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Stories of Wonder platforms and celebrates the real impact Deakin students, alumni, researchers and staff are making in the world, right now.
Lucky Perera's story is
anything but ordinary.
A scientist turned
photographer, turned teacher.
He navigated early childhood
challenges as a migrant in Australia,
only to finish high school and
earn a PhD in medical physics.
As a photographer, Lucky spent around
a decade shooting bands, weddings, and
galaxies sometimes at the same time.
And recently after completing a Master
of Teaching at Deakin, Lucky added
Education onto his plate, revitalising
the physics program at Kyneton High School
in regional Victoria, and using his life
experience to engage the next generation
of young people to study science.
In this episode, we explore finding
purpose, embracing change and
the power of human connection.
Recorded on the lands of Wurundjeri
people, this is Stories of Wonder.
Lucky, welcome.
Thanks, Dom.
Awesome to be here.
So your journey has spanned science,
photography, and now education.
How would you describe yourself today?
The best way to probably describe
it is like somebody that's able to
take risks and jump into, something.
I was very cautious and, slow to
adapt to change when I was in my
thirties and now having had these
great experiences doing all sorts of
different things, I see the joy that
life can bring through being brave and
going and doing something in the mument.
And look, I still struggle with it.
In life I, probably am still cautious
in some ways, but when it comes to
careers and work and opportunities, I
guess I just encourage everyone to just
go and do what makes you feel happy.
Yeah.
And that's that's where I am right now.
And when I was at uni, my supervisor
used to joke that one day I'd be the
world's most overqualified taxi driver.
And now that sounds
like a pretty good gig.
There's still time.
Yeah, still time.
So you were born in the eighties and
then you moved to Sri Lanka as a baby.
And then you returned to
Australia at the age of seven.
What was your experience like when you
came back and started going to school?
Like how did those early experiences
shape your identity and worldview?
It was not an easy time.
Like the eighties in Australia was
not a particularly progressive place.
And I went to a school that
was predominantly white.
I had a pretty strong accent.
I was bullied because of my
accent, because of my appearance.
So actually there was
this conscious attempt.
Or maybe it was unconscious at
the time, but, just trying to
assimilate, just trying to fit in.
And I don't think I felt any sense
of, pride around who I was at
the time about being Sri Lankan.
There's a lot of shame attached to
the differences that I possessed.
And I think it was probably about when
I was about 20, that I was able to
reflect on the culture that my family
brought and be able to have any sense
of joy or pride in where I came from.
So yeah, primary school was not easy.
And I guess, yeah, I found it
pretty hard to make friends, didn't
have a huge number of friends.
And yeah, it was a pretty slow kind of
time and it took me, yeah, it took me a
long time to grow into myself, I think.
Yeah, I think I was just a pretty
shy and timid and awkward kid.
After high school, you then
started in engineering, but
you found a passion in physics.
What was it about
physics that drew you in?
I dunno.
I think, I always loved physics at school.
I had a great teacher.
Explaining how the universe
works, it just felt like there
was this natural affinity to it.
I'd always been this really curious
child and I had all of these books on
science and space and I'd wanted to be
an astronaut since I was, a little kid.
And I was like, most people passed that
phase when they're about seven or eight,
but I was still there at about 15 when I
realised actually I was gonna be too tall.
Oh.
I think the cutoff at that time was like,
I think 188 centimeters or something.
I didn't even know that,
there was like, okay.
Yeah.
I think it's gone up a little bit now, but
at that time it was a little bit lower.
I think I might be too tall as well now.
That's really hard.
I'm gonna need a minute here.
Sorry to crush your dreams.
yeah, Thanks, Lucky.
Yeah, I think like my natural
interest in space and science, it was
a good kind of lead in to physics.
And yeah, having a good teacher and
doing pretty well in physics at school
allowed me to look at it as a potential
pathway when I got to university.
And I got into an engineering
degree, through early entry.
So I cruised, cruised my way
through year 12 to get into that.
And then yeah, I was probably
about six months into it when
I realised, I don't know.
I dunno if this is what I wanna be doing.
Yeah, tacked on a physics degree as well.
So did a, double degree.
As you do.
And thankfully, the university
I was at in Wollongong was able
to accommodate that degree.
So yeah, it was a nice way to
do two things at the same time.
Talk to me a little bit about
how you ended up doing a PhD
in medical radiation physics.
How did that come about?
I'm one of these people that kind
of lives in the mument a lot.
I don't really think too much
about the past and I don't really
think too much about the future.
And I probably at that time in my life,
I just went with things naturally.
I didn't really, I didn't really have
any goals or dreams or aspirations
to do anything, and that's how
things have always worked for me.
I've just gone with the flow and, I had
done a master's in medical physics after
I finished my undergrad and my supervisor,
he said look you can do a PhD here.
And I was like, oh, okay.
Cool.
That sounds good.
I was Lucky enough to get a
scholarship to do my PhD. Nice.
And I was living at home.
I had a pretty good deal.
Somewhere on that spectrum of
laziness that allowed me to
just go with it and just do it.
Yeah.
A little passive.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Very passive.
