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Released every Tuesday, the LOUNGE LIZARDS podcast helps listeners navigate the experience of finding and enjoying premium cigars (both Cuban and non-Cuban) and quality spirits. Episodes are normally around 90 minutes long and feature a variety of different topics including food, travel, life, sports and work.
The podcast features eight members: Rooster, Poobah, Gizmo, Senator, Pagoda, Chef Ricky, Grinder and Bam Bam.
This is not your typical cigar podcast. We’re a group of friends who love sharing cigars, whiskey and a good laugh.
Join us and become a card-carrying lounge lizard yourself! Email us at hello@loungelizardspod.com to join the conversation and be featured on an upcoming episode!
**Gizmo:** [00:00:00] Welcome to the Lounge Lizards podcast presented by Fabrica 5. It's so good to have you here. It's a leisure and lifestyle podcast founded on our love of premium cigars, as well as whiskey, travel, food, work, and whatever else we feel like getting into. My name is Gizmo. Tonight I'm joined by Rooster, Poobah, Senator, Pagoda, Grinder, and Bam Bam, a full house of lizards, and our plan is to smoke a cigar, drink some champagne, talk about life, and of course, have some laughs.
So take this as your 139th official invitation to join us and become a card carrying lounge lizard. Plan to meet us here once a week. We are going to smoke a Cupid cigar tonight, share our thoughts on it, and give you our formal lizard rating. We discussed the recent media blitz around Trinidad's 55th anniversary.
We dive into the long history of our champagne pairing and we share some more details on the new Habanos Aging program all among a variety of other things for the next 90 minutes. So sit back, get your favorite drink, light up a cigar and enjoy as we pair Ruin Art Brut Blanc de Blanc Champagne with Trinidad Esmeraldas.
A Robusto Extra tonight on The Pod from [00:01:00] Cuba. It's a beautiful cigar. The Trinidad Esmeralda. It's a 53 ring gauge cigar by five and three quarters inches long. And boys, we are celebrating the 55th anniversary of Trinidad here tonight. Oh my. Like everybody else. Maybe we're on the payroll.
**Bam Bam:** Uh, that's all you see is Trinidad promotion here.
Trinidad promotion there. Well, that's right. So Trinidad
**Gizmo:** is a Gemini. There you go. Trinidad's a Gemini.
**Bam Bam:** This cigar looks beautiful tonight.
**Gizmo:** I, so that, Bam, we were talking before we came on air. I, I know I've never had one of those and when I got these in, they. Have sat and have caught my eye going on three or four weeks now.
**Bam Bam:** Yeah,
**Gizmo:** I've been so excited to smoke this cigar It's
**Bam Bam:** beautiful. Nice toothy wrapper. Beautiful color and a pigtail first his favorite.
**Rooster:** Yeah, love that. Love the love the pigtail.
**Bam Bam:** It's
**Rooster:** gorgeous What's
**Poobah:** the ring
**Gizmo:** gauge on this? 53 Wow. 53. Factory name on this is a DeNorris. DeNorris.
**Bam Bam:** So here's a question. [00:02:00] Are you guys gonna do a pinch or a cut?
**Gizmo:** I'm gonna do a small cut.
**Bam Bam:** Me too. Personally. Alright.
**Gizmo:** Alright boys, let's cut this thing. See what we're getting on the cold draw on the wrapper?
**Bam Bam:** That's a beautiful cigar. Oh my lord. I barely took off anything and it's wide open. For me.
**Gizmo:** Is that unusual? That's wonderful. It's crazy.
**Bam Bam:** Same
**Senator:** exact thing for me.
**Gizmo:** I'm getting a little cinnamon on the cold draw. Me too. A little cinnamon cedar. Mm hmm. Mm hmm.
**Bam Bam:** Ton of cedar. I agree with that. Uh, more cinnamon than cedar for me.
**Gizmo:** That's really nice.
**Bam Bam:** And a dimple I think
**Gizmo:** we got here, huh? I do have a dimple on mine. Yeah, I do too. That's a great sign. Yes, it is. Yes, sir. All right, boys, let's light this thing.
The Trinidad Esmeralda from Cuba. Again, it's a Robusto Extra, an odd ring gauge, 53 by five and three quarters inches long. Again, the factory name is a DeNorris. [00:03:00]
**Bam Bam:** What's the year on these?
**Gizmo:** And the box code on these is BSM February, 2022. So these are a little over two years old now.
**Bam Bam:** And did we mention the price?
**Gizmo:** We did not. The price on these unfortunately is going through the roof and it's going to continue as
**Bam Bam:** like every other Trinidad
**Gizmo:** as Habanos relaunches the Trinidad brand right now because they're not selling.
**Senator:** I'm at a, I'm at a butane. Are you? Look at how long this is taking everyone to like this stick.
Jesus. It's a, it's
**Gizmo:** a,
**Senator:** it's
**Gizmo:** a, I'll say though, it's well worth it because that is amazing on the way.
Wow. It's like a dessert. You know what I'm getting? The first note that I'm getting is almost like a cream corn. Look at gizmo
**Bam Bam:** tonight. Well, it's, there's definitely the salty Cuban twang right off the bat. I think it's that salt that's making you, um, [00:04:00]
**Grinder:** I'm getting, I'm getting like a vanilla cream. That's
**Gizmo:** nice.
**Grinder:** Vanilla cream. Yeah.
**Gizmo:** Mine is very much like what you'd have, like, you know, like a corn casserole.
**Bam Bam:** Different cream.
**Gizmo:** Yeah, corn, cream corn.
**Bam Bam:** It does start off like most other Trinidad's. It's very subtle. It's not in your face flavor.
**Gizmo:** But it feels very complex. Boob is still working on getting his
**Bam Bam:** lit. Yeah, he'll join us at some point.
I'm
**Poobah:** taking my time here. I'm trying not to.
**Bam Bam:** You're putting a bead of weld on a piece of steel over there.
**Poobah:** No, it's, my lighter's a little low.
**Rooster:** You
**Bam Bam:** want to borrow mine?
**Pagoda:** In fact, you can borrow mine.
**Poobah:** Actually, I can light it up from here. It's not a soft flame.
**Pagoda:** Pagoda's got the torch, man. Right from here, zoom.
**Grinder:** For the listener, Pagoda has a massive welder's torch that it could probably light a cigar from across the room.
**Gizmo:** Can you light Poobah Cigar, please?
**Grinder:** Yeah, I'm trying. Shoot a shot across his bowel.
**Gizmo:** This is an [00:05:00] elegant cigar. Feels great in the hand. Have you retro'd yet? I have. Nice and Very, very smooth. It's creamy.
Creamy. Easy.
**Grinder:** Is any For some reason, it tastes a little Maybe it's just me. It tastes a little young.
**Gizmo:** No, no, that's just me. I feel like I'm, I'm tasting not aged tobacco, but it, it's, it seems like it's rounded out in its two years. I think there's
**Rooster:** a, maybe like a woody, woody flavor woodiness that you kind of, maybe I get, maybe
**Bam Bam:** that cinnamon's gone, but it's definitely a nice salty flavor for me.
**Poobah:** It, it, it reminds me of that kind of light cedar with a little bit of, of, of sweetness that you get when you light a visia. I don't know if you guys have had a visia. I have not. But, you know, easy. This is gonna build into something. You know, bigger, hopefully bigger and better than that.
**Bam Bam:** Jerry's out
**Poobah:** for me right now.
**Bam Bam:** It's pretty good. [00:06:00]
**Gizmo:** Oh, I think it's, this is off to a great start for me. Yeah, that's good. I think on
**Rooster:** the light, it's very good. It's like a
**Bam Bam:** little bit of a polarizing start. BEMS on sold.
**Poobah:** I
**Bam Bam:** do love the, see, I don't get the sweetness for me. It's salty, which I love. I love that. And, uh, the cinnamon's gone, which I wanted to experience a little longer, but it's good.
**Poobah:** Can't complain. It's creamy. I taste, I taste the Trinidad DNA in here. Yeah,
**Bam Bam:** that's true.
**Poobah:** I'm
**Grinder:** working on it. You're not loving it either. I'm not sold either. I, if you're not sold, I mean,
**Bam Bam:** you know, the colonialist that I've had, I can't count how many times I've had that cigar it's graham cracker and honey.
And yeah, dry fruit. I get all that in that cigar. I'm not getting. any of that here, but this is a good cigar.
**Senator:** I, I think I'm somewhere in between. I'm, I'm kind of on the fence in that there are notes that I'm liking about this. It is creamy, not getting as much youth, but I think that the amount of cinnamon, like maybe you're still getting that.
I, I [00:07:00] am. And I even twice, believe it or not, have, you know, inadvertently retro hailed, as I told you, I need
**Bam Bam:** to witness this to actually confirm your subconscious, your subconscious for
**Senator:** you, the sentiment really comes out on the lizard
**Bam Bam:** cam on his nose. I just want to make sure that a replay. Yes. Let's put me on the jumbo truck.
Senator's nose, right?
**Rooster:** I mean, I definitely get a, get a creaminess, a little bit of woodiness, and there's a spice. It could be a baking spice, like a nutmeg or cinnamon, like you say.
**Gizmo:** Really?
**Rooster:** You know, so far.
**Poobah:** I'm, I'm with you a hundred percent. I purged mine. That's a good idea. And that helped a little. It's a lot of smoke output, which is nice.
Yeah. Yeah. You would expect it for this range. Combustion's
**Gizmo:** really good. I don't know for me right now, this is off to a fantastic start. I'm very, very happy with the cigar right now. Oh, the aroma on that. You know, cause I've kind of, since we did, you [00:08:00] know, this is the third Trinidad we've done, like I said, we've done two others, did the Fundadoras and the Colonialis and we'll go through the line in a minute, but I will say since we did the Fundadoras episode, which is quite some time ago, I think it was episode 70.
This is episode 139, I think almost halfway through the journey. We did the Fundadoras, Fundadoras. I've kind of fallen out of love. With Trinidad as a marker.
**Bam Bam:** Same.
**Gizmo:** Uh, every time I've had a Trinidad since then, I've,
**Bam Bam:** I've felt disappointed. Except for the colonialists. Honestly, that's, that's a special. I think
**Gizmo:** I've only had one or two right after we did that episode, which is that's forever ago.
The colonialists. I
**Poobah:** think some of it has to do pricing, right? Thanks for exactly, exactly. Yeah. That's where I was going. I think some of it has to do with The with price, it's, it's so pleasant. It's so good. If, if it [00:09:00] wasn't, how much is this? 45 bucks.
**Gizmo:** So we got these for 40 from a friend. I think that if you're getting these in the open market, they're probably closer to 50 and, and actually as of the release of this episode.
Uh, early July here last week or the week before was the Habanos world days in London. A price increase just went into effect in early June. So what we're going to experience is probably a 15 to 20 percent increase in prices. We could talk about that. So you're, you know, really, you're probably in the 50 range at this point today.
**Poobah:** Exactly.
**Gizmo:** So, so
**Poobah:** like the Trinidad's that it's, it's when you go back pre COVID the prices were what?
**Gizmo:** 40 percent less. Yeah. I would say even less than that. These are, you could probably get one of these cigars for 22 to 25, right? This was a higher end Robusto extra, let's say for them, right. You know, kind of in line with the Cohibo.
So
**Poobah:** it's, it's, it's tough to, to disconnect the price point from the experience. I'm [00:10:00] going to try and do that and kind of smoke the cigar for what it is, but you can't ask for better, like, you know, everyone's got a great draw. Yeah. The, the construction, I mean, is fantastic. I
**Rooster:** mean, pricing is a factor. But especially in the funda doors, I think, yeah, well, the funda door is, you know, we used to buy boxes in the mid sixes and we all have three years ago.
