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Matt and Sean talk with Alec Watson (TechnologyConnections) about future tech, current trends and dead ends, and why dishwashers are so fascinating.
Matt and Sean talk with Alec Watson (TechnologyConnections) about future tech, current trends and dead ends, and why dishwashers are so fascinating.
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What is Still To Be Determined?
Join Matt Ferrell from the YouTube Channel, Undecided, and his brother Sean Ferrell as they discuss electric vehicles, renewable energy, smart technologies, and how they impact our lives. Still TBD continues the conversation from the Undecided YouTube channel.
Alec Watson: That's the sort of thing I'm really trying to consciously do, is just like, the world is wonderful and amazing, but, like, you gotta look at it, and you can't just let other people tell you what's interesting and what's not. And, like, I felt that we have this. I used to call it a crisis of curiosity. Now I'm not sure it's quite that. It might just be a crisis of, like, people ask a question, but then they don't ask themselves how they can find the answer to that question.
Sean Ferrell: Today on Still to Be Determined, we're talking about making connections. Welcome, everybody, to Still to be Determined. This is, of course, the podcast that follows up on Undecided with Matt Ferrell for the, let's see, 299th time. Holy cow. I am not Matt Ferrell. I am Sean Ferrell. I'm Matt's older brother. And with me, as always, is the aforementioned Matt. Matt, how are you doing today?
Matt Ferrell: I'm doing really well. I'm very excited for today's conversation Sean.
Sean Ferrell: Today's conversation is going to be a good one, and I'll tell you why. Because Matt and I are sick of talking to each other. So we brought in a special guest. We've brought in Alec Watson of Technology Connections. I'm going to provide a brief intro to who Alec is to everybody, but I am going to assume that most, if not all of you are already very familiar with Alec. Alec is, of course, Technology Connections, a channel on YouTube that has more than 3 million subs. He lives in the Chicago area and he takes basically a look at technology in our lives, where Matt takes a look at technology's changes and its impact on our lives moving forward. Alec's angle is much more. Where are you right now with that refrigerator or that coffee maker or how do these light bulbs work? What are you putting on your Christmas tree? And so we've all seen these videos. Matt and I had the opportunity to sit down and chat with Alec, and we're very, very excited to share that with you here. So we'll move on now to the conversation we had in which we talked about everything from solar panels to how videos get put together to what does he actually think about whether or not you should put stuff on the roof of your house? So on now to our conversation with Alec. Alec, thank you for being here with us.
Alec Watson: Thank you so much for having me.
Sean Ferrell: Yeah, I've been looking forward to this conversation because I really want to find out why is it that I have to screw in my light bulbs clockwise so Take it away, Alec.
Alec Watson: Well, I mean, are you aware that there are counterclockwise light bulbs?
Matt Ferrell: See, there are?
Sean Ferrell: That's why you're here.
Alec Watson: There are. They were designed primarily for hotels, so they had light sockets that were backwards and nobody could steal the light bulbs because they'd be useless at home.
Sean Ferrell: I absolutely love you. Love that. I love it so much.
Alec Watson: I mean, I'm not sure if that was the main reason backwards light bulbs existed, but like a lot of hotels to this day, they don't use Edison's crew bulbs. They use the GU10 base, so that way they're useless to guests.
Sean Ferrell: I think that's fantastic. Well, you've already.
Matt Ferrell: That's phenomenal.
Alec Watson: Yeah.
Sean Ferrell: We start before we started recording. Alec warned us. He comes into these blind. He doesn't want to do too much to try to load up the interview from a certain perspective. But there he goes. He's opened the door to the perfect starter conversation, which was Matt and I talked about inviting you to share your path to where you are now. What was it that brought you into the YouTube sphere? Because we know that you have a background in hotel and guest management. So based on your channel, you would say, here's somebody who has background in building these things, putting these things together. And yet that doesn't seem to be the case. Were you like, Matt, the person who took things apart when you were a kid, and you just like, I know how these things work now, but I don't need to go to school for it.
Alec Watson: A hundred percent. My mom tells a story that I was like three or four and one of my toys had the battery died and she brought. I said, I need a screwdriver. And she brought me a flathead screwdriver. I was like, no, mom, it needs to be a Phillips. And like, apparently I've just been like this my entire life, just taking stuff apart and figuring out what I need to do to get other things to do things. And, you know, I didn't really know how to turn that into a job, so I went into hotel management basically just because you gotta have a career of some sort. And it was my mom's suggestion, we just going by a hotel and asked if I thought about that. Cause I looked into engineering degrees and stuff, but. But that is so much more math than I want to be doing professionally.
Sean Ferrell: Right?
Matt Ferrell: Yeah. I reminded Sean yesterday when we were talking about the call today. Like when I was a kid, I was about 4, 5 years old, I took my mom's egg timer apart because I was really curious how it worked. I took the bell off the egg timer and I started taking all the gears out. I was fascinated by it. And then my mom came in the room and it was all laid out in front of me and I got in so much trouble. It was not supportive of like, oh, my curious son. It's like, you broke my egg timer.
Alec Watson: Yeah. Luckily I didn’t. With that, I had very supportive parents who would find things for me to take apart. And, you know, later on, the kind of. What really got everything started was I bought a broken jukebox on ebay. Like, I'm gonna. I bet I can fix this thing. And it took like, I bought this when I was in sixth grade. So what is that? You're 12. So, like, I didn't buy it. My parents bought it for me. But it took me a very long time to figure that out. But that was basically just like, this is what I need to do is just find broken things and fix them and explain how things work. And I don't know, it's my. My weird compulsion I turned into a YouTube channel. But I didn't expect this to happen. So I just went into hotel management as my. What I thought would be my career.
Sean Ferrell: What was the first thing that you were putting together as far as a project you were working on? You were like, I'm going to set up a camera and record this and talk about it and then put it up on YouTube. Do you even remember now?
Alec Watson: Well, I know. I know some of the projects that got my original channel, which is still there, but most of the videos have been unlisted because they're terrible. I remember some of those projects. They mostly involved terrible things that high school age children think are fun to do to cars. Um, so lots of blue LEDs in my past, but. Which is very funny because now I'm just like, I can't stand that we have blue LEDs on everything. I want that to be over.
Sean Ferrell: I saw that in your last Christmas light video.
