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Beyond The Message is a weekly podcast that dives deeper into the weekend’s teaching. Released after each Sunday service, it offers thoughtful conversation, added insight, and practical reflection to help our community process and apply what they heard. Whether you're revisiting the message or catching up, this podcast is designed to help you go deeper throughout the week.
Welcome to Beyond the Message, the podcast where we take the weekly teaching at Christ Community Chapel and we bring it into your week. Each week we sit down together as friends and as colleagues and we talk, we reflect, we laugh a little bit, and we think about how to live out what it is that we are learning. If you didn't hear the sermon yet, no big deal. Drop down and you can watch or listen to it at the link below and then come back and I hope you'll join us. My name is Stacey and today I am joined with Anthony Pietrocini, first time on the podcast, Anthony. We're excited about that. And Lana Chilton and Jamie Hewitt. Oh, were you gonna do it sounded like you're gonna do a woo woo. I wanted to cheer for her, but you didn't leave any room for me. Too fast. She didn't leave any room, but. So glad that you guys are here. this week I'll read the proverbs. It's Proverbs 22. 7. The rich over the poor and the borrower is the slave of the lender. So because we're going to be talking about money a lot on this one, very practical again. But wanted to start things off kind of on the other end of the money spectrum and ask you, what is something that you bought that was worth every penny and more of what you spent on it? I don't think there's anything more valuable per dollar than a Mama Cozzi's pepperoni pizza from aldi. It is $6.99 of he. I've never had family and it is worth every penny. If you're listening, you just had to see Jamie's face. You knew something like ridiculous was coming. But $6.99 for a pizza? I mean, Costco pizza is like a steal too. Every penny, every. And then some. Listen, hot tip, Aldi also has a gluten free pizza right next to the whatever you're talking about and it's fine on it. That's not my thing. What's yours? My thing is 10 years ago in Missouri, I had packed all clothing thinking it was going to be like 45 degrees in November and it was 85 degrees. And so I went to Walmart and on the clearance rack was this like cottony jean skirt that had shorts underneath it and it kind of would go with anything. And I bought it for $5. I have worn it every summer. I wore it to the outdoor service last week and someone asked me where they could get one. And, that's why it was on my mind when you asked this question. And I said, I'm sorry, 10 years ago, for $5 on the Walmart clearance rack, you could have. But a jean skirt with shorts under it. And it's not jean. Jean. It looks like jean, but it's real, like, oh, so nice and light. It's so great. So I have. I have had those 500 pennies. This is going in a different direction than I thought. Mine's. Mine's not nearly as funny, but I'm gonna get brownie points for this one. wedding ring. I knew you were gonna say that. Yes, I actually use this. I actually thought you were gonna say that. Carolyn, if you're listening. Pizza. Pizza. Wedding ring. I stand by. I stand by. Okay. no, I just use this, actually as a sermon analogy at upward. but y. I mean, it's funny that you don't even think about what a wedding ring costs. Because it's worth it. It's worth it. That's. How long have you been married, Anthony? Coming up on three years. That's awesome. Three years. I thought very much about my wedding ring. We'll talk later, Anthony. We'll talk later. Okay. I was gonna go in a different direction, do it too, but that I just. And this might be on my mind. Cause I'm heading out on vacation very soon. But, money that I've spent on vacations. I mean, probably there's times that I've, like, oh, maybe we spent too much. The memories and the time spent together with families. I was torn between a trip with my family to Disney or pizza or your jean skirt. And you saw. You saw where I went. Mama cozy spin. Mama cozy flew in. Okay, well, let's jump in. I think we're gonna have a lot to talk about. so again, the passage is the rich rule over the poor, and the borrower is a slave to the lender. Pastor Zach taught and he had, his three points. But I'm gonna break down a few other things too. The first one was, are you trapped? And it was a picture. He explained really well how the metaphor of just slavery is to this and being a slave to money. And why that makes sense with this talked, about, like, the average family or person, and they're in, you know, consumer debt of $1,392 a month. and then moved into a next section that was just called are you leaking? And the reality that, again, maybe money isn't the only thing that causes these different things, but can be a factor in us having A loss of purpose. So going to work just to get our job done because we have to, because we have to make the money. a loss of peace, meaning that anxiety and fear, relationships that can be in turmoil