Men & Women In Church, Part 2

We all come from God, and we can’t make it without each other. God created both men and women, because we complement each
other…we complete each other. And the center of our faith is the Lord Jesus, who unites us. Join Pastor Jonathan Schaeffer in the second part of his message, Men & Women In Church, as he unpacks both the cultural and practical side of what Paul is writing to the Corinthian church about the roles of men and women in church.

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What is Grace CMA Church Messages Podcast?

Welcome to the Grace Church Messages Podcast! These are the weekly Sunday messages from Grace Church in the greater Cleveland, Ohio area. Listen to biblical teaching from our weekend services to help you understand Scripture, follow Jesus in your everyday life, and grow in your faith. Perfect for the morning commute, the treadmill, or wherever life happens.

Let me start with our message with a question and it's this What do you do when there's an apparent contradiction in the Bible? How do you handle that? Sometimes you'll hear a person say that it's why they don't accept Christianity, or maybe they've deconstructed their faith or like, you know, there's just too many contradictions in the Bible.

I don't know how to make sense of them all. And and and how do you respond to that? I want to start with the principle for Bible interpretation before we look at the passage today. Then we're going to take these principles and apply them to the difficult passage we're going to see today. Because here's the challenge, even for those of us who are followers of Jesus to accept God's Word, we have to come to difficult passages and either say, I need to understand that, but I can't simply ignored and just pretend it's not there.

What do I do to principles? We could talk about several for hermeneutics, which is the fancy word for understanding and applying the Bible. But we'll look at two of these. The first one, and if you're follow along in your notes so you pull on the way in or if you're line. Welcome to all of you and our friends at Lorain Correctional. We love you guys. And you can find notes, guys, Lorain Correctional on the table there on the front, or those of you engaging online or at our website. And you'll see the bulletin there with principal notes, principal number one. Consider the context. This principal emphasizes the fact that when you come to a passage of Scripture, the meaning of a particular verse is best in the words or the sentences that surround it.

Let me give you an example. One of the most common scriptures tattooed on anybody is Philippians 413, which says, what? I can do all things through Christ who gives me strength. Now Do you take that as an absolute I can do all things. Suppose that I'm in a game of pickup basketball and I really want to dunk it and not just a regular dunk. I want to do a 360 windmill dunk. Then I just keep on going. I can do all things, all things through Christ who gives me strength. I can do all things for Christ. Give me strength. Am I going to be able to dunk the basketball? Some of you're going, Jonathan, I know you could dunk the basketball. That's very kind of you, but it would only happen in your dreams and mine.

That's not the context for what Paul is talking about. I could not pick up a violin and play a takeoff skills, you know, concerto and in D Major because I don't play the violin. Right. We have to come back and say, what's the context of what's Paul is talking about in Philippians chapter four, verse 12, there's just prior he says this I've learned how to be content with whatever I have.

I know how to live on almost nothing or with everything I've learned, the secret of living in every situation, whether it is with the full stomach or empty with plenty or little, for I can do. Oh wow, there's the meaning of it. What is Paul talking about in the context? He's talking about contentment, right? He's going. It's hard sometimes in your circumstances, in a difficult marriage, maybe in a job you don't like, there's something else and you go, It's hard to be content.

And Paul goes, Yeah, I agree. But he goes, I can do all things. What through Christ, who gives me strength? Now? Can we apply that to other things as well, like endurance in the face of suffering? Yeah, but we always have to consider the context. As someone has said, context is king. Here's another principle. Let Scripture interpret Scripture.

The Bible contains 66 books and it's written by over 30 human authors over a course of a span of maybe 1500 years. But in the end, the Bible is how many books? It's one book right behind those numerous authors. 30 Some is really one author. It's a story told from beginning to Revelation Genesis two and and really is telling us the story of what God is doing in the world, how it all began, where went wrong, how has gone reconciling it.

And in this divine author the Scriptures are inspired by God. God breathed is he's perfect. He everything and he never lies. So you're never going to come to a scripture that you go, Yep. Contradicts that Scripture can't. If this book is a unified book, which we believe it and it's all God breathe, then we can say, as I've found in my own experience, any apparent contradiction.