Alec Watson: Oh, gosh, yes. It's so funny to me. That's a topic that a lot of people innately understand. There's something very different about Christmas lights now, but they don't really have the vocabulary to explain what it is and why it bothers them. And so basically I was just like, I guess somebody needed to make some videos and explain to people it is fundamentally different how the light is being produced, and that's why it looks wrong.
Sean Ferrell: Yeah. You've become part of my annual Christmas tradition. We put up the tree and then, and I'm like, I'm gonna go see what we have to say about Christmas lights this year.
Alec Watson: Well, listen, I don't know how much longer it can keep being a thing if the industry keeps fixing itself as it seems to slowly be doing. But we'll see.
Matt Ferrell: You're having an impact. That's what I'll say.
Alec Watson: Yeah, a weird one, but I'm glad to have it.
Matt Ferrell: On that note, you actually have also had an impact on the EV industry, like with Hyundai with that video that you put out, like hammering about the way the tail lights.
Alec Watson: Well, if only I could get them to listen to me about manual battery preconditioning, because that's still not a thing. But yeah, that. I mean, I give a lot of credit to that to Consumer Reports because I don't think Hyundai was going to listen to me unless Consumer Reports picked up the video, which they did. But yes, I'm very proud that eventually I was like, this is a serious problem we need to fix. And one automaker actually fixed it. So that's really cool.
Matt Ferrell: Yeah, job well done on that one, by the way. I have the same exact car. And the manual, the manual preheating, it's driving me bonkers this past winter, it's like.
Alec Watson: So you have a pre 25?
Matt Ferrell: Oh, I have a 25. It's like. But it doesn't do automatic preconditioning for when I go anywhere.
Alec Watson: Oh, no, no. I want manual battery preconditioning. I don't want my car. You have to use its navigation system. Its logic is terrible.
Matt Ferrell: But the button that they've put in there is hidden. It's like really hard to find. And then you can customize the screen to get it to a better place. And for some reason on my car, it will not remember it. It resets itself back to the original setup every time. So it's buried in a menu. I can't stand it.
Alec Watson: It's amazing because it's like, I really didn't think Hyundai was going to become gm, but they kind of seem like they are because it's like you're 90% there, guys. But there's this 10% you gotta really just sit down and fix, but you're just not doing it. So. Yeah.
Sean Ferrell: Is there a place where you've seen one of your videos have traction that you didn't anticipate? You know, other than the thing with the Hyundai incident, is there been something where you've been surprised at having had an impact or having gotten the attention you've received?
Alec Watson: The way I would answer that question is, it's not really about impact. Just I've been surprised at some videos for how popular they were. Just me thinking, there's no way anybody's gonna wanna watch this video. But then they do. As far as, like, real world impact, the thing that really frustrates me is my dishwasher videos have not really increased the number of people that are skeptical of the pods.
Matt Ferrell: That's me.
Alec Watson: Because, I mean, like, you still can't get anything that's not pods. I mean, you can, but it's really difficult. And I'm very proud of the work I did with Good Store to. I can't say to come up with a formulation, but to promote someone who did come up with the formulation just to prove that we can actually do this. It's just the profit margin isn't there. So they're not making them because they know. Because, like, seriously, that. That product, I've been testing it, you only need a teaspoon almost all the time. And it's just like they're selling you the pods because then they know you're getting 50 washes out of this. You're not going to stretch that out. But, you know, Midwesterners aren't in charge of anything anymore, which is a problem.
Matt Ferrell: The pathetic Midwesterner.
Sean Ferrell: Yeah. Given that our mother grew up in the Midwest, she grew up in Nebraska and Iowa, and so we grew up with that. So we're familiar with the, like, you don't need the flashy. Like. I think when you talk about the pods, the thing that went through my mind through that entire conversation was, how are you going to make the product you're promoting that you were talking about as pretty as a pod? Because that is doing the heavy lifting for the marketing right there. It's got that really swirl on it. It's different colors. It's easy to look at and say, ooh. It's not as sexy to say, like, do you have a teaspoon? Yeah, it's just not going to. It's just not going to get people lining up in the same way. And it's just so easy to say, like, here's a bucket full of pods and look how pretty they are when you open them up.
Alec Watson: I'm really trying consciously to, like, get more people to just be conscious of that kind of marketing and that not gonna, you know, judge you for preferring dishwasher pods. But, like, it's soap, it's a commodity product, and you don't like. One thing that really bugs me is like, why are. Why is Dishwasher detergent scented. Why you're not. Are you going to open up your dishwasher mid cycle to really get that lemon scent or are you just going to have the vague hint of lemon that you kind of get? It's just, you know, there's a lot of stuff like that that I'm very dissenting in.
Sean Ferrell: Dishwasher. Dishwasher pods is to me reminiscent of the fact that banana flavored candy doesn't taste like bananas do today. Oh, my God. It tastes like bananas used to. And it's just this kind of like, what's the point of. What's the point of calling this what you're calling it when it's not actually meeting a need that the lemon scented steam that comes out and hits you in the face, that's not a. That's not a pleasant experience.
Alec Watson: Yeah. And so it's just like, I don't know. I mean, I totally get putting scent in laundry detergent because, like, you'll smell that, but not dishwasher detergent.
Sean Ferrell: Just before we hit the record button on this, you mentioned and it landed right into one of the questions that Matt and I were wondering about. Is there a project that you've been working on where you're just like, I accidentally grabbed a tiger by the tail and it's in control of me. I'm not in control of it. And you kind of gave a hint that there's something you've been working on where it feels a little bit like that.
Alec Watson: Do you share any videos on this podcast? Because the thing I'm talking about is right over there.
Matt Ferrell: Yeah, sure.
Alec Watson: Okay, hold on one second. So I have this engine block and.
Matt Ferrell: Oh, my God,
Sean Ferrell: Suddenly this looks exactly like one of your episodes.
Alec Watson: Yeah.
Sean Ferrell: Where you're just pulling out a giant piece of metal.
