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Chats with law enforcement experts and leaders
Hi. This is Sergeant Betsy Brantner Smith with the National Police Association, and this is the National Police Association Podcast. I have a guest today. You know, I talked to a lot of law enforcement people, and, my guest today, I really wanted to get her on to talk to another aspect of the law enforcement life that I I think the general public doesn't necessarily think about very much, and that's that aspect of being a spouse. And there's a whole lot to talk about when it comes to that.
Betsy Smith:So I'm bringing in the expert, Rebecca Lynn from Proud Police Wife. Welcome to the show.
Rebecca Lynn:Thank you so much. I'm so excited to be here, and I just wanna thank you because I, you know, I think sometimes the family spouses are overlooked a little bit. And so I think it's important that if we wanna help the officer officers, we need to start including the family in those conversations too. So I'm excited to come on and talk.
Betsy Smith:Absolutely. And and let's just throw it right out there. Yeah. It's not easy being married to a cop, is it?
Rebecca Lynn:No. Not always. Definitely not. I mean, you know, my husband has been in law enforcement for twenty years, and we were high school sweethearts, you know, before he went into law enforcement. And I had no idea.
Rebecca Lynn:I absolutely had no idea what that would entail, how, you know, our our kind of family would just be impacted by his job. It's not everything, but it's it is a piece of it. And so it's it's important to have those conversations, I think. And, yeah, it's not always easy.
Betsy Smith:And, you know, you you mentioned something really important. You so he wasn't a cop when you guys got together. And I think there's two distinctions there. When you start dating someone and then ultimately marrying them and they become a cop, and on the other side, when you start dating a cop and marry them and now I'll you know, those are kinda two different worlds. Right?
Betsy Smith:Absolutely. Yeah. I think
Rebecca Lynn:it would have been maybe a little bit different if we had been dating through that so I could get a taste of, okay. This is what the experience might be like. But I knew he wanted to be a police officer, but we went through, you know, high school, college, you know, and all those things. He had another, you know, job before he went into the police academy. So, you know, we had a different experience prior to that.
Rebecca Lynn:And so that's when I kinda started initially seeing and and questioning, okay. Are there resources out there for police families? Because I saw the difference in our relationship from when he first went in and then started seeing just changes, like, once he finished the academy into field training. And and not all of it was bad, but it was just like, okay. We couldn't finish a conversation for three days sometimes.
Rebecca Lynn:And and I'm like, is this normal? And back then, there was nothing out there. And so that bothered me, which we can talk more about, you know, as we get going, but that's kinda what prompted proud police wife was I couldn't find anything out there. And so I think too if you're starting to date someone, you know, and they're already a police officer, you you get aspects of that. You know?
Rebecca Lynn:You get to see little pieces like, hey. My plans changed again. We gotta, you know, reschedule, or I can't be there during that time. You know, you get little taste of that. So it's I'm sure both experiences are very unique.
Rebecca Lynn:Obviously, I can only speak to the fact of, you know, not having that in our life prior. But, so, yeah, definitely two different ends of the spectrum, I think.
Betsy Smith:Well, so let's talk about that. How did so here you are, a young policewife, and you're looking for resources on on how to do this. And and you discovered there really wasn't much out there. Right?
Rebecca Lynn:No. Not at all. And this was, again, twenty years ago. So, you know, it was I would Google things, and I found I remember two articles that just talked about high divorce rates and don't marry a cop. That was it.
Rebecca Lynn:That was what I found. And I was like, this is ridiculous. And so my background was actually in teaching. I taught kindergarten at the time, and, and I just kind of always had it in my head where I was like, man, I I wanna help these families someday because, you know, we did just fine, but we still, you know, went through different seasons where I'm like, this is really hard. And it would be like, you know, okay.
