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Nobody taught you how to handle it when a prospect hangs up mid-pitch. Or when your biggest deal goes dark on a Thursday. Or when you're one call away from quota and your stomach won't stop turning because you don’t know what to do next.
That's the stuff we’re here to talk about. Josh and Eric, two former athletes turned sellers, break down what it actually takes to compete in sales right now. The plays that work, the ones that don't, and the embarrassing stories in between.
No suit-and-tie energy here. We want to help you get your head in the game and make you the hero of your own sales story.
It’s time to get game-day ready. You in?
Eric Salvo (00:00):
Experiences are everything. People are going to remember you for the experience, not necessarily who you are, what you do, what you sell. Totally. Making them feel something.
Josh Rasmussen (00:12):
We're back with another episode of GameShape. I'm Josh. And I'm Eric. And we are here live this week at HubSpot Unbound. This is a marketing event. We're sales guys. We are sales guys. We're in maybe the wrong place, but we have had a lot of conversations with people this week about a lot of different things. As we're going to talk about today, the trends, insights, maybe some other fun topics that we've discussed this week.
Eric Salvo (00:36):
Yeah, it's been a fun week so far doing a ton of activation content. And now we're here, spent the whole morning doing nano street interviews, which can't wait to show you guys. That was a lot, a lot of fun. But now we're here sitting down, relaxing in the shade. In the shade. In the Amazon rainforest here. Very excited. Beautiful setting.
Josh Rasmussen (00:52):
Beautiful setting. So first thing to talk about, this is your first event of the year.
Eric Salvo (00:57):
My first. This is your - Like seven? Six, six or seven. Six, seven? Yikes. I can't believe you said that.
Josh Rasmussen (01:04):
Dang. I think we're too old to be doing that.
Eric Salvo (01:05):
Probably.
Josh Rasmussen (01:06):
But first event of the year, what's your one big takeaway so far? We've been here, obviously you did some man on the street interviews. We've talked to a lot of people. What's one thing you've heard through the conversations we've had so far that's stuck with you that we can take through the rest of the week?
Eric Salvo (01:19):
Yeah. One thing that I'm hearing from a lot of folks is there are a shit ton of tools here and obviously we're seeing a lot of tools. Hundreds out there. But a lot of people with AI today are now just trying to just build it on their own and they're just getting frustrated because they can only get so far. So those purpose-built tools are frustrating people, but having to be a necessary evil for them to go and buy essentially. And that's again, why we're part of this conference. So that's one of the things I'm hearing. I know you're on the DDR side, you probably have tried to build some things too, but at the end of the day you have to buy, right?
Josh Rasmussen (01:49):
Yeah. Well, I think there's different areas where it makes sense. There are some tools - To automate. You definitely build a lot of stuff, especially with the MTP connections in Claude and ChatGPT. And there's obviously a lot of really smart people that can do a lot of things, but there's also a lot of tools where it doesn't make sense to do it. I think that's the discrepancy of what does make sense to spend some time trying to build and automating for your own teams and where does it make sense to this, good luck. This conversation we have a lot of time, you should definitely go try to do this and we'll talk to you in a month. That's usually what happens. Where does it actually make sense for you to spend time trying to build something, which is usually the hard part for people.
Eric Salvo (02:29):
It varies depending on size too. There's some small companies that have really figured it out, have built a true work stream, know what they're doing, are able to go in, execute, and really are fluent in AI. And then there are even larger companies too that I'm having conversations with on a day-to-day basis and even some today where they're just incredibly far behind and the word Claude or GPT is almost a foreign concept to them. And they're at a conference like this to try and figure out, well, how do I start to actually implement this in my business? Which is crazy to hear in late 2026, but it's happening. There's still a lot of folks out there who still don't really know what's don't know anything. And we're on the cutting edge because we work in tech.
Josh Rasmussen (03:03):
Yeah, we're definitely lucky that we work in the AI space. Basically it's shoved in our face. We have to know about it, which is a luxury. And it can be a pro and con, but it does help to be in the forefront of what's going on, what are the conversations happening. And on that same front, tool evaluation. People are not only looking for tools, but it's adjacent to that build versus buy conversation of we have a need for something. Do we just go try to build or do we buy it? You talk about some of the conversations you've had of what are people looking for? How do they identify what to look for? And then they get to that crossroads of build versus buy. What does it look like?