Alec Watson: I mean, that's going to be the bit is I need to take this engine apart real quick and then here's the block. But there's just so much to talk about. And a lot of it is like, gearheads are not. And I wrote in this script, like, if you're a gearhead, you know all this, there's nothing here for you. I'm really like, honestly, the. One of the reasons I'm making these videos is because I want the layperson who doesn't think much about engines to be like, these are insane. Like, the fact that we're just used to this and we're. We're like, yeah, sure, it's fine. These are insane. If you actually, like, take one apart and you start looking at all of this stuff has to work perfectly or the engine will kill itself. Which is the, you know the hook I have for this video which is the. If there's one light on your dashboard you should never ever, ever ignore, it's the oil pressure warning light. So. But it's basically just been like, I have so much stuff I would like to discuss and really the ulterior motive for a lot of it is basically just like, this is crazy, we're used to it, which is why it doesn't feel crazy, but it's crazy and maybe we should stop. But I'm not exactly, you know, saying that. Just basically like here's everything that's actually going on inside of an engine and maybe alternatives to it in any form are good. Yeah. EV or E bike or transit or walkable cities, anything. I don't want to pick a lane. Just it's nuts that we've been manufacturing millions of these things and we're all like, yeah, you turn the key and it goes. It's like it's a miracle that that works. It really is.
Matt Ferrell: We've gotten really good at it though. That's the thing.
Alec Watson: We got really good at it. And now we know how to make these things, but they're still crazy.
Sean Ferrell: So it's a little bit like what you and Matt are doing in your channels seems a little bit like a calling to public education. And do you feel that as a part of what energizes the work that you're doing? You of course have the light hearted stuff that's just like let's take a look at Christmas lights and these are simply ugly versus these that are very pretty. And there's that, there's that video, but then there are videos like the one you're putting together around like here's an ice engine. What is actually happening in here? Are you aware or the video you had about renewable energy in general, your long form video and where you explored the pushback against sustainable energy production. And it really feels like there's a kind of clarion call in that to say like hey everybody, wake up to, to these issues that are in your lives all around you, but you're not paying enough attention to them. Is that something you feel?
Alec Watson: Yeah, absolutely. That's a big, like every one of my videos has to have a point. And sometimes the point is just here's an interesting piece of old technology that we're going to look at and think about how we used to do things. And so the point there is very subtle because it's really just like, hey guys, a lot of progress happened. We should pay attention to that, learn the lessons or remember the lessons we have already learned and just remember that like humanity is really cool. We're doing a lot of cool stuff. But, but a lot of people just aren't thinking about a lot of stuff. And it's basically just like, I just, I made a video about the. On my second channel about the universe of energy attraction at Epcot and how it's kind of like we used to be a culture that was like, hey guys, we're going to build a theme park about learning stuff. And now we're just like, meh. And so like, I really am trying to, in a conscious way, I don't like the phrase, but really what I'm doing is tricking people into learning stuff. Just like, here's some, here's some brain Candy on your YouTubes. But it's not just candy. There's some nutrition here.
Matt Ferrell: It's a similar thing for me. It's, it's. I. That video where you talked about Epcot, I was a little, you know, 12 year old kid going to Epcot for the first time. It was my favorite park in the world. It was just, I just loved the learning aspect of it. And that's basically my motivation behind what I'm doing now. It's like I like exploring the context
Alec Watson: and there's so like, you know, I. Growing up in Chicagoland, the Museum of Science and Industry in Chicago is a fantastic place. If you've never been, I would highly recommend going. And it's just like that, that's the sort of thing I'm really trying to consciously do is just like, the world is wonderful and amazing, but like, you gotta look at it and you can't just let other people tell you what's, what's interesting and what's not. And like, I felt that we have this. I used to call it a crisis of curiosity. Now I'm not sure it's quite that. It might just be a crisis of like, people ask a question, but then they don't ask themselves how they can find the answer to that question. And this is a really weird thing that's been happening more and more lately. And a weird example I'll give off the cuff is that this ties back to a video that I made back in 2018 about LED traffic lights and how I think it was 2018, how there's so many people that were like, well, they can't melt the snow, so we shouldn't use them in snowy places. And it's like, I understand that impulse, but let's, you know, think about other ways we could solve that, because there's a lot of advantages to them. And so just the other day, I happened to notice that on a road near me, the red lenses, or the shroud over the red lenses of the traffic lights was suddenly really big and longer than the rest of them. And I was like, what's. What's going on with that? And then I finally stopped at a light at an angle, and I could see. And I had read about this in Japan. There's a big transparent cone on the front of the lens, and the shroud is designed to catch the wind so it throws snow off of there. I was like, oh, wow, cool. We're starting to get those here. And so I just posted on bluesky, and I got like, five questioners, like, no shade, if you happen to be listening to this.
But I got five people that were asking, why did they only do the red lights, though?
Sean Ferrell: Yeah.
Alec Watson: And I'm just like, let's think about it. Come on. Yeah, let's just think about it.
Matt Ferrell: Which one's gonna save lives?
Alec Watson: Which one's gonna save lives? Money isn't infinite. Like, yeah, there you go.
Sean Ferrell: Nobody ever yelled in a panic, oh, my God, go. It was not the. Well, just behind.
Matt Ferrell: If you live in the Boston and New York area, Sean, people act like that's true.
Alec Watson: That's true a little bit around here, too. But, yeah, that's just the sort of thing where I'm just like. I don't know. I'm just trying to really get more people to realize that, like, it's great to have to be curious about things, but, like, pull on the thread yourself.
Matt Ferrell: Yeah.
Alec Watson: And see what you can find, because there's so much stuff out there that's going to help you, but you gotta, you know, you. You gotta pull on those threads.
Matt Ferrell: I think that kind of dovetails into the. The renewable energy video that you put out recently where you basically described how, like, everybody's lying to you about this, and then you had your, like, last half hour. That was that tack on that you did. That's one of the reasons I reached out to you and said, could we talk on the podcast? Was because that video was. It was such a normal video for you for the first 2/3. Felt very much like a technology connections video. But of course, the final bit was completely different from anything you've ever done before. Talked politics a little bit, which you've never done before. I don't talk politics on my channel. Very deliberate reasons why I don't. I'm curious what made you feel like this was the time that you had to kind of break and do something different?