Rebecca Lynn:You know, just adapting our own relationship to the schedule, and we used to be together all the time. Now we weren't. And so just, you know, the normal things that we had to adapt to as a couple, but then you start having children. And then I would, you know, get asked, you know, oh, your husband's not able to join us again. And, you know, like, just little things that, obviously, in the grand scheme of life, may not be a big deal.
Rebecca Lynn:But when you're experiencing for the first time and it's new and you have no one else to talk to about it like, I didn't know if this stuff was normal or not. And so I would look for things. There was nothing out there. And so finally, it was about ten years into his career. After our second child was born, we decided I was gonna stay home for just a year.
Rebecca Lynn:And because, you know, two kids in day care, and and I was a teacher, and he was a cop. And so I was like, okay. Two year you know, you one year, I'm gonna stay home. And then I was like, couldn't sit still. I'm just not a very, you know, very good at, you know, doing one thing.
Rebecca Lynn:And so I like to be creative. I'm like, it still bothers me that there's nothing out there. It's been ten years, and I'm still not seeing anything out there for families. And now we had adjusted a lot, but I saw families and and new spouses come into his apartment department, and I saw the struggles they went through. And so, of course, this was very localized to, like, where we lived and wasn't seeing anything online still.
Rebecca Lynn:So I said to my husband, look. I like to write. Can I like, are you okay with me sharing kind of about our life together and what our experience has been like as a police couple? And he was like, yeah. Go for it.
Rebecca Lynn:And so I started a website, and that's all it was was, like, black and white website. Like, I didn't know much, you know, ten years ago. And I wrote four articles and at the time. And the fourth article got picked up somehow by a Facebook police group and surprisingly was, like, very positive. I was kinda like, oh, you know, when it goes out there to police officers, like, how is everybody gonna think?
Rebecca Lynn:But it had hundreds of thousands of, you know, views and so many comments, and people were like, keep talking. Keep sharing this. This is helpful. And so that's kind of how it all began. And so I just kind of made it my mission.
Rebecca Lynn:Now this is my full time job. Never went back to teaching. And, and I just kinda made it my mission to openly share what it is that we go through, what our experiences were, also to find resources that exist because there are a lot of resources now. And a lot of times people have no idea where those are or that they even exist. And, and then I really want to try to just give that support and positivity.
Rebecca Lynn:Not everything is bad. And and, you know, it may just be different than what people are used to, or, you know, maybe they don't have someone to talk to because they don't have anybody, you know, that knows this lifestyle or anything like that. So I try to just openly share and then share those resources so that people can get support.
Betsy Smith:My husband and I used to teach a class called beyond off duty survival, and it it stemmed from we had a class called off duty survival where it was just basically, four hours of getting involved in shootings with your family. And it was it was tactically, was great, but it was kinda depressing. Right? And the spouses were like, could you talk more about just because I he and I would say funny things on the side that that people would relate to. And and so then we started talking about communication and and things like that.
Betsy Smith:And I know that that's some of the stuff that that you talk about. You have become you know, you're an influencer. Right? I mean, you're you're huge. You're all over social media.
Betsy Smith:Your Instagram especially, is phenomenal. And and that's the thing. You know, even though, you know, I've been forty plus years in this profession, and I'm retired and my husband's retired, I still go to your Instagram and and things just to just to see cool stuff and Yeah. And very it's it's very it's very relatable. And and I think now we're more we're far more as a society aware of the things that not just law enforcement officers deal with, but the spout what the spouses deal with.
Betsy Smith:When I was in the academy, you know, we were riding our covered wagons to patrol. We were told in the police academy, don't talk about the job at home. I mean, you were it was demanded. Don't take that stuff home to your family. How ridiculous was that?
Rebecca Lynn:Yeah. Absolutely. And it honestly, it's mind blowing, and I get pieces of that in the sense of a lot of times officers wanna protect their spouse from the trauma and the stuff that they see at work, and they don't wanna share that. But we can't, you know, help or support if we have no idea what's going on. And, you know, I talk with a lot of spouses all the time about, you know, yes, officers need that decompression time when they come home.
