Subscribe
Share
Share
Embed
On this episode of The Lead On Podcast, Jeff Iorg, president of the SBC Executive Committee, challenges ministry leaders to stop playing it safe and start taking faith-filled risks like Peter stepping out of the boat. He explores why both young and seasoned leaders often become risk-averse, then offers practical guidance for weighing reward versus cost and discerning the difference between personal and organizational risk so that leaders can move their lives and ministries forward with courage.
Creators and Guests
What is Lead On Podcast?
Ready to hone your leadership skills and unlock your full potential? Tune in to the Lead On Podcast, where Jeff Iorg dives deep into Biblical leadership.
Hosted by SBC Executive Committee President Jeff Iorg, this dynamic podcast provides insight for seasoned executives, aspiring leaders, or those in ministry who are simply passionate about personal growth. The Lead On Podcast offers actionable, practical tips to help you navigate the complexities of ministry leadership in today's ever-changing world.
From effective communication and team building to strategic decision-making and fostering innovation, each episode is packed with valuable lessons and inspiring stories to empower you on your leadership journey.
Put these principles into practice and Lead On!
Welcome to the Lead On podcast. This is Jeff Iorg, the president of the executive committee of the Southern Baptist Convention, talking with you once again about practical issues related to ministry leadership. Today, I wanna talk about the importance of taking risks as a ministry leader. I see too many young leaders who are intimidated, afraid, overly cautious, not willing to take risks. Now we're gonna talk about how to take appropriate risks and how to measure the need for risk and know maybe more when to take one appropriately.
Jeff Iorg:We'll get to all that. But let's start out with a story, one of my favorite stories from the bible. It's in Matthew 14. It's also in Luke or excuse me, Mark six and John six. It's the story of Peter walking on the water.
Jeff Iorg:So let's talk about that story for just a minute. You know, Peter learned an important, important lesson that night. Jesus had finished a a demanding day of ministry that included the feeding of 5,000 men, the Bible says, plus women, children, so who knows how many people. He told the disciples to get in
Jeff Iorg:the boat and to go over to the other side of the sea,
Jeff Iorg:and Jesus then dismissed the crowd, went up the mountain to pray.
Jeff Iorg:You know the setting. But during the night,
Jeff Iorg:I think it was more like actually about 03:00 in
Jeff Iorg:the morning, the Bible says, Jesus decided to join the fellas on the boat.
Jeff Iorg:But a storm had come up,
Jeff Iorg:and that boat was being tossed about in the waves. Jesus walked on the water through the storm, approached the boat. Now imagine those disciples. They're already stressed by their circumstances. They finished a demanding day of ministry.
Jeff Iorg:They have rode into the night trying to go across that lake. They were in the middle of
Jeff Iorg:a storm with the wind howling, the rain falling. They saw someone coming at them over the water and they thought they were seeing a
Jeff Iorg:ghost. But before you act react too strongly to to their fear, think about it. If you fear being shipwrecked and you see someone walking on
Jeff Iorg:the water toward you, what would you think? So thinking they were seeing a ghost makes as much sense as thinking they were seeing a person. After all, seeing someone walk on water through a storm, that's gotta evoke all kinds of illusionary guesses about the identity of the the apparition, if you will, that's coming at you. Man, they must have been shouting and crying out and otherwise communicating their fear because Jesus called out to them.
Jeff Iorg:Have courage, he said. It is I. Now Peter recognized Jesus, recognized who he was, and probably recognized his voice. So he replied, Lord, if it's you, command me to come to you on the water. Jesus replied, one word, come.
Jeff Iorg:What an invitation that was. Come. Man, that one word. That one word resonated with Peter. You know what he did.
Jeff Iorg:Bible says Peter climbed out of the boat and started walking toward Jesus. Can you imagine how amazing those first steps must have been? That first step walking on water. How amazing. What what that must have felt like.
Jeff Iorg:The exhilaration of it. The wind is howling, the waves are crashing, Peter is walking on the water toward Jesus. Imagine it. But then
Jeff Iorg:Peter lost focus. He noticed the wind and the waves and he started to sink. Panicked, he called out to Jesus asking to be rescued. And Jesus caught Peter and helped him, and they got back to the boat.
