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"A LOT with Audra" is the podcast for women juggling big dreams and full lives. Each episode, host, Audra Dinell, Midwestern wife, mom and neurodivergent multi-six figure entrepreneur encourages women to embrace their many roles holistically by living a values-based life with confidence and joy. Through candid discussions, practical strategies and inspiring stories, this podcast is your guide to designing and achieving success without losing yourself in the process.
Ep70
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Motherhood Changes Everything
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[00:00:00]
Audra Dinell: [00:01:00] Today we're talking about motherhood and how it changes everything, not just your sleep or your schedule, but your whole identity, your relationships, and your sense of self. My guest hosts the podcast Reproductively Speaking, where she explores the intersection of parenthood purpose and wellbeing.
And this conversation is for anyone who has felt cracked, open, rearranged. Remade by Motherhood Terran Vigar is a therapist and business owner who is passionate about helping women navigate the real, often unspoken emotional shifts of motherhood. She specializes in perinatal mental health and works with women and couples through fertility struggles, postpartum experiences, and the identity changes that come with this season of life.
Outside of her work, Taryn is in the thick of motherhood herself, raising her nine, eight, and 4-year-old, prioritizing movement when she can, and spending time thrifting. One [00:02:00] of her favorite ways to unwind and reconnect with herself. Welcome, Taryn.
Welcome, Taryn.
Taryn Zweygardt: Hello.
Expectations vs Reality
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Audra Dinell: Okay, so before becoming a mother, how did you imagine that motherhood would affect you?
Taryn Zweygardt: Well, I think I had like the traditional belief that, you know, motherhood or parenting would be the most happiest time of my life and it would be so fun and, and it is fun in moments, right?
But I definitely, I think I underestimated the impact that it would have. The hard moments and also the good moments too that maybe seemed really hard in the moment. But then, you know, as I'm reflecting back on 'em, I'm realizing like, okay, wow. I wasn't expecting that to come from the situation or the season of motherhood.
So, I definitely just. Had this belief that I was gonna rock it. You know, I enjoyed babysitting when I was younger. Spoiler alert, parenting is not the same as babysitting for just a short period of time. So, it was very surprising for sure. [00:03:00]
Audra Dinell: Hmm. I can relate so much.
When It Doesn’t Feel Natural
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Audra Dinell: I remember struggling to have my first son, we had a couple of miscarriages and once we had him, so it's like we prayed for him, we wanted him, we were in our.
Early thirties, like we were so ready and once we had him, I just remember this amazing burst of love for like my husband and my son and it was like, oh, this world, it's just the three of us.
Taryn Zweygardt: Yeah.
Audra Dinell: And then he wouldn't latch or my milk didn't come in. There was some feeding challenge early.
Taryn Zweygardt: Yeah.
Audra Dinell: That just like crippled me with anxiety and.
I just wasn't expecting that.
Taryn Zweygardt: Mm-hmm. Yeah, I think that's one thing. You know, I talk with a lot of clients about that, where I think we are almost like sold this idea that becoming a mom or like. Motherhood in general can feel or should feel very natural, and that is one thing that comes up sometimes I feel like is we have a mom who is struggling or is saying to me like, I didn't realize it [00:04:00] was supposed it was gonna feel this hard, or Is there something wrong with me because it feels this hard or.
Maybe they don't feel that natural like love right away or bonding. And that can bring up some really challenging feelings and emotions that I've had to, and I still continue to like, help clients navigate as they're kind of figuring out motherhood and what it feels like for them.
Audra Dinell: And what a gift.
What a gift. The work you do, really.
Taryn Zweygardt: Yeah.
Audra Dinell: I mean, because the stories. That we are told, or the pictures that have been painted for us aren't always lining up with our reality. Mm-hmm. And shame can come up. Yeah. I'm sure. I mean, just so much.
Taryn Zweygardt: Yeah.
Normalizing the Hard Parts
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Taryn Zweygardt: And you know, something that's important to me and my clients know this is.
You know, I'm very much deep in my own season of, you know, mothering and motherhood and, you know, my, my youngest is only four and so I'm not quite out of like the trenches you could say. And I think it's important for me as a [00:05:00] therapist. Yeah, I have the education and I went to school for this and I take the trainings and all of the things, but that doesn't mean that I have it all figured out.
Unfortunately, when we have kids, they don't send us home from the hospital with like a parenting manual. Also. Spoiler alert, there is none. And so I am too also figuring it out and there's some power in normalizing that. Like, Hey, you're sitting here in this space with me and you're telling me that this is hard.
