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The podcast on man things
S1 E10: Rocky Pt. 2
Catherine: All I've seen so far is talk and charm and smoozing. Smooth smoothing.
Christiaan: Is that smoothing?
Catherine: Smoothing, schmoozing. Hi, everyone. I'm Catherine, and this is men's stuff, the podcast on man things.
Christiaan: Wait, I thought we established you're not a man. Am I remembering that correctly?
Catherine: But who better to learn about man stuff than a woman? Today we're picking up where we left off with the 1976 movie Rocky, and we are doing part two of our in depth analysis. Christiaan, my friend, is joining me. He's the expert on the topic of martial arts as well as the film Rocky. So I have 14 pages of notes, by the way. Now I have a good reference point, knowing that 14 pages of notes is 2 hours of talking. So thank you, Chris.
Rocky preparing for heavyweight title fight against Apollo Creed
We're going to just pick up right where we left off. Rocky has learned that he's going into this heavyweight title against Apollo Creed. Things are heating up between him and Adrian. He's really kind of getting into the training portion of the film, and it's.
Christiaan: Going to be a big one. It's going to move.
Catherine: It's going to move. It's going to heat up. Okay, well, let's just jump right in then.
The film opens with Rocky getting interviewed for a new job at a gym
Halfway through, we get back on track with the plot, titanic style. It's time for the second vhs tape, and Rocky has a fight in five weeks, and he's got to get ready for it. We see Rocky getting interviewed. He shouts out to Adrian during the interview, which is very romantic. Someone finally takes the cigarette out of his mouth, which I was grateful for. So this random man agrees that he should probably chill on the smoking if he's training. Uh, we also see that now everyone wants a piece of the pie. Adrian's brother, Polly, he wants to be a part of it. The coach at the gym who wouldn't give Rocky the time of day now wants to be part of it. And we have this interesting scene where the coach goes over to Rocky's house to try to secure his position as coach. And Rocky reminds him that he hadn't helped him in the past ten years that they've known each other. And even the way the coach is presenting his pitch still feels like he doesn't view Rocky as a good athlete. He's never really telling Rocky that he earned it more focusing on that his coaching can make the win happen. And then Rocky has this really authentic meltdown that, uh, I think we've all kind of had. When we feel someone hasn't seen our full worth, he just lights into the coach punching walls, really like letting us see this emotion that he's been bottling up. And I hope it was cleansing for him because it was for me.
Christiaan: Right. And that scene always kind of made me think about, like, a surrogate father scene. But why am I not good enough for you, dad? I feel like it spoke to a lot of people, um, who maybe either didn't have fathers who had to find father figures in other locations or if they were someone living under a father. So that scene was extremely cathartic.
Catherine: It was so good because whenever I feel that way, I wonder, do other people have moments like this? And thank you, Rocky, for letting me know that. Yes, other people feel this way, too. Even Rocky lost his school. Mister m genuine mister good guy.
Christiaan: Rocky starts practicing abstinence leading up to the fight
Then the training starts. And this is good because he only has 45 minutes left in the film and he needs to get to it. So we get a scene where he wakes up, gets out of bed, and starts dropping raw eggs into a glasse, which, of course, he drinks. Then he does something that really concerns me as a runner. He drank two cups of raw eggs and then went directly out for a run. Um, have you ever gone for a run in the morning, Christiaan?
Christiaan: I have. And let me tell you, there's usually a good 15 minutes between when I drink some water and eat a protein bar before I. Before I will attempt that run.
Catherine: 1 minute you're running, the next you're running to the bathroom. And that's with, like, a piece of toast, not two cups of raw eggs. Um, we see the stairs for the first time. He gets a stitch running up them. I thought this was the training montage scene. I got excited and it wasn't. We learned that Rocky has employed the jerk coach even after all of that. So he's mature and he still takes this offer. And they work on his footwork by tying his feet together. So he's improving his methods, which is something he struggled with. We see Paulie let Rocky use his meat cooler for training. This is good, too, because before this meat cooler, Rocky was just punching his couch in his apartment. So he's upgrading a little bit. I'm wondering, why is he not training at the gym? Punching the bags.
