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My name is Jeff, and I'd like to welcome you on a journey of reflection and insight into the tolls and triumphs of a career in automotive repair.
After more than 20 years of skinned knuckles and tool debt, I want to share my perspective and hear other people's thoughts about our industry.
So pour yourself a strong coffee or grab a cold Canadian beer and get ready for some great conversation.
Jeff Compton [00:00:00]:
Like, oh, you guys are always talking like you're talking down to us. I'm not talking down to you.
John Firm [00:00:12]:
I'm sharing the wisdom.
Jeff Compton [00:00:13]:
I'm talking about a different method. Right. It's not. I'm not saying your method is wrong. If it works for you, good for you.
John Firm [00:00:19]:
Yeah.
Jeff Compton [00:00:20]:
But how many other things have you missed out in life on because you're convinced that your only method is the only method?
Rick White [00:00:25]:
Right. There's more than one way to get to California.
Jeff Compton [00:00:28]:
That's right.
Rick White [00:00:28]:
Right. And as long as your path and my path get us there at about the same time.
Jeff Compton [00:00:35]:
Right.
Rick White [00:00:36]:
At about the same cost, who cares?
Jeff Compton [00:00:40]:
Yes. Good morning, ladies and gentlemen. Welcome back to another exciting episode of the Jada Mechanic podcast. This morning's episode is brought to you by our family at Promotive. Promotive has been absolutely the best thing that has come along in a very long time for my podcast. And our industry people reach out to me every day and tell me how fundamental Promotive was in helping them find the people that they need for their business. So, with all love, thank you, Promotive. So I'm sitting here this morning with two very esteemed young gentlemen.
Rick White [00:01:19]:
There's lie number one.
John Firm [00:01:22]:
Are we going to track you today?
Rick White [00:01:23]:
Well, actually, it's two. It's esteemed and young.
Jeff Compton [00:01:28]:
You gotta lay it on thick when you're starting. Mr. Rick White from 180 Biz and everybody's favorite redneck, John Firm from Firm Automotive. How was everybody this morning?
Rick White [00:01:39]:
Oh, man.
Jeff Compton [00:01:40]:
I'll tell you what.
Rick White [00:01:41]:
I can now die a happy man. I've been on the Jaded Mechanic podcast.
John Firm [00:01:45]:
This is it. Yeah.
Rick White [00:01:47]:
This is like the height. Like, it's all downhill from here.
Jeff Compton [00:01:49]:
And this is. This is a long time for. I guess we could call it almost a sequel. But Rick was on very early on, before I had my podcast with Lucas and I. And I did the absolute thing that I try not to do, but it does happen. As I steamrolled the guest and I kind of. I didn't let Rick have enough to say. And then I've gotten to know Rick really well, and that me then is not me now in terms of where my headspace is at and a lot of my.
Rick White [00:02:15]:
You needed to vent back then.
John Firm [00:02:17]:
Oh, yeah.
Rick White [00:02:18]:
I represented every evil shop owner you've ever known. I knew it even then. I'm like, I just gotta let this poor guy go. He's gonna burst.
John Firm [00:02:26]:
Yeah.
Jeff Compton [00:02:27]:
And then I went and aligned my with the most evilest, Mike Allen.
John Firm [00:02:31]:
Right.
Jeff Compton [00:02:32]:
And then it's like, what was Everybody thinking, but. So I'm sitting here with you two gentlemen today because I have so much respect for both of you guys in terms of, as I've gotten to know you, how it never waves from the course of what is best for the industry. It's not about the bottom line. It's not about the pocketbook. It's about what's best for the industry. Right. And we've been talking a lot about how we just set it out in the lobby. I don't have a problem with somebody.
Jeff Compton [00:02:56]:
I'm never going to say to someone, you have the wrong coach, but I'm going to thank you for having a coach.
John Firm [00:03:00]:
They're not matched up. Right. Maybe.
Jeff Compton [00:03:02]:
And then let's talk. Exactly. Let's talk about what's the best fit for what you're trying to achieve in this industry.
Rick White [00:03:08]:
It's really important.
Jeff Compton [00:03:09]:
Yeah, right.
Rick White [00:03:09]:
There's got to be a good fit if you. You could have the best coach in the world, but if there's not a, like a fit or a dynamic to. Doesn't work. Yeah. Right. And then all of a sudden what ends up happening is you end up going while coaching doesn't work. And it's not that the coaching didn't work. It was.
Rick White [00:03:25]:
The relationship didn't work. Yes. Right. Everybody needs a coach.
Jeff Compton [00:03:29]:
Yeah.
John Firm [00:03:29]:
And you got to get it closer, Rick.
Rick White [00:03:31]:
Dude, if it's any closer, I'm gonna.
Jeff Compton [00:03:33]:
Sound like you in another room if.
John Firm [00:03:35]:
You'Re not up in it. I'm just saying I want you here with us. Come on, get in here with us.
Rick White [00:03:39]:
Okay.
John Firm [00:03:40]:
Go with your coaching. Deal.
Jeff Compton [00:03:41]:
So you said a very powerful thing right there is that everybody needs a coach.
Rick White [00:03:44]:
Everybody needs a coach.
Jeff Compton [00:03:45]:
Yeah. Now, is that. Is that an honor? Is that. Do you still find that that's. Maybe you're met with a lot of kickback when you say that everybody needs one.
Rick White [00:03:55]:
Honestly, I don't care. Right. Because truth is truth. Everybody needs a coach. You know, for technicians. I don't know if people know it, but like, guys like Eric Ziegler, they have a mentoring program. Yeah, right. Why would you not.
Rick White [00:04:09]:
Like, you complain about your techs not growing, but what are you doing to invest in them? Right.
Jeff Compton [00:04:14]:
Amen.
Rick White [00:04:14]:
So there's coaches that we should be having coaches for every part of our lives. And, you know, whether that's therapy, sometimes it's. Sometimes it's business coaching, sometimes it's mentors. But you should always, always have a coach.
Jeff Compton [00:04:30]:
Right.
Rick White [00:04:30]:
Because there's always somebody that's above you.
Jeff Compton [00:04:33]:
Yes.
Rick White [00:04:34]:
Right. And one of the Core tenets that I have in my life is always be a student. I want to be the dumbest person in the room.
Jeff Compton [00:04:41]:
Amen.
Rick White [00:04:42]:
Which is not hard to do. No. Like, it's super easy for me to be dumbest person in the room. I have no problem. And one of the other things I learned a long time ago, it's an old saying. I think it's oriental in its foundation, but it says, you can not understand something, ask and look like an idiot for five seconds. Or you cannot ask and be an idiot for a lifetime.
Jeff Compton [00:05:04]:
Yes.
Rick White [00:05:05]:
And I am one of those guys that. You know, it's funny, I was sitting down with Donnie Cipher and a couple of big hitters as far as technical trainers. And where were we? We're at an ate out North Northwest there in Seattle. And we were in between classes and the guys were talking about the key programming and, you know, all that stuff. And they started putting some acronyms around.
Jeff Compton [00:05:31]:
Right.
Rick White [00:05:31]:
I didn't know what the acronyms were. Right. So I said, guys, I'm really sorry, I'm gonna sound stupid. What is this?
Jeff Compton [00:05:37]:
Yeah.
Rick White [00:05:38]:
Like, I have no problem doing that. Right. Don't do that.
John Firm [00:05:43]:
No.
Rick White [00:05:44]:
There's a lot of equipment down here.
Jeff Compton [00:05:46]:
And it was your cell phone.
Rick White [00:05:49]:
But seriously, everybody needs a coach. And some of my coaches, honestly, I love reading. And I've read books that are over 100 years old that are still as applicable today as they were then. Like, people talk to me about the help situation. I go, hey, there's a really great short book called Letters to Garcia, and it's about a 60 page book.
Jeff Compton [00:06:14]:
Okay, sure.
Rick White [00:06:15]:
And it's 140 years old. And it's about not being able to get good help back then. Right. I mean, it is.
John Firm [00:06:21]:
I struggled back in. What would you.
Rick White [00:06:23]:
Now, it is not new.
Jeff Compton [00:06:24]:
No.
Rick White [00:06:25]:
And there's so much wisdom in some of the older texts. But being able to step back and just be that student, part of it, I think, is you got to be curious. I think it's three things. You gotta be curious, you gotta be humble.