And I am supposed to be, you know, the, the expert or the one that has it all figured out, but I also am still trying to figure this out too. And sometimes it's just that normalization that can help sort of like, have clients take a deep breath and be like, okay, it's not just me. I'm not failing at this.
Audra Dinell: Yeah. And I see in your work, you're so good at being real.
Taryn Zweygardt: Mm-hmm. It's, I mean, I think it's so important, motherhood, especially in the day and [00:06:00] age, I guess, of social media and technology. I can promise you that what we see on social media is not real. I have sat in spaces with people who, you know, on the outside and to others may appear like buttoned up and they have it all together.
But when I get to sit in that real. Raw space with them. They're having struggles that the rest of us are struggling with, and I think that there can be something so powerful about just being open and honest about what you're navigating instead of pretending instead of. Being like, oh, here's my perfectly clean home and here's me being patient and loving with my kids every second of the day.
Audra Dinell: Yeah.
Taryn Zweygardt: Because we know that's not really what happens. And that's okay. And it doesn't mean that we're a bad mom. You know, I tell my clients often you know, good moms yell at their kids sometimes. Good moms lose their patience. And good moms aren't always like super loving and want to play with their kids and that's okay.
'Cause at the end of the day, we're humans first. And being a [00:07:00] mom or parenting is just one part of our identity.
Audra Dinell: Yeah.
Social Media and Real Life
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Audra Dinell: Speaking of social media, how do you think people can show up? Just more real like you do, where it is not always rainbows and butterflies, but it's always also not.
Mm-hmm. Always sort of like complaining and just. Down. Like how do you think people can show up for, for one another in their real lives or even online?
Taryn Zweygardt: Yeah, I mean, I think even if you're like having a hard moment, it's okay to talk about it, but also like when you're having moments where you feel more empowered or you're in a better place, like using those moments to help encourage other moms, like, Hey, been there, done that, and I promise you it gets better.
Or it doesn't always feel this hard. I'm kind of in this weird place with social media myself right now where I am sort of having to put myself in check, where I'm having to remind myself. At like from perf like my professional standpoint where sometimes it can feel [00:08:00] competitive, like I have to show up or I have to post so many times, or like, what does that mean?
But you know, I, I think I'm always reminding myself the real work is happening either, you know, with clients and session or when I'm connecting with friends and family or even in my own individual therapy sessions, you know? And so it doesn't really matter how I show up or if I show up at all. I think the last time I posted on social media on my professional page was like weeks ago.
And I was just telling you before we got on like, oh, I was supposed to make a post about a new podcast episode, but I didn't. And that's okay. Like I've just been knee deep in real life, and that's okay sometimes too. I
Audra Dinell: agree. And I have that similar battle, so I appreciate that. I'm not the only one.
Taryn Zweygardt: Yeah,
Audra Dinell: you are not the only one for sure.
Identity After Becoming Mom
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Audra Dinell: So tell me, when you became a mom, what ways did that reshape? Your sense of self? Mm.
Taryn Zweygardt: I tend to be the type of person who [00:09:00] unfortunately in my past was basing my worth on output or productivity. And one thing about motherhood is, especially in that first year, you know, first two, three years, our kids can't really communicate and they, you know, not very well.
It's not like they can tell you what they need. And so in those moments that were really hard, when I couldn't get my kids, to stop crying or I couldn't figure out what was wrong. That was really challenging the parts of me that wanted to always get it right. Yeah. Or wanted to be able to like, solve the issues.
And so that, that has been really difficult. But also it's been really good for me to sort of challenge that part of myself and spend time and prove to myself like, even if I don't get it right all the time, it doesn't mean I'm failing. Or even if I can't figure it out, or, Hey, this is gonna be trial and error.
And I think that's something unique about. Motherhood is, [00:10:00] every season looks different. Like just when you think you figured it out. Yeah. Then like some new challenge comes up and then it's like, okay, here we go again. And so it is exciting, but it is challenging. And just sort of learning that, you know, I'm a human and it's, it's okay if I dunno how to do it the first time.
Learning to have more patience with myself and grace it's a lot.
Audra Dinell: It sounds
Taryn Zweygardt: like
Perfectionism and ADHD Revealed
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Audra Dinell: becoming a mother and navigating the early seasons helped you sort of like shake up or break off some perfectionism. Idealization or, or tendencies or like the word perfectionist comes to mind when you're talking about that.
Taryn Zweygardt: Yeah, I think, you know, perfectionism is definitely something that I struggle with. You know, another part that sort of came from motherhood that has been interesting to navigate is. I was 32 when I was finally diagnosed with A DHD. And motherhood [00:11:00] really illuminated that for me. You know, looking back on things, I realize now it's probably something that I struggled with.
