Unsensible - The Asian Startup Podcast

Dive headfirst into the world of venture capitalism with Rachel, co-founder of Gateway Private Markets. Beginning her career as a banker in Asia to her role disrupting the private markets, Rachel's journey is one of innovation and perseverance. Rachael covers the the explosive growth in the startup sector over the past decade, examining the rise of unicorns and the increasingly diverse range of investors including hedge funds, public market investors, and family offices. 

What if the venture capital market, now valued at over $1.7 trillion, could be democratised? Rachel shares her insights on the challenges and opportunities in the evolution of this market. We discuss the importance of an efficient ecosystem for capital flows and explore how Gateway Private Markets is rising to this challenge. Listen in as we tackle issues around access to liquidity and due diligence, as we unveil how Gateway Private Markets is empowering founders and intermediaries to make informed decisions and ensure liquidity for early investors. Don't miss out on this deep dive into the fascinating world of private markets!
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Visit our website to learn more about our work with Asia's leading tech startups.
  • (00:00) - Innovation and Growth in Private Markets
  • (02:33) - The Evolution of Venture Capital Marketplace
  • (15:18) - Democratization of Venture Capital Markets

Creators & Guests

Host
Jonathan Nguyen
I help founders and VCs of biotech and tech startups commercialise.

What is Unsensible - The Asian Startup Podcast?

BRAVE SOULS WANTED. 
Failure almost certain. Attempting is unwise. 
Far east adventure. Success is changing the world. 

Join us on the Unsensible podcast where we talk to the Asian startups and their ecosystem partners who are intent on changing the world. 

Rachel Troublaiewitch: So, if
you look at the companies that

are impacting our lives the most
, it is this innovation startup

sector, and what we saw as a
challenge was that it used to be

this very closed world of the
big guys have access.

Your biggest venture funds were
funding a lot of these startups

and that's that kind of
misconception around the big

guys have access and the small
guys don't, and that's still

very much true now.

But what's happened over the
last 10 years is we've seen

incredible growth in this market
that you have unicorns being

founded every day.

But it's not just the venture
funds and the founders.

You now have hedge funds, you
have public market investors

this concept of family office
that are now active within the

space.

Jonathan Nguyen: Hello and
welcome again to the untold

podcast.

Today we have someone a little
bit different, mainly because

we've typically interviewed male
founders and there's no other

reason for that than they're the
ones that have just popped up

on our radar and we've been
deliberately trying to be more

inclusive.

And today we have Rachel from
Gateway Private Markets.

Rachel is going to tell us a
little bit about the problem

that she came across that led
her to setting up what is

probably one of the most
innovative private markets

platforms, certainly that we've
seen.

Rachel tell us a little bit
more about yourself and about

Gateway Private Markets.

Rachel Troublaiewitch: No, thank
you, Jonathan.

So excited to be here and to be
the first, but hopefully one of

many, female founders, so
that's really exciting.

Look, I'm one of the founders
for Gateway Private Markets.

I started my career, as
expected, in Asia as an

ex-banker.

Jonathan Nguyen: So always you
weren't hold out against you.

Try not to.

Rachel Troublaiewitch: I was
always in banking, really

focusing on supporting
corporates in Asia around

tapping into capital flows
whether that's equity debt,

managing their cash balances and
so that's an industry I've

always been in, but four years
ago so I built my career within

banking.

I left in 2012, really with the
intention to take a lot of

those financial skills I had
built and see how I could apply

it within actually a world that
was evolving very, very quickly

outside of the banking industry,
and the fastest growing

industry that we see now is
venture capital.

Let me put some context around
it.

If I ask you what are the three
companies that have probably

changed your life the most, what
would you say?

Jonathan Nguyen: I would say
Facebook, google and probably

now OpenAI, exactly, and I think
a lot of people would agree

with you.

Rachel Troublaiewitch: And if
you look at the similarities

between those three companies
OpenAI is still a startup, fast

growing startup Facebook and
Google they're now public, but

they started off within the
venture ecosystem.

So if you look at the companies
that are impacting our lives the

most, it is this innovation
startup sector, and what we saw

as a challenge was that it used
to be this very closed world of

the big guys have access.

