Subscribe
Share
Share
Embed
Two deranged lawyers talking about our deranged obsessions.
Raven Sinner (00:01)
Thanks for watching!
Raven (00:26)
derangers. Welcome back to Deranged De Jure. We are your hosts, Raven and...
Pisha (00:34)
Hello America, I am Pisha.
Raven (00:36)
Yes, yes you are. And we are two deranged lawyers. We are covering our deranged obsessions that we are sharing with you tonight. So first of all, if you are watching this, you may be wondering why Pisha is wearing sunglasses. Why his looks?
Pisha (00:53)
Why she looks this way. Well, well, to put it briefly, I am having a little bit of a menty B and just a little bit. And, I want to point out for the record that I've not only remembered to take my medication today, but I've, I've pulled out the big guns, the heavy artillery is out. I'm operating at like half speed right now. So this.
Raven (01:06)
a little bit.
Yeah.
Pisha (01:23)
This is all because of a bad review we got. So.
Raven (01:26)
Yes, yeah, we decided we needed to take all of the meds instead of, you know, we forgot to take them apparently, according to this review.
Pisha (01:35)
Yeah, yeah, we were, we were accused of not taking our pills. So I wanted to prove that's what we are like on our pills. This is what we're like when we're on all the pills, all the pills. And so I'm going to read the review because we, we've been arguing about, not really arguing. It's been fun trying to like speculate who it is. Yeah. So,
Raven (01:46)
You choose, you choose listeners. Yes, please do.
deciphering. We're deciphering who it is. Yeah.
Pisha (02:05)
Here we go. Ready? It says, terrible one star. This is possibly one of the most seethingly negative full of lies podcast in history. We did it. We made history. Okay. I am deeply embarrassed for this host. They obviously forgot to take their pills.
Raven (02:06)
I'm ready.
Full of lies.
We're historical!
Pisha (02:35)
So, so as there's some misspellings and the handle is it wasn't me, sir. 45. And this was posted. Yeah. Yeah. Posted shortly after our Waco episode. And so I was speculating that it was a bot because like that's all the red flags of a bot. And then it could, yeah. And then I got thinking about it and I was like,
Raven (02:45)
Shaggy.
It sounds like one.
Pisha (03:05)
Well, it couldn't possibly be any of our family because that's a bullshit, chicken shit way of showing support.
Raven (03:10)
Well, I kind of think it might be someone from my family, I'm not gonna lie.
Pisha (03:16)
Yeah, I know, but I'm, you know, I'm just trying to make a point that that's not what family, I mean, family values. They are all about talking shit and leaving shitty reviews on their family's podcasts. So anyways, but I want to point out that I literally cannot tell the difference between a bot and a Trump supporter anymore because they are equally without human thought. And so.
Raven (03:18)
We're not naming names. Don't get it.
You
This is correct. Yes.
Pisha (03:41)
So yeah, so we also speculated that it was Casey Anthony because we've talked shit about her multiple times. We've also speculated that it's our boy Putin. Putin, this is full of lies podcast, full of lies. These hosts should be embarrassed. Seethingly negative, full of lies podcast in all of history of mother Russia.
Raven (03:46)
Yes.
yes, yes. Mm -hmm.
Seedingly, seedingly.
Pisha (04:09)
Yeah, so anyways, Putin, I got your number, bro. I know you scared. Tuck tail, run, boy. That's right.
Raven (04:10)
That's it. Yeah. Listen, we're not turning down. We're not turning down. We're going to turn up for what? Anyway. Sorry about that.
Pisha (04:18)
That's right.
Sorry, I almost spit out my drink. Okay, go ahead. No, that's fine. So that was our bad review. That's, that's, and by the way, by the way, I don't want to give any power to the bad reviewer. The menti B is 100 % unrelated to the review.
Raven (04:29)
Yeah, so here's why it's important.
Well, listen, you are about a week away from your wedding, so I feel like you are fully entitled to have all of the minty bees that you need and want. And I'm here and I'm supporting it, and I might have one with you, just in solidarity.
Pisha (04:41)
Yeah, yeah.
Yeah, and we just. Yep. Yay, collective menti bees. You get a menti bee, you get a menti bee, you get a menti bee. OK, anyways, this is me half speed everyone.
Raven (05:00)
Yeah.
See, this is what they want is maybe on half of the meds. So yeah.
Pisha (05:04)
Ahem.
Yeah, yeah, maybe not all of them. Earlier I was wondering if someone could get a Best Actor award for a Planet of the Apes movie because if you believe the pain in the eyes of the monkey, like, that's not the actor. Like, it's a computer. Okay, we can cut all of this out. I'm so sorry. Go on.
Raven (05:25)
That's true. That's a good point. I never thought about this. No, no, no, no, no, we are not cutting any of this out. We are going to give a couple of updates though. So there's been a few things that have happened in the media recently that very much have to do with things that we've talked about. So I feel like we should probably cover those. Number one, and this has like been driving me up the wall the past like week or so, although I'm like, I'm equally disturbed as I am encouraged by...
what happened and with the response. So Bumble, which we talked about during our dating app episode, if you haven't listened to it, you probably should. I think it's probably one of our more popular episodes actually, because everyone loves like a good hateful dating story. So they love it. They do. And we give the people what they love and Bumble does not, it turns out. So Bumble.
Pisha (06:10)
yeah, yeah, sip that tea, it's so, so sweet. yeah.
Raven (06:23)
Bumble recently has taken a far left turn, a far right turn? I don't know, either way. They lost their CEO, who was the one who was in charge of making this. I don't want to go too far into it, but she used to be a part of the whole Tinder group. And then she left from them and created Bumble in order to create a woman -friendly app.
And so that's what Bumble was supposed to be. And pretty much every woman on Bumble was like, this sucks. And so then she ended up leaving and Bumble changed its whole formula. And so now instead of like having the woman talk first, now it's not that way. And they decided, whoever, I don't know who created this like marketing scheme, but it was
Bumble said that a vow of celibacy is not the answer. And obviously these are targeted towards women and they are targeted because women are not putting out to the men on these apps. I think it's, you know, we even covered it.
there are more men on the apps now than there are women. And it's because of the pornographic of these apps and how men see it as the door dash of getting sex instead of choosing...
Pisha (07:50)
Yeah, not relationships and connection and bond. It's all about sex and physical connection.
Raven (07:54)
Right. Exactly. And so like women have had enough. And so they like they've gotten off of the apps. And so Bumble's genius like way of getting them back on the apps was to shame them, gaslight them into doing the thing that we they all that we've all known this entire time was like the whole prerogative of Bumble.
