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Beyond The Message is a weekly podcast that dives deeper into the weekend’s teaching. Released after each Sunday service, it offers thoughtful conversation, added insight, and practical reflection to help our community process and apply what they heard. Whether you're revisiting the message or catching up, this podcast is designed to help you go deeper throughout the week.
Welcome to Beyond the Message, the podcast where we take the weekly teaching at Christ Community Chapel and bring it into your week. Each and every week I sit down with some friends and we laugh a little bit and we talk about what we just learned and figure out ways to live out what, what we are learning. if you didn't catch the sermon, not a big deal. Drop down to the description and there you'll find a link to the sermon. Watch it, and then come back and join in on this conversation. My name is Stacey DiNardo and I'm joined today by Brooks Montgomery, by Jimmy Kozy, and by Jamie Hewitt. Good day. Thanks, Jamie and Jimmy and Brooks, all of you for being here today. It's a joy. It's a great day to be here. It's a great day to be here. we'll start off with a little, way to break the ice. So Pastor Zach, one analogy he used was he was talking about turbulence on an airplane. M. Right. And he was talking about how really, you know, the pilot comes on, tells us that. And that actually just should remind us of the fact they're in control when it actually does happen. So at least they say they are. At least they say they are. I thought that's what they want you to believe. What is your best. And I actually, this was fun coming in today. Cause I was like, what is your best plane story or scariest turbulent story about planes? And Jimmy, you just came back from like a really. Yeah, I don't actually. Last night. Jimmy, you don't want to talk about it. Little too soon. We've got no, we have workers that are not able to work right now, which is really sad because the government shutdown, it created a very serious plane situation. Anyone have bad turbulence though, or, or just experience with luggage? Plane. I, I have one that comes to mind. I mean, you're a big traveler, Brooks. That, I mean, definitely the gamut of cancellations. One, one that I'm very proud of. It was, I think it was very proud of the cancellation. Very proud of the cancellation. I canceled the flight. I did something that actually segues into the flight was delayed. Right. We were coming in and the flight attendant or whatever on our plane, we were, we were going to land, hop on another quick connection for another flight to our destination. They said, you're never going to make it. We're running late. Your plane's leaving in 10 minutes. It's physically impossible for you to reach your gate. I dare not. I said, sir, what's your name? See you at the gate. And I did, I did do the unforgivable thing of, like, running to the front of the plane when we landed, right? Oh, you did. I did do that, but I sprinted. I think all bets are, I mean, I, I don't think I've ran so fast in my life. I think my heart rate was like, out of my chest. But we made the flight and it was a. We was it like. So I made it and then I had like, Lydia behind me. Okay. And you're like, she's a few minutes behind because she was carrying all the luggage. But I, I got to the gate and I was like, hey, hold the plane. But you needed to get there to hold it. And I think we have a new conversation. Like, dumb and dumber run off the jetway. And then she went and got me a coffee, grabbed our luggage. I'm kidding, but very proud of that moment, you know, running through the airport. Has anybody here ever boarded when it was not their zone? They're like, zone three. You're not zone seven. I did it a couple weeks ago and I don't regret it at all. It didn't, it didn't pop up, though, or anything. Like, they don't stop you. No, they don't. I mean, I. It's all a shame with someone else in my family that was in a different zone. And I was like, there's. The zones are meaningless unless you're. Unless you're zone one. And I think then they're like, you didn't. Zone one is like first class. So you just. Unapologetically, I was just like, you know what? I'm tired of sitting in this airport. I'm getting on the plane. That's your. Nobody stopped me. I got another plane story. we were. So it's a while ago, but, we were traveling. It was something for here. We're going to a conference with some people from the student ministry team at the time. And the conference was in Houston. And if, you've ever been to Houston, there are two airports in Houston. There's the big airport and then there's like the Southwest Frontier Airport. And, so we, we. I was flying from somewhere else, and then one of our staff members was flying there. And, so I'm in the airport. It's like 10 o' clock at night because they were late flights and we're trying to all get connected to try to drive to the hotel. And so I'm on the phone with this staff member and, and I'm. I'M like, I'm walking around baggage claim and she's walking around baggage claim. And it took us like 15 minutes to realize we are at different airports. Oh man. That's embarrassing for them. Yeah, for them. Lost, you don't have to if you don't have anything. You guys. I don't travel as much as Brooks, but. But who does. Lost our luggage on our honeymoon. So that was, that was a rough trip to not, have lugg. They did a good job of getting that stuff back to us. the thing that first came to my mind because the question is so broad. Just you flying plane. whenever my wife and I flew before we had a will, which was like the first 10 years of our marriage, we would sit in the plane and we would send a text to her sister and husband and we would say in the event of a catastrophic accident, every time you flew, entrust to. To