Think Fast Talk Smart: Communication Techniques

People are forgetful. Here’s how to make your messages more memorable.

After any presentation, your audience will forget about 90% of what you said. That’s okay, says Carmen Simon — just make sure they remember the right 10%.
Simon is a cognitive neuroscientist, speaker, author, and expert on how the brain processes and retains information. Her research reveals a humbling truth: “We forget our lives almost as quickly as we live them,” she says. But instead of fighting our forgetfulness, Simon believes we can work with it — by getting intentional about what we want people to remember. “So many people aspire at attention and memory, but very few really know what they want to be memorable for,” she says. “Ask the question: what is my 10% message?”
In this episode of Think Fast, Talk Smart, Simon and host Matt Abrahams discuss how to distill your communication for maximum memorability. Whether you're pitching an idea or presenting to a team, Simon’s practical techniques will help you ensure your 10% message is the one your audience takes away.

Episode Reference Links:
Connect:

Chapters:

  • (00:00) - Introduction
  • (02:36) - Attention vs. Memory
  • (05:12) - Novelty & Surprise
  • (06:33) - Why Attention Isn’t Enough
  • (08:01) - The Power of Priming
  • (09:34) - Priming in Business Communication
  • (10:18) - Why Audiences Forget
  • (13:29) - Smart Repetition
  • (15:05) - The Final Three Questions
  • (22:21) - Conclusion

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Creators and Guests

Host
Matt Abrahams
Lecturer Stanford University Graduate School of Business | Think Fast Talk Smart podcast host
Guest
Carmen Simon
Cognitive Neuroscientist | Author | Speaker

What is Think Fast Talk Smart: Communication Techniques?

One of the most essential ingredients to success in business and life is effective communication.

Join Matt Abrahams, best-selling author and Strategic Communication lecturer at Stanford Graduate School of Business, as he interviews experts to provide actionable insights that help you communicate with clarity, confidence, and impact. From handling impromptu questions to crafting compelling messages, Matt explores practical strategies for real-world communication challenges.

Whether you’re navigating a high-stakes presentation, perfecting your email tone, or speaking off the cuff, Think Fast, Talk Smart equips you with the tools, techniques, and best practices to express yourself effectively in any situation. Enhance your communication skills to elevate your career and build stronger professional relationships.

Tune in every Tuesday for new episodes. Subscribe now to unlock your potential as a thoughtful, impactful communicator. Learn more and sign up for our eNewsletter at fastersmarter.io.

Matt Abrahams: To combat the inevitable
forgetting of your content that

your audience will experience, you
need to define your 10% message.

My name's Matt Abrahams and I
teach Strategic Communication at

Stanford Graduate School of Business.

Welcome to Think Fast
Talk Smart, the podcast.

Today I am really excited to
speak with my friend Carmen Simon.

Carmen is a cognitive neuroscientist,
author, and speaker who studies

the way the human brain processes
and retains information.

Her work focuses on helping professionals
create memorable experiences that

influence decision making and behavior.

She's the author of Impossible
to Ignore: Create Memorable

Content to Influence Decisions.

Well, welcome Carmen.

I am so excited to have you here.

It's about time you've been on the show.

We've known each other for decades, and
I'm really excited to have you here.

Carmen Simon: Thank you so much for
inviting me and welcome everyone.

Matt Abrahams: Yeah.

So let's get started.

In your research, in your book,
Impossible to Ignore, you discuss the

difference between attention and memory.

You go further to say that memory
is a byproduct of attention.

How can a communicator design a
message that's not just experienced

in the moment, but is structured to
create lasting memory that influences

future decisions and behaviors?

Carmen Simon: That's a strong question
and a very deep one, because to aspire

at creating memory traces in somebody
else's brain, it sounds very good and

noble on the surface, not so easy to
do in practice, because we forget our

lives almost as quickly as we live them.

Matt Abrahams: More so
as I get older, for sure.

Carmen Simon: It's to say for
all of us after the age of

25, it's a downhill battle.