Alec Watson: Well, I can identify the moment which was when we did whatever we did in Venezuela. Who knows what we're calling that. But when that happened I was basically just like we. I have got. Because like now at this point I am basically not using petroleum at all. I have my two. Well, the cube is for video making, but I do have my stupid the Nissan Figaro which I drive. I think I probably fill it up twice a year at the most, but otherwise it's just like I don't use petroleum products. And it's like we are at a point where it is possible to live your life without caring about oil at all. So why are we still doing this? And I mean, I know why, but basically just so many people are still stuck in a mindset of 30 years ago that like solar and wind are a one day future thing. And it's like, no, it's here now we just need to do it. So that was the moment that really was like, I'm so sick of what's happening, I'm just gonna start talking about it. But I started writing a script possibly the day after the last election, maybe the same day. And it was just titled like why I do this. And a lot of that script got reborn in that section on the end, which is just like, I am not trying to trick you, I am not trying to sell you anything. I just want you to be aware of what technology is around you, what the consequences are of burning stuff to live our lives and the fact that we no longer have to do that. But there's just constant, constant pushback when you say that. And I got just so sick of the fundamental disconnect of the people that say like, well, lithium's just going to become the new oil. It's just like I. Do you really. Is it just not clicking yet that we set fire to oil? Because like, and I had a number of people who were very flattering and said I'm so like they liked that I said disposable energy. Because nobody had framed it like that before.
I'm just like, I don't know why nobody framed it like that before, but I think it's because most people that are thinking about this sort of thing find that self explanatory, but a large amount of the population is just not thinking about that sort of thing. And so you gotta kind of just do what I did, which was kind of trick them and be like, this is a video which is about renewable energy and how good it is. And also, oh, by the way, there's a people that keep lying to you about this and here's who those people are. So yeah, that's why that happened. It was just basically, you know, pent up frustration and then like, are we really doing this? And you know, now with the war in Iran, it's just like, oh yeah,
Matt Ferrell: it's clear as day right now what's happening.
Alec Watson: If only we'll remember that's the problem. So we gotta, you know, we just gotta talk to each other and be like, remember this is why we're doing this. Because our current energy system is incredibly precarious and it doesn't have to be, but we need to do work to do that.
Sean Ferrell: One of the things that came up in your video was talking about what you can do as an individual versus what we can do as a society and the personal responsibility to listen to sources that are providing actual factual information, digest that, push our politicians and our representatives in those directions to double down on the truthiness of things. And then there's another side of it which I think is the side that Matt and I most often come to these conversations from, which is what can you as an individual do in your lived experience like electric vehicles or the sources of your electrical power in your home and stuff like that. Matt has solar panels on his house. You have said solar panels in your home may be doing a counter, they may be pushing against what would be a commercial scale solarization so that you, your sources of power by design are, I'm not going to do it on my own roof, I'm going to do it this way because this way encourages the for profit energy industry to move that direction. So I wanted to invite you to talk a little bit about these trends and what you see as far as, is there a tipping point that you can see in the future of mass scale energy production? In that, in that vein, is there the opportunity and do you see it in your own research and in your lived experience where you're seeing the growth of that kind of corporate, yeah, we're following the dollars, but we're doing something that's more morally defensible as opposed to saying, well people, you're on your own, you got to start putting panels on your roof.
Alec Watson: The thing I said without saying it was I think we need to nationalize the power grade. But like, fat chance that's going to happen anytime soon. No. So my take on rooftop solar is basically just a lot of it comes from the fact that I follow a lot of voices in the urbanist community. And when we look at the kind of sustainability that those folks are really moving towards, it kind of precludes the idea of rooftop solar altogether. And that's why I'm kind of just like rooftop solar kind of does move against our need to build densely because in order to have self sufficiency you need to have more sprawl. Basically. I just like there's so many issues that we open up by promoting rooftop solar. And that's my frustration is that it's a really good idea, but it ends up being like, well, can you buy your way out of a power bill? Well, that's only going to happen, you know, only people wealthy enough to purchase their own photovoltaic systems are going to be able to do that. And then I'm genuinely worried that like we're going to have a point where the power grid becomes something that people would rather not connect to. Because the way that we have created these billing structures to compensate private individuals for purchasing their own photovoltaic arrays just does not smell very fair to me at all. And I know that there are some countries that are doing a pretty good job at this, like Australia. But I'm still, I have to admit, I'm still very skeptical that the idea of turning consumers into producers is logistically sustainable.
Matt Ferrell: I actually have a video that I'm working on right now that's going to be addressing some of this. I've spoken to people in the industry, like gentleman named Carl Rubago who worked for utilities and he worked on the other side as well. He's done advising for like corporations as well as utilities regulations and he's a huge believer in residential solar and more of a. There's a phrase called Internetification of our grid.
Alec Watson: Yeah, yeah, I've heard a lot about this.
Matt Ferrell: Yeah. Where it distributes. It distributes it in a completely different way and I'm a big believer of that. Solar panels have unlocked something that has never existed before. We can make our own energy. Like we don't have to rely on a gigantic nuclear power plant to distribute for an entire region. We can distribute that everywhere and you can have your cake and eat it too. Like here in New England and Vermont, there's Green Mountain Power, I think it's, it's called where they provided batteries to people's homes and it's used as a virtual power plant for the,
Alec Watson: that I'm like I can totally see that working.
Sean Ferrell: Right.
Matt Ferrell: But it's the same thing for. It's the same thing for solar, though. They can do the same exact thing,
Alec Watson: except a ton of people don't have the agency or the space or anything to put solar panels on their roof. And that's why I'm like, I don't. People who are very gung ho about it tend to live in the suburbs. They tend to drive electric cars. They tend to be doing a whole bunch of things that, like, are better than our life now. But I don't know, I mean, I live in the suburbs. I don't really want to live in the dense city. But like, I'm more aware of the fact that like, okay, great, my neighbor can buy a bunch of solar panels and disconnect from the power grid, but then that doesn't help the people living in Humboldt Park. So it's, you know, I mean, that's
Matt Ferrell: the thing where I kind of disagree with you a little bit because I. I'm not seeing that trend. People that are getting solar are still grid connected. They're still tied into the grid.
Alec Watson: Oh, oh, yeah, yeah. To be clear. But I'm saying that those people need to have some form of compensation to make that worthwhile for them. And I really don't know how we are going to make it such that it isn't just a wealth transfer towards people who can buy their own solar panels. I'll admit that that's a pretty lefty take of mine, but that's the reason why it is what it is.
Matt Ferrell: Right? Well, that's the thing. It's like, the more reading I've been doing this, there are ways to get there. There are 100% ways to get there. And it's. For me, it's not a. Yeah, it's not an either or. It's like a little bit of everything is kind of the way I look at it.
Alec Watson: I agree with that. Except we do not have a very good handle on policy right now. No, no, we do not.
Matt Ferrell: No, no, we don't. No, we don't.