you all of our children, all of our assets and our airplane mode. So we never knew how that would hold up in court if, if it needed to. Thankfully, it. It was not needed. but we've always wondered. That was our. Our text. Our text will whenever we would fly. Wow. okay. There's a few I could draw on. I'll make it very fast. So I. This is a long time ago, but I know you might not believe that I was alive before there were cell phones, but I was. So let's start on, Just kidding. So before that I was traveling to Europe to actually live there for a year on a missions trip. And I was going to meet someone I'd never met before. Language I didn't speak. I arrive in Austria and all of my baggage has been lost. And I don't have any way to tell the person picking me up that I'm trying to navigate lost language. It was a different world before. So. It was a different world. And so I just remember this. Yeah. Late flight and lost all my luggage. Didn't have. But. And I. But did it ever get recovered or. No, it did get recovered and brought to where I was living. But it was a, lot to navigate. There's some more there. Anyways, airplanes. We'll talk more about that. let's jump in to recap things. But even actually one step before I do. This is week nine of a ten week series which means this beyond the message has run during this 10 week series and we're gonna be taking a break after next week. So this week, next week will be on the message and then we will have our Christmas season, our Advent series, and we will be back in the new year, so be listening for that. We're so excited again to even just the fact that so many people are listening means that we're going, okay, we're, we're thankful for how God is using this and look forward to coming back after a small break. So make note of that if you are listening. And then we're going to jump into week nine, which is first Peter, chapter four, verses 12 through 19. and in this, it just, it stuck out to me that Pastor Zach was reminding us that almost 40% of the book of Peter, First Peter, is about suffering. and to just tap into the analogy he made about turbulence and about a pilot coming on that the fact that this is written to us and telling us that suffering is coming, telling us how to deal with suffering, really just preempts things to remind us that God is in control. To allow us to know like this is, this should be no surprise to us and to give us hope in the middle of our suffering. So the four points that he touched on there were suffering is inevitable. Not all suffering is the same. All suffering has a purpose. And then suffering asks us, asks a question. So to kick things off, any takeaways or where would you want to start and thinking about, what you heard this week? I think, the one thing that I came away thinking about a lot after this message was just when I'm experiencing something that is suffering, whether it's, you know, capital S italicized suffering or you know, a little day to day, just not to be so quick to try to get out of it that I don't stop to think what God might be wanting to try to do with it. Because I think our tendency is like, let's get this over with. Yep. And in alignment with that, the line from the sermon where Pastor Zach said, as long as we are entrusting it to God, no suffering is wasted. Yeah, I think that that's the same thing. Like, don't be so quick to just get out of it if God can use it for some and to shape, to redirect, to, you know, change us even. Yeah, yeah, I don't want to fall out, I don't want it to fall on us either. Like, I think this sermon really, really struck people. I know I ran into more people, were taping on a Sunday, today that had tears in their eyes saying, man, this sermon, it really, really helped me, really challenged me, but really helped me. So, you know, that Just reminds me that there's a lot of people in the middle of suffering right now. So, yeah, I think mine was. It is very, easy to interpret God's goodness based on circumstance. So if I'm in something hard, I can question God's goodness quickly. and I think Zach just continually talked about, I mean, the only thing that can anchor you with hope, anchor you, that suffering has a purpose that kind of its end. right. Like all of those realities are. Because God is good. Yeah, because God is good. that should interpret how I view my suffering, not the other way around, where because I'm suffering, that I'm questioning God's good. It's almost like the suffering doesn't diminish God's goodness. If anything, it can be a vehicle to enhance our understanding of it. And I think Zach said at some point, like, you know, suffering is not a reality, that God has abandoned you, but it perhaps could be an imitation that he is working so closely on something within you to make you more like Jesus. Yeah, no, that's really good. Well, let's take a look at a clip, that Pastor Zach, where again, he was speaking again about suffering, not always being good, but being. But the story is good. So let's check that out. Peter says that the key to understanding suffering is not to see suffering as good, but to see God and the story he's writing as good. God is using suffering, whether it's your fault, someone else's fault, or whether it's because of your faith, or whether it's no one's fault. God is using suffering to take you somewhere. He's using suffering to make you who he wants to be. Suffering isn't good, but God is. And I know, man, that is hard, isn't it? The idea that the only way for God to take me, the only way for God to get me where he wants me to go, is for me to suffer. How could I ever trust that God? How could I ever love that God? How could I ever believe that God loves me? And, friends, that's where you have to understand that God knows that is hard. And that's why he showed us and proved to us that he's good, even in suffering