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You know that sinking feeling when you wake up with a hangover and think: “I’m never doing this again”? We’ve all been there. But what happens when you follow through? Sonia Kahlon and Kathleen Killen can tell you, because they did it! They went from sisters-in-law, to Sisters in Sobriety.
In this podcast, Sonia and Kathleen invite you into their world, as they navigate the ups and downs of sobriety, explore stories of personal growth and share their journey of wellness and recovery.
Get ready for some real, honest conversations about sobriety, addiction, and everything in between. Episodes will cover topics such as: reaching emotional sobriety, how to make the decision to get sober, adopting a more mindful lifestyle, socializing without alcohol, and much more.
Whether you’re sober-curious, seeking inspiration and self-care through sobriety, or embracing the alcohol-free lifestyle already… Tune in for a weekly dose of vulnerability, mutual support and much needed comic relief. Together, let’s celebrate the transformative power of sisterhood in substance recovery!
Kathleen Killen is a registered psychotherapist (qualifying) and certified coach based in Ontario, Canada. Her practice is centered on relational therapy and she specializes in couples and working with individuals who are navigating their personal relationships.
Having been through many life transitions herself, Kathleen has made it her mission to help others find the support and communication they need in their closest relationships. To find out more about Kathleen’s work, check out her website.
Sonia Kahlon is a recovery coach and former addict. She grappled with high-functioning alcohol use disorder throughout her life, before getting sober in 2016.
Over the last five years, she has appeared on successful sobriety platforms, such as the Story Exchange, the Sobriety Diaries podcast and the Sober Curator, to tell her story of empowerment and addiction recovery, discuss health and midlife sobriety, and share how she is thriving without alcohol.
Your sobriety success story starts today, with Kathleen and Sonia. Just press play!
[00:00:00] Sonia: Okay,
[00:00:03] Kathleen: Alida. We'll delve into different approaches and components of recovery support. So from one on one recovery, coaching sober companions and group support, and each of these paths offer unique advantages and can be integral to a successful recovery strategy.
[00:00:20] Kathleen: It is worth the listen. Believe me
[00:00:22] Sonia: That actually moves us really nicely into talking a little bit more about what you do. And so you did talk about like walking next to somebody. So what, can you tell us just a little bit more about sober companionship and what the importance of a sober companion can be in the recovery process?
[00:00:40] Alida: Yeah, I think sober companioning is still fairly new in, in parts of the world. my, my experience with sober companioning before I became one was like, I kind of saw sometimes like on [00:01:00] social media, on entertainment tonight, right? that, like, a famous person was coming out of rehab or that a famous person had a relapse.
[00:01:08] Alida: and that they kind of had this, like, person with them, you know, following them around. here in Toronto, we had, a public figure who very publicly had a sober companion for a period of time. I, I know the companion and and companioning was something that you, expected from sort of the rich and famous.
[00:01:27] Alida: Right? What, the benefits of companioning are, and what a sober companion does is it's somebody who is supporting the recovery through their day. So, they're essentially by the recovery side 24 7, helping them as they're bumping up against resistance or challenges in real time. Right, so. So, they're there saying, hey, let's process that or, a, it's [00:02:00] a person who's by your side for transition.
[00:02:02] Alida: Right? And so we see so many people go into treatment for however many weeks or months, and then they come home and, Look, man, sometimes they're coming home to a space that isn't safe or secure, where there are substances literally still out on the coffee table, right? I was the person who said this, right?
[00:02:21] Alida: Like I'm three months sober. It's like, yeah, Lita, you're three months sober in rehab, man. Like anyone could do that, right? like that is a safe and secure environment where you're supported 24 seven. Somebody is preparing your meals. You have a safe space to process. You have like minded people, right?
[00:02:39] Alida: and that's the rehab bubble. And then you come home and, and all of that, literally all of that support vanishes, and you now have to interface with people who are arguably, possibly hurt, who you have, wronged. Um, [00:03:00] And, and those people, may be cheering you on, but more often than not, they're like, yeah, well, last time, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, right?
[00:03:06] Alida: there's so much interpersonal stuff to navigate. There might be a job, there might be, you know, grocery shopping, and then you're in the grocery store and, and there's, there's the wine aisle or there's the liquor aisle. And, sothat's one of the occasions that people might want a companion.
