Gizmo:During COVID. And then chef, you got yours, what, two years ago now?
Chef Ricky:Yeah. Actually,
Gizmo:yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Right after you joined the pod.
Rooster:Well, fam fam god has in 2020. That's right.
Gizmo:He's he installed it in '23. Yeah.
Bam Bam:But he was waiting for this. I was waiting for this.
Senator:To move it from his garage into his house. It was
Gizmo:a three year process.
Bam Bam:I had it for
Gizmo:a while. But Craig Craig remember,
Rooster:this guy's a contractor. Craig was businessman.
Bam Bam:I had it for a while. It's true. It's true. He was waiting
Chef Ricky:for the wife to put it together. Correct.
Rooster:Exactly. Exactly.
Bam Bam:She's handy.
Gizmo:Great question from Lizard Marcus. Thanks for writing in. And, if any other lizards out there have storage or Humidor questions, please let us know. Alright, boys. And now it's time to go into our lizard of the week presented by our friends at Bond Roberts.
Gizmo:How awesome are those dahlias? How awesome are those phenomenos that we have in our hands tonight, boys?
Bam Bam:Fantastic.
Gizmo:Get them now at fabrica005.com. And our lizard of the week this week is Lizard Jim. And he says, hello, Lizards. I'm a longtime smoker of cigars that has converted to a cigar smoker. I like that.
Gizmo:Using our terminology over the past couple of years, and I owe much of that conversion to your podcast. You all are great at demystifying much of the knowledge that true cigar smokers know. So thank you for that. My home lounge is Casa de Monte Cristo JR cigar in Whippany, New Jersey.
Bam Bam:Oh.
Gizmo:I am fortunate to have a lounge close by with an amazing humidor.
Bam Bam:Local boy.
Gizmo:Great selection of spirits and a more than acceptable kitchen. It's highly recommended if you haven't already had a chance to go. I've been there many times.
Chef Ricky:Sounds like he's
Gizmo:in Guam. He's in Guam. He lives in Guam. I'm working my way through the Lounge Lizard Sampler Pack from smallbatchcigar.com. Of course, I used your discount code.
Gizmo:I have to say my purchasing experience was exactly how you guys described it would be. I will be ordering from them again. I just finished listening to episode 235, and your discussion of the merits of Cuban cigars versus New World cigars reminded me of a question that I've had for some time. What country produces the most, quote, Cuban like cigar experience? Based upon episode 235, it sounded like it's Honduras for all of you, but I don't believe that it was explicitly mentioned.
Gizmo:And what are the attributes and qualities that make whatever country you pick the most, quote, Cuban like? I will share a recent experience I had with three Cuban cigars that left me a little disappointed. I was in London for work, so I went to Soudar and purchased five cigars. Three Cuban Monte Cristos, one my father blue, and one Aladino eighty fifth and a Rosario. I made a point of smoking the Monte Cristos prior to returning stateside to avoid duplicating Giz's global entry experience.
Gizmo:One of the three practically unraveled in my hand as I smoked it. One was great and one was just okay. Wow. So that's the Monte Cristos. I chalk up the different smoking experiences to not allowing them to rest before smoking.
Gizmo:On the other hand, I allowed the Aladino and the My Father to rest in my humidor before enjoying them, and they were just fantastic. Far better than the Monte Cristos. I'm a longtime bourbon fan, and I have a nice selection at home. One of your recent episodes, the subject of price came up. I like this right here.
Gizmo:I use a useful rule of thumb for a benchmark on bourbon that is $10 per year of age.
Bam Bam:K.
Gizmo:So if it's a, you know, 10 years aged, a $100, etcetera. So I like that he's applying a number to the age. Of course, there are exceptions like the Wild Turkey one zero one eight year you recently reviewed, which shows what a value that spirit truly is. I hope to run into you boys one of these days in Northern New Jersey. Best, Lizard Jim.
Bam Bam:Cool.
Gizmo:Great email from Lizard Jim, our neighbor here. Oh, Chef and my neighbor over in That's right. In Guam. So let's talk about his questions about the Cubans. So I think I'll answer for everybody.