Yeah.
I think that's a really good word.
Yeah.
I was never, yeah.
I think, I was never
active in driving my life.
That's, I think that's a really,
good way of describing it.
Yeah, for sure.
And what'd your parents think of that?
Were they pushing you to do
something in particular, or were
they pretty comfortable with
you just following the vibe?
No, they're not those kinds of people.
Mum and dad both had to work
really hard, to get to where
they got to in their lives.
So both come from, pretty, oh,
I wouldn't say poor families,
but I know my mum's family
particularly didn't have much money.
So there was five kids.
They lived in rural Sri
Lanka, and my granddad was a
farmer, who loved the horses.
So there's not always a lot of money left.
And my dad's dad passed
away when dad was 13.
So they, they didn't really have a
heap of money either, so they got to
where they got to through education.
So through, through working really hard
and amazingly in my family of aunties
and uncles, nearly all of them managed
to go to university in Sri Lanka,
which is just absolutely unheard of.
Wow.
I think dad was one of
150 people in the country.
Wow.
Of 20 million people or something to get
into an engineering degree in that time.
And it was through the hard work
and the graft and the determination
that they both were able to get into
those careers that they got into.
And then dad was offered an opportunity
to come to Australia to study.
So the backdrop of that kind of
contextualises the kind of life that
I had growing up, which is you need
to study, you need to work hard.
And I guess, mum and dad
probably saw me as, I think lazy
is the appropriate word here.
I think they probably saw me as
like not achieving my potential.
Not working hard enough.
And I suppose there is a bit of
truth to that 'cause I probably,
I definitely didn't work anywhere
near as much as I should have.
They were obviously pleased
that I was still pursuing
some sort of academic pursuit.
Yeah.
And they were supportive
in lots of other ways.
I don't know if you've had much experience
with ethnic families, but love is shown
in different ways in ethnic families.
And it's not generally through,
through all of the words.
And I'm proud of you and I love you.
Yeah.
And you don't get that, but you get
all of the, service, love is shown.
The love language is service.
I reflect on that time and my partner.
Kristen, she had a completely
different experience at university.
She was working full
time, studying full time.
And she says, you didn't have
to grow up until you were 30.
And I was like, yeah, absolutely.
I guess during that time though,
you were doing something though.
You were work working towards something
and even though it might've been
a bit abstract, to your parents as
to exactly where it was taking you.
Yeah.
Like it is pretty amazing that
you were doing, a PhD. Yeah.
At this point.
Yeah.
And I think, I think there was probably
a sense of, they never said it to me,
but I sensed there was a sense of pride.
Yeah.
As well, because, to do a PhD is in,
in their mind like the pinnacle of.
Yeah.
Academic achievement.
Absolutely.
So I think there was definitely pride
attached to it as well, but as to whether
I experienced it at the time or not,
that's, that's a different question.
And, it's a shared experience for
lots of migrant and ethnic kids.
Yeah.
When you were doing your PhD, was,
what was your experience like?
Did you, because of how it came
about, which sounds almost like it
was a bit of a, I don't know, like
circumstantial, maybe a little accidental.
Yeah.
Who knows?
Did you ever struggle with that
in your mind or feel a sense of,
I don't know, imposter syndrome?
Yeah, absolutely.
All of the time.
All of the time.
And even now, I'm, I question
whether I was deserving of my
qualification at the end of it.
Why?
I don't know if I worked hard enough.
During the time to get it.
I don't know if I'd contributed
enough to the body of scientific
knowledge to be, to be worthy of it.
And for the first two years
I didn't really get anywhere.
I was stuck and my supervisor
was like desperate to, to
support me as best as he could.
And I was nearly at the point where
I was like, I just can't do this.
I'm not getting anywhere.
And then one day I was in a like
a seminar that was being presented
by, one of our fellow PhD students.
And I was just doodling on a piece
of paper, and I drew a circle
and started doing some coordinate
geometry kind of calculations.
And, this idea came to me that, oh,
this is actually going to be something
I could possibly use and code.
So my work was in positron
emission tomography.
So we designed this new type of
detector at our university, and my
job was to, run some simulations and
to characterise it and to work out
what kind of imaging it could do.
And yeah, this idea of,
the circle and the maths.
And I was like, okay, I can code that.
And it slowly started from there.
And, that was two years, that was
the next two years of my life.
Wow.
Just coding, coding, writing, writing
this, program to get the data from
the simulation and reconstruct it into
an image that could be used to assess
how good the detector modules were.
Wow.
So I felt like I did my PhD in two years.
Yeah.
And like I said, at the end it
was still very foundational.
Like it was, this is the starting point.
It was the start and somebody else
needed to take it to the next step and
be able to use it in more effective ways.
And is that generally what a PhD kind
of is like you are contributing some
sort of bit of research or exploration
of something for others to carry on?
I, yeah.
I don't know maybe the
struggle for me, was like.
I guess seeing my colleagues, 'cause
they were all working on these
amazing projects at our center.
I just felt like I was, it was
pretty low level, I didn't feel
like I was contributing much.
Like I had a mate who was
characterising detectors, for
like for use by astronauts.