It's not that it's impossible.

We have to try harder to first
pay attention, and as a result of

that, remember a little bit better.

It's not easy to pay attention.

Attention is one of the most misunderstood
cognitive processes in the brain.

The good news though, is that we
don't pay attention just in one way.

We pay attention in various ways.

We have multiple attention systems.

So one practical guideline that we
can share with our audiences is, as

you think about attention, your own
or attracting other people's, think of

it in terms of these two dimensions.

One is, where are you looking?

Because attention can be
paid to the external world.

What is something that has gotten
your attention lately, for instance?

Matt Abrahams: I'm spending a
lot of time thinking about AI.

Carmen Simon: Okay, so
you've, uh, turned around.

You're surrounded by tools.

Some are text-based, some are voice-based,
but the attention is going outward.

Attention can also be paid inward.

As you're thinking about AI, and perhaps
you have some introspective thoughts, are

these tools getting better than we are?

Are they as creative as we are?

Where are you looking
internally or externally?

And there's also another dimension,
which is who's dictating the looking?

Are you looking on your own accord,
either outside or inside, or is

someone prompting you to look?

Because sometimes you may be passing
by somebody or something and suddenly

you just have to do a double take.

At the intersection of these two
variables, where are you looking

and who's doing the looking or
prompting it, you might think, well,

I have a lot of control in terms of
prompting someone to look outside.

From that perspective, you can use
some physical properties of a stimulus.

Like for instance, if something
is small all the time, then making

something large will get attention.

If something is quiet, then something that
will be louder will get your attention.

So think about some properties of a
stimulus that you can manipulate on

your own and that makes someone look, if
you make them look, you're more likely

to enable them to remember something.

Matt Abrahams: That's really fascinating.

So it's taking something and
changing the way it normally appears.

Our brains are wired for novelty
or things that change, so

that attracts our attention.

Carmen Simon: Luckily, novelty is not the
only thing that attracts our attention,

but yes, if you can make something new,
or sometimes you don't have to put so

much pressure on yourselves, 'cause
coming up with something new all the

time, that would be very difficult.

But I want to make a distinction between
these two terms, novelty and surprise.

Novelty is something that you
haven't seen or experienced

before, very hard to come up with.

Surprise is something that you have seen
or experienced before but did not expect.

And the reason why that still works
on attention is because the difference

between what you expect and what
happens is how the brain learns.

So biologically speaking, we don't
really like surprises, because

what is a surprise but a failure
to predict what happens next.

But we can afford not to pay attention
to surprises because a brain that

predicts the next step is a brain
that survives a little bit longer.

So for example, I remember seeing
an image in a presentation that

somebody had created of an eggshell,
and out of it comes this little pug.

You don't expect that.

You have seen the pug before.

You have seen an eggshell before,
but not in that combination.

So as a practical guideline, wonder,
can you look at what your audiences

are looking at and expecting?

And at some point, twist the familiar.

Matt Abrahams: And it doesn't have to
be as dramatic as having a dog come

out of an eggshell, but it could be
anything that's slightly surprising.

And by virtue of helping guide people's
attention, does that necessarily

mean that they'll remember it more?

Carmen Simon: Typically, so if you
can't have attention, you are increasing

the chances of memory and what is
science, but the increased likelihood

that something is going to happen,
is it going to happen all the time?

Definitely not, and it's unfortunate
because I would love if a hundred

percent of attention turned into
a hundred percent of memory,

and that is not always the case.

Often attention is combined with some
stronger emotion too, because you may

see the pug and the eggshell, but maybe
you don't really care about pugs at all.

You're thinking, ah, yeah, whatever.

And those segments are not
really all that easy to come by.

Like I remember a classic study that
was done on a campus and somebody

had put a clown on a unicycle, and
they wanted to see how much attention

would that clown on a unicycle get?

And because people were walking,
looking at their phones, maybe a

fraction of those paid attention, even
those who did look weren't necessarily

tuned into what was happening.