Jeff Compton [00:06:41]:
Yes.
Rick White [00:06:41]:
Right. And when I say humble, it doesn't mean think less of yourself. It means think less of yourself, you know, more often or less often. Right.
John Firm [00:06:50]:
Yeah.
Rick White [00:06:51]:
And then the third part is be open to new thoughts. New. Because you can either be right or you can learn.
Jeff Compton [00:07:00]:
Yeah.
Rick White [00:07:00]:
Because the moment you are, you think you're right. The door shut.
Jeff Compton [00:07:05]:
Well, I just had a conversation this morning about one of my shorts that came out and we got talking about processes of how I would check for a Problem in a car. And somebody says, well, I just check all the fuses first. And immediately, of course, we have a couple different people. And it's like I just very, you know, casually say, well, what about if the fuse box that is for all the fuses in the car is buried under something? Say it's in the trunk and there's three sets of golf clubs and, you know, some questionable shoes and laundry and all this kind of stuff in the back. And you want to just check all the fuses in that fuse box, whether they power what you're trying to fix or not. Does that make sense to gut that truck, that trunk, Excuse me, To go and check all the fuses? Or would your process not be, maybe I look at the wiring diagram and figure out how this power feed works so I can save myself some time easily? Everybody's like, I'm not staring at wiring diagrams for hours. Well, and then it becomes a situation of like. So we get talking about it and it evolves to another level of conversation.
Jeff Compton [00:07:58]:
Well, how do you actually check a fuse the traditional way? A lot of people that are not in our realm would be like, I would pull it out and look through the sun and see if that little bridge is broken. Now, any of us that have ever been there, you might have just fixed the car because you restored the connection or what, you've made something go to sleep, something turn on, like, and it's. Everybody's like, oh, you guys are always talking like you're talking down to us. I'm not talking down to you.
John Firm [00:08:21]:
I'm sharing the wisdom.
Jeff Compton [00:08:22]:
I'm talking about a different method. Right. I'm not saying your method is wrong. If it works for you, good for you.
John Firm [00:08:28]:
Yeah.
Jeff Compton [00:08:28]:
But how many other things, things have you missed out in life on because you're convinced that your only method is the only method.
Rick White [00:08:34]:
Right. Right. There's more than one way to get to California.
Jeff Compton [00:08:38]:
That's right.
Rick White [00:08:38]:
Right. And as long as your path and my path get us there at about the same time.
Jeff Compton [00:08:45]:
Right.
Rick White [00:08:45]:
At about the same cost, who cares?
Jeff Compton [00:08:50]:
Yes.
Rick White [00:08:51]:
Right. And that's one of the things as owners and leaders, because a lot of owners are former technicians, we've got to be very, very careful about thinking our way is the only way. Right. That's where we start to micromanage.
Jeff Compton [00:09:04]:
Yeah.
Rick White [00:09:05]:
Right. You got to lead from an outcome based thought process.
John Firm [00:09:10]:
Amen.
Rick White [00:09:10]:
Yeah. Right. And when you start doing that, you don't manage the tasks, you manage outcomes, and that gets to be a lot easier. It's. It requires better Communication. But what you're doing is you're building a team that's self directed, they're self motivated and it really starts to work. Right. Because they're taking on responsibility.
Rick White [00:09:32]:
I don't want you to do something. I want you to achieve something. That's right. Right. And by doing that, by doing that, then I'm able to let them go back, you know. Now what if the guy. Well, yeah, but Rick, what if he's like five hours on a diagnostic job? Well, dude, you suck. Right?
Jeff Compton [00:09:49]:
Yeah.
Rick White [00:09:49]:
You got to be able to say, okay, you got 20 minutes. At the end of 20 minutes, come talk to me, tell me where you're at. If you're lost, we're going to escalate to level two. Yeah, right. We're not going to, we're not going to, we're not going to do it. A shotgun diagnostic to it. We're going to step back, we're going to fix what's needed, but we got to be able to stay profitable doing it.
Jeff Compton [00:10:11]:
And that, that communication factor is so much more. What I'm still learning is how do I communicate? You can't come out there and go, you've got 30 minutes into this. Right. I'm not charging for diag because she thinks it might be related to what was in last time. So it's 30 minutes in, like, where are we going with this? And the technician is not thinking, where are we going with this? In terms of where we're going with this car technician's mind is still in trying to solve the problem. You're bringing them an outside problem of like, is this profitable or not? And they're focused on the only task, which is fix the car.
Rick White [00:10:41]:
Well, you gotta understand, the technicians judge their self worth, typically by the number of hoods. The number of hoods I close on fixed cars versus the number I opened on broken cars. Right. We gotta teach them time management. Right. Because ultimately our widget, we're a widget factory and our widget is labor. Yep. But we've gotta do it in a way that makes sense.
Rick White [00:11:03]:
Now, one of the things I always had a problem with and I teach my clients about, is when a car comes back, do not assume it's a comeback. Right. You, you reassure the client, the vehicle owner, hey, if this has got anything to do with what we got we did, it's on us. Yeah, 100%. But we are not, I do not walk into a situation like that and assume 100% like, I'm so sorry, it's our fault, we're going to take care of it for you. I don't know what the problem is. I'm not willing to step in front of that bullet yet. Okay.
Rick White [00:11:35]:
So I give my tech the same courtesy and respect that they need to be able to step back and say, hey, guys, here's. Here's more data. It was in two weeks ago. We did this. Go. Yeah, right. Come back in 20 minutes, tell me what's happening that way there. We're staying in control of it.
Rick White [00:11:55]:
See, it's funny. I'm actually doing. I did an accountability class on Tuesday, and the biggest thing is communication. You know, accountability is not you versus them.
Jeff Compton [00:12:05]:
Right.
Rick White [00:12:06]:
Accountability is a shared responsibility to an outcome where both parties know exactly what's expected of them when it's expected of them. That makes a big difference.
Jeff Compton [00:12:18]:
Because, John, you and I, as both have been in the. In the. In the fleet realm.
John Firm [00:12:23]:
Right.
Jeff Compton [00:12:23]:
We truly know what a comeback is.
John Firm [00:12:25]:
Exactly.
Jeff Compton [00:12:25]:
Right. We kind of know, like we put the engine in. We forgot to plug in that connector on the side of the alternator or something in the car. You know what I mean? And now it's coming back on a tow truck. That's a comeback. Right. Whereas the other side of the. Of the equation would be like we put the engine in and the brake light doesn't work.
John Firm [00:12:41]:
Oh, yeah.
Jeff Compton [00:12:42]:
You know, now that. Can that still be related? Definitely. You know, it all depends on how the car's configured. But the probability for the pto, but the probability is it might not be right. And it's just like you were talking about. Now, here's what I wanted to really kind of touch on is because it's something that I've thought about as I've gotten to know both of you gentlemen, is Rick, when you're teaching or. Let me ask you this, John, when you're facing. Looking at some of the business coaching and stuff, is there things that you tweak because you're predominantly a lot of.
Jeff Compton [00:13:11]:
I'm after the fleet side of things. Is there stuff that's being coached or taught by Rick that you kind of have to tweak a little bit to fit your model?
John Firm [00:13:17]:
Yes, a lot. A lot of stuff that he teaches for increasing productivity, the goals and things like that for a retail client is not what fits with me.
Rick White [00:13:29]:
Right.
John Firm [00:13:30]:
Marketing. He's on marketing all the time. That doesn't fit with me. I'm very strict on how many people come back into my business because I have to control how many I have here.
Jeff Compton [00:13:38]:
Right.
John Firm [00:13:39]:
And take care of that. I don't have room for another client to come in today? If I did, I would upset somebody else. There's things like marketing is the biggest thing. I just ignore it most of the time. That's rude.
Jeff Compton [00:13:51]:
So, Rick, what do you see the challenges when you look at like a fleet shop that you're being tasked with, hey, coach, me versus what we just call a traditional one or two car family kind of dynamic.
Rick White [00:14:02]:
Yeah. So from a production perspective, it's the same.
Jeff Compton [00:14:05]:
Okay.
Rick White [00:14:06]:
Right. We're a widget factory.
John Firm [00:14:07]:
Yeah.
