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On the podcast today we welcome Tina Moen, GM of IBM Micromedex & Chief Pharmacy Officer, IBM Watson Health.
Show Notes
Episode 3 - Tina Moen “Humans Helping Humans”
Today, on our third episode, host Meg Escobosa welcomes Tina Moen, GM IBM Micromedex & Chief Pharmacy Officer, IBM Watson Health.
Meg and Tina discuss Tina’s overnight decision to become a pharmacist, her inspiration and evolution as a leader, her view of the value of the interplay between technology, AI and humans in healthcare - above all to serve patients. She shares the biggest challenges we face and how to keep teams motivated in the uphill climb of launching new solutions.
About Tina Moen:
Tina Moen, GM IBM Micromedex & Chief Pharmacy Officer, IBM Watson Health, leads the Micromedex team providing clinical decision support for medication, disease, patient education, and toxicology decisions within healthcare organizations around the globe. Dr. Moen previously led a clinical team working across Watson Health to provide clinical leadership and support for strategy and sales.
Before joining IBM, Tina served as VP of Client Strategy for Health Language, part of Wolters Kluwer Health, where she collaborated with clients delivering a solution to unlock data and drive semantic interoperability across the enterprise. She also made an impact in several departments of Truven Health Analytics, as the Vice President of Provider Analytics and as the Chief Clinical Officer.
Early in her career she was a pharmacist in pediatrics, home healthcare, HIV, and organ transplantation. Tina received her Doctor of Pharmacy degree from Creighton University.
Episode Credits:
The Game-Changing Women of Healthcare is a production of The Krinsky Company.
Hosted by Meg Escobosa.
Produced, edited, engineered, and mixed by Calvin Marty.
Theme music composed and performed by Calvin Marty.
Intro and outro voiced by John Parsons.
©2021 The Krinsky Company
Creators & Guests
Host
Meg Escobosa
Meg Escobosa has 15 years of innovation consulting experience, focusing on the unique challenges of healthcare since 2012. For The Krinsky Company, Meg leads client engagements overseeing advisory board design, creation and management. She also leads industry research, expert recruitment and trend analysis to support corporate innovation initiatives centered on the future of healthcare. Her background in innovation and strategy consulting began at IdeaScope Associates where she was involved all aspects of strategic innovation initiatives including understanding the voice of the customer, industry research and aligning the executive team to invest in promising strategic growth opportunities. Meg received her BA in Latin American Studies from Trinity College in Hartford and her MBA in sustainable management from the pioneering Master’s degree program, Presidio Graduate School. She is also on the board of a non-profit foundation focused on researching and developing technology to support a sustainable society. She lives in San Francisco with her husband and two teenage daughters.
Producer
Calvin Marty
A man of many hats, Calvin Marty is a Podcast Producer, Editor, Engineer, Voice Actor, Actor, Composer, Singer/Songwriter, Musician, and Tennis Enthusiast. Calvin produces, engineers, edits, mixes, and scores The Game-Changing Women of Healthcare. Calvin is also the creator of the 2020 podcast, irRegular People, among others. Find his music under the names Calvin Marty, Billy Dubbs, Nature Show, and The Sunken Ship. Over his long career as an actor, Calvin's has voiced many Radio and TV commercials for a wide-range of companies and products and has appeared in small on-camera roles on shows such as Chicago Fire and Empire.
What is The Game-Changing Women of Healthcare?
The Game-Changing Women of Healthcare is a podcast featuring exceptional women making an impact in healthcare today. We celebrate our guests’ accomplishments, setbacks, and the lessons they've learned throughout their careers. We dig into the many healthcare issues we face today and how these innovative leaders are working to solve them. Join host Meg Escobosa in conversation with some of the many brilliant, courageous women on the front lines of the future of health.
Tina Moen: [00:00:00] A human to human connection in health care is essential. Oftentimes what we all need and want when we're a consumer of the healthcare industry is compassion and empathy. And sometimes somebody to hold our hand and technology is never going to do that for us. And so we have to make sure that technology doesn't get in the way of the humans doing that for us in our loved ones.[00:00:30] [00:01:00]
John Parsons ANNCR: You’re listening to The Game-Changing Women of Healthcare, a podcast celebrating courage, perseverance, creativity, and vision in the pursuit of healthcare innovation. Join host Meg Escobosa in conversation with some of the most inspiring, and forward-thinking women in healthcare today. Meg goes behind the scenes to uncover previously untold stories of struggle and success in a notoriously complex and highly-regulated industry. As the world’s of healthcare and technology continue to converge and as women continue to take on increasingly more important roles in both, these are timely tales that deserve to be told.
