Subscribe
Share
Share
Embed
Stories of veteran service and sacrifice straight from the people driving today’s most important veterans causes and veterans organizations around the world. The show shines a spotlight on their inspiring projects making a real difference for veterans and their families, and along the way we'll hear the stories that drive them to do their best every day as they work to support veterans and their memory.
00:00:06:01 - 00:00:33:10
Speaker 1
Hey, it's Matthew Cudmore and welcome to Story Behind the Stone. Today we're joined by Kurt Deion, a public historian, author and member of the education team at the historic Congressional Cemetery in Washington, DC. In today's episode, we'll explore his lifelong journey as the presidential grave hunter, the unique experiences working at America's hippest cemetery, and why visiting the final resting places of historical figures offers a perspective on the past that you simply can't get from a textbook.
00:00:33:12 - 00:00:44:17
Speaker 1
Kurt, thank you for the passion and curiosity that you bring to this work and to our listeners. Thanks for tuning in.
00:00:44:19 - 00:01:01:04
Speaker 1
welcome to Story Behind the Stone, the show where we talk service, sacrifice and story. My name is Matthew Cudmore. I'm so pleased to welcome my guest today, Kurt Deion, a public historian and author. And he's on the education team at the Historic Congressional Cemetery in Washington, DC. Kurt, thank you so much for coming on the show today.
00:01:01:06 - 00:01:02:13
Speaker 2
Thank you for having me, Matt.
00:01:02:14 - 00:01:11:17
Speaker 1
Lots of ground to cover today. You're known as the presidential grave hunter. Tell me what got you started on and inspired and interested in this passion.
00:01:11:22 - 00:01:36:06
Speaker 2
When I was seven years old, my mother Lynn, bought me a book. It's called So You Want to Be President, written by Judith Saint George, illustrated by David Small. It came from a Scholastic Book Club's order form. And when I was seven years old, I really loved the anecdotes that were in there. And the illustrations by David Small accompanying them.
00:01:36:08 - 00:02:13:05
Speaker 2
Like George Washington had him as an adult, as the president in facial features and everything. But he had a smaller, characterized, caricatured body and all these tykes pulling on his wig and coat tails and everything. Talking about all his annoying siblings and thought that was funny, or William Howard Taft was not able to fit in a regular sized bathtub due to his immense size, and they had to create a, a giant sized bathtub that could fit for average sized men.
00:02:13:09 - 00:02:47:01
Speaker 2
There's the apocryphal story that he got stuck in the regular sized bath tub. That's most likely not true, but the cartoon by David Small showed him being either lowered or raised out of the larger tub within, like an industrial sized crane. And these cuts and a turkey leg and stuff and things like that. Nixon bowling at the white House and jumping up and down and doing his double Nixon tea set, things like that, really just interested me and the president's.
00:02:47:03 - 00:03:21:04
Speaker 2
Then the following year, 2003, I went to a few different presidential sites, the Adams sites in Quincy, Massachusetts, the tomb of George and Martha Washington at Mount Vernon, in addition to the Mount Vernon mansion and, plantation, the Kennedy burial sites at Arlington National Cemetery. And it was really cool for me to visit these sites where presidents lived and, and then also where they ended up in the physical sense, where their story ended.
00:03:21:06 - 00:03:46:09
Speaker 2
Then toward the end of the year and December 2003. My dad was channel surfing and he came across a re airing of a book talk on C-Span. This about the book who's buried in Grant's Tomb? It said by Brian Lamb and the C-Span staff and, there were contributions in there from people such as his friend, presidential historian Richard Norton Smith.
00:03:46:11 - 00:04:08:22
Speaker 2
And both of them had separately gone to the graves of all the US presidents then Brian Lamb, but even with a couple exceptions at the time, went to the graves of all the vice presidents. And I was nine by this point. My dad came to me and told me about this program and the quests of Lamb and Smith, and I looked up at my father and I said, can we do that?
00:04:08:22 - 00:04:36:11
Speaker 2
And he said, do what? And I said, go to every presidential burial site. And so that's how it started. Both my father, Paul and my mother, Lynn, were, very supportive of this educational journey. It was me in the driver's seat of it, even though I wasn't old enough to physically drive. So that required my, father, who had more freedom, you know, job schedule wise, than my mother did to take me around.
00:04:36:11 - 00:04:40:14
Speaker 2
And it was, a journey that started in a few different steps.