So like they put them in the International
Space Station to detect the radiation
doses that astronauts are getting.
Right.
And like he's doing that and I'm literally
sitting in front of a computer writing
a bit of code to reconstruct an image.
So I didn't feel like I was anywhere near
those kind of levels of contribution.
And I, and I don't think
everyone needs to be.
No.
At that level.
But yeah, there's a
little part of me I think.
It's really interesting.
Like I, I feel like I'm this interesting
kind of mix between wanting to be really
good at something but not actually
putting the work in to be that good at it.
So I felt like maybe if I worked
harder or if I put more time into
it, then I could be at his level.
But then I didn't actually
ever get to that point.
But now, I reflect on it and, I
was diagnosed with ADHD last year.
And thinking about all of the things in
my life that look like that make sense.
I'm like, okay, you did your best.
Like you tried, you actually did your
best, but you were, neurologically
incapable of actually getting to
those levels without the support
that you needed at that time.
Yeah, I reflect on that period of life and
all of my schooling and it makes sense.
And I, at the time it was hard.
I think it was really hard to
see myself as maybe somebody that
didn't achieve what they imagined
themselves being able to achieve.
But now I look at that journey
that's gone, left, right, up and
down and go, actually, it's allowed
me to do all these amazing things
that I wouldn't have been able to
do if I'd been an amazing scientist.
Yeah.
If I'd been an amazing scientist.
I would probably still be working in it.
And all the contributions
are a contribution as well.
Yeah.
There's no, it reminds me of the
Seinfeld bit where he's talking about,
you got some, scientists curing cancer
and some other person's going, I need
to get the seeds out of watermelon.
That's my thing.
And you know what, that's worthy as well.
Yeah, absolutely.
Yeah.
You've said that.
Science can help us get out of
what science has gotten us into.
What do you mean by that?
Oh gosh.
How much time do you have?
Not much.
Yeah.
The Industrial Revolution was a
pretty amazing thing for our world.
At that time, like it, it allowed us
to do all of these wonderful things
that we'd never been able to do before.
And it was through scientists and
engineers and years of endeavor and
grit and hard work that we were able
to come up with the technology to
do all of these wonderful things.
But I guess the consequence of that
now is that we're in a world that is
experiencing this climate catastrophe.
Like we are heading towards this,
this awful kind of endpoint for
humanity if we keep going this way.
And I think putting aside all the
political aspects of it, which is 95%
of the problem, I think there is an
opportunity for scientists and science
to firstly identify what the problem is.
And we've been doing
that for about 20 years.
And I say we, not as in me,
but we as in scientists.
Yep.
For about 20 years.
And I think we've gotta move to the
next phase, which is the investment
and the time and the political support
for some of the ideas that are being
put forward to actually be used.
Really amazing opportunity if we can
put aside all the politics and if the
support for the people who are off
making money somewhere else, while
everybody else is struggling away.
If we ignore the needs of all the
political donors and all of that kind
of stuff, there is an opportunity
for us to actually be able to do
something to mitigate the problem
that we've created for ourselves.
Big ifs.
Big ifs.
I would've hoped that we
were at a tipping point now.
Yeah.
I was just listening to a John Butler
song the other day and it was from an
album that was like 15 years old and
he's still singing it, is singing about
stuff that's still the same stuff.
Yeah.
Nothing has changed, And I
really wish that there was,
a space in the world for, for people
to look at science and research and
engineering and be able to look at the
expertise that's there and use that as
the guiding principle for how we get
ourselves out of this without worrying
about the economics, without worrying
about the political ramifications,
without worrying about whether we're
keeping, the billionaire class happy
whether the stakeholders are happy.
If we can ignore the economics of
all of this stuff, I think there is
a possibility that we can actually
do something that will help.
So after your PhD, which so you,
you've spent all this time in
Queensland really up until this
point, you moved to Melbourne.
Yeah.
And you spent a decade as a photographer
doing things like weddings, capturing
special muments like that infamous
galaxy behind the bride and groom photo
that sort of went around the world.
What did photography teach you about
human connection and storytelling?
Yeah, good question.
Do you know It's really interesting.
When I first became a
photographer, I, did it because.
I ran out of other options, so Uhhuh.
I actually applied for a job at
a research center in Melbourne.
Didn't get it.
And it was the first time in
my life that I hadn't got a job
that I'd applied for and I was
like, oh man, what am I gonna do?
And my partner Kristen was, incredible.
And she said, Hey, you
don't have to be miserable.
You don't have to dread
going to work every day.
If you wanna be a photographer,
you can be a photographer.
And how long have you guys been together?
Did you meet here in Melbourne
or was it in Brisbane?
No, we met in Brisbane.
I think we'd been together for
about two years by that point.
Right?
Yeah.
Yeah.
So Kristen and I like, we were
like tight right from the start.
Yeah.
She was instrumental to helping me
get out of that really constrained
worldview, being conservative, not
willing to take risks because that's
the complete opposite of her, like
for her, when something's not okay.
She's like okay, I'm gonna
do something about it.
She's not passive.
She's really active.