through Jesus Christ. Yeah, I mean, that sums up a lot. I feel like that is a summation of a lot of what Pastor Zach said. But what struck me that again, this might just be the week that it hit me in a new way and you guys have already gotten it. But, you know, the fact that at the very center of the gospel, of the story that we put our, our entire hope in, and in the truth of it is a suffering we cannot even imagine. And that, like the vehicle that God used in that suffering for our ultimate hope, you know, suffering was the vehicle rather in that. And it just was such a reminder of going like, yeah, this should not be a surprise. And yet we have such an incredible hope to hold onto. And earlier in the series, just to tie that up, I know Pastor Joe challenged us to, like, even for most of the weeks, to read through First Peter 1. And that section in First Peter 1, I'm just gonna read two verses. It says, blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ. According to his great mercy, he has caused us to be born again to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead. That ultimate suffering. Two, an inheritance that is imperishable, undefiled and unfading, kept in heaven for you. So just a reminder in the middle of whatever suffering we're in, and we'll be talking about reminder that he has gone before us in all of it. So, yeah, I don't know if you guys have anything else to add on that, but, yeah, we'll jump in. One thing, that Zach talked about in his point was just that not all suffering is equal and different types of suffering. And in this first angle was really the reality that, thinking about suffering through the lens of suffering that maybe that I have caused, I've brought on myself suffering that is being imposed upon me because of someone else's actions. Our faith can cause, be the cause of suffering. There's any variety. I kind of think about it as suffering coming in all directions. And this is a question that was in the circle guide, that was put out this week. I'm going to shout out Jamie Hewitt, who helps lead our circles. And while you're listening to this content digitally, which we value very much, you getting this content. But it is so important to have community and so shout out to circles. If you're not in one, get in one. This is a question from one of those circle guides is why is it important to kind of distinguish between different types of suffering happening, imposed on us, us to others, that type of thing. Any thoughts on that? I think, our response to suffering varies depending on what's causing it. When we were gathering up with young adults on Thursday night, one of the questions that I had those groups look at was, how would you respond differently to suffering? If you were the cause of it, how would you respond differently to suffering if it was caused by somebody else? How would you respond if it seemed like it had no cause? and how would you respond if it was suffering that arose because of your obedience to Jesus? And I think it's like, all right, if I'm the cause of it, then my response is actually repentance. That's right. If I am, suffering because of faithfulness and obedience to Jesus and sharing the gospel, then it's steadfastness. That's, the clear call of scripture. And those are very different things. One is saying you need to change from where you are. And one is saying, stay the course in the midst of this, knowing that Jesus has overcome it all. So I think understanding what is the cause of it, drastically can change how you and I should respond to it. So. And that's what I think I love. Just whether it's conviction or endurance to keep going. It's like both have a purpose. Very different purposes, to your point. Well, both have a purpose to grow through the process of even evaluating that. Right. I mean, it might be forgiveness. If suffering is caused and being imposed on you because of something someone else has done, that being able to extend forgiveness is another direction. And, yeah, our posture entirely can change. or I mean, alternatively to that, if the suffering is arising because of your disobedience to God. It's kind of like that. I'm sure you've all seen that meme on the Internet of the guy in the hot dog suit, and he's saying, we're all trying to find the guy who did this. When in reality, it's like, you know, in some respects, the response there is not to lament the suffering and to confess the sin and figure out what to, you know, that doesn't make the suffering any less unpleasant, but at the same time, to lump that in with suffering that might be coming because you're obeying Jesus or that is external suffering like an illness, or, you know, that's. You can. It's like using too blunt of, an object when you need precision. Yeah. And responding in any of those different ways is how I think we can see Jesus in the midst of any of them. So I think, you know, if you are the cause of it and you pursue repentance, you meet Jesus in that. Yes. If you are being sinned against and hurt and you pursue forgiveness. That's right. Knowing how you've been forgiven, you get more of Jesus. That's right. Like in any one of those things, as you apply, you know, the scalpel making the distinction of what's causing this suffering. You get to meet Jesus in a clearer way than if you just have a one, you know, suffering. Yeah. And this is what you just grin and grit down and bear it or whatever. Like, I don't know if, if you really get to see Jesus as clearly. Yeah. And maybe it's like obedience to Jesus is actually going to. In your suffering is going to require you to kind of be able to discern and locate. Right. Like it's that. I think that's the It's very easy for me when I suffer just to get really cynical and they're just like kind of to your point earlier of just like a. See suffering as bad, get myself out of