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Hosted by Steve Phipps of Wayfind Marketing, The Growth-Minded Marketing Podcast simplifies marketing for B2B CEOs ready to grow with confidence. Each episode offers real-world strategies, step-by-step coaching, and inspiring CEO interviews—all designed to help you align your marketing with your business goals, stop wasting time and money, and scale without the stress. If you’re a growth-minded leader tired of vague advice and underperforming tactics, this is your next step.
AnnieLaurie: At what point does the
thing that built your business start
to become the thing holding it back?
Steve (2): Welcome back to the
Growth Minded Marketing Podcast.
I'm Steve Phipps, joined by AnnieLaurie
Walters, and today we're talking
to someone that the Wayfind team
knows very well, Chris Riggins.
Now, Chris has been a client of
ours for a long time, and we've
had a pretty close view of a lot of
what he's going to talk about today
AnnieLaurie: Which honestly made
listening to this interview kind of
interesting because hearing Chris
tell the whole story in one sitting, I
kept coming back to the same thought.
Every time the business needed
to grow, had to grow first
Steve (2): And that's really
what this conversation's about.
On the surface, it's a story about a
growing painting company, but underneath
of it, it's the story of a business owner
learning that what got him to one stage
wasn't going to get him to the next.
And, and Chris is, is incredibly honest
and refreshingly so about that journey.
Every growth stage has required
something different from him as a
leader, different types of decisions,
different skills, different perspectives.
And more than once, it took someone
from outside of the business to help him
to see what he couldn't see on his own
AnnieLaurie: He has this phrase,
does Chris Riggins need to do to
get out of Chris Riggins' way?"
And I like that, and I think that's
kind of the whole episode right there.
He started Riggins Painting in 2009.
The housing market had just collapsed.
The company he worked for shut
down, and basically he went from
employee to business owner overnight.
All he had was a set of hand tools and an
old truck with over 200,000 miles on it.
But now he's grown the business into
a nine-person management team and at
least tripled his revenue since 2022
Steve (2): And as impressive as that
is, it's the how of that growth, the
mindset shifts, the moments where he had
to let go of control, the decision to
bring in outside coaches and partners.
That's what makes this
conversation resonate with CEOs.
So without further ado, here's my
conversation with Chris Riggins
Steve: All right, friends, so
Welcome back to another episode of
the Growth Minded Marketing Podcast.
And if you're a first time listener,
one of the things that we do
here is I have conversations with
business owners and CEOs usually of
service-based businesses, and they
get a chance to share their story.
So these are folks that are in the
trenches, and they've learned a lot.
These are folks that have grown
companies or still building their
companies, and this is an opportunity
for sh- them to share their stories,
w- the lessons that they've learned,
the challenges that they've faced
the hard wisdom gained through the
challenges of owning a business.
And so I'm excited about today's guest.
Today Chris Riggins from Riggins
Painting is joining us, and I've
known Chris for a number of years.
Our first conversation
was at a Panera Bread.
We were introduced by a mutual friend,
and the initial conversation was, "Hey,
Chris has a painting company, and they
might need some help with marketing."
And I've had the opportunity
to work with Chris and his team
being a marketing partner with
them for a number of years now.
And so not only is Chris a great
business owner and operator,
but he's just a good guy.
I enjoyâ¦
I consider him a friend and, and he's
just, he's somebody fun to banter with.
But he's got a fantastic story.
So Chris, thank you for joining us today.
I'm glad you're on the podcast.
Chris: Man, it's an honor to be here.
And likewise, I appreciate our
friendship over the years and yeah,
looking forward to many more to come.
Steve: Now, Chris, why don't you
tell our listeners a little bit
about you, your company, and how
you even got the business started?
Chris: Yeah, man.
So I grew up in kind of what I
would call a blue collar family.
My dad was a mechanic and
painted on the side with his dad.
My great-granddad was a painter.
My great-uncle owned a painting company,
I was told that my great-granddad was
actually color blind but he could make
the best candy apple red color you
could imagine back when they would mix
the tint in the, in their vans, right?
To ma- Oh, wow ⦠to get the color
close to what the customer wanted.
So, you know, it's not something
I obviously set out to do.
I didn't thinkâ¦
I, I, I didn't know that about
my, my family until I kind
of got into it, honestly.
Okay,
Steve: so you didn't have
aspirations from childhood to-
Chris: Absolutely not ⦠have a
Steve: painting business?