But our capacity shrinks when we go from only having to worry about ourselves and what we need to survive to then having to think about. Another human or putting another human first. Thinking about their needs, it's a lot and the mental load increases. And I was really shocked by that, by how hard and difficult that was.
And so also learning that part of me and how that part of me sort of like. Is on fire now in different moments of motherhood and learning. You know, what does that part of me need? How do I what do I need to provide for myself to make those moments feel less difficult? Yeah, that's been, it's definitely been a challenge.
Her Motherhood Timeline
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Taryn Zweygardt: So tell me your timeline. How. Older your kids, at what point did you get diagnosed with A [00:12:00] DHD? Yeah, so, so my personal motherhood journey, so my husband and I got married when I was 25. We got married in June and I found out I was pregnant in November. So we got pregnant very quickly right away.
Audra Dinell: Yep.
Taryn Zweygardt: My husband is also six years older than me, so he was like rearing and like ready to have kids.
And because I had this belief that like. Well, this is just the next phase in life. Like this is what we're supposed to do. We got married, now we're supposed to have kids. And also, oh, having kids will complete me. Right? Like it will make me feel like, it will make me feel like we, everything is, you know, falling into place.
So, we had our first daughter in August of 2016. And when my daughter was five months old, I found out I was pregnant again.
Audra Dinell: Oh my
Taryn Zweygardt: gosh. That was not planned or expected. What happens in Vegas does not stay in Vegas, and we learned that the hard way. And so then we welcomed our second child, Rhett in October of 2017.
And so my first two kiddos are like 14 months apart. Wow. [00:13:00] Talk about a whirlwind. That was probably one of the hardest seasons of motherhood for sure. Looking back on it now, it's crazy. The other night I'm a very, like sentimental, nostalgic person and my grandmother's birthday's coming up. And so I was like looking back on some photos in my phone and I was coming across photos of myself and with the kids when they were younger.
And I felt sad for myself because I just remember how hard that season was. And I wasn't to this point yet where I was giving myself grace or like letting go of like those perfectionist. Tendencies and I was just thinking that I was failing and you know, how the heck am I supposed to do this? And that was really difficult.
And that's also through that experience is why I do what I do now, because I had my master's degree, I was working in mental health. I even hold my ob GYN, that I was struggling. And it didn't feel like I was given adequate options for support. [00:14:00] And that really bothered me because if. Me, a person who is well educated and asked for help was struggling and couldn't find help.
What does that mean about other people?
Audra Dinell: Mm.
Taryn Zweygardt: People that don't know that it's, it's common for their, these types of struggles to be happening. So I really started diving in and like learning more about like perinatal mental health and what that was. And so my third son we had him a couple years later when my youngest was three, my oldest was four.
So we took some time and some space that pregnancy and postpartum experience was so drastically different because I had a little bit more grace, a little bit more knowledge. I kept taking medication during pregnancy postpartum, like I just knew better. And, and I didn't shame myself. I allowed myself to do what I needed to do and how drastically different that was.
So now currently my kiddos are four, eight, and nine. And they keep me so busy. It's [00:15:00] sports season and me and my husband are like ships passing in the night. Most nights somebody's taking somebody to practice and somebody else is going to a different practice. So
Audra Dinell: and so when it's a crazy
Taryn Zweygardt: time,
Audra Dinell: your when, during the point of your.
Motherhood journey. Did you get diagnosed in between your second and third?
Taryn Zweygardt: Actually it wasn't until after my third, like probably a year. I think he was probably like a year old. So I only just got diagnosed like in the last four years I think. So it's pretty recent. Yeah. Like, I started taking medication for ADHD and that was like really, honestly life changing.
I remember taking medication for the first time and I was talking to my best friend and I was like, is this what a normal person's brain feels like? I don't have a million thoughts swirling around in there at once. So yeah. So it's still pretty, pretty new. But yeah, it was after all I had all of my kids and I was trying to navigate all of that until I got a diagnosis.
So. And
Audra Dinell: I know that's so common. Yeah. Because I got my diagnosis I think at 37 or 38. Yeah, I think 38. So two [00:16:00] years ago post kids, post business, which we'll talk about in a minute. But I just think motherhood for me has been such a beautiful mirror.
Taryn Zweygardt: Mm-hmm.
Audra Dinell: Beautiful. And like fragile, like both ends of the stick.
Yeah. It just shows me like the best in myself and it also illuminates. My weaknesses and everything in between.