When you begin to dig in a bit in the study, you go, Oh, okay, there's it's a pretty reasonable explanation right there. Two examples on this one about letting Scripture interpret Scripture first, and James chapter two are passage. We're going to look at his first Corinthians 14, but let me just give two examples here. James two says this We're shown to be right with God by what we do not by faith alone.

Some of my read then go Wait a second time out. That goes directly against what Paul says in one of my favorite passages, Ephesians two, where he says Fruit is by grace. You've been, say, through faith and it is not from yourselves. It's the gift of God, not by what by works, so that no one can boast. So which one is it?

Are we saved by faith alone, as Paul says, or we say by faith? Plus good works, as James seems to argue, just James contradict Paul on this matter. What do we do? We allow Scripture to what interpret scripture. So if you look a little bit earlier in James chapter two, you see this. It says, What good is it to your brothers and sisters if you say you have faith, but don't show it by your actions.

Can that kind of faith save anyone? You hear what he's saying? He's going your faith has to be genuine. He's saying if you profess faith in Jesus, say, I believe in Jesus, but it doesn't the way you live and you don't give a rip about the people around you and you go, you know what? I don't really care what's happening in Bangladesh or downtown or wherever in the world, because it doesn't impact my life.

You know, it's not really. He goes, No, no, no, your faith, if your faith is genuine, your faith is going to be worked out and the way you care for people around you and the way that you live out your faith. So so Paul is emphasizing your saved by grace through faith alone. And James says, I agree, you're saved by grace through faith alone.

And that faith, if it's genuine, is going to be matched by good deeds that show your faith is real. One more passage I often mention, because it's such a clear example of letting Scripture interpret Scripture Jesus was speaking to a crowd on one occasion. Chapter 14 records it, and Jesus says this If anyone comes to me and does not hate Father and mother, wife and children, brothers and sisters.

Yes, even their own life. Such a person cannot be my disciple reading that recently, and I've decided to make that my next Mother's Day theme. This coming May just to say, Hey everybody, if you really want to follow Christ, we have some cards specifically that say, I hate my mother right now. Well, you go, What does he really mean there?

Because on another occasion and Mark, Jesus says, honor your father and your mother. So if we just come to the one passage and it says, if you don't hate your mother and father, brothers and sisters, and we just go, hey, straight up. That's their title. I mean, that's that's what it says, right? You'd go, Well, does Jesus contradict himself? No, no, no. Here's what Jesus is saying. He's saying there may be a really high cost to following him, including your family relationships. Some of you face that, that when there is a painful choice, that following Jesus means somehow disappointing your family, you've got to follow Jesus and that sends your love for Jesus will almost look like hate for your family.

The sense of saying, I need to I can't participate in that behavior. I can't. Not that you're a jerk to them or you make fun of them or you guys are a bunch. You're all on your way to hell or No, no, no, no, not that at all. But if they if they ridicule you or whatever it may be, you say, you know, I prioritize my relationship with Jesus above every other relationship.

That's my heart. Many Christians will never have to face that kind of painful choice of turning their backs on their family in order to follow Christ. But there is certainly people today around the world and even around us who, you know, have been disowned by their families, persecuted. We've had to have we've had people here baptized in private because in their country, if they were found out about being baptized, it might mean that their life would be over.

So Jesus says sometimes it's going to be really hard with your own family. That's a key principle of the Bible interpretation. He didn't literally mean just, I want you to go out and hate your family. He means I want you to really, really love me. So we let Scripture interpret Scripture, and that's what we want to do today as we come to a challenging passage.

Let's turn to first Corinthians 414. We've been going through this book and we've titled it Whitewater, sort of navigating, you know, the challenges of of church and life and culture and saying we're led by God's Word and we want to be led today and to have good principles for for understanding God's word. Because, again, if we just read this and go, you know, what doesn't really make sense, we're just not going to follow that.

We can't do that with the scripture, right? We have to either follow it or say, this scripture helps us to shed light on this scripture. And that's why and I think that's what we find here today, First Corinthians 14, verse 34 women should remain silent in the churches. They are not allowed to speak, but must be in submission, as the law says, If we raise the temperature a little bit here and here, if they want to inquire about something, they should ask their own husbands at home first.