00:04:40:19 - 00:04:51:09
Speaker 1
So tell me a little bit about the numbers. You visited 3000 notable graves, as I understand it, but how many miles are recovering here? How many planes, trains and automobiles I visited?
00:04:51:11 - 00:05:18:19
Speaker 2
2000 and 901 currently famous graves. And then I have a list of about 2 or 300 I've been to where I said, well, they could be famous. So really it's over 3000 historical and pop culture figures graves I've visited now across 32 states and Washington, D.C. and as of October, I visited, 12 in Italy. So, Tuscany, region.
00:05:18:19 - 00:05:44:22
Speaker 2
So it's been quite a quite a journey. But it started with the presidents and of course, most of the first lady's, not all of them, but most of the first ladies are buried next to, the presidents and then started really in earnest, the vice presidents when I was at 14 years old. But and I ran out of presidents when I was 17 and vice presidents when I was 19, not counting the ones that have since passed away.
00:05:44:22 - 00:05:52:03
Speaker 2
But it's been, an interesting 22 years that I've been doing this. Now I'm 31. So what was.
00:05:52:03 - 00:05:54:20
Speaker 1
The most challenging gravesite to locate so far?
00:05:54:22 - 00:06:17:17
Speaker 2
This isn't necessarily the top one, but recently I was revisiting Albany Rural Cemetery in mainland New York, and there was a famous jurist, learned hand, and he was in an area not too far from where I'd already been. And the cemetery on previous visits. But he it was more challenging to get to his than a section in the woods.
00:06:17:17 - 00:06:45:14
Speaker 2
There's, some that I do keep a list, on find a room. You can create what they call a virtual cemetery. So that's how I keep some of these lists. And I know that it's 2901 famous graves visited and whatnot. I have a list of over 300 unknown and unverified burials. So some will say totally unknown or some words saying, well, they might be here, but I'm not entirely sold on it kind of thing.
00:06:45:14 - 00:07:01:03
Speaker 2
So I haven't seen a marker or there's no verification in the cemetery records, that are made or at least publicly accessible. So that's one that comes to mind. Luckily, I didn't have that problem with the US presidents. They're all pretty well marked when.
00:07:01:03 - 00:07:07:12
Speaker 1
It comes to visiting the presidents for someone that may not have visited a presidential gravesite before, which one would you recommend?
00:07:07:13 - 00:07:36:22
Speaker 2
Probably still, my number one grave of all time is the James a Garfield Memorial in Cleveland, Ohio. That's where President Garfield and Mrs. Lucretia Garfield are interred. And, they've gotten some wider renown, lately with the recent Netflix series A Death by Lightning President James Garfield. The tomb doesn't appear at the end of the miniseries or anything, but the tomb is 180ft tall.
00:07:37:02 - 00:08:09:08
Speaker 2
It's got gargoyles and stained glass windows and mosaics and, Italian marble statue and life sized terracotta sculptures depicting different scenes and moments from President Garfield's life. And then when you go into the basement crypts, there's a named caged area. And within that, in caged area, which is usually locked, is the caskets of President Garfield and the casket of Mrs. Garfield, and the urns of their daughter Molly and her husband.
00:08:09:08 - 00:08:34:08
Speaker 2
But they're not in sarcophagi or stone coffin or casket containers or anything. But on the wall that buried under soil, they're just laid out there on beers, so that if you got in there and technically were able to flip open the caskets, you would see whatever still remains of, them after they died in 1881 and 1918. But so that's a really remarkable one to me.
00:08:34:08 - 00:09:02:15
Speaker 2
The Abraham Lincoln tomb, of course, at Oak Ridge Cemetery, Springfield, Illinois, very poignant. And that's an interesting one, too, because it was redone in the 1930s and then Art Deco style, which was not a style that existed in Abraham Lincoln's lifetime, but that that's really cool too, because, again, some of these things they these tombs, these graves, they also bring you into the areas where these people lived.
00:09:02:15 - 00:09:26:11
Speaker 2
So going to the Lincoln tomb near only a few miles from the only house that Abraham and Mary Lincoln, ever owned together, or, the Lincoln Presidential Library or things like that. And, Garfield, you're not too far from mentor where the James Garfield National Historic Site is, which is their house, lawn field. So I really like those.