When we, moved down to Melbourne,
she was like, look if you wanna
be a photographer, you can do it.
And she was really good with
helping me get my business started.
So that was like the foundation and
one of the things that she talked a
lot about is, in terms of presenting
yourself as a photographer, like there
are a million photographers out there.
Why would anybody want to hire you?
Why should they hire you?
And she said The best way to do that
is to just be completely yourself.
Yeah.
Present yourself in the way that you are
and the way that you want to be seen.
Because then you will attract
people who had the same values, who
are interested in the same stuff.
And that was just such an amazing
way of looking at things because
I'd never really thought about it.
I never felt comfortable
in being truly myself.
And I think that's again, connected
to the kind of trauma that I
experienced as a migrant and.
Absolutely.
And like just making myself small.
And she was like, no, you don't
need to be this tiny thing.
You can be loud, you can be yourself.
You can express the things
that are important to you.
So I was really lucky that I had that
amazing advice so early on because
it allowed me to find a niche in the
wedding and photography world, that
just wasn't really a thing back then.
Like people didn't talk about their
political and social beliefs on
their wedding photography website.
I talked about the ethics of
photography, and I talked about,
the ways that we should treat each
other and the way that we should,
do the operational side of business
as well, like in, in an ethical way.
And what are the ethics of, just
quickly, of the photography that
you were including in there.
Yeah.
Also, it's a very, even today, like with
what I see with wedding photography,
and it's the cottage industry around
weddings, it can be very white.
Yeah.
Here in Australia.
Yeah.
And I think that's one of the
things we often talked about, the
industry is not representative of
the society that we live in, Uhhuh.
So there was very much, focus on
attractive and I say attractive,
white heterosexual couples.
that was who the industry showed.
Kristen and I got married, I
think about a year before that.
And when we were like looking
around for ideas, I didn't see
anyone that looked like me.
Yeah.
There was nobody that looked like me
out there, not in the wedding world.
And I think that was a bit
of a, an eyeopener I guess
without being conscious of it.
That's a gap in the market.
Yeah.
Yeah.
That's it.
It was just truly myself and yeah.
That actually allowed me to connect
with people from everywhere that
really I felt like they saw the
world through a similar lens.
And what that meant for me was
that I could go to a wedding and
I would, I wasn't a contractor.
I wasn't just a dude that
turned up and take, took photos.
Yeah.
It allowed me to become
more of a human connection.
There was a human connection.
Like it was not just a transaction,
it wasn't transactional in any way.
Yeah.
It wasn't just about the money.
It was always about, I love
spending time with these people.
I love being there for that beautiful,
amazing experience in their lives.
Like one of the most intimate occasions.
Yeah.
In some ways their lives, and I like
I, I would often say with couples,
I will spend more time with each of
them, or definitely one of them, than
they probably were with each other.
Yeah.
On the day.
So I felt really invested in
every wedding that I photographed.
And it was probably, like probably
unhealthy at times in some ways.
Like sometimes.
That's lot of weddings as well because
Yeah, You did this for what, 10 years-ish?
Yeah.
About yeah, 10, 12 years.
And it was amazing.
Like it was, beautiful and I got
to travel all around Australia.
Got to I think like 15
countries or something.
We had endless summers for about three
years 'cause we'd base ourselves out
of the UK and travel and photograph,
in Europe and North America.
So it was this really amazing kind of life
that I got to lead through photography.
And I remember I went to
the UK a few years later.
And I was there for six weeks
and it was just me at that time.
And I think I spent like a total
of 200 pounds in the six weeks
that I was there because I was
just staying at people's houses.
They were driving me around,
they were picking me up.
And they were just people that I'd
met through photography, through
photographing their weddings or having,
met them at like workshops or something.
It was just this beautiful,
nourishing experience to be able
to, to do something like that.
Yeah.
And that speaks to the connection
that you were able to like,
establish with all these people.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I, and I think that's the, I think
that's the real, the real crux of
any kind of career that you do where
you have to relate with people.
This quote always gets
attributed to Maya Angelou.
It's like people won't always remember
what you do or what you say, but they'll
always remember how you made them feel.
And I dunno if that is actually
her quote, but that kind of sits at
the heart of how I try and connect.
Yeah.
Obviously I try and say and do the
right things as well, but at the heart
of it, I'm always conscious of how did
I make those people feel on the day?
Did I make them feel valued?
Yeah.
Did I make them feel important?
Did I make them feel like I
cared about them as humans?
And that's something that I think I
take into my day-to-day life as well.
Speaking of, it sounds like you
may have taken this into your next
career because eventually you shifted
from photography into teaching.
How did that happen?
I think during the pandemic,
obviously everyone's lives
was, were quite disrupted.
Yep.
Particularly here in Melbourne.
Yeah.
Melbourne.
Yeah.
Victoria, we did it pretty tough here.
All of my weddings and photography
stuff were put on pause.
Yeah.
I was reflecting on that 'cause I was at
home, I was, taking care of our daughter.
Cooking, cleaning, spending
time with the three of them.
So you have a daughter by now?
Yeah.
Sorry.
