Broadband Labels Deadline Insights, With Dounia Chikhoune

With about two months to go before the Oct. 10 broadband label deadline, Dounia Chikhoune, from JSI, shares insights about on what she's seen big and small ISPs do to be ready.

Creators & Guests

Host

Andy Johns

Vice President of Marketing

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StoryConnect features interviews with marketers, communicators, CEOs and other leaders at cooperative and independent broadband companies, electric cooperatives and municipal power providers. The goal of the podcast is to help listeners discover ideas to shape their stories and connect with their customers. It is produced by Pioneer Utility Resources.

Intro:
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StoryConnect, helping communicators discover ideas to shape
their stories and connect with their customers.

Andy Johns:
What have we learned about broadband labels now that the October
10th deadline is coming up quick?

That's what we'll be talking about on this episode of The
StoryConnect Podcast.

My name is Andy Johns, your host with Pioneer, and I'm joined on
this episode by Dounia Chikhoune, who is the Associate Policy

Counsel with JSI.

Dounia, thanks so much for joining me.

Dounia Chikhoune:
Hi. Thanks for having me.

I'm excited to be here.

Andy Johns:
So the blog post and the podcast that we have done about the
broadband labels have been some of the most popular content on

our site over the last year or so.

Excited to get Dounia's take and kind of where JSI's things
going.

I think, Dounia, the first thing that everybody is wondering
after the April 10th deadline, when all the 100,000 plus

subscriber companies had to have their stuff together, did
anybody get busted?

Do we know yet?

Dounia Chikhoune:
Yeah. No, we actually don't know.

Haven't heard anything from the FCC of any type of audits or,
you know, investigations of any sort.

I think they're probably waiting again to see this October
deadline to see how it's going.

I don't know if there's conversations happening, but in terms of
public facing, there's no updates there on the

implementation of the bigger providers.

Andy Johns:
Okay. It would have been a little bit more exciting podcast if we
had some ongoing investigations.

Dounia Chikhoune:
I know, right.

Andy Johns:
But, you know, it is what it is.

Just to kind of summarize and Dounia, you can jump in here for
just a second.

But what we're talking about is the broadband labels, they were
called the broadband nutrition labels at the beginning.

But it's a requirement that basically on April 10th deadline,
where anybody, any broadband providers with more than 100,000

subscribers had to have them published and public by April 10th.

And then the subscribers, like most of the folks listening to
this podcast that are under 100,000 subscribers, you'll have to

have your labels ready by October 10th.

That's the basics of it, am I right so far?

And what other details would you say when you're kind of
describing the broadband labels requirements to folks?

Dounia Chikhoune:
Yeah. So like you mentioned, very similar to nutritional fact
labels.

It's a, you know, a standardized format for transparency
purposes so that when consumers are shopping for a

plan that best fits their needs, it's apples to apples
comparison, shop in between the providers.

And there's more transparency in terms of fees and actual speed
that the consumer's going to typically expect from that

plan and what they're purchasing.

Yeah, and so as you mentioned, the bigger providers had an April
10th deadline.

Smaller rural providers with 100,000 or less broadband
subscribers have that October 10th.

All providers, though, have there's two items in the order that
all providers have the October 10th deadline for, and

that's to make your labels in a machine readable format and to
have the labels on your customer online account portals.

So those two aspects, the bigger providers have not had to
implement that just yet.

They still have that a couple of months here to implement those
two requirements.

Andy Johns:
Interesting, I wasn't aware of that.

That's good to know.

Dounia Chikhoune:
Yeah. And it's too, it's for standalone broadband plans.

So you won't find labels for any bundled plans.

Also for grandfathered plans.

So you may have a customer on a current plan, but that plan is
no longer being offered to new customers.

That's considered a grandfather plan; therefore, they don't need
to create a label for that.

And that's because, again, this is for new customers.

This is when someone's shopping around.

So yeah.

Andy Johns:
So that old copper 10 [Mbps] plan that somebody's been on and
just refuses to convert, you don't have to come up with a

new label just for that for just a couple of folks that are
still on that plan.

It's just anything that you're actively selling new.

Dounia Chikhoune:
Yeah, exactly.

And, it's business and residential.

So it's your standardized off the shelf, you know, offering.

Anything that's customized or negotiated is not considered mass
market; therefore, it does not need a label also.