Meg Escobosa: Hello, everyone. And welcome to The Game-Changing Women of Healthcare. I'm your host, Meg Escobosa. We're joined today by Dr. Tina Moen, who has spent the last two decades as a clinical leader in the healthcare [00:01:30] it industry. Today, she's the general manager for IBM Micromedics and chief pharmacy officer within IBM.
She leads the Micromedics team, providing clinical decision support for medication disease, patient education, and toxicology decisions within healthcare organizations around the globe. Dr. Moen previously led a clinical team working across Watson health to provide clinical leadership and support for strategy and.
Before joining IBM, Tina served as VP of [00:02:00] client strategy for health language, part of Wolters Kluwer health, where she collaborated with clients, delivering a solution to unlock data and drive semantic interoperability across the enterprise. She also made an impact in several departments of Truven health analytics as the vice president of provider analytics, and as the chief clinical officer.
Early in her career she was a pharmacist in pediatrics, home health care, HIV and organ transplantation. Tina received her doctor pharmacy degree [00:02:30] from Creighton university. Welcome Tina.
Tina Moen: Thank you Meg. It's so great to be here. Good to talk to you again.
Meg Escobosa: Is there anything else you would like to share as part of your introduction?
Tina Moen: I don’t think so. I think that was sufficient. We could go way back to my long career at taco bell prior to college, but I think,
Tina Moen: I think what we highlighted there is the nuggets of the most recent part of my career, for sure.
Meg Escobosa: Awesome. Okay. Well, I'm thrilled to have the chance to catch up with you.
Um, it's been a couple of years since we saw each other. [00:03:00] We can probably say that about anyone indeed. It's been well. Yes, absolutely. Fortunately, you know, getting to continue to work remotely and with a great team and different clients. So we're very lucky. Good, good. I'm glad to hear that. I thought we could start with you sharing a little bit about what attracted you to becoming a pharmacy.
And like, is there anyone in your family that's a pharmacist or what's the story? There, there is not anybody in my family.
Tina Moen: That's a pharmacist. [00:03:30] However, it was family that led me down this path. My, as you know, my dad is one of my, what was one of my, unfortunately we lost him five years ago, but a big mentor of mine and my idol when I was a little girl, definitely a daddy's girl.
And he wanted to be a pharmacist. So he was what was called a pharmacist assistant when he was in high school and had planned to go to college and become a pharmacist and go back to that same community pharmacy here in Colorado and, and be a pharmacist. And he went to college and [00:04:00] unfortunately Vietnam got in the way.
And, you know, he, he took a slightly different path and ended up becoming a Green beret in the army and spent his career serving other people in that way, uh, rather than being coming a pharmacist. And so. I liked chemistry and he would talk about how much he liked pharmacy and thought it was such a great career.
And so one day I found out that, uh, folks who are good at chemistry are often interested in a variety of careers of course, but including pharmacies. So it was just a, almost an overnight [00:04:30] decision. I think I made the connection between my interest in chemistry and. The stories I'd heard from my dad over the years and wanting to make him proud.
And so I became a pharmacist. And my, my favorite part of that sort of memory in my mind is that I was, as I was in pharmacy school, not as much in undergrad, but as I was in pharmacy school, my dad would not let me sell my books back at the end of each. Term because he wanted to read them and he did. So I, I [00:05:00] would often tease him that I think he read more of them than maybe I did.
I'm pretty sure he could read them cover to cover. And, uh, was always asking me different things that he was learning as I was learning as well. So yes, that's what led me into pharmacy as a. Uh, desire to make my dad proud. And, and of course my interest in chemistry, and I think there's a caregiver nature and people who go into health, professional careers.
And certainly I have that as well. So there's some obvious [00:05:30] connections there as well, but the original decision was, I think my dad might be proud of me if I do this. So here I am. And I think he is proud of me.
Meg Escobosa: I'm sure he is no doubt about it. In fact, it sounds like the healthiest example of, you know, parents living out through their children.
You know, it just, you know, it's driven by you, but also obviously enabled and supported by your dad. But I love that. I love that connection. You guys shared.
Tina Moen: Yes, yes. Me too. Me too. In fact, I on a few presentations I've given over the years. [00:06:00] I'm often talking to an audience is full of clinicians. And I often ask them why they chose this career.