Rick White [00:14:07]:
Okay. The three carries for fleet that make it a little bit different is client acquisition. Right. You're not going after retail. You're going after one to many. I'm not going after one house with one or two cars. I'm going after a company that has 5, 10, 20 vehicles. So that's.
Rick White [00:14:24]:
That's the first thing is acquisition is different. And it was really fun. Probably about a year ago, year and a half ago, John and I did. We do a training that's. We call it a sprint. Okay. And it's one week of training on one subject matter. And John and I, we.
Rick White [00:14:39]:
We co chaired how to build your fleet business, and we did that for our group.
Jeff Compton [00:14:45]:
Very cool.
Rick White [00:14:46]:
It was a lot of fun.
John Firm [00:14:47]:
It was. Well, you got a lot of response out of that. A lot of the clients still reach out to me. What'd you say? You said this.
Jeff Compton [00:14:52]:
How this happened.
John Firm [00:14:53]:
You know, I gave away a lot of my secrets that I do.
Jeff Compton [00:14:56]:
And you hold those really tight. Oh, yeah, Yeah.
John Firm [00:14:58]:
I would not share them with.
Rick White [00:14:59]:
I don't have. I don't want to tell you what I had to do to get them.
John Firm [00:15:01]:
Yeah. The general public, you know, but with the 180Biz family, I'm pretty much an open book with those guys.
Jeff Compton [00:15:08]:
Yeah.
Rick White [00:15:08]:
Yeah. So. So the. So the acquisition is different. Okay. Flow is a little bit different. But the cool thing about it is you can be really proactive because a lot of people don't understand. I used to run a fleet shop.
Jeff Compton [00:15:22]:
I remember.
Rick White [00:15:23]:
Yeah. Right. So I, I actually worked with a courier company. They owned their own garage.
Jeff Compton [00:15:31]:
Yeah.
Rick White [00:15:32]:
And they hired me to manage the fleet. Right. And There was some 70 vehicles in the fleet. So I learned a lot from that side of it that I now teach. Like, you should be getting, like, one of the things I think is the coolest thing ever. If I was doing fleet work today, I'd be putting the little dongles in on the vehicles, getting the mileages, and I would be calling the fleet manager up going, hey, these three are due for service. This week. Right.
Rick White [00:16:01]:
So you can be proactive. Check. Engine light comes on, I can see what's going on, the whole nine yards. And you charge for it.
John Firm [00:16:08]:
Yeah.
Rick White [00:16:09]:
Right. It's 100 bucks a year per vehicle. It's done. We know where they are. We can put speed limits on them. There's all kind of cool things. So that's a really simple thing to do. And you can be really proactive.
Rick White [00:16:20]:
So one of the things I did, because it was before this, was every week, the fleet manager would call me up, he would give me the miles for each unit number, and then I would go in and see which one was due for service, and we would get them in.
Jeff Compton [00:16:33]:
Don't schedule it.
Rick White [00:16:33]:
Yeah. And it was, you know, take this one off. Take this one off. And it was awesome. So that experience has really helped. But acquisition is different. Okay. Production's the same.
Rick White [00:16:44]:
You gotta be careful with fleet because you can end up with one or two really big clients and think you're doing really well, and then all of a sudden, one of those clients go away.
Jeff Compton [00:16:54]:
We talked about this yesterday.
John Firm [00:16:55]:
That's huge.
Rick White [00:16:56]:
And you're in a real big pickle. So one of the things I say is you really want to make sure that any one client isn't more than 15 or 20% of your business. That's really important.
Jeff Compton [00:17:06]:
That's powerful.
Rick White [00:17:07]:
Okay. You always want to be marketing. Most don't, but you always want to be marketing, working on getting that next fleet in. Because invariably you'll have a fleet that goes out and buys a whole bunch of new vehicles.
John Firm [00:17:20]:
And I call that marketing.
Rick White [00:17:22]:
Yeah.
John Firm [00:17:22]:
Dating.
Jeff Compton [00:17:22]:
Yes, absolutely. John.
John Firm [00:17:24]:
John forever.
Jeff Compton [00:17:25]:
Reference to. It's like you have your number one girl, but you also may have a girl that you're going to send some flowers to once in a while. I can't take you out every week.
John Firm [00:17:32]:
Yeah.
Jeff Compton [00:17:33]:
But I might.
Rick White [00:17:33]:
Careful. Once you put the ring on, I might come.
Jeff Compton [00:17:35]:
I might come by once a month and, you know, give you a flyer and a box of donuts or something. But, like, we're not. We're not. We're not steady.
Rick White [00:17:44]:
Right. The other thing that you got to be careful about is pricing. Because a lot of shops, when they're doing fleet work, they feel like they have to do it for next to nothing.
John Firm [00:17:54]:
Right.
Rick White [00:17:54]:
Discount, discount, discount. So one of the differences I teach is value. Build the value. Right. Because if you can get them off the focus on the expense and onto the focus of the lost revenue of the vehicle being down, now, that makes a lot more sense. Right.
Jeff Compton [00:18:13]:
Because we've seen the topic come up. Just recently, somebody asked, how do I build into my software program that it immediately deducts the labor rate for my fleet company?
Rick White [00:18:24]:
Don't do that. You should charge more. You, not less.
Jeff Compton [00:18:27]:
Exactly.
John Firm [00:18:28]:
Much more to take care of a fleet and every demand, so much more.
Jeff Compton [00:18:32]:
And it was cool because that conversation and everybody started asking questions, what do you mean charge more? Like, they're. They're my loyalty, they're my. Yeah, but you're also giving them a level of service that you're not just giving to any random person that comes into your business.
Rick White [00:18:43]:
Absolutely.
Jeff Compton [00:18:44]:
And what that means that they are expecting a different level. Ergo, it costs more to provide that level. I shouldn't be cheapening in what I'm trying to do. I should be making more as a.
John Firm [00:18:54]:
Client that wants that lower level. You need to let him go tie up another shop.
Jeff Compton [00:19:00]:
Yes.
John Firm [00:19:00]:
So you have room for that better client.
Rick White [00:19:03]:
Yeah, it's scary. Said this for years. Anytime you're competing on price, it's a race to the bottom because there's always somebody dumber out there that's going to do it cheaper. I mean, I don't mean that disrespectfully. We price from fear. Business is math. It's all it is. It's math and it's people.
Rick White [00:19:26]:
Right. And you got to be good at both of those things. And I think that's where our first encounter was so interesting because you just thought it. For me, it was all about the math and the money and screw the text. And like I tell people all the time, I was talking to somebody yesterday and they said, oh, I gotta call my supplier and get better pricing. I went, don't do that. He goes, what do you mean? I said, I actually went to my supplier and said, I'll pay you 10% more. I want this and this from you.
Rick White [00:19:52]:
Yeah. And they fell over backwards to do it.
John Firm [00:19:54]:
Right.
Rick White [00:19:54]:
And here's the thing. From a business perspective, if I buy a more expensive part with my matrix, I actually make more money.
John Firm [00:20:01]:
Amen.
Rick White [00:20:02]:
Right. So to start giving this stuff away, it doesn't make sense. Okay. So the pricing, learning to. To sell value versus like, one of the things that I did that was really helpful when I. Whenever I worked with fleets is we gave them a monthly cost per mile. Right.
John Firm [00:20:21]:
Good information there.
Jeff Compton [00:20:22]:
Yes.
Rick White [00:20:22]:
That. That was a game changer because we could start to watch. We would set a threshold for how much it should cost per mile for maintenance and repair. And anytime we saw one go up, we would have a conversation while it was a one time hit. We put an engine in, whatever the case was. So this will, this will drop back down again or hey, this one is.
Jeff Compton [00:20:41]:
Starting to always be in the shop every couple months. Last month it was an AC compressor. This month the tranny is, you know, next week. Or like the axles got to be rebuilt because it's puking oil all over the thing. That's what I know from my experience. A lot of fleet managers looking at, they know how to retire their unit or liquidate it to somebody else based on that number.
Rick White [00:21:01]:
Yes.
Jeff Compton [00:21:02]:
It's cost me. Cost of operation for the last six months was more than it was for the last 18 months prior to this one's probably long in its tooth and time to put her out, time to go.
