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On Cornerstone Conversations, we explore the unique dynamic of fathers and sons who work together, whether they built something from scratch or carried something forward.
Our mission is to create a space for intentional conversation and storytelling around family business transitions and legacy by enabling more dads to see working with their kids as a discipleship opportunity and more sons to see working with dad as an honor, not a handout.
Learn more about Cornerstone Coaching at www.cornerstoneco.com
Kile Graves: [00:00:00] Welcome to Cornerstone Conversations, where we discuss timely topics impacting communities, cultures, and economies. First topic we're gonna dive into in this series is family business. Currently, there are 32 million family businesses in the US, generating over half of our GDP as a country. They also employ 83 million people.
What's interesting is only 30% of family businesses make it to the second generation, and only 12% make it to the third. You've probably heard of the great wealth transfer that is taking place across the globe in the next five to seven years. 40% of all the small businesses in the US are owned by a baby boomer who is reaching retirement age pretty soon.
As coaches, we're really interested in what those impacts do to communities and cultures at large. We've had the privilege of walking alongside a lot of family business leaders over the past few years, and we believe this major intersection is something that can really, uh, impact communities well. We're gonna talk to six, uh, dads and sons that are working together and are trying to navigate what it means as a [00:01:00] son to carry forward what their dad started, and as dads trying to let go of something that they've held onto for so long.
Blake and Dwight Power, uh, thank you guys for doing this. Um, you guys help brands sell into Walmart and Sam's Club. Mm-hmm. Um, been doing it a long time and have helped a lot of people do it well. Wanna get into your background, kind of how you started it, Dwight, uh, what it was like in the early days, and then Blake, how you, how you got involved.
Um, but before we start, and I, I kind of start every conversation like this, there's two, there's two broad categories of family business that we work with, uh, and have talked to kind of in this series. There's legacy businesses, so this is, "Hey, my dad or my grandfather started this company, and it's passed down generation after generation."
Or, uh, there's a joint family venture, which is if you two went and started a restaurant or something new together and you said, "Hey, let's go start something from scratch." Those are kind of the two [00:02:00] categories. You guys are in the legacy business category, which is really cool because, uh, you're passing on a lot of things that you started, a lot of insights, a lot of knowledge.
Um, you get to step into that and learn from your dad, and also put your unique fingerprints on something he started. Um, and there's just a lot of compelling layers within that. So, um, Dwight, maybe just give us your story, kind of how you got into this industry, what it's been like. So-
Dwight Power: You know, when I was a kid, I spent a lot of time with, you know, my grandfather and my dad watching to see what their general direction in life was gonna be.
My grandfather, um, you know, worked for Sears and was a buyer at Sears and, uh, eventually a vice president in Sears. Um, and so I, I saw him doing that. And my dad here had a local business here and, um, you know, it, it was a big business and I mean, he, he grew it a lot. [00:03:00] But what was interesting was is that I had a very pivotal pos- time in my life when I was coming out of college because he really wanted me to get into the business, and I had zero interest.
I did not want that life. Mm. And, you know, so I made a decision to do my own thing, and I followed my path, which was much more oriented towards what my grandfather did. And so I started, uh, two years into college, I started at Kmart, which, you know, was down where now the Hobby Lobby in Fayetteville, Arkansas was, and, uh, I worked there for two years.
And probably the best training and understanding merchandising came from a, a manager there who put time into me to teach me how to, um, understand merchandising and what makes the consumer come get attracted to something on an end cap or at a, you know, even as a, a clip strip. I mean, just little things that make a difference in sales.
And [00:04:00] so I went from there, and I joined Sam's Club in '87 and was at Sam's Club for about five and a half years. And I started off there, believe it or not, finishing up my last year of college was in the cash office. So I was the money guy. And that was... And what was funny was is I was like, "I didn't see that on my resume."
But somehow they said, "I guess he can count, maybe we'll put him in there." We'll put him back there. And, um, so then I went from there. I, I, I took another step. I went in buyer training program and then became what they've, uh, launched me as was a regional buyer. I stayed with, uh, Sam's Club, and we moved to Atlanta, was there for about 18 months, and then I moved to a little company, was a mass merchant up in St.
Louis, and that company is called Grandpa's. And they were-- Grandpa's was about 140 to $160 million company, was not a big one, but there were five Walmart guys that went up there. And so I just went along with the group and- Mm-hmm ... and, um, you know, I got very broadened in my, you know, [00:05:00] understanding because I had been, you know...
With all the things I had done so far, club business is very different than retail. So when I was up there, again, I was-- I went from Kmart, then I went to Sam's Club, and then eventually I ended up at Grandpa's, which was a mass market retail. So in, basically in 1993, um, a friend of mine, and became my partner, w- came to me and said, "Hey, I would really like for you to come down, 'cause you have something that was very unique in the business, which was you worked at a competitor, you worked for Walmart, you know, and then you worked for another competitor.
So you have all the strategic things to, uh, knowledge, and basically what I wanna do is open up a brokerage." And so we did. So in the fall of '93 we came here. Now, Walmart at that time only had, which is really amazing, there were 78 Supercenters and four Hypermarts. Whoa. So they had two perishable DCs, and they were both...
One of them was a complete disaster, and I spent a lot of time [00:06:00] helping, going into those- Wow ... things to help them get that done. Now you see where they're at today. It's, it's been a massive story. But, um, you know, I started off as basically a one-man band, but my success came because I was always the... I always thought of myself as a, an accounting procedure, which was I was gonna be the first one in and the last one out.
And, you know, they, they, you know, it, it's, it's something that I made sure of that no one was gonna beat me. And I think a lot of my success for Walmart was, and I always answered the phone. You know, if you ask the kids, man, it didn't matter where I was. Yeah. I- it didn't matter if I was in Europe on a cruise, I answered the phone.
And, you know, so you do those things, and that's where I built a lot of the equity into the company that's now been here for 33 years. So the journey has been that, you know, I managed my first, I would say my first year I probably [00:07:00] managed about maybe $2 million in business, and today we're, you know, between 800 and a billion dollars, 800 million and a billion dollars in retail managed sales.
So- Mm ... um, you know, that's a, that's, I'm proud of that. But I also know that I did it, uh, my journey was to not be the biggest guy on the block. I just wanted to be the best, and so I've had that. And so I, you know, I didn't, I didn't wanna chase down the big consulting groups like, you know, the ones that are here now.
And today I'm, you know, now I'm in the process of taking, uh, taking my reins and passing them to, uh, to Blake.
Kile Graves: Was the, was the brokerage industry, was it s- as large in the early days in '93? Were there a handful- Oh, no.
Dwight Power: In fact, Sam Walton was hugely anti-broker. So- Right ... you know, that, that was, um, that was a real...
That, that hurdle lasted for about four to five years, and really about 1999 I [00:08:00] was started to see that loosen up where they were more accepting. You know, they, uh, I only got thrown out of one meeting. You know, so, you know, they said, "Uh, we don't deal with brokers." And so I got up and left the meeting. Mm. Um, you know, but what's odd about that is, is that today is a completely different day about that.
Oh, yeah. Yeah, 'cause they, they need us. They need- Probably,
Steve Graves: you know, probably though, Dwight, because of your work ethic and your style and character, probably sitting across the table from some of the same friends at Walmart, they knew you as a guy who worked hard, did it right. I mean, all those same things, and so even though you were across on the other side of the table, they still knew you as the same person.
So you probably had, you probably had a lot of people have, give you at least some early respect, you know, to, to be able to kinda get some momentum in your business and stuff like that- Yeah ... it would seem like, you know.
Dwight Power: Yeah. The... And what's interesting is, is that a lot of those guys that I worked with, that I sat across from desks on when I was there in the corporate office, you know, later became [00:09:00] VPs.