Your biggest venture funds were
funding a lot of these startups

and that's that kind of
misconception around the big

guys have access and the small
guys don't, and that's still

very much true now.

But what's happened over the
last 10 years is we've seen

incredible growth in this market
, that you have unicorns being

founded every day, but it's not
just the venture funds and the

founders.

You now have hedge funds, you
have public market investors

this concept of family office
that are now active within the

space, and so what we realized
when I left banking was the

biggest problem is within even
the largest institutions in

venture capital, they need to
more efficiently tap into how to

access these companies, how to
actually get liquidity in

companies that historically
should have been public, and how

to basically be efficient in
terms of managing those two-way

capital flows.

That was the opportunity that
we saw and why we opted to

ultimately found gateway private
markets four years ago.

Jonathan Nguyen: Yeah, it's
really interesting you brought

up that point, because what we
see is traditionally the idea of

VC was a very specific type of
investor.

But, as you mentioned, from
what I see of startups at the

moment there's family offices,
there's hedge funds People

traditionally wouldn't have
considered to be VCs.

Rachel Troublaiewitch: Exactly.

Just to give it a bit of
context, when we say VC is big,

again we see the companies that
we interact with day in, day out

.

Now I heard a number that the
global VC market is $1.7

trillion.

Let's compare that to something
that's larger than the GDP of

Australia today and it's growing
.

So you really have a market
that's so big now continues to

grow.

That, how you interact, how
these different institutions

interact with each other, you
actually need a more fulsome

ecosystem to support the capital
flows.

How to help these founders to
grow, how to actually direct

money in, money out.

Jonathan Nguyen: Okay, well,
let's drill into that a little

bit.

So, as I understand it, it's a
platform you can match founders

with money.

What else is on there?

So you mentioned like help with
business support and these

other things?

What else can the platform do?

Rachel Troublaiewitch: So, with
that gateway we have built, or

what we see for the market, is
the creation of an institutional

marketplace for global venture
capital.

And what does marketplace means
?

It's the same way that you look
at any kind of asset class,

which is that you need a big
network of the right kind of

investors, founders,
shareholders that are looking to

invest in these companies.

They're looking to get
liquidity, they're looking to

actually manage their portfolios
.

So, within the gateway
marketplace, we've actually been

building out tools, the
infrastructure, so that these

participants your venture funds,
your family office, your

founders can actually trust that
they can deal together and that

they can do so in a very
efficient manner.

Jonathan Nguyen: And on the
platform itself at the moment.

Are there any brands we would
recognize?

Rachel Troublaiewitch: A lot
actually.

So on the marketplace we cover
actively about 130 global

venture companies, some of the
names that you would know well

that are very popular now
ByteDance fantastic example

OpenAI, some of the most
innovative companies like

Impossible Foods.

Right, we were active in even a
lot of the Asian companies like

Grab and Gojek before they went
public.

Jonathan Nguyen: That's a lot of
traction already.

What do you think like getting
to this point?

How long have you been
operating now?

Rachel Troublaiewitch: So we
founded the company four years

ago and been building out an
incredible team and just really

continue to see incredible
amount of support from our

clients and our participants.

Jonathan Nguyen: So about four
years now.

So what I see is this is a tech
platform in basically the

finance business.

Everything is screaming out,
very male dominated.

You must have come across some
challenges like getting it set

up.

Rachel Troublaiewitch: A lot,
and I don't think it's specific

to our business.

Every founder has faced
challenges.

I would say that the journey
has been.

Some of the challenge that
we've faced have been both as a

business that we were founded in
2019.

So, immediately after founding,
we had the protests in Hong

Kong, we had COVID, we had FTX,
silicon Valley Bank, now credit

Swiss, so we had a lot of pretty
meaningful events that had a

direct impact on our business,
had an impact on our clients and

actually how they manage their
venture capital portfolios, and

so that's kind of overarching
within the broader business, and

so making sure that the tools
how we service our clients

really fit within what's
happening on a macro level was

actually a big challenge, and it
continues to be.

The world continues to evolve.

Jonathan Nguyen: Judging by the
news in the last few weeks.

So I think we're quite settled
yet, right.

