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Life by Design is a podcast that shares the experiences and tools to help couples align their wealth goals and reclaim their time, enabling them to experience freedom, abundance, and a life by design.
Jessilyn Persson (00:00)
Welcome to the Life By Design podcast where Jessalyn and Brian Pearson, struggling to align your financial goals or confidently invest in real estate as a couple,
Brian Persson (00:09)
That's why we created this podcast and the Riches, Relationships and Real Estate program to help you build wealth and strengthen your relationship. Visit weekendwealth.ca to take our quiz and discover your real estate investor type. Let's create the life you deserve together.
Jessilyn Persson (00:26)
Today we're going to be talking about being comfortable being uncomfortable. ⁓ It's a powerful mindset principle. means embracing growth, challenge and uncertainty. Knowing that discomfort often signals progress. So today we're going to share some insights and stories on how to apply this in your life. So let's talk about why it matters. I mean, we got different concepts here to share, but
We've learned from experience that growth lives outside of comfort.
Brian Persson (00:58)
Yep. Yeah, just think about working out. That's the simplest example of where growth really matters. You will never grow muscle. You'll never get faster, better, stronger if you don't work out and cause those muscles a little bit of aches and pains, right?
Same thing goes with financial, emotional, ⁓ physical growth. They all require just that little bit of stretch zone, just some kind of stretch, some kind of pressure on them to go a little bit further than where you've gone before. And often that can be very uncomfortable for most people. We're creatures of habit. We like to stay exactly where we are, what's known, what's safe, what's convenient.
and growth doesn't really live in safe and convenient all the time.
Jessilyn Persson (01:49)
Yeah, I know we talk often about networking. That's how we built our business, is how we built our real estate, even our, ⁓ just our source of connections. But networking is really uncomfortable for many people, especially if you don't do it often or you're new to it.
And I know that being in the nonprofit that I'm the president of currently where we work with business owners, women in business specifically, and so many women just talk about how they're uncomfortable networking. They won't make eye contact, they'll stand in a corner by themselves, some of them will even buy a ticket to an event and then they don't actually...
because they don't think they know anyone there and it's an interesting dynamic. I I can appreciate it, but I've been networking for over 20 years now. I kind of was thrown into it straight out of university with one of the companies I worked with. I was out working 50 to 90 hours a week, mostly networking at events. That was just the job. So I guess I'm fortunate that I got trained young enough and early enough to carry it forward, but it can be daunting to enter a room of
Unknown and people you don't know and not sure what to say and what can get kind of caught in our heads, right? On what to what to what are people gonna say? What are people gonna think? I don't know what you're right and opposed to just stepping in and saying hi, I'm just land
Brian Persson (03:24)
You're never going to get it right the first networking time. Like it's interesting you said you started young because I think that's key. And that's key not just with networking but just anything you do in life. The earlier you can start, the more you're going to grow and the bigger you're going to be into the future. So if you started networking at 40, well, you now you're 50 by the time you have experienced networking, like and you're kind of the master of it. You started at 20, well, guess what? You're 30 when you're...
now you're in the master of networking. I was having that conversation with our kids the other day. ⁓ Our oldest, Jackson, he was like, you know, I go to these camps because it's summertime right now and we send them to a whole bunch of camps. And he's like, I never know what to ask the other kids. then the week goes by and then everybody's leaving and he's like, I feel like I haven't made any friends. ⁓
Yeah, but he's just not experienced in networking, right? And he's maybe nervous to ask the wrong questions or say the wrong thing. But the reality is, that if he just gets out there and says something or asks something, you know, what's your favorite color? It doesn't really matter. Yeah. Then he's out there connecting with other kids. And same thing with an adult networking room or a business networking room. You just got to get out there and you're going to bomb some questions and you're going to win some questions.
You just figure it out through the practice of it. But if you're too uncomfortable and you just don't go, then you're never gonna get there. So, sweat some bullets, get into those networking rooms, because I know I used to sweat bullets years and years ago. Now, almost any networking room I go into, new, old, like first time I've ever been in there, no nervousness, I just kind of go in and immediately go to some people and start chatting and there's no qualms about it in my head.
no uncomfortableness, that uncomfortableness has kind of gone away.
Jessilyn Persson (05:19)
Yeah, absolutely. And I mean, I've stepped up into a president role, like I said, for a nonprofit. And so it's not I don't really have a choice. I'm at every event that's part of my mandate being in that role. And I also am speaking to the entire crowd every time at these. I'm at these events, but I don't go into it with nerves about who am I going to meet now? I have a different perspective going in, so I'm like, now I've got to make sure my board set up. Everyone's got what they need. Right. But in that.
way I'm still meeting individuals all the time and I'm now getting to see it kind of from a different perspective of watching these new people come in or even my board if they're newer and having to support them on on how to network in a room.