Mm. So, you know, those guys did know who I was. And, you know, in this business, if you, you look at what we do, the, there's not been very many that have made it much more than 20 years- Right ... let alone than 30. Yeah. And as of now, I don't know how to quantify this, but I don't know of any other company. You know, Acosta has been there for- Right
you know, as long as I've been there. But as, when you look at small independent brokers like what we do, and consultants, we're probably the longest one banner- Yeah ... you know, that's out there today.
Steve Graves: So did you, or when you first launched, did you launch in the same category that you were on the buyer side of it?
Or did you pick a, a hot topic or hot category that you said, "Boy, this is gonna be a real potential opportunity"? Like, how, like, where'd you go with all the different SKUs and categories? How'd you, how... Or did you just pick whatever was available, and you just kinda repped hard and here we go?
Dwight Power: No, I knew exactly where [00:10:00] my strengths were.
Okay. Because, you know, all, all my career had been somewhat in food- Okay ... you know, and/or health and beauty aid. Okay. So what those two things, for me, I, that's the only areas that I really wanted to concentrate on. Because those are consumables that are needed every day, you know? So lawn and garden and, and things like that are, are really tough categories to get into because, you know, you can have a great winter where you can be warm- And so, you know, you, you're never right.
You don't have a way of throwing the, uh, the bullseye out to hit it perfect. That's right. So I always knew that in food we're always gonna eat. Hmm. And with health and beauty aids we're always gonna have something. So I knew that I would focus in that. Yeah. And that's what I would say probably 65% of our business is centered around today.
Yeah. I bought shampoo yesterday. There you go. There it is.
Kile Graves: There you go. And I ate today. Wow. Yeah. You're, you're helping. Uh, how many people... How big is the team, and how long did it [00:11:00] take? Was growth slow and steady, or was there kind of a five-year stretch where it accelerated pretty quick?
Dwight Power: Well, one of the things that I would tell you, and I've thought a lot about this in coming to have this conversation, is, is that, you know, I saw how Sam Walton, and I've seen how, how leaders of industries, they drive so hard that sometimes they forget what's important.
And to me, what was actually important was is that I wanted to be at every event my kids went to and did, whether it was a spelling bee or if it was a baseball game or if it was, you know, watching a dance recital. It... I wanted to be there. So my goal kind of was predetermined that I wanted to have my cake and eat it too.
So over the course of the 33 years, um, I have the highest amount of staff I have today. But, you know, I've grown very slowly and very organically. It's not been... I, I don't hardly advertise anymore because my name's out there. [00:12:00] Um, you know, I have found that the internet has been a fantastic vehicle to be able to get information out about us.
Oh, yeah. Um, and so that has really worked well. So and that's what Blake and, and his generation, you know, they're used to their phones. They're used to these things on their computers, and, and they're searching, and for that vehicle is their information highway. Right. Where us who, who, you know, were still rotary dial as kids, you know, we didn't have those things.
So, um, what's important for me was is that I had a balance, and 'cause I didn't see the balance with so many people who drove in this business, and I wanted to be able to be at that. I mean, I helped coach his baseball, you know, for all those years. I didn't hardly miss, you know. And it was funny because even when we get into some of these other questions, you're gonna say, you know, he, he is with me 40 hours a week.
And so now, you know, it's, it's a continual gift for me. It may not be for [00:13:00] him. You know, it may not be... It, it may have not been when I was 40 hours a week watching him play baseball on the weekends either. Yeah. Right. So, um, you know, but that's the relationship that I wanted to have with both of my kids is, is to, to be there.
And, um, you know, I'm, I'm... So I, yeah. Have I been had opportunities to have companies chase me and wanna to purchase me? Yes. And I've turned every one of them down. But, you know, you don't know that question until he jumps in and says, yeah, I'm willing to take this and let's move forward with that.
Kile Graves: Hey guys, I want to take a second and tell you a little bit more about the business you're learning in this episode.
Dwight and Blake Power are our guests today, and they're the owners of Ozark Consulting and Marketing, where Dwight is the founder and CEO. They've been focused exclusively on Walmart and Sam's Club since 1993. It's all they do. If you've ever tried to navigate the Walmart supplier world on your own, you know how complex it can get.
Their team exists to solve exactly those problems. So if you're [00:14:00] interested in learning more about what they do, you can reach out to me directly or click on the link in the description below. I mean, that's kind of a good transition here for Blake. How long have you been working with your dad and what were you doing before?
Did you come straight into this out of college?
Blake Power: No, no, I didn't. So I went to U of A, did a double major in finance and small business management. And so my primary focus was on the finance side of things. And so I worked at a bank throughout college and went kind of the banking route. And so out of college, went into wealth management, started working on the trust side of things, and pretty quickly realized that this, like the finance side of stuff was not where I wanted to be.
And so that was right around when COVID was happening. And so there's a lot of changes back in 2020, in the beginning of 21. And so about middle of 2020, [00:15:00] I was actively looking for something else for kind of a change. And so he and a couple of his buddies, they approached me and they were like, hey, we've got this medical sales company that they're starting up and we'll start up.
They had these antibody tests that were COVID antibody tests. And they're like all the doctors and everybody, they're all looking for it. So kind of started a company and I helped pretty much run the thing and got a lot of really good exposure, selling, building websites, doing CRM, all that kind of stuff.
And so him and his buddies, they were just kind of the faces of the company. And I helped, I got the experience of being able to kind of run the business and be a lot of the backend stuff. And so, I mean, I was packaging up all the supplies and sending them out and all that. Was this on the side or was this like full time?
Yeah, this was full time. Yeah. So I left the bank and started this, was doing [00:16:00] this full time. And kind of the very beginning of 2021, things were kind of dying down, more people were looking for other things. And so we got out and before we ended things, he called me and was like, he's like, hey, there's an opportunity for you to come work for me.
You don't have to. He's like, "It's your decision, but got a position if you want it." And he was never putting pressure on me or anything, and I was like, "You know what? I think, I think now is a good, would be a good time for me to transition into that." Um, but- Had you
Kile Graves: thought about it before or- And, and/or
Steve Graves: talked about it.
Had y'all ever- Yeah ... had a conversation about that? So, so what was
Blake Power: really interesting is, and, and something I'm very thankful for, was he never pressured me, at like ever, to come into the business. Like, I mean, we talk- we had talked about it, but he had, um... There was never any plans, you know. Um, I think in the back of our minds, like, you know, maybe he wanted me to, and then, [00:17:00] you know, I always kinda wanted to, but, you know, we never really verbalized that.
But he was very like, "Hey, go, go do your own journey, you know. Explore yourself. Go have, you know, go have fun. Figure out how to live life. Um, you know, do things on your own." And he was, he pretty much was always there for me whenever I, I wanted to, to come join the business. And so, um, something I'm very thankful for, that he, he was never like pushing, like, "Hey," like- Yeah
"This is, this is what I want you to do." You know, it, it was, it was definitely my decision to come in. That's cool. Um, which I'm really thankful for. And so it started in the beginning of 2021. Um, and, uh, you know, early on he, he was like, "Hey," like, "you are the owner's son, and you're gonna have to, you're gonna have to earn it.
You know, you're gonna have to make your, make your keep and, um, you know, earn the respect of everybody here." And so, you know, he was like, "You're gonna start out at the very bottom, and you gotta work your way up." Okay. So, [00:18:00] um, you know, started me out at a $38,000 salary and, um, and said, "All right, you gotta figure it out."
And, and so, um, here we are today and, uh- And I paid you that much money? Yeah. You, you didn't
Steve Graves: realize you were overpaying him? Yeah,
Blake Power: I know. Yeah. I know, but as a, uh, as a 25-year-old- Oh ... coming in, it was like- You were wealthy, man. You was... I was-
Steve Graves: You had money everywhere ... it was good. It was good. So Blake, did you, uh, as a, as, in your 25-year-old state- Um, what kind of knowledge and awareness did you have of your dad's business?