And the answer is span the gamut, right? Have all sorts of fascinating, different things. But during that part of the presentation, I often have a picture of my dad who won a scholarship because of his service as a pharmacist assistant when he first went to college. So I have that picture on this slide behind me.
Oftentimes it's, it's very meaningful to me for sure.
Meg Escobosa: Absolutely. And just so inspiring. That's really cool. I love that you [00:06:30] loved chemistry. That's cool to see. I didn't have that interest. I hear that from a lot of people. Yeah. Yeah. But were there, did you have any particular goals? Did you want to achieve something specific?
Tina Moen: Yes. When I originally made the decision and my probably senior year of high school, maybe, maybe the end of my junior year. The goal was just to be a pharmacist. I really didn't really couldn't even have told you much about what that meant. I have that same understanding of the professional pharmacy that most people [00:07:00] still have, that, that they're working at a retail pharmacy, and we go and pick up a prescriptions.
I may have had—had I given it a little thought—realized that there was some pharmacists in hospitals as well. It wasn't until I got into pharmacy school and started learning about the various options, which were not indicated to be as many as there actually are now that I'm at this point in my career. But as I got into pharmacy school, I thought for sure, I would build a career in clinical pharmacy.
Inpatient healthcare [00:07:30] provider, hospital, partnering with healthcare professionals to help our patients, whether that be because they're ill and we want to help them get better or I'm helping educate them so they can stay well. But as we know, life throws, curve balls at us. So, so I find myself now having spent the last 20 years of my career in healthcare technology.
And that early part of my career in clinical practice has really informed this core of my career about how technology can help practicing clinicians, pharmacists, nurses, [00:08:00] physicians take care of people using technology, but never letting the technology get in the way, which is important to me as well. I think.
The human to human connection and health care is essential. Oftentimes what we all need and want when we're a consumer of the healthcare industry is compassion and empathy. And sometimes somebody to hold our hand and technology's never going to do that for us. And so we have to make sure the technology doesn't get in the way of the humans doing that for [00:08:30] us in our loved ones.
So again, early, early career thought I would be a clinical pharmacist in a, in a provider organization. And here I am in healthcare technology for 20 years. Very different.
Meg Escobosa: I mean, your clinical background and your experience obviously is so valuable in a technology environment. I mean, That insight that you bring, I know is so useful.
And, um, it's, it's great to know you. Yeah. It's recognized and you get to play this role. Did you have, besides your [00:09:00] dad, any other big influencers or mentors? That you, that that sort of inspired you? Yeah. You know, I've had, I've had a lot of mentors along the way?
Tina Moen: I think I'm a pretty introspective person and certainly getting more so as I get older.
So my dad of course, huge influence both professionally and personally. And, and as I mentioned, he's been gone for about five years and at least once a week, oftentimes more there's things I would still like to run past him. But in general, when I think about people who have influenced me, [00:09:30] it's not necessarily…named people, you know, somebody who played a significant role in my life, although I've got many wonderful, significant people in my life. I think that because I observe, I tend to observe behaviors my own and other people's behaviors. And then I enjoy thinking about them, mulling them over in my head, really, you know, kind of turning it over and over and thinking about how did that work for them?
How would that work for me or. Or man that was a mess. Um, how do I make sure I don't follow in that [00:10:00] example, you know, would, would replicating something I just saw be authentic to who I am. So I've had a lot of influences from that perspective, you know, I've, I've had a lot of quiet leaders. Who have taught me that I don't need to always be the loudest person in the room, which, which certainly as a younger person was probably my dominant approach.
I've had strategic leaders who really have taught me that brilliant strategies are rarely developed by one person. And I think that's a [00:10:30] misconception that many of us start out with that, you know, we have to come up with this genius idea. On our own. And it's rarely the case. I was an athlete and had coaches where I, who have
helped
Tina Moen: teach me how to be a better teammate, which is essential in business and in life in general.
So lots of influencers from all around my life. And, and I think my approach has always been to be very intentional about observing those people and determining what is [00:11:00] resonating with me and what would be authentic to who I am.
Meg Escobosa: I love it. I'm so sorry about your dad. And I know it's something we all have to face.
And I appreciate you sharing…it stinks.
Tina Moen: It does. He's he's over my shoulder. Always. Yeah. It's, it's a, it's a journey that we're all on and it's certainly the right order of things. I would hate for it to have been the other order, right. Is not easy for sure.
Meg Escobosa: Right. It's like, what would dad say right now?