Taryn Zweygardt: Yeah.
Audra Dinell: I would not say neurodivergency is a weakness. Right. But it definitely came through the mirror. Mirror during motherhood.
Taryn Zweygardt: Yeah, for sure.
Audra Dinell: It's like I don't think I would have been able to be fully myself without becoming a mom, even though our journey's much different.
Mm-hmm. My husband and I met in high school. We got married in our mid twenties. I don't think having kids was very important to us. Mm-hmm. And then one day it just switched and we decided, okay, yeah, we definitely wanna become parents. Yeah. And like now, and we talked about it, but it wasn't like the drive or the desire.
[00:17:00] Right?
Taryn Zweygardt: Yeah.
Audra Dinell: I think we waited six years,
Taryn Zweygardt: yeah.
Audra Dinell: After being married. And we were together 10 years before we got married. So we waited a long time before we had kids in the course of our relationship.
Taryn Zweygardt: But honestly, like, I feel like that is the best way. Like, and I may be like a, I, I may be somebody who has a different view on this based on my personal experience and also based on like what I hear every single day in my office.
The Pond Rock Metaphor
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Taryn Zweygardt: But I think there is an under what's the word we don't talk about enough? The impact of parenting on us and you know, the costs and the benefits.
Audra Dinell: Yeah.
Taryn Zweygardt: And so I really do think, like society sometimes tries to sell us this idea that like what success looks like is, oh yeah, you get married. Then the next thing you're supposed to do is have kids.
Mm-hmm. And then like, oh, also, and you need to like have, buy a house and all of those things. And [00:18:00] you know, if I know anything, it's that the world is not black and white like that. There is so much gray in between and there is a cost when we just like sort of follow that timeline that's been sold to us and not actually like pause and ask ourself like.
But what is it that I really want? Yeah. And like what's going on in my life that I need to like work on myself before maybe I take on this next season of life or this, you know, the next step I have this like analogy or this imagery that I share with clients. And I think this sort of, you know, illuminates what is parenthood And it's, you know, imagine a pond and it's calm and there's no wind, and the pond is clear and you can see down to the bottom right.
That's your life before you enter into parenthood. And then parenthood is like, so then you like pick up a rock on the side of the pond and you throw it in and all of the shit that's settled at the bottom of the pond, like is now rising to the [00:19:00] surface.
Audra Dinell: Oh my gosh. That's it.
Taryn Zweygardt: And that is what happens. And so.
If you are somebody like me or like, you know, the majority of us who maybe has like shoved some stuff down or not thinked about, or not thought about, like how certain things have impacted you you might be a little surprised by the things that come up in your own parenting journey.
Audra Dinell: Okay. And then navigating that within a marriage,
Taryn Zweygardt: right?
Audra Dinell: Because both my husband and I had. Done therapy before becoming kids. Like we, I feel like we were both, you know, very interested in working on ourselves, but I couldn't have seen what was deep, deep down there. Mm-hmm. Without motherhood bringing that up. I'm not saying that's for everyone, but that's my personal experience.
Yeah. And then. Realizing how much our families of origin and the way they function for decades and decades and decades, generations back, like long before we ever knew were impacting us. Mm-hmm. And how we showed up in the world and our [00:20:00] marriage and our thoughts about parenting.
Taryn Zweygardt: Yeah.
Audra Dinell: That's just a wild,
Taryn Zweygardt: yeah.
Audra Dinell: Wild ride if you choose to be like. We're gonna look at this. Mm-hmm. Like, we're gonna, we're gonna keep pulling the layers back and we're gonna look at this. We're not gonna
Taryn Zweygardt: Yeah.
Audra Dinell: Keep it at the bottom of the pond. We're gonna try and clean this pond out.
Taryn Zweygardt: Yeah. And it is like an act. I mean, like, it is a conscious effort to try and do things differently because, you know, we, we tend to parent to the way that we were parented.
Unless we decide like, Hey, you know, like that doesn't really feel good for me, or I wanna do things differently. But like the learning of how to do things differently, like that takes effort and that takes time. And it's not easy because I think we tend to sort of like fall back into what feels natural or what, you know, we're accustomed to.
And so it is like an ongoing process.
Choosing Your Parenting Path
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Audra Dinell: Well, and you have to have real agency over that process.
Taryn Zweygardt: Yeah.
Audra Dinell: How are you going to get educated? Where are you going to learn? You know, there's social media mm-hmm. And books [00:21:00] and therapy and the way friends, parent, there's so many things to look at. Yeah. And observe different ways of parenting, but not all of them, you know, are right for us.