Eric Salvo (03:38):
Yeah. Well, I think a lot of it right now is the internal build of, hey, I want to create some sort of, really from a sales perspective, a internal sales tool that scrapes all the leads and tells me what to do. And flawed in theory can do that, but ultimately there's a lot of the tools out there that are actually specifically designed for it and aren't just some crappy workaround that you could start to do. That's part of it there too. And I'd also say that's a really relevant conversation because it's late September right now, mid-September. We're four months away from end of the year. So fiscals planning, budget planning is happening right now. And they're like, all right, I have to weigh the pros and cons of, could I build something that equates to this or relatively close in the next two months or do I have to go buy something?
(04:20):
Totally. It's like that's another relevant part of the conversation which makes this conference so important for even us as a company to go out and secure leads and be a part of that. That's what I'm hearing though. You're saying you actually buys tools. Exactly. What you think?
Josh Rasmussen (04:32):
Yeah. So I just went for my first actual buying process of tool here at Vivun. It's weird to be on the other side of it because when you're SDR, BDR, AE, it's like you have one goal in mind. It's like my goal is to get this across the finish line. Most of the time, people only close when they need something. Very rarely do they buy a tool, especially now, purse strings are cinch tight. Nobody's buying stuff because of that's cool. They're only buying stuff because they have a need for it. And the tool that we just bought was strictly because we had a pain point. We went and evaluated the tools in the space. We tested them out and then we bought the tool that made the most sense for us. And so it literally came down to, do we have a pain point? Is there a product that fits it?
(05:13):
Yes or no? Then we make a purchase.
Eric Salvo (05:15):
There's three Ts in sales that I was told by a friend of mine who work at Rapid7 still, been there for a long time. Three Ts that evaluate what it is about sales and there's timing, talent, and territory. That all kind of works into how you're going to eventually hit quota. So much of it is timing. It is. Are you at the right place at the right time? Is budget available? Has someone recently left that wasn't a huge fan of your product or someone else's strategic initiative that is now departed the company? That is the biggest thing in sales. And I believe that you have all ideals. If you're out there at the right place at the right time, you have a much higher chance of getting something done.
Josh Rasmussen (05:49):
Totally. And you talked about now being a time where it's planning season and we're at an event where there's maybe a hundred tools inside right now. We talked to a lot of people on the street. One question we ask people is how do you grab people's attention? How are you grabbing people's attention? How are we going to further ourselves?
Eric Salvo (06:09):
At this conference when I'm at the booth, it's always a compliment and you always have to show up with friendly face and a smile, but if you compliment something about their appearance, their look, that's an easy way to bring them into the booth and at least get them to not only look at you, but look at what's behind you, see the screen and be like, does that make sense or not? And luckily our marketing team does a great job putting something out there. You've got a different method though. You love to point and time.
Josh Rasmussen (06:32):
I like to just grab people.
Eric Salvo (06:33):
Just try and connect eye to eye.
Josh Rasmussen (06:35):
Yeah. If you make eye contact, it's immediately like a.
Eric Salvo (06:39):
They're coming with me.
Josh Rasmussen (06:40):
It does then proceed into love the pink jumpsuit or
(06:45):
There's a group of people that looked like curious George, yellow suits on. It's something, but it is some type of compliment or anything to grab them. But if you make eye contact - It's over. It's a wrap. It's a wrap. Come talk. If we make it uncomfortable because I will or I'll chase you down. Jason Voorhees is a hero of mine. I'm just kidding. But seriously, if you make eye contact, you're coming to the booth to have a conversation so I can get a badge again so marketing doesn't get mad at me for the lack of - MQL is very important at these events. But I think that's the key is we've talked about you have to grab people's attention, and especially being at a marketing event. I've seen people just walk around a booth just to look. What's on your booth? Is there messaging? What's the strategy?
(07:23):
What's the strategy? And I think that's another thing that we heard this morning from somebody was the biggest thing they care about is the experience. How does a booth make me feel? It's less about what does your product actually do and how do you make me feel at this event?