Gizmo:The country that produces the most Cuban like cigars as a general statement is certainly Honduras. Now if I were, you know, like like Lizard Jim said, how would you describe what you're looking for in a, quote, Cuban like experience from a non Cuban cigar? How would you describe that?
Senator:I mean, I think like a a minerality and kinda almost saltiness that you get in Cuban tobacco that's very unique. It's something you don't get as much in Nicaraguan or Dominican tobacco. So for me, that's like probably at the top. And then I would say second to that is like some of those like floral and like lighter, brighter citrus or fruit notes that you get in Cuban tobacco, usually with like some bit of a creaminess to it. I think that's like those are, like, the most unique distinct flavors that you get alongside the more traditional commonalities across Nicaraguan, Dominican, Honduran tobacco, a nuttiness, cocoa, coffee.
Senator:I mean, that's, I think, what's in common across those regions. But I think it's those lighter, brighter, more mineral forward notes that are unique to Cuban and Honduran tobacco.
Rooster:I think that Cuban tobacco, the soil is very neutral, first of all. It's a very neutral pH. The level of pH in Nicaraguan soil is very it's on the higher side. The tobaccos need more age, first of all. Cuban tobacco, they hardly age the cigars.
Rooster:They just roll them out, it goes out. And they're pretty much ready to smoke, especially a lot of the Some
Gizmo:of the new stuff.
Rooster:A lot of the
Gizmo:old stuff.
Rooster:A lot
Gizmo:of the stuff, forget about it. The old blends, no.
Rooster:Now the construction issues still persist just by his experience.
Bam Bam:That's correct.
Rooster:So having said that, but when you have a great Cuban cigar, nothing beats it. Absolutely nothing beats
Bam Bam:that cigar. Specifically for me, the Cuban experience is very distinct in the notes that I'm getting. And I, for me, I pursue in a Cuban cigar. I love that graham cracker note that I get in many, many Cubans.
Rooster:Yeah. The baking spice, the graham
Gizmo:cracker.
Bam Bam:I get I get a touch of funk, which is it it could be called barnyard. It could be called sour cream type of a funk type of a thing. But that in combination with the graham cracker, a touch of salt that senator mentioned, and, honestly, I'm gonna go back, that quintessential dried fruit, it's like an apricot. The lighter fruits that are dried, like apricot and apple, especially dried apple for me, is very distinct. I don't get that in any cigar made anywhere else in the world except for Cuba.
Rooster:Even more so the floral notes that you will not get
Bam Bam:in a non Cuba cigars.
Rooster:Yeah. Especially the La Gloria Cubanos. The LGCs, of course.
Chef Ricky:I mean,
Bam Bam:they are so floral. Mean, there's a graham cracker there too. For me, that graham cracker dry fruit is pervasive in almost every marca, but then you get hints of other things in other marcas like the floral. You don't get that in every marca. You don't even really get that salt minerality in every marca.
Bam Bam:For me, there is a consistency in two specific notes.
Rooster:And the baking spice and nutty flavor that you get from the Upmans. And the deep salt,
Bam Bam:the cinnamon Sure. That you
Rooster:Yeah. The salty twang that you get out of the Monte Cristo line.
Bam Bam:You're really not getting this in any other new world except really for that Honduran marker. All those markers coming out
Gizmo:of Honduran. A great Cuban cigar has some sort of x factor that's not better or worse No. Than anything else, but it's different than anything else.
Bam Bam:And personally for me, it's that that barnyard and how it's balanced with some of the fruit notes that I'm getting.
Chef Ricky:Yeah. I think the way that what sets Honduran cigars apart from our Nicaraguan counterparts is that when we're smoking Cubans, the floral notes that you're that you're calling rooster, the graham cracker notes that you're calling Bam, the citrus notes, the minerality that you're getting senator. And Cuban tobacco from my experience with you guys is that it delivers it in a very round and creamy manner, especially when they're well aged.
Senator:Yep, it's true.