**Bam Bam:** I can't speak for everyone, but most of us have two boxes of fundies and I'd like to sell all of mine. Yeah. I totally agree.
**Rooster:** I'll buy them back at the original price. I've,
**Poobah:** I've had, I sold you a
**Rooster:** box.
**Poobah:** Well, the thing is there's some, you run into draw issues with those sometimes, which is disappointing.
**Bam Bam:** Yeah.
Even with the draw issues. So no, no. I've never had a performance issue. They've always been perfect. That's just the flavor profile. It's not interesting. Really? Like that colonialists. I go back to that. That's really the most flavorful Trinidad. So here,
**Rooster:** let's make a deal. I'll give you the coloniales for the fundies.
**Bam Bam:** You give me four boxes of coloniales, you [00:11:00] can have my two boxes of fundies. I
**Poobah:** mean, I don't think it's, I don't see anything right now, like if this was blinded. I'm getting like some, I'm getting some baking spices out of this. If this was a blinded cigar and I didn't know what it was like, is it up in like maybe a little, is it like a hybrid of an upman and a Cohiba and a Cohiba kind of, you know what I'm saying?
Like, I think you're right on point.
**Senator:** I like that call out a lot. And I got to say, I've come around, I'm really enjoying this. It's damn good. I think for me. I similarly have fallen out of love a bit with Trinidad and I think the flavor profile has just become a little too mild or uninteresting really for my palate.
This has a really good amount of flavor. This like has a little bit of the Trinidad DNA, but then a lot more flavor than I'm used to that. I think Poobah's analogy of kind of the Upman and Cohiba hybrid that brings out like some [00:12:00] different interesting notes in this. I'm very impressed. I really like it.
**Bam Bam:** Yeah. You know, I'm only capturing the baking spice and some of the things you're mentioning through the retrohale for me. On the typical draw, I'm getting a little bit, and on the foot, the foot's very nice. The aroma's nice. Oh, it smells great. It does. To me, the typical draw, it's okay. But the retro is
**Grinder:** phenomenal.
I'm with, I'm with Bam Bam as well. The, the, the retro and the aroma is phenomenal. I'm not, I'm not getting much flavor on the palate though.
**Gizmo:** It's interesting. You guys are saying that I, I, I guess I'm feeling lucky over here. My, my cigar is really superb right now. Superb. I'm from the first one. I'm
**Poobah:** in lockstep with you and Senator.
I'm in lockstep. I, the. The, this start when we're just here, we just let it, what, five minutes ago, we're 10 minutes in, maybe I'm saying to myself, this is, this is, this is setting up pretty nice.
**Gizmo:** I agree. I think
**Poobah:** it's going to build. And I think it's going to be a multi kind of a multifaceted experience.[00:13:00]
Let's see if it presents, um, any rough edges down the stretch. But for me right now, like I've said before in the pod, like you're relaxing, you're in a lounge and like, I'm lighting this in a social, social situation and sharing it with someone. I'm pretty relaxed at this point.
**Senator:** I agree. And I think Gizmo early on when he took probably the first puff said, this is a really elegant cigar.
To me, this was with some champagne.
**Bam Bam:** Oh, home run. Hard to beat. So that's also with the Fundy. That's also very elegant. It smokes creamy and velvety. It has those, that element in it, but again, the flavor profile, I don't know. Bam. I put it on a platter.
**Senator:** I put it on a platter for you. It's some champagne. You, you were meant to, daddy's not biting on it
for the listener. I'm literally holding a bottle of champagne in my hand, waiting for someone to agree and say, let's open some champagne and bam. [00:14:00] You know, now that bam said it,
**Gizmo:** I'm in, let's do this.
**Poobah:** I think that this is going to be a wonderful pairing. I don't think I know.
**Gizmo:** So can I ask you a question?
**Senator:** Spillage. Senator hates spillage. Pagoda, did you back into a pole when you transported this year? No, no, no. Shake it up.
**Pagoda:** No, not at all. Hey, listen. A little bit, a little bit of the champagne has to come out. Just to present some bubbliness. Correct.
**Gizmo:** So while the guys are pouring champagne, I'll talk a little bit about the presentation of these cigars.
So they were released first in 2019. These cigars only come in semi buoyant nature boxes of 12 cigars. So like we said, at a 50 price point, you're probably paying between five and 600, maybe even more on, uh, on the gray market for a box of Esmeraldas. Unlike a lot of, you know, uh, famously. Unlike the Fondadoras, those come in 24 count boxes.
These have only ever been presented in 12 [00:15:00] count.
**Poobah:** The floral note, I'm getting a, are you getting that floral rooster? Yeah. A little bit of that floral note, um, is coming through for me now. It's it's really, it, it, it, it, it, it's presentation, uh, and flavor profile is very elegant. There's a floral note to it.
There's, there's some baking spices built in that we all know and kind of love that are a little bit up in the like, but it's got some of that depth, like a, like a, maybe a Cohiba has, um, I think it's. I think it's super.
**Rooster:** And I think in the up and you could make a comparison to the up and 46, like that spice that you get in the 46.
Yeah. That with a Cohiba, you know, Magnum
**Grinder:** 46.
**Rooster:** Yeah.
**Grinder:** Yeah. I'm, I'm getting some, uh, a more prominent wood as I'm coming along here. And it's like, uh, it's, it's not like a, Cedar. It's like an oaky wood. [00:16:00] It's definitely like an oaky.
**Rooster:** I agree. It's very well constructed. I mean the ashes, but, and the burn line's.
Very nice. Burn line is, yeah, sharp.
**Bam Bam:** I am getting a bit of a split in my wrapper here. Oh yeah, yeah. Same here. Yeah. I don't mind that though. I don't. That's not a flaw. I mean it is, but that's not something that bothers me. Right on the top.
**Poobah:** Yeah. I think, I think one, I do think that this needs to be, the wrapper is so delicate, you know, smoke it slow on this, that if you heat it up too much, you really need to be careful because you can tell the cigar was kept perfectly just based on the touch and When you talk, well, it's true.
And how can you tell that? It came out of Giz's humidor. But, um, but I've also had part of Giz's that have blown up in my face, like a bottle rocket from his humidor, um, uh, Lucy's. No, but, but, but it's been kept at it, but the rapper's so delicate that if you hurry it, [00:17:00] you can, you can risk. Doing some damage.
So I, I think it's one of these cigars that you need to kind of
**Bam Bam:** take your time with it, take
**Poobah:** your time with it a little bit. I think I'd probably, if you're too aggressive, I fell
**Bam Bam:** victim to that. I was going a little too quick. If you're
**Poobah:** going too quick, you can risk the rapper. So delicate, but
**Gizmo:** for the listener out there, you know, let's, let's put rapper and construction aside when you're picking up a 50, 60 Robusto extra from Cuba in your hand, this is a cigar that it has earned the, you know, it has earned your time.
Um, show it that respect, smoke it slowly. Oh yeah. You know, don't try to blow through this in an hour, hour, 10 minutes. You know, this is a cigar that deserves to be smoked slowly. It's an elegant, elegant cigar. It's presented beautifully. And it's just a classic Cuban, great
**Poobah:** Cuban flavor profile. It's not, it's not a Maduro.
It's not a, like a, it's not a Maduro that you just mall after a steak dinner. You know what I'm saying? Like, I'm going to mall this thing like an animal. Like he, I don't think you can approach it like [00:18:00] that.
**Gizmo:** So boys, let's talk about our champagne pairing tonight. Senator, what do we got? So we've got
**Senator:** a Pagoda brought us, uh, some, uh, ruin art Blanc to Blanc.
Blanc to Blanc. Wow. Wow.
**Bam Bam:** It looks beautiful. The bottle's pretty cool.
**Senator:** The bottle's always beautiful. They, they, they really, I feel like the last several years have marketed a lot more this brand. And believe it or not, I haven't drank much Ruenart at all. I think like maybe had it poured at like an event, but not something I could have focused on it and really even remember what I got out of it.
Um, so I'm excited to try this. Yeah.
**Gizmo:** Yeah. Let's take a sip. Cheers boys. Cheers. Cheers. To the Trinidad Esmeralda.
**Bam Bam:** This is quite delicious. It's pretty good. There's a sweetness there and a nice dry finish as well.
**Gizmo:** Oh, that's really nice. Yeah. Very. Nice classic champagne.
**Senator:** How much was this bottle, Pagoda? It's, uh, 85 bucks, a total wine. Wow. How many
**Bam Bam:** ounces in that, uh,
**Senator:** fluid
**Bam Bam:** ounce? Standard
**Senator:** bottle. Wow. [00:19:00] So here's a
**Gizmo:** question, Senator. Can you explain the outer packaging that's sitting on the floor beneath the bottle? Yeah, it's
**Senator:** actually really cool, so A lot of the champagne houses, particularly because people love to give champagne, they come up with their own kind of sleeves that will help keep the champagne colder for longer, because especially you take it out of the fridge, you go drive to someone's place, you transport it just coming down in temperature as you're getting there.
So usually they'll come up with like some kind of insulated sleeve that'll help keep the temperature better. So this one's interesting because usually like Vuclico has a thousand of these and it's usually like a neoprone sleeve or like some kind of, you know, material that's reusable. This one from a Ruinart, it says it's made of natural wood fibers sourced from responsibly managed European forests.
Uh, and it's entirely recyclable, the whole thing, but it looks nice. It looks pretty cool. Yeah. It doesn't look like it has any wood in it. If you feel it, it feels like, like a egg carton. Oh,
**Bam Bam:** cool. Interesting.
**Senator:** Pass [00:20:00] it around.
**Gizmo:** That's neat. Smart. I think this is a very good champagne. Very nice. It's
**Bam Bam:** delicious.
Honestly. But I would probably have this like an after dinner thing for me. Because it's very sweet.
**Gizmo:** Yeah. It's not. Yeah. It's very sweet.
**Bam Bam:** Yeah.
**Gizmo:** How do you think it's pairing with the cigar? I love it.
**Grinder:** I think it's great. I think it's balancing the woodiness perfectly.
**Poobah:** Poobah? I think it's, I think it's terrific.
Um, I would, I would choose this over Vouv. I mean. Hell yeah. Hell yeah. Um, it's, it's not kind of like. Like, like, like, uh, the Veuve Clicquot, you know, as a, that's not pedestrian champagne, or maybe it is, but it's popular. It's like more aggressive with the sweet up front. And almost the dry it's like, and then it tries to present this dryness in the back of the pallet.
This is very, this is, I think this is more balanced. Um, it's certainly straightforward in its presentation and very, very [00:21:00] drinkable. Um,
**Senator:** I like it. I also, I'm sorry, I don't think it's very sweet. No? Um, to me there are fruit forward notes on the, uh, the front of the palette. So maybe I'm confusing that then.
I don't know. The finish to me is, it's got a lot of acidity. The groove is sweeter. No? So like, first we should talk about this bottle. It's the, the Blanc de Blanc I mentioned. Which, what that means is that most champagne, if it doesn't say Blanc de Blanc, is made from a mixture of white grapes and red wine grapes.
They just remove the skin on the red wine, uh, red wine grapes, which is why there's no red color in it. Um, a rosé champagne, they keep some of the skin to impart some of the color, so a Blanc de Blanc is a hundred percent from white to red. Grapes. It's like it literally means white from whites. Um, so usually with that, there tends to be a little more acidity.