[00:03:25] Alida: But it is for that transition piece, right? There might be somebody who's had a reoccurrence and, has been to treatment so many times. They're just like, I just need someone to support me and get me back on track. Right? Or, more often than not, there are extenuating circumstances, be it financial, be it, we've got a single parent.
[00:03:45] Alida: You can't actually parachute out of your life and go to treatment for it. X number of days or weeks or months. And so bringing not treatment to the person, but bringing support in, is also an option. Sonia, I don't know if I even answered your question.
[00:03:59] Sonia: [00:04:00] You did. No, you really did. Yeah, I
[00:04:05] Kathleen: How do you tailor your sober companionship to fit the needs of the individual clients? Like I'm assuming you, you have to know. Background, what exactly they need? What their what?
[00:04:17] Kathleen: their particular, challenges might be, but can you elaborate on that?
[00:04:22] Alida: It's such a good question. And it sounds, it sounds so hokey pokey, but so much of the work I do is intuitive. So I think I will answer it in three parts, right? the first part is, It depends, it depends how I come in. So, so let's say, I'm contacted by a family, right? The family can give me the briefing. Let's say I'm contacted by a treatment center. The treatment center would give me the briefing. Of the recovery, and with recovery consent, of course, um, here is the background on this individual.
[00:04:57] Alida: Here are the successes that they've had in treatment. [00:05:00] Here are some of the challenges and things that they've bumped up against. More often than not, it is actually the person of concern or the recovery who is contacting me and saying, hey, I need support. We will have a very candid, most often lengthy conversation, before I go in.
[00:05:18] Alida: We also want to make sure that. I'm the right fit, right? Like, I have a Rolodex of companions. And so, um, I am not one of those people who is going to do a hard sell for anyone. I'm moving into their home. I am, I am literally,living in their space, right? It needs to be a fit to set that person up for success.
[00:05:40] Alida: And, and if it's not the right fit, There could be someone else who's a better fit, right? I work with a lot of co occurring disorders. So I will have, often folks who are in substance use recovery and eating disorder recovery or different mental health it's more common than not. Um, and. And [00:06:00] if I'm going to be in their space, and if we're going to be together doing this thing, it's vital that, that there's a connection there. the other thing that I will say is, I am with this person for an extended period of time often. So sometimes it's. two or three days.
[00:06:18] Alida: sometimes it's a month, sometimes it's two or three weeks. And at the beginning of my engagement, I'm observing, right? I'm not going to parachute in and tell somebody, or like suggest, Hey, you might want to try this, or you might want to try that. That's, that's not going to serve anyone. So I'm kind of a fly on the wall.
[00:06:42] Alida: Supporting throughout, but also observing the impulsivity, the decision making, what is being prioritized in the day? What isn't? how are the interactions going? Where is the resistance? Especially in interpersonal relationships, right? Where are the triggers? Where are the glimmers? and it's all [00:07:00] strength based approach.
[00:07:01] Alida: So, so we're looking at where the recovery's strengths are and. We're also really focusing in on uncovering some areas where the recovery has maybe had, like, little experience or success in setting boundaries or navigating challenges
[00:07:20] Sonia: that did answer the question. So I was listening to you talk. I'm wondering, is there an intervention piece to sober companioning? Are you sometimes hired by the family and the person you're companioning isn't as much a part of that process?
[00:07:36] Alida: so I did my intervention training with Hightower and Associates. Like, I, I am trained as an interventionist,usually with an intervention, the person is going to treatment. So I've never had a personal experience where, there's an intervention and they're like, and here's your companion, and, you know, some people are like, oh, you, you make so much money.
[00:07:59] Alida: or you're [00:08:00] after the money. You're making money off of people's misery. And I would turn down that gig, if someone came to me and said, hey, we're doing an intervention. We want you to be the companion.we're going to intervene and then we're going to send this person home with you and they're going to stop using. You know, uh, my cause for pause there is nah, man, I need to meet the person of concern and make sure that this is gonna fly. Right? If it's not gonna fly,you're not setting the recovery up for success. So I don't know if that happens out in the world, but what I do know is that that gig would not be for me.