Eric Salvo (07:38):
It's a combination of what's in the booth. There's some really unique things that people have. And then what is your interaction like with that person? They stand out to you? Are they different? They actually hear you and care about what you say and aren't just rushing to pitch you the product. That is the experience aspect here too, because they're going to have a lot of conversations with a lot of different people. We're going to speak to upwards of 300 people, 40 people, 500 people at time. We're done here. How many of those people are you going to be able to point out and be like, "That's who we remember, that's who I want to have more conversations with." Totally. And that's a part of our job. Well,
Josh Rasmussen (08:09):
They may not even remember you or our conversation, but I remember guy this morning, I think there was a booth doing facials, which is just a weird thing to do. If you're asking, "Hey, come lay down for 10 minutes and let somebody rub some moisturizer on your face is a little crazy." But you're going to talk about that forever.You're going to go back to your team and be like, "I went to this event. I got some moisture facial done at an event, which is insane. Letting some random person do it at an event in public to me is crazy. But there's a slime station. There a lot of crazy activations, but that's what gets you to talk about the product later and create more of the brand recognition. Even if there's not demand right now, which comes back to the pain point, the pain creates the demand, but if the brand isn't there initially, then you're kind of cooked.
(08:57):
You have to create the brand first.
Eric Salvo (08:59):
That starts by getting people into the booth today.
Josh Rasmussen (09:02):
If you don't have a fun activation,
Eric Salvo (09:04):
You're already in trouble.
Josh Rasmussen (09:04):
You need to have fun salespeople at the booth.
Eric Salvo (09:07):
Sales people, marketers, whoever. Whoever's got a personality that's willing to jump out and try and stop a stranger. We had some conversations so far with people at booths that were like," I don't know if they should be at a booth. "Not the most talkative. It is interesting to hear the selection of really marketing, you're in sales? I don't know. But that's what we've seen so far. I just can't believe it because that feels like there are different salespeople out there in different marketers who are introverted or extroverted, but if you're coming to an event here at HubSpot now, 13,000 people, this is not a cheap event. You really have to go out and do your thing. And I feel like if you didn't pick those people, you could be in deep trouble. We're missing out. So fun activation, fun salespeople, fun marketers, fun people at the booth.
(09:50):
If you get those two, then you have the ability to then create the experience, then remind them of that brand, that title, whatever it might be. Ideally bring them in for a meeting after and continue the brand on.
Josh Rasmussen (10:00):
I think even if you're someone that's going to an event that you are at the booth, if you view it as a, damn, I have to go sit at a booth for 10 hours for three days, you're shit out of luck. It's make it fun. And ideally, your team sends you with fun people. We need to be here together. We've got a couple fun BDRs.
Eric Salvo (10:19):
BDRs. Early career BDRs are a lot of fun. Watching them, I love. I did today with one of our BDRs. Someone came in and said, "What do you guys do?" And I remember when I was at BDR and Gerard, funny enough, pushed me and was like, "What do we do, Eric?" And so this is years ago, and now I get to look over the BDR. I was like, "What do we do, Tori?" And Tori went and pitched, did a great job, but it's fun to go through that evolution of having young salespeople there and watching them fumble and stumble and Tori crushed it, but I also love seeing the hiccups that happen and the coaching moments because now we're a little bit later into our careers. We've gone through that struggle and time and now we're here to actually help coach and support them. Speaking of that -
Josh Rasmussen (10:56):
Yeah, fun for me. I could just throw my reps into the fire.
Eric Salvo (11:00):
Yeah. See that person right there? You got to go and try and interact. Yeah, because
Josh Rasmussen (11:04):
Traditionally it's just been me at the events. It's me and our marketing friends or we did bring SEs to events as well. Now it's like we're bringing Eric, he's our rock star-y, and then we got two other spots. Let's bring the BDRs. Let's bring
Eric Salvo (11:18):
Some BDRs.
Josh Rasmussen (11:19):
Maybe they're terrified that I'm overhearing because I don't get to hear all their cold calls or what they're actually
Eric Salvo (11:24):
Doing as it comes. Super raw. This is it and it's the best.
Josh Rasmussen (11:27):
So it's like guy stops by the booth, that's you. Let's see what you got. I think it's great learning experience too.
Eric Salvo (11:34):
It is, it is.