But no one was saying and so now now that door is open. They issued an apology which was bullshit and And like and tried to make like this token donation to like a domestic violence organization and said like and we're gonna also like donate our billboard space to like that that Domestic violence thing and it's like but you're still not fucking getting the point. You're not listening to women You're not listening to the fact that women are so frustrated
with the way that men are treating them on these apps and you're doing nothing about it. Like, you know, they're not doing anything about the men who are being reported. They're not doing anything to, you know, make sure that women are safe on these dates. Like, they're not doing anything. Instead, they're just saying like, anyway, just come back to us, please, because we need you. We need your value is like in giving sex to these men and being treated like trash.
And so anyway, that happened this week. And there was a couple other things that happened. Anything you want to talk about, Pisha?
Pisha (09:28)
Yeah, I guess. So a tiny kicking man who plays less than six seconds of, wait minutes, six minutes of the most boring part of football, thought of himself as like the most important person in the world. And here's.
Raven (09:41)
minutes, it doesn't matter.
Pisha (09:51)
Here's one of the quotes from his 20 minute long commencement speech at a Catholic college. It is you, the women, who have had the most diabolic lies told to you. Some of you may go on to lead successful careers in the world, but I would venture to guess that the majority of you are most excited about your marriage and the children you will bring into this world. So fucking gross. This is why.
Raven (10:16)
Gross, gross. Two of a room full of women graduates from college.
Pisha (10:22)
graduating women. Yeah. And yeah, and this is why we choose the bear. The bear would not give us a commencement speech mansplaining the true value of women to us. And I just, you know, I want to read that, but like, but with a different demographic, ready? It is you, the black people.
Raven (10:38)
Right.
Mm -hmm, okay.
Pisha (10:49)
who have had the most diabolic lies told to you. Some of you may go on to lead successful careers in the world, but I would venture to guess that the majority of you are most excited about your chance to play pro football.
Raven (11:02)
Ooh, yeah, good point.
Pisha (11:04)
Ouch, like that, if that wouldn't work, like you don't get to do it this way either. Like it's just, you don't get to single out a demographic and tell them what their value is. As a white man, especially a short, weenie, gross, over -makeuped.
Raven (11:10)
No, completely not. I know what I...
Exactly. Ugh.
Short dick man. Let's get back to the 90s. That is why we choose to bear. Yeah. Yeah. So we've had a lot of misogynistic things happening this week. But, you know, we want to get back to the story at hand because we were just starting to get into the goods on the Delphi murders. And that's where we're getting back into today. So.
Pisha (11:25)
Anyways, so that's why we choose the bear. We choose the bear.
Raven (11:51)
Before we get into it, I just wanted to make this disclaimer because I went back and I kind of thought about this a little bit and it's with everything with true crime, right? I don't want there ever to be the impression that we are trying to glorify or anything like
So we are not trying to trivialize or sensationalize the death of two little girls.
it's to the contrary, it's because we care so much about what happens in the world and what happens to women in the world especially that we are choosing to cover this. And so also, as a criminal defense lawyer, this story stuck out to me because it is so crazy how they got to this guy who's the criminal defendant in this case when there's a very real, tangible...
alternative story out there. So anyway, I just wanted to lay that out there before we get back into this. Like, you know, I, we're going to get into some of like the grisly details and I don't like doing that generally, but you know, but I do want, you know, people to know that like we very much feel for the victims in this case and the victim's families.
is, you know, this is about like just trying to grapple with the difficulties that, you know, that women in general deal with and especially young girls. So, you know, if the wrong person is in jail waiting for trial, that's a double injustice, right? Like, so if Richard Allen is actually innocent, that's a problem for him who's like spent a good portion of his time.
facing a good deal of harassment and abuse. And it's also problematic for the family, right? Because there's still someone out there, there's still people out there, in my opinion, who are responsible for this, who are not facing justice. So anyway, that's my little spiel. Getting back into it, the last that we left off with was that we got into the first few pages of the Frank's motion, which is that motion.
dealing with the search warrant affidavit and probable cause. And defense counsel in this case is putting forward a case that there's an Odinist cult who killed Abby and Libby and that Richard Allen has been harassed and abused by corrections officers in prison who are members of this Odinist cult. So, yeah, that's a good place to lay bot upon, right? Like, I mean...
Pisha (14:18)
Yeah, yeah, that's quite the cliffhanger.
Raven (14:23)
It is, yeah, and you know, somewhat purposefully. But in any case, there is one quick correction that I have to make. I did say during the last time that there were no, like there were not a lot of like leads in this case. There were a lot of leads. But it's just that there weren't any actual criminal defenses. Like no one was charged until Richard Allen was charged. So.
And also one more quick caveat before we get into this. I am not going to be naming any names in this. These names are put out there in this motion that you can look up it as public. But I just don't feel like this is the time and the place to be doing that. I don't want anybody to be facing any undue harassment or anything like this. This is just a matter of putting out there what could be the truth, but we don't.
actually have any facts of that until anybody is formally charged. So we've been a little creative in the process and put different names in for different suspects that you may recognize their names, but that's not actually who I'm talking about. So anyway, I did. I did have fun. I sure did. Yeah. So anyway.
Pisha (15:36)
You had fun, just admit it. You had a great time coming up with names for these folks. You're like a proud little puppy.
Raven (15:44)
Yeah, yeah, that's exactly right. I am. So, yeah, so, but before we get into the who and the why and all of that, we did talk about like in the last podcast, the crime scene and why we thought that like one person might not be responsible and also why we thought that there might be an Odinist cult who might be responsible. So,
Pisha (15:47)
This
Raven (16:13)
And we talked about it being grisly. So this is the time where I'm gonna give a little bit of a trigger warning, and especially for people who are sensitive to some of the more grisly details of murders and things like that. But I think it's important, because I think it's important that we try and figure out what actually happened to these girls. So we talked about these being very closely,
linked to some odinistic rights, right? Like we said, rights like a sacrificial right, not like a constitutional right. But so I'm going to give a little bit of the details of that. There were some specific runes that were left at the crime scene that were formed with sticks and with tree branches and also using the victim's blood. So talking about Libby first.
Libby's body was laid flat on her back. She was naked. Her arms were stretched above her head. Her hands were covered in blood with spots and drippings all over her body. Her right arm was placed along her side. One tree branch on her left shoulder extending above her head. So this is a long tree branch like between like above her head and below her feet. And there were two smaller branches as well who like kind of formed like a V shape.
down towards her pelvis and extending towards her head. Her neck was
and it was covered by the fourth branch. No blood was on the leaves or the trees near her head, which indicates that she was likely dragged to her final resting place. It wasn't like she was killed there and then they just put branches over her.
Pisha (18:01)
Right, there would be way too much blood from those types of injuries left behind, so she was probably killed somewhere else and like you said, dragged over.