Chef Ricky:And we're able to pull that out of an Aladino. We're able to pull that out of some of our fabric of five, most of our fabric of five. In fact, that Trinity Robusto offers that for a meal in a very just literal fashion. So 100% Honduran tobacco is the way to go if you're looking for that Cuban
Rooster:experience. I think the Bond Robert cigars are the closest
Gizmo:That's
Rooster:thing
Gizmo:a Cuban also true.
Senator:That for sure, but I mean, just on the Trini Robusto, I remember when Fabricify first put that out, when I first smoked that cigar, I hadn't even looked on the website, and I was sitting in the lounge here, and I said, this tastes to me like a schwa supreme.
Gizmo:Mhmm.
Senator:Because I was initially getting these berry notes that you get on a schwa supreme.
Bam Bam:I still get that, senator.
Senator:And then I said, like an Upman, I was getting this nuttiness. And when I went to order my first bundle years ago, it literally said Schwa Supreme meets Upman Connie one or two. And I was like, that is the perfect description of the flavor profile you get in that, and that is only what Honduran tobacco is capable of delivering that close to a Cuban experience.
Bam Bam:That's correct.
Gizmo:So I think you're saying that the tasting panel did a great job with that cigar.
Senator:I mean, well, I think most
Bam Bam:When you have a global insider in the room, you get to get that experience.
Senator:I mean, thank you,
Gizmo:Hamlet. Correct. That is correct.
Rooster:So I'm curious why Lizard Jim in London bought New World cigars because he must have paid an arm and a leg for those.
Gizmo:Maybe he wanted to try them. I don't know.
Senator:Oh, I'm sure they were cheaper than Cuban cigars.
Gizmo:Yeah. Much cheaper
Rooster:than But Cuban the New World cigars here compared to in in Europe, he would have paid more.
Senator:No. For sure. But just for what's accessible to him, it's gotta be the case just like here that a New World cigar is cheaper than
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:a Cuban.
Chef Ricky:Yeah. And it seems like he wanted to do a direct comparison at the time. Exactly.
Senator:I'm just stunned that he was able to go to Soudre And get and find an Aladino eighty fifth and a My Father Blue. Very cool. Mean, the last time I was in Sauder, granted, this is probably six, at most seven years ago, but probably like six years ago, maybe like 2019 before COVID, I had not seen a single New World cigar available for purchase there.
Gizmo:Tells you what that's That tells you how the Habano supply has changed Yeah. Yeah. Since that time. Yeah. The other thing I wanna say too is Lawrence Davis, who's the owner of Souter, is if you watch any of his review videos or anything he's done, he loves cigars at like 72 plus percent relative humidity.
Bam Bam:Like our He
Gizmo:chews on them. He, I mean,
Bam Bam:he Like our friend in The Caymans.
Gizmo:He he loves cigars that wet. So my assumption He chars them too. My assumption of Lizard Jim's experience here with those cigars that blew up was that he just did not give those cigars enough time to come down to the proper humidity, proper quote unquote, as we say in this room in that 62 to 65 range for Cubans. I'm assuming that's what happened with those Monte Cristos for sure. So, boys, again, we have to congratulate Lizard Jim winning a 10 count box of cigars from our friends at Bond Roberts.
Gizmo:And now it's time to move into the ratings portion of our program. Don't forget to send me your ratings on the Glenlivet Fusion Cask single malt scotch whiskey and the Perez-Carrillo Pledge Purple, the Toro special release from Casa Carrillo. Alright, boys. It's time now to move into the formal liquor rating tonight on the Glenlivet Fusion Cask single malt scotch whiskey. Bam.
Gizmo:Bam. You're up. Thank you for the ASMR, Bam.
Bam Bam:The aroma on the nose is heavenly. It's honestly, I was coming in with very low expectations.
Gizmo:On the Glenlivet?
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:Yes. Your
Bam Bam:mistake. Well, yeah. I am at a 10. This is probably the most delicious, easy drinking, elegant, smooth, yet buttery. For me, buttery on the front and honestly on the finish, that banana call out that they have with the baking spice is so freaking accurate.