00:09:26:11 - 00:09:53:15
Speaker 2
And, a recent one, a few months ago, my father, Paul, and I did go down to Plains, Georgia, to visit the gravesite of, Jimmy and Rosalynn Carter. And it was in Plains is a very interesting town. Population's only around 700. We actually visited, the Carters when they were alive back in June of 2013. My father and I attended the Sunday school service that Jimmy Carter, taught.
00:09:53:15 - 00:10:16:23
Speaker 2
And I got our pictures with him and Rosalynn Carter at the end of it. And it's just very interesting to see how much this town embrace them. And now you can go to their, gravesite next to the Rosalynn Carter, butterfly garden there. And it's overlooking a manmade, pond that Jimmy and his famous brother Billy had created together.
00:10:16:23 - 00:10:34:10
Speaker 2
And it's right across from their home where they lived since the 1960s, where they both passed away. And that will one day be open as the National Park Service I site that you'll be able to go into the home. So those are some that really stand out for me among the presidents and the first ladies.
00:10:34:13 - 00:10:42:11
Speaker 1
These are some really special places, and you've documented a lot of your journey in books. What are you trying to accomplish? You know, by putting pen to paper?
00:10:42:11 - 00:11:05:20
Speaker 2
I'm trying to share my passion with people for hands on history and visiting cemeteries because, as I say in my book, Presidential Grave Hunter One Kid's Quest to Visit the Tombs of Every president, vice president, I didn't have a chance to meet Abraham Lincoln or Harry Truman or John F Kennedy, but I can go to Springfield and go to that house.
00:11:05:20 - 00:11:42:22
Speaker 2
I mentioned the one that Lincoln owned with Mary Lincoln, and they invite you to put your hand on the railing as you go up the stairs to the second story. So the same railing that the Lincolns and their kids used. And I can go, have a lunch at the Union Oyster House in Boston, Massachusetts, where John F Kennedy used to have clam chowder, or in independence, Missouri, you can go walk on the route that president Harry Truman used to walk in town and just go see these places.
00:11:42:22 - 00:12:09:08
Speaker 2
I used to talk about going to the Pettus Bridge in Selma, Alabama, Bloody Sunday, and it took three tries to fully get over the bridge and, march to the state capital in Montgomery and see all these sights. And then also, again, the gravesites, how they really show how somebody wished to be remembered. Maybe they chose their own epitaph, or maybe their spouse or children did.
00:12:09:08 - 00:12:41:23
Speaker 2
And then sometimes with, say, Abraham Lincoln again, you really get how the public or a certain segment of the public wanted to remember a particular individual, like at Lincoln's tomb. So, again, grandiose and maybe not exactly what he would have envisioned for himself again, especially that Art Deco being really anachronistic. But it's really a way to just go learn history in a way that's just different from a documentary or a historical book.
00:12:41:23 - 00:13:02:17
Speaker 2
And I try to encourage people to to do that, engage in this hands on history and grave hunting. And I also say, though at the end that even if that's not where your interest lies, that I encourage you to do something akin to this that resonates with you. And whatever your area of of interest is, when.
00:13:02:17 - 00:13:08:19
Speaker 1
You think back to yourself at seven, eight, nine, what do you think your younger self would think of what you've accomplished?
00:13:08:21 - 00:13:40:02
Speaker 2
In a lot of regards, my younger self would be quite pleased that I was able to achieve, my basic goals that I had with the, the, the presidential sites and I think really impressed that I have maintained it and expanded it. So again, there's 40 deceased U.S. presidents and I've been to the grace of, again, I'm going to say over 3000 different historical pop culture figures now.
00:13:40:04 - 00:13:49:13
Speaker 2
So, that's, that's that's quite a leap beyond just the presidents and then the first ladies and vice presidents, I think in general, impressed.
00:13:49:15 - 00:13:59:08
Speaker 1
So tell me a little bit about your process. You know, how do you identify your notable burials and grave sites and prioritize things? It's a lot to tackle, isn't it?
00:13:59:10 - 00:14:20:16
Speaker 2
Oh, it is. So, of course, a president is always going to be at the at the top of, my list. And since, finishing my quest and there have been two presidents that have passed away, George H.W. Bush and Jimmy Carter and I have visited both of their burial sites within a year of their passing.
00:14:20:18 - 00:14:45:14
Speaker 2
And there's other ways that the priorities, could be made. Sometimes it's just based off of a location where, where I'm able to get to with, just driving around or trying to be rather cost effective, or if I've got something that's a priority, like, a few months ago, I went to Washington State for the very first, time.