Raven (18:08)
Exactly. Right, and I think like what the defense is trying to get at here is that they don't think that this, where the bodies were laid was actually where they were murdered because there's not enough blood anywhere near the area, at least from what they know that this could have been the case. So Abby, on the other hand, was placed a few feet away. Both of their heads were placed near each other.
And from the motion, I wasn't really clear if that meant that they were decapitated, but I don't think that's the case. Like I didn't quite get
Abby's body was found also on her back, but she was clothed. And her elbows were bent to place both of her hands kind of like near her face on either side. And her left leg was held straight and her right leg was bent at the knee and her.
and was placed underneath her left leg. So kind of like if you're in yoga, like the tree kind of stance.
Pisha (19:08)
Yeah, okay, that's weird. That's a really weird position to have a body in. Yeah, it would have intent, like you said, like it's so specific. It has to intentionally be placed that way.
Raven (19:13)
Yeah, completely, right, yeah, exactly.
Exactly, right. Yeah. And so like this just looked like a sacrificial, right? So tree branches were also placed in a specific pattern on top of Abbey and it resembled an asterisk. And so one of those tree branches was actually cut by an electric saw, which also indicates that the murderers probably must have brought this electric saw with
So this is all like, I mean, it's all very strange, right? Like this isn't a random killing. This is very intentional. And they, I don't know, they picked these two girls on the bridge, unfortunately, and made them into some kind of a weird sacrificial rite. So.
Pisha (20:04)
could they tell if the tree branches were removed from the area where the bodies were found? Like, were they able to look around at the trees and bushes and stuff and go, that's where this one was cut?
Raven (20:16)
I believe so. And the reason I say that is like, so one of the tree branches, like that I said, was cut with an electrical saw. I think that they actually found like some of the branches on the trees that were cut with an electrical saw. So I think that it was.
Pisha (20:17)
Okay.
Mm -hmm.
Got it, so it wasn't just the ends of the sticks themselves that they were looking at, they were actually able to find like the source tree or bush or whatever. Okay, cool, interesting.
Raven (20:38)
Right, exactly. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
and then also above her head, above Abby's head, I should say, there were sticks that were placed like around her hair, mimicking antlers or
and this is all going to become like very important as we, you know, continue talking about this. But there was also this symbol that was like placed into a tree about four feet up.
that resembled an F, like our alphabetical F, but that was painted with Libby's blood. They did a DNA test and they determined it was Libby's. The F is a Nordic rune, like it's called fehu, which means, literally means cattle, But it's also interpreted to mean wealth and is commonly used by
Do you want to try and cover this or do you want me to cover it? Okay, let's do it.
Pisha (21:28)
Yeah. All right, guys, we're going to try some reading. Okay, so I'm going to talk a little bit about the Odinist connection here. I mean, it's pretty obvious just based on what you've described to me that there's a lot of Norse mythology and symbolism going on. So the defense did hire an expert in Odinism. And now we'll see a little more why Odinism and white supremacy are connected.
so, Odinism is closely related to Asatru, I mean, it looks like that, the Icelandic word for belief in Aesir or gods, which was highly favored in Nazi Germany as a bedrock belief for the key third Reich
Raven (22:03)
I think that's how you say it.
Mm -hmm.
Got it.
Pisha (22:18)
Okay. So the defense in the motion attached an image from an odinism website with a man hanging upside down from a tree, neck sliced like Abby's and legs and arms posed similarly to Abby's. They also attached an odinist website image of a man wearing antlers similar to Abby's with the legs positioned identically to the way Abby's were.
So there's all these connections already that they've attached to the motion. And one of the suspects will call him Ben Harper to keep these guys clear. But that's not his real name, as we pointed out. But anyway, so Ben Harper made a painting he posted on to social media of a tree with the caption painting by Ben Harper, Odin hanging from world tree. That was the name. Wait.
Raven (22:56)
You
Pisha (23:12)
That's it. That's the name he gave to it. But also that was the same positioning of the legs as the Odinist websites. The painting also has the F rune that was at the crime scene and 217 written at the bottom. So that's pretty like when...
Raven (23:13)
Mm -hmm. That's the name that he gave that painting.
Mm -hmm.
the date of the crime, like allegedly. Like, yeah, February, yeah, exactly. Well, and so, and I guess they had said too that like, it looks like that it says 21718, which almost makes it a little bit weirder because it's
Pisha (23:40)
That's when it happened.
Raven (23:54)
like the anniversary, right. And so, yeah, so who knows what that was about, but it's like, it's just,
like a really weird connection between like this Odinistic rite that they've been able to uncover through these Odinist websites and Ben Harper, who clearly is a murderer. I will listen to his music.
Pisha (24:17)
Might be. He definitely murdered my ears.
Raven (24:23)
Exactly. So, yeah, so in any case, yeah, it's a really weird, I guess, like, parallel something or other, something's going on there. We don't, we don't quite know what yet, but we'll get we'll get there. So.
Pisha (24:40)
do you think - do you think the real Ben Harper's gonna call us up and be like, what the fuck, guys? why did you do this? now everyone thinks I'm in an Odinist cult and I murder people
Raven (24:44)
Slander! This is...
Listen, I don't mean the real Ben Harper. I will leave that out there.
Pisha (24:55)
We're gonna continue to point that out throughout all of this.
Raven (25:00)
None of this is real. This is all about different people that are not the people that we are talking about. So...
Pisha (25:04)
And remember, we are full of lies podcasts.
Raven (25:09)
Slander. Yeah, seethingly, I'm sorry, seethingly, below bliss. Yeah, so this Odinist angle was not something that was like unknown to the state at the time. They didn't bring it up really ever, not in any press conference or anything like that. But there was a report that was actually generated.
Pisha (25:14)
EATING!
Raven (25:35)
by some of the investigators in the case. There was a 12 page report that goes into detail into a lot of this that we're going to be talking about today. So this Odin report was created by Indiana State Trooper Kevin Murphy. It's an independent investigation. And I actually really love these pages in this motion because it really like compliments these guys, like the ones who are on their side. And so there's just like this
undue praise for law enforcement that you don't like generally see. Yes, exactly. Way to go. Way to not be Tony Liggett, which we'll get into later. So Kevin Murphy did this independent investigation which links members of the eugenic right to the murders.
Pisha (26:05)
Right, they're like, good job not being in a cult. Congratulations not being on a cult. Thank you for bringing up the facts.
Raven (26:27)
And Todd Click, who's another one of the guys who's one of the good guys, according to the defense, he also drafted an 85 page report, but that wasn't given to defense until like pretty soon right before this whole motion came forward. And I don't, there must've been like a deadline or something. I kept thinking that because there was a couple of things that they talked about that were not, went into in depth, like in this 136 page motion, which you would imagine that it generally would have.