Rick White [00:21:11]:
Right. So being able to be a resource instead of just a vendor. Right. A partner in helping them keep that fleet on the road. Because I talk to them. I'm not here to keep your, you know, work on your cars cheap. Right. Or your vehicle's cheap.
Rick White [00:21:26]:
I'm here to keep you making money. Right. And it's a partnership. We're going to work together to do that.
Jeff Compton [00:21:31]:
Can we go back to the parts question for a minute? Because you kind of. Well, it was not a parts question, but.
John Firm [00:21:38]:
What it was.
Jeff Compton [00:21:38]:
Yeah. So, Rick, isn't because I've worked for so many people that they think the method is to beat up the vendor. No, I need that part line. I need that part line even less. Even less. How do we get them to a question? Maybe that's hard to answer, but I'll do two. So when you have a customer approach you and they say, I have an account with xyz, Right. And I want to use what they are because this is the price.
Jeff Compton [00:22:01]:
Do you allow them to use that account when you're servicing their cars?
John Firm [00:22:03]:
No, no, no.
Rick White [00:22:05]:
You have. I don't think so. We have. No.
John Firm [00:22:09]:
Yeah.
Rick White [00:22:09]:
Heck no. Hell no. And then there's one more I won't say. Right?
John Firm [00:22:12]:
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Rick White [00:22:13]:
And that's a, that's a, that's a hard. No. You don't know the quality of the part. You have to be in control of that chain of custody. There are some insurance companies today that if you let a customer supplied part, the insurance will not cover you because they, they want to spread liability. Yeah. And if, if they don't have a chain with a chain of control with that part, they don't have it. Yeah.
Rick White [00:22:37]:
So they don't want to set, they don't want to take on that whole Liability. So my response. And I'm kind of an asshole sometimes, right? I would just look at them, smile and say, great, let them put it in. Yeah, right. You want our warranty, you want this, you want that, you want this? It's got nothing to do. You want me to match that price? Fine. And my labor rate's $300 an hour. I don't care where the gross profit comes from, Right.
Rick White [00:23:00]:
I'm going to make percentage of gross profit so that I can run the business. I can pay my technicians what they should get paid.
John Firm [00:23:08]:
Amen.
Rick White [00:23:08]:
By the way, it should be about 120 to 150,000 a year. And yes, they should be getting really well paid today. You're gonna see labor rates skyrocket over the next 12 to 18 months because you're gonna start paying 75, $80 an hour for a good guy. Now, one of the things that shops, I really think, need to reevaluate is this concept that I need you. All my guys need to be unicorns. They do not. You need a good labor mix. I need one guy that's a real solid A.
Rick White [00:23:41]:
I need a good B. Plus that's learning to become an A. Right. I need a good B. And then I could have a C Tech or a, you know, a GS. But I've got to be very, very careful there because they tend to be more activity focused than opportunity focused. And their job is, let me get it out, let me get it out. And I'm like, no, no, man.
Rick White [00:24:04]:
Let's go through the car. Let's see what it needs, right? Slow down. Right? Anytime you want to make more money, slow down, slow down.
Jeff Compton [00:24:11]:
To go fast.
Rick White [00:24:12]:
So for me, I don't beat up my vendors. I don't beat up my techs. I used to work at a dealership and they paid us 4/10 to do an oil service, Right. That was road test the car twice, rack it, stand for 20 minutes at parts to get the oil filter. Right. And then they would do this thing back in the day was a 995oil. Anytime it got slow, they put out a 995oil service thing out. They dropped our time to 2/10.
Jeff Compton [00:24:44]:
Yeah, but do the same amount of work.
John Firm [00:24:46]:
Yeah.
Rick White [00:24:47]:
And my thing was, you want to give something away, that's fine. Take it out on me.
Jeff Compton [00:24:52]:
Right?
Rick White [00:24:53]:
So whenever I'm working in this industry with another shop, I've been a tech. Like, I was playing with carburetors when I was 6. I rebuilt my first transmission was 17. Yeah, right. I still bleed Dexteron. I mean, it's just one of those things.
Jeff Compton [00:25:07]:
So take care of your people, take.
Rick White [00:25:11]:
Care of the techs, take care of your advisors. Right. It's just the right way to do it.
John Firm [00:25:16]:
I think that was a proven fact. He's human. Yeah.
Jeff Compton [00:25:18]:
No, and this is why I adore both of you, is because I know the background that you guys are not just somebody that's like, you're not just a shop owner who never put a wrench in your hand and you're not a coach that never had a wrench.
John Firm [00:25:28]:
In your hand or owned a shop.
Jeff Compton [00:25:30]:
Yeah. You both have been where.
John Firm [00:25:31]:
Where I have been exactly in the trenches.
Jeff Compton [00:25:34]:
Yeah. So what, what's the challenge that you see coming in right now with the things that are, from a fleet standpoint that are coming into your shop? Where are you getting? Where? It's like I have to. Wow. I have to maybe think about this or I have to think about that. What are you seeing? Is it the technology that's coming in?
John Firm [00:25:49]:
Yeah, the technology. Last week I just had to buy a new Ford scanner, new generotor scanner, you know, because our old stuff is not going to work in a couple more days.
Jeff Compton [00:25:57]:
Yeah.
John Firm [00:25:58]:
You know, and then you got to register them with auto authority and you got arrested with nasdaq. You got to go through all the steps and all the hoops.
Jeff Compton [00:26:04]:
You know, Rick, when they'd have to do something like that is that when it immediately you let your customer aware of a rate change.
Rick White [00:26:13]:
We could do rate change or one of the things we've been talking with clients about is add a sublet.
Jeff Compton [00:26:17]:
Okay.
Rick White [00:26:18]:
For an equipment access fee.
Jeff Compton [00:26:20]:
Okay.
Rick White [00:26:21]:
And that way there, if you do a rate change, everybody's paying for the equipment.
Jeff Compton [00:26:24]:
Right.
Rick White [00:26:25]:
I feel like only the people using it should pay for it.
Jeff Compton [00:26:28]:
True.
Rick White [00:26:28]:
So there's an equipment access fee. And because if you're going to make an investment in quick, I'm going to back up years ago. Generationally, we have bought equipment to do the work. We can't have that mindset anymore. You can't buy a hundred thousand dollar alignment machine and do them for 79.95. Right. Where's the return? Because you're not making any money on the job. Right.
Rick White [00:26:55]:
So if you're going to buy a $50,000 scan tool, it's going to last you five years. You should be able to step back and say, okay, I want this to make 100% profit on it. Not 100% profit, but I want to make. I want to make $100,000.
Jeff Compton [00:27:08]:
Yes.
Rick White [00:27:08]:
Right. On that investment. So that's a 50% return. I love that. Now how do I do it? How many times do I use it? We actually have spreadsheets that help people figure this out.
Jeff Compton [00:27:19]:
But if you, if you do the diag for free, everybody, only he does that. Everybody that comes in is paying.
Rick White [00:27:26]:
Only he does that. If I have a client doing diag for free, I will drive to their shop with a baseball bat and I will kick the shit out of them. Sorry.
Jeff Compton [00:27:36]:
It's okay.
Rick White [00:27:37]:
Am I gonna get muted?
John Firm [00:27:39]:
No, no.
Jeff Compton [00:27:41]:
We don't mute on the JD Mechanic podcast. But I mean, and that's the thing. It's because to me, and again, I love that guy and, and I love him too. We don't have. I don't. We don't. It. What works for some, in some areas doesn't work.
Rick White [00:27:51]:
And that's great, but you can't. What do you tell a technician that goes to 100 hours or 200 hours of training a year and then you give that time away? What value have you just put on it?
John Firm [00:28:05]:
Well, he's using the word diagnosis has no value. Yeah, okay.
Rick White [00:28:10]:
I use the word test and yes.
John Firm [00:28:11]:
You'Re using the word testing. That's where he comes across. The diagnosis has no value to him.
Rick White [00:28:17]:
Or his AutoZone killed that.
Jeff Compton [00:28:18]:
Yeah.
Rick White [00:28:19]:
You know we're going to do free diagonal right down. Dude, that's not a diag.
John Firm [00:28:23]:
I agree with you. It's just read the code, here's your guess and shotgun it out. You know?