00:14:45:14 - 00:15:05:07
Speaker 2
I have a family that lives there, at least as of this recording. They're actually moving in a few months to Idaho. But I thought, oh, this will be a good, time to visit, these family members. And so while I was out there, I also visited, different graves, Bruce Lee, Jimi Hendrix, a couple baseball Hall of Famers.
00:15:05:10 - 00:15:28:21
Speaker 2
Football Hall of Famer. So sometimes it's, location based. And I do, have some other goals of, different, different lists like Supreme Court justices. I just mentioned the Baseball Hall of Famers. The Football Hall of Famers. Could be Andrew Johnson, impeachment managers. I'd say the biggest thing is, tight time and money. As always.
00:15:28:21 - 00:15:49:16
Speaker 2
What, what I can do. And I live currently Washington, DC. I'm from, Rhode Island. So, a few times a year, I go the 400 miles back and forth, that's, you know, some stopping in new Jersey and New York and seeing who I can continue to cross off. I have a, Google Sheet that's broken down now.
00:15:49:16 - 00:16:17:18
Speaker 2
I started it with my friend this about almost ten years ago. State, county or parish? If you're in, Louisiana, you know, town or city, cemetery and then alphabetical by last name and that helps me. I've also got, map now where I've got it, never so visually mapped out like that. And, we'll find a grave.com, helps me that that's my 99% of the time.
00:16:17:18 - 00:16:20:20
Speaker 2
That's what I use to locate a particular grave.
00:16:21:01 - 00:16:29:11
Speaker 1
You're on the education team and historic congressional. Tell me a little bit about the tours that you're, providing the on site experience. What are you trying to drive home for.
00:16:29:11 - 00:17:04:02
Speaker 2
Visitors this year? I came the lead on our docent tour program at Historic Congressional Cemetery. And we offer a variety of tours. So most commonly are introductory tours that will give people a flavor of our cemetery, which dates back to April 1807. And the different major historical figures, there they and, J. Edgar Hoover of the Federal Bureau of Investigation, Belva Lockwood, first woman to legally run for president, things like that.
00:17:04:04 - 00:17:38:19
Speaker 2
We also have tours that are thematic. So, we'll have, Jewish history tours or American Indian tours, black history tours. When I got there, because of my keen interest in presidential history, I developed a walking tour of presidential connections. So we did have, at one point, three U.S. presidents temporarily interred at the cemetery in the fall, as well as two first ladies temporarily at the cemetery.
00:17:38:19 - 00:18:11:10
Speaker 2
But we continue to have six cabinet members, Abraham Lincoln's landlady and sprig, from his one term in the House of Representatives in the 1840s. Presidential assassination. Coconspirator David Herold and, just various connections that show that, the president, while in charge, is not the, sole person who makes the presidency happen or when you you're a presidential assassination conspirator like Harold.
00:18:11:10 - 00:18:36:04
Speaker 2
Enough work to president's goals. So showing that, the presidential history is more than just the president himself or hopefully someday herself. Those are some of the things that we tried to do. And we're trying to show that Congressional Cemetery is really a microcosm of American history, again, because we have all these things about 100 or so, members of, Congress.
00:18:36:04 - 00:19:00:00
Speaker 2
Belva Lockwood was also the first woman to argue a case in front of the Supreme Court. And we also have history hunt field trips. Now for students who are at our second year of doing that. And so will, lead around students and show them, different folks such as Vice President Elbridge Gerry. And we'll talk about how he signed the Declaration of Independence.
00:19:00:00 - 00:19:39:12
Speaker 2
But he was opposed to the Constitution as it stood at the time, because it didn't yet have the Bill of rights. And we'll talk about no. What rights do you think we should have or what you think Elbridge Gerry was concerned about in the 1780s or, Leonard Matt Leavitt, what rights was he, fighting for and how history is relevant in all these areas, even if you know whether you've heard of somebody because they're a household name or somebody that you haven't heard of, but we think, their story should be better known, and those are the things that we're trying to do on our tours and on our field trips.
00:19:39:14 - 00:19:42:00
Speaker 1
What does a day in your life look like at congressional?
00:19:42:04 - 00:20:11:02
Speaker 2
You never fully know what a day is going to look like at Congressional Cemetery. And I like that sometimes I like a little bit of stability and routine with it. And I do like things being changed up and not monotonous. My bus, H.A. or Lakoff, was on a previous episode of yours that, dropped in May 2025, and he talked a lot about our, our dog walking program and everything and all those sorts of events programing that we do as well.