Yeah. And so I feel like that's a whole nother thing too, if you're going to choose to break chains to do things differently.
Taryn Zweygardt: Mm-hmm.
Audra Dinell: You have to have real ownership of that journey because there is also no. Guide. Yeah. There's like a hundred guides.
Taryn Zweygardt: Right, right.
Audra Dinell: But you have to figure it out. You have to write your own book.
Taryn Zweygardt: Yeah. I, and I have done a podcast episode on like social media in today, in day, today's day and age with parenting. Because. I think we, we, it's an advantage and also a disadvantage that we have access to so much information that one, a lot of times it can feel really overwhelming and sometimes it can bring up some feelings of like shame or guilt, because what do you mean if I do it this way?
That it's gonna cause my child? Childhood [00:22:00] trauma that they're gonna have to go to therapy for or whatever. Right, right. Like whatever Instagram reel or TikTok that you see that comes across your page and then you're like, wait a second. I literally did that yesterday with my kid. And so it's like, it's about finding and choosing what works for you and for your family.
And again, realizing like. If there was one way to parent, they would send us home with a manual Right. At the hospital. Right. And and they don't do that. Yeah. So like you and your, your partner, you have to choose to parent in a way that feels best for you. And I think that also depends on things like if you have a diagnosis like a DHD, like you have to figure out what the things that you need to do for yourself to help.
You know, for me it's like my mornings run smoother or bedtime run smoother or all of the things. And so. Yeah, it can be really overwhelming, just the access to information.
Audra Dinell: I agree.
Trust Your Parenting Gut
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Audra Dinell: I often have to just shut it out. Yeah. And try to look in my own life, like you said. Mm-hmm. And figure out what works for us, regardless of what my [00:23:00] parents think.
Yeah. Or this Instagram person says, or what the other moms at school are doing, because it's like I have to just trust myself. Like I'm in my family, I know my family best. Mm-hmm. But it is hard to tune down the noise at times,
Taryn Zweygardt: for sure.
ADHD Meets Business
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Audra Dinell: Okay, so I want to jump to entrepreneurship because after you got diagnosed with A DHD, then you decided to start a business.
Taryn Zweygardt: Yeah, actually. So I had started flourish. So the collective that I co-own and then like a year into it is when I got diagnosed. Okay. Yeah, because actually the medication provider that was with Flourish is the one who gave me my diagnosis and was like, you probably have been struggling with this your whole life.
And, but now motherhood has really illuminated it because you have all of these balls in the air and it's becoming more difficult to juggle. So, yeah, that has been also a huge learning experience. And I'm still learning, like even [00:24:00] today, before we hopped on here too, I was telling you just like the overwhelm of juggling all the balls and you know, with this like perfectionist tendency, and then also with my A DHD, I have this lovely like, ization that comes sometimes from the overwhelm and giving myself permission to offload some of that can be really difficult at times because. Again, I'm like, oh, I just have to do it all and I know I can do it. And sure, maybe like 10 years ago I could do it all, but now my capacity is much different.
And so really learning to just share some of that with other people.
Capacity And Boundaries
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Audra Dinell: Yeah, I think the capacity thing is very interesting because I have struggled a lot with that. Just sort of like the confusion at, wait a minute. Who am I? Why is this different? And I'm not surprised at all to hear that. It was like motherhood and then entrepreneurship and then it's like, boom, diagnosis, uhhuh.
Yeah. That was my story too. [00:25:00] Yeah. Because it's like I could handle my life prior to motherhood and was very organized. Mm. I mean like extremely organized. That was one of the ways I was able to move through the world, was being very, very organized. Yeah. And then, you know, you have a couple of kids and they're real humans who you don't control.
Yeah. You know, and. To manage all of the things that come with parenthood. And even if you have like a wonderful partner who co-managers it with you. Mm-hmm. It's still a lot.
Taryn Zweygardt: It is a lot.
Audra Dinell: And then you're like, I'm gonna start my own business so that there is actually no structure. I have to create all this structure.
Taryn Zweygardt: Yeah.
Audra Dinell: And the capacity stretch is real. And it just confused me for a very long time of like, why is this so hard right now? Yeah. I used to be able to. Do this or do that. And just like the grace I've had to give myself and the knows I've had to say that. Mm-hmm. Some people don't [00:26:00] understand and frankly
Taryn Zweygardt: Yeah.
Audra Dinell: Feel offended by
Taryn Zweygardt: Yeah.