Wow.
I missed that very
important aspect of my life.
Yeah.
She's nine, nearly nine now.
wow.
So yeah, the lockdown was just like,
it's like this new family, time that
I had not really had and my daughter
Vega was like, she loved playing
soccer and I, and I'd been thinking,
oh my God, I'm missing out on being
able to take her to, to her games.
'cause I'm shooting weddings on Saturdays.
Yeah.
Gave me a time to reflect on what my life
looked like and did I want to miss every
Saturday for the rest of my life, or.
Yeah.
Did I want to be away?
I think the answer that I came to was, no.
And Kristen was again really good
with helping me reflect on it.
She's I think you've just
lost your mojo, mate.
And I was like.
I don't think I have.
And she's yeah.
So we, there was a lot of backwards and
forwards around and she's I just don't
think you're are as motivated as before.
And now again, contextualising in
within the lens of my ADHD, i'm
like, yeah, I think the dopamine
was not getting released anymore.
I'd gotten to the point where
I was like, okay, that's it.
Your brain's Okay, mate, you're ready
to go to the next thing you need.
You're searching that
next hit of dopamine.
What a good partner.
Yeah.
Isn't that always the way though?
They always know Exactly.
Yeah.
They know what's going on for you.
Yeah.
Before you know what's going on for you.
Yeah.
I think that's pretty consistent
with Kristen in general.
Like she's really good with
understanding people and she's
very good at understanding me.
With that support and time to
think about what else I could.
get myself into, I'd always loved
teaching, like I'd done a little
bit of teaching when I was at uni.
And I really loved getting young,
people interested in science.
That was like my jam, I, really loved it.
And living regionally, you recognise
that you bring, for me, I, I
bring a skill set that is not very
common for that part of the world.
Like you, lots of regional high schools
don't have access to physics teachers,
like they're not, we're not everywhere.
So there's, you're in
Kyneton at this point.
Yeah.
Yeah.
In Victoria and Regional Victoria.
Yeah.
Firstly you studied at Deakin Yep.
For this?
Yep.
Was it a master's?
Yeah, I did an Mteach
in primary and secondary.
Yeah.
How was that experience for you, firstly?
and it was all online
at this point, was it?
Yeah.
Yeah.
I chose the online, the
cloud, the cloud degree.
Yeah.
it made sense in terms of, managing
all of my family responsibilities
and also the distance as well.
It's a long way, it's not really workable.
It was nice to have that option
and I was, also really fortunate
that there was an option to do
the primary and the secondary.
Yeah.
I was gonna ask like, how did
you, and what, were your feelings
going into that and what did
you think you would enjoy more?
Yeah.
And how, like what was your
experience trying both.
Yeah, it was.
It was, good.
I guess because in 2016 my partner
and I opened a kids' bookstore
in Kyneton called Squishy Minnie.
And the week before we opened,
Kristen was like, oh, so are
you happy to run the story time?
And I was like, what?
What do you, want me to do?
And she's oh, you just have to like maybe
read some stories and play some songs.
I was like, oh, okay, cool.
No worries.
I'll give it a go.
And again, living in the
mument, not thinking about the
implications or ramifications.
Maybe I can do that.
And then story time became
this institution in Kyneton.
It was wild.
Like we would get, I think the most we
had was like 120 people in the shop.
Woah.
And there was like prams, like
a row of prams out the front.
My goodness.
Like, a rock show.
Yeah, I walked through Kyneton and like
the little, the three and four year olds
would be like, theres Lucky there's Lucky!
Like it was like, it was
So you were like a celebr,
like a local celebrity.
In the under four demographic only.
Yeah.
That's the demographic that matters.
That's the demographic
you're aiming for, right?
Yeah.
So I had this really joyous, beautiful
experience with these young kids.
And I think that was what kind of drew me
into, oh, maybe primary school's for you.
And I'd always considered
this idea like, where can you
make, have the biggest impact.
Where can you change the
lives of the most people?
I was like, if you get in early then
you can, you can help kids know that
they're loved and they're supported
and that you see them for who they are.
And then you go into secondary and you
can teach something that you are really
good at or you're really passionate about.
And like I've heard people say, you
go into primary if you love kids,
you go into secondary if you love
your subject, And I don't necessarily
see the divide that clearly for me.
I think it's possible to have both
of those things in both contexts.
So going into primary was, very much
around, yeah, let's get in early.
let's work with some of these kids.
And did you enter being like,
you should all know who I am.
I'm a celebrity and were you on
YouTube at this point, by the way?
'Cause you'd started doing
some story times and stuff.
Was that during COVID?
Yeah, during COVID we were
doing like Zoom and YouTube
story time and we'd get people.
coming in from all over the place.
I had lovely messages from people, I had
letters, was getting letters in the mail.
It was very strange.
Like I didn't feel like I was global.
Yeah.
I didn't feel like it was much, Yeah.
But, but at that time I think there was.
Simple things.
So many people that were
just doing it so tough.
And I just got, we were getting
all of these messages from people
saying, thank you so much because you
are giving me 30 minutes to myself.