Rick White [00:28:28]:
You know, I tell people all the time, you want to beat AutoZone, it's easy, right? What is AutoZone there to do? There's there to sell parts. So they, they plug it in, they get a coat, they go back to the computer, they put the car in, they put the code in. It gives them a list of things that are probably with a probability of fixing it. They start selling your parts and when they run out, they go, go go find a shop. They achieved their goal.
John Firm [00:28:53]:
Actually, they recommend one of their high quality shops. They have a list of high quality shops.
Jeff Compton [00:28:58]:
Their high quality shop could be the shop that buys the most from that particular store.
Rick White [00:29:02]:
Yeah, I would not be careful.
Jeff Compton [00:29:05]:
Yes, most vetted.
John Firm [00:29:06]:
I did say their high quality shop didn'.
Rick White [00:29:08]:
Yeah. Based on what? See, this is where, you know, I tell people all the time when you're talking and listening to people, one of the worst things we do in communication is we listen to other people's words and we apply our meaning to it.
John Firm [00:29:22]:
Yep.
Rick White [00:29:23]:
So he says quality and I'm Going, oh, it's a really good thing. Tell me what quality means, right? So someone will say, you know, hey, we do a great job. Great. What's a great job?
Jeff Compton [00:29:33]:
Well, and this is the, the, the buzzword in a lot of groups that I go around is people saying it really triggers some of my friends is fair.
Rick White [00:29:40]:
But what's fair?
Jeff Compton [00:29:41]:
Well, that's what I mean, what is fair? Fair. For some people, it was like as cheap as possible. Fair was the. It cost 10% more but they managed to get the car done on time. That was fair. Or they came and picked me up and they took me where I needed to go and it cost the same as the local. But that was fair. But there is just perception.
Rick White [00:30:00]:
But, but you can only have a successful interaction when you both have the same definition of fair.
Jeff Compton [00:30:07]:
Right? Yeah. Fair is not cheap, fair is not free. Fair is what we've agreed upon, makes you feel satisfied and you feel satisfied.
John Firm [00:30:17]:
That's right.
Rick White [00:30:18]:
Yeah. And I actually don't want satisfied.
Jeff Compton [00:30:20]:
Okay.
Rick White [00:30:20]:
Because that's the lowest acceptable outcome we can have. Right. I don't want to go for satisfied. I want to blow you away. Like, I want you to walk in. Like people walk into our group and they're like, holy crap. There is so much interaction, so much, so many resources available to them. They're like overwhelmed that I'm like, no, no, you don't have to do all of it.
Rick White [00:30:45]:
It's just there when you need it. But there's just so much. But I don't. I want you come in and expect in this and getting this. Yeah, right. That's got to be intentional.
Jeff Compton [00:30:57]:
What about some of the. Because I tell some technicians. Because it seems to be the trend wants to be to try and do everything. Especially like I had a conversation yesterday and he's like, he said to me, says it seems like every shop in Canada has to do everything. They can't just do one thing and say, I'm not going to touch tires as an example. Right. I'm just going to focus on diagnostic shop. But I see every little shop.
Jeff Compton [00:31:19]:
It doesn't matter if there are two bays and they have two killers of diag. Guys, they got a damn tire machine in there. What are you doing? You're trying. Well, I'm trying to serve my customer. But is there, Rick, is there a method to that that doesn't like, how do you make it work then? Is it okay to say, stay in your lane and don't try and do everything?
Rick White [00:31:37]:
Why do you think we do everything?
Jeff Compton [00:31:39]:
Because we're Greedy.
Rick White [00:31:40]:
No, most shops are not greedy. They're barely surviving.
Jeff Compton [00:31:46]:
Right, okay.
John Firm [00:31:47]:
Yep.
Rick White [00:31:47]:
It's not greed. It's survival. Okay, does that make sense? You know, when you have Maslow's hierarchy of needs until you get the first one, which is like, I have a roof over my head and I got some food in my belly, you can't talk about other aspirational things. It doesn't work. Right. The problem is it's fear of missing out. It'll be a couple of bucks, they'll go someplace else, and then all of a sudden, that other place will be better than me, and then I'll lose them, and they're not going to come to me anymore. And we start down this path.
Rick White [00:32:21]:
Right? So one of the things I'm teaching people to do is because we have a shortage in help. You've got to make sure that the work you're doing is the kind of work that's a high wind probability. High wind probability has three ingredients. Number one, it's gotta be something that the vehicle owner values. They gotta value what you're doing. They gotta appreciate you.
Jeff Compton [00:32:48]:
Yeah.
Rick White [00:32:48]:
Okay. That's the first thing I get somebody that doesn't trust me after the third or fourth visit, I'm like, dude, I think you got to find somebody else. Yeah, Right. This is just not a good fit. Right. I had one guy tell me I couldn't do that. I walked him outside. I had a.
Rick White [00:33:03]:
I had five other people in my office. I walked him outside and I said, hey, where's my sign? You see my sign up there? And he goes, yeah. I said, what's it say? He goes, rick White's Traymont Street Garage. I said, hey, fantastic. You can read, right? What's the apostrophe S mean? He goes, it means it's yours. I said, that's right. I told you I've kind of an ass sometimes. Right? But.
Rick White [00:33:23]:
But it's one of those things. The people that appreciate what I do, I love on them like nothing else. Right?
Jeff Compton [00:33:28]:
Amen.
Rick White [00:33:28]:
So that's the first thing we got to have for high wind probability. Second thing is I gotta be really good at it. Right. And the third thing is I gotta be able to make money.
Jeff Compton [00:33:36]:
Mm.
Rick White [00:33:38]:
That's a high wind probability. If I don't have one of those three things, I should be running away from it. Okay. I didn't work on European cars, okay? When I had my shop, every European shop owner I knew was bald.
Jeff Compton [00:33:50]:
Yeah.
Rick White [00:33:51]:
And I like hair, okay? So. And I think it's because they're Looking at a car, they put all the parts in there going, shit, what else could it be? And they're just pulling their hair out doing it. Right. So for me, it was. That was just a hard no. But guess what would happen every time we slowed down, every call we got was for a European car. It is hard when you're looking at payroll that week. It is hard to go, no, thank you.
Rick White [00:34:16]:
Because invariably what happens, you take on a job you shouldn't.
John Firm [00:34:19]:
Amen.
Rick White [00:34:20]:
Right. A Mercedes comes in with an electrical problem. Okay, we'll do it. I got three technicians in the back and they're each like, okay, which one's getting the bottom strong?
Jeff Compton [00:34:28]:
I'm taking off tomorrow.
Rick White [00:34:29]:
I'm sick.
Jeff Compton [00:34:29]:
Yeah.
Rick White [00:34:30]:
And then all of a sudden, fate. I take the car in and the car. Then the phone starts ringing off the hook. So I'm gonna start doing the turn and burn stuff to get the bank account back up. Right. I'm pissing off the Mercedes owner.
John Firm [00:34:43]:
Yeah.
Rick White [00:34:43]:
My techs are standing there going, damn, we're still gon have to fix this at some point. And I'm kicking my ass because I said yes.
Jeff Compton [00:34:49]:
And then the Mercedes owner, I was saying yesterday is one of those people that has a lot more influence sometimes in the community than the guy that's just standing at the feed store with a pickup truck that, you know, had to wait an extra day.
Rick White [00:35:01]:
It's not worth it. You got to be able to say no. Right.
John Firm [00:35:06]:
Best thing I've done to take care of this situation is get to know other shop owners around me. So when I do get suckered with at Mercedes, I have a guy down the highway that works on nothing but Mercedes.
Jeff Compton [00:35:18]:
Yeah.
John Firm [00:35:19]:
You know, so I can take it in and gamble it and then if I can't do it, I can just take it down there, get her done.
Jeff Compton [00:35:24]:
Yeah.
John Firm [00:35:25]:
You know? Yeah. So I like the idea of staying focused and what you're good at. That's a must.
Rick White [00:35:31]:
Yeah.
John Firm [00:35:32]:
But every night, again, even I to this day, take in something that.
Jeff Compton [00:35:36]:
That kicks you and reminds me of my clients.
John Firm [00:35:39]:
Say, hey, I got this thing I need help with.
Jeff Compton [00:35:41]:
Yeah.
John Firm [00:35:41]:
And you're going to say, I got a guy. I can help you.