Like there's acidity in, there's much more city in white wine than there is red wine. And so to me that comes through on the finish. I do agree. It's, it's [00:22:00] fruit forward. On the front of your palate, but I do think the finish, like I would, I would pair this with like oysters or some, you know, shrimp or some kind of seafood, um, prior to dinner.
And I think also like because of the acidity on the finish, like cheese and anything that's like, you know, fatty and rich, I think this helps cut. Nicely. So to me, it's very versatile. It's nice.
**Bam Bam:** I would definitely have this after dinner with a fruit plate and cheese. I think that would be outstanding for me.
Yeah. After dinner for me because I do find it to be
**Senator:** What if someone puts out some fruit and some cheese before dinner?
Make
**Grinder:** sure it's dry fruit. So this cigar has taken a very strong, positive turn for me. Yeah. I'm happy to hear that. It's definitely like The subtle notes that I was picking up are just, they've just kind of mellowed out, but turned up the volume. There's less
**Bam Bam:** reverb. I think the cinnamon has come back for me.
Um, it's more pungent, which I love in a Cuban [00:23:00] cigar, and that saltiness is still there, just a touch of it.
**Gizmo:** You know what I wonder, too, is if that's just a complication of the human rolling these cigars, or the multiple human beings rolling these cigars, just bunching the, the leaves differently, just moving that blend around a little, little bit, and you guys just taking what, you know, Three quarters of an inch or half an inch to get to where it should be.
Yeah, it's settled in
**Bam Bam:** nicely.
**Poobah:** Yeah, totally. And I do believe that when, um, when you light a cigar and we're all using butane torches, um, I do believe that I'm guilty of this as well. I'm trying, we're trying to get the cigar lit and you're, and you're, and you're doing that and you can inadvertently heat up the foot.
Where the cigar is not really settled in yet. And what you're getting when you first light it sometimes is not exactly representative of what the presentation could be, where if you really use the soft flame and really [00:24:00] took your time or a Cedar spill, and you really toasted it lightly and blew on it, you know, you can heat a cigar up and then in the first.
Couple of minutes, you're going, uh, you know, this isn't pre, this isn't maybe as good as I thought it was, but once it kind of settles in to what it's kind of supposed to be after that, you purge it a little, it becomes maybe more representative of what it should be, which, you know, it makes the argument for indoors, using a soft, you know, using a soft flame and taking your time to light the cigar.
Uh, I'm guilty of it. I think we all are. It can get a little, that first part, sometimes just heat it up a little too much. You know what I mean? And then once it settles in, like right here where we're at, maybe an inch. Okay. Now it's presenting itself as it should. Um, anyway, just a thought.
**Senator:** No, I think that's right.
I think when the cigar overheats in any way, it's going to lose, uh, some of the flavors. So I think I've done it too. I mean, especially with the butane torch, you're just [00:25:00] trying to get it light quickly. patience helps with that. Um, but it's tough with a cigar like this because I was commenting how long it took to light this cigar.
And so when you have a butane torch, I mean, you're sitting there and waiting and waiting, but it is probably overheating a bit in the process to get lit and then settling down as you go along. Yeah,
**Rooster:** that's,
**Senator:** yeah,
**Rooster:** that's, that's a good hypothesis. To me, the cigar Fondadoris than any other. I think you're right.
**Bam Bam:** I think you're, I, I kind of agree with that.
**Rooster:** Because I'm getting the similar like the woodiness, the creaminess, even a hint of floral note. It's subtle though. And I'm kinda, I want to go back to your comment you were making earlier that the Fundadoras have kind of fallen off for you a little bit. Cause I was just looking to see what we paired the Fundadoras with, you know, in the 70th episode that we did, we did tequila Don Filano.
**Bam Bam:** Ah. It's kind of an odd pairing. It's unusual. Don Filano. Yeah. Kind of an up
**Rooster:** airing. And, uh, guess what your rating was?
**Bam Bam:** Oh, I loved the Fundy then. I [00:26:00] know. I gave it a 10, I bet.
**Rooster:** You did? Yeah. Yeah, all of us. I mean, we gave, you gave, Sanford gave it an 8. There were some 10. I had a Fundy. So I'm surprised that it's not
**Bam Bam:** I had a Fundy maybe two months ago and prior to that it's been since we bought the damn things.
I really haven't had them. After experiencing all the Cuban cigars that we've had and then going back to the Fundy, it, it didn't have enough. It felt like it just didn't have enough. Yeah.
**Grinder:** I think, I think, yeah, I think there's more to be, it's not, it's an excellent cigar, but there's more variety that you're looking for.
Once you, especially if you taste all those Cubans, I mean, this has
**Poobah:** subtle flavors that are just, I think that's what I
**Bam Bam:** noted. It's very subtle. Yeah. Which is beautiful. There's a beauty to that.
**Rooster:** I think the fundadoras, when we bought those cigars, I mean, those boxes, we paid like in the mid, like 685 or something.
And now what they're going for, if you paid like upwards of 1, 200 or 1, 300 for a box, and it doesn't deliver. I [00:27:00] mean, what a disappointment that is. It would be.
**Grinder:** This is definitely delivering though. This is phenomenal. I think I'm faster than you guys. I gotta slow down. I gotta also
**Bam Bam:** say the champagne's a great pairing with this thing.
I agree. It's a beautiful
**Senator:** experience. Honestly. It is, but I have one complaint. So this cigar, I think, I agree with the commentary that there are similarities with the Fundy and particularly the creaminess of the cigar reminds me of the Fundy. The thing I'm just a little bit frustrated with the champagne.
There's there ought to be some more creaminess in the champagne that I would have expected to pair perfectly with this and the finish is so acidic being a Blanc to Blanc that I, for me, it's like I'm having like a piece of creamy cheese when I like take a puff of the cigar, like just something rich and creamy, this is cutting it, but I actually don't want it to cut it, you know, so like when I'm eating food, that's so rich, I need something to cut it, but this cigar is like just rich enough.
It's not super rich. And I don't want it to cut that finish and it is when I'm having it. So that's the [00:28:00] only complaint that I would have with the champagne. It's more a product of pairing it with this cigar, but I do wish there was a more of a creaminess to kind of just bring everything together a little more.
**Gizmo:** So the, the red grape component of some champagnes, obviously you said they de skin them. Right. Is that, does that offer creaminess? Is that what
**Senator:** we're to assume? It can help with it, but it's also the style that they blend this. And so I think the style intentionally for this was to have some more acidity on the finish, um, to cut some of those richer foods that you might pair it with, but there, I'm sure other Blanc de Blancs that might have a bit of a creamier finish that they would use white grapes that lend itself more to that.
So it really depends on the particular bottle and that champagne house and what they're trying to do. And I see the intent, but I, I love like a creamier champagne that it's just like, it's hard to describe, but the way it hits your palate where this is. There is a
**Bam Bam:** [00:29:00] cleansing factor to this drink tonight.
Yeah. It cleanses your palate. Right away. Right.
**Poobah:** We're, we're, we're maybe something that was a little bit stronger, more lingering. Maybe
**Senator:** you'd want that. Like even VUV has a cream, like VUV has a creamier finish than this. Bollinger certainly does. Paul Roger. Um, this is just a, it's a very distinct style and there are occasions to definitely pursue it.
I just, for this cigar, that's the missing piece for me.
**Gizmo:** I, I have a question. What other champagne would you say this is the best? Very much in line with
**Senator:** I mean any Blanc de Blanc most Blanc de Blancs Honestly are more drier and acidic on the finish. I personally don't seek them out very much because I like a creamier Less acidic dare.
I say even like I don't want to say more complex because this has complexity but I just like more of like the Brioche and nutty and creamy flavors in a champagne. Then I do [00:30:00] like the more traditional white grapes of like a more acidic and floral. Kind of and then some fruit presentation. I think a
**Poobah:** bowling a bottle of Bollinger may maybe Maybe getting close to optimal for this cigar Yeah I agree because it's got a it's got some fullness to it and it's got that it's it's got almost a it's it's got more of Us a little bit more of viscosity Maybe I agree Bollinger and body to hold the whole to hold up and it's definitely creamier
**Pagoda:** But I do think that now, like, I think if you give it some more time when the temperature comes off a bit, you'll find that it's, uh, really helping and improving from that perspective, yeah.
It's a very good point.
**Bam Bam:** Nevertheless, though, it's still a pleasant experience for both tonight.
**Poobah:** It's, it's, it's, it's very Foro through the retro hell, but not, like, overpowering at all. It's, it's mild, but it actually has a long finish on it. which is cool. Tastes very Cuban. It's salty. It's [00:31:00] a, but not too salty.
It's a little bit sweet. It's got some baking spices in there. It's got some, it's really a, it's really an elegant smoke. It is.
**Gizmo:** You know, what's interesting about when a lot of what you just said is, When I've had fundadoras recently, a lot of what you just said, which is what I've been chasing, is absent from most of the fundadoras.
And I've, I'm finding disappointment more in fundadoras than I am being blown away. Mm hmm. And I think it's a product of the, the Vitola. You know, I think it's just a Yeah. challenging Vitola. It's a, a slightly bigger than a Lancero at 40. Rooster, when was the last time you had a
**Rooster:** Fundy? I don't have any. I gave them all to you.
**Poobah:** No, you didn't. I think what you're saying though is accurate. Mm hmm. It's, there's something going on with this cigar that to me just says, it's like, it's like something you'd smoke in a tuxedo. I agree. Oh yeah. That's a great call. And I think
**Gizmo:** that what [00:32:00] I love about it too is I'm never, when I pull this cigar out, I'm never going to worry if it's going to draw well.
I'm never going to worry if I'm going to have to fight it or put the perfect draw in it. I think this cigar is just set up in its blend, in how the tobacco's packed. I felt most of them as I was packing it up today, everything felt very consistently, properly filled, where, you know, when you reach for a thinner ring gauge cigar, which we've done a lot on the podcast here and we've talked about a lot, sometimes those cigars can be over packed and you end up with a real, real difficult draw situation.
**Poobah:** And you're fighting it. Totally. And, and, and it's a little bit, I want to say it's a little bit E2 ish. It's a little bit kind of, but, but milder than that cigar. Sure. But in not in a bad way, because I'm actually impressed with this smoke because as, as mild as it is, it has a longer, it has a long finish and it's [00:33:00] delivering these flavors.
You can have this before a meal. You could, it's not Leharo heavy, but it's delivering. Like these really great notes, like it tastes really good.
**Gizmo:** So let's talk about our Champagne Pairing Ruin Art. Senator, you said you have some history on it. I'm interested about this brand because the champagne is very interesting.
**Senator:** Yeah, so it has more history than any Champagne House period. It is the oldest Champagne House in the world. Really? Which I never knew. I've never even heard of it. I know. Well, I mean, I've heard of it, but I never knew until we were doing this podcast. That's shocking. It's crazy. Wow. It was founded in, 1729, over 300 years, they've been making champagne.
Insanity. So it was founded by a guy named Nicholas Ruinart and he was essentially inspired to start making champagne by his uncle Thierry Ruinart, who was a Benedictine monk and had told him about experiments conducted by Dom Perignon with what they called at the time, wine with bubbles. They [00:34:00] didn't have a name for it.
That's literally what they were going around calling it and eventually selling it as. And so in 1730, he formally launched it onto the European market. Originally, it was a business gift to his most important cloth customers. The guy actually had a fabric business. So he was, uh, you know, one of Rooster's, uh, forefathers,
**Rooster:** I used to buy fabric for my
**Bam Bam:** 1730
**Gizmo:** cigars back then.
And he got some vino con gas.