Christiaan: Always wonder
00:05:00
Christiaan: that. And what is it with this movie and raw food? The raw eggs, the raw meat. How is Rock e. Coli or salmonella like that man should at the very least?
Catherine: You know, that's a very good point. There's a lot of germs. Please wash your hands. Rocky goes and he starts fighting the meat. And speaking of fighting the meat, Rocky starts practicing abstinence leading up to the fight because, as his coach told him, women weaken legs. I can't comment on that at all. I'm not a man. I have no idea how having sex affects, uh, your physical performance.
Christiaan: Nothing is off limits today. I think it's to get you aggravated. Testosterone leaves you one of two choices. Fuck it or kill it. And I think by taking away the one option, he was hoping he would channel all of his energy into the other. That's just my pet theory. At, uh, no point in my taekwondo history did they tell me I was supposed to remain abstinent.
Catherine: So testosterone makes sense. It's not a, uh, performance enhancer, but it kind of is. So you're not taking steroids, but you're just upping your aggravation levels. And, you know, it did give us a little glimpse that she was just distracting him by questioning his motives for being a fighter. The coach does know what he's talking about.
Christiaan: One thing I like about Adrian, she never discourages him, really. She questions, but she never asks him to stop. She never forced that. We do know that rocky is full of doubt, and I can't but wonder if the coach recognized that. I was like, okay, how do we insulate him? Like, the coach knows Polly, which means the coach probably knows Adrian. There's been a lot of questions.
Catherine: Yes. And if this man has been coaching for this long, then he knows it's not just about physical training, it's mental training, too.
We get a cut to Apollo Creed preparing for the fight against Rocky
Then we get a cut to Apollo Creed and how he's preparing for the fight. Strategic marketing, press releases going on camera. He's dumping tons of money into the media campaign and is even sending 200 flowers to the mayor's wife. I'm wondering at this point, can this guy even fight? Because all I've seen so far is talk and charm and smoozing. Smooth smoothing. Uh, smoothing, schmoozing. I am wondering, is Apollo Creed just all talk? But I like him, and I guess he's kind of the antagonist, but honestly, he doesn't seem to have any glaring moral flaws. He doesn't insult Rocky. They just kind of get along like, we're going to fight. And he makes some jokes to him. So I still find him very likeable.
Christiaan: And, you know, that's a great point. Apollo is just likable person. He's the heavyweight champion. He's not taking the fight super seriously because Rocky's in the little leagues. There's that idea that maybe Apollo is underestimating him a little bit, and that's his fatal flaw. He's just a good guy.
This movie came out in 1976, which means filming was between 74-75
And something I really appreciate about this is, again, it came out in 1976, which means filming was between 74 and 75. Apollo's black, and he's the person in the position of power here. He's the one who's the heavyweight champion. He's the one with the money. He's the one that got this plot moving, and that's unusual, but he's not portrayed in any way, shape, or form as a true villain. He's the catalyst for Rocky's growth. He's not sending anonymous letters to the editor, insulting Adrian, you know, sends the mere 200 roses, you know, which is just a very charming thing to do. He's a smart businessman. He knows how to work this from a business angle. I've always thought he liked Rocky. I like this one. This is gonna be fun.
Catherine: Yes, yes. It's very genuine. And I like that you pointed out the time period and just how they portray this character. He's a black man. He's very successful, renowned, and he's charming, and he's nice, and he's likable. Desegregation of, uh, schools was in 1969. This movie being seven years after that, that is truly forward thinking and breakthrough for them to portray him that way. And I also noticed that the news reporter was a black woman. Her dialogue, though very short, was direct and confident and in control, and I appreciated that.
Christiaan: This is never a grudge match, but it was still so hyped by the time we get to the fight, it's like, all right, here we go. Do we feel like you must take down Apollo? We want him to win, but not because we want him to beat Apollo, per se. We want him to win for him.
Catherine: Yes.
Christiaan: Yay.