Chris: Absolutely not.
No, I got married young, man.
Had kids young, responsibility started.
There was a church group that I
was a part of that had s- several
businesses, and painting was one of them.
So- Hmm ⦠in the summer I would
go and work in this company.
I learned how to paint.
When I graduated high school, I was
a foreman, project manager, and a
sales guy for that particular company.
So learned kind of the ins and outs of
the business, but also learned, learned
about the you know, how to paint.
Like, that's if you're going
to start a painting company,
it's good to know how to paint.
So that's how I started in the trade.
Well, in '09, '08, '09 when the housing
market crashed the company I was working
in prior to they shut down and- Okay
we were doing a lot of high-end new
construction at the time and so I picked
it up and you know, I just grabbed
the logo that we used to have and put
my last name on it, Riggins Painting.
The idea originally was like, let
me survive for a couple of years and
then see where it goes from here.
I had three of my five kids at the time.
It was a very tough two years '09, 2010.
It was kind of at the end of '09
when I started, so 2010 and even into
2011 it was it was a, it was pretty
brutal getting things off the ground.
But man I knew a lot about the painting
world as far as like how to put the paint
on the walls and the technical side of it.
Also, a little bit about management
and a little bit about sales.
Zero about marketing and zero
about administrating a business.
So there was a lot of like school
of hard knocks that I had to,
to run through on that side.
Th- the owner of the original business
was, was gracious enough to give me a, a
220,000 mile Ram truck with my hand tools.
So that's, that's kind of where I
started, man, just like, at, at the base
there with just my, my truck and tools.
Steve: Yeah, so, so no
aspirations for growing a company.
At that point, like you
said, it was more survival.
Chris: Yep.
Steve: The company folded and
you've got a skill set, now you've
got tools, now you've got a truck.
So those first two years, as
you said, were pretty brutal.
What were some of the lessons
that you learned through
those first couple of years?
Chris: I learned how hard it is to
start a business from the ground up.
Sure.
I mean, that's not really understanding
having really any contacts.
I mean, I had, I had some customers
that knew me like that I had worked
with in the past, so there was
at least a small starting place.
I think one of the lessons that
I learned there was how important
it was to, Manage time well.
A lot of, there's a lot of hats
that you're spending, especially
when you're starting a business.
You're the chief cook and
bottle washer, as I like to say.
I-
Steve: Yeah
⦠Chris: you know, there is no one else.
It's you.
The buck stops with you.
And, you know, if I had to do it
over again, I don't know that I
could have done it any differently
because there, there wasn't an option.
There wasn't an opportunity.
I didn't have you know, a stash of cash.
I wasn't, I wasn't saved and
ready to start a business.
I couldn't even get a
loan for that matter.
I was, in my 20s.
So yeah, there was a lot going against
me, but man, by God's grace, we were
able to kind of pull through it.
Steve: So one of the things I think is
important to note here, something you
said that, that really struck a, a chord
is Not everybody's equipped to start a
business from the ground up, and, and
because that is a unique skill set.
And, what I've seen happen, and it's a,
it's a common story for entrepreneurs, is
somebody is able to start the business.
They get through the first few years,
which as you said, can be brutal.
Just the challenges, especially when
you've got a family, you've got kids,
and, and so just the, the weight of all
of that that's riding on your shoulders.
The challenge that, that I know
some business owners and CEOs run
into is they get to a point where
things have to shift and change if
they're going to continue growing
the business beyond just themselves
and maybe one or two other people.
And so walk me through, if you will,
When did you get to a point where
you realized that you had to do
something different if you were
going to keep growing the business,
and what did that look like?
Chris: Yeah, man, great question.
I think for me, there were multiple
transition phases through the journey.
Obviously, the first transition
phase of being an employee versus a
business owner, or does the businessâ¦
Do you own the business
or does it own you, right?
And, and- Yeah ⦠that's like the
first few years of struggle of not
allowing the beast to swallow you whole.
So that just takes some grit,
stamina, and persistence, right?
But to your point, once you get to an
area where you're like, "Okay, I've
gone as far as I can personally go,"
how do you move to the next level?
And I think for each transition phase, you
need a, a healthy dose of self-awareness.
Mm.
Like, what I end up always
finding is, it's, it's super
easy to blame your surroundings.
It's super easy to blame other
people, your circumstances.