Tina Moen: Yep. I ask it all the time and I often hear his voice. [00:11:30]
Meg Escobosa: That's so true. That's great. Um, Sort of where you feel you've made the most impact or accomplishment. What is something that you're most proud of over the course of these 20 years? Where do you feel you've been able to make a difference?
Tina Moen: Interesting. I think maybe an example of how sometimes you're not quite sure how you've gotten to be this old. Um, I think, I think the big differences are yet to be made and I hope that is the case, but [00:12:00] nonetheless, I I'm sure I've made some differences along the way. The thing I find the most satisfaction in is. The knowledge that technologies that I've worked on over the years have been able to impact patients literally around the world.
You know, as a, as a individually practicing pharmacist had, I stayed as a clinical pharmacist at a hospital, I would have had wonderful opportunities to impact patient's lives. Of course. And when you get into health tech, you don't have that direct patient interaction. So I've, I've taken the satisfaction [00:12:30] from knowing that what I'm doing is impacting patients indeed.
And many more than I ever could have individually. So, you know, the human beings who all I'll never have the opportunity to meet. Yeah. But for whom some small part of their healthcare experience was supported by something I did, I, you know, way over here in Colorado is, is very meaningful to me. And I think in the way that many clinicians can.
Cast their mind back to us, very specific patient interaction, which of course I can from my clinical practice as well. [00:13:00] I cast my mind back to, you know, this is a customer story we heard where our technology helped a clinician do the best, next thing for a human being somewhere. And it's very meaningful, you know, whether that be helping to avoid a adverse drug reaction, adverse drug event, which.
2 million of them, depending on who's counting, um, a year. And it's remarkable to think of that. And so if I think about our technologies, you know, 5,000 [00:13:30] customers around the world, if we, if I have some small role in impacting just one adverse drug reaction from, uh, occurring one a day, That's great. That's 365 a year and multiply that by 30 years, which that's the meaning I take in and why I get up every day and come back to this desk and do what I do because it's, they really are human beings at the other end.
Meg Escobosa: I love that. I do also appreciate how, what it shows is how complex [00:14:00] our industry is and just the, the adverse drug reactions alone. If we're just looking at that issue, it's hugely impactful to be able to avoid them hugely.
Tina Moen: Yeah. And on all metrics, you know, that there's a huge personal impact to the person having their reaction.
Of course. And then not to mention the reaction then that causes for their families and their loved ones that are. Uh, fearful for them anyway, but then also a huge cost implication, which we know particularly in the U S is a [00:14:30] significant problem in the healthcare and the healthcare industry. So both sides of both the human side.
Um, but also the financial side is, um, very rewarding to know that we may be making a difference on that around the world.
Meg Escobosa: What do you think has enabled you all to get the. Tool. And maybe you could talk a little bit more about just even the tool itself around the, that helps clients understand the potential for drug reactions or adverse drug reactions.
[00:15:00] And how did you get it out there? What, um, what are you, is there a story around getting that out or is it kind of more, it went to plan the product was produced at work and there was no challenge. Is there anything behind?
Tina Moen: Yeah. Well, it's, it's interesting. So. So, obviously I have over 20 years worked on lots of different solutions, but the current one with Micromedics is a 45 year old company who has been really focused on helping clinicians who are taking care of [00:15:30] patients directly.
Have the insights that they need to be able to make the next best decision, whether that be a decision about a medication, whether that be helping to avoid a drug interaction or some other sort of adverse drug events, whether that be helping to confirm a diagnosis or avoid some side effects or provide
some patient education.
Tina Moen: The key is that there's so much for a clinician to be thinking about as you're standing next to a patient and. The patient to be the thing [00:16:00] they're thinking about the most as they as, and that's what they want as well. And that's what we want as a patient also. Of course. Yeah. So, so they need to be focused on the patient, but there's, you know, there's what, you know, what's going on with the, the IVs what's going on with the, you know, physical.
Uh, manifestations in the patient, how are they feeling? How are their, their mental and emotional health doing, but to make decisions for that patient. There's all of this knowledge that they have learned over the years, of course, but also new information [00:16:30] that's being produced by primary literature and studies and research and case examples and all of these things that are happening.
And there's just no way for anyone human beings. To always know all the things about any topic, right. Keeping up typically, right. But particularly healthcare. So our objective is to assist them with that evidence-based information. So making sure that we are creating content that a clinician pharmacist, nurse, physician can use.
Having their back [00:17:00] pocket for when they are taking care of someone and they need to research what the best medication. I have a story. I used to always tell it when I was in pediatrics, we had a little guy who was really struggling with systemic fungal infections, and he was just, just a tiny little thing.