[00:08:38] Kathleen: Well, I think, you know, I have a whole other set of questions about, what it's like for you to be a sober companion, but I'll keep, I'll keep going with this thread of what do you think some misconceptions are about sober companionship? What do you think people that it is that it's not?
[00:08:58] Kathleen: Ha, [00:09:00] ha,
[00:09:00] Alida: Hmm, I love that question. let me tell you what I think people think. My husband would tell you I'm very good at this, right? Like, let me tell you what he's thinking. I know exactly. this is just my intuition, right? I don't think that a lot of people know a lot about companioning. I think that people might think that it's for the rich and famous. I think folks might think that, um, We're babysitters, we're like housekeepers and chefs and I'm going to have someone to come in and take care of me.
[00:09:34] Alida: Right? = I need to be really clear about, what my roles are when I go in for an engagement. I'm. A motivator, a cheerleader, a problem solver, a resource broker. I'm an advocate. Um, I'm an ally. I'm a coach. I'm not your housekeeper. and, we're actually navigating in real time. What transitioning into a sober life or [00:10:00] reestablishing a recovery life. Or a life and recovery looks like, I also think that some people may believe that the companion is the answer
[00:10:11] Alida: and the companion cannot do the work that the recovery needs to do. Right? when, for me, in my
[00:10:17] Alida: experience, when success, best success happens is when, the human I'm working with is really leaning into the process and the more authentic and the more vulnerable we can show up, the more gains we make.
[00:10:29] Alida: And I'm full of platitudes, right? sometimes I just roll my own, I'm like, oh, you're so embarrassing Alita, but it's not. Win or lose, it's win or learn, right? when there's resistance there, when we're bumping up against that thing, it's like, I put on my, let's get curious about that, right?
[00:10:46] Alida: Or let's unpack that. Again, I'm not a therapist. I couldn't work in those confines, but it's like, shit gets real fast, right? Like, when you go to therapy and I go see my therapist once a week, I [00:11:00] got a little list of stuff. But When there's no mustard for your sandwich and you have a meltdown in your kitchen, real example, right?
[00:11:10] Alida: that is the thing that sets you off. It's like, that's interesting because it has nothing to do with the mustard. And
[00:11:18] Kathleen: No. No.
[00:11:21] Kathleen: you you said a lot there. Oh, me too. I have too. You said a lot there, Alida, and I, I really resonate with a couple of one, The sober companion is not the magic wand. Like you are not the magic potion. The person has to lean in and also, like they have to do the work. They have to want, want to do the work.
[00:11:44] Kathleen: And it's not like you can just be the recovery. They have to
[00:11:48] Alida: I say that all the time and it sounds harsh, right? for someone who's, who's struggling, I say, if I could give you your recovery, I wouldn't, right?
[00:11:59] Alida: the 1 [00:12:00] thing that I protect fiercely, harder than probably anything, is my recovery, you know, and my dogs,
[00:12:07] Kathleen: Mm hmm.
[00:12:07] Alida: right?
[00:12:08] Alida: But like, um, Because I fought, and I'll be so bold as to use the word we, right? Like, we fought for this. We fought whatever that looks like, and so, the reason I protect it, and the reason that I'm so passionate about being where I am today, knowing where I came from, is it was, it was so hard.
[00:12:35] Alida: It was so hard.
[00:12:37] Kathleen: It was so hard, and with the and,
[00:12:41] Kathleen: and, right, and so, and, it was so hard, and you wouldn't have had the growth you had without the hard.
[00:12:49] Alida: And, and I wouldn't be so proud and so passionate and so protective. And standing in that light, if I hadn't [00:13:00] struggled and triumphed along the way.
[00:13:03] Sonia: Alita, I love some of the color you've given to sober companionship, but could you walk us through a typical day as a sober companion, or is there a typical day?
[00:13:14] Alida: So again, I'm going to bucket it and be really general. there are always exceptions. So, there would be kind of two types of days. Uh, the first type would be that the. Recovery has not yet returned to work if the recovery works. Okay. And then the, the other kind of bucket would be that the recovery has returned to work and, and, uh, you know, those, those two days look very different.