Brian Persson (06:01)
Yeah.
Quick story about networking. I remember our cleaner, this is a few months ago, she wanted to get more business. so I invited her to one of the real estate networking events because she wanted to do more move out cleanings. That's, it's a little bit more profitable of a business for her. And she was so nervous going into that room, but she did it. And, and she got like ⁓ a, a contact with a fairly large developer here in, in Edmonton.
And you know what, now she has that contact. I don't know if it's generated any business for her, but if she hadn't gone and worked through those nerves of hers, ⁓ where she was, I think at one point she was like actually sweating, but really big business, like just with one, one event. And, that's, that's the way it works is just pushing through that, that effort.
Jessilyn Persson (06:51)
Absolutely. And so as we noted that growth lives outside the comfort zone, you want to be intentional about it. mean, life can be uncomfortable because it's happening to you or you perceive it that it's happening to you as supposing to choosing what happens to you and how it happens to you.
Brian Persson (07:14)
Yeah. And that's really it is just choice, right? Do you work out now so that you're healthier later? And then, or do you not work out now so that you, the, the hard you experience in life comes in the form of sore hips when you're in your sixties and seventies and maybe back problems and all kinds of other issues. Same, same with finances. Do you build your finances now? Do you build your wealth now versus like panicking near, you know, at into retirement, seeing how you're going to survive.
Both ways are hard, but you get to choose your heart. If you can choose it early enough, then you will, you know, it might feel uncomfortable, but it'll probably in the end look like the easier path. And you get to choose it.
Jessilyn Persson (07:57)
absolutely.
You do, right? Like, you see people living what you might call their best life, spending all their money. ⁓ But what I don't think people realize is that if you're not building your wealth and planning for your future, you don't know 10, 20 years down the road what's going to happen to you or the life you're in. And if you get some kind of an illness or a disease or an impediment that...
⁓ enables you to be in a position where you maybe can't work as much as you did earlier on in life. Okay, well now not only do you have less access to income, you didn't save up so you don't have something to fall back on and now you're gonna be worrying about retirement or possible other costs coming up depending on what it is.
Yeah, I agree. Maybe take a few less vacations, maybe work in a side job, a side hustle, invest in real estate and put your money in there now. And then when you have it invested in your wealth is there, take those extra vacations, work less, do what you want to do. But it's all a choice as opposed to hoping it works.
Brian Persson (09:03)
out. Yeah and choosing like which hard you take like whether it's you know early in life hard or later in life hard could be as easy and simple as not going to Starbucks every day. Yeah. Like the you know it's it's fun to go to Starbucks it's it's easy to make coffee ⁓ you know when Starbucks is making it for you but but the reality is is that like you know that's
choosing your heart you're choosing to make coffee at home rather than going to starbucks and the amount of money that you can save in that simple choice where it's just a little bit more difficult and a little bit less convenient for you to make coffee at home rather than to go out for coffee makes a huge difference in your finances
Jessilyn Persson (09:48)
Yeah, absolutely. So you want to find your growth zone as we call it. So not so much that, you know, it breaks you and you're exhausted and you're stressed out, but not too little that it's not really actually stretching you either.
Brian Persson (10:01)
Yeah, just like physical activity, if you know you're lifting weights and the weights aren't challenging, are they really going to increase your strength?
Jessilyn Persson (10:08)
Increase
your weights. Yeah. But you also don't want to start off with 50 pounds if you've never lifted weights before.
Brian Persson (10:14)
Exactly. Yeah, you don't want to injure yourself off the first thing. Same thing with finances. Don't, you know, if you, if you're buying real estate, ⁓ unless you've spent a lot of time and a lot of effort to learn like the bigger properties of real estate, don't go into a property that is going to financially destroy you if it doesn't go proper, right? If you, if you can't control it, ⁓ again, even then, if you, like I said, if you've done your education, well, that's part of the hard, right? Like,
getting all that education, talking to all those people, learning all those skills before you get into any kind of real estate, it can be hard. And you get to choose whether or not you take on that hard or do it another way, or perhaps not at all. And then you're looking at a hard financial life later on in the future.
Jessilyn Persson (11:04)
Exactly. So another, you know, getting comfortable being uncomfortable is that fear is a compass. So if it scares you, it might be the thing you need to do. And I know a great example of this for me is speaking on stages. I know back in 2022, I decided I wanted to be speaker and I wanted to get on stages. No big deal. And then I get on my first stage and I to this day don't remember it.