Rachel Troublaiewitch: Das
hasn't fully settled.

He hasn't fully settled, but we
don't see it as necessarily a

bad thing, right that we know
you still have an incredible

amount of companies that are
delivering real innovation and

value to the world.

There was a bit everyone's
talking tech bubble.

Is there going to be a reset in
terms of valuations?

When is the money going to be
unlocked?

We see that we're kind of at
that time now, and what happened

with Silicon Valley Bank, even
though they've now been bailed

out, this is a good catalyst for
it, and so we actually see this

as a positive thing that you're
going to have some great

companies that will continue to
come to the market, will

continue to look for great
synergistic investors, but how

they can do so efficiently, they
need support, right, and so

we're going to see, over the
next, I think, three to six

months, this kind of reset in
investor and founder

expectations.

So we're going to bring those
tech valuations down to a much

more healthier level, and we
really need to shift this

mindset around everyone who's
active within venture capital,

around how they can actually
interact together.

An interesting way to look at
it, at what we're doing with our

business.

It's not that specific to
finance.

If you looked at when, I think,
airbnb was founded?

If I'd asked you, would you get
into a stranger's car?

Jonathan Nguyen: at that time,
absolutely not.

Rachel Troublaiewitc: Absolutely
not right.

Would you stay in a stranger's
house?

Jonathan Nguyen: Yeah, no.

Rachel Troublaiewitch: But now
you have Airbnb, right.

We're facing a similar type of
challenge within our business,

that within venture capital,
that trust or the ease in which

you can deal with somebody that
you don't know within a

financial setting.

That's kind of where we are and
that's what we're fighting.

In terms of the roadblocker for
the market is this status quo,

that you know what it has to be
difficult, that you have a lot

of mistrust in the market, that
every transaction is very, very

complex.

But it doesn't have to be that
way, and that's the fundamental

thing that what we're building
with the gateway marketplace

we're looking to address.

Jonathan Nguyen: Is it
oversimplifying to say it's like

the eBay of venture capital?

Rachel Troublaiewitch: I think
it's a fantastic analogy.

Actually, ebay, amazon, all
these kind of marketplace models

, that's exactly what they do,
right?

Taking your eBay or Amazon
example further, you could

always buy books.

You go down the street, there's
five different bookshops, but

it's not efficient, it's not
easy, right, and what Amazon did

was to provide a platform where
they brought together all of

the best book publishers
together.

But they also made it easy
because it wasn't just about

having access to the books.

You could have that if you
walked to Barnes Noble, but it

was a way that you could read
the reviews.

You would know that the sellers
actually trusted that they

would easily get the book to
your doorstep logistically.

And then, once you have that
market, they take it further,

they introduce the e-books, and
so that's the evolution that we

saw within consumer goods, and
that's why we see that

marketplace model applies very,
very well with Inventory Capital

as well.

Jonathan Nguyen: So is there an
element here of a somewhat of a

democratization of capital?

I guess, like a lot of these
deals and venture funding comes

from networks, old boys networks
, the handshake that people are

worked with at Goldman, people
are worked with that JP, that

kind of thing.

Do you think that this will
kind of open up that marketplace

a lot more?

Rachel Troublaiewitch: I think
so, and we already start to see

it now In that the number of new
participants to the market,

some of them that you
highlighted before, they are not

your traditional venture fund
players.

They still play a very
important role, but you just

have more people coming in.

You have private banks, you
have family offices, you now

have asset managers who are
dedicated only to buying

existing shares to the secondary
market and so these are not

your traditional players within
the venture space.

And how these traditional and
these kind of new entrants can

actually transact together or
connect together, it's not

natural, it's not easy, without
kind of a neutral platform, to

help facilitator, provide that
infrastructure for them to trust

and be effectively very
efficient in how they deal

together.

Jonathan Nguyen: So we talked a
lot about the venture side and

the capital side.

What about for the startups and
for founders?

What's the experience like?

Rachel Troublaiewitch: That's a
really great question.

So we had the incredible
experience of working with a

founder who had built out a
global unicorn, had caught in

the US, and so they had offices
in the US, asia, europe.

He had actually delivered.