[00:13:49] Alida: Um, if I had my, I've started using old people words. If I had my druthers, right. Okay.
[00:13:55] Sonia: Druthers?
[00:13:57] Kathleen: Alita. I, I used that word yesterday. [00:14:00] I used that word yesterday with a client. I was like, if I had my druthers,
[00:14:06] Alida: did we turn 80?
[00:14:08] Kathleen: nine, my 91 year old dad says that
[00:14:13] Alida: right? Like, okay,
[00:14:15] Sonia: so funny.
[00:14:16] Sonia: No, I thought it was an American thing. So like when I moved to the U S from Canada and I moved to like the Midwest, people would say druthers. And I was like, that is such an American thing. And I didn't realize you're just an old people thing. Old
[00:14:31] Sonia: druthers.
[00:14:32] Kathleen: We love you. If you say druthers, we say druthers too. Okay. Continue. If you had your
[00:14:40] Alida: druthers,
[00:14:41] Alida: right? Um, every situation is different and, and every situation is, uh, is tailored to the specific client. And, and I don't usually like saying client. I, I, I really do try to use recovery. I think it's a much more empowering phrase. So. [00:15:00] If I had my druthers, I would like to have a week at minimum with said recovery in their space to acclimatize before there is any real shift of return to normal.
[00:15:17] Alida: Sometimes that isn't possible, right? So if, and there's so many F's and so many like column a column B, if. The recovery is transitioning from an inpatient treatment facility back home. That 1 week is vital. Right? And and when we look at. An investment from a financial standpoint, right? this person, or this family has.
[00:15:44] Kathleen: Mm
[00:15:45] Alida: Allocated financially.
[00:15:48] Kathleen: What?
[00:15:49] Alida: uh,
[00:15:50] Kathleen: hmm.
[00:15:51] Alida: significant. Um, Some to this person's inpatient treatment program. [00:16:00] Right. It would, okay, get ready for it. This one ups druthers. It would behoove, it would behoove you to, to also invest in the transition. Right. This is, this is where we fall down. We suck. We, as a, as a collective group.
[00:16:22] Alida: People suck at the transition, right? That's where the resistance is going to be. That's where the triggers are going to be that acclimatizing, right? It's sort of like buying trip insurance. On a trip that you just spent 30, 000 on, right? Spend the extra percentage to ensure that if anything happens on that trip, you're good.
[00:16:49] Alida: and so, a typical day when we're at home, right?and not going to work, I will say that in. What 2 minutes or [00:17:00] less, I'm dragging on here. So my druthers are that we have this week together. Right? What what we are trying to do, is is to establish a new recovery routine. Slash lifestyle in that home environment, right?
[00:17:16] Alida: And so. I think I spoke earlier in the interview about. I had built my life around. The use of substance in, in, almost every facet of my life. Right? And, and that is often a common theme.so, you know, how do we make breakfast in the morning without using a line of Coke? How do we, get up without, Taking 2, 3, 10 swigs, from the bottle of vodka that's on our bedside table, right?
[00:17:49] Alida: that is how we have hardwired our life. And now we're back in a space, often the same environment that we have been using in for an extended period of time, [00:18:00] every room, every activity, every behavior. In the past may have involved using and so rewiring that. So it is literally so I will either sleep in the same room as the recovery, or I will have a room or a couch or an inflatable mattress.
[00:18:19] Alida: Right? I'm getting into the nitty gritty and, and if possible, I try to get up before the recovery. Right? More often than not the recovery. is having a hard time getting up in the morning, right? this is where the rubber hits the road, folks. this is the real deal, right?
[00:18:36] Alida: you've been to treatment and now you're home. It's like, how do we apply all of the shit we learned in treatment to our real life? And, I always say education does not equal transformation, folks. Right? Like treatment centers would be out of business. Like I could read a book on how to get sober and then I'm sober.
[00:18:58] Alida: Nah, it doesn't work like [00:19:00] that. Right? So it's education, it's execution, and then it's encouragement. Right? And we know some stuff. Just because we know some stuff doesn't mean we're going to do the stuff. So, we move through the day, right? And, and we're building a life or a day together, right?