Jeff Iorg:When he was safe, Jesus Jesus later said, you have little faith.
Jeff Iorg:Why why did you doubt? Jesus focused on Peter's wavering faith. He corrected him a bit
Jeff Iorg:for losing focus on him in the midst of the storm.
Jeff Iorg:And there is no doubt that is the focus of this story. Peter lost focus on Jesus, and when he did, he began to sink.
Jeff Iorg:And in that critical moment, he cried out desperate desperate to be delivered from such a frightening situation. Now many sermons many sermons have been preached on the symbolism in this story. The ocean is symbolic of life's challenges
Jeff Iorg:and the fixing of your gaze on Jesus is symbolic of not losing your focus or your faith. And to be sure, those are appropriate insights. But they are not the focus of this podcast, and they are not the focus that I have when I read this story. Rather than focus on what Jesus said to Peter and what Peter may have done while out there on that water, I go back to this seminal moment in the story. Peter got out of the boat.
Jeff Iorg:Peter got out of the boat. 12 disciples saw that figure walking on the water.
Jeff Iorg:They may have all heard Peter call out knowing that it was Jesus. And when Jesus said, come, he may have been addressing Peter in the context, but
Jeff Iorg:he did not say only Peter, come. Any of the disciples could have responded to Jesus' invitation to meet him on the waves, but only one person, Peter,
Jeff Iorg:got out of the boat.
Jeff Iorg:While Jesus later did rebuke him for losing faith, at least he had a faith to lose. Peter got out of the boat. The rest of those guys, they never left the boat. They were content to watch Peter climb out and walk to Jesus while they watched from relative safety. Peter got out of that boat.
Jeff Iorg:That's always been the best part of the story for me. Oh, I don't want to criticize Peter for losing focus on Jesus, and I want to acknowledge that that Jesus corrected him about his loss of faith. I I get all of that,
Jeff Iorg:but I'm always, always somehow secretly and deeply moved, if you will, by thinking about the fact that Peter got out of the boat. I wanna be like that. I don't wanna be a guy that always sits in the boat and watches other people take faith filled risks.
Jeff Iorg:Peter learned an important lesson that night. Leaders take risks. He models that for us. They see Jesus walking where angels fear to tread and leaders follow him there. They are not content to sit safely watching other people take risks.
Jeff Iorg:Leaders get out of the boat. Now I've taught this principle to my children, and my daughter Melody believed me. She was an athlete in high school and a good basketball player, particularly a good defensive player. In fact, one time, she was guarding the best offensive player in our conference. And moving into the fourth quarter of that game, this girl had not scored even one point.
Jeff Iorg:Finally, the girl dribbled the basketball off her foot. It went out of bounds, she just burst into tears and turned and stomped off the court. Melody was a bit shocked that this girl was reacting that way and kind of looked up at me in the stands with a befuddled expression and kind of shrugged her shoulders like, what do you do, dad? I mean, I'm just guarding her close. I don't see why she's going off the court crying.
Jeff Iorg:Well, after that, much to my wife's chagrin, who's a lot kinder than we are in our rather athletic competitive family, my last words to my daughter before any game after that, from basketball and on into soccer, my last words to her were, hey, Melody. Go make them cry. I wanna see you get out there and make it happen. Now we often joked about that, but I also told my daughter, don't be one of the stand around girls. You know, the stand around girls are the girls who stand around the outside of the gym gossiping about other girls, but they never get in the game.
Jeff Iorg:They're too cool to sweat, too self absorbed to perform in front of other people, and too insecure to risk failure in front of people. So besides make them cry,
Jeff Iorg:my other watchword for my daughter was, don't be a stand around girl.
Jeff Iorg:Get in the game. Take a chance. Take a risk. Well,
Jeff Iorg:my daughter believed those things and then went on ultimately to college. And while she was there, she did an study abroad program for a semester. She went to Spain. And when she arrived there, she found out that she could take the classes at the university in either English or Spanish. And so she said, let's take them in Spanish.
Jeff Iorg:I'm in Spain. Let's take them in Spanish. Now her Spanish was rudimentary at best, but she took two courses in Spanish for a whole semester, somehow managed to pass them both
Jeff Iorg:while learning and working in a different culture.