Josh Rasmussen (11:35):
You're forced. I think it does a couple things. One, it does throw you in the fire. But two, I think one thing I learned early on at events is you can meet somebody and have a conversation and then it's let's connect on LinkedIn. It's like CRO at 100,000 people company.
Eric Salvo (11:51):
Rare, but half. Rare,
Josh Rasmussen (11:52):
But you realize it's just a regular person. It's that fear that most people have of picking up the phone and calling somebody. It's like, oh no, this is scary CRO. It's like, no, it's a regular person. Recognize that in person. It's just for whatever reason, LinkedIn, that screen that's like this guy's CRO, scary. But then you meet him in person, it's like it's
Eric Salvo (12:12):
A regular guy.
Josh Rasmussen (12:12):
The dude has a dog, a white and kids at home. He's a regular suburban dad.
Eric Salvo (12:16):
Drinking a coffee. He's hung over the following day. He might say happy hour last night. He might have as a typical salesperson. He might have stayed out a little too late. I think one of the funny parts about working remotely too, or even being an SDR calling is that it's a different
(12:33):
Muscle to do that over the phone versus when you get in person, way different. Yeah. We're not door-to-door reps. We're not field sales reps. Yeah, we go in person every once in a while for a prospect conversation. It's a later stage, but it's not the same muscle, but pick up pick a phone, have all the research right there. This is completely different. You're trying to scan their badge like, "What company you work for? Nick? Okay. Hey, Nick." And you're trying to figure it out as you go, but it is a different muscle and it does take a little bit of learning and trials and tribulations. And so I remember my first conference I went to just to complete dud. The first day, you're really nervous. You're trying to figure it out. I think it was a 20-year-old kid, 21-year-old guy I didn't really drink at these events.
(13:13):
And just going out there, having those conversations with people, you're kind of trembling in your boots there a little bit too. Your BDR manager, your sales leader, is sitting there watching you do it. Like a hawk. Yeah. And there's a real progression that happens, so the easiest thing is to get the reps in and make it happen. Go continue to get better at it, but you will fuck up the first couple times as we go through.
Josh Rasmussen (13:35):
You stumble. We get confidence really quickly
Eric Salvo (13:37):
Yeah.
Josh Rasmussen (13:37):
It just picks up and you can get real-time feedback too.
Eric Salvo (13:39):
Exactly.
Josh Rasmussen (13:41):
It happened this morning like, "Hey, someone said this. Is that what we want to say?" Restart, redo it.
Eric Salvo (13:46):
To close out. Land the first. Land the plane. We have to land the plane now. Plane's coming down. And as sales guys at a marketing conference, one of the biggest marketing conferences, I think a couple of big takeaways for us are experiences are everything. People are going to remember you for the experience, not necessarily who you are, what you do, what you sell. Totally. Making them feel something. There is a ton of tech here. Everyone's trying to figure out whether they have to go buy something or build something. That's a very relevant conversation right now with four months to go until the end of the fiscal year. And on top of that, AEs, BDRs, you got to have a very fun booth presence or some sort of activation that is actually going to draw people to your event or to your booth. And if you aren't doing that, you got to reevaluate what you're thinking, what you're doing because there's a real investment that goes in here and if there isn't close one revenue coming out of it, you probably didn't do your extra job to make something happen.
(14:39):
100%. That's what I would say if you're missing anything.
Josh Rasmussen (14:41):
I think the only adjacent thing I would say to piggyback off of is people do pay to be here and they come to events for one of two reasons, maybe a third one, but they want to learn something. They're here to learn whether it's about how people are using tools. Obviously AI is a hot topic. The other piece is networking. They all want to meet people. It's like you would be doing yourself a disservice if you weren't trying to point at people and bring them to the booth. And then the last piece, again, people get away from their real life for a couple days, so they go to the happy hours, they want to hang out drinking, which does happen.
Eric Salvo (15:13):
They want to get schmoozed a little bit. There's a lot of vendors here and you show up with a big title and they're like, "Hey, I got budget to spend." You're going to have a lot of free stuff coming your way and a lot of bar invites and whatnot.
Josh Rasmussen (15:22):
Sit by them with the - what I be in the morning because -
Eric Salvo (15:24):
And then you're taking your job in three months. Yeah, exactly. All the fun stuff.