From parents 'cause their kids would
be, watching us doing story time.
And so what were, did you do placements
and things like that during your course?
And what was that like when
you were studying online?
Yeah, I did a couple of
placements, sorry, not a couple.
I did a couple in, primary
context and a couple in secondary.
They were really good, really, good.
The first, the first placement was the
primary one in a prep class actually.
And.
I just was able to observe and
just see how the teacher around
the class and he actually is
now a pretty good mate of mine.
So I guess we connected on a human level
and seeing him do his job so well and
to see how the kids responded to him.
It was like a really
nice kind of experience.
And, yeah, like he was a really
good mentor teacher to have.
And then, I had, I had really
good mentor teachers in general.
Like they were all
pretty exceptional kind of teachers
and getting to see how they worked with
the young people and how they taught
and how they manage their classes.
And it's really interesting 'cause
I guess like when you are studying
in a classroom environment, what
you learn is often very different
to the practical application of it.
So there was stuff that I was learning,
during my degree, which is really
helpful in terms of when I'm planning
a lesson or when I'm thinking about the
fundamental approach to how do I do this?
But then you get into a classroom
and there's so much more that you
still have to learn before you can
actually be an effective teacher.
So seeing my mentor teachers modeling
that, like how do you manage a class?
How do you get everyone to put their
hands up when it's time for a question?
How do you manage your time effectively
to make sure you don't run out
of time at the end of the class?
Yeah.
So watching them do all of those
things was, was really good.
And I feel very fortunate that I was
able to do my placements in person
because I think 6- 12 months earlier,
nobody was doing it in person and yeah.
Yeah.
Wow.
So what was it like when you wrapped
up your degree and how did you, you're
obviously a teacher now, like how was
the process of finding a job afterwards?
And also do you, did
all of this prepare you?
For what it's really like?
About half of what I have learned,
I haven't used yet because
it's in a primary context.
So I've done one day of CRT work
at a primary school and all of the
stuff that I learned about primary
teaching started slowly coming back.
But a lot of the foundational literacy
and numeracy stuff I haven't had a
chance to really utilise effectively.
But in a secondary context.
Yeah, there's all this stuff that
that I learned along the way that
has allowed me to probably be a
pretty effective science teacher.
And I had an amazing physics lecturer.
He was an ex-teacher himself.
And just the way that he
communicated, the enthusiasm and the
passion that he had for teaching.
It was just such a great way
to learn about teaching physics
and I stole his rubrics.
Like I basically completely
100% copied his style of rubric.
Uhhuh.
And used that in all of the subjects
that I teach at school, because I
just was like, man this is so clear.
He's telling me exactly what he wants.
Uhhuh.
And, yeah, so I think the stuff
that I did here was really, helpful.
And and I think the first semester
especially was really nice because
there's a lot of the, the resetting of
our kind of inherent biases that we have.
Because that's really critical as
teachers, like we need to go into it
recognising that the world and the
classroom is not an equitable place.
It's not a fair place.
So how do we support those kids
that aren't afforded the same
privileges as many of the rest of us?
So yeah.
I was gonna ask like how did your, your
experience as a student in the various
forms as well through uni as well, affect
the way that you approached teaching?
Yeah.
Being somebody that's been in the
margins, being on the edge, I really
connect with those kids that don't have
always positive experiences at school.
So that could be kids that maybe
come from backgrounds that, that
are tricky or tough for them.
They've had trauma experiences.
They may have school trauma, they
may have, learning difficulties.
They may have behavioral stuff going on.
They may have, neurodivergent
stuff happening.
So when I look at those kids, I see a
little bit of myself, and I, I guess I
look at it like, how can I make sure that
these kids are seen for who they are?
These young people are not just
the sum of their behaviors.
'Cause if you look at just their
behaviors in isolation, you're completely
ignoring the context of where they come
from and the experiences they've had.
So I guess I teach kids.
In the context of teaching the
subject as well, that's one thing.
But there's also this thing.
It's like I want you to grow up to
be a rounded young person that has
options and opportunities in life.
And how do I teach you to become
a functional member of society?
It's not just about can you be good at
coding, 'cause I teach year seven digital
technologies as well and I'm at either
end of the school, I'm at year seven with
those guys in year 11/12 with the physics.
So how do I get those year sevens to get
to a point where they can come into my
year 11 or 12 physics class and still be,
and to be good students,
to be good learners and to
be importantly good people.
Yeah.
Because you, we take in a massive
geographical area in Kyneton and
you get kids from all sorts of
backgrounds, all sorts of lives.
And some of them, you may be
the only person in the day
that says hello to them, or
Yeah.
Says a kind word to them.
Yeah.
So I take that responsibility
really seriously and, I feel
obligated to make sure that
all of the kids in my class, not just the
kids that want, that need a little extra
support, feel seen and feel respected.
And I see them as a whole person
and as a person with agency.
They're not, a child to be molded.
Allow them to make mistakes,
learn from the mistakes.
And I always say with my digi tech
class, 'cause there's a lot of kids
that, like love, digi tech, like
love, love the coding, and love
the code breaking stuff that we do.