Rebecca Lynn:And I share about things that my husband and I do. We do something called no question nights where if I know he's had a, can I cuss, crazy ass day, then, you know, he's come home, and it's it's insanity? And, I will basically like, I'm I kind of would use to word vomit. He would come in the door, and I'd be like, oh, I wanna talk to you. I wanna share all the things.
Rebecca Lynn:I wanna ask the questions, tell you about the kids. Well, guess what? That would kinda lead to almost, like, animosity because he wasn't in the frame of mind to answer a thousand more questions when he's already done that and made life or death situation or decisions all day long at work. Not that he didn't wanna talk. He was just his body was done, and he was in that hypervigilant state, and he just couldn't do it.
Rebecca Lynn:So, like, we would have no question nights where unless it was something that really needed to be answered that night, like, for the next morning, we would just wait, and we would wait till the next morning. And conversations were way better because I got the outcome I wanted. He was much more open, ready to talk, and he was refreshed and able to answer. And but you don't know those things until you communicate and share about them. And I remember, years and years ago, I had realized that things were, like, maybe a little different, and I even picked up on some of the things like his dark humor because we would talk about things at the dinner table that I realized now that or at the time, okay.
Rebecca Lynn:We talked about something, and I remember another couple was with us who's not a law enforcement couple, and they were, like, looking at us like, we don't talk about those things at this entertainment. And I'm like, we do. You know? So I like, there's just little nuances that are different than kind of, like, the normal nine to five family or couple. And it's just nice to be able to know that, like, you know, it's relatable with somebody else that's might be a police family or, you're just not alone.
Rebecca Lynn:So when you mentioned Instagram, that's kind of a lot of what I share on there too is just little things that we may all go through that other people don't understand or, you know, don't get or will never get, and and that's okay.
Betsy Smith:I've I've often said, and I discovered this when I was training, police officers and their spouses, that the only thing crustier and more, cynical than a thirty year cop is a thirty year police wife. And because you do you kinda take on that that Yeah. That cynicism and that you know, there's not much you can say to a thirty year police wife that will shock her either.
Rebecca Lynn:No. Yeah. That's so true. So true. Nothing surprises me anymore.
Betsy Smith:Exactly. And that does become, you know, when you socialize with other people Yeah. Which is interesting. In fact, people watching this, if you have cop friends and you're not in the law enforcement profession, you do kinda look at them sometimes and and because it, you know, it is different. But I do think you need to have nonpolice friends.
Betsy Smith:Right?
Rebecca Lynn:Yes. And I was actually gonna mention that because it's so important, I think, to remove that, to have you know, you have an identity and a life outside of law enforcement and outside of your spouse's career and all of that. And so what's funny is now this is my job, and I share about, you know, our lifestyle. And I, you know, really work to find support and resources for police families. But at the end of the day, I close my phone.
Rebecca Lynn:I don't talk about this. Like, this is not you know what I mean? Like, yes, this is what I share about on social media and things like that. But, like, later, I'm going on a walk with a friend, not a police wife. We don't talk about it because it's just it's you need that removal.
Rebecca Lynn:I think it's very healthy. I think it there is a time and place to have those law enforcement friends too because I think for the officer, especially, they you know, it's it's easier to talk with them sometimes. Like, you don't have to explain the job or, but I think it's so important to have those other friends outside of because, you know, I I really I realized early on too, while there are unique challenges that please couples can go through, we're not the only this is not the only profession that's out there that deals with this. And so, you know, I had a good friend whose husband was a pilot, and she dealt with similar things because her spouse was gone. Her spouse worked long hours.
Rebecca Lynn:She was parenting without her spouse for days. I have friends that are military spouses. I have a friend that, you know, is a manager of a, you know, cars car department sales department. But guess what? He works six out of seven days a week and works really long hours.