**Bam Bam:** Oh, that's when you had the Exclusivo first time. Was
**Senator:** it? So, uh, apparently the first shipment of, uh, Ruinart was, uh, sent to the, uh, Danish island of Zeeland, better known as the location for Shakespeare's Hamlet. And it, like, exploded and took off. And so in 1735. Um, Nicholas Runehart stopped, uh, his fabric business and focused exclusively on sparkling wine in [00:35:00] 1768.
They became the first producer to purchase and dig out quarries underground to be able to store and age all their champagne. So now a lot of the champagne houses do it. But they were the first to really, uh, figure out that like this was the optimal conditions to really store and age the champagne. And so they would dig these things 38 meters deep and it's even a national historical site in France.
The original, uh, quarries that they had where they would keep and age, uh, Ruinart Champagne.
**Gizmo:** Imagine the, the labor, the man hours that it would take to dig a quarry by hand. Of course. With minimal tools in the 1700s. Mm hmm. Mm hmm. 38, what'd you say? 30, 38 meters into the ground to store barrels of Vino con gas.
Yeah. Yeah, like that's crazy. No, it is just a hammer and a sickle.
**Poobah:** And just, so I've been to Champaign, I've been to Dijon, I've been, I've been to Burgundy, [00:36:00] um, now that doesn't make me an expert. It was these, this was 20 plus years ago. Th they do have this like ancient infrastructure. when you go on these tours through France.
And it's absolutely like mind blowing.
**Senator:** I mean, to your point, ruin art to this day, stores and ages their champagne in the original quarries that were dug all those years ago. And they still maintain them.
**Poobah:** They take groups in and you do tastings, uh, In the quarry. Yeah. You do tastings in these, in these things.
And it's really, and in Burgundy as well, they have these kind of underground areas. It's interesting anyway. Well, the funny
**Senator:** thing is in the, the original quarries that they have. You won't find any wines predating 1945. So they key, I mean, they have some like crazy stuff in there from around that time period, but nothing before.
And the reason is the, uh, ruin arts, us brand director said that during the war, the Germans found their way into the [00:37:00] cellars and basically emptied them. That's why they don't have a single bottle from prior to 1945. Motherfucker. That's just,
**Grinder:** that's the story. They, they obviously, obviously someone pilfered the quarry.
I was like, just blame it on the Nazis.
**Poobah:** And one, one distinctive thing I remember is that they, they do this thing called riddling. It's, it's where they, they, they, they have people who go up on these ladders where they're stored, turn the bottle and they twist them and they twist it. So they, they turn the bottles, uh, uh, You know, from the, uh, from the base, I like cheese.
**Pagoda:** I like the way you put both your hands up and you're moving them. Oh, me too.
**Poobah:** Cause that's how they're doing it. They're like just going, you know, well, the funny thing even
**Senator:** about that little
**Gizmo:** suggestive in here, a lot of
**Senator:** related activities. The funny thing about that, why champagne even had such a hard time really taking off in the market was originally all wine was only shipped and sold in barrels and you can't do that with champagne.
And so it wasn't until like they had, you [00:38:00] know, develop real bottling to be able to bottle the champagne and then ship, um, and sell it elsewhere that champagne was able to be distributed outside of those, you know, actual champagne houses in France. Um, another funny story involving, um, uh, war and this one, World War I.
So, um, the champagne house is in Rheims in the Champagne region and apparently During world war one, it, uh, one of the big major buildings of the Champaign house was destroyed. So in order to keep the business going, uh, one of the family members who was involved in the business, Andre ruin are decided to move his office underground into the, um, quarries we were talking about the quarries became flooded.
And so for a period of time, he ran the business from his office on a raft, just floating around trying to run this ship during world war one, which is just It's so ridiculous. It's a great way to avoid taxes. It is. No zip code.
**Poobah:** Maritime law. No taxes out there. Correct. [00:39:00] And incoming ordinance. Yeah, that too.
**Senator:** And then, unsurprisingly, Andre died prematurely in 1919 and his wife Charlotte actually took over running the business and um, it says like, uh, Barb Nicole Clicquot, uh, Ponsardine, who was part of the Clicquot family that obviously is moved, um, Um, she was like one of the most famous women to basically run a champagne house.
And then fast forward to 1963, decades later, um, and what is true today. So Ruinart was sold to, uh, Moet and Chandon. Um, now it is part of the whole big LVMH empire to this day. So none of the Ruinart family, that's the one sad part of the history. That is sad. They have 300 years of history, but there is not a single family member that is at all involved anymore in the production, um, of the spirit.
And the last thing I'll say about the style and the grape we're talking about it being a Blanc to Blanc only made from white wine grapes. Ruinart is often called the Chardonnay house. Because they rely on Chardonnay grapes more than any. [00:40:00] Now I'm quickly realizing, I think as everybody knows, I hate Chardonnay.
**Bam Bam:** Yes, you do.
**Senator:** Not a chardonnay guy. So that may be part of the reason that I have just a little frustration with this, even though I think it's a very, very good champagne. Um, but that's really, uh, it looks like the, the dominant grape in, uh, everything that. They make, and the brand director says, Chardonnay's.
America's favorite grape is by far the country's most consumed varietal. Uh, there's obviously different levels of quality from pretty basic wines to the top white burgundy. And so, uh, when we talk about ruin art, uh, it's basically chardonnay with bubbles. That is kind of their approach to champagne making it.
It's
**Poobah:** interesting that you mentioned the Chardonnay. I wouldn't have picked up on it, but as the carbonation dissipates, it dissipates and as it gets warmer French, French Chardonnay. Mm-Hmm. , um. It does take, it does have some of those characteristics that are in there. You can kind of taste it, but it's a nice champagne.
I mean, I would drink it again. I would too.
**Pagoda:** I do think it works better when the temperature is a [00:41:00] bit warmer than what.
**Senator:** I agree. There, there's a lot of, um, debate about the serving temperature. So ruin art says that it's best served at six to eight degrees Celsius. What is that Fahrenheit? 42.
**Gizmo:** I'm not even going to try to guess.
12 does whatever. Yeah, no idea. 42
**Senator:** to 46 Fahrenheit.
**Rooster:** Okay. Zero is 32. Which,
**Senator:** what are most refrigerators? It's about that. 45?
**Rooster:** Yeah.
**Senator:** Really?
**Rooster:** Yeah.
**Senator:** Okay. So this came out initially what they would say you should serve it as, but I do agree with Pagoda that I think that it coming a little up in temperature has actually helped the flavor profile.
Although I could have this on a very warm summer day outside. I
**Gizmo:** was going to say this, this drinks like an, uh, like a very refreshing really summer champagne. That's where the
**Senator:** acidity is great. Like that's, what's fantastic about white wine in the summer. Like any white wine with some acidity, whether it's a Sauvignon Blanc and Albarino, any of those, that's what is so refreshing, right?
Like that [00:42:00] acidity that just kind of balance things. You're barbecuing
**Bam Bam:** lobster or shrimp. Oh yeah. Have a plate of that. I think that great, great pairing.
**Rooster:** So, so what other cigar would this pair really well with? Like, what can you, it's a good
**Bam Bam:** question. That's good. Yeah. You're not going to, I don't think you're going to go Rass or any, I don't want to do a Particus with this, but QD.
I was going to say Corona Sclero,
**Gizmo:** I think would go well with this cigar.
**Bam Bam:** Oh yeah. The QD 52, man. I agree. Corona Scleros would go good. Maybe not 54.
**Poobah:** Anything that's a little bit more mild than complex. Would, would pair up, would pair up well, you know, we're, we're,
**Bam Bam:** we're the petite Corona be great with this,
**Poobah:** but when you start to get towards maybe more of that party, more of that part of this flavor profile, I think it, it starts to trend away for this particular champagne,
**Gizmo:** you know, what cigar I think might do well with this just because of that citrusy thing would be the schwa supreme.
That's a good one. I'll mention that. Yeah. I think that'd be good. Oh yeah. That's. And to [00:43:00] me, that's a cigar. Like when, when I think of the schwa supreme. I mean, we're just coming into the depths of summer now here in the U. S. And especially in the East coast, you know, uh, that's a cigar I haven't thought about in quite some time, the Schwoz Supreme, but now coming into the summer months, that's a cigar I reach for in the summer.
**Bam Bam:** You go boy. Keep talking about that. Well, this love that.
**Poobah:** It's funny you say that this is, this, this says summer. I mean, this cigar is, is for sure. Like a warm weather. Cigar, this is like a, this is a cigar you have on the patio
**Grinder:** of the, after the golf round. Exactly. Afternoon. Yeah.
**Poobah:** It's not going to kick your light.
Afternoon delight, golden hour, after golf, you know, the sun's going down. It's a nice, it's a night, it's a nice night. And, um, it gives, it's giving you that combustion. You can smoke it outside. Cause it gets the smoke outputs solid. Yeah. There's good combustion. There's [00:44:00] good combustion. It's a
**Gizmo:** smoky room right now.
Yeah.
**Poobah:** It doesn't kick you around. I mean, it's not a nicotine heavy cigar. It's not a Leharo heavy cigar. Uh, but I really liked the blend. It's just very elegant.
**Rooster:** I think this would pair well with a tequila also. Um,
**Bam Bam:** yeah, yeah. Maybe a
**Rooster:** Blanco. Some of them.
**Bam Bam:** Yes.
**Gizmo:** So boys, we're coming to the halfway point here on the Trinidad Esmeraldas from Cuba.
What's everybody thinking? Has it taken any turns?
**Bam Bam:** No, I think it's getting better and better as we get into it. I agree with you. I think the complexity is increasing slightly. I said it earlier, it's very subtle, but that subtlety is starting to ramp up just a touch. I have a,
**Gizmo:** I have a phrase in my mind and I hesitate to use it.
I know we're only at the halfway point. This is a young cigar. Price point aside, we can, we can argue that. I think the way this tastes right now, this is some of the best of Cuban tobacco you can buy right now. I agree. Couldn't agree more. I think that if I were to tell someone, if someone were to say to me, I can only buy one Cuban cigar [00:45:00] right now, that's interesting, complex, is not offensive in any way.
Subtle and sophisticated. Subtle, sophisticated, very classy and elegant. And that's, that's what Cuba is. That's what we're getting. I think I might point them to this. Yeah. I really feel good about this cigar right now.
**Poobah:** I'm totally with you with one thing I'm hoping for, which hasn't happened yet. I'm wishing it's just would pick up in strength just a little.
I love what's happening. I love what's been happening the whole time.
**Bam Bam:** Can I see how far you've gotten into it? Just hold up your cigar. It's
**Poobah:** around
**Bam Bam:** halfway. Yeah. So once you get a little further beyond that, it will go up a touch. It has for me just a touch.
**Gizmo:** But I don't know if it was designed to do that Poobah.
So I, I don't know if you're setting yourself up for it's been intentionally
**Poobah:** designed this way. You're saying, yeah, yeah. Like don't set yourself up for
**Gizmo:** disappointment on it. Cause I don't know if it's going to get there.
**Poobah:** Right. Which is cool. I'm cool with that. You know, I'm cool with that. Um, but like towards the end, sometimes I want that little bit of a build, [00:46:00] but again, I, it's not a complaint.
It's a, it's more of an observation, but there's not a lot of things to complain about.
**Rooster:** I mean, I just wanted to add that for a 2022 box, it is smoking amazing, amazing, elegant Senator. I mean, it doesn't have a lot of age on it. So what are you thinking? Very good.