But there's a lot that they didn't get until pretty late in the game. So it'll be interesting to see what they bring out during trial because I think there's a whole lot more that we probably don't know about. So shit's gonna get wild here again. You ready for it?
Pisha (27:14)
So ready.
Raven (27:15)
Alright, how are those tills feeling?
Pisha (27:18)
Half speed, Raven, half speed. That's good.
Raven (27:20)
All right. All right. That's probably where we want it. All right. So so Ben Harper's son was dating Abby Williams at the time of the murders. And he was in Delphi. That's Ben. Ben was in Delphi every weekend visiting his friend, Peter Parker, and attending. Yeah, you know that. Yes. Yeah. And attending Asset True.
Pisha (27:40)
As you would.
Raven (27:49)
religious ceremonies in Delphi. There's quite a few people who are in this cult that are in Delphi and so we'll talk about that as we go on. So yeah, yeah, so...
Pisha (28:01)
It's like, it's reminding me of hot fuzz right now where the whole town isn't on it.
Raven (28:11)
Yeah, yeah,
all of these like, as a true guys
hanging out on the weekends and Ben is a big part of that. There's not a whole lot out there about Ben's son, although I don't know that like there's any kind of connection whatsoever. Like there's not any kind of forensic anything. So, but.
Pisha (28:30)
Just that there's like a connection to the victim. Really. Like there's this actual connection.
Raven (28:34)
Right, exactly. Yeah, so, which there isn't with Richard Allen, at least from what I could tell from the emotions and from what I've been able to decipher from everything that I've read. There's not really a motive. He's not one of these Odinist guys. There's really nothing there tying him to the actual murders. So, mm -hmm.
Pisha (28:41)
Right.
Right, and to the victims, whereas this guy, he has these connections to the victim already. He has like these open, he openly, you know, practices these religious ceremonies.
Raven (29:02)
Exactly.
Exactly, exactly. Him and along with a few other guys. Peter Parker, which we all knew. Yeah, that guy was trouble from the beginning. We all knew that. So, but Ben's wife actually did an interview with law enforcement and she said that her husband had told her while he was drunk that he and Peter Parker were no longer friends as of February 2017 because...
Pisha (29:12)
Peter Parker. Spider -Man.
Yeah.
Raven (29:38)
They were in the woods near a river doing a ritual and one of them said or did something that the other did not agree with and they no longer talk. Exactly, exactly. Like their last like social media post together was on January 21st of 2017, right before the murders happened. Yeah. She also said during her second interview, so she was interviewed once then they decided to go back and talk to her again.
Pisha (29:42)
GASP
Like murder a little girl perhaps?
Uhhhh
Hey.
Raven (30:08)
and this is even more damning. She says that her husband told her to stay away from Peter Parker or she would end up dead and that Parker and his crew were responsible for the murders of the girls in Delphi and also another murder where there was a fire that killed two other girls. I think it actually was like a fire where four girls were killed so she might not have had the facts exactly right.
But it sounds like there were more murders that had happened that they were not held responsible for. So Harper also posted a photo on Facebook of the room that was found at the crime scene drawn on his hand about 52 days before the murders occurred. He also had a post showing two girls, this is not the same, this is not the crime scene, just want to make that very clear, but it is two girls lying on the forest grounds, either dead or posed to be dead.
with tree limbs arranged over their bodies and their harms and hands positioned similarly to the way that Abbeys and Libby's were. So he also posted a video of a ritual where Peter Parker ended this ritual by painting a tree with his hand in the shape of a rune. And on February 17th of 2017, just three days after the murders allegedly occurred, he posted a meme saying like, it was like a,
Goodfellas type of meme, like with a picture of Goodfellas, where it says something to the effect of like, real friends help you bury the body, basically, and never speak good of it again. So all of this is like very circumstantial, who knows, like it's not enough to charge someone with a murder at this point. Although, we were getting close. So the only problem is that,
Ben Harper has an alibi. He's a very famous singer and he didn't do it.
Pisha (32:08)
He was touring. He was very famous. He just couldn't have done it.
Raven (32:10)
Yeah, no. They couldn't have done it. No, he was at work when the murders happened, allegedly. But the problem with that is that the law enforcement never vetted that. So like they didn't go and like talk to his employers. They didn't go and check and see like if he had a time card that he checked in and out of. Like they just took him at his word of saying like, I was at work at the time of the murders. So.
Pisha (32:21)
Okay.
Hmm. Okay. Yeah.
Raven (32:39)
Next, we are going to get into Enzo Ferrari. Are you prepared for that?
Pisha (32:45)
Yeah, I'm so prepared. Ready guys? Ready guys? Let's do this together. So Enzo Ferrari is our third person identified in this motion. The Enzo Ferrari. Who's dead? They brought him back just for this. And so their words were that Enzo Ferrari is a mentally infirm man.
Raven (32:56)
The Enzo. Who's dead? Really dead.
Pisha (33:12)
from about 126 miles away who mimicked all of Ben Harper's posts. On 2 14, 2017, a witness, the sister of Enzo? Okay, so Enzo's sister told law enforcement that Enzo was rambling, hyper and borderline incoherent talking about having a brother and being a part of a gang and that he had been on the bridge when the girls were killed.
Raven (33:18)
Mm -hmm.
And so, yeah.
Pisha (33:42)
and that someone named Abigail was a pain in the ass and a troublemaker. Enzo, yeah, that's a lot of details. Enzo tried to give this witness a blue jacket on that date. She says he also said he placed leaves on her and used sticks to give her horns. boy.
Raven (33:53)
Mm -hmm.
blue jacket.
Which is like that's not a detail that ever went to the public. I just want to make that very clear. So like so that is bizarre that he's using the name Abigail and he's saying that It's weird. Yeah, there's some there's some connection there is it's it has to be anyway keep going. Sorry.
Pisha (34:18)
Right. He has so many of the details. Yeah.
No, that's good. I think that's good to point out because he really does have enough details here that only people who were there would have had. So he's getting it from somewhere. His sister had been trying to get law enforcement to look into Enzo for a year before they gave her a polygraph and determined she wasn't lying. So they would interview him. What? I need to interview you. I polygraph you to see if you're lying about.
Raven (34:50)
Yeah. Right? Isn't that?
Pisha (34:57)
claim someone else is making. What? That's stupid and a waste of time and resources.
Raven (34:59)
Right, it's bizarre.
Well, they wouldn't listen to her. And that was like the weirdest thing was like, she has this like very real and, you know, I mean, I think if they had just listened to her strictly about the Antlers, like that would have been enough, like for them to have interviewed Enzo a whole lot earlier, but they didn't.
Pisha (35:15)
Yeah.