Zero would be barely knew anything, 10 would be I know as much as he knows. Mm-hmm. Where, where would you be in your knowledge and awareness- Yeah ... if somebody said, "Hey, man, tell me what your dad's business is." Mm-hmm. You'd kick in at, at, at what?
Blake Power: Yeah, I'd say probably about a six. Um- Okay, so pretty aware. So I was pretty aware.
Um, I mean, he started the business before I was born, and so, you know, that's all I've [00:19:00] known. Um, since I was a kid and, and until now it's, um, it's been OCM. That's, that's been the, you know, his life and, and our family's life, and he supported us through that. And he, he did a really good job of teaching me and kind of explaining to me a- anytime I had questions about kind of what he did.
And, um, you know, he traveled a lot, you know, going and visiting clients and going to shows and stuff like that, and I was always curious. Like, "Hey, what, you know, why are you going?" Like, "Why are you leaving? You know, what's, what's going on?" And he always did a good job of explaining kind of the imp- importance of that and why, um, you know, why he was going.
And so I had a pretty good understanding of the business. Um, but the thing with, with Walmart, um, we, we tell every employee that comes in, is it's a very steep learning curve. And that's, that's where, you know, the, some of the value for our company comes in, is that it... Walmart and Sam's Club, they're beasts.
I mean, they're very, very complicated. Um, and, and so... But that's where a lot of the [00:20:00] value for our business comes in, is the knowledge of the industry, the knowledge of Walmart and Sam's. And, um, and so I had a, uh, I had a general understanding, but I didn't, uh, you know, nowhere close to- Sure ... to his knowledge.
But I, I knew enough to be able to explain to somebody, you know, at, at 25, like, "Hey, this is what this is what my dad does and this is what the business is."
Kile Graves: Yeah. That's good. Uh, Dwight, when Blake joined, were you hoping for anything specifically? Were you, you know, were you kind of in the back of your head like, "I think he could probably take this over one day"?
Or was it just kind of like, "Here's an open role. We'll see how it goes. Don't really know where this is gonna lead"? Or do you remember? The,
Dwight Power: the har- the hardest thing that I would tell you this, is that I remember how I was with my dad. I was emphatic that that is not what I want to do, that that is not the path I'm chasing.
And, but
Steve Graves: I should- hang on. What, I, I meant to ask you this earlier. Was it because of the [00:21:00] sector? Was it because of the, the sector product service area? Yes. That, that, you just didn't want that?
Dwight Power: I- Okay ... I, I really did not want to have anything to do with customer facing. Got it. Because you'll never win. Got it.
You know, those poor people at stores never win 'cause somebody's mad about something. Yeah. And I just had enough of that where I was like, "I'm not... You know, I, I can't, I can't say what I wanna say." And, you know, the, to me, I knew that, and my dad was fully in that, and I was not gonna do that. So I knew that path was not my path.
But I remember, you know, I was very certain, and I was very quickly when he was like, "I want you to go through, I want you to go through the training of this. I really want you to, to eventually own the business." And I said, "This isn't what I wanna do." And it wasn't that I wanted to go be a ski bum or I wanted to go learn how, you know, teach fly fishing.
It was more along the lines of that that wasn't my path. I [00:22:00] just wanted to, to be my person, independent. So all my life I've kind of treated Blake and Taylor the same way, as saying, "Whatever the path is you want to take, I'll be there on the journey with you or I'll be, you know, I'll watch from afar."
Depends on the journey that he wanted to take. I didn't wanna force the journey, and I think that's where I won in all of this was, is I never forced the journey and said, "Hey, I want you to..." He didn't work for me in the summers. I mean, I made him go to Legacy, you know, and be a teller for a summer, learn about money.
Yeah. Well, you know, that, that was like watching paint dry to him. He'd come home and just moan and groan- ... how bad this was. But I mean- At the time, at the time ... at the time. But
Blake Power: it's, I look back and that was priceless. Yeah.
Dwight Power: You know? 'Cause, 'cause you got to read for, you know, you got to stay on your phone for 35 minutes- Yeah
you know, every hour or so. But no, the, the... I knew at that point that my journey, I didn't want him to m- I, I didn't want him to [00:23:00] have my journey. Wanted it to be his.
Steve Graves: Yeah.
Dwight Power: And you have... There, there's one of the most important things, and I think you all have done a very good job throughout this, is, is talking about how do you know?
And how do you know when is the journey, and how, what are the, what are those keys that come into play during this journey? 'Cause this is, this is tough stuff for, for, you know, a dad and a son. You know, 'cause he's, you know, I'm... It's, it's a long journey. You know? It's a, it's a lifetime journey no matter what you do.
So I had to decide how to do it, and I said, "I'm gonna be patient," and I wasn't gonna push him. And, um, you know, there, that's what paid off to get us to where we're at here today. Because I don't think I ever made him feel like he had to do it. I wanted him to want to do it. And now the want and the drive is what I see is the same similarity I had when I was th- almost 30 years old.[00:24:00]
Wow.
Kile Graves: That's cool. That's great. Um, so get into who's doing what. How did you... How are you dividing up roles? I mean, you started at the bottom, and what are you doing now? What's your role look like? Yeah. And how has that evolved, Dwight, for what you were doing? Unpack, unpack that.
Blake Power: Yeah. Um, yeah, I'll, I'll go.
It's, uh... My role now, so my title is I'm, I'm vice president of opera- operations and marketing. Um, and, you know, as you guys know, in a small business, you, a lot of times you have to wear multiple hats. Um, but my journey started, I was an analyst in the very beginning, um, just learning the backend side of things, numbers, how to, you know, how to do Excel formulas, how to, you know, analyze data sheets and sales and, um, you know, analyze trends, all that kind of stuff.
And that, that helped lay a really good foundation for me, um, and understanding. So then from that role, I, I started managing some accounts, and I [00:25:00] was a, I became an account manager, and so started working with several different clients and suppliers throughout, um, and so I did that for several years. Um-
Kile Graves: So that's the core, that's the core job- That is the-
in this industry ...
Blake Power: yeah, that, that really is the, the core job for, um, you know, for a broker consulting company, um, is, is the account manager. I mean, that's... They're, they're the ones working with the suppliers and working with Walmart directly and, um, and, and having that connection there. But, so I did that for several years, um, and, you know, I, I, I never really wanted to rush into leadership, um, because I, I wanted to have a, a, a good enough foundation and knowledge base where, um, you know, I could go into, you know, conversations with any of our other employees and have some answers to 'em, you know, to, to some of their questions.
And, um, so I was an account manager for a couple years and then, um, I moved [00:26:00] into our director of operations role, so kind of more in the backend side of things, you know, doing some HR, doing some accounting, doing some of that, uh, you know, all that kind of stuff. And, um, kind of on a base level, uh, but really starting to get inter- intertwined into the actual business side of things.
Um, and, but while still doing that, I was also still managing clients, and I still manage clients today. Um, and so it's like I, I really kind of have three to four different roles that I'm- Yeah ... working in right now. So I do all of our accounting, so accounts receivables, payables. Do all of our operations, so HR, internal Still account manager, so do that.
And then I'm also a head of our marketing department. So, um, so a lot of different roles and have to use the different sides of the brain for different, different parts. But, um, and so, but now I'm, I mean, I, I work a lot on the day-to-day side of the business. Um, and, and so, [00:27:00] um, the goal, you know, was taking some of the responsibilities from him to where he doesn't have to do a lot of the, the day-to-day responsibilities, you know, working in the weeds and, you know, paying different bills and doing all that kind of stuff.