Bam Bam:I don't remember having having a scotch that was this smooth and delicious. It's truly fantastic. Great, elegant experience. Solid 10.
Gizmo:Alright, chef.
Chef Ricky:Yeah. The nose here is great, Pam, as you pointed out. But what really caught me was the first sip, buttery, rich vanilla custard, and then the finish, I was just getting this citrus. And it was delicious. Very light, no heat, easy to drink.
Chef Ricky:You could get lost in the spirit.
Rooster:Chocoflan.
Chef Ricky:Yeah, chocoflan with the cigar. Yeah, and the fact that it's so versatile just makes us great. So for me it's a 10.
Bam Bam:Yeah, that's the incredible thing about this, like we said a moment ago. Honestly, I will smoke this with any cigar Cuban in your world, and for me that is just
Chef Ricky:And while you smoke it, I'm a drink it with any cigar Cuban in your world.
Senator:Bam loves to smoke a single malt. Wait.
Bam Bam:Is that what I said?
Gizmo:How glasses have you had?
Bam Bam:That's my 3rd Floor.
Gizmo:It's a lot. Oh, boy.
Bam Bam:You feel vindicated, don't you?
Gizmo:Not yet. So for me, it's also a 10. I I think this is one of the best cigar pairing single malts we've had in the room. I I did hesitate nine or 10 as I was thinking about the price, but I really think even at that price, this was a perfect scotch tonight, especially for what we do here. I love its versatility and how it would pair with any origin of cigar, any combination of tobaccos that we would smoke in this room.
Gizmo:I really loved it. I'm blown away again by the Glenlivet. For me, it was an absolute perfect single malt scotch tonight. I'm blown away. It's a 10.
Gizmo:Senator.
Senator:So I've been toying with a nine and a 10. I'll start by saying it is an outstanding spirit and an outstanding single malt. Here we go. The balance in this is Why are you so upset if I'm debating between a nine and a 10?
Bam Bam:I'm actually laughing with glee. It's his third pore. Correct. Correct. I'm enjoying myself.
Bam Bam:We're gonna
Senator:need to mute his mic. Correct. So there is tremendous balance in this spirit. The butteriness that I talked about, it's like the way it just dances on your palate. It coats your mouth.
Senator:It's outrageously smooth. I mean, I think, you know, Giz mentioned this may be a gateway single malt. Now the price point is not ideal for a gateway, but to your point, like, the flavor profile
Gizmo:If you really like this friend that you're trying to gateway into single malts, this is the one.
Chef Ricky:This is
Rooster:his If
Gizmo:you don't like that person too much
Senator:it's as easy drinking as single malt as exists. The only reason that I rounded down to the nine is at this price point, I do wish there was a little bit more richness and oomph in the flavor that it delivered, And the single malt that I would honestly compare this to is like Macallan 15, which is not that far off in price point. This is what you said a 110, a 120 a bottle gives. A 115. A 115.
Senator:Macallan 15 is like a 150. That is very smooth, can be drank neat, like we're enjoying this, but there is more depth and richness in the flavor that that McAllen 15 delivers. And so if I have one complaint, again, if this were sub a $100, if this were a $75 bottle, I I would probably round up to the 10 and not be this picky about what my expectations are. But I
Bam Bam:was 115.
Senator:Yeah. I mean, a 115, like, this is none of us drink anything that we drink in our regular rotations, I'm
Gizmo:a 115 bottles of a FortiCagna So
Senator:it's like, this is an occasion spirit for any one of us in the world.
Gizmo:From the
Bam Bam:point of view, the price correct.
Senator:Not one of us would just regularly every day pour a $115 spirit, and so there's just a higher bar for that. And when I compare that to other 100 to a $150 spirits, I am just left wanting a little bit more richness and fullness in flavor. Like, we talk about, like, a full bodied cigar. Like, to me, this is a medium bodied single malt, and I typically reach for a single malt when I want something that's medium full or full in terms of the body and flavor that it's delivering. So I just want a little bit more at that price point, which is what would have given it to 10, but I'm at an incredibly strong nine.