Jeff Iorg:As part of that, she told me, hey, dad. I I joined a women's soccer team like a club team that plays in the park on the weekends so I can make friends there and share the gospel. When I started doing that, I I found a a Christian that hooked me up with a church, they're doing a women's ministry in a prison. I'm thinking, baby, what are you doing? It was hard enough for me to see you go off to Spain.
Jeff Iorg:Now you're joining a a local club soccer team, and now you're going into Spanish women's prison. My daughter was determined not to be a stand around girl. She was willing to get out of
Jeff Iorg:the boat, take a risk or two.
Jeff Iorg:And then another example, I'm so proud of her in so many ways as you can tell on this podcast, but when she was nearing the end of college, she had to
Jeff Iorg:do an internship. And she thought, well, okay.
Jeff Iorg:Her internship needed to be in something related to culture or multicultural ministry related to her social studies degree. And she said, well, I don't really wanna take the safe route. I I wanna do an internship in a different context. And so she worked through some contacts that she had to get a five month internship in Iraq of all places. She served as a coach and a mentor assisting with developing the Iraqi women's national basketball program through a Christian coach that had been hired to go there and work in that program for a few years.
Jeff Iorg:So my my daughter's goal was not just getting some practical experience that any internship could have provided. Her goal was reinventing this internship assignment as a way to get the gospel to difficult places by whatever means possible. Well, enough about my daughter. Just suffice it to say, she is definitely not one of the stand around girls. I'm so proud of her and the risks she's taken and modeled in ministry leadership.
Jeff Iorg:You know, we've taken some risks in our family over the years when we moved to Oregon to plant the church, when
Jeff Iorg:we set out to start a family and a and or raise our family difficult setting like that.
Jeff Iorg:We've takes taken other risks along the way in terms of this relocation of the seminary, and you know those kinds of stories.
Jeff Iorg:I wanna challenge you today to be a risk taker in ministry leadership. Now if you're a younger leader, you have much less to lose by taking risks than older leaders may have. But if you're an older leader, you have the opposite problem. You may find yourself avoiding risk because the stakes get higher. But whether you're a young leader starting out needing to
Jeff Iorg:be challenged to take risks
Jeff Iorg:or whether you're an older leader who still needs to
Jeff Iorg:be challenged to take risks. On the one hand, the problems may be you're taking risks that are foolhardy, if you will, but on the other, it may be that you're avoiding risk because you're being way too safe.
Jeff Iorg:So today, I want you to be like Peter. I want you to get out of the boat. Now,
Jeff Iorg:having said that, let me give you four things to think about, some cautions to consider, or some encouragement to internalize as you process
Jeff Iorg:on taking more risk as a ministry leader. First,
Jeff Iorg:When you're thinking about a risk,
Jeff Iorg:you have to think about the risk reward and the cost of the risk in relationship to what might be gained. I have
Jeff Iorg:a friend that I worked with who said, you have to make sure the juice is worth the squeeze. In other words, is what I'm about to do, the risk I'm about to take on, is it worth what might come out of it on the
Jeff Iorg:other side? Risk, reward. And then you weigh that also against the cost involved. Asking yourself, if
Jeff Iorg:I pay the price, whatever that price may be in this moment, will it be something that I can manage, something I can recover from, something that I can handle along the way? A few years ago, my youngest son, Caleb, was graduating from college and was offered a very nice job with a very prominent company here in America. He, had done an internship with them, and they had liked his work, and they had offered him what I thought was a very, very nice position. While he was considering it, he said, dad, I'm I'm thinking about it, but I'm also thinking about starting a company. And he laid out for me this idea that he and his partner had about starting a company together.
Jeff Iorg:And quite honestly, man, this company sounded kind of risky to me, a little bit far fetched even. But my son was graduating with an MBA, and his friend has was also a pretty bright guy. And they've been working on this problem of possibly starting this company for months and months, and they really believed they could do it and do it successfully. I wasn't so sure. And so my son and I had a very, meaningful conversation about it, and I look back on that, and I'm just so grateful my son would even have a conversation with me about these kinds of things.