Like he, he didn't need to be doing that. Um, but that's what he was doing for the last 30 years. Um, and I remember about three years ago, we started having a conversation where I was like... I told him, I said, "One of my goals is to take some of this burden away from you, so that way, you know, you can focus on doing what you do best and running the company, being the CEO, going out and selling."
Um, 'cause you guys know, I mean, nobody is a better salesman than the founder of a company. Um, and so he loves it. He loves talking to clients. I mean, he could talk to a brick wall all day long, and the brick wall would start selling him something, you know? But, um, so that was ultimately one of my, my goals with [00:28:00] him is, and so we started these conversations years ago, um, of like, what does that look like?
How do, how do I start taking some of those responsibilities away from you so that way you can focus on what, what you, you know, what you love and what you do best? And you initiated that? Yeah. Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Dwight Power: Again, I didn't want him, I didn't want him to be told to do it. Yeah. I wanted him to do
Blake Power: it. But he, he would ask me, it, it felt like almost every quarter, he was like, "What do you want to do?"
You know, "Do you want to just be a sales guy? Do you want to, you know, be an account manager?" That's fine. That's good. "Just be in sales?" And he was like, "If you want to do that, that's fine. And, and for the rest of your career, that's totally fine." And, um, so he would ask, he's like, "What, what do you want to do?"
And I would... You know, my answer to him repeatedly was, you know, "I want to help run this business, and I want to help, um, you know, help you out so that way, um, you know, we can make the transition seamless where, um, to where I can help really take the reins on, on a lot of [00:29:00] stuff for the business." And, um, but he was very clear with me.
He was like, "You don't have to do anything. I'm not telling you the direction I want you to go or need you to go or any of those kind of things." He's like, "This decision's yours." Um, so yeah.
Steve Graves: So Blake, did you guys ever have, um... Well, not both of you, but you, did you ever have any, uh, seasons, short seasons where you were saying, "Wow, um, this is not really what I want to do," either, either the c- this, either this, the cate- you know, the area, the vertical, the space you're in- Or the season that the business cycle was in itself, or like, n- not necessarily any kind of big, deep remorse, but like did you ever have any shiny thing come across where two buddies from college said, "Hey, man, we're gonna start this new business.
You need to come be our third partner," and, you know, I mean, kinda do something else? Or was it just kinda like, "No, man, I've found my place." I mean, I've kinda... I mean, not that, not that you never had a tough Friday. Right. I'm [00:30:00] not saying that, but I'm talking about, like, just the fit, like the sense of saying- Mm-hmm
I think I'm home. Yeah. I think, I think I'm here.
Blake Power: Yeah. I found that pretty early on- Okay ... in, in the business when I started with him. Um, when I first started I didn't, you know, I didn't know. Um, again, I was, you know, 25 and, you know, very young in my career. And, you know, at that point you, you don't really know what you want, you know.
Um, except, you know, you start... You want... You have the idea of like, oh, you wanna chase money and, you know, um, having a wife and trying to support her and, you know, some of those kind of things. But, you know, I never really had, um, a ton of, like, opportunities or people that, that came pursuing me. Um, so the decisions from that standpoint were...
It was pretty easy for me. Yeah. But in the business, I mean, it was, it was probably about year two I was like, "Okay, this is where, this is where I wanna be." Now, when I was in college, I really, like, pretty early on, I would say [00:31:00] probably my sophomore year, um, I had it stuck in my brain that I wanted to run a business someday.
Um, and so that's where the small business management major- Oh, okay ... came from. Okay. I was like, "I wanna pursue that," 'cause they had entrepreneurial classes, they had business management classes, all of that kind of stuff. Um, and so I wanted to kind of pursue that, um, as well. Um, the finance side was kind of a safety net for me, 'cause it was, it was easy.
That was the just kind of natural transition, but in the back of my mind I always knew that I wanted to run a business. Um, and, you know, I'm thankful every day that, for the opportunity to, you know, to work with him, that he provided me a platform to, you know, pursue that and, you know, pursue those dreams of someday, you know, running a company.
And, um, and so, so yeah.
Kile Graves: Was it hard letting go of some of those operational business owner type of tasks? It,
Steve Graves: it did take him a long time to shake them,
Dwight Power: yeah. I can tell you that. [00:32:00] You're ready to go. No, I think, you know, the... It's all about timing, you know? And, and knowing when it's right. And I... You know, the one thing that is the, maybe the most difficult thing for, you know, our kids is, is patience, you know?
And understanding that you gotta go around... I, I call it you got to go around the sun. You gotta go around the sun again, and then again, and then- That's a great statement ... what happens is, is that, you know, once you start going around the sun, you start getting comfortable- where you're at. And even after the third year, I was still asking him, and he said that.
You know, "Is this what you want to do?" Yeah. You know, because the thing about it is, is that again, I didn't w- I want him to want it. I don't want me to want it for him. Right. That's great. And, you know, I, I, I just, I, I knew that for him it would be best if he made that decision. So to answer your question directly, has it been hard to let go?
No, because, you know, when [00:33:00] you put the right people in place, it's actually quite a bit easier to let it go than it is as if you're, you're not sure. Right. And for where we're at today, you know, it's been the easiest transition. Now, I mean, I still have, um... You know, I'm 62, but I'm, I'm still 12 right here. So the...
I have this energy that is just endless. Yeah. And so do I have this huge desire to retire? You know, I get this asked, now you crawl into your 60s, everybody's like, "Are you gonna retire?" And, you know, I'm like, "You know what? I don't know what I would do. I need something to do." And I love what I do. You know, for, so for 33 years I can say, "I love what I do."
Kile Graves: Sound like this guy. So
Dwight Power: guess what? I'm gonna be around. But I also would say, you know, the, the things on operationally that Blake has, the things that are part of our sales team, and the VP that I have of sales, they have made my life so much better that I can [00:34:00] focus on what I really do well. So I'm doing that now.
So have I completely let go of the reins? No. But I would say that, you know, just days around the sun, you know, is what is really
Steve Graves: important here.
Dwight Power: Yeah. Dude,
Steve Graves: I love that statement. That is, that's some real rich, deep stuff. Real quick question for someone, uh, with a different situation than yours. Um, you guys are in a really pretty good setup because the way you trained and raised him as a son allowed him to not be too energetic and too eager.
I mean, like, when you said, "We gotta make a few laps around the sun," he wasn't over there banging his head on the table and, you know, whatever. What, what would you say to a, to a father who has a son who's a little more, like, always pressing, always pressing, you know? And not, you know, not because they're entitled or arrogant, but like, just they're just always pressing the envelope [00:35:00] on timing and speed, and you're an, a big, among your biggest jobs is just to slow them down.
What, what would you... How would you... What would you say to a dad
Kile Graves: like that? Let me put a second coat of paint- Yeah ... before I answer that. Yeah. Yes. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's, well, it's the same question, but, uh, among the many, you mentioned this earlier, Dwight, it's, this is a long journey. If you're gonna work with your son or your dad and transition the business, it's a long journey.
Among the many tensions that pop up- For the son, one of the core tensions that you have to wrestle with is ambition versus humility. So y- what you were getting at is if you're s- if you're a son stepping in, you're like, "I've got my own unique skillsets, my vision, my ambition, and I need to apply that," but you also have to wrestle some element of humility and, "My dad's still here, it's still his business.
I'm not fully in charge yet." But both of those have to show up, and if you're only humble with no ambition, then you're a passive leader and you're not gonna be able to lead well. But if you're only ambition with no humility, then you [00:36:00] guys are gonna be butting heads. So same question, but just layer that on top of it.
Has that showed up?
Dwight Power: So I'm gonna let Blake answer the second part of your question. I'm gonna answer yours. Okay. So, you know, one of the things that is really important in, in... if you're gonna develop your son, is to make sure he knows all aspects of the business. So if I've given off... What I've done with Blake is, is that I started him in the most simple part of the business as an analyst, and then he went into sales.