It's just disgraceful for a woman to speak in the church. Or did the word of God originate with you? Or are you the only people it is reached? If anyone thinks they are a prophet or otherwise gifted by the Spirit, let them acknowledge that what I'm writing to you is the Lord's Command. But if anyone ignores this, they will themselves be ignored.

Therefore, my brothers and sisters be eager to prophesy and do not forbid speaking in tongues. But everything should be done in a fitting and orderly way. Entire journal articles, even books have been written on just those first two verses there, and someone could go, Hey, it's straight forward to me. I mean, right there. Case closed. It's clear women should not be speaking or teaching in the church.

But can I just say that can't be what Paul means. Remember one of our keys to Bible interpretation lets Scripture interpret What if you read this right here? On the face of it, it's like reading Jesus words when he says, You have to hate your mother and father. Go ahead. Don't show me another passage. I don't want to look at anything.

I just want to look at this passage. It says to hate my mother, my father, and that's what I'm going to do. And I'd go, You're missing the balance of scriptural teaching. It's the same thing here. Last week we looked at first Corinthians 11 and we sort of the basis you can go back and watch that online on YouTube or on our website.

But we saw and if you want to turn there, you can first Corinthians 11 verse four, Paul says this. He says, Every man who prays or prophesies, that is has a word from God for his people. He talks about this headship and then he says in verse five, and every woman who prays or prophesies. So women were praying a prophesy during the worship service and Bible studies, etc..right.

So Paul is contradicting in First Corinthians 14 what he just said in first Corinthians 11, or we have to find a way for Scripture to interpret scripture. Chapter 14 He again talks about their verse 29. He says, Every Jesus follower has a gift and should use that gift, whether in song, prophecy, whatever, and use that gift to build others up.

So Paul is clearly with women speaking and teaching and etc. In fact, it was expected. So how does that fit with what Paul says in first Corinthians 14 or First Timothy Chapter two, which we'll look at in just a few minutes. Two possible interpretations that Bible scholars, commentators come up with. One is this that if we read this in context, Paul is talking about an elder concept and says, in that light, women who are not elders should be silent.

Here's what he says in verse 29. The context. Paul says, Two or three prophets should speak and the others should weigh carefully what is said and who would do the evaluate, adding or watching out, guarding against weird doctrines, false teachings, etc. These were issues to be dealt with by the elders in the church. And in that context, Paul therefore says in verse 34 is In all the congregations of the Saints, women should remain silent in the church.

In other words, doctrinal disputes, misleading, you know, prophecies were to be handled by the elders. That's true. Even at Grace Church today, we would say that our elders help to be sort of a protector of doctrine here, a grace we've had to ask certain people, you know, your teaching is more like Jehovah's Witness. We had a small group leader or there's something else, and and our elders step into that.

And so Paul may be saying here, when you're evaluating, when you're doing elder work, that should be elders and they should be the ones to speak to that second possibility. Some think, looking at the context that there may have been a situation in this particular church in Corinth, Greece, that where a group of women were publicly interrupting and criticizing their what their husbands were saying during the worship service.

Again, the context verse 35, he says, If women want to inquire about something, they should ask their own husbands at home. That one we'd have to know. The situation is almost like we weren't there. We don't really know. But it doesn't mean they can never speak publicly otherwise. It's difficult to make sense of what Paul says in Chapter 11 and also what he says and first, Timothy Chapter two.

Let me just read that one, because it's sort of a similar passage. He says in first Timothy two, verse 11 Women should learn quietly as submissively. I do not let women teach men or have authority over them. Let them listen quietly. Again, that might seem pretty airtight, right? But how do we square that with the fact that the practice of the early church Acts Chapter 29 it talks about the fact that Philip's four daughters prophesy and it doesn't limit where they prophesied. It says they prophesied, and we understand it to be for the church. They spoke to the church or there's Aquila and Priscilla. Priscilla had a key role of instruction in the early church, teaching others, including men. She's mentioned six times in the New Testament, four of those before her husband, Aquila, is mentioned.

And and so would Paul tell us something in first Corinthians 14 that clearly would be a contradiction if we don't understand it rightly to the practice of the early church. One author today, Craig Blomberg, who takes a very conservative view, he says you need to read all of these verses in their context. And first, Timothy says Paul goes on immediately in chapter three to talk about elders and their qualifications.