Rick White [00:35:44]:
And that's what I firmly believe. Get a good transmission shop. If you're not going to do tires, get a great tire shop. Right. So that they're not competition. Direct them to somebody you know will take care of them. Right. And you should have a relationship that's back and forth so that the tire shop is sending you the work that you do.
John Firm [00:36:05]:
Yeah.
Rick White [00:36:05]:
Right. That's a great way to keep growing your business.
John Firm [00:36:08]:
Networking. Yes. Local.
Rick White [00:36:10]:
It's reciprocal. And. And when it's like that now it gets easier. Like, someone comes in, says, hey, man, I got Mercedes, man, I can't help you. But you know what I can do? Hold on. I get on the phone, hey, Joe, I got a guy.
Jeff Compton [00:36:22]:
Yeah, here.
Rick White [00:36:24]:
Let them set it up. You know, so do you take.
Jeff Compton [00:36:29]:
Here's gonna be my next question. So if you. How often do you sublet and put a little bit on for yourself?
John Firm [00:36:35]:
Or all the time.
Jeff Compton [00:36:36]:
Okay. Versus in your example, you just kind of shared. You just kind of like you made the most. Like you're handing the phone over. But do you do. I guess in that situation, you're not necessarily looking to make 2%, 5%, 10% on it. You just want to get it out of your shop so that you can focus on what you're good at.
Rick White [00:36:52]:
I don't want to be the go between.
Jeff Compton [00:36:54]:
Yeah.
Rick White [00:36:55]:
I want to be able to free myself up to work on other things, and I want to put him in touch with somebody I know has that same level of caring and quality that I do, and I feel good about it. Because here's the thing. I don't want that car. I want that relationship.
Jeff Compton [00:37:12]:
Right?
Rick White [00:37:13]:
Right. So when I'm talking to him. So, man, I really can't help you with the Mercedes, but what other cars do you have?
John Firm [00:37:18]:
Okay, so clarify this. What Rick is explaining to you is retail sales.
Jeff Compton [00:37:24]:
Yes.
John Firm [00:37:24]:
What I'm explaining to you is commercial sales. A fleet of men says, I have a problem. Yep. You don't want to tell him to go someplace else.
Rick White [00:37:32]:
That's true.
John Firm [00:37:33]:
You got to step up the plate and take care of that. Right. You don't make a dog on what it is.
Jeff Compton [00:37:38]:
Yeah.
John Firm [00:37:38]:
And he don't want to say, hey, tell me where to go.
Jeff Compton [00:37:41]:
Right.
John Firm [00:37:41]:
He wants to say, I can take care of that.
Jeff Compton [00:37:43]:
I can take.
John Firm [00:37:44]:
That's the reason why I do. And I have the buffer markup that I do to take care of that for him.
Rick White [00:37:51]:
And that works. And when I had the shop. When I had my shop, if your car needed bodywork, I'll hook it up.
John Firm [00:38:00]:
Right.
Rick White [00:38:00]:
I had a body shop. You just drop it off of me. I'll give you one of my loaners, and we'll get it over to the body shop. Right? Right. If it's got to go to the dealership for a recall. Here's one of our loaners. I will bring it to the dealership for a recall. For you.
John Firm [00:38:12]:
Amen.
Rick White [00:38:13]:
I did not play. I wanted that car to stay with me. I wanted that relationship. When I said we were a one stop shop, I wanted it to be that way.
Jeff Compton [00:38:23]:
That recall example. Sorry to interrupt you. I remember reading about that from gentlemen's shop owners doing it in IATN over 20 years ago.
John Firm [00:38:30]:
Amen.
Jeff Compton [00:38:31]:
Keep the, like, you know, keep them so that you took care of it for them. But they didn't go to the dealer and get hit with their free dvi, their free inspection, their free, you know, hey, we noticed your taillight when it came in. Let us do it free. Whatever. They didn't get hit with that. They kept it in their thing. Because you're gonna drive over there. Listen, I can't tell you how many.
John Firm [00:38:50]:
Letters I get from the manufacturers that I got a recall on some vehicle that I took over there from one of my clients. And the client's not getting that letter.
Jeff Compton [00:38:58]:
That's right.
John Firm [00:38:58]:
I'm getting that letter wanting me to come back for an oil change for.
Jeff Compton [00:39:01]:
Because you know what the customers do, right. They know if they get a recall letter in the mail, they go, I'm gonna wait till my next oil changes and I'm gonna get the two of them done at once. I'll just have the dealer do it. You see that happen?
John Firm [00:39:11]:
Yeah.
Jeff Compton [00:39:12]:
And I made my living on that. Right. Recalls I almost used to think were from the OE side were almost like.
Rick White [00:39:18]:
Plan stuff just to generate car.
Jeff Compton [00:39:20]:
Just to generate car back in the dealership, Right?
Rick White [00:39:23]:
Yeah.
Jeff Compton [00:39:23]:
If you think it's not, I go, thank you again. I would argue, yeah. You know, why do you think all this software stuff is out there? Right.
Rick White [00:39:30]:
I just got a new, I just. We got a new. My wife's got a 2025 Hyundai Palisade and we just got a recall notice on a seatbelt that's like, really?
Jeff Compton [00:39:39]:
Yeah.
Rick White [00:39:40]:
So I just smiled when I saw it. I said, oh, there must be slow.
John Firm [00:39:46]:
Kind of drum it up a little bit.
Jeff Compton [00:39:47]:
So I gotta ask, because I've talked about this and I've asked a couple different business coaches. When you have a, you have a client.
Rick White [00:39:57]:
Yeah.
Jeff Compton [00:39:57]:
And it's not necessarily not following process, but say they're not following process and not being completely truthful with how they're doing things day to day.
Rick White [00:40:08]:
Tell me more. What do you mean?
Jeff Compton [00:40:08]:
So like if you are teaching your, your, your I'll call them, your students, your shop owners to put on this level apart all the time, put the margin at this right. Warranty for that. And then you know, that they show their numbers and it's like, you know, the part that they put in based on their matrix was not that part. It's got a used part that went in. What do you, what do you do when you see this consistently happening over and over again, Rick, do you go to them and go, this is not a good fit for me anymore. Or are you able to rein them back in and go, why are you not being truthful? Like, because I look at it as like, why are you gonna pay a coach X amount of dollars a month, right, for a coaching contract and then not implicate what the coach teaches you?
Rick White [00:40:52]:
Okay. So when I first started coaching in 2003, I thought, I gotta teach people how to read their numbers, give them some strategies, and I'm done. I have since realized that the job comes with a couch because most of my time is spent as a practical psychologist.
John Firm [00:41:15]:
Marriage counselor, Accountant.
Rick White [00:41:17]:
Yes, right. I am a mediator, facilitator, marriage counselor. I've saved marriages. I mean, it's been, I mean, so being able to understand, okay, there's a difference between understanding something and knowing it's right. And that's the action of doing so. The way it works is I learn, I understand, I do. I know, I know, I know, I know. And then I master, right? So just understanding something doesn't mean it's happening yet.
Jeff Compton [00:41:52]:
Right?
Rick White [00:41:53]:
So I understand the strategy, but now we have to unpack the resistance. Is it fear? Is it, you know, you know, nine times out of ten it's a fear related issue, right? So it's being able to understand what that fear is and helping them work through it. So I had one client that discounted heavily and he was struggling and I said, okay, here's what I want you to do. He goes, what? Said every time you give a discount, here's the cool thing. I said, do you tell your client? He said, I want to help him out. I said, well, do you tell them you gave him a discount? He goes, well, no. I said, then let's be real. You were doing it so you could make the sale.
Rick White [00:42:36]:
Yeah, right. You were making it easier. I said, but here's what I want you to do. Every time you give a discount, I want you to go to your kids savings account and I want you to pull that discount down. And he looked at me with wide eyes and he goes, what do you mean? I said, you are taking money from your family every time you discount. And he. That right there, that reframe. Yeah.
Rick White [00:43:01]:
Stopped it completely right there. One of the things I teach is nobody's gonna value what you do until you do.
Jeff Compton [00:43:09]:
Yes. That's a big change even at the technician level. Yes.