And then he started doing some operational things, and then I gave him more of the marketing e-commerce part of our business. But it was all a, a crawl, walk, run. It was not speed. And the problem is, is that when you're 25 to 30 years old, you, you just know how you wanna get from point A to point B. My way of doing it was, is that when I started to see the impatience grow, I then, then I moved him into a [00:37:00] different area and made him learn and go around the sun again.
There you go. Because it's... What happens is, is that you gotta keep feeding the monster. But what they want, you know, it's like somebody asked me, "Is, you know, Blake ready to take this over and kick you out?" And I said, "No, I don't think so. I don't think, I don't think that he feels that way at all." But I do think that that is going to happen with a lot of others, because I want to take that over.
If you look at all the Roman, you know, all the Roman, uh, um, Caesars of all the times, you know, their sons were just itching to get rid of Dad. Yeah. Yeah. Or they killed him. Yeah. Yeah. And, you know, so you, what you learn from history is, is that the best ones would say, you know, "Claudius, I'm gonna send you out with a Roman legion.
You're gonna go take over the French." And so I just bought myself 18 months, 'cause I know that that's how long it's gonna take him to do it, but when he comes back, he's gonna be going, "Hey, uh, what, what-" Yeah. "What's next?" Yeah. "Come on." Yeah. You know, so... And he had some of that. He had some impatience. But [00:38:00] I always made it that when I saw that meter raise up, I made sure that then I sent him on his next path.
Steve Graves: Okay. Okay. That's good.
Dwight Power: By ins- You need to save the Roman thing ... by instinct,
Steve Graves: by instinct or were you... I mean, like, how'd you know that? Like, where'd you, where'd you come up with that?
Dwight Power: It was, it was all instinct Okay. Okay It, it's all has to do with the way that I would wanna be treated Okay You know? And so, you know, that's the problem, is that, um, the, the father-son magic is so difficult to pinpoint 'cause there's so many different times in life.
You know, they, you, you know, y- I would say that they need you, you know, you're, you're independent, and then they become independent. But, you know, he's, he's... I still think that dependency when it comes to learning, there's always something that I can teach him, and that doesn't end. That, that'll end... That will never end.
So but what's the hardest part is making sure that you [00:39:00] make the right door open at the right time because you don't wanna lose them, but you also wanna make sure that they get around the sun and learn it. And so, like right now, he's, he's around the sun learning it, so I'm, I'm able to wash and be able to give some of those things out that I've never given up before, and it was easy because I felt like he was ready.
Blake Power: Well, to piggyback off that, to kinda answer some of your questions too, is we had, and we still do, conversations all the time. We talked all the time, and I think where some of the challenges with father-son relationship, especially in a business, is if they're not communicating and talking about expectations and, hey, talking about, "Here's my goals and dreams," and all these sort of things, um, you know, "Here's what I wanna do.
What do you wanna do? How do you wanna handle it?" And having those conversations, um, you know, that's where a lot of the tension can build up, um, especially if the son is super ambitious and is like, "Hey, I wanna do this, I wanna do this." [00:40:00] Um, but if they're not talking and having constant communication, um, you know, I think that that's where it can get into a lot of trouble.
And, and for us, I mean, even in the very beginning, um, you know, when I came into the business, I mean, at least once a week, we would have an hour-long conversation. May not be work-related, but a lot of times it would be in, in talking about, "Hey, what do you think? What do you... You know, what's next? You know, what are...
What's the future look like?" And so we would very intentionally have conversations about this kind of stuff. Um, and you know, sometimes I'd have to track him down. You know, he's world traveler over here. Yeah, yeah. And, you know, like, "Hey, we need to talk. Like, we... I've got a lot on my mind and a lot on my chest that I wanna talk to you about."
Um, but that, that helped a lot. Um, and I think, you know, he would come to me and say, you know, "Hey, there's, there's an opportunity here, you know, let's, let's talk about it." Um, and, and so K- Kyle, kind of to address your questions about, you know, the [00:41:00] humility versus ambition aspect of it, um, you know, I've tried, I've tried really hard, you know, pretty much my entire life to be a humble person, not be, you know, showy, and not be, um, you know, just, like, m- super ambitious and that's what I'm known for, and I'm gonna, I'm gonna do whatever I can to get, you know, to get to my goals.
Um- Yeah ... like, I, I very much want to and, and have, you know, pursued the, the idea of being a, a servant leader and, you know, showing humility of, like, "Hey, I'm... Like, I can't, I can't do this without you, you know. Um, I need your help. I need, you know, guidance," and all of that. Um, and so I've, I've really wanted to try, um, and have, have s- put a lot of effort into how do I, how do I maintain, you know, being humble with the role that I'm in, um, uh, without overstepping, you know, with ambition and, and being like, "Hey, I'm...
You know, I want this, I want this. Let's do [00:42:00] this," you know? So...
Dwight Power: What i- what would I say? Slow down, Ricky Bobby.
Blake Power: Slow down, Ricky Bobby. Were
Kile Graves: there any examples- That's perfect ... of things where- That's perfect ... like, what's an example of something where he would have to say, "Slow down"? Was it, like, a marketing idea, or let's get into this channel, or- Oh, yeah
let's hire 10 people? Yeah. All the above. Okay. One,
Blake Power: one a day. Because I would... What I would do is I, I would come up with ideas, and I'd just spitball on that, you know, throw them out there, and just kind of, you know, it's like, you know, throw your spaghetti against the wall and see if, you know- ... see if it sticks.
Yeah. You know? It's like that's, that's what I would try to do, is, is I'd throw out all these ideas and, you know, have, have some of these crazy things, and he'd be like, "Whoa, whoa, whoa. Slow down." Ricky Bobby. Slow down, Ricky Bobby. So...
Dwight Power: Yeah, that's... But that, that's the one thing that if, if he's off on a tangent, I would always bring in a little humor or a quote from a movie to slow him down, you know, and that was kind of always my trigger for him to just say, "Hang on a second."
That's [00:43:00] funny. You know, because, you know, the, the, the funny thing is when you say it, you know what it's saying. You know, you know... He knows what I'm telling him. Yeah. So, you know, I've done that. Um, I just recently did it to a president and CEO of a billion-dollar company, and he was jumping all over the place on this deck we were presenting, and I finally said, I said, "Slow down, Ricky Bobby."
"It's on page nine." And they died laughing- Oh ... because they knew what it was. But guess what it did? The rest of the meeting, he didn't jump around. Yeah. So it wasn't an insult because, you know, um, I, I, I an- I answered it with the first thing they could see is Will Ferrell and Ricky Bobby- Yeah ... in the, them being, doing a TV interview.
Right. You know, which you're not f- I'm not first, you're la- Ooh. You know, I mean, if you're not first, you're last. So it was always a way for me to communicate. I used a lot of humor with him. That's fun. Um, you know, I'll do some Monty Python things periodically- Yeah. That's good ... that go back, way back in age- Yep
'cause I think that is really some of the [00:44:00] best humor. Yeah.
Kile Graves: Well, and it sounds like, it sounds like you're h- you're navigating the ambition/humility struggle well. But it probably helps because you did let go of some stuff. Mm-hmm. Like, you were able to take on... You know, so if, if the core tension for the, for the son is ambition versus humility, one of them that we've seen for the dad would be steering wisely, 'cause you still know way more than the son does, but also letting go of something.
Mm-hmm. So if you're o- if you're only steering and making all the decisions, and you won't let go of anything, then your son's gonna be like, "Give me something." Mm-hmm. Right. But if you let go of all of it, then you may go into the ditch, 'cause he still needs you to lead wisely. Yeah. So it, it sounds like you were able to let go of some stuff, and he could take 'em and run, and that helped you kinda
Blake Power: navigate that.