But then there's another group
of kids who really hate it.
Because they're just not into it.
and I tell them.
And do they all have
to do it in year seven?
Yeah.
It's compulsory.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So I say to them, look, it's
okay if you hate my subject.
That's totally cool.
I'm not gonna be offended.
But you need to get through, Okay.
Yeah.
Because this is what life looks like.
Life is full of stuff that
you are probably not into.
You don't wanna do.
That you don't wanna do.
Yeah.
But you have to learn the skill of how
to push through and how to get something
done even if you are not enjoying it.
Yeah.
And that's my motivation
and drive for those kids.
It's not like you just
need to do the work.
No, It's not about doing the work.
Yeah.
It's about learning the skill.
And you're not taking
personally about your,
the subject you are teaching
or anything like that.
No.
No.
Yeah.
No.
And where are you teaching now?
So you're at Kyneton High, Is that right?
And did you do placement there?
Yeah, I did.
I actually did a, my very final
placement at Kyneton High.
Oh, wow.
So I was already working there.
I'd been asked to start working on
a permission to teach, teaching.
Wow.
Yeah.
Two year seven classes, two or
three, three year, seven classes.
And I guess I'm still there.
Yeah, not only are you still there,
but you have your, you've rebuilt
the physics program from what I can
see, and you've raised the number of
students that are even studying physics.
Yeah.
From two to 19 in VCE, right?
Yeah.
Yeah.
Like we, we haven't had a, a
large number of students in
physics, for quite some time.
And last year was my first cohort
of year twelves to go through.
And I had five, five
year twelves last year.
We had, only two year elevens elect to do
physics, so they didn't run the subject.
Wow.
To the school's credit, they.
I think my principal was pretty keen to
get the physics program up and going.
So she advocated, I think, to get me
to do a year 10, science elective.
And I built that subject.
I joked that I propagandised
all of the students, to get them
to do physics and chemistry.
And this year I've got, 19.
Yeah.
19 year elevens.
Wow.
So from two students to 19.
Yeah.
That's incredible.
You won a couple of awards while
you're studying a Deakin, right?
Yep.
So we've got an academic excellence
award for the highest weighted average
mark in the master of teaching,
and we've got the Student prize
for outstanding teaching practice.
How does that feel?
It was so strange getting the phone call.
I was, I was just genuinely shocked.
I think, I'd never been, I'd
never been the best at anything.
It's like I always just cruised
through just in the middle,
so I was just, yeah, I was very surprised.
Absolutely humbled and honoured.
but it was like, wow, that's
not something I expected.
But to be fair, I think that the
MTeach was the first time that
I truly felt interested and 100%
engaged in what I was doing.
So throughout all of my other
degrees, like I, I enjoyed
them, but I don't think I was as
invested as I was with the MTeach.
I, dunno what it was.
Maybe it was just, maybe this is the
calling in my life that I've just
it's taken me a while to get there.
But yeah, I worked really hard,
like this is the first time I've
worked really hard on anything.
Probably through the
detriment of my family.
Did you do it part-time while you
were studying or was it full-time?
No, it was full-time.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So I was in seminars at 6, 6 30, I
think in the evenings, and my poor
partners come back from work and she's
having to get our daughter to bed.
Yeah.
And our daughter had been having a pretty,
pretty rough time at school and she,
like afternoons weren't easy for her.
And I was like, okay, sorry, I gotta
close the door, gotta get doing my thing.
And I think now can I can reflect on
that and go, oh, maybe you probably put
in a bit too much time into, your study
considering the context of your life.
But now I can also see it through
the lens again of my adhd.
It's like the hyper focus, like it was
like, my brain is like really into this.
So I can shut off the world.
Yeah, absolutely.
Shut off the world.
And I can, do this and yeah.
But was it flexible as well?
Were you able to pick when your lectures
were or when your seminars were?
Yeah.
Yeah.
I think, a lot of our seminars were, you
could attend them live if you wanted to.
Yeah.
And I tried to go to quite a few of them
'cause I think there's like a benefit
from being able to ask questions and
Totally.
And be involved in like the small
group discussions and stuff like that.
And I think that was really good.
But often I would find
myself watching the lectures.
At like double speed just to try and scrub
through things as quickly as I could.
Yeah.
no other student has done that, right?
Nobody ever.
No.
Ever would do that.
No.
There, there was definitely,
opportunities for me to work
around what, my schedule was.
Yeah.
Like I was still photographing at the
time as well, like when, right when,
when things opened up again in Victoria.
So I was still photographing and
working, while I was studying.
So it wasn't just, you can study during
the day while your kid's at school.
Yeah.
So the, yeah, I was able to
balance a lot of my life.
Yeah,
through, through studying
through Deakin and it was,
pretty good and pretty flexible.
And, I think yeah, having, that
option allowed me to do this thing,
to get this degree that I probably
wouldn't have been able to manage
if I'd had to be there in person.
Yeah.
And so did you enjoy your Deakin sort
of experience at the end of the day?
Yeah, I think so.
It's a, little bit hard when you are
not located on site with other people.
Like,
Yeah.