Alec Watson: And so that's why I'm kind of like my Midwestern thing of like, you already have wires that are already in your house. The most important thing we should be doing is getting your everything on those wires. And potentially rooftop solar will be a way to avoid some of the grid upgrades that that would require. And that's something that I am interested in. But I'm also just kind of like, I don't know, the math doesn't math right in my head right now. And that's the main reason why I don't push people towards installing our rooftop unless they want to. Like, I'm not going to say don't do it.
Matt Ferrell: Yeah.
Alec Watson: But it's just. And I should also say, like, I opened that video with. I'm not trying to sell you anything. Because every single time I have ever talked about renewable energy, people say, well, I can't install solar panels on my roof, or I can't afford solar panels. Or I've looked into this and I'm like, I don't care if you get solar or not. I just want you to realize we can do this. And you should stop listening to people who tell you we can't.
Matt Ferrell: I did the same exact thing. Every time I talk about my solar panels, I'm like, this is my situation. This is not your situation. It's going to vary depending on where you are. You have to do your own evaluation. I can't tell you if you should get solar or not. It's like, that's the first thing I always say.
Alec Watson: The technology itself is very simple, but the changes that it's going to make are very difficult. And that is something that I just am not. I'm not thrilled with how we're doing it right now. I'll just put it that way.
Matt Ferrell: Yeah, yeah.
Sean Ferrell: We're currently doing it in the mode of let's pretend we're not sick.
Alec Watson: Yeah, yeah.
Sean Ferrell: It's a little bit of just like I'm going to ignore these symptoms. I wake up in the morning and my hip is killing me, but I'm just going to continue to walk around and pretend I don't have to go to the doctor. So it's. It feels a little bit like that to me. One of the things that I enjoy most out of your channel are the deep dives into. Oh, you know that thing. You just bought a brand new one and it cost you 150 bucks. The one that used to cost 15 bucks back when you were a kid is doing the exact same thing. Something like a drip coffee maker. Now the drip coffee makers are coming out with good news, everybody. It's got AI in it. And. Okay, did I need that? So there's kind of like the one half of your content in which you're like, things are changing and they're changing in fundamental ways, and we can go in a whole new direction and really make a difference. And then there's the side of your channel which is you're not really getting improvements. You're Just getting a high price point. And some of the things that we've been making, like this little tiny coffee maker over here from 1978 is doing exactly what the 2026 coffee maker is doing. How do you balance out for yourself when you're contemplating things? You're going to talk about the line between sometimes progress is only the marketing side of it and sometimes progress is legitimately something we need to talk about and embrace. So what's your thought process around that?
Alec Watson: It's interesting because I haven't ever put this to words, but now that you've asked this question, I have a very good answer, which is, does it feel to me as though you're being tricked? And if it feels to me as if you're being tricked and you're being sold something as new, even though it's definitely not, I will very much try to, try to bring that to people's attention. And it's difficult because sometimes I run into this. So like something I've, I've had multiple conversations about this on social media where I'm basically like, why do you want your washing machine connected to the Internet?
Sean Ferrell: Right?
Alec Watson: And people, people will then say to me, well, it's nice because it lets me know the clothes are done. And I'm like, yeah, there's no other
Sean Ferrell: way to find out.
Alec Watson: There's no right. And I'm like, you have, you, you have a phone in your pocket. You could set a one hour timer and then as a reminder to go. But then like there's other people who hate when their appliances make noise. So I'm like, well it makes noise so you can hear that it's done, right? Like that's the reason it's there. But then they're like, I don't want it to make any noise. I'd rather have my smartphone do a thing.
Sean Ferrell: I would rather have a second house with all of my appliances and then Internet connectivity to those appliances to let me know when I need to go next door.
Alec Watson: Yeah, yeah. And like that's. So I don't necessarily feel as though that's a trick. I just feel as though like a lot of people are sold solutions to problems that they don't actually have or that they don't realize they could solve themselves, themselves with a tool they already have. So that's like, that's a big part of it is basically just like, I don't want people to waste their money. And like one of the things that I, a lesson that I learned very early on is basically just like, you're going to buy a lot of new gadgets and some of them are going to really disappoint you. So why don't you just wait until you actually have a problem. Right.
Sean Ferrell: Yeah.
Alec Watson: And then you look for a solution to that problem.
Sean Ferrell: Does that mean you've got a third channel on the way that's going to be called Tricksnology Connections?
Alec Watson: I, I doubt it. I doubt it.
Sean Ferrell: What's the thing that you've bought that you have six days later been like, oh boy, did they really get me?
Alec Watson: Well, I'd have to like, as far as something in my personal life, I'd have to give that my thought. But the freeze dryer is absolutely that.
Sean Ferrell: Oh, that one. If you had started a three season long deep dive drama around.
Matt Ferrell: Yeah.
Sean Ferrell: That I would have watched every episode with gusto. Because watching you eat freeze dried food that never should have been freeze dried watching.
Alec Watson: Yeah.
Matt Ferrell: I mean it was amazing.
Alec Watson: I mean that, that's like. But the thing is that's the most fun you can have with one of those machines. Otherwise. Oh my God, there's such a pain in the butt. But there's this big influencer campaign that like there's multiple companies that make freeze dryers. So who knows how this actually got started. But there's a ton of influencers like you know, homesteaders and preppers and stuff who've just like, oh, you should have a freeze dryer. Like, you're not being honest about what people are signing up for if they buy one of these things because it's a pain in the butt.
Sean Ferrell: And like, good news, now you've got some place to put that 60 pounds of venison. Like, no thank you.
Alec Watson: Yeah, well, and like I live in Brooklyn.
Sean Ferrell: I'm not getting, I'm not getting a, I'm not getting any of those anytime soon.
Alec Watson: Yeah. It's just so like that's a, that's a perfect example of something that like in general, I think people, you know, there's something that I've heard multiple people say now where it's like, there's too much money in the world right now. And there's, there's some people that are just like, I'll just blow three grand on this freeze dryer and think nothing of it. And I'm just like, you know, this is terrible. Unless you have an. And you know, like I'm starting to see more and more freeze dried candy appear on, on shelves and stuff. And they all seem to be made from like small mom and pop operations. I'm like, is, I bet It's a bunch of people that bought 10 or 12 of those freeze dryers and they've just created their. And I'm like, cool. That's a cool entrepreneurial business. But like, unless. And I know someone who has like, really, really severe food allergies and a freeze dryer is useful for doing, like, packing food for traveling and stuff. But the general purpose or the general, average person has no legitimate use for a freeze dryer unless they want to have fun with it. So. And I'm not having any more fun with it because it's such a pain in the butt. Like, I'm actually kind of. Costco is selling them now, and I'm kind of a little annoyed at Costco for selling them because I don't. Don't take this seriously. This is. This is just a very expensive toy that makes a lot of noise and uses a lot of energy.