Oh, yeah. Absolutely. Yeah, there's, there's been countless times where, you know, if he, he let go and let me take charge of something, and if I f- if I failed, or if, you know, I didn't succeed at one of the, the, the tasks or something that he gave me because I just didn't... Either I didn't know what I was [00:45:00] doing, or I didn't have the, the right strategy behind it or whatever, he was always there to be like, "Hey, here's, you know, h- let's, let's walk through this.
Here's what I would've done, um, so learn from this, and, you know, don't make the same mistake again." And- Yeah.
Dwight Power: We really haven't had that, that, that kind of thing because it's, a lot of it has to do with your personality. Yeah. Yeah. You know, you, you all have people who are, you know, type A personalities. You know, you can be a type A, but you can also be a passive type A.
Yep. Right. Where you have an understanding, and that's kind of more of who I am, you know? And so I'm not sitting there, you know, I don't... In fact, if I have a bad day, it's usually on the car, because the only time you ever see me with anything is road rage in Fayetteville, Arkansas. Driving around here, trying to get from point A to point B.
And other than that, that's the only place these kids- Yep ... ever see me get go wild. We're not driving with him. Yeah. Yeah. Right. The rest [00:46:00] of, the rest of my life, it's not that way, but I think that's what's also been great for him is that, you know, how I managed him in high school in baseball was that, you know, y- you run out a ball.
If you pop it up, you run it out. And, or you, you, you... The th- those things that you're trying to send messages of trying to develop that personality, I've already done all that. You know, this is already set. You know, the, the biggest question was, and it was that way for, you know, the first three years he was there, "Is this really what you wanna do?"
And I wanna make sure, because if I turn these reins over, it's yours, you know? That's great. And that's
Steve Graves: how it's been. That's great. That's cool.
Kile Graves: Something we say a lot with family businesses is it's a, uh, it's a uniquely rewarding opportunity, but it can be uniquely challenging because of the family dynamics and, and expectations and stuff at risk.
What's been, what's been uniquely rewarding about working with each other, and maybe an example of something that's been uniquely [00:47:00] challenging? Hmm.
Blake Power: Yeah, I think f- for me, one of the, the most rewarding aspects of, of working with him is just getting to be around him. You know, we've, we've had a really great relationship my entire life and, you know, very thankful, very blessed to, to have that.
Um, and to j- just be able to work with him 40 hours a week, see him all the time, talk to him all the time, um, you know, that has been probably the most rewarding aspect for me, um, getting to work with him. Um, you know, but also just, like, continuing to learn how he operates in his space, in his arena, and because this has been his, you know, his life for the last 33 years.
Um, and, you know, getting to just continue to learn more about, you know, how he handles certain situations, how he processes, how [00:48:00] he, you know, um, attacks different challenges. Um, you know, 'cause at, at home, you know, especially growing up, you don't see a lot of that. And, you know, him and my mom, they, they did a really good job of kind of protecting some of the, the emotions and some of the stuff from, from work.
But, you know, it gave, uh... Working with him has given me an opportunity to kind of see more into, you know, the window of, you know, who he is and how he handles certain situations and stuff like that. So just getting to, to learn and, um, see how he operates has also been, been very rewarding. Um, but I mean, it does come with its challenges, uh, for sure.
Um, I don't really know off the top of my head what, w- you know, what challenges that- Yeah ... that have come up. Um, you know, we've, we've had a pretty good time. I mean, there's obviously ups and downs of the business- Yeah ... side of things. Think, think [00:49:00] hardest
Steve Graves: part of it. F- don't, don't let the word challenge trip you.
Just think- Yeah ... what's the hardest part of working with- my dad or working in the family business or whatever. Mm-hmm. If you just had to kind of stack up a few things under that list- Yeah ... what would that look like?
Blake Power: I mean, the, the, the classic, you know, kind of nepotism thing of like, "Oh, he's my dad," you know, the owner's the dad, you know.
The handout component. The handout component. Yeah. Yeah. Um, you know, I've, I've had to make a very conscious effort, you know, to earn the respect of everybody in the business and- Yeah ... you know, prove myself, um, to everybody. Um, and that- Internally ... internally that I'm, that I'm worthy of, you know, the position that I'm in.
Um, that I haven't been gifted it, that I haven't been just handed it because I am the owner's son. Um, that's a challenge that'll always be there. Um, you know, it's just... But, you know, it's, it's a really good challenge for me because I think it also, you know, keeps me humble and [00:50:00] keeps me g- grounded, so that way I'm not like, "Oh, I'm, I'm the man."
Yeah. You know, I've, I've earned this, you know. I, this is my- Yeah ... you know. Yeah, no entitlement. No entitlement, right. Yeah, no entitlement- Yeah ... coming
Kile Graves: your way. Yeah. That's good. Yeah. The, uh, kind of the vision for this, these conversations is, uh, for more dads to see working with their son as a way to amplify their legacy and disciple their son in the workplace, and for more, for more sons to see working with their dad, uh, as an honor and not just a handout.
It's kind of the like vision statement for this, this series. Um, 'cause we had the same... I mean, the, the answer of like the handout component, I got the last name on my jersey, everyone knows my dad runs it, like that's been a similar answer for everyone we've talked to. It's part of my story. I remember Esther was like, when I was leaving Bearded Goat, uh, she's like, "What if you worked for your dad?"
I was like, "I, no, I'm not gonna go, like, I don't wanna do that. I don't want a handout." And, uh, she helped reframe. She's like, "What if, [00:51:00] what if Milas..." We just had our son. Uh, he's three now, but she's like, "What if Milas like came to you one day and was like, 'I wanna work with you,' you'd be excited, right?" And I was like, "Well, yeah."
She's like, "It's a, it's a cool opportunity. Why are you viewing it in such a negative light?" So, but it's a common thing. Mm-hmm. You know? So
Dwight Power: yeah, that's good. It's, it's not easy to be LeBron James and then him be Bronny. Or Bryce on Arizona. Or Bryce, or on Arizona. Wait, Bryce is, Bryce is still undetermined yet.
So. You know, but- Yeah ... you can't live up, you- He's saying I'm a lot worse than LeBron ... you have a hard time... Yeah. Yeah, in tennis and golf probably, yeah. Yeah, probably. But outside of that, you probably own me on all other sports. Yeah. But, you know, the, the, what I think is a great, it's a, it's, it's really what the depth of what you all are trying to get into is to learn about how does it, how do you make this tick right.
Blake Power: Yeah.
Dwight Power: You know? And how does that work? And it's, um, you know, I didn't, I don't, I've never read a book that said, "This is how you do it." It's [00:52:00] just intuition. It's just a gut. And I think, you know, you, you don't wanna, you don't wanna make it seem like it's LeBron and, and, and, you know, Ronnie. It... You don't wanna do that.
I've never wanted to make him feel like I was that much better than him, you know? And just because I've had it for 33 years, I mean, I now tell people that I want to write a book of being, you know, the only guy, the only broker, consultant, agency who has seen it from Walmart for 50 years. Well, that puts me at, you know, that basically puts me at 82, 81.
Or not... Yeah. So I mean, I'd be writing a book when I'm, I'm o- 80 years old, but I want to be able to say, "But it's got two chapters. It's, it's got my chapter, but it's got his." That's awesome. That's cool. Because that's what... You know, that's where you really look at legacy, is that being able to say, "You know what?
That's the goal." So if my goal for him is I want to [00:53:00] write a book together and say, "What has our 50 years been of selling to Walmart and Sam's?" That's fun. That's
Kile Graves: cool. Um, so kind of the, the final section, uh, for this is talking about the future and what is, what's the vision for maybe that second chapter or the second section of the book?
What does that look like? When is that coming? What does kind of the transition look like between you two and, uh... Because you're still handling clients, right, Dwight? I do. Or has that slowed down? I do. Um, there's kind of three... There's three seasons we've seen that a family business will work through. The, the first one is where you're just learning, and the dad's still leading in all capacities.