And his mother understandably. Beside herself, which adds another challenge in pediatrics, as many Patrick practitioners will attest to, but he was allergic to the [00:17:30] first, second, third line therapies. And so we were really struggling to know what the next thing was for him to. What we could try to see if we could get this systemic fungal infection under control.
And so it's that sort of thing that the solution I work on now is helping clinicians with. In fact, I actually went to the solution I work on now to help me, help me answer that question. It comes back to how do we enable a clinician in partnership with the patient and patient family to make the next best decision using [00:18:00] evidence-based medicine.
So that's a little bit on sort of what we're doing. You know, uh, was there any, was there any roadblocks getting there? Of course, 45 years? There's been a lots of roadblocks. Undoubtedly. I, of course haven't been here the whole 45 years, but I think we're way too young for that. I don't know about way too young, but a little bit, at least I think like everything else, you know, Lots of hard work, not giving up, even when frustration sets in trusting your colleagues to come to the table with equally as [00:18:30] genius ideas as yours, or, or sometimes equally bad as bad ideas and having the psychological safety to tell each other that, wow, those were both really terrible ideas.
Tina Moen: We need to try again. But I think at the core of it in my mind, it's really believing. The why of what you do and what we all do. Um, I talk about that a lot with my teams now that we're so fortunate to be working in a industry where the why is really easy to get behind because healthcare is [00:19:00] personal to every human being on the, on the planet.
And so holding that WHY at the center of the hard days in particular is I think what helps. Pass some of the hurdles and through some of the frustrations and the long nights and stressful moments of figuring out how you're going to make this thing happen.
Meg Escobosa: I agree completely. I love that you can pick yourself back up because you've got a good reason to do it.
Tina Moen: Yeah. In fact, I, I often tell a story that I have the unfortunate opportunity, I guess, of [00:19:30] finding myself in the ICU for about seven days. Unexpectedly several years ago. And I, of course don't remember much of it thanks to modern medicine and sedative effects. Um, but my children tell me all the funny stories of things I did or said, or, or, or, and some of the scary ones, of course, but one of the things I apparently did was every time anybody would walk into the room and it didn't matter if they were coming in to clean the room, deliver my food, a procedure, a nurse, a [00:20:00] physician didn't matter who it was.
I would crack my eyes open and say, what technology are you using to save my life? And the, everyone would, uh, you know, the people who weren't there to save my life, but to empty the trash bin or what have you sort of looked at me strangely, but, but I think it's just so ingrained in my heart of that. The technology should be helping these humans, um, take care of patients that even when I was the patient.
I was doing a little bit of market research, I guess [00:20:30]
Meg Escobosa:That is a great story. I'm so happy to see that you have recovered and you're doing well as well. Oh my goodness. Looking back kind of, you know, on this vein of reflection and what you accomplished, where, what do you think you've learned along the way about what it takes to move an organization to new ground or create new categories or truly disrupt a market sector?
Tina Moen: Yeah, that's great. That's great. I've, I've learned a lot of ways not to do things for sure, which I think we all do [00:21:00] if we, if we pay attention, but, um, I think two primary things. So as I've sort of alluded to first and foremost, I've learned that people come first and that's both the people that we work with, our teams and the people we work on behalf of.
So in our case, And the clinicians that support them, I'm really passionate that the healthcare is a human centered industry. No matter that I've spent 20 years in health technology and technology is powerful and important, but it's never about the [00:21:30] data or the software or the hardware. It's always about the humans that those things are supporting.
And so if I keep that idea in, in the, in the center, then the second lesson is that. As I sort of mentioned a moment ago, having the sense of purpose for people, energizes organizations and that sense of purpose for people within your organization. And again, the people that you're working on behalf of, so that, that combination of the people-centered ness and the energy that it fostered.
I think really reminds [00:22:00] teams. Why, why they're working hard to deliver something that matters and that motivates and fosters creativity. And that's exactly what you need to move organizations to, to new grounds and, and be innovative and create new things. So I often am, you know, reading articles or business books, or what have you on really brilliant business strategies, which are all valid, maybe not all of them, but many of them valid.
Powerful, but even within those, it always comes [00:22:30] back to what sense of team do you have and what purpose are you marshaling those resources around to support the purpose, solve the problem? What have you? So that's my biggest learning on moving organizations. You know, there's all sorts of more business focused strategies that we could dig into, but all of those come back to.