because of finances. A loss of patience, meaning, or responding, maybe in anger and bitterness and different things, because we're riddled with that anxiety and fear. And also, he said something earlier today. I can't remember if he said it in the actual sermon, but just, like, how that almost feels so normalized as a society that it's just. What we know is our culture is like American culture. You're gonna be in debt. Finances are gonna grip you in this way. so then moving on, though, last point was, are you ready to get out? He talked about the where the red fern grows analogy. If you heard the sermon, just connected to that. Was that a raccoon Paul? Is that what that was? A raccoon Paul would be stuck in. Stuck in grabbing that quarter. and really, that Jesus is our answer. So Jesus went to Matthew 6, which is a tremendous passage, but where we kind of looked at where Jesus is saying, don't lay up your treasures in heaven. We got to let go of that quarter. why are you so anxious? And just the fact that, like, he knows this is going to rob us. And then also ultimately, Jesus saying, seek first the kingdom of God, meaning, trust him with our finances, and he'll take care of everything else. So there's a lot to get into there. But I thought I'd start by asking or just kind of going around talking about if any of us have had a season in our life where money kind of quietly became the biggest source of anxiety for us. And then ultimately, if you have anything in this kind of what helped you to get out and get out of that place. So, Lana, you're nodding, so I'm gonna let you start and jump in on that one. Okay. Thanks, Stacy. Yes. I would say yes. And it was the first few years of our marriage. We were just celebrated 24 years. And when we started our marriage, we. I didn't know. We had had a few conversations about money. We did really great premarital counseling. But even it wasn't enough for us to really have a good picture of our financial situation. Neither Brian nor I had any financial education going into marriage. So there was so much debt, so much more than what Brian even realized, for a complicated situation. And so that created instant anxiety for the next several years of our marriage. Then there was a layoff, more anxiety, debt, car payments, more Anxiety. What helped, was a conversation with friends the evening of May 27, 2008. That's amazing. And you might wonder why I know that. it is because we had closed on a house that day in Georgia. We just moved to Georgia. We were having dinner with the only people we knew. And those of you that know the housing crisis of 2008, this was right before that. Okay. So we closed on a modest house, but at the peak of its price, we didn't know what was coming. And those friends began to talk about financial principles that Zach was talking about today. And it caused us to get a book and do a course and learn some things. And our testimony is just God's faithfulness through it. But I would say what we learned was, you know, so much of what Zach pointed to, so much of what we're going to offer in the financial workshop later this summer. And it was information and then the hard work of applying it. And God was so faithful. Yeah. Yeah. What, about you? Anybody else? Yeah, I think in our. The first couple of years of our marriage, I came on staff with a ministry and made very little left a job and made half as much, to do ministry. And I remember a season where I had bought a car fresh out of college and could afford it. But then when you take a job that's. You make half as much as you were making. And I remember calling my whatever lender and being like, hey, I'm worried about being able to make these payments. Is there any way we can refinance this? And they're like, we don't do that. And so I remember there was like a month where I'm like, what are we going to do? Because we had done the math and, our bank account was going to be just completely empty in a couple of months. And I remember sitting with Carolyn and I mean, some, some prayer and like, a lot of anxiety. So that's what, you know, comes to mind when I think of this. And so, ultimately, in the end of the day, we were. We had been reading through the Gospel of Mark, and God is really good sometimes and gives you often exactly what you need in his word. And we came upon the passage where Jesus has fed the 4,000. So, the second iteration of a feeding miracle. And then he's with his disciples soon after that, and they're crossing over and they're complaining about not having enough bread. And I, remember, you know, he's like, are you little faith? Like, were you there when I fed the 5,000? How many loaves were there. They say 12. And he's like, and were you there when I fed the 4,000? And how many loaves were left? Baskets full of loaves were left over. And they say seven baskets. And he's just like. I mean, essentially he's like, trust me, haven't I shown you enough? And so Caroline and I just sat there and we're like, God, we know that you've never let us down, and we want to trust you, whatever this looks like. So a lot of anxiety there. and