So Blomberg writes this He says The apostle Paul is not prohibiting women from all forms of teaching or from exercising authority, but from doing this in the role of an overseer or elder. So he concludes, women can fill every major role in church life and leadership, except that of Elder. And really, that's exactly what we would say here agrees to.

If you've been a grace for a little while, you see that women serve communion, women baptized women, women lead short term missions, trips, they all kinds of different ministry. And we would say the ability or the authority to do that, men or women, is delegated by elders. And there's this sort of umbrella of elder leadership, like you see in that diagram right there.

We talked about this last week, that word carefully. Remember, that carefully means headship. And we said that that the father is the head of Christ. The Christ is the head of, you know, the church. And and we looked at it that way and we said, the elders, there are a group of godly men seeking Jesus. And then we have our ministry staff and then who are seeking to equip our church family to lead.

And so there's great freedom under that umbrella to be able to serve in all kinds of ways that were empowered and gifted for ministry. But in the local church, Paul appointed men to be elders. It was the practice of Jesus with his disciples as well. But let's not miss this, that women have always been gifted by God for significant ministry.

You think back from the very beginning, you know, in the Old Testament, how when the nation of Israel is raised up that God uses, along with Moses, his brother and sister, Aaron and Miriam, and they have these these key roles alongside their brother in leading like probably 2 million people, or Deborah, who's one of the judges, leads the military of Israel to a great victory.

Or Ruth, this was courageous faith and she's an immigrant in Israel, and she becomes a great, great, great, great grandmother of Jesus, Queen Esther, this courageous, bold queen who rescues the nation of Israel from almost certain genocide. In Proverbs 31, you have this amazing business woman who's strong and influential and well-respected. And and then in the New Testament, you have, you know, Luke mentioned Zulu Chapter 80 describes how a group of women Among Jesus followers were the financial benefactor.

The you know, they were the donors. You wonder how did Jesus and his disciples, like, pay for all their food? And maybe lodging, etc.. And it talks about these women who are very influential, women who who were helping to contribute to the work of Jesus ministry. And then you see how many women Jesus interacted with in his ministry, and then the first witnesses to the most history shaking life transforming event that ever took place, the resurrection of Jesus.

Like he actually comes back from death. And the first witnesses are who men or women or women, right? I mean, that God in his providence chose that. And so even today we go, God, thank you. Men and women are equipped to serve on the body of Christ to make a huge impact, empowered by the Holy Spirit, to reach their full potential in the local and global work of the Church of Jesus.

They can be strong and competitive and capable and high impact Christ like individuals. The Lord was there for all of us, men and women both. And I love seeing that at Grace Church. And and so so when you come to a difficult passage like this and you say, why are we messing up here, you have to read that in light of the context and allow Scripture to interpret Scripture makes sense.

Let's talk about one issue in our family of churches. The Christian Missionary Alliance recently had a discussion and they gave the opportunity for local alliance churches to decide on titles for men and women. One of the beauties of our denomination, the Alliance, is that there's about 2000 alliance churches in the U.S., about 25,000 around the world. And in the U.S. alone, there are 38 different languages that mark the primary worship of that church family.

Even here in Cleveland, we have a church, that alliance church that is an Ethiopian Amhara. And we have a French Congolese church. We have here a grace. We have an Arabic speaking church in ASL and Spanish, and we would just keep on going. And so that kind of diversity means that there's going to be different ways that people even the way words that are used.

And so the alliance to let's allow for local autonomy rather than national uniformity. So one of those is with the title pastor. Some see the title pastor is only for men that to be an elder is equal. But with being a pastor like that one right there, others see Pastor as being a gift in the vein of Ephesians chapter four that you care for a group of people, you shepherd them.

You've got the gift of being a pastor and it does not automatically imply elder ship. So the key in this discussion is how you interpret this. And one of the ways to do that would be to say all elders have the gift of teaching, but that doesn't mean all teachers are elders. All elders should have the gift of pastoring, but that doesn't mean that all elders are pastors.

And so if you look at the next diagram here, you could say it this way A lot of people have the gift of pastoring, right? There is another way of looking at it. Many men and women in the church and group of those pastors are the elders among us. They help to shepherd the flock here a grace. And so that's something that our elder team is wrestling with and praying about.