Senator:I think if you're a single malt drinker, it would be a mistake not to try this. If you love Glenlivet, you'll be blown away by this expression. They've done an outstanding job.
Gizmo:So boys, the formal liquor rating tonight on the Glenlivet Fusion Cask single malt scotch whiskey is a 9.8. GEO coming through tonight. Amazing. Thank you, Lizard Geo. Let's compare that to the other three Glenlivet's we've done on the podcast.
Gizmo:On episode 26, we did the Glenlivet 18, scored a 9.3. On episode 60, we did the Glenlivet 12, scored an eight. And on episode 117, with the punch double corona, if you believe it, the Glenlivet 14 scored a 9.8, same as this.
Bam Bam:Very good showing.
Senator:We've never done the Glenlivet 18? Yeah. What did you say, cut?
Rooster:9.8. Oh.
Gizmo:That was the first one.
Bam Bam:That's low.
Senator:I'm sorry. Glenlivet 18 is outstanding.
Chef Ricky:Well, tell me senator
Gizmo:By the way, did rate that on episode 26. That's two eleven Regardless episodes
Bam Bam:though, this brand has done great on our pod. Yeah. Really well shown.
Gizmo:I'm telling you, this pod has really reinforced how great of a brand Glenlivet is because you see it everywhere. It's like McDonald's. Like, you see it everywhere. You wouldn't think that it's excellent.
Bam Bam:You take it for Yes.
Gizmo:Cause you can get it anytime, anywhere. And it really has proven itself to be Yeah. A fantastic single malt scotch. Alright, boys. It's time now to move into the formal lizard rating tonight on the Perez-Carrillo Pledge Purple.
Gizmo:Rooster, you're up.
Rooster:Great cigar. I mean, the cigar was not a one act play, not a two act play. It was actually a three act play. The cigar started off with coffee with milk, with a little bit of black pepper, just a hint. And it really built up.
Rooster:Like every third of the cigar got better and fuller as you smoked it down. At the halfway point, it picked up a little bit in body and strength and got fuller. But not only that, there were some other flavors that instead of coffee, it became more espresso. The black pepper, although there was a little bit there, but it was there. It was throughout.
Rooster:It was a hint of it. It wasn't over none of the notes were overpowering. There was no note that was so dominant. So it had great balance. The cigar was really well blended.
Rooster:The last third of the cigar got a deep, sweet, dark chocolate delicious smoke throughout. So the construction was phenomenal. You could taste like the aged tobaccos in this. I mean, I know the wrapper is aged ten years, and you could really taste that. So I'm at a solid nine on this cigar.
Rooster:I'm sorry. You've got to explain that.
Senator:Everything you said was about how perfect
Rooster:this cigar was. So why a nine is I'll that. All right. So the reason why I'm at a nine is because there's a lot of other cigars that are, at this point, are lower that, for me, an Exclusivo is a solid 10. So that gives me a little bit more flavor than this one did.
Rooster:It's more in my flavor profile. I'll pick up an Exclusivo over this. And not just because of the price point, just because of the satisfaction that I get out of an Exclusivo.
Senator:Gotcha. That makes sense.
Gizmo:So I just want to say that I just looked at the Lounge Lizards ratings guide. Oh, boy. And on the Pedro- Who
Bam Bam:we calling out
Rooster:Exclusivo Maduro episode. It might have been that Rooster
Gizmo:rated that cigar a nine. I just wanted to say.
Senator:But remember, he loves that cigar more than I do.
Gizmo:I have been smoking
Bam Bam:vindicated. Nineteen twenty seven smoking a cigar.
Rooster:I smoke Padron's now more than any other brand. I mean, literally every other day I'm lighting up.
Gizmo:Listen, I'm just going to the ratings guy. That's all. It took him a hundred years,
Rooster:but What mean, what what episode was that?
Gizmo:Episode three, but that's that's immaterial.
Rooster:I mean It's not immaterial.
Senator:You were 93.