I so like in my own head, even though there was a crowd of about, I think, close to 200 people in the room, I just remember not remembering much up to it because I was just nervous, so nervous about getting on stage and then I did it and then I was just like, wow, and then just so critical on what I delivered that when I got off, I was so busy evaluating myself that I barely remember the event. But what I did do that year is push myself, I signed up to be on, I think I was on eight stages that year.
every time it was scary, I will say that. But it got just a bit easier every time and a bit easier as I figured it out and learned what I had to do. And then the next year I went on a few stages and then I decided to take a break, be like, okay, I've been on a lot of stages, let's assess what this looks like and what it means. And now I'm going back on stages or I'll just be called on and be like, Jess, you're gonna be speaking on this. And I'll be like, all right, I don't even think twice about it. Like, I mean, yes, I got to maybe prepare for it.
But before the stage fright, if you will, or the fear that would sometimes sit in my body for weeks leading up to the event, I don't really stress at it anymore. And also when I'm on stage, I've learned to just be more present and enjoying and appreciating the crowd and being present for that as opposed to being worried about what I'm going to say. And if I'm going to say the right thing and how it's going to be perceived, now it's a matter of like, I'm on stage for a reason. I've got an important message I'm looking to deliver and just
deliver it and I just, there's a huge shift from when I first started to how I am on stage now, but that took practice and it took pushing myself to be uncomfortable. Like I signed up without letting myself not to. So it wasn't, I didn't give myself an option. I didn't want to sometimes and I got, as I got closer to the event, I'd be like, why did I do this again? Why did I do this to myself? Why did I put the stress on and this pressure? But I knew it would push me hard enough to shift.
Brian Persson (13:30)
Yeah, and sometimes intention can push you through that fear. Like you said, you had a message to deliver. For me, it's getting on stage. I'm nervous pretty well every time I get on stage. I've never had anybody come to me and say, hey, you looked super nervous and we saw you shaking, right? I don't think I shake on stage, my heart's pumping a little faster and I am nervous, but no one has ever actually noticed it.
And the fact is that even though every time I'm nervous, no one notices it, but I do have an intention behind it. And that's why I push through that nervousness every single time. that I know by getting on stage, I'm going to get way more conversations. I'm going to get way more eyeballs. I'm going to get way more attention towards my business than I could ever get if I went and networked a room of a hundred people. You know, I can.
get on stage and connect with 100 people in 5 to 10 minutes. for me, that's the intention. ⁓ I also have a message to deliver, but it's really just a matter of efficiency for me. And the efficiency of getting on stage is way, more important for me than how nervous I might feel.
Jessilyn Persson (14:48)
Yeah, and that lends back to, like you said, being intentional about why you're-
getting uncomfortable. What's the goal? What's the purpose? What's the reason? I know another uncomfortable thing I had to do years ago was asking for a raise and I'm pretty sure we talked about this in one, one if not many of our previous podcasts, but I remember stewing on it for a week and pacing the floor in the hallway outside my boss's office. And finally, I just got to myself and I was like, you are not ruining another weekend. Stressing about this, just walking. I mean, obviously the intention for that is I want to make more money.
But I walk in and it was a no-brainer for him. He's like, yeah, I'll give you a raise. I'm like, oh, really? Like all this fear, all the stress I had for what he already deemed was acceptable. And yeah, I absolutely deserved it. And so, but I had to push past that fear and I had to actually take that action. And that wasn't the first time, I mean, sorry, that was the first time, but not the only time. I've since done it a couple more times. And again, each time it got a little easier and a little easier to ask for that.
that rage. ⁓ But if I was, you if I let fear eat me, I wouldn't be making what I'm making.
Brian Persson (16:00)
Nope. like you got it. Yeah. Fear is a big stopping point for a lot of people. talk about debt a lot on this podcast. Debt is a huge stopping point for people. ⁓ Real estate is full of debt, like because you have mortgages, you have, you know, all this stuff on the, all these loans against the property. ⁓ And some people can't get their heads past that either. And they, let the fear of that debt, you know, the need to pay off the mortgage.
from probably the upbringings from their parents. ⁓ That really is stopping them from growing true wealth. It's only bad if you have to pay for that debt. When you have tenants and when you have like, whether it's commercial, industrial or residential, you have people paying for that debt, that's a good debt. And you got to get your head around the fact that you might be air quotes, millions of dollars in debt, but someone else is paying for that debt and building.
your future wealth. Still, you gotta push through that fear of like, what happens with this debt? Can I put the right plans in place to mitigate that stuff?