00:20:11:02 - 00:20:43:08
Speaker 2
So my current titles, education specialist, but when you work at a small nonprofit, you do a lot of, different things. So I also do a lot of events, execution, help with planning. I've had to be a pallbearer unexpectedly three times, which is not usually what you know should happen again. You never you never know. There was an arsonist that was, in the neighborhood, a few months ago and was lighting fires next to the cemetery, but it did kind of bleed over to our fence a little bit.
00:20:43:08 - 00:21:03:06
Speaker 2
So, at the end of March, tried to use a fire extinguisher for the first time in my life. So things like that are, very, very rare. But, you know, some days a dog, has gotten out of the sight of its owner, and we're trying to find, find the human or an unexpected tour group that shows up, and you have to be like, wow, sorry.
00:21:03:06 - 00:21:27:04
Speaker 2
There's a funeral right now, and you have to come back another time. And, thread those needles, because we have to give first and foremost, respect the place that's an active cemetery. So you never quite know what 100% of your day is going to look like at what we cause. DC's greatest undertaking, and what The Washington Post's nicknamed several years ago is America's hippest cemetery.
00:21:27:08 - 00:21:56:20
Speaker 2
I'll just mention there was one time last year, we have cinema history where we have an inflatable screen. It will show different, movies. And last year, the rope on the, the screen broke and AJ and I and, a little bit rotating, our colleague, Gabriella Welsh, had to manually hold up the screen for the last 45 minutes of, the 2003 Eddie Murphy Haunted Mansion movie.
00:21:56:21 - 00:22:02:09
Speaker 2
That's a day where you never know it's not a normal place.
00:22:02:11 - 00:22:04:23
Speaker 1
Do you have a favorite corner of the cemetery? Kirk.
00:22:05:01 - 00:22:29:19
Speaker 2
There's so many aspects to like at the cemetery in Gay corner. Again, go back to AJ's episode. It's a, definitely a popular one I really like over by the Marine band leader John Philip Sousa. He has, a lot of cherry blossoms near his grave sites there that's, really set the. When the seasons bloom, those that there's Yoshi knows over there.
00:22:29:19 - 00:22:49:17
Speaker 2
So March and April, that's a great place. I also like where my plot is, so I have a plot there. I actually got it in November 2022. Prior to, me working there, so I like that. So someday I'll be in the same row that we're spread out, but technically the same row or range as we say at the cemetery.
00:22:49:19 - 00:23:15:09
Speaker 2
As DC's mayor for life, Marion Barry, Technical Sergeant Leonard Malevich, Clyde Tolson, the number two official at the FBI during J. Edgar Hoover's time, and also, J. Edgar Hoover himself. So if, you're listening to this in the hopefully far future, visit me at range 20, site 209 at Congressional Cemetery is incredible.
00:23:15:09 - 00:23:20:02
Speaker 1
You know, I when we started emailing, I noticed that in your signature future resident.
00:23:20:04 - 00:23:45:01
Speaker 2
Yes. Future residents, what we call ourselves. And we have it on some merch. If you're, if you're of, that, persuasion, I include that in there because, I think that's very much part of my identity in my connection to the cemetery. Not just my, my job position. Because, if I'm a future resident, that's going to last much longer than whatever job I have there in life.
00:23:45:02 - 00:24:11:10
Speaker 2
Also trying to show, I think, erase some of the stigma, about death and those the ever popular, these days, like the death positivity movement where it's just, again, trying to break down certain stigmas and it's okay to talk about some of these difficult things and embrace it in different ways, even though, it's not always the easiest thing to do.
00:24:11:10 - 00:24:37:20
Speaker 2
And I think it also shows how much I believe in Congressional Cemetery and its overall, missions, to another one on the educate, but continue to be an active steward of Wright history and active burial site where we have to respect and, honor the people who continue to be buried there or have been buried, you know, quite recently.
00:24:38:02 - 00:25:05:06
Speaker 2
And, how just in general, the cemetery aligns with how I think a cemetery should be, which is I'm not saying that every cemetery has to have an off leash dog walking program or anything, but don't be a stick in the mud place or organization. Back in 2011, my father and our friend, Nick and I were stopped at a grave site for taking pictures.
00:25:05:06 - 00:25:27:00
Speaker 2
We were told that we couldn't take pictures of this, gravesite. My father demanded that we be brought to, the, cemetery office, and they were all up in arms that we wanted to take pictures of gravesites, and we were told that we couldn't take pictures of quote stones with names on them unless we were related to the deceased person.