So even though visually you're
seeing it, you're not really

processing all that fully.

So therefore the memory
for it is not as strong.

So imagine I look with humility at
business content because hardly ever are

we in the position to create something
as exciting as a clown on a unicycle.

So if that doesn't get
attention, it's very clear that

we have to work hard at it.

Matt Abrahams: In the business
context, people are often

distracted by other things.

So actually just getting that
focus in the first place is hard.

Carmen Simon: So true, multitasking
and distractions are quite

often the biggest culprits to
attention and therefore memory.

So in a humbling kind of way, look
at what people are doing, deviate

from the pattern, and a step before
that would be what we call priming.

So get the brain in a ready
state to pay attention.

One of the reasons we may not
observe the clown on a unicycle is

because we're not ready for something
that's a little extra special.

So priming means getting the
brain to process the stimulus

so that the next stimulus can be
processed a little bit differently.

So if you sacrifice some of your
darlings, let's just say, you're

coming up with some of these surprising
elements, something that's a little bit

more unusual, put those elements right
before something that really has to get

attention and therefore be memorable.

So don't waste those within a sequence.

Place them strategically before points
that really have to get attention.

Matt Abrahams: Really interesting.

So this notion of priming and disrupting
patterns can be really powerful and

as somebody who does what I do, uh,
helping people craft stories, we

often talk about the emotional arc
or the logic of the story, but what

I hear you is adding something else
to it, which is thinking about where

those things that are most surprising
fall, and what you can do beforehand

to get people prepared for them.

That adds a whole nother dimension,
but one that could be very valuable.

Carmen Simon: Very valuable
because everything has a sequence.

Something happens first, and
then something else happens

and something else happens.

And I'm noticing in my neuroscience
research quite often it is very important

to get their brain in a ready state.

Matt Abrahams: Gimme an example
of something you could do to prime

somebody for a typical business
presentation that somebody might do.

What might I do to help?

Carmen Simon: Let's think
of some primers first.

There's some generic ones, just so you
can recognize the power of priming.

So for instance, let's just say that
I wanted you to process the word table

a little bit easier, if I said to
you the word chair, you'd be a little

bit more ready for the word table.

But I, if I said to you the
word tiger, you would not be

all that ready for the next one.

In business content, let's just say that
you want people to remember the fact

that if they use your services, they
will be prepared for AI, for instance.

You could have a semantic prime,
you could have an emotional prime.

A strong story can be a good primer
to an otherwise abstract message.

Matt Abrahams: I'm reminded of a
conversation I had with Robert Cialdini,

and he talked about pre-suasion,
the things that we can do in advance

to make somebody more likely.

And he gave the example of a mattress
company who on their website had pictures

of clouds, and the idea was that our
beds are very comfortable and soft.

And so you're priming the brain
to think about that, and I

find this really fascinating.

You argue that the brain
is naturally forgetful.

How can a speaker proactively
build retention moments into their

presentations or communication using
specific, perhaps linguistic or

visual cues, to ensure that the most
critical information isn't forgotten?

Carmen Simon: What I'm noticing in my
research, no exception, is after 48

hours, people forget 90% or more of
the content that they're exposed to.

Beyond the fancy environment of
it all, beyond the handwriting of

it all, people naturally forget.

We haven't merged with AI yet.

We have human brains, and
those brains are fallible.

I'm not so worried about
the 90% that is forgotten.

I am worried about the 10%, let's consider
it a metaphorical number because sometimes

people forget way more, by the way.

Every so often I'm noticing
increase just slightly, not by much.

So the metaphorical 10% tends
to stay there across time.

You need it to stay there because people
make decisions in your favor based on what

they remember, not on what they forget.

But what I worry about that 10% is that
it is random unless you take care of it.

What I mean by that is if you present
to a group of 20 people, one person

will take away one 10% message,
another one will take another one,

and another one will take another one.

And the reason sometimes decisions in your
favor are slower is because not everyone

walks away remembering the same things.