Audra Dinell: But it's like I have to trust myself that I know my capacity. I'm gonna try really hard to stay within it so that I can stretch to like go after my dreams. Mm-hmm. Or give my. Kid who's struggling extra support or
Taryn Zweygardt: Yeah.
Audra Dinell: Whatever that may be.
Taryn Zweygardt: Yeah.
Hell Yes Or No
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Taryn Zweygardt: You know, I, I feel like maybe I said this whenever we were talking about this in one of the thread workshops.
But I went to a conference years ago with, it was the Rachel Hollis conference. Yeah. And Dave actually rest his soul. Is the one that said this on stage. And like I always try to think about this and I've tried to be really intentional about it, especially this last year of like, if it's not a hell yes, then it's a hell no.
Mm-hmm. And I think, you know, thinking about the things that I'm doing and really asking myself like, why am I doing this? Mm-hmm. Am I doing this because like. [00:27:00] Another business owner does this and I feel like I need to be doing this, or am I doing this because I actually want to, and I enjoy doing it. And I think that has been really eyeopening for me.
And maybe like, why, you know, six months ago I probably would be putting so much pressure on myself about the social media thing of like not posting for weeks because. Isn't that what I'm supposed to be doing? 'cause I'm a business owner.
Audra Dinell: Yeah.
Taryn Zweygardt: But now I'm like, I don't really care. Like my business is thriving, like, and I'm very thankful for that.
And the people who know me know what I do and you know, my clients know how to find me. Mm-hmm. And so. Why put that pressure on myself to do something if I don't have the capacity, simply because it's what I'm supposed to be doing.
Audra Dinell: Yeah.
Taryn Zweygardt: And so just really like practicing that pause and asking myself, is this really something I wanna be doing, or am I just feeling like some external pressure of.
This is what I'm supposed to be doing based on, you [00:28:00] know, whatever metric that day I'm basing myself on.
Audra Dinell: Well, and to that point, there's someone, somewhere, some expert who's saying, do it this way. Mm-hmm. Do it white. And then there's somewhere an expert who's saying, do it black. Ah-huh. You know, so it's impossible to do it, quote.
Right, right. Yeah. Because there is no way to do it. Right. You have to figure out. What works for you and your business. Mm-hmm. And what moves the needle and what's in your skillset and what can be outsourced.
Taryn Zweygardt: Yeah. Yeah.
Audra Dinell: But it, it's definitely a lot of balls to juggle, especially when you are also a parent.
Taryn Zweygardt: Mm-hmm.
Mental Load Reality
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Audra Dinell: That makes me think about the mental load that you mentioned earlier.
Taryn Zweygardt: Mm-hmm.
Audra Dinell: When you became a parent, you realized how much your mental load increased. And that's also something I feel like. I wasn't fully aware of and I don't think anyone really can be. Yeah. Before I actually became a mom, [00:29:00] because I liked the mental load I had when it was just my husband and I.
Taryn Zweygardt: Yeah.
Audra Dinell: I liked being the finance person and the calendar manager and the organizer of the home. And then it just doubles and triples and quadruples Right. With the kids and the business, and it just becomes too much. So I'm curious in your practice. What do you wish more mothers actually understood about their own mental and emotional loads?
Taryn Zweygardt: Mm, yeah.
Asking For Direct Help
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Taryn Zweygardt: So one thing that I see often is explaining the mental load to our partners can be really difficult because I know it's, it's no surprise or it shouldn't be a surprise to many that. Men and women's brains work drastically different. So the things that I prioritize, it's not going to be number one priority on my husband's to-do list.
And that's important to know because then comes in this [00:30:00] idea of like, if I'm feeling overwhelmed, if there are too many balls that I'm juggling, I have to figure out how to ask for help. And I will be the first to say it is very hard for me at times to ask for help because. What does it mean that I can't do it all?
What does that mean about me? Right? Like that story's not true, but if that is something that we have had ingrained in us for so long. We might be like questioning ourself in, in regards to what does it mean that I have to ask for help or that I can't carry this all anymore?
Audra Dinell: Mm-hmm.
Taryn Zweygardt: And so you do have to be good at asking for help.
And as like small and simple as it seems, it can be really difficult for people. And asking for help means asking for direct. That's also something that I see a lot of people struggling with. It's not enough to just tell your partner that you're feeling overwhelmed or that there's too much on your plate.
Like you really have to think about the specific things that you need help with. And so like that could look like, [00:31:00] Hey, can you pick up the kids from daycare on Tuesdays and Thursdays? So I can stay an hour late at work to finish up some stuff.
Audra Dinell: Yeah.
Taryn Zweygardt: Or can you be in charge of cooking dinner two nights a week?