Catherine: You are so modest. You're just like Rocky, someone who isn't modest. We cut to a scene where the brother, Paulie, is having another emotional meltdown, and we see a huge argument. Adrienne stands up for herself, and she and Rocky go off to live together. And it makes me continue to question Rocky's friendship with Polly. Ollie's having some trouble. He's struggling.
Christiaan: Yeah, it does beg a lot of questions, and it kind of makes you wonder if Rocky has the confidence to be social enough to make other friends. Polly might have picked up Rocky, so to speak.
Catherine: Sure.
Christiaan: But, yeah, uh, we know that Polly's toxic. Somebody like Rocky, who's, you know, cognitive faculties
00:10:00
Christiaan: are not great. Rocky was not on the honor roll. You can't help but wonder if somebody like Polly, who is a bit more clever, absorbed him because Rocky being a debt collector who's also a talented fighter would be someone that somebody working as an entrepreneur would definitely want to have in their back pocket. Ooh.
Catherine: Everybody else in Rocky's life, it's quite transactional. There's not a lot of relationship. When he meets Adrian for the first time, he's just talking nonstop. Rocky talking. He's so comfortable with her that he can be himself, but he doesn't have that with any other character.
Christiaan: He's almost submissive to a lot of other characters. He tends to take a lot of abuse from other people.
Catherine: Another thing I noticed in this scene is that Adrienne has stopped wearing her glasses altogether. So, um, I guess her vision is fixed. Love is not blind. It's the opposite. And she swapped out her crappy beanie for very fancy berets, which, honestly, I don't hate. She kept her signature hat. I. And then fan service.
I'm wondering if the fight is even legitimate and if it's engineered
Finally, I get my montage. He has 29 minutes left. And the montage begins. Rocky song starts. It's a Pennsylvania morning. The sun is rising. He's running in his gray jogging suit. He's carrying some bricks like you do running on the train tracks, going through the open air market. Everyone's watching are high. He starts doing some insane push ups at the gym that involve legs being in the air. He goes to town on some meat. And then the payoff scene, he runs up those stairs. Philadelphia is his bitch. I feel like I've trained to fight Apollo Creed at this moment. So satisfying.
Christiaan: And I do have to, at this point, insert the obligatory he's beating his meat on camera joke.
Catherine: Honestly. Almost made a comment about the gray sweatpants.
Christiaan: Always, especially running up the stairs. Yeah.
Catherine: Mhm. He knew what he was doing. Apollo's going down. He's had five minutes of screen time, and none of it has been fighting or training. So I'm kind of worried for him at this point.
Christiaan: Right?
Catherine: And then, as if the movie gods read my mind, we get a scene where Rocky visits the venue. For some reason, Apollo's manager is there and he tells him that the fight doesn't really matter and that Rocky's going to give it a great show. So just when I was feeling like Rocky had a chance. Now I'm wondering if the fight is even legitimate and if it's engineered for Rocky to lose. Having not seen Apollo train, having seen Rocky train, and then those two things really stuck out to me. Those two quotes. It doesn't really matter and you'll give it a good show. Made me feel like it's engineered for Rocky to lose. He comes home, he's doubting himself. Adrian comforts him. She's very supportive. And he even shares with her that he knows he's going to lose, but he wants to go the distance with Creed because no one has ever done that before. And I've heard the phrase going the distance, and I always thought it was related to automobiles. But in this case, he means he wants to go to the end of the fight with no knockout.
Christiaan: Yep. He's hoping to make it to the end of the fight. Cause the thing about Apollo, we don't see him train, but I think it's gonna add a little bit to that mystique. Cause he is the heavyweight champion. How dangerous is this guy? And then now, uh, even Rocky's doubting himself. And, you know, Rocky knows who he is. Rocky's undoubtedly, uh, seen his fights on tv or listened to them on the radio or read about. Well, maybe not read about. Had them read to him later by somebody who can be pastor. He knows how good Apollo is. This guy has that whole history behind him. He has this whole institution behind him. He's had these many years of professional training behind him. No one expects him to win. Oh, uh, he's like, you know, what? If I can't win, that's okay, because I'm gonna last longer than they thought I'm going to. That's kind of a powerful moment for him. How do you beat someone who's not afraid to lose?