Rooster:You guys rated a That's correct. You guys rated a Glenlivet 18 a 9.3, and this one is much higher.
Gizmo:It's as worse. You know? That's true.
Bam Bam:So
Gizmo:Alright, senator. You're up.
Senator:So I agree with a lot of Rooster's commentary. Thank God. But he is wrong in the sense that for me, this is deserving of a 10. I can't really find a flaw in this cigar. And I think the thing that surprised me is, you know, the Carrillo cigars that we've smoked, I think, perform similar to Padron in some other markets in that they're not really by design meant to be multiple act plays.
Senator:Like, there's a pretty consistent delivery of flavor from start to finish that's characteristic of the brand, and I was very surprised that this took me on such a journey, and I grew with rooster is firmly a three act play. Started medium, second, third got medium full, and definitely ended full. And it went from, like, coffee, not espresso, coffee with brown sugar to by the end of it, like, just dark espresso with no sugar. The cigar was balanced all the way through. I grew with Rooster.
Senator:The aged tobacco's definitely shined in this. There wasn't a single rough edge even when it got full, and that's when I got a little nervous because when it picked up in body and strength, I was worried that that's maybe where there would be some rough edges, and there were none, which speaks to the tobacco that they use for the blend. You know, I don't disagree with Rooster that if I had to choose, you know, would I pick up the exclusive over this? Sure. But that doesn't take away from the fact that for me, this is just as perfect in its own right and in what it is trying to do as an ex lusivo is in its own right and what it's trying to do.
Senator:And a world of credit to Ernesto in that, you know, to use an American wrapper on this, you know, this isn't like a Connecticut shade wrapper that everybody's used dime a dozen. Like, this is a wrapper that is meant to deliver a ton of flavor and does complement the filler so well. So I think he's done an outstanding job. I also, like Giz mentioned, was not a big fan of the pledge prequel, but boy, this is, I think, leaps and bounds, more special than that cigar. I get why it's a special release.
Senator:I hope that they consider either reviving this at some point or maybe even making it part of the standard production because I would buy this in the future. I mean, in the long term, like, think it's that excellent a cigar. So I'm at a strong 10. I really can't find a flaw. The combustion was great.
Senator:The construction, it really checked every box for for me at least.
Rooster:I I would imagine that the wrapper is in limited supply. I would think so.
Chef Ricky:You know,
Rooster:this kind of age on it.
Gizmo:So for all those reasons, I also disagree with Rooster. And I'm also at a 10. I thought this cigar was brilliant. I thought it was perfect. What I loved about this, and we know that it has that American wrapper on it.
Gizmo:We know that it's a Dominican cigar. But if we smoked this blind tonight, I would have 100% assumed that this was a Nicaraguan cigar. But it has an essence of Dominican smoothness to it that is really, really special where that cigar being able to slot in like we talked about in that kind of Exclusivo Trinidad Espiritu aging room slot for us. I think this has a unique place like you just said. The only disappointment I have, and I I said it earlier, is that I can't smoke this every week because they're just not available.
Gizmo:They're gone.
Ernesto Perez-Carrillo:That's correct.
Senator:Right? So And that you couldn't keep the ash in the ashtray.
Gizmo:Well, I'm working over here. I'm working over here. I I really I'm blown away by this cigar. I I do think that $16.50 that we paid or 18 MSRP is a very reasonable price for the experience we had tonight. I thought it was elegant.
Gizmo:I thought it was a three act play as as you said. I I thought it was brilliant. I think this was one of the best Perez-Carrillo blends that I've smoked, probably alongside the twenty twenty three or 2024. I think it's the 2023 pledge of allegiance that really, really blew us away. Some of the other cigars did as well, but this one stands above for me.
Gizmo:I'm I'm really, really impressed with this. I loved it. So for me, it's a 10. Chef?
Chef Ricky:Beautiful cigar. Beautiful presentation. I'm looking at this lacquered purple box here that just looks great. It reminds me of Prince.
Gizmo:It does. Yeah. I wish I had a purple Range Rover.