Matt Ferrell: So there's a thing like buying things you don't need. There was a company that sent me, I'm not going to name who they were, but they sent me a robot snowblower for your driveway. They sent it to me saying, hey, we want to check this out. And I was like, sure, why not? It was the worst thing I've ever tried out. It made me furious every time I tried to use it. And it got so much attention from UPS drivers who'd be delivering something to the house and they'd be like, what is that? Is that a robot snowblower? Do you like it? How much was it? I'm like, you do not want to buy this. This is like the worst thing ever. Don't buy it. Don't buy it. It's amazing how much. And the thing costs like five.
Sean Ferrell: Five grand.
Matt Ferrell: It's like, I can't believe people are.
Alec Watson: Well, actually. Okay, so I have a snowblower. Hot take, actually, which is. It's actually not about snowblowers. It's about. It's the exact same thing. People buying. Buying stuff just in case. And so, like here, here in Chicagoland. I mean, lately we don't seem to get that much snow anymore. I wonder why.
Sean Ferrell: But certainly not because they're lying to you.
Alec Watson: Yeah. So I'm sure everything's fine. But like, you know, it is pretty rare that we get more than 8 inches of snow at a time. And so, like growing up, my mom and dad, because they're sensible Midwesterners, just bought a single. You know the difference between a single stage and a two stage snowblower? They just bought a single stage. One And I remember I made a video on my second channel just about whether stable actually works or not. Which it looks like Project Farm did a video on. It does seem like it works. But anyway, I got so many comments. They're like, that's not a real snowblower. You need a two stage one. And I'm like, no, what you gotta do. Okay, look, if you know you're gonna get two feet of snow, you do the driveway multiple times. You just don't like more power to you. If you want to spend an extra fifteen hundred dollars on this snowblower so you can wait until the snow is done and then go out there and do it once. But I would rather save $1,500 and just do it. And honestly, every single time I've seen someone using one of those big two stage machines, they're just like crawling along. Whereas with my single stage I've always just like I'm just going down the drive. So I'm just like people, so many people think like I have the better one and then they don't do any actual analysis of whether they needed that thing. And I'm still. That's like my whole personality is like figure out what you actually need and then maybe go a little bit beyond that. But don't go crazy.
Sean Ferrell: The flip side of that question is is there a thing that you are stunned is not more widely popular when you're like it does what it says it's supposed to do and it does it. Well, I don't get why this thing isn't what everybody's going for.
Alec Watson: That's huh. I can't pick. So nothing comes to mind immediately.
Matt Ferrell: I've got one that you've talked about.
Alec Watson: Okay, well then what was that?
Matt Ferrell: Induction cooktops.
Alec Watson: Oh. Oh yeah. Except. Well, except the problem is I'm so Midwestern that I, I'm fine without induction. I'm fine with conventional electric stoves. But yes, induction is a, is a wonderful example of like we've had this real. We've had this better than both technology for close to 50 years now if you count what was going on in Europe. And we're just like eh, this is king. I just installed a 120 volt heat pump water heater at home. That's going to be a video in July. But I'm waiting. This is going to be like bit spoilery but there's going to be a switcheroo which is like oh, that's why I installed it in February. Because everybody like I, it's exactly what happened I knew I would have a hard time finding a plumber that would want to install this because they're like, why do you want this? I'm like, because it's cool.
Matt Ferrell: And heat pumps rock.
Alec Watson: And also, like, I live in the exact situation where someone would say, why do you want this? Because I live in a townhome. I don't have a basement. It's in a utility closet that's part of my living space. And I live in the Midwest where it gets very cold. And so I'm like, But I bet it's not really that big of a deal. And it's totally not. It's totally not that big of a deal.
Matt Ferrell: No, I get that too. With mine, people are like, it makes the space colder. I'm like, okay, yeah.
Alec Watson: And like, I think the lowest it makes the room, it's in about 5 degrees cooler after it's been running for a couple hours. Which brand?
Matt Ferrell: This is going to be a tangent, but which brand did you get?
Alec Watson: Okay. I went with the A.O. Smith one because it actually is a hybrid and the collars for ducting the intake and exhaust are much more useful than any of the other models.
Matt Ferrell: Okay.
Alec Watson: So. But I know it doesn't seem to be the most reliable, so I'm taking a bit of a gamble on it.
Sean Ferrell: Yeah.
Matt Ferrell: Because I have a Rheem. And the thing that drives me nuts about the Rheem is like, in the app, when you're. You can configure. Configure it in different ways. There's an energy saver mode that anytime I open the app at the top screaming red banner, put it into energy saver mode. I have it in heat pump only mode and it keeps screaming at me to put it in energy saver mode. And I find this infuriating because I did a test. I ran. I ran it as energy saver for a little bit and I ran it for heat pump only. And I've gone back and forth and done an analysis. It uses more energy. Energy Saver uses more energy than the heat pump mode.
Alec Watson: I'm not, I'm not surprised. I think what they're really. What they're really doing is they're calling Energy Saver, like the default cycle. And, and, yeah, like, so the one that I got, because it has. It's a plugin with resistive elements, so they're only 900 watts. But also, that's another point I wanted to make was like, why does nobody just sell a 120 volt water heater? Like, if you're okay. With the recovery time being 10 hours, why can't I just buy that? Because like if you have a 65 gallon tank of hot water and it's gonna take 10 hours to get hot, if you run out of water, out of hot water, that doesn't matter when you don't run out of hot water all the time. So I find it very frustrating that nobody was just selling a 1 kilo, you know, just a big water heater, but with 1 kilowatt heating elements. Yeah, well, A.O. Smith kind of does. So I'm going to play around with that.
Sean Ferrell: So what do you have coming up that you'd be able to share some teasers on? You already talked about potentially in July having a heat pump video. But do you have other things in the pipeline right now that you'll. That you would be willing to share with us here?