It's super hard to have a good, hard
look in the mirror and say, "What
is it that Chris Riggins needs to do
to get out of Chris Riggins' way?"
And I would say that each transition
required that type of honesty with
myself, but also seeking out that type of,
input into my life or into my business.
You know, I, I had a lot of mentors
along the way, man both spiritual
and just business oriented.
And I think that that was a huge deal.
But I would say the first transition
for me was from employee to
business, like starting a business,
and then from starting and running
the business to how do I become an
owner/operator where I'm not always
operating, but I'm owning operating.
Yeah.
And that moment I needed to hire people.
And, you know, thankfully I had some
friends that worked with me in the
past that came in and helped me do
some of the actual hands-on painting
work so that I could focus more on
sales and project management and admin.
And I saw that as like, wow,
okay, this really makes sense.
But I think there's a lot of sometimes
owners get, at least for me in the blue
collar world, not having much business
experience- there's this little piece
of pride no one can do it like I do it.
Mm.
If I'm not on the job site, it
won't go the way I want it to.
If I don't complete this particular
task, it won't get done the right way.
I've tried hiring people, and they screw
it up, and so therefore it's just easier,
quote, easier for me to do it myself.
Steve: So, so what did you help?
'Cause I think you're right, and th-
that's a common thing for founders.
Because you, you know, there,
there's this, the initial phases of
the business, you're the one who's
executing, so you're doing things the
way that you feel they should be, and
so there's a high degree of control.
And I think, I think that's difficult
for a lot of folks to get past that.
So what, what helped you
make that jump, make thatâ¦
You know, to be able to step back enough
to go, "Okay, I recognize this isn't gonna
get done exactly the way that I would
do it, but I'm gonna let go of that"?
Chris: Yeah, man.
I think thereâ¦
You know, when I was actually p-
in the painting world I had a guy
running a job one time, and he just
did it completely the opposite way
than I would, that I would do it.
He started in a place I wouldn't start.
And the midway, midway point was
nowhere where my midway point was.
There's so many things
different and, quote, wrong
about the way he was doing it.
The finished product was no
different, and the timeline-
Mm ⦠was pretty much the same.
And so that was kind of a key
in for me to be like, i, I think
it's just a humility thing, right?
Like, you gotta swallow
your pride a little bit.
And actually, when I did that and I began
to step out in faith, I saw that people
were actually better, way better at
certain aspects of my business than I was.
And once, once I began to
find those kinds of people-
Steve: Hmm
Chris: and recognize that, it made
it, it made the letting go a lot
easier, because then I knew that
it was in, it was in good hands.
Steve: So there's a couple of
things here that I wanna point out.
As leaders, as CEOs, as business
owners, it's important for us to help
define what the end result looks like.
But where we can get hung up is when we
feel like we need to dictate the how.
Now, there are clearly times where the
how needs to be done a certain way.
Absolutely.
Sure.
But there are a lot of
situations where, as you said,
he started someplace different.
His midpoint looked different, but the end
result, it was a good end result, and it
got done within the, the needed timeframe.
And so I think there are some
of those points, as you said.
It, it, it comes back to, am
I just being prideful here?
Is this me trying to control
something that I don't need to?
And then, and then two, a as you said,
you had people that you could trust.
It, it's funny because starting a business
is risky, but sometimes I think it feels
riskier to hand that over to somebody
else and letting them have some control.
Chris: Yeah, I agree.
I, I think that one of
the key points for meâ¦
So, we got to about 750,000 in, in
sales when I was still running kind
of all the ins and outs of everything.
So hiring my first, like, in-house manager
was a project manager, and then trying
to organize, like, how do I pay this guy?
What does payroll look like?
You know, what's a W-2 versus 10-9-
⦠Like, at this point, it's just been,
like my, my guys that are helping me are
1099s, so they're super easy in terms
of like, "Hey, help me with this job.
I'll pay you X number of
dollars," and we move on.
But, like, hiring a management team was
a completely different animal that I had
never s- you know, I'd never done before.
You know, so I started
going to, like, expos.
That was super helpful for me.
Go and meet people who are in the
same industry as you in a different
state they're actually very helpful
to people who are getting started.
I attribute a lot of my success to that
as well because I was able to break away.
I made the time to break away to go
to some of these expo- expos, right?
So, like, some people are like, "Well,
I can't afford the time to do it."