Rebecca Lynn:So, like, there's things about the jobs that overlap. While it may not all be the same, I find that if people don't understand, if they wanna be friends with you, typically, they try to understand. But there's so many other things to talk about in the world other than this profession and your spouse's profession.
Betsy Smith:How what do you advise, new police spouses, you know, on on how to deal with? Because I see this, and I see this in some of the forums as well where, you know, they got come home from the honeymoon, and then the the police officer, you know, primarily a guy, isn't isn't around. And and you are going to parties and activities, or you're sitting home alone, you know, on Saturday night before you have kids. And and and I remember being a young police you know, I was a cop, but I was also a police spouse. And and where people would say, oh, you know, here you are alone again.
Betsy Smith:What's your advice for that situation?
Rebecca Lynn:I really think it's important to still live your life. Obviously, you need to still have, you know, that time where you're making time for your family, your spouse, but you can't let that dictate everything about your life, or you're gonna have a lot of resentment, I think. I think it's really important. You need to stay keep your own hobbies. You need to keep your own you know, it can be mutual friends that you have with your spouse too, but keep your friends.
Rebecca Lynn:See your family and do those things. I really tried to early on, the time that my husband was working, make that kinda, like, me time. You know? I would go to dinner with my mom, or I would, you know, do a hobby or, you know, just kinda sitting around waiting for them or feeling like, ugh, I'm alone again. If that's the perspective we have, then I think that it's gonna eat you alive.
Rebecca Lynn:You you have to continue to live your life. And, and then I think too is, you know, we have to realize that we have to be a little flexible when it comes to the job in the sense of I didn't realize early on, and I was very naive. But I didn't realize early on that, like, okay. He said he got off at 5AM. I kinda thought he'd be home by 05:30, 05:45.
Rebecca Lynn:Nope. But did I let that ruin my day? No. It's when they're working, I just kind of treat the days that my husband is working as all day he's working. Like, you know, don't don't make a plan for, like, okay.
Rebecca Lynn:We'll try to do something in the evening, or we'll try to you know, it's I feel like there's it's way too hard to, navigate around that, and it's easy to be let down. So I think, just really protecting the time that your spouse is off and making sure that you protect that time as at you know, if you don't have kids yet, for example, it's just the two of you as a couple. Protect that time for you time and and, you know, time with being with family, but that time that your spouse is working, do something for yourself. Like, you have to continue to live your life.
Betsy Smith:So there are you know, now and really for the last ten years, you know, we've really had this kinda media war on cops. You know? And we had the Michael Brown situation and everything that happened after that. Then we had the George Floyd situation. And and and, again, I don't think that people think about, you know, we how that affects our families.
Betsy Smith:What have you seen in the last five or ten years, and what have you been advising other police spouses to do to deal with all that negativity?
Rebecca Lynn:Yeah. So for the first part of your question, I think, you know, I saw a shift even the way when I would share online. It was before 2020. You know? That's a big one.
Rebecca Lynn:Before 2020, it was so positive and welcoming. And and, obviously, most of my audience is first responder family. But, you know, a lot of people would come across my, you know, Facebook, Instagram, TikTok who was not, But it was always welcoming and positive. We support the police. And then it abruptly made a turn in 2020.
Rebecca Lynn:And I got so much online harassment, but not from the police community, obviously, from the outside world. And anyone that, kinda showed, at least from the spouses I talked to and, again, I talked to thousands of spouses a month, and they were all feeling it. Whether they had a, you know, public account or it was private, they would get messages from family. They would get messages from coworkers and just with horrible disdain for law enforcement. And it was so difficult for thousands of spouses because, they just felt like the world hated their spouse.
Rebecca Lynn:And they were going off of what not they not what they knew about that person, about their spouse, but what the media dictated. And so it it's been very, very difficult. I feel like I'm still navigating that a little bit. I mean, it doesn't I have very thick skin, and I've been doing this a long time. So that kind of stuff doesn't bother me anymore.