Right. But they had to know they had to make everything so difficult. And so according to page one of the Odin report, after interviewing Enzo, he asked Trooper Murphy, what would happen if my spit is found on one of the girls? But he has an explanation. Would I? but I have and it's OK. I'm reading exactly. I'm trying not to fuck up here. OK, so.
Raven (35:25)
Mm -hmm.
next one again. Yeah, I'm sorry.
Hmm.
Pisha (35:49)
What would happen if my spit is found on one of the girls, but I have an explanation, would I still be in trouble? Another witness told law enforcement that in October 2017, Enzo told her, I am in a lot of trouble. I am going away for a long time. I was on that trail and that bridge with those girls when they were murdered. There were two other people there.
with me when it happened, I spit on one of the girls after they were killed. Eee. Do we know how long spit survives on a body like that? A long time, okay.
Raven (36:23)
Yeah!
long time, very long time. And I don't know, like, I don't know if they ever did, like, I don't think they ever got a DNA search warrant. No, no, which is absolutely insane. Like, this guy is admitting to having DNA on one of the victims. Like, how would you not get a search warrant based on that? I don't know. Anyway, keep going.
Pisha (36:32)
Like swabs or anything. Huh.
Yeah.
on the bodies.
Yeah, yeah. So in addition, Enzo also lied to law enforcement about knowing the Odinist recruiter who was a mutual acquaintance with Ben Harper. Phone records show he was in his town the day of the murders, but also that he didn't use his phone at all during that time. And another witness claimed, yeah, that's a long time to not use your phone. So kind of sus behavior.
Raven (37:10)
It's like a nine hour period, yeah.
Mm -hmm.
Pisha (37:17)
And another witness claimed they were at the hospital together and had their phones at the time. What? Yeah.
Raven (37:17)
Mm -hmm.
which they couldn't have. They couldn't have had their phones. Like this witness said like, yeah, we were at such and such hospital. but you wouldn't be able to like, you know, see that we were there because the hospital like cell reception is so bad there or whatever. Like, and yeah. And it's like, that's not necessarily the case, but also that was wrong because Enzo's phone was...
Pisha (37:33)
Yeah.
Got you.
Raven (37:50)
at his house the entire time of the date of the murder. So anyway.
Pisha (37:54)
Right, right. So one last thing about Enzo Ferrari. He's potentially a diddler. He... Yeah, we're gonna get called by so many people's agents and they're like, you've ruined all their lives. And I'm like, they're dead, get over it. It's fine. We clearly don't mean it.
Raven (38:02)
I'm very sorry to like Enzo Ferrari's legacy. I don't mean it.
god. Actually no. Yeah, clearly we don't mean it, but yeah, we needed a name.
Pisha (38:22)
Enzo Ferrari's not actually a diddler. I can't say for sure, because I didn't know him before he died, but anyways. So this Enzo Ferrari, the fake one, who is the third person identified in this motion, he's potentially a diddler, and he used Facebook to message girls as young as like 12, 13, 14 years old. Gross.
Raven (38:41)
Yeah, yeah, yeah, super gross. Anyway, yeah, that guy, yeah, there's something like super suspicious about him. Like some of the Facebook posts that like he's posting mimicking Ben Harper's are like, you know, the oldness type of stuff. Like he's trying to be a part of the gang and like that's his whole thing. So anyway, as far as like Peter Parker,
Pisha (38:43)
Yeah.
Raven (39:05)
And we have one more player in here who's the recruiter that you were talking about. His name is John Mayer. You may have heard of him. And their connection to the crime scene. Peter lives within a seven minute drive from where the girls were murdered. And the recruiter, John Mayer and Ben Harper are commonly hung out at that bridge. And Peter knows the woods around that trail very well. So Peter.
Pisha (39:10)
Ha ha!
Raven (39:32)
is actually the Asatru pastor. So these guys are all, like I said, they're all part of this like church or whatever it is. Like I think they call themselves like the Finlanders and who knows, it's gross. But like, but that's, that's their bullshit. And Mayor, John Mayor, that is, he went to Delphi around Valentine's Day to hang out with these guys.
Pisha (39:51)
you
Raven (39:56)
So it's weird because all of these guys are telling very vastly different stories. Like Peter Parker says that he was at home the day of the murders and so did Enzo. Enzo said he was at home as
but Mayer says that he was there and hanging out with presumably these guys because he didn't have any reason else to go to Delphi. So the other weird thing about John Mayer is that his car had blood.
that was like alongside it, that there was no explanation for this blood. And I don't know if it was like, assistant or whatever, but like they went to go like try and wash the blood off of the car. It took several times to get the blood off. This is not a little amount of blood. This is a substantial amount of blood with no explanation. So.
Pisha (40:40)
Well, and how weird because there's such an easy explanation. Like I hit a deer or you know what I mean? Like it's to not offer any explanation and just be like, clean this blood off my vehicle. That's weird.
Raven (40:47)
Right! Right!
Yeah, it is very
I want to bring it back around a little bit because we've been talking about all of these different actors. But, you know, Richard Allen is the one who's been charged with these crimes. And I want to make a point of clarification as to the sketches that we were talking about beforehand. So I said before that I couldn't remember like who which sketch was like belonged to who or whatever.
But it's clearly in the motion. So the second sketch came from the first witness who was about like 50 feet away on the Monon High Bridge. And that was sometime around like two o 'clock PM, right? So she describes him as being white, around age 20, brown curly hair, medium built. This sketch wasn't released to the public for two years.
And when it was, the witness met with the officer, frustrated that it wasn't released because the first sketch did not match the man that she observed on the
We went through those last time. And so the second sketch, like I said, I'm talking about the sketch that was released after the first one. And...
Pisha (41:55)
Yeah.
This is the one with the guy that looks just so different from the, like, it doesn't look like the first sketch at all. It doesn't look like the picture. It's like, who the heck is this guy?
Raven (42:16)
No, exactly right. Like there's no way that those two people are the same. At the same time, you have Tony Liggett, who's the investigator in this case, who wrote the search warrant affidavit, which I said we're gonna get back to, who's like just adamant that like, no, these guys are the same guy. Like there's very minimal differences, but like if you look at those two pictures, there's not, they look nothing alike. Like one of them is in his forties probably and has like a goatee.
and we talked about wearing it with the newspaper cap, and then this guy has curly hair. And if he has curly hair, there's absolutely no way that this could have been Richard Allen at all, because he has no hair. And he didn't have hair at the time of the incident either. So she gave this description only four days after the incident, and she had a good look at his face that's only about 50 feet away.
I should point out here too as well that like there is some speculation that this second sketch does resemble Enzo Ferrari. So, mm -hmm.
Pisha (43:21)
I was gonna ask, I was gonna ask if this second sketch matches any of the people we've been talking about.