I still actually. I don't know how we made it financially. Yeah, I didn't ever, like, do the accounting, but I know that we were supposed to run out of money and we never did, so. Okay, that probably makes me a really bad steward. Yeah. Similar experience, too. Like, start, of our marriage. Like, I think for me, two things were happening at once. One was I felt probably to an unhealthy point, a sense of responsibility to now provide and all that. And. But then also, I didn't get a background of financial education. Neither did my wife, really. And so I was getting plugged into CCC more. I was listening to podcasts, and those things fed off each other. So the. The pressure to provide and then listening to podcasts was, like, really starting to get unhealthy. And so the thing that actually helped me get out of it was I had to stop listening to financial podcasts. And I got what I needed to get to move forward and not obsess about it, though, but not obsessed about, because it just ended up becoming beat obsess. Yeah. And so, yeah, I just add for myself, it definitely I was answer yes and probably multiple times in my life. And I think, two things that I'd say. First of all, I think every person, if you are married, if you're. If you're not married, you probably experience this as well. But, like, we were just on different pages and had different upbringings regarding finances, so that just coming to the table saw that differently and didn't do much planning on the front end. And so that's still, to be honest, like, we'll kind of come up over and over because there's just that difference that we still see through. but I would say what helped me, and this is maybe feels backwards, but it's not, because it's who God is, is I think the more, I took steps to, no matter what, be generous and to give. And that feels so backwards, but the more it did. First of all, it opened my hands and also lessened My worry, and I think it's, we are. God is incredibly generous. He's given us everything. And I think that I often tell people that are nervous about taking steps to, like, step out in faith and give. To, like, just do it. You God will show up time and time again in, in that faithfulness. So, let me jump to another question. So Jesus talks about money a lot, in, in the New Testament, and in the Gospels. Are there other takeaways that you guys have had about money and debt connected to what scriptures taught? Anything that you would want kind of add on to everything that we kind of learned today? You were just talking about generosity. And I have a few verses that I had written down here. Just, Proverbs 22:9 says, A generous person will be blessed, for he shares his food with the poor. 11:25. A generous person will prosper. Whoever refreshes others will himself be refreshed. And that is not why we should be generous. That is not why we should. God is just so good that he lets generosity because it's in his nature and his character. It is. He's such a reciprocal blessing to us. but I think in order to be generous, we have to. In order to say yes to that. The biblical principles of saying no to other things come into play. And it starts with saying no to yourself and saying no to impulsive things, no to fear, no to anxiety, but also no to just getting whatever you want, when you want it, how you want it. I've said to my son recently, every time we get to say yes to something, because God's given us the provision, he enabled us to say no to something previously to be able to say this. Yes, it came up with a unexpected car repair this week. You know, but anyway, generosity. We could talk. I want to hear what others have to say too. But you mentioned generosity. That was the principle that stood out to you. Stood out to me. Yeah, yeah. You got something, Anthony? I got it. Go for it. Pastor, Zach mentioned Matthew 6, but Matthew 6 has always been a special passage for me and my wife. And I love the end where it says, seek first God's kingdom and his righteousness, and all else will be given to you. I heard, another pastor say this one time that has always stuck with me. And, that's not obviously a prosperity gospel passage. But, what, I think this is what the pastor was saying. What, Jesus means in that is whatever work that God has for you, he will provide exactly what you need to do that for some People that might be a lot. for some people, that might not be so much, but it's sufficient to do the work that God has for you. And that has always been super comforting to know that. And then you get into the. Look at the birds of the air. They don't sow, they don't weep. So, yeah, that's always been comforting to know that whatever work God has for me, he will. He won't back it up. And I love that when Zach read from that passage in the sermon, he started a little earlier, talking about, lay up for yourself treasures. And I've been thinking on that since the. Since the sermon and what that means. And part of what I think it means, part is to make Jesus himself your treasure, to make him the thing we're going after. So if we're gonna seek first the kingdom, he has