So you're not just after a memory or
after a unified memory across a group.

Decisions are hardly ever
individual, usually they're social.

So as a practical technique ahead of
time, wonder what is your 10% message.

So many people aspire at attention
and memory, but very few really know

what they want to be memorable for.

So as you're listening to us have
this conversation, ask the question

always, what is my 10% message?

And if you had the courage to call your
audience members in 48 hours and say,

what do you remember from that segment?

Would you be satisfied with their answer?

You're only satisfied with the
answer if you know your 10% message

and then there is no secret.

Repetition is the mother of memory.

You'll come back to that
message again and again.

Like for instance, if we had to
create a 10% message for this show

right now, let's call it control
your 10% and one criteria then for

controlling your 10% is you clarify it.

Then you repeat it more
often than you think.

In my studies, I'm showing that in a
five minute presentation, a repetition

of four times is necessary for you
to be in charge what they take away,

10 minutes repetition of at least six
times, 20 minutes, at least 12 times.

And the reason I think people are
not so comfortable with repetition

is because they think I'm approaching
very smart audiences, especially

people in tech, especially people
globally who have brilliant minds.

Even those brilliant minds still
have human brains and their memory

is just as valuable as yours.

Repeat your 10%.

Matt Abrahams: This notion of picking
what is your 10% and doubling down and

really focusing, really, really important.

Does that repetition have to be saying
the same thing exactly the same way?

Or can I say it, and then tell
a story that reflects it or use

an analogy that represents it?

Does the repetition have to be
the same words to get the effect?

Carmen Simon: I like where you're going
to in the sense of you're using the

repetition, you're using the analogy.

You can use all of the other
techniques you want, as long as

once you're done with those, you
come back to the exact same message.

Don't leave it to chance and
don't leave it to them because

especially from a beautiful story,
people can extract so many other

meanings and so many other nuances.

So they can take it in many directions,
but no, we want to come back to the

same main message, control your 10%,
for instance, for our conversation.

Matt Abrahams: So you can use a variety of
tools for repetition, but you definitely

wanna say the same thing a few times.

So if I have to say it 12 times for a 20
minute presentation, maybe I actually say

the literal words three or four times, but
I use all these other examples to fit in.

Carmen Simon: You can use the other
examples, but come back 12 times because

when you want people to decide in your
favor, they will use their memory.

And if you are in a competitive space
and people don't remember you and a

message associated with you verbatim,
what happens is that you take away gist.

And if they take gist away from you and
gist from somebody else, and gist from

somebody else, after 48 hours and beyond,
people will not know who said what.

And what do they do?

They tend to give credibility
to the more familiar source.

And if you're not a familiar source,
that means you have spent that time

creating somebody else's message and they
take the credit and that really hurts.

Matt Abrahams: Absolutely.

Carmen, I knew this was gonna
be a fantastic conversation.

You did not disappoint.

You've given me so many tools to
think about how I can communicate

so that I get my 10% message
across and engage audiences more.

Before we end, I like to ask
three questions, as you well know.

One I create just for you, and the
other two are similar across everybody.

Are you, you up for this?

Carmen Simon: Sure, sure.

Matt Abrahams: You do a masterful
job in your explanation of being

very descriptive, of using lots of
examples, you practice very well the

things that you teach and have studied.

Is that something that
you really think through?

Is that just natural?

And how did you learn to do
that with so little effort?

Carmen Simon: It's, um,
often a combination.

Some things come naturally, but
some things have to come a bit

more deliberately because in our
practice we help a lot of clients

do the same for their audiences.

In our business, as you very well
know, we have audiences with audiences.

It's very easy to start speaking
about your own features and benefits

and things that get you excited
at the expense of what this means

to you, the secondary audience.

So it's always a reminder to put
it through their lens, sit where

they're sitting, wear a few of
their shoes, the customer's shoes,

would be even more, more exciting.

I really enjoy also examples because
if I have some good examples and

stories, and you are a believer in
great stories, with each time that

you speak, it's almost an extra
excitement moment for your own energy.