Catherine: Oh, that is a good point that we've had this very microscopic view of rocky training, and Rocky has probably been in his own head training for the past five weeks now. Rocky level sets as an audience. We level set. Wait a minute. Even after all of this, he's still going up against Goliath here?
Christiaan: Yeah.
Catherine: Okay. So I like that you have a very realistic viewpoint where mine was so conspiracy like, it's going to be rigged. We cut to the fight. It's about to start. He's saying goodbye to Adrian, and he still finds time to flirt with her and be unbelievably adorable. I love you, Rocky. Don't change. Then we get to the entrances. Rocky's is very low key, but we see his ultra cool italian stallion robe. When Apollo Chubb's creed has a huge entrance, that's very patriotic. Over the top, he's surrounded by sexy statues of Liberty.
00:15:00
Catherine: He is truly embracing the pomp and circumstance of the fight. So we get even more visual representation of how these people are different.
Rocky at 190 and Apollo Creed at 210 weigh in for heavyweight title fight
Now, another martial arts question for you. When they announced the fights, they mentioned the weights, and I noticed that Rocky weighed 190 and Apollo Creed weighed 210. That seems huge. Is 20 pounds okay for a heavyweight title match?
Christiaan: So it depends on how the brackets are done, but that is, they would be on opposite ends of the same bracket, and that makes a huge difference in power. The implication that's kind of unspoken, though, is that Rocky's more likely to be able to use a stick and run strategy. He's going to be able to wear out the heavier opponent because even that opponent is stronger than he is, maybe has better cardio. They still have to use more energy per movement, and, I mean, moving the same distance is going to take them more energy. So if he can outlast his opponent, that would be the assumed strategy coming in if he were going to win. But there's going to be a notable difference in power to the audience right off the bat. And when we see them side by side, we can really see that difference, because, I mean, Apollo is not a small man. Rocky's up to, like, what, his nose, his chin, something like that. Like, I mean, he's significantly shorter. He's very much looking the proverbial horse in the mouth.
Catherine: I love it, if I understand correctly about these weight classes, is that they're set with these parameters because the fighters have to decide where they want to apply their skills. Just like, if you're building a character in a video game, you have ten pounds. Are you going to dedicate that ten pounds to muscle, weight, and strength, or be leaner and you'll have more agility and quickness and reaction time. So where you apply your dedication has a lot to do with the fight. We have Rocky at 190 and Apollo Creed at 210.
Christiaan: So the size difference alone, like, just biologically speaking, like, Paolo just has a much bigger frame to work with. Rocky might be in trouble, but in the training aspect of it is an interesting thing because, you know, we know that Rocky's, um, coach was really working with him on his footwork, but we can definitely see, like, as we're watching, Rocky's more comfortable working on his athleticism, his power. He has a lot of training in behind his skills, because, you know, whenever you have this kind of combat sport, there are the two sides of training that kind of triangulate. One is just the straight up skills, and the other side is the physical athleticism, which then also breaks down to the things like power, speed, agility, flexibility, endurance, things like that. When you really think about, we've seen Rocky train hard, but we haven't really seen him on the technique as much as he has been on the conditioning side of it. And now we're left to wonder, how much of an expert is Apollo with the technique? And will good technique beat scrappiness, especially.
Catherine: When there's power behind tale as old as time? M can scrappiness beat skill is just another one of those things that increases the anticipation of this fight.
Adrian: I really like the cinematography in Creed. It's very raw and authentic
We have the underdog, and you rhetorically posed the question, how is Apollo on his technique? I'm gonna guess pretty good. We have this amazing scene, everyone panning around the ring while the boxers fight each other, punch each other. First of all, their punches are looking exactly like the Nintendo game punch out, which Chris brought. And I'm like, are those stunt doubles, or are they the two actors, the.
Christiaan: Folks we saw on camera, they knew how to box. They knew what they were doing.
Catherine: Yes, there was no fancy camera work, and it is just very raw. It's all them doing it. Then we have a really notable thing happen. Rocky knocks down Apollo, and it's the first time that's ever happened to Apollo Creed. He's never been knocked down in 46 fights.