**Senator:** I love it. Uh, to me, the second third is even better than the first third.
And I can't wait for the final third. I'm really shocked and impressed. I think there's just enough body and strength to this that. Keeps my interest all the way through. I think like Poobah said, I, I do want a little bit more in the final third, but honestly, I like the flavor profile so much. And to me, the notes are so distinguishable that even if it stayed this way all the way through, I'm still going to give this a very high score, a hundred percent,
**Poobah:** a hundred, no, a hundred percent.
It's it's. It's
**Gizmo:** got a lot going for it. I mean, and you know what the cigars performed so well through this first half that it's like, for me, it's [00:47:00] just, I'm kind of letting it take me where it goes, you know, not disputing you looking for a little more of something different. Like I'm so happy with the cigar right now that I'm excited as to what the last third is going to show me similar to what Senator just said.
Like I'm really looking forward to what this blend is going to offer,
**Poobah:** like, like it's slot. It could slot in. Exactly where I would slot a QD, you know, or a milder cigar where that's what you want. But this is delivering one, it's a distinct flavor profile. It's it's different. This is distinctly different than anything.
It's not a Cohiba. It's not an up man, it's not a parus. It's distinct. So it's, no, it's, it's a Trinidad. It's a Trinidad, you know, but, but there's other cigars that we smoked where you're like, like,
**Rooster:** that's Trinidad, DNA, you can tell
**Poobah:** the DNA A is there, you know, and it's so, it's a standout in that respect.
And I, and I think it's a merit. The thing that's surprising to me, you know,
**Senator:** [00:48:00] rooster pointed out this is a 22 box. The creaminess in this cigar is something you expect from a stick with a lot more age than just a couple of years. I mean, I think of even the fundies that we get a real creamy kind of flavor profile with, those are at least four, five, six, if not eight years.
Like, I don't know many Cuban cigars with just two years of age that I would describe as creamy as this cigar, which is shocking that they're able to do that.
**Poobah:** And there's no rough edges. They must age this tobacco a little bit. I mean, they've got to do something.
**Bam Bam:** Well, they have a whole aging program.
Didn't you know? They do. We're going to talk about that in a minute.
**Poobah:** Well, no. And what I'm saying is this, this, this does not taste like typical, um, inline brand, regular catalog tobacco. It's just doesn't, I think it's premium. I
**Gizmo:** think that whoever blended this cigar did a brilliant job of taking, you know, obviously it's premium tobacco.
I don't know how [00:49:00] aged it is or isn't. I would assume it's not very aged, but I think the blend is just playing into all of our wheelhouses right now. The entire room. What factory is that? BSM. So this came out of, so actually, The Trinidad mother factory now is actually not El Deguito anymore. It's actually a factory in Pinar del Rio that it moved to.
So it came out of that factory. So the home of Trinidad's cigars is now in Pinar del Rio. Interesting. Got it. So as of a few years ago. So actually, let's talk about Trinidad history for a minute, boys. I know we did two other cigars. We'll touch on some of this. We've obviously seen the media onslaught on the Internet and publications, et cetera, celebrating the 55th anniversary of Trinidad.
And what's actually happened as this 55th anniversary of Trinidad has been, you know, widely promoted is there's been a little bit of a interesting kind of back and forth on some of the aspects of its history. Obviously, Being 55 years old. We know that the brand was founded in [00:50:00] 1969, but it wasn't released commercially until 1998, the funded doors was released and it was the only cigar that came out in 1998 prior to that, for those first.
Almost 30 years. It was a diplomatic gift that was used by the Cuban government, specifically Fidel Castro to give out to diplomats. What's interesting about that is cigar aficionado who has gotten in the fold here of this celebration of Trinidad's 55th, which is an odd thing we can talk about in a minute when they did their premiere episode in 1992 or 93.
Marvin R. Schenken. Specifically asked Fidel Castro about these Trinidad cigars that were being rolled at El Aguito and Fidel vehemently denied the existence of Trinidad, quite literally said, I have never heard of it. I have never given out a Trinidad. I only give out Cohiba. There is no such thing. And here we are in 2024 celebrating the 55th anniversary [00:51:00] of Trinidad officially.
You know, through the Cuban government and Habano S. A. And a global relaunch, no
**Senator:** less. Everything that comes out of the Cuban government is always the truth. So we should just take it at face value.
**Gizmo:** Exactly right. So it, it's interesting that that now has come up again as, you know, kind of the rebirth of Trinidad, combing through this, the history of Trinidad as these publications and media are, that that rub has come up where, you know, Marvin Arshankin said to Fidel, you know, have you ever heard of Fundadoros or Trinidad?
And he said, absolutely not. I only give out Cohiba. Now, obviously we're celebrating the birthday. So Trinidad was founded in 1969. It was only used for state gifts. Like I said, until 1998, it was commercially launched in 97. The first cigars came out in 98. The brand is named after the 16th century city of La Santissima Trinidad, the Holy Trinity.
It is not related to the Trinidad cigarette brand. That was discontinued in 1958. I guess that was a big cigarette brand in the forties and fifties. What's interesting is Habano SSA still [00:52:00] classifies this as a value brand in their portfolio. So obviously we know with what's happening with Trinidad, the prices, everything else.
That this has climbed well up to broke
**Bam Bam:** Americans. We just can't, you know, afford these propaganda. I mean, it's enough already.
**Gizmo:** So currently in production, there's only a few cigars. First of course, is the funded Doris cigar we did on the podcast. It's a Lonsdale 40 ring gauge cigar by seven and a half inches.
Again, we did mention it on the funded Doris episode. It's interesting to note that the original funded doors that were used as diplomatic gifts were actually 38 ring gauge cigars. I don't know why they went to 40, but it's. What they did, and this is interesting too, before it became commercially available, the Trinidad funded doors used to come in a simple unmarked cedar box of 100 cigars and the factory produced about 20 boxes a month.
So what was it called before that? So before it was called the funded doors, the original 38 ring gauge cigar by seven inches was called the El Aguito number one, and they were only enrolled at El [00:53:00] Aguito and they only made 2000 cigars a month. Those 20 boxes of course, were used. By Fidel Castro and other Cuban diplomats as gifts, uh, alongside Cohiba.
And it was said that the only person who could give Trinidad away, obviously contrary to what we just talked about with that original interview, was Fidel Castro. So Trinidad has had a, uh, a very, very interesting launch. Some of the other cigars in the line are the Colonialis, which is a Corona we did on the podcast, 44 by five and a quarter, came out in 2004.
Alongside that, the Reyes came out the same year, a petite Corona, 40 by four and three eighths inches. The Robustos Extra, which is not yet available, apparently. Uh, was reinstated in 2024. It was a 2004 release originally, and it was discontinued in 2012. Of course, the video we've talked about that little cigar before the petite Robusto 54 by four and three eighths inches that came out in 2014.
There's the Latrova, which is the LCD [00:54:00] H release, the double Robusto, a kind of nausea, a special 52 by six and a half, the media Luna. The petite Robusto 50 by four and a half came out in 2019. The Topas also came out around that same time. Robusto 56 by a little under five inches. And then finally the cigar we're smoking tonight, the Esmeralda 53 by five and three quarters inches long in its unique Vitola.
Called the Dinorous. There is one discontinued cigar from Trinidad called the Robustos T. Released in 2009 as a tribute to the 40th anniversary of the brand that was discontinued in 2012. So Trinidad has some interesting stuff going on. Rooster has got all those cigars in his tower. He does the original ones.
Yeah. The original ones. So like we said, Trinidad has struggled in the market since the price increases last year. We know this and we've talked about it. You know, that, that with those major price increases and we kind of called it when we were going over price increases last year, like Trinidad might struggle a little bit, you [00:55:00] know, releasing these cigars at these prices.
And, and they certainly have, they're sitting on shelves and I don't think anybody in the industry would deny that. So Habanos has done a full court press relaunching. Trinidad as a sister to the glory of Cohiba. And actually about a week or two ago in London, they did the Habanos world day celebration where they released a new edition limitata called the Cabildos, which is a 2024 limitata 46 ring gauge by six and three eighths inches long.
So Habanos world days is a program that was run by hunters and Frank out in London. And I got to tell you, you know, we've joked a few times. Uh, you know, as we came on air tonight about the full court press of this, but it's really been a media onslaught of Cuban cigars. Unlike I think anything we've ever seen.
Yeah,
**Bam Bam:** it's unusual.
**Gizmo:** So what I find interesting is that it seems to me, and we talked about this a [00:56:00] couple of weeks ago with Cigar Aficionado and our rub with them republishing the interview with Fidel Castro that we just talked about them talking about, you know, completely ignoring the humanitarian crisis and saying that Cuba has done more for human rights than anybody else.
Now we're seeing that not only did they cover the festival, they put Cuba on the cover of the magazine. They gave the age up number two. The cigar of the year for the first time in a while last year, David Savona and Greg Mottola went to the Habanos festival for the first time in, I don't know, six, seven, eight, 10 years.
And now we see in the official Habanos produced Trinidad series from Kirby Allison on YouTube, which is a wonderful production content, a little questionable to me, but fine. Quality is good. Quality is amazing. Can't, can't knock that. But there's David Savona from Cigar Aficionado in this official video.
Being interviewed in Cuba by Kirby Allison. So, it really does seem to me that Poobah especially was on the money that Cigar Aficionado is [00:57:00] back on the payroll. Oh, absolutely. For Habanos. More than ever. And it's, Seems like it's been a long build, certainly, since the Upman 2 won Cigar of the Year a couple years ago, and everybody was kind of shocked about
**Bam Bam:** that.
And Kirby's a pony that Hibana Sese's riding right now. You're exactly right. Am I wrong? Am I wrong? No,
**Grinder:** you're exactly right. Thank you. It's not a Mustang, though. I mean, like, does this guy have much of a persona? He is not a Mustang. He's a pony. What's the, what's the rub? Like Who cares kind of thing.
**Poobah:** I mean, the production value of, of what he's doing is, is good.
It's, it's, it's his business. I mean, it's a certain audience. I think that it appeals to, which is totally fine. If, if you're an Anglophile, which he clearly is, I mean, he's an Anglophile. He's enchanted with British culture. With the UK and with, um, because he talks about different topics outside of cigars.
He, I don't even know if he, if he claims to [00:58:00] be like a cigar expert.
**Gizmo:** No, I do. Well, I think, I think, you know what I'm saying? I think the thing to note is, so let's, let's, for the listener set this up. So Kirby Allison has been very successful on YouTube for probably 13, 15 years. Working in the bespoke clothing, bespoke shoes and accessories, accessories, don't forget the hangers, hangers, umbrellas, you know, this, this elevated classy English lifestyle that has been his thing.
And he's a man from Texas, right? So I think one of the things he does well,
**Senator:** sorry. I love that. He's a man from Texas. I mean, it's true. If you watch his videos and you watch how he even comports himself, he'd have you think he's like some Brit and he's just not. He's It was in Texas. He's an American from Texas and he doesn't know how to
**Poobah:** change a tire.
No, no, true. All true. But, but what I think he does do well for the audience that he serves is that there's a certain audience for, for, for, for this. Absolutely. And, and I, and I think what he does do well, it's not my bag, [00:59:00] but what he does do well is he does, I don't, he doesn't present himself, um, as a cigar expert.
He presents himself as, as someone who enjoys. These things cigars, custom shoes, civil row suits, whatever that is. And however pretentious one may think that made that that is, or how ridiculous is ridiculous. It may be or not. Um, he. He does make an attempt to educate folks who are interested in these types of things.