to first be the treasure. The treasure, yeah. Yeah, yeah. The verse that came to mind for me was the warning where he'll say, you can't serve two masters. and just the hold that money has. And I think even that's probably why it's talked about so much in Scripture. So I'm trying to remember the actual stat, but I feel like it was somebody I, once heard. It's like 8% of the verses in the New Testament talk about money or something crazy when you think of all the things that Jesus does talk about, but, like, almost 10% of it is in this because it's. It can get such a deep hold on us. Yeah, for sure. Yeah. And that's where generosity can start to kind of unravel that. It really can. okay. Kind of hot take question for us, as a Christian, do you think it should be our goal to just increase our wealth? Like, I think we live. I just know I live in, like, okay, how much are we putting away for retirement? How much am I putting. What am I investing here? And what can be my overall, you know, wealth? And I don't know, should that be our. Even if it's not the only end game, should it be one? I think increasing influence for the purpose of building the kingdom, seeing the kingdom built should be. And so if. But is it unwise to save? No. Okay, so that's what I mean. And if increasing wealth enables us to increase influence, then, you know, there's wisdom. M. I mean, there's so many even proverbs about saving. So is. Yeah, no, I think that it's wise. I think it's a good pursuit in the healthy. Yeah. And I think a lot of People. There are incredible examples in the New Testament especially of people who used that influence for good. To the glory of God. Absolutely. So Phoebe. Oh yeah, you have her and Lydia Finance like you have so many. Yeah. So many different people. You have you know, Luke writes Luke and Acts, but he's got a patron. Theophilus, who in many ways has allowed that work to be done. And so I think if your and our work and wealth is used to the glory of God and we are open handed with it in some way like what Stacy was talking about, I think that God blesses that. So it's not inherently bad, I don't think. Yeah, I think going off what you said Jamie, I think our goal, related to money is our goal related to everything else as a Christian, which is to love God and love neighbor and to glorify God, whether whatever we do, eat or drink, glorify God. And so I think the question is what are we doing with our money? Is it loving God? Is it loving neighbor? And if that has wealth attached to it or if it doesn't have wealth attached to it, it's still the same question. So. You guys are so wise. No we are not. That's all good stuff though. Okay, so if we think of first of all, one takeaway I would say is if this, if you're impacted or maybe even if you weren't read Matthew 6 this. I do think there's so much in that that is connected to this and there might be even just more. I know I want to do that. That just kind of comes to mind that I connect to kind of how I view money and what I'm storing away and, and anxiety that I have, you know, I think in correlation with that. But as it does end with Matthew 6:33 with seeking first the kingdom. So if we think about that, what does. When it boils down, what does seeking first the kingdom look like when that paycheck comes? What does that mean? Lana, you've got to go first because you're making. You're so excited about this topic. I am. m so excited, Stacy. And you know what? I'm excited for similar reasons that I was last week. When you experience God like redeeming something in your life, it is sincerely something that is so precious and so good and you want that for somebody else. That's right. That's how I feel. And so gratitude comes to my mind. Like how do we do this? It's gratitude to God, our paycheck, all of it. Is from him. That's really cool. All of it is from him. And so right now, you know, my husband's PayCheck comes from DHL. That is who God has chosen to use as part of our provision. But that came from God. And so one of the ways that we seek him first is to make him first. And so when we do our budget, he's first, and he's the first thing coming out of the. You know, giving to the work of his kingdom is the first thing. And that is part of gratitude. It's also part of obedience. It's grateful obedience. I was talking to somebody recently who is new to thinking about giving, and this individual said, this is gonna be really hard. And it's kind of a first job situation, first job scenario. So the amount maybe isn't huge, but in perspective to what they are earning, right? And then the statement was, this is gonna be. This is gonna be hard, but I know it's right. And I said, yeah. And, you know, it only will get harder the longer you wait to trust the Lord here, or it will get more fun. Not just easier, but more enjoyable and more rewarding to experience God out giving you, you know, and that's not why we give. But he's just that good. So that's one thing I would say. What would you guys say? Well, it's just like Jesus, it's more blessed to give than to receive. Like, it is for our good that we