Christiaan: That is enormous. And it was a turning point in the movie because it really kind of gives you that hope of, can Rocky win? Because now Apollo has that moment where he's like, shoot, I should probably take this a little more seriously.
Catherine: It's as if he woke up. The mood and the pace of the fight completely changes at this point. And again, I really like the cinematography. Everything is faster and more raw. I can feel the emotions of Apollo Creed, that hunger to win is palatable. I can just feel it in all of the movements. The intensity increases. Now we realize that Apollo can fight. He might wear nice suits and send the mayor's wife roses. He got where he is for a reason.
Christiaan: At this point in the movie, we're getting a very fast look at the subplot for Apollo's character development, because I can't help but wonder if all that showmanship, all the business side of it, if he was starting to get bored with his career, the way he toyed with Rocky in the beginning and his cheeks got clapped first time he got knocked down ever, that was a growth point for him. I wonder if he found the joy in the fight after that, because, I mean, he. It's not just him putting his best into it, but he's having to work for it. Halfway through that fight, both of these men are bleeding. They're actively bleeding.
Catherine: Rocky gets punched in the eye, and it's swelling. So badly that it has be cut open to relieve the pressure. You gotta be really close with somebody to cut open
00:20:00
Catherine: their eyelid, right.
Christiaan: They didn't just show Rocky being the one having to power through that, uh.
Catherine: Though Rocky breaks some of Apollo Creed's ribs, all of that meat training, it paid off. We see Apollo creed suffering injuries. Both sides telling their management team this fight is not to be called off, no matter what. I think that Apollo Creed probably had a lot more to lose in this fight. Going up against this no name, but the intensity that Rocky approaches it with, it almost turns for him, too. He's proving things for himself. For Adrian, his equal view of not backing down is very cool. They're in it to win.
Christiaan: It, uh, between the two of them, Apollo truly had more to lose at the same time. Like, he definitely proved he's not this pampered, spoiled little business guy in a suit. You know?
Catherine: He is not.
Christiaan: But that fighting spirit can go across classes, it can go across races, it can go across generations. Like, that's one of the things I love about that fight so much is no matter which side you're rooting for, you're on the right side. Yeah, that's one of the real good moments about that movie.
Catherine: Yeah, that boxing fight where everyone was bleeding was such a feel good moment. I agree.
Christiaan: So bizarre. But that's where we ended up.
Catherine: Rounds and rounds go by. Someone in the background says the phrase in the kisser, which really did it for me. And then we get to the final round, and rocky kind of gets his bell rung. We know that he wants to go the distance. He gets knocked down slow to get up. Seven count before he starts getting to his feet. He's seeing birds flying around his head. Ultimately, even though he's wobbly on his feet and partially conscious, he does not get called out, and he continues to fight. To the surprise of Apollo Creed, who almost seems reluctant to go punch him again. He manages to stay upright. And then a little anticlimactic. The bell rings, and the fight's over. No one is knocked out. It's just done.
Christiaan: We are really conditioned for the big finish, but the fact that he went all the way to the end, I feel like it's a little bit more realistic that he didn't knock out Apollo. Apollo wins by decision. Right. But let's be honest. Rocky won the day, he won the event, and he wanted to make it to the end of day, and he made his goal. And the fact that he and Apollo hug it out at the end, I think it's just such a beautiful conclusion.
The fight between Rocky and Apollo lasted 15 rounds. Is that normal?
Earlier I mentioned that with that weight difference, I mean, 20 pounds, that's a lot. I'm about 20 pounds heavier now than I was at my fight weight ten years ago. And I can tell you the amount m of power I have now versus then is significant. I can only imagine what that's like, being on the other end of that. Yeah. Rocky didn't use the stick and run. He was right there, toe to toe, trading blows with a much larger, much stronger, more experienced opponent. And he did it for 15 rounds.
Catherine: 15 rounds. Is that normal? Because I thought that most had three and maybe five if it was a big match.