John Firm [00:43:14]:
And it teaches that so much in his rich ism is what I call it, that you eventually catch on that you need to learn your value. And it's one of the greatest things he done for me is give me the perspective of my value. What do I bring to the table. And when you get your value down and you understand that your mind thinking changes a hundred percent.
Rick White [00:43:42]:
It's not fear based anymore.
Jeff Compton [00:43:43]:
Yeah.
Rick White [00:43:44]:
It's like, hey, this is an invitation. Right. I can help you. Is that something you want? Right. I was. One of our clients had surgery. Okay. And John's.
Rick White [00:43:55]:
John's amazing. John would give you the shirt off his back. Please don't. But John has. Is amazing. We had one of our clients who was in trouble. John drove from Dallas, Fort Worth. Not Dallas, from Fort Worth, Texas, up to Nebraska and spent a week at the shop to help him.
Rick White [00:44:13]:
In April, one of our clients is about two hours away from me in Virginia, had surgery and he was down it. He was shorthanded. So I said, I sat down my coaches and said, I really want to help him out. I said, can you guys handle the coaching? And I'll. I'm going to go help him out. And they said, go. So I spent two weeks running his front counter. Never use tech metric in my world.
Rick White [00:44:35]:
Am I right? I mean, from the management side reports and stuff, I could do it. I started writing service for one and a half texts. I wrote $100,000 in estimates in eight days and sold $71,000.
John Firm [00:44:48]:
I didn't discount anything.
Rick White [00:44:50]:
And it was funny because I drove out on Sunday and he lives outside of Richmond and it's very rural.
Jeff Compton [00:44:54]:
Yep. And he's.
Rick White [00:44:56]:
I'm driving out Sunday and I haven't written service in 30 years. I teach it all the time. But I like, you know. So he calls me up and he goes, rick, I just want to remind you we're in the. We're in farming country.
Jeff Compton [00:45:06]:
Sure.
Rick White [00:45:06]:
He says they don't pay testing. He says they don't do maintenance and they do all their own work.
Jeff Compton [00:45:12]:
Oh, yeah.
Rick White [00:45:14]:
Yep. Okay. When we left, when I left, his level one testing was between 215 and 275. For level one testing, I made him buy the BG Air induction service because I sold four of them the first week I was there. Okay. Three engine dynamic restores.
Jeff Compton [00:45:34]:
Yeah.
Rick White [00:45:34]:
Okay. $700 each. Okay. And they bought everything. But one guy comes In. And he just says to me, you guys are too expensive. I said, free you? Yeah. He goes, what do you mean? I said, come on over here.
Rick White [00:45:50]:
We had 40 Ford trucks lined up. I said, see all these trucks? He goes, yeah. I said, they said, yes. Yeah, we're too expensive for you. That's okay.
Jeff Compton [00:45:57]:
That's all right.
John Firm [00:45:58]:
Yeah.
Rick White [00:45:59]:
There's no harm with that. See, when you know your value, it's just not a good fit. It's nothing personal.
Jeff Compton [00:46:05]:
Yeah.
Rick White [00:46:06]:
Right. So I either had to do a better job at building the value or screening him out before I started to recognize he was a low in probability.
John Firm [00:46:15]:
Yeah.
Rick White [00:46:16]:
Right. And that's where there's constant learning. But I had a 71% close rate for two weeks in an area that I knew nobody. Not even the text.
Jeff Compton [00:46:27]:
That's right.
Rick White [00:46:29]:
And it's just, relax.
Jeff Compton [00:46:31]:
They try to hire you after they came in.
John Firm [00:46:33]:
Yeah.
Rick White [00:46:33]:
He couldn't afford me.
Jeff Compton [00:46:35]:
But isn't that crazy, though, that, like, what you've been teaching, what you've been coaching? You go in there and you, like, walk the walk, as we say. Right. You in there, like, how does somebody come back from that and go, what have I been missing out on? What have I been missing out on?
Rick White [00:46:51]:
His calls are recorded, right?
Jeff Compton [00:46:52]:
Yeah.
Rick White [00:46:53]:
And so the group is like, share the calls. Share the calls. And the guy's like, no way.
Jeff Compton [00:46:57]:
No way.
John Firm [00:46:57]:
They're gold, too. Gold.
Rick White [00:47:00]:
It's hilarious. And. But it's being able to understand that this is what it's about. So as the shortage gets there, the constraint in the shop becomes production. So we've got to make sure that the production we're doing is at the highest value on return.
Jeff Compton [00:47:16]:
Okay.
Rick White [00:47:17]:
Right.
John Firm [00:47:18]:
Yeah.
Rick White [00:47:18]:
You can't be doing engines. I got one tech. I got two techs. Don't be doing engines, man. You don't got the room.
Jeff Compton [00:47:23]:
That's right.
Rick White [00:47:25]:
Farm it out. Get it out someplace else. You got to do the turn and burn. No, I got to take care of the client. No, dude, that's going to put you out of business.
John Firm [00:47:32]:
Yep.
Rick White [00:47:33]:
Right.
John Firm [00:47:33]:
The client's important, but, yeah, you got.
Jeff Compton [00:47:35]:
It's your business, not theirs. Right. If you allow them to dictate the process of what you're doing in your business, Whether it's saying yes to everything or not, it's. You let them run it.
Rick White [00:47:44]:
Yeah.
Jeff Compton [00:47:44]:
And that's not what we should be doing.
Rick White [00:47:45]:
No. You got to understand what your window of service is. Right. This is my. These are my strengths. This is not. If I took this on, you think I'm Helping you, but I'm actually not because it's not my wheelhouse. Let me find somebody that.
Rick White [00:47:58]:
It is for you. That's a much better way to handle it.
Jeff Compton [00:48:02]:
I like that. You know, same question for both of you and then we'll wrap it up because I know you're both in high demand today. One piece of advice for new technicians coming in for both of you. John, you can go first. What's the one thing that you need to see them improve on when they come into you into this industry? What do you see them? What's the one piece of advice you can see that they need to come with?
John Firm [00:48:22]:
Well, technician. Okay. There's so many different levels of technician.
Jeff Compton [00:48:27]:
Right.
John Firm [00:48:28]:
The attitude.
Jeff Compton [00:48:29]:
Okay.
John Firm [00:48:29]:
Okay. You're not coming in for a freaking job. This is a career. This is something that you may do for a long time in your life.
Jeff Compton [00:48:38]:
Yep.
John Firm [00:48:39]:
Dedicate yourself to improving yourself, whether it be training, reading about what you're working on. And don't go in there working on broke cars. Go in there, look at good running cars. Look at the good data.
Jeff Compton [00:48:53]:
Yeah.
John Firm [00:48:53]:
Learn what your good data is, no matter what it is, and then you can see the bad data.
Jeff Compton [00:48:59]:
I like that, Rick. Same, same question. Same kind of.
Rick White [00:49:03]:
How much time do I have?
Jeff Compton [00:49:05]:
As much as you got.
John Firm [00:49:06]:
30 seconds.
Jeff Compton [00:49:07]:
I owe you a ton from last time.
John Firm [00:49:08]:
Cut him short.
Rick White [00:49:11]:
I was born a poor white child. Okay.
John Firm [00:49:14]:
I'm going in this fence row.
Rick White [00:49:15]:
I heard that. Yeah. I can't say the actual term anymore. I get skewered. So for new technicians, find a shop that's willing to invest in you. Find a shop that has a growth mentality that allows you to make mistakes. Recognize that when you start out, you aren't at the top, that you got to pay your dues. But if you stay with it, you will.
Rick White [00:49:40]:
The other thing is, as in anything else, there's good and bad. If you get snookered into a shop that's not a good shop, that does not mean that's the industry. There's some really, really good shops that need you.
John Firm [00:49:57]:
Amen.
Rick White [00:49:58]:
So I need you to come in humble, hungry and smart. Okay. Ask lots of questions. Don't be afraid to and learn. And that's gonna be amazing. I worked at a transmission shop as their lead rebuilder at 20 years old. And one day I couldn't understand why the guy was carrying a gun all the time. And one day.
Jeff Compton [00:50:24]:
Because it wasn't Texas.
John Firm [00:50:25]:
It wasn't Texas.
Rick White [00:50:26]:
We just normally do that. It was Massachusetts, man. Right. We're about as anti gun as you can get. They did a proctology exam before you got a permit to carry in Massachusetts.