Alec Watson: You know, I'm going down a bit of a personal rabbit hole with. It is related to clean tech. Old CFLs. I'm starting to buy old CFLs on eBay because I'm starting to get a little fascinated about the history of how they were developed. And a video might end up coming out of the works of that. But like I found some weird old ones from the days before we really figured out how to make them. Well, but what. The reason why I went down this rabbit hole was because I remembered there was an 11 watt IKEA weird tubular bulb that I remember from my childhood. And I was like, that light had a better. It was more convincing like incandescent light than most other CFLs that I remember. So I just started going down this rabbit hole to track them down and try to figure out like how did the phosphor formulations change over the years? That may happen, but I don't know. It's a. It's a little navel gaze-y. Silly. But it is interesting finding some of the original packaging and seeing the things that they used to market these for. Like this will save however many pounds of coal or gallons of oil and stuff. But otherwise it's. It's the stupid engine videos and that's. That was gonna be. I was really hopeful that I could have shot the talking head on Wednesday, yesterday as we record this. But no, that didn't work.
Sean Ferrell: How long from inception to conclusion does your video process take? It's. I know that I've talked to Matt about that and it's a lot longer than people would.
Matt Ferrell: Longer than people realize. Yeah, say that.
Alec Watson: Oh yeah. So I have the video production part down to such a process that once I have a finished script, it is rare that it takes me more than three or four days to actually finish the video. But the script part is what. Is what takes forever. And in this case, it's basically just there's so many different forks in the road that you could choose to take. And I just, you know, I've been going through the script and being like, well, I need to. Right, I need to say that. But then that changes the, you know, the flow up. And so this one's just been quite frustrating. So I finally, you know, I finally found, like, this is a good hook, this is a good narrative. But then when it comes to, like, okay, we're talking about an inline four cylinder. Should I mention V engines and the fact that, like, this is. This is probably the most common type of engine in a car, but they're not all like this. So there's other ones. Do you know what a V8 means? But, you know, so that was in the script and then got removed. But now I'm like, should I put that back? So, yeah,
Matt Ferrell: I was going to ask you, like, how do you thread the needle of. Because I'm always struggling with this. Of, like, how much to put in and what to cut out. It's like, for me, it's like there's a narrative flow I try to hit in every video, but I could go down to five different tangents and it would make the video from 20 minutes to an hour. And it's like. And if it's an hour, it might be boring to people, but if it's, you know, too short, people are going to be going. But what about in the comments
Alec Watson: I was going to ask, do you. You also bristle at. You forgot to talk about. Which is my. Oh, it's like, oh, that's my least favorite comment. Because it's usually. No, I chose not to talk about this, actually, because there's not enough time. So, yeah, it really is just like, you know, sometimes if it's funny enough as a bit, I will go on layered tangents. But, like, if I feel it's distracting, I might just cut it. And I. I don't know whether I want to cut the V engine or not, because it is, you know, with the point when I'm getting to demonstrating the crankshaft, it's like, well, you could put two pistons on the same bearing and have them point in opposite directions. That's what a V engine is. But it's also, like, it's not really important to the topic. So I don't know, I haven't decided.
Sean Ferrell: It doesn't change the argument. Yeah, yeah. Is there a sweet spot for you as far as like video length? Like are you, do you aim for a consistent goal in that regard or is it just once you're done with that topic? The video is what it is used
Alec Watson: to have a consistent goal, but I've blown past it so consistently that now I just don't care. Right.
Matt Ferrell: What was it, what was your goal
Alec Watson: that you tried 20 to 30 minutes but then it was like, well now they're all regularly like 40. So.
Matt Ferrell: Yeah, but people watch them.
Alec Watson: So I guess just. And so the script right now I just did a read through, it's about 35 minutes. And so I'm like, I have, I could, I could push that in there. But like it's kind of, you know, by the time I get back to the like here's why the oil pressure light is so important. We're like 20 minutes into exploring all the parts of the engine. So it's kind of like, I feel like that's a really long wait. But yeah, we'll see.
Matt Ferrell: I've been struggling with it. It's like back long time ago it was like 15 minutes. I was trying to target 15 minutes and then my videos started to get to 20. Now they're getting up to like 25 at times. And so it's like I keep creeping up longer and longer because there's topics getting more and more complex. But at the same time I am riveted watching you talk about Dishwashers for like 45 minutes. It's like it's riveting television.
Alec Watson: Yeah. I mean, thank you so much. I, I don't, I don't know what I'm doing, but I did, you know, that's like, that's part of why I made the renewable energy video as I did because it's like I do have some sort of talent to hold people's attention. So why not use it for good and then slap some of the people that haven't really been paying attention.
Matt Ferrell: How was the audience reaction to that video?
Alec Watson: Oh man, I was so worried putting it out there because I was, you know, I, when I committed to it, I put on my Patreon and said, hey, I just want you all to know I'm going to do this. If that makes you upset, you are more than welcome to leave, but I'm going to do this. And I had a few angry and I mean like I knew my Patreon is largely going to be self selecting so But I still expected probably losing a few dozen patrons at least. But I only had a few cranky people in the comments. And then when I released it publicly, I had a. One of my Patreon members suggested setting the video to only allow comments to people who have been subscribed for a week, which, honestly, I didn't realize you could do that.
Matt Ferrell: I didn't know you could do that.
Alec Watson: Yeah, it's.
Matt Ferrell: Oh my God.
Alec Watson: It's pretty deep in the layers, but you can. Per video, you can do different. Not monetization, moderation settings. And so Chloe suggested that, and I was like, that's a really good idea. And so the comments are way less toxic than they would normally be. But Likes Dislikes is still sitting at like 95%, which is so much higher than I was expecting. And I just crossed 3 million subscribers when I released that video. So I was like, let's see how quickly I end up going below 3. But I did not lose any. I mean, I did, but there were enough new subscribers that I'm still net positive. So I was pretty scared of releasing that video. But I was just like, you know what? Screw it. Things are falling apart so fast that if I end up alienating half my audience, that's worth it. But it ended up just not being the case.