would do that. And I think the act of doing that and trusting is how he'll shape our heart and give us joy through that. no. You looked like you were going to say something. Yeah, I was waiting. No, my brain just went blank. Oh, that's okay. That happens. I'm almost 40. So big you weren't sure if you were ready to bring it. It's Thursday night. It's late, guys. It's been a long day. Jamie's brain went blank. That hasn't happened before. Anthony, what do you think? For me, I started doing this about two years ago. So I plan out our budget for the year. So I'll project a, budget for the year, but then at the end of every month, I'll plan the next month and everything. but Megan and I have yearly, goals. And so we'll have financial goals, we'll have personal goals, and, we write those up and we put them on the fridge. Oh, wow. You guys are those people. You're those people. It's probably unhealthy, but, I've done that For a while. but recently, like I said two years ago, I started putting, seek first my kingdom in my righteousness at the start. Because it's just a reminder. It's a reminder. And related to financial goals, I think talking about the paycheck, looking and saying, do the goals of my paycheck, do the goals of my budget align with the goals of God? Sometimes the answer isn't as yes as I want it to be. And so that's a good time to correct. Yeah. I'm so glad you shared that. It reminded me of earlier. And there are times where I don't do this like I used to, but sitting down to do the bills every month like it was prayer first it was gratitude first, it was, Lord, I don't know how you're gonna make all the numbers work, but yet you somehow do. And just setting your heart and your affection and your attention and your, trust toward Christ. Yeah. Do I get a second chance? Second shot since your brain. I, So I was just thinking. For me, actually, I think one of the biggest problems is I have made my life so automatic. I have direct deposit of my paycheck into my bank account. I have giving set up recurring automatic recurring giving. I have saving set up, to move things into allocated accounts. And I often just. I will go months on autopilot and I have no idea. Yeah. Which is not surprising for you. You don't, like, go back and balance everything. No, I don't, surprisingly. but I just think even, like, that gives me anxiety. The rhythm of reflecting, it creates months of non anxiety followed by acute seasons of anxiety. When you're like, okay, how did we get here? Where to go? but I think even in real time, I'm like, rhythms of reflection would be good for me to introduce. I think what should we do when the paycheck comes in is stop to remember actively that it's not mine. And even I think, sadly and confessionally, my just ignoring it and not thinking about it is because I just assume that it's mine. Like it comes in. And so I think stopping, reflecting, remembering that it's not mine, that it is a gift to me. And then, even then just asking the tangible question of, hey, God, is there anything you want me to do with this that I haven't already been thinking about? Is there a change you want me to make with this? And for the record, I don't do any of that regularly. Like I said, all of that. Good. We're all figuring out this is an Intervention. But, yeah, I think all of that stuff as you were talking, I'm like, man, if we stopped, if we reflected, if we gave God the glory for it, remembered that it's, you know, even if we earned it through working, it was by his strength and grace that we had the ability to do that. and so, yeah, hey, I think to close, I would just add that, you know, if you might be in a position, listening to this, where you're going, whoa, I am nowhere near being able to even be in that healthy of a place financially. Just take one step. Just do one thing. I mean, we talked about the workshops that are coming up, but just take one step. You might not have your goals on the fridge like Anthony and his wife. I don't either. Everything for a year plan, but that's okay. Like, it's just figuring out that next week and, like, maybe a baby step, you can do something you won't buy that you typically did to start to unravel those things. So it's, you know, it. It can be overwhelming if you've got a long way to go. But, I mean, you just shared a testimony, Lana, of you getting out of a place of a lot of debt. So it's. And there's so many like that, so. And if you're looking for a cheap dinner, we know mama code 6.99 at Aldi. Perfect. In the Walmart clearance rack. You never know. That's right. Well, thank you guys for joining me. And we will be back next week with the next week in our Proverbs series. What? More wisdom, more life. Yeah. Thanks so much. If you are joining us, for beyond the Message. So glad that you've joined us. If before you leave, make sure you go ahead and like, and subscribe so that next week you can get pinged with the next Beyond the Message. And in the meantime, make sure you check out other resources we have on our app on our website so that you can grow right where you're at. And we'll see you next week.