It may not be our interest. You know, he's talking about so many different things. I mean, his humidor and his cigars and what he's smoking is not all that. Um, I guess extensive, like deep diving into cigars. So
**Gizmo:** yeah, he's kind of, he's kind of picked some of the top line stuff. Yeah. He's acquired boxes on bond Roberts and through hunters and [01:00:00] Franco and.
You know, through other things, you know, he, but he really likes high end stuff from the Cuban cigar, which aligns with his brand. I get it.
**Grinder:** I don't know anything about him, but he sounds like a luxury goods grifter. That's what he's
**Senator:** not. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. Like I have a completely different take. I'm
**Bam Bam:** banging my head on a microphone for a sense of reason.
Thank you.
**Senator:** Look, I think there are several of us in this room who like nice things. I'm definitely one of those people as most of us are, right? Like he, he is not a guy that actually. sells or understands nice things. I'm sorry, like, the, the, there's barely any clothing, first of all, on his website. It's mostly to Rooster's point, like, literally, shoe trees and fucking hangers, like, as if, like, the wood of his hangers is so much better than the wood of a hanger that I could pick up at Nordstrom.
I mean, it's just so stupid. So, I don't, I don't even understand the
**Gizmo:** whole luxury By the way, I want to tell you
**Senator:** Those
**Gizmo:** hangers were featured in Cigar Aficionado's Father's Day guide this year. Go ahead. How ridiculous is that? This is so incestuous. That's crazy. This whole thing is so incestuous. [01:01:00]
**Senator:** It's just absurd.
But I'm sorry, like, if you go on his website, like, Anybody who, you know, appreciates finer thing, that's not the kind of stuff that people are looking for. It's just not, I give, if he actually made some really cool, interesting luxury products. Yeah, I'd, I'd be all in, I'd be very interested in that. That's not what he does.
And the cigar piece, he's obviously not someone who actually knows a whole lot about cigars. And, and I think the most frustrating thing is, you know, the production quality, which is not him, who's whoever's actually producing these videos that he features in, um, is. Outstanding at what they do, but the frustration I have is that he's clearly become a mouthpiece for the Cuban government and Havana says, say where every video makes Havana look like the most beautiful, pristine, orderly place on the planet.
I mean, if I showed his videos to anyone who has not been to Cuba, they would be like, They would literally think that you're in Havana having a five star [01:02:00] experience everywhere. You are that's paradise. It's paradise. When booking flights, Senator, even you look at like how they color correct clearly in those videos, like you don't see the crumbling buildings that are all over every street in Havana.
You can't walk through Havana without seeing something in disrepair that they just haven't had the resources to address. None of that makes it into the videos. None of the commentary or the conversation is about what's really happening there. It just makes it seem like this is where people go who have money and just have a grand old time and a five star lifestyle there when that's just not what it's like in Havana.
I mean, you know, I wish for the people there and for, um, you know, even selfishly as a tourist that it was that perfect and wonderful and pristine, but that's just not the reality of the situation. So that's my problem. Like if you're going to go in somewhere, Documentary style and capture all this great B roll and tell the story.
It's like the most dishonest account I've seen out there of what it's really like. It's
**Gizmo:** parallel directly to the cigar [01:03:00] aficionado argument we had a few weeks ago and the problem I have, and we see that on even cigar aficionados, Instagram, after our episode came out, we saw David Savona kind of in the comments saying, you know, that was just.
Fidel Castro's words. We just reprinted what he said and they throw up their hands like, Hey, we don't need to be a journalist. We don't need to tell these stories. And I think the word that you said, it's very dishonest about what's going on there, especially when we're talking about a product that's made by the human beings in Havana with their hands who are suffering.
And
**Senator:** the motive is clear. It's for access. Like it's not a coincidence that at the end of last year, Kirby Allison was up for Habanos man of the year. This is a guy who doesn't know much about cigars, who has not dove in on anything meaningful or honest, um, in, in explaining really what's going on in Cuba or even profiling the life of the people who make this product, right?
Like there's not even enough content about that. And it's [01:04:00] so clearly for access in the same way. That with that Cigar Fish and Auto article, that is in any way suggesting that any words Castro said in an interview decades ago ring true today, which they do not, it's for access. It's to get product. I mean, it's a joke.
He only
**Rooster:** recently went to Cuba, like two years ago, and he's been there maybe twice. And where is the poverty in Cuba? Where's the poverty on the streets? I mean, the lines of the gas stations. I mean, that's the reality of Cuba. What it is.
**Poobah:** But his, um, like his brand and his show and what he does is more aligned with him sitting down with the Shahakians at Davidoff and smoking, uh, you know, and, and kind of going in there in a custom made suit and crossing his legs and, and And, and, and chumming it up with them, the father and the son and, and, and, and having a cigar and talking about toasting the food and they bringing, they're bringing out a [01:05:00] vintage cigar and he smokes it with them and talks about how much he appreciates it.
And, you know, but a lot of the stuff that he does isn't even cigar related.
**Gizmo:** Most of it isn't. Most of it isn't. And he, what's interesting about all of this is that, and I'm not, you know, I have no angle to say this. I certainly don't want to be the chosen one here. We don't want to be chosen.
**Poobah:** He's talking about custom boots and stuff.
We don't want to be. Not
**Senator:** even. That's the sad part. Sorry. I'm on his website. These are the categories of products that this guy sells and is known for. Hangers is the first thing. Shoe care, which I'm sorry. If your audience, if your audience is like people who are very affluent or who really like nice things, I don't think most of those people are fucking shining their own shoes and interested in shoe care.
They take it somewhere and have an expert actually handle that. So that to me doesn't make sense. Garment care. I also don't think that these people are caring for their own garments. They're taking their clothes to a dry cleaner to do that. And the last thing is [01:06:00] accessories. He's right. And the accessories are, Uh, ties and pocket squares.
He is
**Gizmo:** an S. T. DuPont dealer. You will find S. T. DuPont on there. It's unbelievable. Is that
**Senator:** true? Yeah. So, he's not selling like bespoke suits or things like that, which I'd have more respect for. Like, you talk about an Anglophile. Like, that, that's the culture in London, right? Everybody's got a custom, beautiful suit.
Like, this guy's not even
**Gizmo:** doing that. It, it bothers me that a man from Texas. has become the mouthpiece for Habanos SA and the Cuban government.
**Bam Bam:** Well, it's only because
**Gizmo:** of his YouTube following. I understand that. But my point is, is that, uh, going back to the same word that we said a couple of weeks ago with Cigar Aficionado, you know, it boils down to me, like, how are you not?
Taking the blinders off. How are you not a little bit more curious as you're walking the streets of Cuba, you're spending 10 days there. You don't have to go at the Cuban government. You don't have to be harsh on it. You look at what Anthony Bourdain did when he went there twice. He did not attack the Cuban government, but he didn't mince words.
He didn't mince the truth and he shared an [01:07:00] accurate representation of what's happening. He
**Bam Bam:** never missed. Words, wherever he went, and that's, and that's
**Gizmo:** what, that's what I expect of anyone going to Havana, you don't have to torch the Cuban government. You don't have to go in on them, but just be honest about what the people are, he's
**Bam Bam:** a kept guy.
He's a kept man. Well, it's what he is. Well, no, no,
**Poobah:** it's yeah, it's his living. It's a, it's a commercial operation that he's running. So yeah, it's just
**Senator:** not an honest living. That's the problem I have with it. Right, exactly.
**Poobah:** Right, right. It's a commercial. So, so, I mean, look, this is America. People can go out and they can do, I'm not defending him.
I just want to say, I'm not a huge fan of what he does, but I do understand what he's doing, which is, this is a commercial, this is a commercial thing for him. This is how he makes his living. So he's playing the game and, and, and, and, and, and, and he's appealing to a certain segment, a certain audience.
There's, there's an audience that he's identified and, and, and he's [01:08:00] speaking to them and there's. Certainly, I guess enough of them to buy some merchandise through his website and, and to do these things. And I don't disagree with any of the commentary, um, from Senator or from anybody else, but like for me, this is America.
The guy wants to go out and do what he wants to do fine, but yes, is it, is it. It's a hundred percent over the top bougie. He's an Anglophile. And I think he would probably admit that. I mean, like he's so into the UK. I mean, that's what he
**Bam Bam:** is. For those of us that have been to Cuba, that I've seen it firsthand, watching his videos are just tremendously disingenuous and it's a little disturbing.
**Senator:** I think that's the word. He's disingenuous. That's my only problem with it. Me too. I'm sorry. Like I, I wish that Havana looked like his videos. I re I think everybody wishes that were the case, but the fact that they clearly, yes, that component is [01:09:00] they controlled every move and word that he said, Senator,
**Poobah:** everything.
It's just outrageous. Yes. The catalyst for this conversation is this particular representation of Cuba. Mm-Hmm. . That's what we're talking about. And I
**Gizmo:** think also being in bed with Haos to that level. Is quite disturbing to me. It is. For a man from Texas. Yeah. That's disturbing to me.
**Bam Bam:** Texas.
**Gizmo:** It's disturbing.
No,
**Senator:** it's true. I mean, I'm sorry. It's just. Well,
**Poobah:** yes. And also his whole demeanor and everything else is just weird. I mean, let's face the facts of it. I mean, you're, you're kind of saying. You know, what are you like, who acts like this, but there's an audience, these stupid
**Senator:** suits and these ridiculous hats and fedoras, double breasted suits.
I mean, the guy posts a photo of himself with a flat tire. Oh, that was horrible. Cuba smoking a cigar, smoking a cigar while he's wearing a suit. And it's like great day in Havana. And there's like two Cuban guys that are like on their hands and knees, Trying to fix this tire. And he's just sitting there puffing away on his cigar.
Like no self awareness at all. Like I said, he can't [01:10:00] totally,
**Poobah:** totally.
**Gizmo:** I it's so, so listen here, I'll say this again to sum it up. I think our, our beef with this whole thing is how disingenuous, how dishonest the representation of Cuba, Havana, you went to Trinidad, Pinar del Rio. I think it's a gross misrepresentation of what's happening there.
I don't think anybody who's been there. I mean, it's a fact that there's a humanitarian crisis there right now, to the point where Cuba's asked the world food bank for food. I mean, the fact that these things are glossed over for the sale of these high end luxury goods that Habanos makes and we smoke and, and the world smokes.
Um, I think not telling the complete story is a real, real problem. And, you know, credit to him. He's got great production, but I think that if he turned on the curiosity meter a little bit and, and. told a little bit more of a complete story. I think the world would be better for,
**Poobah:** doesn't care he's making money.
**Gizmo:** So be it. So boys, we're coming to the last third here on the Trinidad esmeraldas. [01:11:00] What's everybody thinking? Picked up in strength. Yeah, I'm really,
**Bam Bam:** really enjoying it. I think it's gotten more complex. It's grown a bit from the point of view of the body. It's really, really good.
**Gizmo:** I think it's as close to the Fondaduras right now as it's been the entire super.
I scarfed
**Grinder:** mine down. I absolutely mauled it. It's awesome. I absolutely mauled it. I mean, I've been done.
**Rooster:** I think it's one of the best cigar put out by Trinidad. I agree with that. I think it's better than the Fundadorus.
**Bam Bam:** I do too. I agree. Yeah.
**Rooster:** I think Colonialis is up there. I agree. And then the Esmeralda.
**Gizmo:** And I think, I think the batting average that this cigar is experiencing in the room and will experience in general because of the Vittola we talked about, the pack of the tobacco, the bunching, et cetera, I think you're going to have better bang for your buck with this cigar than you are with the Vittola.