Jessilyn Persson (17:09)
Yeah, we've got many people we've met who the minute they hear our mortgage amounts, you physically see them freeze up like the fear in them. It is not even their debt. No. And it's funny because I 100 % believe that their fear firstly is not validated. They don't have any evidence to see what debt can do for them. ⁓ Stories they've heard.
as they were raised or grew up and then it's just what they sit with. They never think to go past the, a minute. Firstly, why does this scare me? Like, where's this fear coming from? And is it valid? And if I got rid of it, what could it do for me? like, for example, I know we've discussed like you have $100,000 in debt in real estate, 10 years in the future, still $100,000 of debt, yes. But say you bought a $500,000 asset, well, in 10 years,
it could be worth 800,000 and now you sit there going, okay, well, I did have $100,000 in debt, but between my managing it properly and my tenants, I didn't have to pay for any of it and it's going down and now I have an asset that is $300,000 more. You would never have had that by doing nothing.
Brian Persson (18:26)
Yeah, quick lesson in debt there is that debt does not increase with inflation, whereas all other things increase with inflation. So when you borrow money, that money stays stuck in time back when you borrowed it, whereas everything else increases along with inflation. So the property prices and rent and everything else increases, whereas your debt stays exactly the same. And that's why that's a very important factor to get your head around when it comes to debt.
is that not that you should go and seek out bad debt for that reason, but if you can seek out good debt for that reason, then you will always be wealthier in the future, even if your property doesn't cashflow or grow, because you are never increasing the value of that debt. Whereas the value of whatever you bought with it is always increasing.
Jessilyn Persson (19:15)
Yep, good point. And being comfortable, being uncomfortable, another tidbit we really wanted to share was that adaptability wins every time. The world changes fast, right? We see that. And I feel like as I'm getting older, changing faster and faster. ⁓ But being at ease with this comfort makes you resilient. And I know one thing that we learned.
We weren't always this way, but saying yes and then figuring it out. A lot times we used to say no, because again, there was a fear of like, well, I don't know what it's going to do. I don't know what it's going to create. I don't know what it's going to look like. But now we've leaned into saying yes and figuring it out. And that has absolutely made us more resilient. know, for example, recently, earlier this year, ⁓ I was asked if I would be able to take on another stream, so another project.
and essentially take over for another PM without removing any of the workload off my cart plate. And I just something just said, yep, say yes. And so I did. And I doubled my workload. I doubled my team. But it made me more resilient within the company because first and foremost, now I'm the only one managing all this work and they don't have extra PMs to give the work to. And so.
should something come about where they need to release contractors, I'm pretty confident I'm not going anywhere for a few years just based on the contract or certain other contract with the project and the end date and all the knowledge I have plus my ability, flexibility, I should say for them. So when they came to me and I said yes, without hesitation, that looked.
good for them. And then when I took it on, even though it was a mess and I had to really sort out that was a different story, but they saw I did it. I took it on, I worked through it, I got everything in order, I presented it as they needed, and I took care of it without putting extra stress on my bosses and the executive.
Brian Persson (21:19)
And it was uncomfortable for you for a few. But ask yourself the question, am I a better project manager or am I a better whatever I just took on than I was before because I took this thing on that did make me uncomfortable?
Jessilyn Persson (21:22)
So uncomfortable.
absolutely, it stretched me and I grew. I became more dominant in kind of the industry where I'm at. I also grew my relationships with the executive. So now I can do pretty much whatever I need to in my projects and I know I have full support.
Brian Persson (21:55)
Yeah. Yeah. So it's kind of like, you know, when you took that on, it's kind of like your first few days of a workout where you're really, really, really sore. And then those weights get easier and easier. And now, you know, into the future, it's much, much easier to, for you to manage those projects. Same thing with real estate. ⁓ know, real estate feels easy to us now, but back, back years ago, man, like a tenant would do something, which is a total non-event nowadays.
Jessilyn Persson (22:02)
And it hurts so bad.
Brian Persson (22:24)
And I would stress about it for weeks and like try and figure out the right options and just figure out like how to make this better. Nowadays, just because I've lifted that weight of, you know, managing real estate so many times, there's so many things that happen that are not events. And the easiest example is like just the appliances. So like a furnace goes or like a dishwasher goes and I'm like, okay, no more, replace it. And I talked to homeowners where something
similar like that happens and it's like their house is falling apart.
Jessilyn Persson (22:57)
Yeah, and what I do appreciate about that is that you use that same mentality in our house as homeowners. So when our dishwasher went, I'm like, God, and you're like, no, boom, boom, order a new one and arrived a week later. I was like, all right.