My argument would be you can't afford not
to do it because what ends up happening
is 30 years goes by and you're in the same
place you were and nothing ever changes
because you don't break out of the box
and lose some of the head trash, right?
Like, you need, you need another business
owner to look you in the face and say,
"What you just said is head trash.
Stop saying that.
Go do this."
Steve: It's so important to have
those people who are willing to
be that kind of person who can
do exactly what you just said.
It's like, "Hey, look, I s- I
understand why you're thinking
that, but it's not gonna work out."
Chris: That's right
Steve: And I think that goes along with
the idea of humility, it's not just a
willingness to ask for that, that type
of input and feedback, but it's then
the willingness to do something with it.
Chris: Yep.
Yep.
I think asking for it and then absolutely
it, it has to be actionable, right?
Like, we can't stay in idea mode.
If it stays in idea mode, then
yeah, you're, you're no better
than you were when you began.
Steve: And it, it's, it's the
old adage of what got you here
isn't going to get you there.
Chris: That's right.
Steve: And, and so speaking of there,
I, I wanna fast-forward because you,
you've had some pretty big transitions
over the last two years, and so the
business looks a lot different now
than it did back, you know, a few years
ago, 10 years ago, five years ago.
So w- why don't you walk us through
what's, what have been some of
the recent changes and transitions
that you've walked through?
What are some of the lessons learned?
Chris: Yeah, man.
So we, we grew the business.
We, we hired you know, some guys
to, to help me run the day-to-day
operations in the office.
I actually moved four hours away from
my business six years ago in 2020.
Has it been
Steve: that long?
Chris: Yeah, yeah, October of 2020.
Wow.
We moved, Man, seems
Steve: like it's only
been, like, three years.
That's-
Chris: Yeah
⦠Steve: that's, that's wild.
Chris: Okay.
Yeah, we moved we moved four
hours from the business.
Man, I was able to install
a general manager that could
do the day-to-day operations.
I disengaged completely from the
business and the day-to-day operations
for at least two years, and I actually
did some coaching on the side.
The business was still profitable
and still operating, and you know,
honestly, I was actually pretty
happy where I'd gotten the business.
Like, a lot of, a lot of people looking
on were saying things like, "Wow,
you made it," you know, "You did it.
You were able to build a business
and reap the benefits of the
profitability of the business and
not have to be there day to day.
That's pretty awesome,"
blah, blah, blah, and it was.
I don't downplay that.
But what happened was is there,
all the talent and people that have
brought me to that level wanted more
and needed more for their families.
And so that en- that reengaged me
back to say, "Hey, let's, let's
keep going," and that's what we did.
So, we met a group of, of folks
that were really good at, at
scaling painting companies.
We partnered with them.
We brought them in on a level that, Most
may not be comfortable doing because,
again, it was another step in that
direction for me to be like, "Okay, I can
just sit here for the next 15 years and be
just fine with what I'm, what I'm getting,
but what I want is more for my people."
And, and also realizing if I
don't, I'm gonna lose them, right?
If I don't continue to scale and grow, I'm
going to lose the talent and people that
I've brought to the table at this point.
So-
Steve: Yeah
⦠Chris: yeah, partnering with these folks,
man, and we've pretty much, I guess, you
know, at least trip- at least tripled in
our gross sales over the last since 2022.
And, yeah, we- we're up to nine, nine
in-house managers, like three project
managers, three salespeople a project
coordinator, an office manager, a
general manager, a marketing coordinator.
Those are all in-house employees
of our painting company, and
none of them paint, okay?
They all just manage-
Steve: It'sâ¦
Yeah
⦠Chris: the-
Steve: Yeah.
They're helping provide the
infrastructure, the support.
Chris: Right.
That's right.
Steve: So, I, I really, the thing I
appreciate about your story, th- there's
several things here that stand out to me.
One is, is the humility that you've
had to recognize that there are things
that you need to shift and change in
order for the business to continue
to grow and scale, and you've been
willing to ask for that help, and
you've been willing to do the work.
I think it's also it, and again,
because I've known you, a- and
so I know your character, but it,
it's your heart for other people.
You know, as you said, in, inâ¦
by a lot of standards, you,
you had sort of arrived.
You know, here you are, you've
built a business and, and you're
enjoying the, the fruit of that.
I mean, y- you've put in time, effort,
and energy, and so now you're, you're
experiencing the fruit of that.
B- but your willingness to step back
in, one, I don't hear any begrudging.