Meg Escobosa: That's the kind of team I want to work on. You know, I want to work, meet a leader who really sees the team for who they [00:23:00] are and the value they bring. So that's really aligns to something I've experienced too. Fortunately, I have been lucky enough to work with colleagues and leaders who really care about their people and, you know, so I agree with you and I in you only know.
When you don't have it. I mean, I learned that my, I moved to a different organization and realized, oh wait, they don't really even care what we value and what's important. And what drives us. Right. So that's exactly right. It sounds like [00:23:30] you have learned a lot. And how would you say your leadership has evolved?
It sounds like, I mean, it's clear that you've learned some really important lessons. Would you say there's any other areas of evolution in your leadership style?
Tina Moen: Absolutely. I like most of us have evolved over 20 years, which is good. Um, but I, as I mentioned earlier, I'm a pretty introspective person and becoming more so as each year passes.
And I, and I often ask a similar question that you just asked me to [00:24:00] interview candidates, particularly around the, what did you learn? What have you learned from things that didn't go well, or from the years you've spent doing this or that? I think that, uh, you, you learn so much from the things that. Quite go.
Right. And maybe even more from the things that don't go quite right. Compared to the things that went swimmingly and you just think, oh my gosh, I really got this down. No problem. I'm amazing. Right. Exactly. And then, and then the university has not taken an opportunity to remind you that we all have room for [00:24:30] improvement.
One of the things that always stands out to me is my early approach to management people management. I had a style that I led with. It was based on different things. I'd learned over the years, again, being an observer, but my maturity level was not yet to where I had reconciled. Whether those things I had learned were authentic to me and also whether or not they were serving me well or serving my team well.
So in my early management days, I think part of [00:25:00] me knew. That's how I was approaching my role. Wasn't resonating with the team and wasn't the best thing for the team, but I decided it was. It should be as a manager. And so I just plowed ahead and, and would have a little voice in my head sometimes being, oh, I don't know if this is quite right, but so fast forward to realization that the only kind of manager I should be is the one that is authentically who I am and, and authentically paying attention to what the team needs.
And importantly, sometimes realizing. [00:25:30] Who I am authentically is not what the team needs, which is a hard, wow. A hard place to land, but I've landed there a time or two. So I overtime started being more competent to take the risk of, or stop taking the risk of being who I thought I was supposed to be. And rather realize that in order to be successful, Both myself and my teams at being authentically, who I am was always the best approach.
And when I, when I see some of those folks that were in those early management days on the, on the receiving end of that, I am [00:26:00] often apologetic for what I didn’t know exactly.
Meg Escobosa: Exactly when you know, better, you do better. Right. So indeed, the idea that you also saw the lack of maturity, or just that it's not a…it's not threatening or at least it feels that way when you're younger to acknowledge. Who you authentically are. That's a certain experience.
Tina Moen: Yeah. And I think in business, in particular, and then being a woman in business [00:26:30] as a whole ‘nother layer to that, as we know, but yeah, I agree. I think there's this sense of, I need to sort of put on this facade and I'm going to represent as I see the world representing.
And that apparently is what works. And so I'll do that, whether it's working for me or whether it's working for the people that I'm trying to support. Is not always something that we're encouraged to pay attention to. And that inevitably fails for everybody involved and often is in a, in a [00:27:00] fiery crash of some source,
Meg Escobosa: some drama.
Tina Moen: Exactly. Um, so I'm very thankful that it's, while there was some drama in my lesson, there was no giant fiery crash was so I guess that was.
Meg Escobosa: Yeah, small blessings, indeed. Um, I, you, you brought it up. I was going to ask a little later in our conversation, but how do you think has being a woman affected your ability to lead innovation or drive change or make a difference in the industry?
If at [00:27:30] all?
Tina Moen: Yeah. You know, it's, it's fascinating. I definitely was raised to not doubt my ability to do anything that anybody else could do, gender not being part of the equation and most things…
Meg Escobosa: More reasons to love your dad…
Tina Moen: Right, right. It's and my mom and my mom, both, I had two military parents. And so there was lots of tough lessons in that house, as you can imagine, but, um, but definitely came out of my childhood, not doubting [00:28:00] my capability in, in, in too many things.
I mean, of course there's lots of things I can't do, but it's certainly not my intellectual capability or my ability to learn the next new thing. But then when I got out into the world, I like many women felt the. The world thinking differently. So I think my personal challenge was balancing that, knowing what I was taught, believing what I was taught and believing in myself in, in many instances, not always, of course, but balancing that [00:28:30] with what the world was telling me.