You're just getting your feet wet, learning the business. This is you as the analyst, you know, bottom of the food chain. Second season is where you're both leading in some capacity. Seems like you're kind of there now- Mm-hmm ... uh, in some way, uh, leading from a title perspective, roles perspective, [00:54:00] um, ownership perspective, whatever.
Uh, and then the third season is the final. You know, the dad steps into some type of, we use the, the term shepherd, some type of shepherding role. Mm-hmm. Whether that's chairman of the board, you know, "I'm on the beach, call me." "I'll be there on Mondays only," or whatever it is, but you're running the show fully.
Uh, where are you guys in that journey, and then what does, what does the future look like as you approach that final stretch?
Dwight Power: I, I, I, I don't know. I, I'm, I'm one of those people that, you know, I, I'm... I don't, I don't know when my end is You know, so I can't say today that, okay, when I'm 67, on my 67th birthday I'm done. Um, what I do know is, is that I have the energy of a 30-year-old, and so I'm still running like [00:55:00] I'm that age. So I'm having fun.
I like what I do. The big transition from, you know, to a shepherd is already kind of starting because what I want to do, you know, I've, I've basically worked with a company for 33 years, and the company that I'm working with today is 24 years. So, you know, when you're with somebody that long, it's like I've got other kids.
That's a, that's a whole... a lot of relationships there. Yeah. But, you know, it... I'm gonna go back to, to... I tell people this all the time. I wanna be relevant, and relevant meaning that I need to be prosperous for the business. I don't need to be an anchor. So an anchor to him would be is if I'm sitting there managing him every day.
I don't wanna manage him every day. I want him to run and go make... do... run the business, get me to 50 years. What I wanna be able to do is, is what I'm good at doing, is go recruit companies to come to us or, you know, work [00:56:00] with a company and help them grow. You know, I love doing that. And, you know, I've, I've, I'm...
I... and I've probably told this, another one of these things Blake just k- shakes his head at, but I'm willing to tell you if your baby's ugly.
Blake Power: I
Dwight Power: mean, you know, I will tell you, and it's something that I've learned that has been one of the most valuable things I've done in business is because I have the ability to tell you that.
So I wanna be relevant. I wanna be still part of the business, but, you know, I don't wanna be sitting there, people... Robert Plant from Led Zeppelin is a perfect for instance. You know, they, they... th- really after 1983, they decided they were done, and he always said, "I w- I'm not, I'm not relevant anymore. Th- music's changed.
Things have changed." And I never respected that because I thought, "What are you talking about, man? I, everybody wants you to release albums." But he also looked back and said, "You know what? I was really, really good in the [00:57:00] '70s, fairly good in the '80s. Am I relevant to what's happening? Do I wanna be that band that's kicking around trying to go back to just play w- off of Led Zeppelin II?
No." He said, "I wanna be relevant." So he changed his course, and he went and did his own, own thing, which never has been as good- Mm ... as what his original thing has been. So as long as I'm relevant to him, then I will be part of his journey. But if I get to that point where I'm, I'm not relevant anymore, then, you know...
But I have to be in the shepherd part now, and going in the future is I need to be shepherding him because I think he's been around the sun long enough- And understands the ups and downs of how things go in business.
Kile Graves: Are there still a few, uh, major functions or components of the business that you're still holding onto that haven't been handed off yet operationally or, or financially or strategically?
Or have most of those [00:58:00] kinda been handed over at this point?
Dwight Power: No. Last year, I really started digging in on financials, you know. So I kept financials away from him for some time. I didn't want him to worry about financials. But when he took over the operational side, the, the financials had to come into play, which mean then he started to know how much money does dad really make, you know, and what does dad do, you know, how does he get to where he is today, and how, how this is supposed to be.
So, um, you know, last year I started sharing all that, and I, and I'm sharing that with him and I'm going through with him diligently. But that's this last part of being around the son of part two- Mm ... that takes me to part three.
Kile Graves: Yeah, that's cool. That's like the, that's the business owner aspects. Or here's, here are the financials of the company.
That's how it impacts me as the owner and how all those things tie together.
Steve Graves: How are you guys thinking about the... You [00:59:00] know, the great news is you have a really long cycle of a thirty-year history. That's, that's great. That's great news. There's also some, um, challenging news because a longstanding business cycle has to be reinvented every few years, you know.
Just has to. Um, you're reinventing yourself against a very specific market, your customer interface with Walmart and Sam's. And so as Walmart and Sam's reinvents itself in, um, you know, like when it reinvented itself from being, you know, there was the, there was the store desk, and then there was the digital desk, and then it's like, "No, no, no, we're not playing that game.
You, you guys, you guys get on one desk and then, then come back and see me." And, um, and then, you know, the AI stuff or just whatever. How, how are you guys, um... How are y'all thinking about that together? Like, I get it when you're by yourself because you're, you're cooking it. [01:00:00] You're cooking it, and you're assimilating it, but, like, one of the things that, that I've r- you know, that I realize is that, um...
I was talking to a... I'm on a, a board that's out of New York, and I was talking to the, the CEO the other day and I said, "Look, you might need..." Like, I've been on the board for fifteen years, and I said, "Look-" You might need to replace me. Like, I, I, like, I understand the whole crystallized intelligence. That's what they call wh- the older you get, you're supposed to have crystallized intelligence.
That's the sec- that's the formal academic term of it, and I said, "I get all that." But I said, "The other side of it is you just kinda get old, and you think the same way that you've always thought for, for a long time." My question's just long wind up. Sorry. My question is, is how... Like, you're not gonna think about, about significant pivots and significant opportunities the same way that your dad will, no more than Kyle will like I will all the time.
Some of them will be similar, you know, but they won't be the [01:01:00] same. So how are you guys thinking about business opportunities in a big macro strategic way? Like, you might not... You might think about acquisitions differently, you know, than maybe your dad would have just because of the market and the opportunity or whatever was happening-
Blake Power: Mm-hmm
20 years
Steve Graves: ago. How, how are y- how are you guys working through that part of owning a business together, transitioning of not just P&L and, you know, running people, but, like, the direction of the business, the speed of the business, the risk of the business, stuff like that?
Blake Power: Mm. One of the things, kinda going back to what we talked about in the beginning, is having, just having the conversations, um, just talking, you know.
And we've- What I do is I, I've, I've got a- all these ideas, and I, I go out, and especially with AI, it's like I've been really pushing hard on how do we integrate it? How do we become an AI native company? How do we, um, you know, 'cause I've, I've had this gut feeling that if we don't [01:02:00] integrate, you know, we'll get left behind and, um...
or we won't be running as efficient as we can. And, um, so I've got all of these ideas and things that I'm processing and running through. And, um, just two weeks ago, I sent him this, you know, 30-page document that I'd put together on kind of a 5, 10, 15 year, you know, where I see the market going and the industry and this, and how the, how AI is impacting and, um, you know, what does our business look like and all of these kind of things.
Like, that's the kind of stuff that's running through my brain and-
Steve Graves: So, so what'd you do with that? So- Stay, stay on that one. Yeah. You know, how, where'd that go? How'd that, how'd that process?
Blake Power: Yeah, so I, you know, I sent it to him in an email and just was like, "Hey, um, you know, we need to... Let's, let's talk about this."
Um- It wasn't slow, slow down, Ricky Bobby. That, that was part of it too. Yeah. That was... 'Cause, uh, you know, when I looked at the, the, uh, you know, I did a one-year outlook. Um, he's like, "Okay, let's, let's talk about that first," 'cause [01:03:00] that's, you know, what's impacting right now. Um, and he was like, "Let's, let's slow down on the conversation on the 5, 10, 15 year from now.