Raven (43:28)
Yeah, and it does, and it does. And so, and it's kind of interesting to me too that the sketch that was like immediately after the fact wasn't released right away. I don't know why that's the case. But then the first sketch, which we talked about, which is the one with like the newspaper hat and it looks like he has a goatee she is a witness who saw this guy from her car at around four o 'clock PM. And so she didn't get a good look at his face. She's far away from him.
And this is, you know, after the fact. And the search for an epideavit claimed that her description of this man was a man in a blue jacket whose blue jeans were muddy and bloody. That's what we talked about last time, like the whole muddy and bloody thing. Turns out she never said those words. Like she never said that A, that he had a blue jacket and B, she never said bloody. She only said that it looks like maybe he was
in muddy clothing. So completely wrong, like not the same person whatsoever.
there's a lot of like just inconsistencies throughout this investigation. And it's like, they just needed to choose somebody and they pointed at this guy and they have very little that like is actually accurate as to what actually happened that day.
may be asking, you know, what do they actually have on Richard Allen? What did he tell law enforcement when they talked to him? So, Pisha do you want to tell us about that?
Pisha (44:54)
Yeah, they don't have much. That's like they don't have much. And end of story. No, really. What he tells law enforcement is that he was at the bridge between 12 and 1 30 p He had driven his black Ford Focus there. This is important because the witness who described the man on the bridge said there was only one car in the parking lot and it was not that car, not a black Ford Focus. So.
Raven (44:56)
Great. Perfect.
Pisha (45:21)
He apparently confessed quote unquote multiple times according to prosecutors, but it's important to note that he didn't confess until he was at Westville where, which is that like holding prison where he was held in prison, right? Yeah.
Raven (45:21)
Mm -hmm.
Exactly, right. Yeah, yeah. And we'll get into what he was experiencing at that prison. But it's not like he said, he did admit to being at the bridge, to law enforcement prior to this happening between 12 and 1 30. But he didn't say he did it. He never said he did it. So in any case, yeah, keep going. Sorry.
Pisha (45:43)
Right.
Mm -hmm.
Yeah, no, that's that's good. He never actually confesses like any sort of recording or anything like that until he is at Westville. And like you said, there's some really important things that go down at Westville that may explain why he would confess at that time. So he also apparently processed the photographs of one of the girls moms at CVS and she was crying. He said the photos were on him.
Raven (46:27)
him like, like, yeah, like he he was gonna pay for them for her. So so clearly to me, what that says is like, he felt bad, right? Like he felt like this.
Pisha (46:31)
got it. okay. So...
Right, like maybe some remorse or guilt or something. But not guilt, but like you said, like some sympathy for her.
Raven (46:45)
Right, I mean, I actually don't think he would have done that if he was actually responsible for it. But if you were a human being living in this world where you're seeing this woman whose daughter was murdered and she is processing
the last photograph daughter, right, you were gonna feel bad and you're gonna be like, you know what, this is on me. As a human being.
Pisha (47:07)
Yeah, and if you were a murderer, you wouldn't do anything that would indicate you, like, you know what I mean? Like, that's pretty obvious to put yourself under a light. Yeah, some scrutiny to like bring yourself up in that way. So if you were the murderer, I would think you would want to just kind of like let her back out of the room and like let that interaction die without you being brought under.
Raven (47:16)
Mm -hmm.
Screw it, me. Right.
Exactly.
Pisha (47:35)
brought into the investigation. So it doesn't really make sense to bring that up and then draw the scrutiny.
Raven (47:38)
Right.
Exactly. And you think that she would have said something like, this guy was acting super shady or like nervous or anything like that. And she didn't
legitimately think he was just trying to be a nice person and seeing a woman who was hurting trying to help out. And that somehow bit him in the ass, because I was listening to this other podcast, I think it was psyche killers or
like
Seethingly. But no, right. And so, you know, I have my own issues with like podcasters who are not like informed as like lawyers or who are not informed as investigators and stuff like that. And they like make all of these speculations. And like, to be fair, we do kind of the same thing, but at the same time,
Pisha (48:04)
one star full of lies. Seethingly negative.
We do it too, yeah.
Raven (48:26)
At the same time, these speculations that they're making about this guy don't make sense. They're saying, yeah, he must have felt guilty and that's why he comped these photographs. And it's like, does that make sense? Does that even make sense at all, logically? No, I don't think so.
Pisha (48:42)
I mean, I said I said it like I said it earlier, but it's like it really doesn't make sense though from the standpoint of a murderer, like if you're expressing guilt, you wouldn't do it like that. I just I don't understand. Yeah.
Raven (48:47)
Mm -hmm.
It doesn't. No.
No, it doesn't.
and there's a lot of other holes that are in the case against Richard Allen as well. I mean, like we talked about last time, we talked about how it couldn't possibly be one guy, right? And I'm gonna get into a little bit more why. So what you should know about Richard Allen is
he has this buzz cut that we've been talking about in this goatee.
beard type of thing that he's had for a really long time. I think he was ex -military actually. But also he's five foot four. And so he's a short guy, short king. Yeah, God bless him. We love him. And so.
Pisha (49:30)
Short King.
Yeah. Well, I mean, yeah, how, how's a little king like that going to do all of the things you described with those bodies and drag them from obviously not where they were killed to the site where they were left?
Raven (49:48)
Exactly. Exactly. Exactly
the defense does a really good job and like, and I think it's very theatrical the way that they do it. They have like, I don't know, maybe like 48 points that they make as to why it could not have been one person doing it and especially not a five foot four man. He's slightly built. Yeah, he may have had a gun, but it still would have been really difficult to have like dragged these two girls into the woods.
across this river. So some of the points just like lean in on the more salient ones. One man would have had to have like marched down this steep hill through a very cold river in February, right, at three and a half feet deep, right? Like so he would have been up to here, like three and a half feet would have been like somewhere around the chest area, right? So he would have had to have marched them to the site of the murders with
with their drenched clothing and prevented both of them from screaming while there are a bunch of houses nearby. I should point that out as well. Exactly, right.
Pisha (50:51)
And it's a pretty popular trail. Like, there were people on the trail. There were all these witnesses.
Raven (50:56)
And these girls were smart. They were obviously like posting to Snapchat trying to get some
there just had to have been something more there. I don't think it could have been one guy and
didn't think to just run away, you know? So he would have had to have like restrained one of them while murdering the other one, taken off both of their clothes, put one of their clothes back on them.
Pisha (51:11)
Yeah.
Raven (51:20)
and then for whatever reason place them into some sacrificial position and done a sacrificial rite by himself? Which isn't like how it's done, right? And he doesn't...
Pisha (51:30)
Yeah, and how does he have the knowledge for all of this?