Rebecca Lynn:But for someone who is just going about their day and someone has something nasty to say about them, you know, it can be pretty alarming. And so the advice that I have given many, many times is that's a reflection of them. We cannot control what people are going to say or do or how they perceive things. I think we really need to just pour into our own families and, you know, continue to be supportive spouses and continue to just focus on our own relationships and and live our lives. And still, I think we still, though, I know a lot of spouses have wanted to shy away from sharing publicly in support of police, or maybe it's not publicly, but, you know, little things.
Rebecca Lynn:Like, there was a nurse who had a, you know, a thing that attached her badge, and I forget what those things are called, but it was Thin Blue Line. And so she's like, I don't feel like I can wear that to work anymore. And and I know that's hard, and you do have to, you know, have some sort of protection there for your own piece. But if you can still share, because law enforcement needs that. They need that support, and that is one thing that I personally refuse to stand down on, you know, things that I believe in because somebody else doesn't like it.
Rebecca Lynn:And so I think, you know, I would encourage others to still do the same in a way that, you know, is is is you know, aligns with them. But I think we really do have to just focus on our families because we can't control what's out there, but still try to find a balance of of supporting police because we know that's the right thing to do.
Betsy Smith:Absolutely. And and we hope that everyone does that. Right? Everyone and we're seeing a a kind of a a bit of a resurgence. It's slow.
Betsy Smith:Yes. But you know? And, you know, there's all the anti ICE nonsense, and we're seeing a lot of people step up and say, no. We support ICE and all law enforcement. And and, you know, and in fact, when we talk about things like ICE, there there is a safety element to what spouses have to think about.
Betsy Smith:Right? You know, as far as because, again, after the death of George Floyd, we saw a lot of doxing of of law enforcement officers. We saw their families impacted. And is that something that you talk about in your in your online presence?
Rebecca Lynn:Yes. I do. And doxing has been a big, you know, thing that I have shared as well. And I've, you know, shared about a service that people can use to get their information offline too because, it's a problem. And people will, a lot of wives have come to me because they'll see, like, someone that again, like a person that's not supportive of police or, you know, criminal, what have you, will see a police car out in public take the picture or take a picture of the police car with the officer and post it in these public forums.
Rebecca Lynn:And then a spouse is seeing this, and then they're posting their addresses online. It's been absolutely horrible. So, I've talked about that a lot because ourselves. We have to protect our families. And I shared with you earlier, like, I'm very, open about not sharing my last name on the Internet.
Rebecca Lynn:My husband's job is my husband's job, and this is mine, and those are two separate things. And so I don't share my kids online. And there are just we just have boundaries about that. And so I think as police families, we have to take that seriously. We have to take our privacy and our protection very seriously.
Rebecca Lynn:That's gonna look different for everybody, but I think it's really important to look into those things because you just you can't trust everybody.
Betsy Smith:And that service that you recommend, would that be officer privacy?
Rebecca Lynn:It is. Yes. I love Pete from officer privacy. I have known him for eight years now, and he's phenomenal. My husband yes.
Rebecca Lynn:He's I I I wasn't sure. I'm like, can I say that? But, yes, he's wonderful. My husband and I have used his service for eight years now, and I actually just got an email. I think it was yesterday morning that another my our names were taken off of another website, and it just gives so much peace of mind, and I highly recommend.
Betsy Smith:Awesome. Officer Google it. Officer privy privacy. I think it's officerprivacy.com. Yes.
Betsy Smith:But he's got a great Instagram presence as well, online presence. Absolutely. Because that is a that's a that doxxing is a is a huge concern, and you don't know when you're gonna need that kind of protection. Because, again, as a law enforcement officer, you know, you might get involved in a shooting next week that is deemed controversial by the media. And all of a sudden, you know, your family's at risk.
Betsy Smith:So if they can't find your family, that's huge. So you you, not only have this great online presence, these phenomenal articles, things like that. You also actually do a conference.
Rebecca Lynn:Yes. Yes. So I do a 100% virtual conference. I love that. Yes.