Um, but we can start planning for those, but let- let's, let's, let's narrow our focus down a little bit." Um, he, uh, he said, he told me when I sent him the document, he's like scrolling and it's 30 pages long. He's like He's like, "I'm gonna be honest with you." "I just skimmed it." "I'm not reading all of that." He's like, "I'm not reading all that."
And he's like, "I need you to-" Yeah. "I need you to tell me." I
Steve Graves: usually send back with a, a hit me with a one-pager. One-pager, yeah, yeah. Hit me with a one-pager- Yeah. Yeah ... and then tell me the pages I need to look at. Yeah. Give me the 30 pages. Yeah.
Blake Power: Yeah. "This was too long. I didn't read it." Yeah. "What's the, uh...
Give me the- Yeah ... SparkNotes version of it." Um, you know, but it, it, it, it created a, an opportunity for conversation. Yeah. Um, and-
Steve Graves: So the dialogue... So my question is, the dialogue you guys are having allows for all those kinds of things to be, to show up.
Blake Power: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, and we have, you know, I've [01:04:00] found that, you know, we have to...
A lot of times it has to be intentional when we talk, when we have these kind of conversations. Um, you know, I'll... Sometimes he'll call me into his office and, you know, we'll be talking about just random stuff and movies and TV shows and, and all of that, and it's very easy for us to have those kind of conversations where, you know, like, still meaningful and fun, but not strategic business conversations.
And so, you know, we have to be really intentional of like, "Hey, I'm scheduling, you know, an hour with you, and we're gonna talk through these things. Um, this is what we've... You know, what's on my mind." And, and, um, but I think the intentionality behind it is really important in, in making sure that we're having these conversations.
'Cause touching back again on what, what we had discussed in the, in e- earlier is like, you know, if you, if you're not intentional about having these conversations, a lot of times they just, they aren't had. Yeah. And- Agreed ... um, you know, so we've... That's, that's what's on my mind is [01:05:00] like, "Hey, you know, if I've got an idea," or, you know, "Here's what I'm thinking as future planning for, for the business," like, we have to have a, a serious conversation where we're both, you know, you know, in a room talking about it, focused, you know, not having, uh, other distractions and stuff like that.
Dwight Power: He recently came to me and said he wants to, to go off on a tangent that we hadn't been in on. I've been on the AI thing for quite a bit, quite a long time. I'm fascinated by it, and I also understand the power of it, and it's so significant now. But, you know, he wanted... He came to me and said, "Hey, I wanna go off on this tangent."
I said, "That's fine." You know, the, the decision when you're in two and, and going into three And really becoming a shepherd isn't really anything more than, you know, is being able to hel- help him understand that, you know, there... Every decision you make, there's a consequence to that decision, and the consequence can be a great one, [01:06:00] and it can be a great path, or it could be something that you just wasted time and money to get to.
So, you know, from my standpoint, like, he wants to really get into more of, of a marketplace and a dot-com-type side of the business and really help companies there. I've never chased that, but that's something he wants to chase, and I'm all for that. Mm. You know, so there's, there's a lot of what you're talking about going on, but again, it's, it...
We communicate probably more than the average, you know, the average does. Yeah. But, you know, a large part of it has to come from, you know, the, the senior has to be willing to communicate. That's great. And it's all about that personality, you know? And if, you know, I, I want him to learn, but I also want him to fail, 'cause I think you grow as much and when you fail 'cause then you know.
So from that standpoint, I'm in that, in that transition that you're talking about, and I'm really trying to help him on the back end of all this, is that when I do let go of all [01:07:00] the reins, maybe I'm only just one of his salesmen. But he can come to me and say, you know, "Hey, I, this... What do you wanna do here?
What do you think about that?" But I'm, I'm never gonna put him in a position where it's like, "You know, if you wanna go chase that, you need to go chase it." So we're-- I think we work well that way. Now, I, you know, if I... He'll see facial expressions. He also knows with me, just like you know with your dad- Yeah
when he's sitting there and you're telling him something and he's like- ... you know, he's got that squint. And then next thing you know, he's looking up in the air. Yeah, like he's over it. You know? Yeah. Yeah. So sometimes facial expressions can tell him, "Okay, maybe I didn't present it that well. Maybe it's something that we need to work on.
Maybe I need to get you to a better place about it." We're in that stage where he's seeing that, because if he, he says something to me and I do give him... It's not the wife head tilt where you're just like- Yeah. Mm ... you know, 'cause we all have this right now. You get the wife head tilt when you know you're wrong.
Yeah. [01:08:00] Okay. Yeah. But it's, he's getting that squint from me. So he, it's a little bit of understanding how to read the room on what it is that you think that's... You know, 'cause there is a core to our business, but you have to be able to manipulate and move with that. Yeah. And, um, I think the core values that we have will always stay, and I think will always be where we're at today, but there are some places that he can go, like with this marketplace, that I think he could really make a difference in, and that needs to be where he, he goes and tries something.
That's great. So, you know, it... And for me, that's great. You know, I, I'm, you know, I'm all in for it. So it's hard. It's hard. Because in the very beginning, you know, you're, you're like, "I n- he needs to go around the sun a little bit, a little bit more, a little bit more." But, you know, you have to judge when is it that he's around the sun, and then let him go rush off and go do what he needs to do.
Blake Power: There was a lot of, lot of times, especially early on, and still to this day, where he'll look at me and be like, [01:09:00] "You have no idea what you're talking about." And you're
Dwight Power: like, "Yeah, I do. I know all of it." Yeah.
Blake Power: No, you really don't. You really
Dwight Power: don't. And, you know, it's been easy for me to actually let go of a lot of the reins, a lot easier than I thought it was gonna be.
And the reason for that is, is because I know he wants it. You know? So that- Right ... that, that's, when you talk about encapsulating everything that you all are doing with, with fathers and sons, you kind of know. It's, it's an intuition that, you know, you, both you two knew, "Hey, this is gonna work, and you have your place.
You have yours." It's the same here. Mm-hmm. So those are the things that are really fun about this, 'cause you asked the question, "What's your favorite thing?" He says, "Well, I'm around him 40 week, 40 hours a week." Yeah, so am I, so we both have the same fix. So, you know, it's, um, it, it, it's very meaningful, but it has to be in the circumstance of understanding where you are and [01:10:00] making sure that you both have that plan.
Is there a day where I'm gonna do the mic drop? Well, it would be if I win the lottery, you know, tomorrow night. But if I don't win the lottery tomorrow night, I'm-
Steve Graves: You're back
Dwight Power: Gonna be around.
Blake Power: You're back. You're back Monday. I'm back on Monday. You're back Monday. You're back on Monday. Well, the good, the good thing is, is if he does win the lottery, I think, you know, we've, we've, he's laid a good enough foundation for me and, and for our, our leadership team and, and the rest of the team to where, you know, if he did mic drop and was like, "All right.
I'm moving to Hawaii. We'll see you guys later," um, we'd be okay. And, and I believe that, and I think he believes that, too. Um- I do ... and so that's a good... You know, it's a comforting place to be. It's a great place to be. Yeah. It's a great
Steve Graves: place to be. Yeah. Bo- both sides, you know. Yeah. And for the customer. Yeah.
You know, I mean, it's a great place for me for a- any, you know, any vantage. Yeah.
Kile Graves: Well, y'all are doing a great job. It's been fun to get to know you better- Yeah ... you too, Dwight, and just see how, how you guys are doing it. There's, uh, there's 32 million family businesses in the US. Uh, 40% of them are owned [01:11:00] by a baby boomer who's nearing retirement age.
Uh, a third of those are gonna transition successfully to the next generation. The other two-thirds are either gonna get bought out or fizzle or the son doesn't want to work there. They can't figure out how to transition or whatever. But you guys are doing it well, and, uh, it's been fun to get an inside look onto how you're doing it and how you've navigated
it.