I didn't really get to know a huge number
of people throughout my degree, but I
was partnered up with a few people in a
few subjects and and in small groups and
I got to meet a few people through that
and there were some really interesting
and cool people that I was exposed to.
And, I guess the real thing that I took
from it was the, obviously the learning.
What, how do, I, what's the
pedagogical knowledge that I
need to be a really good teacher?
And I think that's the best
thing that I got from my degree.
And to know that I guess other
teachers were also getting this view
into teaching about privilege and
advantage, the stuff that's really
important to me, like seeing that
being the focus of so much of our first
semester in first year was really good.
I was like, oh, okay.
So this is gonna filter out a whole
bunch of people that are not into this.
While anyone who's maybe not aware of
it now will become aware of it, and
the next generation of teachers can
be more inclusive and more supportive
and more understanding of all sorts
of kids, regardless of where they come
from and their backgrounds and their
Yeah,
and their lives.
So yeah, I think that was probably
the first six months were like,
okay, this is the place for me.
Yeah.
Lucky, you've had so many careers by
the sounds of it so far, and your path,
hasn't been linear, What have you learned
about embracing change and uncertainty?
Connecting back to the opening question
you asked, change and uncertainty are
definitely things that I embrace now.
I think, I, like I said, I, have in the
past kind of been like very, slow to adapt
and change, and been a bit of a blocker.
And, and that's, that can be tricky to
be a person in the world that lives life
like that, especially when you've got
a partner who's the complete opposite.
So it, comes with the friction of those
two different ways of living and I think
Kristen has taught me through her ways
that you don't need to be like that.
And it, and she's also taught me that
it can be problematic as well, for our
relationship and for our family life.
So I'm much more willing to give
things a crack, and to not be
scared of what could happen.
And I think that's a good way to live.
Like I would've never become a
photographer, if I hadn't taken that jump.
I would've probably not become a teacher
if I hadn't been able to just go, oh,
just, you can just go back to uni.
And, and I say that all with the
understanding that I'm like immensely
privileged to be able to have a life
where I can make these jumps and
leaps into things that I want to do.
because I have a safety net.
I've got a partner that's
got a pretty good job.
I've got a very healthy
kind of life that we lead.
We've got a house that we
live in that we're stable.
So I have all of those privileges
in my life that allow me to do that.
So I think it makes it easy for
me to say, go on jump into things.
And I know that it's not
the same for everyone.
Yeah.
But I think there are little incremental
things that we can do to support
ourselves, to be able to get our lives to
be where they, where we want to end up.
And I look at the story of my family and
how they got to this point in Australia
and how I got to this point in my life.
And I,
I guess it's just all about options
and freedom in terms of how do you
give yourself these options in life?
What do you need to do to work
towards giving yourself options?
And I guess it connects into
this wonderful possibility thing.
Like it's, there are all of these
possibilities that can happen and
sometimes you have to make little
decisions along the way that
allow you to get to that point.
But for me as a teacher, the way I
approach it with my students is at
the end of school, it's not about
whether you go into university or
whether you go into being a tradie or
whether you go into doing X, Y, or Z.
It's about getting to that
point and being able to choose.
It's not about, I don't want you to get to
the end of year 11 or year 12 or whenever
you choose to leave and go, I don't have
any choice of what my next life, what
my next stage of my life looks like.
Yeah.
I wanna be able to make a
choice where I want to go.
And I think that's the big
kind of overarching perspective
that I take into teaching.
Give yourself opportunities, give
yourself the freedom to choose.
I guess final question,
what's your next choice?
What's next for you?
Taxi driver, obviously.
Yeah.
The world's most so qualified taxi driver.
Yeah, all right.
Lucky, thanks so much for joining.
Do you know what?
It's, so I've been in all of
my careers for about 10 years.
Yeah.
10 years each.
So I've got about seven years
left, I reckon, in teaching.
Yep.
And then.
I dunno.
I'm like really into
woodworking at the mument.
Uhhuh.
That's like maybe a hyper
focus thing as well.
Maybe that will pass and
I'll do something else.
I don't know like I,
I love lots of things.
I love making music.
I love kind of being outside and
building things around our house
and I don't know, I just don't know.
But again, this is I'm not a thinker,
I don't plan, I'm not a planner.
So whatever happens will
happen, in some way.
But I've given myself enough things
in life to be able to go, okay, if
that happens, this will work out.
So if we decide to travel and
we go somewhere around Australia
or something and drive around.
I've got a teaching degree.
I can work in schools, I
can go do something else.
I can photograph.
And I've, and it's all of my
education in its different ways.
Whether I have learned it at school
or whether I've taught myself watching
YouTube videos, all of these things that
I've learned along the way have now put
me in a position where I can choose what I
wanna do next, and whatever that is, I've
got the skills to be able to make it work.
I don't know.
You might, I might be in your seat soon.
Yeah, we'll see.
We'll mark our calendars
for seven years time.
Seven years time.
See what your choice is then.
Sounds good.
Okay.
Yeah.
Lucky, thanks so much
for chatting to us today.
Thanks, Dom.
It's been awesome, man.
Thank you.