John Firm [00:50:40]:
I passed the permits at birth.
Rick White [00:50:41]:
I tried to tell them that's not where I'm going to conceal it, but they didn't care. Anyway. So one day we had two Mercury Grand Marquis in. Both had C6 transmissions. Yes. I'm dating myself. I don't care. This one was shifting hard, this one was shifting soft.
Rick White [00:51:00]:
They lowered the transmissions down, washed them on the jacks, painted them, flipped them. And I was like, dude, aren't you going to take them apart? He sold them as rebuilts. Right. And he wanted me to put my name on, saying that I had rebuilt those units. And I refused. Yeah. I quit the next day. Do not think that's the industry, because there's really good shop owners out there that will pay you what you're worth, that will invest in you.
Rick White [00:51:30]:
Now the other thing I will tell a new shop, new technician is plan on investing in yourself on some of your own time as well.
John Firm [00:51:36]:
Yeah.
Rick White [00:51:37]:
If you want to be your best, you can't expect the shop to do it all. You have to want to be the best.
Jeff Compton [00:51:43]:
I say that all the time. It's going to be that after hours, your homework. Right. You leave school and your homework never ends. You come home and learn what you're.
Rick White [00:51:50]:
Going to be working on the next day. Absolutely.
Jeff Compton [00:51:52]:
Next hour. That car that kicked your butt that day, maybe you got through it, maybe you didn't. But when? That's the time right then and there where that wound is still fresh that you go in and you're going to try to make yourself an expert on what it kicked your butt. So the next time you kick its butt, it doesn't kick your butt. Absolutely.
Rick White [00:52:07]:
That's what you'll learn. Scars are wisdom.
Jeff Compton [00:52:09]:
100%.
John Firm [00:52:10]:
You both know how much training I do. Yeah. And how much training I send my team.
Jeff Compton [00:52:14]:
I don't know.
Rick White [00:52:14]:
I don't see you in a lot anymore. I don't know.
John Firm [00:52:16]:
Not me, but my team.
Rick White [00:52:17]:
Okay, your team.
John Firm [00:52:18]:
I'll give you a question I ask my team every week. What did you do for you to invest in your career?
Rick White [00:52:25]:
Yeah.
John Firm [00:52:25]:
You know, I listened to their answer. Whether it was listen to a podcast, read a book, or just do some studying on a well known good vehicle.
Jeff Compton [00:52:35]:
Like the Jaded Mechanic podcast.
John Firm [00:52:36]:
Yes, exactly.
Jeff Compton [00:52:37]:
The Jaded Mechanic.
Rick White [00:52:38]:
Definitely. I listen to Jaded Pod. Yeah. Jaded Mechanic.
John Firm [00:52:41]:
Someone's playing at my shop 24 7. We listen to all them episodes.
Jeff Compton [00:52:44]:
I know. Thank you. Thank you, guys.
Rick White [00:52:47]:
Yeah.
Jeff Compton [00:52:47]:
So, Rick, I. This has been too long from happening.
Rick White [00:52:52]:
Yeah.
Jeff Compton [00:52:52]:
I hope going forward that we can. We can do this.
Rick White [00:52:55]:
I would love to talk to you again. We got so much stuff we could jump into and.
Jeff Compton [00:52:58]:
And Brother John.
John Firm [00:53:00]:
It's been a while.
Jeff Compton [00:53:01]:
It's been a while.
John Firm [00:53:01]:
We didn't.
Jeff Compton [00:53:02]:
Yeah.
John Firm [00:53:02]:
Hijack it with fishing at all.
Rick White [00:53:04]:
Can we all go fishing somewhere? I would love that.
Jeff Compton [00:53:06]:
I would love if you guys would come.
Rick White [00:53:08]:
Would you let. Once Canada lets the United States back.
John Firm [00:53:11]:
Yeah, once we can come in, we.
Rick White [00:53:12]:
Would love to be there.
Jeff Compton [00:53:14]:
That's the other thing I'm doing. I'm doing everything I can, but it. I'm just one vote, right. So. But I mean, yeah, I would love to see an event like this, this kind of even 1/10 this size happen in Canada.
Rick White [00:53:25]:
Well, John Cochran was doing something up there and he started doing.
Jeff Compton [00:53:30]:
Murray Vaugh talked about. Murray and I have had a couple conversations about how do we make it happen. And like everything else, like an onion. There's so many layers to get.
John Firm [00:53:38]:
The Texas Two Step training event could just jump across the road.
Jeff Compton [00:53:41]:
Toronto Two Step. Yeah.
John Firm [00:53:42]:
Yeah.
Rick White [00:53:43]:
Cause I gotta tell you, John. I reached out to John recently. Cause he started doing it again. Cause I used to work with John up there in Toronto. I've been to Saskatoon and I've been to Toronto teaching two very different parts of Canada. Oh, yeah, Saskatoon. I was like, I actually offended somebody there, which is again, hard to do. I said I'd never seen something so flat in my entire life.
Rick White [00:54:08]:
Like, I'm on the plane. I was like, guys, you could watch your dog run away for three days. I was like, holy shit. I said, there's not a tree anywhere. This woman come up at break and she shows me a picture of a tree. And I said, what's that? She goes, that's our camp. I said, where is it? She goes, it's three hours away. I said, that don't count.
John Firm [00:54:24]:
Don't count. You know, kind of like going out to Brad Edwards place, huh? Oh my God. Forever.
Rick White [00:54:32]:
I love going up to Canada. We have Canadian clients. I love going to Canada. Love you guys.
Jeff Compton [00:54:39]:
I'll make. I'll make. I'll try to do something to make that happen. Because there's so many of us that need to come up. I feel to start to meet some of those shop owners that are trying to get to the next level. Because we're. We're definitely at a disadvantage. But gentlemen, thank you this morning.
Jeff Compton [00:54:52]:
This has been awesome.
Rick White [00:54:52]:
Thank you so much.
Jeff Compton [00:54:53]:
I can't wait to do this again.
Rick White [00:54:54]:
I love being. And I love being with this guy.
Jeff Compton [00:54:56]:
He's the best there is.
Rick White [00:54:58]:
Awesome. Yeah, he really is.
Jeff Compton [00:54:59]:
He's the best there is.
John Firm [00:55:00]:
Y' all make me blush.
Rick White [00:55:01]:
Yeah.
Jeff Compton [00:55:01]:
Aston was not the same without you there. That's what I wanted to tell you. Yeah, I really missed it a lot.
John Firm [00:55:07]:
I promise.
Rick White [00:55:08]:
I cursed you the entire time I was.
Jeff Compton [00:55:10]:
He was sending me pictures of. Look at this fish I caught.
Rick White [00:55:12]:
No, no, no. This one here is telling me, come. Come to Brazil. You got to ask Brazil with me. And I'm like, you bastard. My wife wants me to go too, right? So I. I was cursing him the whole week.
Jeff Compton [00:55:24]:
Yeah.
John Firm [00:55:25]:
That's all right. Y' all got another opportunity to do it again this year.
Rick White [00:55:28]:
I know, but I gotta tell you, my wife, Brenda, she calls him her second husband.
John Firm [00:55:33]:
Yeah. Yeah. I'm a work. I'm not a. I'm a work husband. Aina.
Rick White [00:55:36]:
I don't know, because I'm a husband, too.
Jeff Compton [00:55:38]:
I guess she must be quite. That she would take on both of you. Yeah, she's quite the lady.
Rick White [00:55:43]:
She's got to go to heaven. Free card. Yeah.
Jeff Compton [00:55:46]:
Everybody, thank you for listening, as always. I love you all, and we'll see you again on the next one.
Rick White [00:55:50]:
Go make some money.
Jeff Compton [00:55:53]:
Hey, if you could do me a favor real quick and, like, comment on and share this episode, I'd really appreciate it. And please, most importantly, set the podcast to automatically download every Tuesday morning. As always, I'd like to thank our amazing guests for their perspectives and expertise, and I hope that you'll please join us again next week on this journey of change. Thank you to my partners in the ASA group and to the Changing the Industry podcast. Remember what I always say, in this industry, you get what you pay for. Here's hoping everyone finds their missing 10 millimeter, and we'll see you all again next time.