[00:19:22] Alida: It could be as simple as you work from home. Let's set you up for success in your day, right? We wake up. Do, do you want to make your bed? Right? I'm not a military person, but sometimes making your bed is something to be like, I did one thing this morning. I made my bed. I walk
[00:19:42] Alida: into my room.
[00:19:43] Alida: There's visual order, arguably. usually we need to fuel or nourish ourselves to start off the day. Are we going to get a workout in? Are we going to do some prayer and meditation and journaling? What does that look like? Right? And, and those are the things that we [00:20:00] discuss as a team, me and the recovery to, establish, and then we start doing that every single day.
[00:20:10] Kathleen: Mm hmm.
[00:20:11] Sonia: hmm. Alita, could you share some of your more touching success stories or ones that have really stayed with you
[00:20:21] Alida: I, I think the most, when I did my certification way back when, right. Um, our, our trainers said something that has stuck with me for forever. And. Keith, Keith said this, he said, we don't take credit for our client's successes because if we take credit for their successes, we also have to take on their failures and their setbacks.
[00:20:55] Kathleen: Mm. Mm.
[00:20:57] Alida: if we're being real [00:21:00] candid, um, sometimes those failures and those setbacks can be catastrophic, right? So, This work isn't for the faint of heart. Um, I, I do this work because my soul is called to do it. And for me, the successes, they're not the big wins. They're not the folks who are celebrating, one year of continuous sobriety.
[00:21:25] Alida: They're not the folks who, reunited with their family and are now invited to, birthday dinners. they are the small they are the, the transformational moments that I get to bear witness to. They, they are, accompanying someone to their cottage on a May long weekend and like having a rip roaring time playing Scrabble with their teenage kid. [00:22:00] seeing the joy and the laughter of a sober parent. Parenting, you know, saying, I need you home by 10 p. m., Watching someone set boundaries with their family. That they've never done before, and not feeling bad that they've done it. that rocks my world, man. those are the things that are setting a recovery up to be resilient, Sonja. Right? Watching the resilience happen, man, that lights my fire. Right? I'm actually like, and I'm trying to play cool, you know, but like inside I am like, you fucking go.
[00:22:52] Alida: Yes. You know, it, it, it is just, it, it is, it is the best high for me [00:23:00] to watch that shit go down.
[00:23:04] Sonia: My God, that makes me so emotional. No, I totally agree. It's the small things. It's not the like,
[00:23:09] Kathleen: Yeah.
[00:23:10] Sonia: things. But it's the like, I'm gonna try to stay sober this week. And when somebody does it, you're like, Oh my God. Yeah.
[00:23:18] Alida: Kathleen. I I was going to say like,
[00:23:20] Alida: you know, as a therapist, right? Like I'm it's. I, I'm not in, in your shoes, but I can imagine like, right, watching those, those little things, those
[00:23:34] Alida: micro changes, because all of them add up.
[00:23:38] Kathleen: Oh, they do. They do. One of my favorite things is when I'm working with clients is reflecting back to them the micro changes that I've witnessed and sometimes when they're in it, they don't see them all right as a whole and When I can reflect back, and then you did this, and then you did this, [00:24:00] and then you learned from this, and then you learned from this, and I'm able to paint a picture of the journey of change is just so profound because it is, it's those small changes that are so, are so inspirational and also really demonstrate growth and healing.
[00:24:20] Kathleen: It's the small things, like you just said, it's that sober parent parenting. It's not a matter of like, woohoo, I got my, you know, one year. It's like, no, this parent went and played Scrabble and was like present with his kids or her kids or their kids. I think that's a great example. Alita, I just want to say thank you so much for joining us today.
[00:24:41] Kathleen: Now we really did a deep dive on, on sober companionship. Well, I won't even say a deep dive. I think there's so many more questions I could have asked. We could have asked. We definitely want to have you back on if you are.
[00:24:52] Alida: Game on.
[00:24:54] Kathleen: Okay. Amazing. Amazing. Well, thank you so much for sharing your insights with [00:25:00] us.
[00:25:00] Kathleen: And thank you all for listening to Sisters in Sobriety and we will see you next week