Christiaan: It's very, very, very rare for it to go beyond three or five, because usually at some point, a decision is going to get called. Somebody's going to be, uh, a judge, the referee, one of the coaches. Someone's going to throw something if someone has not been knocked out already. Yeah. So it's very, very rare. But when it does happen, it is exciting. I don't know if you've ever watched a long boxing match, and, uh, I'm not someone that gets invested in sports on tv, girl. I was yelling and I was angry that he wasn't listening to me fight better. Why?
Catherine: Oh, my gosh. That's a good point. Probably the crowd was very invested at that point. They came there to see a fight. It was not over in 30 minutes, but in fact, it went 15 rounds. Do you know off the top of your head how long a round is?
Christiaan: I don't punch out. It's two.
Catherine: See how accurate that game is.
Christiaan: How long are rounds in, um, pro boxing? Three for men, two for women.
Catherine: 15. Three minute rounds. That is 75.
Christiaan: 45.
Catherine: 45. Yeah, 45 minutes. Thank you.
Christiaan: Math is hard.
Catherine: 45 minutes straight boxing. That's insane.
Christiaan: That is exhausting. First, your quads and your calves have to be constantly engaged so that you can move fluidly and quickly. Your shoulders have to be constantly engaged so that you can move correctly to block and dodge as need be. Your abs are constantly engaged. You can torque and get the power you need. It's not just your arm.
Catherine: And then their time in the corner in between rounds is being dedicated to minor surgery. So, um, it's not like they're getting any true breaks here. You mentioned the significance of them hugging it out at the end just shows they both went through this together and the just incredible amount of respect they have for each other. And it is a contrast to, at the beginning of the film, the person with the great thighs that rocky was fighting
00:25:00
Catherine: at the end of their match. It cut to them both being in the same room, sitting on opposite sides, not speaking to each other. So we get very interesting comparison as, uh, Apollo has refound his passion for fighting, but maybe, maybe Rocky has, too.
Christiaan: Rocky got what he wanted. He proved himself worthy, and, you know, it's like, no one can look at that match and be like, you got clapped. Uh, dude, I knocked him down in the first round. Excuse me. And, you know, Apollo actually got a challenge that he was looking for. You know, both men ultimately got what they wanted out of this fight, and they got it together, as you said, that mutual respect that they had for one another. And they hug it out, and it's such a beautiful ending in the first moment, as that bell rings, it feels anticlimactic, but then you see the aftermath of it. It's like, oh, but this was literally the best possible outcome. Everyone gets a happy ending. That is something you don't really see coming.
I think the point of Rocky has been lost over the years
Again, we want the bad guy defeated. The bad guy was defeated. It was doubt, and it's gone now.
Catherine: I was not expecting any of this. You know, they let you marinate on that. The bell rings. It's announced. It's a split decision. Apollo one, Rocky's calling out for Adrian. She came and saw the end, and then the movie's over. It's it. I assume Rocky and Apollo are lifelong friends. Adrian and Rocky get married. Don't spoil it for me if we do a rinky, too. Uh, but it just. Just as quickly as it began with the rocky across the screen, then, boom, fade to black. We're done.
Christiaan: Yep, we're done.
Catherine: I was sitting there marinating with my feelings, and my first thought was, I need backstories like this for any mma, boxing, wrestling event on television. I need in depth backstory.
Christiaan: Make me care about you.
Catherine: Yes.
Christiaan: So I feel like the point of Rocky has been lost over the years because I think it's been kind of hyper masculinized. And I say that as someone that grew up in the eighties, because it led into the eighties. I brought punch out because that was one of the most popular games on the NES for a long time. In the eighties were this strangely hyper sexualized, hyper masculinized time, like we had Conan the barbarian, Gi Joe, hyper masculine men. I mean, between he man and thundercats, that was the gayest hour on tv until we got RuPaul. And I think that because of that push, that kind of happened between the eighties and nineties. I think the point of Rocky, that this is one man's journey of growth. I think that that part gets lost, because what do people remember? If you ask them about Rocky? The training montage, most of them probably don't even remember the actual fight. If you ask who won? Rocky, wait, no.
Catherine: We've learned that the real answer is everyone.
Christiaan: Literally everybody got what they wanted out of that fight. It's beautiful.