And not having to hold onto what I was taught to believe. So I think the, the difference in many women's and many humans experiences are what they're coming into the experience with. And so I was blessed to come into the experience with that sense of self and know that I had to stand against and fight against and prove wrong.
What the general public, maybe. And I think that's, it's too bad that the general public thinks and says and [00:29:00] implies things to any person of, you know, any group that is indicates that they are less than anything they want to be. So my experience in the workplace as a woman is coming from the perspective of, I didn't doubt myself because of my gender ever, but did I have to fight some uphill battles because somebody else maybe didn't give me this chance.
Of course, that I have to fight off some stereotypes. I remember that I was in a meeting fairly early in my career and [00:29:30] I said something, I don't even remember what it was, but a senior gentleman in that room said, oh, she's more than just a pretty face. And I thought, what a terrible thing to say to me, um, irrelevant.
My, you know, my appearance is irrelevant to whatever we were just talking about some technology issue, but also what a terrible thing to say. I remember even at that point
in my career, probably 35 thinking, no there's younger women in this room. And, and here we are, again, demonstrating to them. That bat [00:30:00] matters when it doesn't.
Meg Escobosa: Wow. What an incredible experience.
Tina Moen: Yeah, it's fascinating. Yeah. And I'm sure I know you're not alone. I'm hopeful that times are changing. I think they are, you know, slowly but surely as, as things do evolution, didn't didn't happen overnight in any, any kind of evolution I do think they are. And I think that every day, there's more power and more confidence across, across our [00:30:30] gender and our, um, demographic to be confident to say, Hey, that's not okay. That's not right. And, and not be quite as fearful of the ramifications, knowing that there are still are plenty of ramifications, inappropriate ramifications that people are fearful of progress.
I do think progress is being. And, you know, it also makes me really excited and proud of creating this podcast because we're telling stories and creating more ways for young women and [00:31:00] anybody who is pursuing great things to feel more confident and to recognize like there are some really great stories out there.
Meg Escobosa: There's, there's definitely bumps along the road, but you hold steady and stay with it and you can get there. So. Partly what is inspired our work.
Tina Moen: Yeah. I love that too. And I, and I love that podcasts like this and the work you all are doing will give young women who maybe didn't have the blessing that I have of coming out of a family that taught me that I could be what I want it to [00:31:30] be the vision of people who can teach them different than maybe they learned at home.
And undoubtedly they learned at home because that's what their families learned at home before them and before them. So, yeah, I think it's, it's really powerful, a really powerful tool for somebody to be able to see themselves in someone else and maybe learn something from somebody else's experiences, you know, the, the way that they were parents had that, that maybe didn't jive with yours, but that resonates with the direction you want to go in.
Meg Escobosa: Speaking of the next generation.
Tina Moen: Yes.
[00:32:00] What words of wisdom can you offer the next generation of change makers who are in the earlier stages of their career right now, women who want to get into healthcare and make a difference?
Tina Moen: Great question. So I, my two children are in their twenties, so I would say the same thing to women that I don't know, or, or just young people that I don't know that I would say to my own children.
First of all, stop seeking perfection. We talked about this a little bit before that when you're younger, sometimes you think [00:32:30] that there's no room for error, there's that you have to be this certain vision, certain image that is expected of you. And it has to be perfect. And it's just not the case. So stop seeking perfection, be open to the curve.
Balls that take you down a road. You never expected to be on. I wouldn't be where I am in this career. If I didn't take a swing at a curve ball. Another thing I think is this, this fine line between holding yourself accountable, [00:33:00] but also knowing when to cut yourself some slack. And that goes back to that perfectionist mentality that I think sometimes is pounded into our children.
So accountability, but also know when to cut yourself some slack. And I think back to my human connection, don't look at the world as something that's working against, you know, that. Human connection is and could and should be at the center of most things. And humans helping humans happens all the time.
We don't [00:33:30] always see it inherit in the media, but it indeed, if you start paying attention and observing, it really is happening in big and small ways all the time. So a great way to move ahead in any ambition, whether that a personal or professional one is to do your fair share of helping. And then to be open and grateful for the help that comes your way, that, that, and it will come your way.
And then of course be authentically you and be unapologetic about it. And remember to have a little bit of fun along the way. [00:34:00]
Meg Escobosa: Beautiful. Beautiful. Beautiful. Can you talk to my daughters?