Sean Ferrell: Well, you mentioned self selection, and I think that's an important thing for all of us to remember. Anybody in any kind of creative space, and you know, you are definitely in that space to remember that you can't live artificially in order to maintain audience, you have to be genuine to who you are and listen to the call of why you're doing what you're doing. And it seems like you may have become an inadvertent YouTuber kind of like backed into the space with like, I do these things and I make these things and I'm sharing these things. And then suddenly you realize people are listening to what you have to say in a way that maybe wasn't your first intention, but you found yourself there with that opportunity. I'm wondering, was there a moment for you where you. Where that kind of thing came online for you, where you were suddenly, like you said of yourself, I have the ability for people to pay attention to me. Was there a moment where that kind of clicked and you said, I have something here that I am doing? Or is that something you've always had in you? Have you always known of yourself that when it comes to this kind of public education or even just conversing with an individual, you're like, people trust me when I tell them the things I tell them.
Alec Watson: You know, looking back on, like, when I was growing up, I certainly did not believe I had any sort of unique ability in this regard. In fact, I think I would describe myself as frustrated that I could not convey why my particular fascinations were so fascinating to me, to other people. I just came to a realization, which is that I am a professional show and tell person.
Sean Ferrell: What a perfect frame that is.
Matt Ferrell: Yet it is.
Sean Ferrell: That's the perfect frame. That's amazing.
Alec Watson: Yep. And I'm like, I didn't know you could make show and tell into a job, but you can. You gotta be very lucky, but you can do it.
Sean Ferrell: That's great.
Alec Watson: And it was the moment when I realized I do have a talent was it wasn't, you know, just watching the success of my, of my channel. It really was the video on the red fridge that got so out of hand with the scripting. And I was just like, no one's gonna watch this stupid thing. And yet I think the video's sitting over 2 million views at this point. And so I was like, okay, people will watch my stuff no matter what it is. Yeah. So maybe I should start leveraging that a little bit.
Matt Ferrell: Does it carry a weight for you as well that you're more cautious about what you say? Because, you know.
Alec Watson: Absolutely. Yeah. It's its own kind of trap because I'm kind of pigeonholing myself a little bit. And then what happens to all YouTube creators is our standards, Like, I try to fight real, really hard against this. And there are some ways where I deliberately do not follow best practices, because I feel like everybody on YouTube just follows best practices and everything starts to look the same. So there's some reasons I deliberately do not do that.
Sean Ferrell: It boils down to leaning into the authenticity of who you are and the voice you have. And then, ironically, it's that very authenticity that continues to feed you the audience that you do. So I'm not gonna walk. The walk that everybody else is walking is exactly why people are paying attention to you. And I think that there's a lot of. You should be proud of that for yourself. I think that that's a. It seems like instinct brought you there, and that was a very good instinct. So, you know, hat tip to you for having had those instincts that got you where you are.
Alec Watson: Well, thank you. I appreciate that. I don't get a lot of real feedback, so when I get it, it's very nice.
Matt Ferrell: That's like par for the course for a YouTuber. It's like I'm talking into a. A camera, and it's like, is anybody. Like, is this thing on? Is anybody listening to this stuff? And then you meet somebody in the real world, and it's like, oh, okay, I am having some kind of impact.
Alec Watson: Yeah. And now it's. It's really weird in my position because it's like, I don't. You know, so the. The costume, whatever you'd call that I wear on video, like, ended up being an accidental stroke of genius because in public I look so different that I. I rarely get recognized. Like, it's maybe quarterly. It's very surprising to me because, like, other people, I know that I've spent time with them, it's just they're getting recognized constantly. But there have been two, actually four occasions, if you count at conferences where I have been talking to someone and then I explained what I do and then say, oh, yeah, you might have seen some videos about dishwashers. And then they immediately remember who I
Sean Ferrell: am, as opposed to, like, a Hank Green. Hank Green's never not going to be Hank Green.
Alec Watson: Yeah. Yeah. So, like, I am so happy I stumbled into that because it means I can live a fairly normal life. But it also, you know, like, just today, before we recorded the podcast, the fire department showed up at the office to do an inspection, and I was just kind of like, oh, great. Because everything here is just. There's an engine that's taken apart on the desk, and there's just. There's a whole bunch of crap everywhere. And I'm like, well, come on in, guys. And then they're like, so. So what do you do here? And I'm like, oh, I'm a YouTuber. And. And so, yeah, that. That part of life has been really weird.
Sean Ferrell: They get back into the truck and they give each other looks, and they're just like, yeah, he's a YouTuber.
Alec Watson: Yeah.
Sean Ferrell: Okay.
Alec Watson: Yeah.
Sean Ferrell: For myself, I just want to say thank you. This has been a great conversation. I really appreciate you taking the time to join us.
Alec Watson: Oh, you're very welcome. I like what you're doing with Undecided. It's good to. It's kind of one of my main news sources for clean tech. Well, just. Just because, like, I mean, other social media, too, but, like, you know, it's. It's curated, which is what we need these days. We need humans deciding what's important and, you know, humans directing our attention and not just machines. Hopefully. Hopefully we get to a point where people appreciate that more.
Matt Ferrell: Yeah. Something tells me, it's going the opposite direction.
Alec Watson: Yeah, right. For, for now. For now. But I, I do think we're getting. There's an increasing awareness of like, this is not doing what it says it's supposed to do. So we'll see.
Sean Ferrell: Yeah. Huge thank you. And we will, if anybody sends us any kinds of questions that we think would be valuable for you to hear and maybe get your feedback on, we'll reach out. But otherwise, just thank you so much. Yeah.
Alec Watson: And if there's enough questions to do another episode, I'd be happy to.
Sean Ferrell: So our thanks once again to Alec for joining us and to all of our viewers and listeners. Was there anything in that conversation that you're like, darn it, why didn't they ask him that? Because we are, of course, Matt and I are more than willing to reach out to Alec if there's follow up conversations that need to happen. So we will once again hunt him down, stuff him in a bag, tie him to a chair and force him to talk to us. That's not really what happened. He was a very nice man and he was willing to sit down and talk to us on his own. So let us know in the comments what you thought about the conversation and what you thought deserves more exploration. As always, your comments do drive the content of this program and we look forward to reading what you have to say. But don't forget to like, subscribe and share with your friends. Those are all very easy ways for you to support this podcast. And if you'd like to support us more directly, you can go to StillTBD.fm and click the join button there. Or you can click the join button on YouTube both ways. Let you throw coins at our heads. We appreciate the welts. And then we get down to the heavy, heavy business, talking to very smart people about very interesting things. Thank you so much, everybody for taking the time to watch or listen. We'll talk to you next time.