00:25:27:00 - 00:25:54:21
Speaker 2
Even if this was a historical figure who you can look up on books, in books or on Wikipedia or something. If this figure died and, you know, the 1800s could not take a picture unless we were related to that person. And that's very much not what I'm about. So if you're buried in the cemetery, I would like to think I can take a picture of your grave for historical purposes or just documenting that I had been there.
00:25:54:21 - 00:26:09:06
Speaker 2
And I love that. Congressional Cemetery, is a place that allows a lot of freedom to be able to embrace the cemetery in different ways that resonate with different communities.
00:26:09:09 - 00:26:17:11
Speaker 1
You mentioned earlier that you had a list of people on places, sites that you want to visit. What are your plans for 2026?
00:26:17:13 - 00:26:46:15
Speaker 2
My plans for 2026, well, I hope to visit some more Supreme Court Justice graves. There are currently 105 deceased justices as of the time of this recording, and I have visited the graves now of 92 of them, actually, most recently, Justice David Souter, who just passed away a few months ago in May 2025, but I was able to visit him in November in Wakefield, Massachusetts.
00:26:46:17 - 00:27:18:05
Speaker 2
So I'm up to 92. So that leaves me with 13 unvisited Supreme Court justices. 11 have confirmed grave sites. There's two that are kind of up in the air. Sandra Day O'Connor. She died December 2023. Her brother intimated that he was going to take her ashes to the lazy B ranch in Arizona, where they grew up, and whether he would scatter all of the ashes there, or maybe he would actually bury some in the ground, or it could split them.
00:27:18:09 - 00:27:49:21
Speaker 2
Yeah. I don't have exact confirmation of. Did he go through with his plans or what was the full extent of his plans? And then there's Abe Fortas, Supreme Court justice briefly on the bench during the 60s. And he was cremated, after he died in the 1980s. His ashes were at some point designated to be buried in a mass like community, unmarked grave just over the line, from DC in Suitland, Maryland.
00:27:49:23 - 00:28:15:19
Speaker 2
But then, records indicate and they don't apparently have clear records on this, who picked up the ashes or when. But he and his wife, I believe, had no children. So who would have had the legal authority to do so? And where did they end up? So I need to get clarity on those two Supreme Court justices, but I'm hoping at least some of the 11 other ones that I have, I can get in 2026.
00:28:15:19 - 00:28:43:12
Speaker 2
But there's some there's two in Colorado, one in Dallas. I still need one in North Carolina. I think one in Ohio, 1 or 2 in Pennsylvania, Michigan, one in Iowa. So they're a bit, you know, not not the absolute easiest to get to from Washington DC, but I'm hoping at least maybe 3 or 4 of them in 2026, I'll visit anybody that I can.
00:28:43:14 - 00:28:55:09
Speaker 2
At this point. And of course, if I can get back out to California with all the celebrities in the Hollywood area cemeteries, that always, takes a big, big chunk out of my, list.
00:28:55:13 - 00:29:01:08
Speaker 1
The hunt continues. Q how can people follow your journey and find your book and support your work?
00:29:01:09 - 00:29:27:12
Speaker 2
I have a website. It's Kurtz Historic sites.com, but if you want to get direct to my book buying page where you can see, my book trailer, that's like a movie trailer, but for my book and see testimonials from different authors and historians. And if you want to buy my book directly from me where I could sign it to you, go to presidential grave hunter.com.
00:29:27:14 - 00:29:39:23
Speaker 2
I'm also on Instagram at Cody Grave hunter.com. I have other things like YouTube and Goodreads and whatnot, and you can just get those links on my website. So again presidential grave hunter.com.
00:29:40:03 - 00:30:02:15
Speaker 1
Fantastic. Well, Kurt Deion, public historian, author on the education team at the Historic Congressional Cemetery. Thank you so much for coming on the show today. It's been fantastic chatting with you, learning about the immense scope of what you've been hunting all this time. Thank you for taking the time to chat with us today.
00:30:02:17 - 00:30:15:17
Speaker 1
Thanks so much for tuning in. Story. Behind the Stone is available on Apple Podcasts, on Spotify, and on the Rise Across America Radio Network on iHeartRadio. Audacity and tune in to search for wreath.
00:30:15:19 - 00:30:16:20
Speaker 1
Thank you for tuning in.