Jeff Iorg:And after he laid it all out for me and I heard all the different aspects, I said, you know, son, this just seems like such a risk to me. The job that you've been offered is a is a good job with a really solid company. It'll get
Jeff Iorg:you started in a really neat way in your career. And then he said, well, dad, you know, if I start this company and it doesn't work out, if the cost is ultimately that I just lose whatever I've put into it, the other job will still be there. That company is not going out of business.
Jeff Iorg:And now we look back these years later, they certainly haven't. They're still thriving. But my son was saying, look, dad. I've weighed the risk, and I've weighed the cost. And I think I can handle that cost.
Jeff Iorg:I really think I can. Even if it's the worst outcome possible and our idea fails, it's still worth the risk because think about the possible reward. What if we start the company and it's really successful? It could set me financially and then make it possible for me to do ministry in ways that are far beyond anything that taking this other more stable job could provide. Well, the end of that story turned out just like that.
Jeff Iorg:My son did start that company, and, eight or ten years later, he and his partner sold it, and it was everything that they set out for it to be. Risk reward. Before you take a big risk, you have to weigh it out. What's the reward and what's the cost? And just because there may be a potentially high cost, if you look at it and say, even in the worst case scenario, it's worth the cost, the risk because the reward would be so significant, and I can manage or handle or deal with the cost, go ahead.
Jeff Iorg:Take the risk. Now second principle to remember in this is when you're considering risk, especially if you're younger, know the difference between taking a risk and doing something that's foolhardy. A risk is something that you take after calculated consideration, after prayerful consideration, after consultation perhaps with mentors and counselors and consultants, Certainly, after having a a meaningful and important conversation if you're married with your spouse, this is what it means to take risk. It's to make a calculated decision about some something of consequence. Foolhardiness just rushes ahead.
Jeff Iorg:Without all the facts, without all the information, without all the possibilities, it just rushes ahead. It feels good. It sounds good. I wanna do it. Don't be foolhardy.
Jeff Iorg:That's not taking risk. That's being bullish. Third, another principle that's helped me in making decisions about risk is doing it in the context of a team environment or a team decision, doing it in conjunction with other people. You know, some of the biggest risks that I've taken personally and professionally are in ministry. I've been willing to take because a group of people came together and said, this is the right thing to do.
Jeff Iorg:We gotta do this together. You know, when I think back to the first church that we relocated, it really was a risk that I was willing to take. But when the rest of the leadership of the church came together around that idea, then it was really a risk that I knew was the right risk for our church to take because we were all in it together. Same thing at the seminary some years later. I I I was willing to take the risk to move the seminary, but I was only willing to do so after our leadership team really coalesced around the idea and became completely convinced it was the right thing to do.
Jeff Iorg:And then, of course, our board did the same thing. You know, when when you are the only voice, the only one who wants to take a big risk, you better be really, really sure you're doing the right thing before you go forward. But if you can find a group of people that share that same passion with you, that same conviction with you, that same willingness to make those decisions with you, if you can do that, then you may have just found this kind of support you need to not only take a big risk but to be sustained all the way through it. And then I would say that this has been so important to me in my marriage. Over the years, I've had some wild haired ideas.
Jeff Iorg:I've come home and said to Anne, hey. I think we ought to do this or I think we ought to do that. And she just kind of looks at me with that smile of hers
Jeff Iorg:and says, well, I'm not I'm not sure
Jeff Iorg:about that. Or can you explain that
Jeff Iorg:to me again? Or maybe we ought to pray about that one. Frankly, I'll
Jeff Iorg:tell you, few times when she's been cool toward one of my hot new ideas, sometimes I've
Jeff Iorg:been frustrated with that. Thought, what is wrong
Jeff Iorg:with this woman? Can't she see this? But more often than not, when Anne has had some reluctance, it's been a good check-in my spirit that this might be a risk beyond what we should take. And when I've come to her with something that really involved a significant risk, like moving our family across The United States and planning a church in a middle school gymnasium with two families or asking what her real thoughts were about me taking on this role at the executive committee. And in circumstances like that, when Anne looks at me with that same smile and says, Jeff, this is what God really wants for you and for me, and we gotta do it together.