Raven (51:34)
Right, and it's to a cult that he has no ties to. So it's like there's just no motive there. There's nothing there saying that this person would have committed these crimes against these girls. and in addition, like all of this would have had to have occurred according to the state's timeline within two hours and 22 minutes. It's virtually
Pisha (51:53)
No.
Raven (51:54)
just could not have happened.
Pisha (51:54)
no way.
go ahead. But I also want to point out that like for a five foot four guy in three and a half foot deep water, that's more than half his body. Like, like you'd have to also consider that he's not getting swept away in like a current or whatever. Like, you know, there's floating objects that could have hit. I don't know. It's just, it's really weird. That's, that's a lot of body to be underwater.
Raven (52:07)
Exactly. Yeah, like.
Right, you're exactly
that river was not just like an easy river, like it was
yeah.
Pisha (52:29)
I do have one question. Does the Snapchat video match any of our characters?
Raven (52:41)
Only in so, we think, potentially.
Pisha (52:44)
The, so wait, the Snapchat video and the second sketch that don't look alike match Enzo?
Raven (52:50)
No, no, no, the second sketch matches Enzo. I think the first sketch, I don't know. It wasn't really clear to me either through this like motion or otherwise. I haven't seen anything. And like I said, like, yeah, it's a popular trail and other people were on it. Like there wasn't anything incriminating that either of these, you know, sketches were doing. The second sketch, I will say, so the one that happened at four o 'clock p that was in a tan jacket. So it doesn't even match like the
Pisha (52:54)
Okay, but -
Okay.
Yeah.
Raven (53:20)
the guy on the bridge, the bridge guy, as they call him in Delphi. The bridge guy is the guy in the blue jacket. And so, yeah.
Pisha (53:24)
Yeah.
Right. I guess what I'm asking is the Snapchat video where they catch the guy saying guys down the hill or something like, right. So that looks like Enzo.
Raven (53:36)
Right, that's Enzo.
Yeah, that's the bridge guy. The bridge guy is we think is Enzo.
Pisha (53:42)
But...
But no, I guess what I'm trying to say is the Snapchat video. We have that. So but I guess. Wait, the second sketch doesn't look like the Snapchat video.
Raven (53:57)
No it does. It does. It's just a guy with a hat.
Pisha (54:01)
but I thought that this... Okay.
Raven (54:04)
It's really hard. So the video is really hard to see. It's really grainy, but you see a guy and he's kind of like bigger and you can't really tell what his hair looks like, but he's wearing a hat, right? And so, and he's wearing a blue jacket.
Pisha (54:08)
Mm -hmm.
Yeah, yeah, I guess what I'm saying, does he match anyone? And you're saying that matches Enzo the same as the one second sketch. Got it.
Raven (54:26)
The second sketch, right. Because the second sketch looks a whole lot more like the guy on the bridge if you took off his hat. But you don't really know. Like, I mean, that's the thing with like the video is like, you can't see his face. You can't see anything else that's going on. It looks like he has hair though. And yeah.
Pisha (54:34)
Yeah.
And that's the one that was released first.
but wasn't the first one. The first one was that one lady who was on the bridge and she was 50 feet away and it's this guy that looks nothing, it's like a 20 year old.
Raven (55:02)
backwards. So you're thinking of the first sketch. So the first sketch is the one that they got where the lady was just passing by on the highway. And she says, this is what this guy looked like. And she's the muddy and bloody guy, but not actually bloody. And then the second sketch is the lady who saw him close up.
Pisha (55:07)
Okay.
Got it.
Okay.
Raven (55:26)
Does that make sense? Ish. Okay.
Pisha (55:27)
No, but I'm on so many pills, everybody. I'm on so many pills. But I trust you to have done all, like, I don't even care because I think you've made sense of all of this just fine for the people who are not on pills.
Raven (55:41)
If you have any questions, like I said, you can always send us a message on any of our socials or email or whatever. All right, so I think we've covered pretty much what happened, the craziness of the different people who were involved. we talked a lot about the corrections officers at the Westville facility last time, and we're going to get deeper into it now.
So on April 3rd of 2023, there were two transport guards that were prominently displaying multiple patches, one of which included, in Odin We Trust, as well as a DOC Department of Corrections name tag, and two patches of a partial American flag and interlocking triangles. And so if you're familiar with white supremacy, that's a very common.
white supremacist symbol. And there was also a patch that was like in the shape of like the Patagonia, you know, like that, like the mountains, the brand that said, I hate people instead of Patagonia on it, which I don't really fully understand still to this day, but that was there as well. So after April 3rd of 2023, after these two transport officers took him,
Richard Allen's mental health started to very steadily decline and his lawyers are starting to become very worried about him. These transport guards actually became like inseparable from Richard Allen so his lawyers couldn't get him away from them. These officers were videotaping the interactions with his lawyers and would be way too close for him to be able to have these confidential...
conversations that you are
entitled
a criminal defendant and with his wife as well. So they're intimidating him. They're like very clearly trying to scare him out of saying anything to his lawyers or saying anything to his wife. So at one point though, so his lawyers keep like raising this and yelling at the guards and eventually are able to like get him.
away from them to the
point where he is, tells them because he's, you know, they can tell he's not well. And that's why they're saying like his mental health is declining. And so Richard Allen is telling them that the guys with the Odin patches were going to kill him. And he kept asking repeatedly if his wife was okay, if his family was okay. And clearly like the implication there is that he thinks that they're
going to get killed by these
it's not just that these officers had these Odinist patches. They also posted all kinds of Odinist shit all over their Facebook pages, including things that were linked to the symbolism that was in these
and a lot of this stuff that was attached to this motion are not made public for good reason. But there are both.
videos and photos of Richard Allen after a couple of incidents where there's alleged abuse and harassment that had occurred caused by these
this is where I think we're going to get into the confession. So, I mean, I think we're all somewhat familiar nowadays with false confessions, thanks to Netflix and John
These inmates know that their phone calls are recorded. They don't see things not purposefully. I mean, speaking from experience, like you have to constantly like remind people, hey, like, you know, this is recorded, whatever, but it's very rare that you're going to get someone who's actually gonna confess something over the phone because they know that these phone calls are recorded. So the confessions that the...