So those are the the exemptions there.

And yeah, it's again for consumers and for competition.

It's for, you know, more transparency there.

And yeah, it's slowly starting to be implemented and we'll see
how it goes after October 10th as well.

Andy Johns:
Yeah. And I'm optimistic.

And you may or may not be, but you know, when you've got folks
like a lot of folks listening to this podcast that are building

the right network, they're using fiber.

They're being forthright with their descriptions and what
they're advertising, what they can actually get a lot of them

with symmetrical connections and all that.

Those are the folks, I think, that a label like this is going to
help.

That transparency really helps people see, you know, who's got
the legit good service with stable pricing and not gimmicks and

other kind of pricing. So I've heard folks be optimistic that
this level of transparency actually helps folks who are doing it

right.

Dounia Chikhoune:
Yeah, exactly.

And I also think a lot of companies are using this time to
consolidate how many offerings they're, you know, if you have

like 30 plans, a lot of people are now because of these labels,
looking at that and seeing what doesn't make sense anymore to be

offering to new customers.

You know, business wise.

And, yeah, with this implementation of this new requirement, I
mean, it makes a difference now to have to implement these labels

with all these offerings.

So I, you know, I suggest if and we advise, you know, if you do
have a lot of plans, this is the time between now and October to,

you know, rethink some of your offerings.

Andy Johns:
Yeah. And 30 sounds like a lot.

But I know we've run into folks that have 17, 18 different
residential plans and then business plans on top.

So yeah, it's wild.

So most of the spots and when we were talking earlier you talked
about, you know, you mentioned the portal, which I think is a

distinction I want to get into.

But a lot of the focus so far has been on websites.

Because I guess that's the easiest to see what other folks are
doing.

So let's start there.

Has there been anything new?

And maybe we get into the portals you talked about.

Has there been anything new or anything that we've learned since

the big guys had to start doing the labels?

And has most of the focus has been on the website side of
things?

Dounia Chikhoune:
I think the website is the easiest way to see the differences of
what providers, the bigger providers, are doing.

And you're seeing that. You're seeing everyone's kind of
interpreting the the order differently.

You know, the order talks about how the labels have to be in
close proximity to the ad, you know, has to be prominently

displayed. Can't be hyperlinked, can't, you know, take you to a
different page.

It needs to be, you know, customers need to be able to easily
access it and see that the ad and the label, and it's

not hard to find.

And everyone's interpreting that a little bit differently.

You're seeing, you know, maybe some hide buttons where you have
to click, you know, the button and then it shows you the label.

So yeah, that's that.

You're not being taken to a different page there.

It's still prominently displayed.

So everyone's interpreting it differently.

Some people are a lot more interpreting it.

You know ad right below is the label.

I think everyone's talking to their website developers and
seeing what makes sense, especially if you do have more than a

couple, you know, for labels how to best design your website so
that they're all displayed there, and how to do

that in a way that isn't confusing to consumers.

Andy Johns:
Sure. And we'll get into the the phone aspect of it and the
retail location here in a minute.

But what are you hearing from your clients, JSI's clients, about
what they're worried about right now?

Or are they worried? Have they had plenty of time to get ready,
or what are their biggest questions, concerns, pain points right

now as as they're looking, you know this will come out early
August, mid-August.

So they're you know, they got about, you know, 2 or 3 months to
go before the deadline.

Dounia Chikhoune:
Yeah. Again, I think the website, if they're using third parties.

So again, the online account portal, you might have your billing
vendor or a third party vendor that's handling that, your online

account portal or your your website developer.

You know, you can't have these conversations a week before the
deadline.

That takes time.

Designing your website will take time.

So those I think are the pain points right now.

They just want to make sure that they have all the relevant
information of being in compliance, so that they can relay that

information to the third party, because at the end of the day,
it is on the service provider to be in compliance with these

rules. These third parties are just kind of your attachment that
are going to help you be in compliance, but at the end of the

day, it's on the service provider.

So that's something that we've been advising is, and it's not
simply just putting on your website.

There's a lot of other compliance aspects to broadband labels
that are a little bit more complicated.

And again, you mentioned the online account portals.

You know, the order talks about, it needs to be on these
portals, and it needs to be easily accessible.

Easily accessible is a very broad, you know, wording there.

What does that mean to everyone?

What does that look like?

Is it the actual label?