So it's off my mental load. And what does that look like? Right? That means planning what we're eating, going to the grocery store, actually getting the things like taking it fully off of my plate. And. Again, all of that takes work and time and the realization that like, it's not as simple again as just saying like, I'm overwhelmed and I don't know what to do.
Audra Dinell: Yeah.
Taryn Zweygardt: And that can be really difficult for some people.
Sharing The Invisible Work
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Audra Dinell: Well, and I think sometimes those details matter. Yeah. So cooking dinner on Monday and Tuesday nights that. Isn't always enough. Right. It's plan what the meal is.
Taryn Zweygardt: Mm-hmm.
Audra Dinell: Make sure we have the ingredients or include them in the cart.
Taryn Zweygardt: Yeah.
Audra Dinell: If one of us is going to the grocery store over the weekend
Taryn Zweygardt: Yeah.
Audra Dinell: And then getting home, making the meal, cleaning the [00:32:00] dishes, or, you know, however you work that out. Mm-hmm. But I find that those, those details are so important.
Taryn Zweygardt: Yeah.
Audra Dinell: When we're trying to share. Our loads and delegate, whether that be to our partners or our kids, or our team members. Mm-hmm. My kids are at the ages where they're starting to do chores.
Yeah. They're seven and nine. It's going well this week. And you know, we're talking about, well, what does that mean? My son cleaned half of the windows in the house over the weekend and he was like, why did I only get half of my chore money for this? And I was like, well, there's also these, these, these and these.
So it's just like the. The details
Taryn Zweygardt: mm-hmm.
Audra Dinell: Matter. But we keep so much of that in our brains and think that everyone else sees the same things that we do. Yeah. But they, they don't always, and it's not their fault. They just have not been like, trained
Taryn Zweygardt: Yeah.
Audra Dinell: To see them.
Taryn Zweygardt: Yeah. And you know, I'm gonna do it. I don't mean to like stand on my like.
Patriarchal lens of things, but it's like very hard to [00:33:00] do that. But I do think that like we still sometimes live in this society where like women are seen as like the person that's supposed to hold the majority of the mental load. And so like that's also like an important. Conversation to happen between couples.
I would say we need to be having this conversation before we're even thinking about having kids. Mm. Shoot before he even puts a ring on it. Like, let's have this conversation of what does it look like to share the load of life. Of life just in general. Because even if you don't have kids, like life is a lot.
And it's a lot for one person. To carry the majority of the mental load and the other person sort of to just be coasting by. And so again, because men and women's brains think different and prioritize differently, we do have to have those conversations. And you know, I encourage a lot of my couples just to have like a weekly, like, Hey, let's sit down and like, let's look at the week, what's coming up.
Mm-hmm. You know, who has practice, what appointments do we have [00:34:00] and, and who's doing what. So that it doesn't feel so overwhelming or that it's just like sort of falling back on the
Audra Dinell: woman in the relationship to carry the majority of that mental load.
Fair Play In Practice
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Audra Dinell: Yeah, I really like Eve Brodsky's Fairplay system.
Taryn Zweygardt: Yes.
Yeah.
Audra Dinell: And I had tried many times and my husband, he, he is a great partner. He takes care of all of like the safety measures. Like, I'm not gonna lie, I don't really think about like, am I safe? And he's like, you know, the person who's like, okay, we've got this, this,
Taryn Zweygardt: yeah.
Audra Dinell: He does all the food things. He takes care of all the outside things.
Yeah. He helps our family members more than I do. Mm-hmm. If they need something, he's the one who's gonna be there doing it for our external family members. So I feel like I'm married a very equal partner.
Taryn Zweygardt: Mm-hmm.
Audra Dinell: And explaining the mental and emotional lotus, especially when it comes to parenting and for me, teaching little boys.
Taryn Zweygardt: Mm-hmm.
Audra Dinell: Emotional maturity or just being with them to regulate things like that.
Taryn Zweygardt: Yeah. Yeah.
Audra Dinell: [00:35:00] I put together this huge spreadsheet. We tried the fair play cards over the years and it never really stuck. Mm-hmm. And so one time on a plane ride home, I got outta Google Doc and I was like, okay. I'm just gonna put down all the steps it takes to run our life.
Mm-hmm. And we had different tabs. Like these are the home tabs, these are the kid tabs, these are the food tabs, these are the holiday tabs. Oh
Taryn Zweygardt: gosh. Yeah. Holidays.
Audra Dinell: Right. And we sat down and I, and I think that was really the first time that I feel like I saw a shift in understanding, or I felt a shift in understanding.