You know, you didn't do it begrudgingly
but you were willing to step back
in because, as you said, you wanted
better for your team, and you
recognize that there's a, you know,
they want to continue growing.
And so you can either support
that, or you can lock down and
try to protect what you have.
But as you said, you're probably gonna
lose them in that, which is gonna
put you back into business anyway.
So I, I really appreciate just
the, your willingness to do that.
And you, you've got a fantastic team.
Brian, your general manager, always
enjoy conversations with him.
He, he always asks me good questions,
you know, just, I know I can't, not
that I would, but, but he, heâ¦
I know I can't come in
just with fluffy answers.
You guys ask good questions because
you're- ⦠you're monitoring the
health of the business and, and-
Yeah ⦠the results of all the, the
different efforts and activities.
So as we, as we start to, to wrap this up,
C- Chris, you, you've got you said 2009,
plus you were painting prior to that.
So you're, you're coming into this
with 17 years of ownership experience,
going from being you to now a
company that you said you've got nine
people on staff, plus your painters.
So what's a lesson learned that
you wish somebody had shared with
you in the early days that you
could share with our listeners?
Chris: I would say probably two things.
One you know, you always hear
people say, "Know your numbers."
I always heard that in the business
world, like know your numbers,
and I never really knew what they
were talking about, but now I do.
Like, knowing your numbers meaning
everything should be driven by metrics,
and the decisions that you make
should be metric supported, right?
Like profitability wise you know, your
sales team you should measure by metrics.
Your pro- your project managers
are measured by metrics, and
everybody knows your numbers.
Yeah.
Not just the owner, right?
The transparency needs to be there.
And the second one that I think that
would've been helpful for me is,
like, what can I do to collapse time?
Because time is our biggest commodity.
Like, money can be made and spent and,
and will be for eternity, but we each
only have a finite amount of time.
Make the most of it.
Mm.
And if there's certain things within
your business that you're withholding
doing because you're afraid of XYZ,
ask the question to yourself, "Am I
collapsing time by making this decision?"
In other words, if, if I can hire a
coach that can get me from A to B in
six months as opposed to me struggling
for two years, is it worth the hire?
The answer is yes.
Steve: Yeah.
Yeah.
That's good.
It's, it's kind of the it's the old
adage of penny-wise and pound-foolish.
Sometimes it's worth making
the investment because, as you
said, it's going to accelerate-
what it is you're trying
to do and gain and, and the
efficiencies that can be gained.
So-
Chris: Yep
Steve: Well, Chris, thank you so
much for sharing your story with us.
Thank you for sharing the lessons learned.
And so for folks who would like to
find you, if you're in the Memphis
and the surrounding area and, and
you're interested in talking to
somebody from Chris's team about
coming out and painting your house
or your business, what's the best way
for them to get in touch with you?
Chris: Yeah, so rigginspainting.com
is absolutely the best place.
Steve knows that w- place well.
He helped me build it and maintain it.
But yeah, rigginspainting.com,
you can actually book online,
book an estimate online.
You don't even have to call
in if you don't want to.
And an estimator will come right out
based on the time that works for you,
and we'll, we'll get it taken care of.
Or you can call 901-444-0944, that's
our direct office number, and a lovely
lady will pick up and get you scheduled.
Steve: Fantastic.
Chris, thanks again for joining us.
And for our listeners, one of the things
that we always hope to help people
achieve through these stories as well
as just through marketing is clarity.
And because when clarity is
missing, it results in confusion,
and that can really hinder growth.
And so a tool that we have on our website
that can help you get some clarity
about where things are going well with
your marketing and where things are
off track and what you can do about
it, if you go to wayfindmarketing.com,
you'll see a link for our business
assessment or our marketing assessment.
It's free.
It's 25 yes/no questions,
takes about five minutes.
It'll give you an immediate score
and access to our marketing playbook.
And so we designed it to give you
clarity and actionable items that you can
begin implementing with your business.
So Chris, thanks again and thanks
to our listeners for joining us.
Chris: It was a pleasure, Steve.
Thanks.
AnnieLaurie: Okay, Steve,
let's debrief a bit.
I want to start with something
Chris said that I think
deserves a little more airtime.
He described every growth transition as
requiring a new look in the mirror, asking
himself, "What does Chris Riggins need
to do to get out of Chris Riggins' way?"
Steve, you're both a CEO and a founder.
Did that resonate with you?