Brian Persson (23:10)
It was replacing no issues yet. Yeah, but it is interesting to know that like I've lifted that weight of managing real estate so many times and then watching, you know, people trying to manage just a single house, their own house, which they have complete control over and no one else is even living in. You know, they don't even have to manage the person living in the house because it's them. Yep. And they still have difficulty with it. So it's just practice, right? Really is what it comes down to.
Jessilyn Persson (23:35)
Absolutely.
And like you said, it wasn't always easy for us. Real estate was not, there was a huge learning curve. And as we've shared many times on previous podcasts and on stages, back in 2000, I believe it was 16, where you came home and like, I am done. I can't manage any more properties, no more tenants, nothing. And I was like, and then I signed you up for this wonderful network that you're so good at now. And we grew there. And then,
We did that for a few years and then more recently over the past year, we decided, hey, let's get into the multifamily and let's play a bigger game. Like, and we're talking, we've got a big game in mind. Like we wouldn't have jumped from just having a condo or a single family home into multifamily like that. took time and experience to get there and understand what we're doing. But our multifamily game is ramping up fast.
because of all the experience we've had before. Totally. And because our learning of sometimes we just got to say yes and sometimes we just got to embrace what's coming as it comes.
Brian Persson (24:40)
Yep, like our first multifamily property that we're buying is the size of our entire real estate portfolio. So like, you know, we're ramping up quite quickly and, ⁓ you know, I can't say it's not scary, but I also can say that, you know, we've done so much in real estate to date that for me, it's just kind of like adding another...
like plate to the weights, right? You know, and you're just doing the same reps, just a little bit heavier now. And so it's not really a big deal. You're just kind of going through the motions and, you know, putting those muscles under a little bit more strain and getting that bigger real estate property in your portfolio. It's really all it comes down to.
Jessilyn Persson (25:24)
Exactly. So we really want to share a quick reframe. So instead of asking, how can I avoid this discomfort, which is typically what we do as humans, ask what is this discomfort trying to teach me? And I know I did that this time when I was asked to take on that extra project, that extra stream. Like you mentioned, I was not happy for a few days, maybe a week or two, where I was just like angry with all the extra work and the chaos that it created. And then
At one point in day, I finally just stopped and said, wait a minute, what is this trying to teach me? Because I'd already said yes, so I was already stuck with it. But what am I meant to learn from this? And when I thought that through, I just had this calm come over me. Because I was no longer looking at it as uncomfortable and annoying and frustrating. I was looking at it ⁓
This is a learning lesson for me. This is like a playground, if you will, for me to expand and experience and grow where I want to grow. And so once I shifted my mindset on that, I accepted it a lot easier and my anger went away and I just kind of rolled with it as it came out and unfolded. So it's interesting how you can just take shifting a question and it can shift the whole framework of what that is for you.
Brian Persson (26:45)
Yeah, I think that's really important to look at uncomfort as a learning experience. There's another phrase like fail forward, right? if you fail, just fall forward and keep on moving forward. If you fall backwards, well, then it no longer becomes a learning experience. Now it's like harming you basically.
Jessilyn Persson (27:05)
Yeah, so we want to give you three quick tips on how to help implement this into your world. The first one is say yes to things that make your palms sweat, like public speaking, launching that offer, investing in yourself, approaching that money partner, whatever it is, if it makes you sweaty, it's probably the right move.
Brian Persson (27:28)
Another one is just to practice doing hard things daily, even tiny ones. I've used the weights analogy numerous times in this podcast and it's exactly that. Just keep lifting those weights and keep doing those hard things every single day.
Jessilyn Persson (27:44)
Yeah, and the third one is reflect. What's one area in my life where staying comfortable is keeping me stuck?
Brian Persson (27:52)
super important.
Jessilyn Persson (27:53)
Yes, so the most important takeaway from what we discussed today, I'd say mine is if you're not growing, ask yourself, where can I get uncomfortable?
Brian Persson (28:03)
Yeah, mine is the key takeaway here is just to, you feel like you're avoiding being uncomfortable, just ask yourself, is it detrimental to me? And if it's not detrimental, go and do it. It's still gonna be uncomfortable, but it's not gonna hurt you.
Jessilyn Persson (28:19)
Thanks so much for tuning in. Listen for more real estate investing stories in the next episode of the Life by Design Podcast.
Brian Persson (28:26)
Before you go, don't forget to visit WeekendWealth.ca to take our quiz and discover what type of real estate investor you are. We release new episodes every two weeks, so be sure to hit that subscribe button on your favourite podcast app. Thank you for joining us on this journey to create your life by designing.
Jessilyn Persson (28:43)
Thanks again for listening. It's been a pleasure being with you today.