Catherine: Everybody hollow. Rocky. Adrienne, the mayor's wife, she won. She got 200 flowers. It's incredible. And what you said was exactly how I felt going into this movie. I identified the six things I knew about it. To be completely honest with you, I thought I was going to be making fun of this a lot more. And it's an excellent film. It's relatable and genuine and cathartic in a way. I've only been to Philadelphia once, and that's probably the only thing I have in common with this movie.
Christiaan: Like I said, it speaks to so many people on so many different levels, because whether you're in a combat sport or not, if you're somebody that's experience, self doubt, that feels like maybe you're underestimated. God knows women in this world could certainly identify with that.
Catherine: Yes.
Christiaan: Often are women underestimated in business, in journalism, in the sciences, mathematics, medicine. The queer community, being the underdogs, like, we see ourselves in it. Like, it's just people who are members of, uh, minority populations, people who are people of color, people who are multilingual. It's such a great underdog story on every, like, sociological level. It's candy in places, but we love it.
Catherine: Comparing it to breaking the glass ceiling or just all of us feeling like the underdog and going up against something big. I think that the movie did a very good job of, uh, not having it have that Disney ending. Rocky didn't knock out Apollo. He didn't win the fight, but he had a small win that he was really, really happy about. And I think that that's very realistic for all of us who are trying to be seen as ourselves. You have to take those small wins because you're not going to get a home run where tomorrow morning everyone's going to respect you 100% and you're going to get all of the credit you deserve. It's realistic to have incremental changes. And he was very satisfied with that, and the audience was satisfied with it, too. I like that because it's the opposite of Disneyland. It's life. I liked also in this movie, just how many social references stem from it.
00:30:00
Catherine: Just everything from going the distance to drinking raw eggs, to a training montage, fighting the meat and running up the stairs. It's just, um. There's so much that's come out of it and. Great. I feel like I'm part of a club now. I get it.
Christiaan: It's always kind of powerful when something pervades their culture, and then suddenly you find the flash point where it entered the zeitgeist. I traveled through time. Yes.
Catherine: So, overall, I'm super happy. I'm super happy that I watched this movie. I'm sad that I didn't know about it until now, but I'm glad that I could watch it at a time where I could really digest it and understand it. Uh, and for the most part, I would say it stood up very, very well and is still very relatable, even though it came out. Let's see, 1976. What are we.
Christiaan: 48 years now? Yeah. You know, if you want to go to Philadelphia in two years, I guarantee you for the 50 year anniversary, they're going to show this at every theater in that city. I promise you that.
Catherine: We have to go. We have to go.
Christiaan: Let me know when m I'll meet you there.
Catherine: Yes. Perfect. I'm going to. I'm going to buy a great beret.
Chris: I loved everything you brought to this and your insight
Chris, I loved everything you brought to this and your insight, comparing it to society and going in depth on characters feelings. It really gave this movie color for me. You're also quite charmed by Sylvester Stallone. And, you know, thank you so much for what you brought to this conversation.
Christiaan: Thank you so much for having me. This is a lot of fun and a really good idea.
Catherine: You're coming back, so don't get too comfortable. Hopefully you didn't hate everything because we're doing this again.
Christiaan: I had to talk to an old friend about a boxy movie with a hot guy in it. I'm good.
Catherine: What a way to spend Saturday.
Christiaan: This is a good way to start pride. I am in a good place.
Catherine: Yes. Happy pride, everyone. I am so inspired. I'm going to go run up some stairs, like, right this second, and just see what I have in my freezer so I can, you know, punch it. Have a wonderful day, beautiful friend. Okay, bye bye. If you like what you are hearing and you want to stay connected, there are a few ways you can do that. We are on Instagram menstuffpodcast. If you'd like to support the show, consider becoming a patreon on patreon.com menstuffpodcasts. And if you have feedback, questions, or topic suggestions or you just want to say hi, you can email us@menstuffpodcastmail.com dot of course, the quickest way to stay in touch with us is to subscribe to us on your platform of choice. And of course, I'd love for you to leave a five star review and tell your friends thanks.
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