That's what often might be a challenging fundadorus in that small ring gauge and small format. And like Senator said, and Pooba said, I think those cigars have a little bit [01:12:00] more oomph to them, a little bit more Le Harrow in them. I think that they need more age than these cigars clearly do. I think a fundadorus probably needs five to eight years.
Obviously we're enjoying this two year old cigars. So it's
**Poobah:** not Le Harrow heavy, so it does, it's, it's,
**Rooster:** it's an anytime smoke. You can smoke it in the morning and the afternoon and the evening. I mean, that's really very versatile. How are you finding it now, Senator?
**Senator:** I agree. I think it has picked up in strength, not.
Um, now where it's even approached medium full, I think it's like ending firmly medium. And I think like the first third was probably mild. Second third, maybe mild medium and the final third firmly medium. But I agree with Rooster. It's, it's versatile. I would smoke this at any time of day. And um, for me, this is the most interesting Trinidad I've maybe ever had.
Agreed.
**Pagoda:** Agreed. I think I'm enjoying it a lot more in the second half. Uh, like, uh, I think the first half was a bit too mild for me, but you know, what do you creamy? [01:13:00] And, uh, I did find a lot of saltiness I think in the beginning.
**Bam Bam:** Yeah, I still have it here actually.
**Pagoda:** And then I think when we were having the champagne, I think, uh, and I don't know whether it was a champagne, but it did make it, you know, I found a little bit of sweetness coming through the cigar, which I felt was some of the baking spices being slightly enhanced.
Um, um, overall really enjoying the cigar. Pleasant experience.
**Poobah:** Totally. And, and, and like the, as this, in this last third, it picked up, which I was really, really hoping for. And it's kind of like that last part that's giving you that, that little bit of oomph. Mm-hmm. , which I'm really enjoying. I really enjoyed the, the mild part at the, you know, creamy.
It was, it's real, it was a three rock play. It, it, it, it, it was, it was mild. Mild, mild. Then it built in the middle. So for me, I agree with that. This was, this was really. Quite a nice journey. Um, and really an excellent smoke. I only, [01:14:00] I had to correct it. Um, a couple of times, um, which is not a demerit, a couple of touchups, but very minor.
Um, so the construction to build, I think the blend, um, the smoke output and the smoke output was really so many merits to this, uh, very pleasurable.
**Rooster:** I mean, it's, it's amazing. You can take the same five leaves of tobacco in Cuba. I mean, everybody uses the same leaf and it just comes down to the blending and how different a cigar can taste.
Yeah,
**Bam Bam:** it's pretty
**Rooster:** amazing.
**Bam Bam:** The blenders are masters and we don't know who they are.
**Rooster:** We
**Bam Bam:** don't.
**Gizmo:** So boys, I do want to talk about one other thing that we mentioned a few weeks ago. We talked about the new Habanos vintage program where they're releasing cigars, vintage five, 10, 15, and the grand vintage 20 years of age on these cigars over the next few years,
**Bam Bam:** another propaganda program and, [01:15:00]
**Gizmo:** and otherwise.
And we talked extensively about that and we're not going to do that again. However, I did, we did get an email on June 5th from Habanos official. And the one thing I wanted to note about this, I found very interesting is that actually going back to the word disingenuous or dishonest, I am really questioning the entire program even more now, because we were kind of Positing that they were potentially maybe aging tobacco in barn somewhere or in Pilonas somewhere that for all this time, and then decided to roll cigars.
Well, they put out a press release on June 5th saying the aging of vintage Habanos is not related to the aging of the tobacco leaves, nor to when they were harvested. Vintage Habanos are Habanos already rolled in their original wooden boxes. Sealed and marked with the month and year of manufacturer These habanos are then left to age for years in perfect conditions of conservation And this process is established and [01:16:00] monitored as we know by the regulatory council of the protected of appellations of origin of habanos Pao, which is unique in the world of premium tobacco.
So what they're saying is that 10 years ago Even more than that, I guess in June, 2011 or something there, they have a video where they're showing these boxes being unboxed that they have 55, 000 Trinidad funded doors from the middle of 2011 or 2012. Sometime they are unboxing them and they are now putting them into more fancy humid doors.
to be released at this high price point with the Vintage 10 label on them. And
**Senator:** of course, they've been kept and stored perfectly over those 10 years, because in Tvent it's so easy to find, you know, humidors that actually keep cigars at exactly the right humidity and temperature. It's a real thing. I think they must have hired Mickey Mouse
**Grinder:** as a, as a consultant for
**Gizmo:** them.
Maybe they use his proprietary aging program. Yeah, yeah,
**Grinder:** correct.
**Gizmo:** But just think about the idea that, They, they're telling us that they had the [01:17:00] foresight that this program was going to come out over 10 years ago to make 55, 000 funded doors and put them away, stamp the boxes, put them away. And in 2024 for the 55th anniversary, release them in these fancy humidors.
It is so unbelievable.
**Bam Bam:** There's, there's a lot of negative commentary that we can make about this tonight. It's not even worth talking about. I agree with you, but it's just.
**Gizmo:** It's so illogical and incomprehensible that, that they plan this out that far in advance. I mean, there's been such a Cuban cigar shortage.
**Senator:** Well, that's the thing. Forget the foresight. I mean, I have no doubt that at any point, of course, this, there'd be a desire to do something like this. It would make perfect sense. The problem is right. The supply has been so limited. And they're so desperate for revenue as we've seen, hence the price increases and everything else that's happened and how quality has suffered over time.
Like brought Kirby in, it's just, it's just not possible for them to hold all that inventory. They can't afford to do that. And they don't have the money to do it. Why did the Chinese buy a part?
**Rooster:** Like they need [01:18:00] money. I mean, how about investing some of that money into the infrastructure? How about investing some of the money into the tobacco fields?
That's the product. That's where you need to focus.
**Gizmo:** You're talking rationally.
**Bam Bam:** Yeah, that's true too.
**Gizmo:** It's just amazing that they think that we're, that, that people are going to buy this. You know, they're, they're going to buy this story. I just, it just makes no sense. And they've have no track record to make us believe that, that, uh, so, so what,
**Rooster:** what box stamps would they have?
What year would these boxes? I
**Gizmo:** think it's BLM's mid 2011 is what they're showing in this video. They're unboxing 55, 000 cigars from 2011 to put in these fancy humidors. Which I'm sorry, they can stamp on it. Of course they can. How are they going to color match them back? Well, they're working on it. To box them back up again.
It's
**Poobah:** a great question. What are they going to put them in big huge bundles and then color match them back into the boxes? I mean, how is that going to work? Kirby will take care
**Bam Bam:** of it. He's got
**Poobah:** it.
**Gizmo:** I guess so. I guess [01:19:00] so. All right, boys. We're coming to the end of our evening here with the ruin art champagne and the Trinidad Esmeraldas.
Any final thoughts here before we move into our ratings? I for one thought the cigar was the shining star. I thought the champagne was great, but this cigar was. blew my expectations out of the water.
**Grinder:** I found the cigar to be very pleasant. I thought the, it started off a little odd, a little wonky for me. I did get a little, um, uh, youth, I thought, uh, just for me, you know, I don't know if that, I think that might
**Senator:** be cause you mulled it.
I may because I'm all heated
**Grinder:** up. Um, uh, it could be a reason, uh, but it turned beautifully and, A lot of unique woody notes that I, that I was really, you know, like I said, I just wanted, I wanted more. I think that's the only thing I'd say about the cigar is I think you have to be in a a a, a mood. I think you have to be in a mood to just really try to find some of the flavors.
It's 'cause it doesn't it, to me, it didn't come [01:20:00] as a parent as I would've hoped and I wanted more.
**Rooster:** I think the cigar kind of puts you in a mood. Maybe it, it does. Yeah.
**Bam Bam:** I will say that cinnamon note that we got there was really surprising. That was special. It was unique too. It kind of came and went, and toward the beginning of the final third, it came back for a bit.
But that salty tone, for
**Grinder:** me, continues all the way through. And oddly enough, I didn't get some of the creaminess you guys were, you know, mentioning. The whole thing was velvety and creamy. Yeah, the whole thing. Yeah, yeah. The retro was creamy. Yeah, it was a different flavor for me, so. But it was still, still phenomenal.
So girl, and I've been done for like 20 minutes.
**Gizmo:** We've been railing about us. All right, boys, it's time to do the formal liquor rating now on the ruin art Blanc to Blanc champagne. Bam Bam, you're up.
**Bam Bam:** I love this champagne. Um, I think it's just, it's so pleasant and easy to drink on a very nice summer afternoon.
Like I said, if I'm grilling seafood with this, I would love to sit down with this in the afternoon with just a cigar, Mrs. Bam Bam on the side yard. I'm giving it an [01:21:00] 8. Mulching the yard?
**Senator:** Yeah, mulch it. I'll go with an 8. Notice he said Mrs. Bam Bam on the cider, none of the lizards.
**Bam Bam:** Well,
**Senator:** I don't spend enough time at
**Grinder:** home.
**Senator:** I
**Grinder:** gotta put my time in it. Grinder. I'm also giving it an 8. I think there's, um, just from a rack and stack perspective, some other champagnes that I, Probably favor that fit my, uh, profile a little more. I think it paired very well with the cigar. And, uh, I'm never gonna turn down a glass of this champagne.
It's delicious.
**Pagoda:** Pagoda. Uh, for me, it's a nine. Um, you know, I, I thought it was balanced and, um, it was a bit dry, it wasn't sweet at all. And I, I liked the, you know, the palate cleansing nature of it. I think when the temperature came down a bit or went up a bit, um, It, um, really, like for me, it really worked well with the cigar.
Uh, it's a nine for me. Senator,
**Senator:** I'm at an eight. I, I enjoy this champagne. I would drink it [01:22:00] again. It's a, it's a recommend overall. I just think for me, I was just missing something to bring it all together. Um, that would have, you know, many champagnes are described as like a, a fine mousse quality about them.
Like there's just something creamy that just brings all the flavors together. And, Um, I don't even think it's necessarily, you know, just ruin art. It's that Blanc to Blanc style, but that's really what they lean into so heavily. And so I don't think it's a brand that I'm going to pursue a whole lot of. Um, although their bottles are very beautiful and unique, um, obviously every champagne bottles, you know, those like long, tall bottles and they kind of have this short stout, um, stout bottle, um, Which apparently is how the, like, I mean, they are the originator.
This is apparently how champagne was drank, you know, all those years ago. Um, so they've kept that style true. The thing that's bizarre is, you know, the bottle is clear. You'll never see another clear champagne bottle, which is not good for storage. That's why they need that sleeve that's around it because light will, will spoil [01:23:00] that, um, uh, much faster than if it were in a darker bottle.
But, um, yeah, I just wanted it a bit more. So it's a soft recommend. I would give it an eight. It almost looks like a cognac bottle. Yeah, in some ways, you know, the shape,
**Bam Bam:** I think an eight's a pretty strong recommend.
**Gizmo:** So it's also an eight for me. I think it's a wonderful champagne. I think for what we do in this room, I think I would have trouble.
Having this champagne stack accurately up to a cigar, maybe aside from the two or three we noted tonight. Oh, correct. Some of the more mild, you've got to plan
**Bam Bam:** your pairing. I
**Gizmo:** think that this would be wonderful with a, you know, a nice lunch outside in the summer, springtime. But for what we do here in the room, I don't think it reached that nine or 10 capabilities.
So it's definitely an eight for me. Poobah. At the price
**Poobah:** point at 85. I think it's, I think it's an eight. It does. It just doesn't stack up to, Some of the other champagnes, um, that we know and that we love. Um, so I agree with the commentary, uh, in the room for [01:24:00] me, it's an eight. I, you know, would I. Pursue it.