I value your prayers for them, for us, and feel free to be in touch if you have questions. But most of all, we want our church family to be a church that honors Jesus, honors his word, and says, Lord, we want to make an impact locally and globally. I said last week, I want to say it again today.

If you're new to Grace Church, maybe on your way to faith in Christ, I want you to remember this. The topic we're talking about today is not the center of our faith. The center of our faith is a person and his name is who is Jesus, right? Jesus Christ. And he's our savior, our redeemer. He came into our broken world.

He lived a perfect life. He died in my place and yours three days later he came back from death. Then 40 days after that, he ascends to have and he sends us this Holy Spirit. Those are the core beliefs of our faith. You're going to see a diagram up here that just we looked at this last week, but then we have these beliefs at the center and Jesus is at the center of our faith.

But then we have convictions that are outside and then preferences like do you prefer, you know, pews or these comfortable theater seats or whatever and and what style of music. But convictions would be the things in the Bible. You go, you know, does Jesus come before the tribulation or does he come after the tribulation or and those are not core to our faith.Godly Bible believing Jesus loving Christians can disagree on those, including the topic we're talking about today. So it's not certainly not a condition for membership of grace. It's also not something to divide over, to say, you know what, I just can't this is not the center of our faith. And so we come back to Jesus and say, Jesus, would you guide us in this?

You know, awful. When I preach, I'm calling for like a life change. And I'm saying, what is God doing? But there are times that we say, let's go after the mind. He we're supposed to love him with all of our heart, soul and mind and strength, right? So we understand, are we go? If I'm going to read passages that are difficult, I go, I don't know how to interpret that.

Maybe we're doing that wrong. It's good for us to look and to say, How do you figure one out? Let's talk about this one. So that's what we've done today. But again, here's my challenge. Always come back to this book. Some of you know how Berea got its name next door, that Berea was settled by early Methodists, and they took their name from Chapter 17, where it talks about how Paul went into the city of Berea in Greece.

You still visit there today. And it says that they were they were more noteworthy than the believers and Jesus and Thessaloniki because the people in Berea search the scriptures to see if what Paul said was what was true. The early settlers and Berea, Ohio, said, you know, we want to be like that. I want us to be like that here at Grace Church.

Just say we're going to search the scriptures because cultural wins, man, they're changing all the time, right? But the word of the Lord endures. For how long? Forever. So come back to the book is God, Bri, this faithful is living. It's active. You can trust it. It's a lamb for our feed and a light for our path. So what can we say?

In summary, from the very beginning it was God's beautiful plan to design men and women as part of His complementarity and to say, I want to show the wonder of my character, my image, and men and women, we might not always understand each other, might not always appreciate each other, but we certainly need each other. Amen. I mean, God has created men and women to be empowered and equipped for ministry and to make an impact in his name.

That was his very good plan. So let me ask you a question. What would it look like even this week for you to cheer on the people around you, whatever gender you are, maybe someone of the other gender, and to say, you know what, I just want to tell you, I see Jesus at work and you his character shines through you men the way that God is using you.

I just I can't wait to see what more He does through your life may we be those who, whatever we believe on these matters are those who say I'm part of a family. I'm going to cheer on my family men and women alike and say, I'm so grateful that you're walking in the power of the Spirit and that God is using you.

May we be that kind of a church? May we be those kind of individuals who say, Lord, you use us and let us be an encouragement to the people around us? Is that your heart? Would you stand with me as a sign of our work together in Christ to let me, let me pray for us, Lord Jesus? We prayed today that we would be in Acts 429 kind of people that there would be no unwholesome talk that comes out of our mouths, but only was helpful for building others up.

Lord, may our words be used in that way. Lord, For those the children among us, for the youth, young adults, for those who are older, maybe feel like, as my ship sailed and to say, No, no, no, until Jesus takes us home. He's got a purpose for your life, man. And women and Lord, all different ethnicities and Lord Jesus, we just want to say, Here we are, Phyllis, with your Holy Spirit.

May we walk in your power And, Lord, may we cheer on every person, us who's seeking to follow you for the glory of your name, and for the sake of people who desperately need to see you today. May they see you in us, Jesus and your name. We pray and everyone said so All about Jesus in the endless Declare this in this great hymn together with the team.