And why is that sometimes
really hard to do?
Steve (2): Yes, that definitely
resonates because for a business
to grow beyond certain stages, the
founder, the CEO is the one who
really has gotta figure things out.
And, and there's a lot of
identity that, that gets wrapped
up in starting a business.
And, you know, we, we heard that
with Chris's story that he got
through those first years, but
as the, the business grew, it
required a different version of him.
And so you shift into moving away
from being the hub of the business to
needing to delegate, to giving others
responsibility and then trusting them
to go do it without micromanaging it.
And so as a, as a founder and
a CEO, giving up that sense of
control it can feel like a threat.
It feels scary and, and that's the
reason why a lot of businesses never
grow beyond a certain limit is because
the, the, the owner, the founder
doesn't get through that threshold.
And, you know, the skill set that
gets you to one stage doesn't
necessarily take you to the next.
And so to, to, to step back and
learn, reinvent, to invite feedback
that might not be easy to hear is
critical to that growth, and it's a
step that a lot of CEOs never take
AnnieLaurie: Chris also talked
about a specific moment he watched
one of his employees paint a room
in completely the wrong order.
For some reason, this just really
resonated with me personally.
But this em- this employee started
in the wrong place, the midpoint
differently, but he was done, it looked
exactly the way it was supposed to.
It was the same quality in
the same timeframe, Chris
called that a humility thing.
Steve, what would you call it?
Steve (2): I would, I would agree
with that, and I would also say
that it's a lot of self-awareness.
Humility is the virtue, but
self-awareness is, is the skill.
And, and what he was able to execute
in that moment was distinguishing
his preferences, his way of doing
things from the desired outcome.
And that's, that's honestly
something that, that a lot of
owners and CEOs have to go through.
It's, it's asking the question,
is my way the only right way,
or is it just my preferred way?
And it's having to look at what is
the desired outcome and, and giving
your team the freedom where it makes
sense to do things in their way as
long as the end result's the same.
Now let me then clarify, there
are absolutely some things that
need to be done a particular way.
It's not just the owner's preference,
it's, it's the way it needs to be done.
But there are a lot of times where
it's more of a preference than a
requirement, and CEOs who are able
to let go of that control of the
how, as long as the end result is
the same, can find a lot of freedom
when they're able to let go of that
AnnieLaurie: Yeah, I agree.
And that principle truly
applies in any leadership role.
It, not just within business, you know?
Is something we all could probably
relate to, to some degree, but I think,
you know, if you've been in any kind
of leadership role, you've felt that
tension of, all right, that is not the
way I would've done it, but the end
result is exactly what it should be.
And that is, that's hard.
And I mean, it does, does take a lot of
humility, but I think the greatest leaders
are the ones who learn that and they
stick to it, and their teams appreciate it
Steve (2): Absolutely
AnnieLaurie: So Steve, you mentioned
the danger of becoming a bottleneck.
It's inevitable.
No one does it on purpose.
But what are some signs that you
think a CEO could look out for
that might indicate that they
have become their own bottleneck?
Steve (2): You know, one is capacity.
As a business grows, especially early
on when, when the CEO is, is at the
center of all the activities, of all the
decisions, a lot of times what happens
is the business gets stuck and doesn't
grow past a certain revenue number.
Another thing to consider is do
things slow down whenever you,
the owner, are out of the loop?
Decisions that really could be
delegated keep coming back to you.
And, and sometimes this shows up in,
in marketing when, when we're working
with someone and the owner's the only
one who really understands the brand,
or maybe others understand it, but
the owner wants to have the input.
They-- everything needs
to route through them.
That, that can create some bottlenecks.
And again, it goes back to stepping
back, empowering other people, equipping
them, letting them make decisions.
Because otherwise what happens is
the business is really just running
through one brain, the owner.
We all know there's, there's a
limit to what one person can, can
handle and do because of time,
emotional bandwidth, et cetera
AnnieLaurie: Steve, I used to have
a boss a long time ago who used
to always tell us we should always
be training our replacements.
Steve (2): Hmm
AnnieLaurie: I know that's not exactly
the same thing that we're talking about
here, but I think a lot of times if we
have that mentality, even if we have
a very small team, like if, if you're
bringing somebody in and you're notâ¦
And that's that humility piece again.
Like, if you're willing to let
somebody come into your process,
see, you know, all the flaws and
all the, all the great things too,
they learn how to do it your way.