it however quickly I can versus in some sense embracing, hey, what is what. Why am I suffering? What does obedience look like in this? It's just a very different mindset that in my flesh I have no. A, natural default pursuit of. Yeah. Trying to discern first. Yeah. So before you just avoid. Yeah, exactly. So I think we've also learned and seen that suffering can be a catalyst for change, for movement, for refining. Right. I mean, some of what we talked about even speaks to that. Zach went through kind of a number of different things, honestly, pretty quickly of saying, you know, suffering can serve to be a stop sign. It can be sandpaper, a spotlight. There's a lot of different directions we could go in that and that I think we can think about suffering in. But how have you seen suffering in your life? Maybe be one of those things, shape, change, refine you. and what has, what has that looked like for. For you? I think, I have two. Two things that are related to. I think the first is I've definitely had periods in my life where I felt like I've seen the sandpaper effect. So, you know, over the last few years, different members of my family have struggled with illness and things have. And that. That's really challenging because, you know, and if you have a family member who's ill, you know that. And But I think, for example, my wife has been sick at various points. Not, you know, life threatening, but like sick enough that it has impacted our family in some ways. And I think that that has shaped and molded me as a husband and as a father and as a follower of Jesus. The one thing that I think that dawned on me recently is that, sometimes that effect is best seen in the rear view mirror. You know, I think that's what's hard about suffering while you're in it, while you're in it, you don't necessarily see what. What God is doing. So maybe that's another step that we talk about later is like, what does it look like when suffering is concluded to not just be like, oh, I'm so relieved that this is over. Which, of course, is a natural thing to feel, but then to also say, okay, let's do an audit of this. What did God do? How was he faithful? How did he show up? How did he shape me? How did he transform me? Because he does. And he will. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I think that's often inviting his people to remember and reflect. And I think that that's a good thing for us to do. so maybe, like we talked about trying to discern on the front end instead of just trying to avoid it, but on the back end, actually taking the time to reflect. for me, I was thinking about the S's. There was a steering wheel was one of them. Yeah, steering wheel was one. Yeah. And so, the message I listened to did not have the steering wheel. So I'm interested. Well, that's Pastor Zach for you. Gonna get different. Different S's and different S. But as I came out of high school, I applied to one college. Cause I was sure I was gonna get into that college. I had my vision of what college was gonna look like. And, I'll be honest, I'll say that God was next to no part of that. Not considered, not really a part of my equation. And I didn't get in. And I remember, like, I had friends who had lower SAT scores, lower gpa, like, all these things. And I'm just like, why? What happened? I remember being really frustrated in the moment of what felt like suffering to me. Looking back on it, that is one of the greatest kindnesses that God has ever done, was withholding from me what I thought I wanted and what I thought was best for me, which felt like suffering in the moment in order to redirect my life, because I ended up staying at home, going to community college. the ministry that I had met Jesus through, was gonna just fold. It was gonna stop existing. And I remember sitting there and being like, well, I'm here. I guess I should help keep this thing alive. And so I started serving in this ministry. And God grew me so much through that. And I'm sitting here today, I believe, because of God's goodness in allowing me to suffer, in redirecting my life in that way, that could be a really good, even just takeaway. For this week, if you're listening, is just going, think back on an experience you've had that was difficult, that was hard, that was suffering. We'll label it as that and go, where do I see God in this? How do I see God use this in my life? And in some sense, it's like, man, that is what all of scripture is. It's like every single moment of, hey, God working in someone. Right? Uh-huh. Like, whether it was suffering based on their own sin or suffering for something that someone did to them, them, it's like all of scripture is evidence that God is circumstantial. His goodness is constant. Right. And it's like us learning and being reminded that from our own stories, but also just in Scripture, is that suffering is not absence of God. Rather, it's, hey, it's part of the story. It's part of even what Christ modeled to say, inviting us to die to yourself, like, that's going to have some suffering. To be able to rise up with me and have new life. Like, suffering is a trajectory for all of us, right? It'll be in there. It'll be in there. Yeah. Yeah. And I'm just thinking of examples in my life, and a lot of them would involve different members of my family. Again, maybe sometimes me not always being the one directly in the line. But another reason why community is so important, you know, is going in that we were able. In multiple instances, I can think, we were just able to point each other and encourage each other in Christ in the middle of really difficult things, in the middle of suffering. because doing it on our own, we're, you know, rarely, I think, do we see things really clearly and for what they are. But often others can help point it out and help us. Especially when you're in it. When you're in