He had built this incredible
communications unicorn that was

valued at over a billion dollars
, so he delivered the value he

was supposed to to his
shareholders, and a lot of those

were some of the largest
financial institutions.

Great.

The challenge was for himself as
a founder.

The company was still private.

For himself, for his executive
team, they had no access to

liquidity, and so that's a big
challenge, because you're really

talking about people make
incredible sacrifices, the time,

the blood, sweat and tears to
build this business.

They're successful and they
have no access to liquidity.

And we hear this often you have
a lot of equity value but you

can't afford your mortgage,
can't send your kids to school,

to a private school, and so
that's a big challenge.

And so how do you actually open
up that capital that still

maintains the alignment that the
founders are still very much

aligned to?

Building the business?

You have continued support from
your shareholders, but you're

able to actually have some
liquidity in a fundamentally

still private business.

That's something that we see,
that trend starts to open up In

Asia.

It's still very, very early in
terms of how to do that.

The mindset around it's okay
for some of those founding teams

to have a little bit of
liquidity and maintain alignment

, and that needs to change in
order for this market to

actually continue to grow.

Jonathan Nguyen: So if I was to,
this is a tricky question.

Okay, obviously you have a
marketplace, which is a network,

value proposition, so on, how
would you say the value prop is?

How would you articulate the
value proposition in a sentence

for investors?

Rachel Troublaiewitch: So if I
had to put it in one line, I

would say that we are building
specialized tools and

infrastructure so that any
institution can transact with

trust and efficiency within
global venture capital.

Jonathan Nguyen: Okay.

So you mentioned that you
started in 2019.

There were all of these
headwinds, okay, but you found

success.

There's traction.

So what do you think is
happening right now, in this

moment, in this kind of
zeitgeist that is driving you

forward?

That's getting you to the next
big thing.

Rachel Troublaiewitch: The
interesting thing is actually,

over the past few years, the
venture market was very hot.

At some point, I think, you had
a unicorn being created every

day in China and there was a lot
of exits.

The IPO market was booming.

You could create a startup.

You knew you would be able to
list it, you'd have an exit and

the post-IPO performance would
continue to support that.

So in a time when the markets
are hot, a lot of the pain

points or a lot of the
fundamental questions aren't

that apparent.

Now it's the complete opposite,
right?

Public equity markets haven't
continued to have pretty weak

performance, so therefore you
don't have a lot of those exits.

The access to venture debt
Silicon Valley Bank it's much

smaller than it used to be, and
so therefore you actually have

this real need where a lot of
the most critical pain points

around access to liquidity.

So any kind of exit and a
symmetry of information is very,

very apparent now, and this is
actually a driver that is very

supportive for our business,
because people now realize that

you need to actually look into
the fundamentals of a company.

You need to understand where
you're putting your money and

how you're actually able to
guide those investment decisions

, whether you're going in from a
fundraising, whether you're

going in through a secondary by
buying existing shares that need

to have the right kind of
connectivity and do your

fundamental analysis is more
apparent now than it used to be.

So this is actually a very,
very good driver for our

business, because people really
need to address these pain

points.

Jonathan Nguyen: So when someone
comes onto the platform they

can, Is it like a pitch book
type of like data interface

where you can like get
information on the companies

that you're wanting to
investigate?

Rachel Troublaiewitch: As an
institutional platform.

We actually sit at really the
intersection of Fin and Tech, in

that we have built now around
500 institutions within our

network, and so these in Asia
are some of your largest VC's,

family office asset managers and
global banks.

But you know, this is a very
traditional network.

In that sense, how we service
them is by, to your point,

providing more transparency.

That's data around where the
market is pricing a particular

company, and so that's available
through some of our dashboard

tools.

At the same time, we know that
when a founder is looking to

raise, when a shareholder is
looking for liquidity, how do

you actually find the right
counterparty?

A lot of that is driven by our
own internal data analytics.

We profile who are the
investors that are actually

active within FinTech, how many
of those actually believe in

Asia, what's their investing
track record, what kind of

investor are they.

That's the kind of data engine
that powers a lot of the

matching that we do as a
platform, and the final part is

just on the infrastructure.

Once you have actually a buyer
and a seller who are looking to

transact together, how do they
actually close?