Tina Moen: I am happy to, yeah. I will also probably say I'm a be good act. Right? Make good choices. I say those things to my children as well and clean your room until they move out and then you don't care what their room looks exactly.
Meg Escobosa: Um, what is next for you? What's the next big problem that you might want to tackle?
Tina Moen: Too many [00:34:30] really, um, in the near term, you know, remaining focused on how to bring the best possible evidence-based insights to clinicians. I think there's the way human beings are taking in content is very different now than it used to be a former colleague of mine read a study somewhere years ago that, you know, we used to read the newspaper for heaven sakes.
We used to read, um, you know, long, long, you know, multi paragraph. Text. And [00:35:00] now we're reading tweets and texts and shorts, you know, 140 character things. And so how we bring evidence-based insights to clinicians has to evolve with how we are all evolving in how we're taking in information. So, so that's, that's the big problem I continue to focus on.
I think in the longterm, from a healthcare perspective, really passionate about how do we improve. What humanity understands about how to sustain good health? [00:35:30] Good health really happens in our everyday lives at home without our healthcare team, anywhere around us. It's not it's by and large, not when we're in a doctor's office or, or being counseled by a nurse or pharmacist or, or whomever.
So I'm really passionate about how we influence change and figure out people's motivations to want to take better care of themselves, to understand how to take better care of themselves. You know, nobody wants to feel like they do when they've got a chronic condition, particularly one that. Can [00:36:00] be mitigated by lifestyle choices, which many can, um, you know, nutrition in particular.
So, so really passionate about how we, how we figure out how to influence that change, knowing that how I need to be influenced is different than how you need to be influenced so that fewer of us are in need of chronic care. And more of us are leading long and healthy lives and having some fun along the way that
Meg Escobosa: That stands to have a huge level of impact what you're talking about.
I love to hear that.
Tina Moen: Thank [00:36:30] you. It's, it's a, it's a big challenge and it's going to take a village for sure, but it's certainly very needed in the U S and many other countries as well. So it's, it's a hard one, but worthwhile for sure.
Meg Escobosa: There are a lot of forces against that mission.
Tina Moen: There are because some of those really yummy foods are really yummy, but very bad for us
Meg Escobosa: and have great marketing teams indeed.
Plus working with the reptilian brain. Right. It's feeding us the sugars and salts
Tina Moen: and fats. Yes. Right, exactly.
Meg Escobosa: Exactly. [00:37:00] What we've been doing in every podcast conversation is asking our guests to finish a couple of sentences. And I'm going to invite you to do that. I've got three here. Innovation means.
Tina Moen: Innovation means the creation of something new, be that a product or a process, a concept, or an idea. Moving, moving from something existing to something new.
Meg Escobosa: The most exciting [00:37:30] innovations in the healthcare industry are:
Tina Moen: The most exciting innovations in healthcare. I think they’re wearables and things that allow individuals to monitor and learn from and modify.
There are health parameters in real time, in their real lives, at home on a, on a day to day basis.
Meg Escobosa: Yeah. And, and, and so many of those are going to help you in that big, huge, ambitious.
Tina Moen: Indeed. Your labs that you get from the doctor are great, but [00:38:00] they're once a year, twice a year. Um, so what's what's going on after I just ate that piece of cake right now.
If I, if I can understand that it might change my decision about the next piece of cake.
Meg Escobosa: Um, okay. The last one is: the most essential ingredients to healthcare innovation.
Tina Moen: The most essential ingredients in healthcare innovation in my minds are always keeping the patient at the center supporting and improving how we support diversity and inclusion in all healthcare deliverables, including health [00:38:30] tech.
And then as I spoke about before preventing an innovation from getting between the human to human interaction, that's at the core of healthcare.
Meg Escobosa: Amazing. Thank you. What a pro, really. Tina, this is so wonderful. It's been just great to reconnect with you and hear what's going on in your world and I'm delighted to see your growth and accomplishments.
Tina Moen: Thank you. Thank you.
Meg Escobosa: It's a privilege to interview you for the podcast.
Tina Moen: Thanks. It is a privilege to be here. It [00:39:00] was great. I'm excited to follow your podcast and learn from all these fascinating women you'll have lined up. Yes. Thank you. My pleasure. Thank you.[00:39:30] [00:40:00]
Meg Escobosa: And thank you to our listeners for joining us today. If you enjoy our show, please consider leaving a rating and review wherever you listen. It helps us reach new listeners. And if you other folks who might enjoy it, please spread the word. To find out more about The Krinsky Company, visit our website.
See ya next time…