it. Right. And when it's affecting you and you are experiencing that suffering, like, it's. That's really hard. Yeah. So this we've. We've talked about. I was talking to Pastor Joe about what next week's sermon is. And it's not actually about suffering, guys, but these last. We have had a good bit in First Peter, and if you think about, like, kind of the overarching scope of that, do you feel like there's anything God has taught you, in the big picture of how we think about suffering? I. I'll jump in to start. And, Jimmy, I'm wondering if you have something similar, but reminded me of, I think I tend to be a fixer, and I just Want to get out of a problem and get to the solution right away. And that is just my tendency. And I, will say that even like my. I. I talk to a counselor sometimes, and my counselor is often the one going, like, sometimes you need to just stay in it a little bit. And that isn't just to be a, like, wow, woe is me. Let's make sure we stay in our suffering. But I think there is a reality that there's a lot God can teach us by. And not just dismissing the fact that myself or someone else may be in the middle of something hard by trying to get to a solution. because God is so present and has showed us so much. And I mean, if, you know, I was reminded especially because Zach read all of Isaiah 53, towards the end of his message. And just the reminder of like, who Jesus is in that and the fact that suffering is very central and not to be celebrated, but God is to be celebrated in it. Yeah. I was just thinking about that even just holding communion that just came in like as Zach read Isaiah 53, and as we take communion every single week, it's that, I think to your point, it's like suffering disorients us. Right. It's like we don't really see straight oftentimes when we're suffering. And the thing that every single week to relocate to recenter our hearts is that when we take communion, remembering the extent in which Christ wanted to show his love for us. and that's almost like. It's almost like getting lost. And you need a GPS to kind of recenter and re. Guide you. It's like, man, that's what. That's a great. This series Communion has been that really profoundly. I think one of the things that makes me think about is the need for us as Christians to intentionally process and pray with God. Because I think, that's one of the things I found to be true in my life when I've experienced times of suffering is that, it's. Maybe this is not the right term. It's productive in the sense like when I am engaged in regular practices of processing. Suffering is productive. When you engage. When I'm engaged with the Lord. Yeah. When you entrust. Entrust it to God. Because as I'm in it. Yeah. And I'm, processing with him. That's when you begin. The Spirit begins to, to reveal. Okay, these are the things that. Within yourself within. Right. Whereas. And I think that maybe takes me to another point that to resist the Temptation to allow suffering to. To drive you away from. From God. Yeah. Because I also. I also understand if it's like, life is hard, I feel like you're responsible God. Therefore, I don't really want to talk to you about it. Yeah. When in reality, we should resist that urge and instead take it as an opportunity to draw near because you might have something to say. Oh, that's really good. I think in light of the repetition, you know, in some ways, you come to week nine of a, sermon series, and you're saying, okay, you know, we've talked about suffering. We've talked about. Yeah. And it can feel like there's been a lot of it. I'm struck over the scope of everything, how much I need to hear it over and over again. I say this a little bit in jest, but as a professional Christian, like, I am so slow to experience suffering and then immediately turn my direction to God. And so you read through 1 Peter, and it's like, in your suffering, remember what Jesus did. That's right. Remember who Jesus reveals God to be and his goodness. In the midst of that, like, Brooks was talking about. And I'm just like, that is not my reflex. Yeah. Think about, you know, on one end, you, when you're hearing it week after week, you could be like, all right, I get it. But it's like, tomorrow I'm going to forget that when actually suffering shows up on my doorstep as a human, I'm going to be like, gosh, why is this so hard? Why can't it just be easy? And I'm like, I need this over and over and over again. And the example of Jesus is really poignant there because in his time of greatest suffering in the Garden of Gethsemane, you see him intentionally pursuing closeness with God. Yeah. Even when he's saying things like, m. Is there another way? Is there another way? Do we have to do it this way? Can. You know, and, I just think that's informative. Three times. Yeah. Going back, we were probably unwise if we ever think that we figured this out. That's right. I think that's. You get to the end of it. Like, oh, man, I heard that a whole lot. This sermon series, it's like, well, it's probably because we need it that much. No, that's so true. Okay, well, I just encourage all of us. I think there's lots to take into our week. Again, whether it's processing something God has done in your life and thinking about those moments of suffering and how he has used it. to again, looking at 1st Peter chapter 1 or Isaiah 53. Some great passages to kind of dig into a little bit more. But thanks so much for joining me and we'll be back next week. Thanks so much for tuning in to Beyond the Message. Before you go, just make sure to subscribe so you don't miss out on any content in the future. And also, we have content for you all week long on our CCC app, YouTube channel, or even on our website so that you can grow where you are all week long. Share that with friends and with family. Until next time. We'll see you soon.