Jeff Iorg:Makes my heart sing and gives me even greater confidence that I'm making the right decision when we make it as a team or in our case, as a couple. Now this is a delicate thing that requires spiritual sense and a and a confidence in in God's leadership in your life. I I get that. But one of the checks that you should have is if you're going it completely alone, you might wanna just go it slower because you may be taking a risk that's really foolhardy, that really doesn't weigh out the cost reward ratio very well, and it really is about to be something that's gonna turn into not just a risk, but possibly something that's a disaster or even devastating to you or to your organization. So when you're measuring risk, first, reward and cost.
Jeff Iorg:Second, foolhardiness and wisdom. Third, team or couple decision.
Jeff Iorg:And then fourth, when you're thinking about taking a risk,
Jeff Iorg:I think there's one set of standards that you have to use to decide if it's a personal issue and a whole another set if it's an organizational issue. When I'm making a decision about taking on risk for myself or maybe just risk for my wife and I, that's really the whole circle that has to be considered. But when you're thinking about taking on risk for an organization, you have to consider, oh, so much more. And certainly, moving to seminary was one of those moments in my life when I had to really count the cost of, is this risk that I'm willing to take on behalf of hundreds of other people? Is it really worth it?
Jeff Iorg:Is it really something God is leading us to do? Is it something that the leadership all share a conviction regarding?
Jeff Iorg:Is it something that I'm willing to do and I have
Jeff Iorg:to weigh that over against the impact on so many other people? You know, it's one thing to take a risk if it only affects you or maybe just you and your family. It's a whole different issue when you're taking risk that involves so many more people. Now the purpose of this podcast today is to challenge you to take more
Jeff Iorg:risks. And so I really wanna underscore this.
Jeff Iorg:Just because the risk you're considering may impact large numbers of people doesn't mean you should not do it. It just means that you have to be, oh, so much more diligent in the decision making process before you get to that final moment of saying, we're going. We're getting out of the boat. So today, we've talked about risk taking in leadership. The problem for younger leaders is they can be haphazard in their decision making and take ill advised risks.
Jeff Iorg:The problem for older leaders, we can become so settled in our ways and so afraid of what it might cost us that we become risk averse and are unwilling to make the bold decisions that need to be made. Whether you're a young leader or an old
Jeff Iorg:leader, you have a responsibility when Jesus says come to get out of the boat. When Jesus calls you into the future, you gotta go. You can't be, as I told my daughter, one of the stand around girls,
Jeff Iorg:can't be on the sideline. Gotta get in the game.
Jeff Iorg:Gotta step into the arena. Gotta be the one who says, I'll take the shot, coach. I will make the decision to take the risk to move our lives, our family, our organization forward.
Jeff Iorg:Taking risk. Now when you do that, keep in mind what I said about these principles to help you think
Jeff Iorg:it
Jeff Iorg:through. First, reward and cost. Weigh those carefully. Second, foolhardy or wise. Think about it.
Jeff Iorg:Don't be foolish. Be insightful as you make these decisions. Third, risk can be mitigated by team decision. The timing, the methodology, the appropriateness. Man, if you and your wife or you and your husband are together on it or if you're in an organizational context, if your leadership team, if the people who make the decisions and you're ultimately accountable for them, if all of those folk are coming together, that's a good indication it might be time to take a big risk.
Jeff Iorg:And then remembering that you have to weigh all of this differently if it's a personal decision versus an organizational decision. God has given us as leaders the capacity to trust him to do things that have not yet been accomplished or to do things that have never been done the way we're considering them. To get there involves risk. You gotta get out of the boat. And yes, you might fail.
Jeff Iorg:Yes, you might lose focus on Jesus. Yes, you might have some sinking moments, but you are still the one who at least was willing to get out of the boat. So today, I want you to think about what it means to take risks, to take them by weighing reward and cost, by making sure they're wise, not foolish, by making them in the context of couples and teams that will help you to know when it's appropriate to take a big risk and to weigh them out personally and organizationally somewhat differently, but never letting risk aversion keep you from making a bold decision to go forward in your life personally personally or to lead your organization in a way that involves risk. Get out of the boat. You can do it as you lead on.