Not, not really, but would I recommend it for someone who likes this Blanc to Blanc style? Um,
**Gizmo:** for sure. So boys, that puts the formal liquor rating on the ruin art Blanc to Blanc Champagne at an 8. 2. It's a
**Bam Bam:** nice
**Gizmo:** score. So, you know, I was looking at the comp ratings of other Champagnes we've done on the podcast.
And for how many times I think we've done Champagne, we've only rated. Three others. Hmm. So I'll go through those right now. The Ilmar and Sea Grower Champagne got an 8.7 on episode 60 or 60 ish New Year's Eve, uh, 2022.
**Bam Bam:** That was a unique bottle that was very nice. Different
**Gizmo:** the, the Paul Roge Brute Reserve Vintage 2013 on episode 100.
That was a special one with the padron. 50 years that got a 10.0. One of the best we've ever done. Mm-Hmm . And on episode 113, the Dom Perignon. Vintage 2013 also was a 9. 7.
**Bam Bam:** All right. [01:25:00]
**Gizmo:** And we've done, obviously, Bollinger. We've done, uh, Paul Roger regular, but we haven't rated those. So maybe we revisit, uh, Bollinger down the road.
**Pagoda:** Anytime. God
**Senator:** forbid. Good correct on that pronunciation, by the way. It's going to be such hard work. We have to drink both of those again to rate it. I know.
**Gizmo:** You know, we might have to do a pre production. Non recording, try it, see how it goes and then have it on the pod. I like it. Really put in the work here for the listener.
**Bam Bam:** Pre
**Gizmo:** pro. All right, boys, it's time to do the formal lizard rating now on the Trinidad Esmeraldas from Cuba. Rooster, you're up. I'm giving
**Rooster:** this cigar a 10. Wow. Whoa. This cigar was wonderful. I mean, I enjoyed it from the beginning till the end. I love the notes on it. The creamy, woody, little bit of baking spice on it.
And it picked up in strength as you, as you went along. And it had a pigtail. That's an extra point. We already knew you were giving it a 10. I love the ring gauge on it. It was so nice to hold. I love the simple band on it. And I think it's one of the, uh, one of the better [01:26:00] Trinidad's out there. So for me, it's a 10.
**Poobah:** Poobah. Um, For me, it's a nine, I really, really enjoyed it. And it's a very strong recommend. It's it's one of the, it's one of the better Trinidad's I've ever had. I thought the ring gauge was great. The construction was great. It's a, it's a mild to medium cigar that built up in strength towards the end. Um, the flavor notes were subtle, but complex that it just, the smoke just has a lot going for it.
The, the, the construction, the combustion, um, the smoke output, the build, the whole thing was really, really a nice experience. I'm just, it's not quite a 10 for me. I'd probably rate it somewhere in the middle if we were doing fractions, but for me, it's a nine, I really, really enjoyed it. [01:27:00] I'd recommend it to anybody.
And, um, I, I really enjoyed the cigar. It was very elegant. So for me, it's a 10. I
**Gizmo:** think it, it's an unbelievable shocker for me tonight. Excuse me? Shocker. Uh, I think this is the, some of the best of Cuban tobacco coming out right now. I think it's better than the funda Doris. I think it's better than the colonialists.
I think it's better than a lot of the Cuban cigars we smoke. Um, I think it's accessible for any smoker, any type of smokers, someone who likes, uh, are more, are more full cigar. I think we'll find interesting notes in this cigar. I think someone who likes a mild cigar, I think anyone across the gamut will fall in love with the cigar.
And I just think that, you know, this blend. It just was perfect for me. From the light, it just knocked my socks off in a way I never expected. I totally came in here thinking that we were going to be in the seven or eights tonight, and uh, it, it completely blew me away. I want to get more of these. I want to get rid of my fundies and, and fill my tower with these.
I absolutely, [01:28:00] absolutely love it. That's a definitive statement. So that's a ten.
**Senator:** Senator. Holy smokes. I'm shocked. Me too. Um, I, I'm sorry. I, I very strongly disagree with the tens in the room. I, I'm at a nine. I'm with Poobah on this. Um, it was an Excellent cigar. I really enjoyed the complexity of it. It showed no signs of youth all the way through, which was remarkable.
It's one of the creamiest Cuban cigars I've had. Um, but for me, for a 10, I just, I, I, I still wanted a little bit more and, uh, you know, for a 10, it's got to be perfect, right? It's I, when I give something a 10, I can't find one thing wrong with it. And for me, This doesn't have the versatility of, you know, would I have this with a more substantial meal?
No, or even after a more substantial meal, this would be great in the afternoon. This would be great early evening before a substantial meal. Um, and they're, they're just, because I'm left wanting more, there's nothing in me that's saying I have to go grab a box of these. What I'm left saying is I would happily [01:29:00] smoke another one of these again, but it's just not something I'm going to chase at any cost at any dollar in the way that anything I've given a 10.
I'm going to buy a box as soon as we stop recording. So, um, it's a nine, it's a strong recommend, but for the reasons I said, I, it doesn't quite crack a 10.
**Pagoda:** Pagoda. Uh, it's a nine for me. I, you know, as you guys know, uh, uh, the flavor profile was a bit mild for me in the beginning. It did pick up, uh, the second half was what I really enjoyed.
Um, you know, and I didn't know whether this would really hold up in a golf course. So, you know, slightly windy because the wrapper was already, you know, It's a very delicate, very delicate, uh, cigar and the flavor is also, you know, very subtle in the beginning, which I didn't know, like if you're in a slightly windy place, you'd be able to really enjoy the flavor profile of that.
But, um, having said that really, really pleasant experience leaves a very pleasant flavor in your, uh, you know, like in the mouth. And it was just fantastic from that perspective. It's definitely a nine. Grinder. I'm an
**Grinder:** eight. [01:30:00] Um, you what? Yeah. You inhaled that thing you said, I'm sure I'm an eight. I loved it, but I, I think I wa I wanted more cont like throughout the whole thing.
Can you go outside and see if there's a full
**Bam Bam:** moon out there? , something's happening in this room. I,
**Grinder:** I wish, I wish the way you described Gizmo, that cigar. I wish I had that experience.
**Gizmo:** Mine was a slam dunk, a home run. Wow. I, I struggled in the
**Grinder:** beginning. I had youth. Unbelievable. I had youth for the first half of the cigar.
Uh, it took a, it took a pretty dramatic turn, but it's still never, I don't think it ever fully redeemed itself. What compelled you to smoke it so fast then? Wow. I was just, I wanted to smoke cigars with to get what we were getting. You just draw it repeatedly. So for me, it's an eight. I, I, I don't. You know, I don't think, um, can I
**Bam Bam:** get that on video,
**Grinder:** please
**Bam Bam:** do that again.
**Grinder:** No, I'm glad we're not a video podcast. Just doing that. Um, no, so for me, it was an eight. I, I, I didn't get the creaminess, um, after the first light and, and you know, to not [01:31:00] to hear you guys recount that and to not experience, it was a little frustrating. Um, like I said, I had some youth, uh, I did maul it, but I think I was also just trying to search for it.
You know, I was trying to, trying to dig deep there. Having said that. I thought everything was, you know, it smoked very well, you know, the, the burn was perfect. Uh, construction again was perfect. I didn't have any issues with touching up. Um, and, and it smoked great. Maybe that's also why I smoked it so quickly.
It smoked very, very well. So yeah, it's a need for me.
**Bam Bam:** Bam Bam. Well, I'm surprised with the eight. Um, you know, I was going to say anything over an eight in this room is an elite score. So we're splitting hairs between nine and a 10. And then this guy throws a curve ball in. Um, I have to say what, I mentioned this earlier and I think a few other guys mentioned it, that cinnamon note for me was special and it came and went and it kept my interest just enough.
I think the creaminess, the elegance of this cigar and how it felt in the hand, I think was a great, great experience. I'm at a nine. I'm just, uh, I'm
**Pagoda:** [01:32:00] just impressed with you, Bam. You still have quite a bit of cigarettes left. No, no, this is, I dropped,
**Bam Bam:** I finished that. Oh, that's
**Pagoda:** a different one. Alright, I would like Everyone's done in the room, including Rooster.
No, no, no.
**Gizmo:** Rooster's fingers are even burning. So boys, the formal lizard rating tonight on the Trinidad Esmeraldas is a 9. 2. Okay. I think that's a perfect score for this fair score. Yeah,
**Bam Bam:** no, actually that is a good score, yeah. It's a great score. The composite score never lies. It never lies. This is
**Gizmo:** true.
Despite
**Senator:** your protest, Senator. I never protest. I'm the biggest fan of whole numbers. I was Pagoda's attorney when he was the one that proposed that. Honestly. Didn't you say you vehemently disagreed with the tens? With your rating, individual.
**Bam Bam:** Poop is kind of on the money. If we were doing decimals. I'd probably be at a nine, five, 95.
Yeah. I keep
**Senator:** in mind. I also wasn't expecting Granter to throw in the eight. That's true. That's true. Had he given it a nine and you gave it a nine, we would have been okay.
**Gizmo:** So boys, this was the third Trinidad we did on the podcast. As I mentioned, let's go through the other two and their ratings on episode 26.
We did the colonialis, which was an 8. 8. And on episode 70, we did the [01:33:00] fundadoras, which was an 8. 7. So this edged both of those by four and five points, respectively. Pretty. At a 9. 2. Yeah. Not a bad night? No. I think it was a very good night. Great night. Very good night. I, I was honestly very surprised by the Esmeraldas tonight.
I mean, I was totally expecting this to end up in the eights and I was very pleasantly surprised. Yeah. You know, even at a 50 price point, I thought it was a very nice Robusto that you could reach for on a special occasion once or twice a half months. Absolutely.
**Poobah:** What was the, what was the Partagas that we reviewed, the LCDH?
The Aliados. Right. What did that score? 5. 7. 5. 7. And that was a what, a 50, 60 cigar? 62 I think, 65. Yeah, so there you go.
**Gizmo:** Yeah. Well, anything with that second band on it, the Senator has, Mm hmm. Mm hmm. Reported. It doesn't work. The LCD age band does not work well on this podcast.
**Rooster:** Here. I want to give you another Esmeralda.
**Gizmo:** Hey, from my fellow 10. Thank you,
**Bam Bam:** Rooster. [01:34:00]
**Gizmo:** Look at that. What a
**Bam Bam:** guy.
**Gizmo:** I got it.
**Grinder:** I give it. I'll go. Go
**Bam Bam:** give it a 10. That's for our remote lizard staff. I'm
**Poobah:** revising my score.
**Gizmo:** All right, boys. A great night tonight on the podcast on the Ruin Art Blanc de Blanc Champagne. We had an 8. 2 and on the Trinidad Esmeraldas at a 9.
2. Great night. Thanks. Uh, thanks to everyone who writes in for listening to the podcast. Of course, thanks to fabric of five for supporting the podcast and we'll see everybody next week. Keep smoking. Hope you enjoyed this episode. Thanks for joining us. You can find our merch store and ratings archive at our brand new website, lounge lizards, pod.
com. That's lounge lizards, P O D. com. Don't forget to leave us a rating and subscribe on your favorite podcast platform. If you have any comments, questions, if you want to reach out, say hello, tell us what you're smoking. Email us hello at lounge lizards, pod. com. You can also find us on Instagram at lounge lizards pod.
We really appreciate your time and we'll, [01:35:00] uh, we'll see you next week.