Chef Ricky:It's great. But you know what, this cigar, it took you on a journey of a bittersweet profile with this round balance that just creamed everything out and made it extremely palatable and enjoyable. I'm talking about flavors that for many could just be overwhelming, right? Like 100% cocoa or even 86% cocoa. But that balance with some nuttiness and baking spice and then some like dark dried fruits brought it all together and made this a pleasurable experience.
Chef Ricky:For me, unlike any other epicarillo cigar I've ever had, this cigar right here is probably the one of the most or the most complex Iplica Carrillo I've ever had. So I really enjoyed it. I love the way it paired with this extremely versatile Scotch. I love the presentation. I love the feel in the hand.
Chef Ricky:The size was great. The price at that discount code or discount that you got was amazing. I can't figure out where to knock this. You know, there were times in the final third where I was getting some tannins that I thought were going to kind of throw me for a loop. But then, as I said, it would, you know, the cigar would introduce some sweetness or some creaminess to balance that out.
Chef Ricky:So it just it did really well and it was a fun smoke. So for me, it's a 10.
Gizmo:Alright, Bam. Alright. Alright. Alright.
Bam Bam:This is interesting for me. You know, I had four of these cigars a few weeks ago, maybe a month ago. They were all fantastic. They were exquisite. Tonight's experience was, I will say, a touch different.
Bam Bam:Some of the commentary someone said they had this a few weeks ago. It wasn't great. I've heard this from other people, kind of mixed reviews, and I'm finding it difficult to want to pursue this cigar if I have to keep it at a separate RH than everything else that I have. But with all that put aside, I I all my commentary earlier in the pod, I think this is an excellent cigar. It's delicious.
Bam Bam:I the first third, the second third are incredible. The beginning of the final third was fantastic, but for me, that final inch tonight, I got a deep earthiness and minerality that I'm not always looking for that I didn't get in any of the other cigars that I had in this particular line a month ago. So for those reasons, I'm at a nine. But with all of that said, though, I think this is probably, as chef said, one of the best cigars that he's put out, and I would love to see him blend in this manner, mixing leaves from other countries as he talked about during the interview. I think that's an interesting approach that he's taking.
Bam Bam:I wanna see more of that from him. So I'm at a firm nine.
Gizmo:So, boys, the formal lizard rating tonight on the Perez-Carrillo Pledge Purple is a 9.6.
Bam Bam:Good score. Excellent.
Gizmo:So let's compare that to the other five Perez Carrillos we've done on the podcast. On episode five, if you believe it, we did the pledge prequel. Wow. Scored a 6.5.
Bam Bam:We were amateurs then.
Gizmo:Correct. On episode 19, the La Historia El Senador scored an 8.8. On episode 87, very apropos to my commentary, the Pledge of Allegiance 2023 scored a 9.6. Correct. Same as this.
Gizmo:On episode 126, the allegiance in sidekick, we did that at the first PCA show, scored a nine.
Bam Bam:That was delicious.
Gizmo:And on episode 197, the Perez-Carrillo encore black in Robusto scored an eight. So this one is at the top with the Pledge of Allegiance 2023 that we've raved about over and over for going on three years now. So awesome cigar tonight.
Senator:Yeah. I think the the coolest thing, you know, to Bam's point about hoping to see Ernesto blending with these different tobaccos. I mean, from that interview, one of the moments that just stood out so much is when we asked him how difficult or frustrating or even disappointing is it working with American tobacco. And for him to sit there and look us all in the eye and say, American tobacco is just as good Shocking
Bam Bam:as to hear that.
Senator:He uses out of the Dominican Republic or Nicaragua, we were floored.
Gizmo:Dude, I couldn't believe it. I always thought that American tobacco was like taboo Yes.
Rooster:It's true. But only on wrapper or No. Everything. Lander and filler.
Senator:Filler. Everything. He he wants to do American puros. Yeah. That's how good the tobacco was that he was working with.
Rooster:Yeah. From where?
Senator:Even he was shocked. He said Grown where? Pennsylvania, Connecticut. Florida. Florida.