Is it can you link to the label in those portals?

And so everyone's interpreting it slightly different.

What does, yeah. Exactly what is easily accessible there.

And also is my vendor one of the vendors that needs to be – is
this

considered an online account portal where a label needs to be?

I think we've had a lot of questions there in making sure that,
you know, yes it is.

It would be applicable if there's you know, the order talks
about how generally these online account portals are websites

where customers, you know, can access an account of some sort,
where you can have information about your billing statements, or

you can specifics to your service offerings, or you can talk to
customer service.

But that's just a, you know, it's an exhaustive list of what, an
online account portal.

It doesn't mean if you only do one, it means you don't need to
have it in that portal.

So yeah, everyone's interpreting that differently, and you just
need to make sure that you're talking to your third party vendor

who's. And some billing vendors are, I've had discussions myself
with some vending billing

vendors, and they are implementing this and have been for the
last couple of months trying to figure out how to get these

labels on these portals.

So and the FCC knew that that was going to take a while, which
is why they have that one year implementation for this specific

requirement, and why the bigger providers had a six month
extension for this specific requirement.

So they they knew there needed to be time, and that's why it was
given.

Andy Johns:
Right. And I think that's kind of an interesting aspect of it,
that even if you have it on the page where it's promoting the

service in the billing portal or in, you know, that extra piece,
there is something that I had not heard folks talk about

when we were looking at this last fall.

So I'm really glad you brought that up.

Dounia Chikhoune:
Yeah. And I was going to just add the intent behind that is, you
know, when a new customer came into, you know,

contacted the provider is looking for a new service, the label
was distributed to them at the time that they were, you know,

shopping. Say they ended up purchasing a plan in the future.

At some point, you know, they get a billing statement.

They don't really understand one of the fees or something about
their billing statement that they're questioning or something.

Andy Johns:
Sure. Sure, it happens all the time.

Dounia Chikhoune:
Yeah. So the intent behind that is they can go on their online
account portal where they have a copy of the label of what

they had purchased at the time and are able to compare.

And if they have any questions, they could always contact the
service provider.

So that's the intent behind that and why the FCC has wanted
those on the portals.

Andy Johns:
Yeah. You brought up, well, I guess before we go into that.

Let's talk just briefly about the machine readable aspect to it.

So it's not good enough to have a JPEG or a PNG of the broadband
label up there.

It has to be machine readable, which I think is a distinction
that's important for folks to know.

Correct?

Dounia Chikhoune:
Yes, yes. So each label will need to have a, like you said, a
machine readable format.

So a spreadsheet, CSV type file.

And so if you have six labels, you'll have six files.

It's the exact same information that's on the label.

It's just a different format to be able to see it.

And maybe it's easier for a customer to see it in that format
than in the label format that's on your website.

And so providers will need to create a URL for where they're
putting all these files, these machine readable formats of each

label. They'll create a URL on their website dedicated to it.

Then they have to publicize this URL in their transparency
disclosures.

So that's, you know, their network management policy.

They'll have to have a placeholder there for the machine
readable format of the labels, the URL.

Andy Johns:
Got it. And there's some ongoing things that have to be done with
this as well, right.

This is not just a set it and forget it kind of a thing.

There's some requirements about how often you update it.

And, you know, having a plan to change things as it goes, right.

Are there other ongoing requirements?

Dounia Chikhoune:
So yes.

So any time there's a change to the plan.

So if there's a change to the label, you change the price, the
whatever it may be, you the provider – when I say you, I mean the

providers – will have to archive that label.

So they will have to take it down from their website, their
alternate sales channels.

And then they'll have to create a new label with a new unique
plan identifier.

So each label at the bottom has a unique plan identifier that
identifies that specific plan.

And it has a format that the FCC requires.

It starts with F or M for fixed or mobile.

Then it's the company's FCC registration number, the FRN, and
then 15 alphanumerical characters that

the provider can do as they please to identify that plan.

And so when you do archive it, you create one.

You have to create that new unique plan identifier.

And you can't reuse unique plan identifiers.

So you will have to keep track of all these labels over time.

Also, it's a way that if a customer in the future ever wants or
if the FCC ever requests for

a copy of a label that's been archived, you have to go, and
they'll get that unique plan identifier, and

that's how it'll identify which plan that they want the label
for.