How do they settle?

How do they do the due
diligence?

How do you manage the documents
in a company-friendly manner.

So those are a lot of the
traditional kind of legal

execution processes that we've
also built into our marketplace.

Jonathan Nguyen: So that could
potentially disappoint a lot of

advisors.

Rachel Troublaiewitch: Yes, in a
sense that the same way you

look at OpenAI and you question
whether AI is going to take away

a lot of that creative process,
we don't see it quite that way,

in that a lot of the global
banks that we work with, a lot

of the intermediaries there are
clients.

We provide them with the right
kind of tools.

Whether that's a founder that
they're representing, we open up

this really fragmented network
of venture participants for them

.

We provide them the data so
they can advise their clients on

how you should think about your
pre-IPO fundraising, how you

should think about a sale.

All of these tools actually we
provide to the whole ecosystem

and this is a fundamental belief
that we have is that in order

to really build a true ecosystem
in venture capital, you

actually need to build tools for
everybody the founders, the

financial intermediaries, the
investors.

You cannot capture the market
by only servicing one part, and

so that can be pretty
controversial, but that is a

fundamental belief that we have
to build a true ecosystem.

Jonathan Nguyen: I'm getting
chills.

So, okay, great, and I think
you touch very much on my next

question, which was you know
what's the kind of innovation in

your approach?

I think you crystallized that
really well.

Then, really, it touches on the
final question, which is the

first step is democratization.

What's next?

The next big, powerful thing
that you think will change the

future of this business?

Rachel Troublaiewitch: I would
actually say our first problem

is creating more efficiency
within the institutional market,

just allowing the biggest
investors, the biggest founders,

to transact easily.

Actually, the next step is then
I would actually call it

democratization opening it up
even further.

We know that naturally means
that access to individual

investors like ourselves.

That's going to be the next big
wave.

But before you clean the market
, make it easier for even the

most sophisticated investors to
participate.

It's very challenging to
democratize.

That goes to your earlier point
.

What we're building out is not
about automation.

It's not so much about
digitization.

It's not just the access of the
big to small.

It's really providing building
the pipelines so that money can

flow smoothly.

Then it's about opening in that
up into a democratized state.

Then the final stage there, our
end goal, where we really see

this market has to go, is
ultimately to support a venture

company, but all the way from
their first founding so where we

were, 2019, all the way until
their IPO.

That's where everything that
we're building is driving

towards that vision that we can
create the fastest growing

network of every investor, every
shareholder that they need to

be interacting with and making
it easy for them.

Easy for them to do that first
seed fundraising round Easy for

them to actually align their
employees and give them equity,

real participation in the
business that they're building

together.

Then, all the way through to
actually for those first

investors that supported you
when you just had an idea, being

able to give them back
liquidity so that they can do

what they do best.

Continue to support early stage
companies, giving them that

liquidity and really building
out that company until you get

that successful exit IPO sale.

That's our vision that we'd
like to build out all the tools,

the network and the ecosystem
to support a company from start

to finish.

Jonathan Nguyen: That's great,
absolutely Good luck.

Rachel Troublaiewitch: Thank you
.

Jonathan Nguyen: We expect to
see you on Bloomberg next right.

Rachel Troublaiewitch: They're
right outside the door.

No, it's been great.

I want to leave you with a
thought.

This applies something I feel
very deeply, I'm sure for

yourself as well, and probably
for a lot of your listeners.

It's this amazing quote by Ben
Horowitz in his book the Hard

Thing About Hard Things.

He said you know, start up life
, you only experience two

emotions terror and euphoria,
both of which are actually

enhanced by a lack of sleep.

Jonathan Nguyen: And copious
amounts of coffee.

Rachel Troublaiewitch: Copious.

I thought that was one of the
best things I've ever heard.

Jonathan Nguyen: Well, it's been
great chatting with you, rachel

, and I hope that we get to chat
soon.

Thank you everyone for joining.

This is a great episode for us.

Again, we've got a different
side of the story basically

someone who's a founder, but
also on the money side somewhat,

and a platform to match both.

So looking forward to catching
up with you all again and we'll

put up Gateway private markets
details.

See you later.