Rebecca Lynn:So we are embarking on our eighth annual police life conference presented by Galls. It starts April 20, so super soon. It is five days, and it's all online. So back when, I started proud police wife, I one of my frustrations was I felt like there were great speakers out there. There were great organizations putting things together, but I felt like there were things that prohibited people from being able to get those resources, whether it be cost or travel or time off work or childcare.
Rebecca Lynn:And so I really wanted to eliminate those things because we know it's hard enough for a police officer to get off, but for the spouse to get off too. And it's like playing Jenga. So I was like, no. We're gonna eliminate as much of that as we can. So I came up with the annual policewife conference.
Rebecca Lynn:So it's five days. General admission pass is absolutely free. We have incredible sponsors that help us, you know, put this together so that we can afford to give general admission pass for free. We have 10 incredible speakers every single year, and those speakers just talk to whatever struggles police spouses are going through, police families, whether it's, you know, we have Nick Daughtry from Financial Cop is coming on to just
Betsy Smith:talk great guy.
Rebecca Lynn:Awesome. Talk about, you know, budgeting, pensions. You name it, he's talking about it financial financial wise. We've got Doug White. He shares he came on last year.
Rebecca Lynn:It was one of our number one watched interviews ever. And he is a retired police officer, but he talks about his story and how he almost ended his life. But his wife is really the one that kind of carried him through everything. And so we talk there's a lot of speakers this year that are talking about and this just kinda happened naturally, but just talking about how the, the marriage was what they needed to focus on, and that is what carried them through is you know, their spouse is what carried them through. And so, just great pieces of information about communication, about parenting.
Rebecca Lynn:You name it, we talk about it. And so, again, April, general admission pass is free. We will have the link. You can go to my website, proudpolicewife.com, and see the little link for the twenty twenty six virtual conference, but we'll also provide it for you, Betsy, so you can share it, in the in the description, so that people can sign up. And we also have incredible giveaways too.
Rebecca Lynn:So to get the giveaways, all you have to do is be registered for the conference, and I pick just random generate jitter generators. Excuse me. And we have swag bags from Gaul's. We have boxes from Shieldbox. We have coin clubs from precinct collectors club.
Rebecca Lynn:We have just tons and tons of giveaways, and so, people can win those by, you know, registering as well. So it's gonna be a really, really awesome time full of tools and support. And, and one of the biggest things that I'm proud of is, yes, most of the time, it's the spouses watching, but I have so many spouses that will message me after and say, look. I watched this video. My, you know, spouse, husband, whomever, wife listened, who's the officer, you know, heard me listening and joined in and listened with me, and now we're having these conversations.
Rebecca Lynn:And so it opens the door sometimes.
Betsy Smith:Huge. Yeah. It's huge.
Rebecca Lynn:It opens the door for these couples to realize, like, wow. Like, we last year, we have date Dave Grossman on, and he was phenomenal. And people loved officers loved listening to him, and it just was that gateway for them to have now conversations with their spouse and, and just, you know, helping marriages, and and I love that. That's my favorite part of it all.
Betsy Smith:That's fantastic. And if you're watching this after the conference is over, definitely go to the website and start planning for next year. Because, again, this is an an annual event. Rebecca, tell everybody where they can find you, all the places they can find you.
Rebecca Lynn:Honestly, just type in proud police wife Rebecca on Google, and it'll bring up my website. Instagram is proud p wife, but you type in proud police wife. It'll still come up. TikTok, Facebook. I have a podcast, proud police wife.
Rebecca Lynn:I have a devotional called proud police wife, 90 devotions behind the badge. So just type in proud police wife, and all of that will come up. All my resources and social media is where you can find me.
Betsy Smith:That is so awesome. You are doing you are literally doing God's work, and and we so appreciate it. I can't thank you enough for spending time with us today. And if you'd like more information about the National Police Association, you can visit us at nationalpolice.org.
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