Andy Johns:
So you need to take those down off the site, but hang on to them
somewhere.

So if it ever comes back up you can.

Dounia Chikhoune:
Yeah. Exactly.

So it's important for providers to have a place where they're
going to archive all of these labels and not only the labels but,

you know, documentation of proof of evidence of on those labels.

So you have to do speed testing for these labels.

You have to, there's a section on the label for your typical
upload download speed and your typical latency.

So there is speed testing.

And so you're going to want the documentation of those.

You're going to archive those.

You're linking to your privacy policy your network management
policy on these labels.

That's also content that's on there.

So you're going to want to archive that with the label.

And there's a two years to archive.

So document retention for broadband label.

So it's important that providers have a procedures in place and
where they're going to store all of this.

Andy Johns:
Sure. Certainly it's good to hang on to that to be able to back
it up if you need to.

You mentioned alternate sales channels, which is something I
know there was a lot of concern about for folks originally there.

You know, we had folks asking us, is this going to be like the
cigarette or alcohol ads where you have to put the every time you

market the, you know, every billboard, every everything, you
have to have one of these?

And it sounds like that's not the case, but there are at what
you call like a retail location where it does have to be

available as well.

And then some kind of audio component for a phone sale as well,
correct?

Dounia Chikhoune:
Yeah. So the order talks about alternate sales channels, which is
yeah, retail locations or over the phone.

So where yeah, where you're selling your services, where you
have maybe sales reps, and yeah.

So at these alternate sales channels, it's all about how you're
distributing the labels there.

So again, you don't need to have these labels, other than the
website, which is your main primary advertisement page of

where that plan is available to the customer at their location,
then at the store or over the phone.

If you can ensure internet access, the customer's internet
access either at home, at your retail location,

or you know their mobile device, then you can distribute the
labels in various ways.

You can, you know, send them a text or email with a link to your
website URL.

You can provide a QR code.

You can print out the URL to your website.

But they need to be able, if you're going to text it or email it
or have a QR code, you need to ensure that the customer can

actually open it and have access to it.

So that's, you know, and if one of the other options is if they
choose to read the label

over the phone, that they read the label in its entirety.

So it's just an option of other ways of distributing the label
to the customer.

And if they cannot ensure internet access either at the store or
over the customer's mobile device or home,

then they do need to provide a printed copy of the label to the
customer.

Andy Johns:
Okay.

Dounia Chikhoune:
And then another aspect of these alternate sales channels is that
you do have to document how

you're, you know, distributing the labels.

And the order first talks about how providers had to document
each instance of when and how the

label was distributed to the customer.

And providers can still do that if they want, but the FCC
noticed that that would be very burdensome to providers.

Andy Johns:
That's a lot.

Dounia Chikhoune:
So yeah, it is a lot.

How do you figure that out?

You have different sales reps.

You know, it's really burdensome.

And some providers don't have the resources to keep track of all
of that.

So in an order on reconsideration, there's an alternate way of
meeting that documentation requirement for the alternate sales

channels. And now another way of meeting that is creating a
document, a training material of some sort that

outlines how you're distributing your labels at your alternate
sales channels.

Keeping that document training material for at least two years,
and if the FCC ever requests for it, providing it to

them within 30 days.

So it's just an easier way.

And again, that ensures to the FCC that the company is
distributing these to customers.

Customers are seeing these when they're shopping before they've
decided on purchasing a plan.

And that everyone's trained, all the sales reps are trained on
how to do it.

And that's just an alternative way of meeting that requirement.

Andy Johns:
Got it. So I imagine that's something that you guys are
suggesting for everybody.

Even if they think the website's good, and they've got the the
documentation there for at the point of sale and all that.

Sounds like some having that training kind of helps as some
blanket coverage where you can at least say that you tried if it

ever came up. Right?

Dounia Chikhoune:
Yeah. So you'll create that training document, outlining your
procedures.

Yeah. And then, yeah, training everyone involved with broadband
labels on that procedure so that, you know, it's being

distributed to customers.

Andy Johns:
It sounds like from talking to you right before we started
recording that that retail space is kind of the key distinction,

where if you are throwing out branded footballs at the high
school football game on a Friday night, you're good.

But if you have a booth where people can actually sign up, you
know, get on the iPad and sign up for service or, you know,

sign up with one of your folks in person, then that's kind of
where you need to be able to show that you had it, that you had

the labels available to them in some shape, form or fashion.