prosecution is talking about, these happened in recorded calls with Richard Allen's wife. And again, these happened on recorded calls. So it's a decent theory that these officers who are harassing, abusing, and preventing Richard Allen from having confidential attorney and family visits were pressuring him to confess to his wife on the recorded line in order to protect
people within their own Odinic right from coming under suspicion and making Richard Allen take the hit for their crimes. So that's where we're
defense is still moving forward. They're going to take this case to trial. And they took a lot of very interesting turns in this case. I think I talked about at the very beginning, like,
This is not something I've ever seen. It's not to say that, you know, I've only been doing this five years, like, who knows, it could have happened in some other cases. But there's also like some kind of nebulous ethical
that they did in this motion that some people might not agree with. But I tend to think that they did a really good investigation in this case. And I think that,
They had a lot of reason to try and get this theory out there before trial and they did that. So what they're saying in this motion is that the sheriff, Tony Liggett, had lied on the search warrant affidavit about this muddy and bloody identification of the suspect and also omitted all of the facts that they now have with regards to the Odinist
angle, all of the evidence that was obtained as a result of that search warrant should be suppressed if the Frank's motion is granted. So if the judge determines, which I think that she didn't, but if she did determine that these were facts that were material to the search warrant and should have been presented as a form of determining probable cause, that
the results of that search warrant should be suppressed.
whole nitty -gritty of it. But it's set for trial now. The motion hasn't been granted, but we kind of know what we're going to be expecting for trial. So I should also say like this is an aside, but like this case is so...
fascinating and how the lawyers have chosen to go about this. These are lawyers who have between them over 50 years of experience. So they're not inexperienced. They know what they're doing. And they've done some very high profile cases. they were actually kicked off of the case because there was a leak within their office where I think someone came into the office and like,
Pisha (1:02:26)
Yeah.
Raven (1:02:41)
somehow came across some of the crime scene photos and leaked them. And so because of that, the judge tried to kick them off, like basically kind of sua sponte meaning by herself. And they originally were going to just like leave it at that and get off of the case. And they decided to voluntarily get off. But after some time, they decided to appeal that.
decision and went all the way to the Supreme Court. The Supreme Court overturned it and now they're back on the case. So yeah. Yeah. So Richard Allen is still at Westville, still at the same place where he was being harassed. And recently, I think very recently, Baldwin and Rozy, the two lawyers who are on his case, the primary lawyers, I think there's a third one as well, they have moved, filed a motion.
to move him to another facility. And there's actually a hearing that's coming up in a couple of days as of I think like the release of this recording. It'll be tomorrow for May 21st and May 23rd. So it'll be determined if he's gonna be moved. And probably I think that motion will probably be heard as well. So trial isn't scheduled until October, but what do you think Pisha? Like after hearing all of this,
Pisha (1:03:43)
wow.
Raven (1:04:00)
What are your thoughts about Richard Allen and what are your thoughts about the case?
Pisha (1:04:04)
I have reasonable doubt. I just, I can't see how the conditions of the body support only one person and being responsible for this. Not to mention the lack of physical evidence tying him to the bodies. You would think that bodies posed in such, he would have had to like,
He didn't leave any trace evidence on these bodies. Nothing like, you know what I mean? He had to position these bodies and do the damage he did and be able to remove all the evidence. I don't see it being something, it's not a one man job. So, I have some reasonable doubt as to whether or not he did this.
Raven (1:04:31)
Yeah.
Yeah, I'm with you. I don't think he did. I mean, I think if it hasn't been said enough, like he doesn't have ties to this Odinist cult. So I just don't see, and the facts of like the crime scene itself, like very much point
Pisha (1:05:01)
Yeah.
Raven (1:05:08)
Odinist sacrificial rite. So I don't know. Yeah.
Pisha (1:05:12)
Yeah.
Raven (1:05:13)
I think it's crazy. One other thing about the whole bullet thing we talked about last time that I kind of looked into a little bit more. Yeah, so it was an unspent bullet, but defenses never received a photograph of that bullet. They've never been able to look at it or anything like that. So who knows how long that bullet was there beforehand? it doesn't make sense.
Pisha (1:05:40)
and it's a best evidence issue and a chain of custody issue if they cannot be provided the actual bullet that was found at the scene. So I don't buy it. I don't. The bullet is so random. It feels like such a red herring.
Raven (1:05:42)
Mm -hmm.
That's exactly right. Yep, completely. Yeah.
Nope.
Mm -hmm. I agree. I agree. Yeah, it doesn't it just doesn't make sense. None of it does so
Pisha (1:06:01)
Yeah, man, I can't wait for the updates on this one. So I hope that like, as we keep going throughout the year, you keep us updated. Yay.
Raven (1:06:05)
Yeah.
I will. Yeah, for sure. I'm keeping tabs on this one because it's, it's a peaks. It is wild. It's crazy. As I've said multiple times throughout this. So, so thank you for for going along on this ride with me, Pisha. I really appreciate it. I know, you know, I love going on little rabbit holes. It's my favorite thing.
Pisha (1:06:14)
It's wild!
I loved it.
yeah. Yeah. And for sure. Thank you for letting me ride that Xanny bus. well we were doing Xanny bananies got a little Xanax in my system, but Hey, we survived. I think I did somewhat. Okay. I, I'm still semi literate, you know, half speed. So,
Raven (1:06:38)
Sanny the Nanny.
I, you did great.
Listen, I don't know how I made it the week before my wedding without Xanax, but like more power to you because you're doing it right.
Pisha (1:07:00)
Thank you. Thank you. I feel no regrets. So, yeah, that's it for this week. I think that's it for this month. It's, you know, yeah, I've got to wrap up my menti bee here and we're going to come back refreshed and renewed in June to celebrate the death of Ronald Reagan with
Raven (1:07:06)
Yeah.
Yeah, we're done. We've got some other things coming up, yeah.
Pisha (1:07:29)
the six degrees of Ronald Reagan. Each week we will be discussing Reagan era policy that has had disastrous outcomes for our now times, which are many and plentiful. And we've had a difficult time narrowing down the list, but we're going to find four of these Reagan era era policies. We're going to tell you how they fucked up our lives today. So be looking for that in the meantime, like.
Follow, listen, subscribe, share our shit. You know? Yeah. my God. I need all of you derangers to please go out there and just water down that one star bot review we got from your family member.
Raven (1:08:02)
Well, you see what happens if you don't review our shit. We get like the crazies. So like, so just do it.
Please.
Pisha (1:08:21)
Like, I just, it's kind of, it's really funny now. I feel like, you know, when I've gained these kinds of enemies, I've won. I am a winner. So, yeah. Right? No, we're not mad. I'm, it's actually hilarious. It's made my life better. So, thank you for that. But you know what else would make my life better? If all of the derangers went out there and gave their own reviews. We want to hear what you guys think and...
Raven (1:08:26)
Ugh.
I agree, I agree, that's what I thought when I read this. So, like, we're not mad, we're not mad at all, but like.
Yeah.
Pisha (1:08:49)
Follow us on the socials, all this and that. Until next time, stay out of law school and the infirmaries.
Raven (1:08:49)
Yeah.
Raven Deranger (1:09:02)
Remember to like and subscribe to Deranged DeJure on your favorite podcast platform and follow at deranged.dejure on all the major social media. Contact us by email at deranged.dejure at gmail.com. This has been a Raven Kink production.