So I'm hoping one of the practical lessons
from this conversation that we have, as

you control your 10%, is to challenge
yourself to say, how can I maintain

my own motivation and have that be up?

Because people will sense
lack of energy very quickly.

And I remember this interview
with the longest lasting Broadway

show, the Phantom of the Opera.

Some people think Cats, but it's
actually the Phantom of the Opera.

So a journalist interviews the person
who has played in the show for so many

years, and his first question is, how
many times have you done this role?

1764 at the time of the interview.

So this person had to repeat
his own 10% message 1700 times.

How do you master that much repetition?

For him it was highly sexual because every
two weeks he says we get a new Christine.

So that's why, how he was
keeping his own motivation going.

But the lesson for all of us is
look for some small elements.

It could be the stories, it could
be the practical applications.

It could be something very
concrete, but something has to

keep your own motivation up.

Matt Abrahams: I very
much appreciate that.

I teach very similar content and have
for many years, and what helps me keep

it fresh is reminding myself that it's
new for the other folks and what can

I do to help land it best for them.

Question number two, who is a
communicator that you admire and why?

Carmen Simon: I know we could go for the
public figures, but here's one that's

still in my mind years later, I wanna
say it's been at least five years.

So picture it.

I'm in Poland and I'm visiting the
Salt Mine, so I'm not a big tour group

person, but the only way to go and
visit the thing is to join a group.

And as I'm here at the entrance, I'm part
of maybe 10, 12 other people, and there

comes a tour guide and the first thing she
says is, welcome to this three hour tour.

And I just want to fall over because
I'm thinking not only am I not a tour

group person, but three freaking hours
of this thing, there's just no way.

And let me just tell you that
she was one of the most inspiring

communicators I had seen in a long time.

I had to go all the way to a
Polish salt mine to find it.

But she applied many of these techniques
that you and I are talking about and

you very likely teach in your classes.

The storytelling was just top notch.

Not only just was it top notch in the
sense that stories existed, they were

being said with good inflections and
the timing and the punchlines and the

priming of it all, like before a good
story would already be ready, that

something exciting is going to happen.

Remember priming the brand
and getting it ready.

So I think we can find
inspiration from so many people.

Like next time, maybe you go to
Starbucks, pay attention to how

that person might have a story and
tell it because they could be a good

communicator that can inspire you.

Matt Abrahams: I love finding great
communicators in average places.

There was a gentleman who ran a barbecue
next to a car wash I used to go to.

He was one of the best storytellers
I've ever heard, and I would

just wash my car a lot because I
just liked connecting with him.

Final question.

What are the first three ingredients that
go into a successful communication recipe?

Carmen Simon: Ooh.

So the three ingredients would be tied by
the one main message, control your 10%.

Underneath that, what
would be the ingredients?

Make sure you clarify it.

If you know what your 10% message is,
your audience is also more likely to

know, nebulous to you, nebulous to them.

Number two, we are talking
about the element of surprise.

Associate some of your messages,
supporting points for your 10%

message with something that jolts
the brain out of its habitation.

And number three, there is no secret.

Repetition is the mother of memory.

Come back to that 10% more often than
you feel comfortable with, and that's

how you are deliberate about your 10%
message and you do not leave it to chance.

Matt Abrahams: Clarify, surprise,
repeat, and in that you will really

deliver on your 10% message and
make your message more memorable.

And Carmen, our time together, I hope,
will live in the memories of all of our

listeners, certainly etched in my memory.

Thank you for your time and I'm
super glad we finally got to do this.

Carmen Simon: Thank you so much everyone.

Matt Abrahams: Thank you for
joining us for another episode of

Think Fast Talk Smart, the podcast.

To learn more about communication
and neuroscience, please listen

to episode 39 with David Eagleman.

This episode was produced by Katherine
Reed, Ryan Campos, and me, Matt Abraham.

Our music is from Floyd Wonder.

With special thanks to
Podium Podcast Company.

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