Dounia Chikhoune:
Yeah. Distribute it to them.

Yeah. It's you know, I think it talks about, you know, if you
have a location, a store location in a mall or, you know, you

have an actual office where customers are coming in, that's the
intent behind retail location.

So if you have, you know, any type of marketing, you know, booth
or you're at your

community, I don't know,.

Andy Johns:
Christmas parade float.

Yeah.

Dounia Chikhoune:
yes. Whatever. That's not considered.

That's marketing, and you're not required to have these labels
in any mass market materials.

You're not, you don't have to have, you know, posters.

And you don't have to have them on your brochures.

You don't have to have them on billing inserts.

When it comes to the mass market material, that's not where,
that's not the requirement of these labels at this time.

You never know. Again, these labels are going to be evolving
over time.

And there wasn't further notice of proposed rulemaking, of
adding more requirements.

So it may change over time.

But where the rules lie today and for October 10th, no mass
market material.

Andy Johns:
Got it. And that was the next thing I was going to ask you.

Any indication at this point that there's going to be any
extension or changes or anything coming up between now and

October 10th? I mean, I guess it could be handed down without
much warning, but you aren't hearing anything that to indicate

that there may be any changes coming that that are going to
alter any of this, right?

Dounia Chikhoune:
No. No word at all on that.

All providers should you know, if you have that October 10th
deadline, that is the deadline, and you should meet that

and understand all the the requirements, regarding the labels.

And not only on your website, but all the again, the compliance
aspects and the procedures that you should put in place.

And like, you're linking to your, again, network management
policy and your privacy policy, you need to make sure that those

are in compliance with the transparency rules, because that's a
whole other, you know,

requirement with its own disclosures that must be on there.

But you're linking to it on the label.

So that also needs to be in compliance.

So this is a time to review and update your policies to make
sure that they are have the disclosures that they need on your

website. And yeah, because you're linking to it, so I think it's
just important that providers know there's more to it than

just the website.

Andy Johns:
Yeah. A great excuse to kind of review a lot of the other pieces
as well.

Well Dounia, the last thing I had for you then what advice do
you have for somebody who may be, they flip the calendar to

August, and they're like, oh no, I've got two months left to do
this.

October 10th seemed so far away.

If there's somebody who finds themselves kind of behind the
curve, obviously calling the experts at JSI would be a good a

good first step. But what advice do you have for somebody who
may be kind of hustling to get it done, or just kind of beginning

getting ready to implement some of these labels?

Dounia Chikhoune:
I mean, I think if you're thinking about it right now, and you've
been in discussions, you're in a good place.

You still have the time, right now.

I would say, you know, now is the time, August, really start
thinking about this.

Even I think, even thinking about it in September might be
cutting it too close.

Andy Johns:
Sounds prettyy stressful.

Dounia Chikhoune:
Yeah. Especially again, how I mentioned there's third parties
potentially involved, and the speed testing that's involved.

So that takes time.

So yeah, I think you're in a good place now.

Do your research, understand the order and the requirements that
are needed.

Yeah. You know, again like you mentioned here at JSI, we can
certainly help, and we have services for that.

And we're happy to help and answer any questions.

I'm the subject matter expert here at JSI, so it comes to me.

So yeah. But yeah, do your research.

Know what's what's needed of you to be in compliance by October
and very much start thinking about it right now.

Andy Johns:
And I know that our web team would say the same thing.

If we built, if Pioneer has built your website, don't wait until
October 9th to reach out and start talking about what the plan is

so. Perfect.

Dounia Chikhoune:
Exactly.

Andy Johns:
Well, Dounia, thanks so much for sharing this with us.

I have learned quite a few things as we're getting ready here
for this October date for the the broadband labels, the other

regulatory requirements. I appreciate you sharing some of your
expertise with us.

Dounia Chikhoune:
Yes. Thank you.

Thank you for having me, and thank you to all the listeners.

Andy Johns:
Sure. She is Dounia Chikhoune.

She is the associate policy counsel with JSI.

I'm your host Andy Johns with Pioneer.

And until we talk again, keep telling your story.

Outro:
StoryConnect is produced by Pioneer Utility Resources, a
communications cooperative that is built to share your story.

StoryConnect is engineered by Lucas Smith of Lucky Sound Studio.