They see, they learn from your mistakes.
They, they watch you succeed and watch
you fail, and I think that that builds
trust between you and somebody else who
you do wanna hand the baton to one day
Steve (2): Yeah, absolutely
AnnieLaurie: It's also interesting
because, if I can build a bridge
here, th-there are some similar
patterns here in marketing.
lot of times people think that
they have a marketing problem,
but really that's not the problem.
They, they don't have clarity.
They're not clear on who
they're trying to reach.
not clear on what makes them different.
They're not clear on the message
that they want the market to hear.
And until they solve that, no
tactic is truly gonna fix it
Steve (2): Yeah.
And, and that's one of the reasons why
we work with our clients on, on getting
clarity, and especially in some of these
spaces where the CEO is sort of the hub
of all the activity, when these types
of things, the, the brand messaging,
the, the marketing personas or the
ICP when that gets clearly defined,
now others on the team are involved.
They get to work from the same
playbook, which can take some of
the pressure off of the owner.
And so when everybody has that clarity,
and when that's communicated through
the website, when it's communicated
through the sales team, when it's
communicated through the marketing
activities and content, then everything
downstream gets easier because
things upstream are a lot clearer.
And it's no longer just in the, the, the,
the owner's brain, but it's now in a plan.
It's now being communicated, so marketing
can be executed much more efficiently
AnnieLaurie: Yes, that's,
that's a good word.
And I think there's a lot of ways
to that one brain stuck scenario
that we mentioned a minute ago.
There, you know, we live
in a world full of, umâ¦
We all have, I would, re-watched the,
uh, uh, movies with my kids over the
Memorial Day break, and it's like we
all have our own personal Jarvis now.
Steve (2): Yes, you, we do
AnnieLaurie: train a brain to, to
think like us and, and plan like us,
and of course, the AI isn't perfect.
But it, there's definitely ways
to avoid that from happening if
you, you wanna invest in them.
But okay, one last thing I wanna
touch on before we wrap this up, and
it's that concept of collapse time.
framed it as one of his biggest lessons.
How does that show up specifically
in marketing decisions?
Steve (2): Well, I see it show up when
business owners are spending months
and months trying to figure out their
marketing only through trial and error.
They test things, they
stop, they start over.
Now, there's a place for that, but the
problem is when that's happening without
any kind of a plan, there's no strategy.
And, and so it's, it's the what
we would call hope wish marketing
or spaghetti marketing, throw it
against the wall, see what sticks.
And, and the cost isn't just the money,
it's the missed opportunities, leads that
weren't generated, a missed momentum.
And honestly, there's
an emotional cost to it.
That can get weary when you're
trying different things.
People get discouraged when
they're not seeing results.
And you know, Chris said it really well.
It's the question isn't whether
you can afford to get help, it's
whether you can afford not to
AnnieLaurie: And if someone's listening
and thinking, "I actually don't know
what's working in my marketing,"
what would be their first step?
Steve (2): What I would encourage
them to do is go take the free
marketing assessment on our
website, wayfindmarketing.com.
It's 25 yes, no questions, takes five
minutes, and it immediately gives you
a score with a clear breakdown of,
of where things are going really well
and where there are opportunities,
where things are off track.
And what it does is it gives an outside
perspective based on a marketing framework
that covers the full gamut of marketing,
and it gives you a view of marketing that
you don't necessarily get from the inside.
And, and the other thing I
would say is, is it's a free
assessment, no strings attached.
You're not gonna get
bombarded by emails or ads.
And it provides some really good resources
AnnieLaurie: Yes.
Yes.
Thank you.
So listener, go over to
wayfindmarketing.com,
take the assessment,
around on our website.
We have a learning center
full of resources that can
help you do marketing better.
And if you are looking for a painter,
if you're in the Mid-South, Memphis
area, and you need residential or
commercial painting, reach out to Chris
and, and his team at Riggins Painting.
You can find them online
at rigginspainting.com
Steve (2): Chris, thank you for being
so honest about what these different
stages look like, what they cost you,
and what it took to move through them.
This is absolutely the kind of
conversation that I love having and it
just, it makes this podcast useful and
helpful for business owners and CEOs.
So thank you for sharing that, Chris.
Greatly appreciate that
AnnieLaurie: And if this one resonated
with you, dear listener, please like,
subscribe, and share it with a business
owner in your world who might be ready
to ask themselves the same hard question.
see you next time