Mm-hmm. And, and shared load on a new level. Yeah. 'cause it was like, this is all the, this is all that it takes just to. Exist the way we're existing if we want to exist on a different level with our home or. Being more thoughtful with thank you notes. Mm-hmm. Things like that. Then we have to add even more things.
Taryn Zweygardt: Yeah.
Audra Dinell: And just putting it all down on paper was just so eyeopening, I think, for both of us.
Taryn Zweygardt: Mm-hmm. Yeah. And I think that is sort of like, was [00:36:00] her, her, her hope with the cards, you know? And I've had people do that in my office too, like, you know, it's not a competition. But like, isn't it eye-opening when you're looking at the stacks compared to one another and you have the majority of the cards in your pile and your partner has none?
Because then if we were to look at each of those cards individually, I guarantee that you could redistribute some of that.
Audra Dinell: Yeah.
Taryn Zweygardt: But the other thing is it's probably just, well, this is the way it's always been and this has always been my role. And so again, you have to get comfortable. Allowing yourself to ask for help and not feeling like, well, I've just been doing it, so I'll just continue to do it.
It's like, no, it's okay to have help. It's okay for your partner to take some of this off of your plate. But again, you have to have those conversations and you have to know what are some of those things that you can offload to your partner. Yeah. And it's okay to let some things drop, right? Yeah, for sure.
Yeah.
Glass Vs Plastic Balls
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Taryn Zweygardt: You know, I love like little analogies or whatever, but another one that I use a lot too is. We're always [00:37:00] juggling so many balls. Some of the balls are plastic and some of the balls are glass. I tend to think of like the glass balls as like our mental health, our, you know, our physical health. Also like our close relationships, so like our partner and our kids, our job.
Right. And then some of the other ones are plastic. So like if by chance we were to drop that plastic ball, let's say it's like. I don't know. Eating healthy, not not eating fast food, right? Like Yeah. Ideally we would like to eat healthy, but if it's easier sometimes to like, skip going to the grocery store this week 'cause we're busy and like eat fast food, that ball will bounce because it's plastic.
Mm. But like, if I neglect my mental health or if I neglect, you know, going to work or if I neglect my partner. Those balls are glass and it's gonna take a lot more work to repair and get that ball back in order and kind of back in the rotation. And so again, it's okay to let some of those balls drop.
Sometimes it's not the end of the world. Yeah. They'll bounce back [00:38:00] up and we'll get 'em back in the rotation, but really focusing on those more important glass balls.
Audra Dinell: Yeah. I love that analogy too. Yeah.
Standards For This Season
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Taryn Zweygardt: And then I think it.
Audra Dinell: Leads to the, the point in the conversation where you can talk about standards, right?
Mm-hmm. Where, you know, maybe one partner loves the dishes, put away clean kitchen, reset home every night before bed so that they can wake up to a fresh house. Mm-hmm. Actually, maybe both partners actually really like that, but you're in a season where. That has to have a little bit lower of a standard.
Yeah. Of we're not gonna leave dishes in the sink for more than 24 hours. Yeah. Or you know, something like that. I just think standards can shift as our seasons change. Mm-hmm. And having conversations about our mental and emotional load can help us examine our own standards. Yeah. And if they're realistic or doable or important enough to make a priority.
In this season, or if we can let ourself off the hook for a little [00:39:00] bit For sure. And let our grass grow. Yeah. Slightly longer than we would normally do.
Taryn Zweygardt: Yeah, for sure.
Closing Advice And Where To Find Her
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Audra Dinell: Okay, so as we wrap up this conversation, what advice would you give to women who are holding this beautiful, worthy tension of motherhood, ambition, womanhood?
Taryn Zweygardt: Hmm. I guess I would say if it feels hard. There's nothing wrong with you and you're not broken. It feels hard because it is hard. It's a lot to balance. And I would just encourage them to really just ask themselves what do I need? You know, encourage them to ask for help if things feel overwhelming and give themselves some grace.
Because we're all learning as we, we go and nobody knows what the heck they're doing, so it's okay. Yeah. Just, you know, take it one day at a time. Thank you so much for this conversation. Yeah. Where can our listeners find you? Okay, so you can find me.
I have a [00:40:00] website. It's tz therapy.com. I'm also sometimes on Instagram the same, it's TZ therapy. And then flourish. My collective, our website is flourish i ct.com and we are also on Instagram as well.
Audra Dinell: Awesome. Yeah.
Taryn Zweygardt: Thank you,
Audra Dinell: Taryn.
Taryn Zweygardt: Of course. Thank you.
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