Gizmo:Newark. Paterson C Caucus. C Caucus. I mean,
Senator:it was stunning. And just to, you know, enjoy this cigar and have American Tobacco have such a presence, the pledge of allegiance that we love, that has American tobacco blended in it from there.
Gizmo:The pledge of allegiance, the special edition as we talked about, is a
Bam Bam:A purifier. Yes.
Gizmo:It's an American purifier.
Senator:That's he does not want that to be his last. He wants to do American purifier. Like, that's how much he enjoyed working with American tobacco. So I just think the experimentation, the innovation that's happening there is awesome. And to Bam's point, we love this.
Senator:I I I can't wait to see what else he comes out with.
Bam Bam:Yeah. There aren't many makers that are talking about experimenting with American tobacco Tobacco. Not just American Tobacco, from other countries around the world he was talking about in our interview.
Senator:The thing is shocking. From his commentary, I think our assumption was that the reason for that is it's inferior, and what he was admitting is just they're they're not as familiar with it. You know, even for him, it was a newer experience working. This is a guy who's been blending for over fifty years.
Rooster:Yeah.
Senator:And it was just a newer experience working with it, so I think a lot of blenders, a lot of brands just don't know what to expect out of American tobacco, probably outside of like a Connecticut shade wrapper. Yep. And so as they venture more into it, I think you'll see other brands start to follow suit and come up with some really cool unique blends.
Bam Bam:And for him to take that jump, that leap of faith, I think it just shows versatility, it shows courage. Yep. And I I wanna see more of
Rooster:it. Sure.
Gizmo:Yeah. Alright, boys. We have to congratulate again Lizard Jim, our lizard of the week, who sent that great email in. And of course, we have to thank Bon Roberts who's gonna send Lizard Jim a 10 count box of cigars for winning lizard of the week. And, of course, go out and pick up the Phenomenos and the Dahlia.
Gizmo:They are now available from Bon Roberts. Course, boys, we have to thank again smallbatchcigar.com, the exclusive retail partner of the Lounge Lizards Podcast. We have to, of course, again, thank our lizard listeners out there who sold out our sampler. There are plenty more samplers that are not ours. There are others on there and they have a great cigar of the month club.
Gizmo:So check that out. Smallbatchcigar.com. And boys, Fabrica five, our presenting sponsor. I'm actually smoking a Trinity Robusto right now.
Bam Bam:Oh, I can see.
Gizmo:Phenomenal cigar. Yeah. I'm loving it. Great follow-up to this Perez Carrillo we smoked tonight. So check out fabrica005.com.
Gizmo:Use our code lizard pod for 10% off the entire store.
Rooster:And finally, boys And Lizard Luigi for the Gurkha's.
Gizmo:And and lizard Luigi for the Gurkha's.
Rooster:Can't wait to direct. Can't wait to review those.
Bam Bam:Oh, I'm sure you can.
Gizmo:And finally, boys, we have to thank again Ernesto Perez-Carrillo, the legend, the tobacco master for sitting with us for as long as he did, allowing us to share that fantastic conversation with Lizard Nation. We really, really appreciate him, and we look forward to next time. What a great night, boys. Awesome night. Unbelievable.
Gizmo:Fantastic. The interview, the pairing
Bam Bam:The pairing off
Gizmo:the charts. Gosh. The the cigar, unbelievable nighttime. My Aladino sampler. Correct.
Bam Bam:Hour. Can't wait to share hours.
Gizmo:I'm sure we're gonna get a bunch of those. Alright, boys. A great night, and, we'll see everybody next week. Hope you enjoyed this episode. Thanks for joining us.
Gizmo:You can find our merch store and ratings archive at our brand new website, loungelizardspod.com. That's loungelizardspod.com. Don't forget to leave us a rating and subscribe on your favorite podcast platform. If you have any comments, questions, if you wanna reach out, say hello, tell us what you're smoking, email us. Hello at loungelizardspod.com.
Gizmo:You can also find us on Instagram at loungelizardspod. We really appreciate your time, and we'll, we'll see you next week.