Welcome to the world of Peptides. New episodes every Tuesday.
I think that the term conventional medicine is nonsense
and what we call conventional is actually non
conventional I have studied these
with some of the most brilliant
peptide minds in the world
and some people are very pro some people are very anti
I am always in the camp of mindful usage
and understanding what you're getting yourself into
I also think that people buying them
are often going underground
and don't know what they're buying
most of them don't test their products
most of them are just throwing things out there
I could make a COA in 5 minutes
welcome to this week's Peptide Show from Longr
where we speak to the people who matter most
in the business of peptides
I'm Richard Skaife a venture capitalist and entrepreneur
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15 years ago
peptides were barely part of the conversation
they lived largely on bodybuilding forums
and research chemical sites
understood by a relatively small group
in a world most people never saw
today peptides have moved out of the shadows
and into the mainstream
Dylan Gemelli has seen that transformation in real time
and what excites him about peptides
concerns him in equal measure
a certificate of analysis can look convincing
and tell you very little
what's on the label may not be what's in the vial
and while GLP-1s have propelled peptides
into public consciousness
Dylan believes they've narrowed our understanding
of what peptides may become
so how much of what we're told can actually be trusted
and as peptides move from the underground
towards established healthcare
who gets to decide what happens next
my guest today is Dylan Gemelli welcome to Peptide Show
Dylan
thank you very much for joining us on Peptide Show
pleasure you have a really interesting story
you spent 15 years of your life
involved in the peptide space
and you obviously I imagine
watched it evolve quite significantly
tell me a little bit about that
that early part of your journey into peptides
and what sort of happened to take you into this space
so I I discovered peptides
really what I discovered was the research
chemical facilities
and companies and things of that nature
kind of got put into my lap basically
it was a supplement company that found me
within bodybuilding forums
and they wanted to get me to start doing YouTube videos
and help promote me as like a entity online
a personality that discussed steroids and supplements
but they also wanted me to talk about SARMs
and peptides and I said look
I don't know what these are I've never heard of them
I have zero clue
I was very educated on steroids and supplements
which I had been studying for years and hormones
and I said if I'm gonna talk about these things
I need as much education as you can provide me well
there was very little at the time
but I did I had enough to where I became comfortable
at least discussing them and I had to preface with
you know the studies are quite minimal there
now there were a few that went back into the 90s
which I was able to get like late 90s studies on
MK-677 and MK-2866
which at the time
were categorized as SARMs
now we know that MK-677
is not a SARM at all it's a secretagogue
and now it's being marketed more in the peptide realm
however still kind of grouped in that range
but that's neither here nor there
at the time
there was only about six or seven
peptides that were even being sold
or that were being discussed
and generally
they were all growth releasing hormone peptides
so I'm talking CJC-1295, Ipamorelin
Sermorelin um
and then there was Melanotan II
which we know is now for tanning and things of
very popular very popular yeah
yeah and you know
at the time I didn't really get too intrigued with them
because for for bodybuilders in the bodybuilding world
SARMs were where it was at
because they were putting on more size
more strength and peptides
it was quite minimal
and people didn't understand exactly what they did
how efficient they were
and this was more along the lines of
bodybuilders were the only ones looking at research
chemical sites that was it and it was very niche
it was a lot smaller and in level
there were very few companies at the time
and everything was marketed as for human consumption only
wow okay
so we're we
we kind of we kind of gone
we kind of gone forwards and then gone backwards
yeah and and you know for me
I was saying what I
I don't want anything to do with this like it
it it became quite clear though
after just a few weeks of getting into it
why that it said that it was a legality thing
it was the only way that they could sell these legally
by putting that on there but
everybody that was buying from there was obviously
using them there was a lot
it was crazy because at the time
people would make posts online about well
my rat was tested with this product or that product
everybody was so paranoid about what they could say
and they used to speak I used to just say
it was rather ignorant and ridiculous
but that was what people believed they had to do
so there was this nod
wink-wink speak
yeah it was this stupid code and verbiage that
I eventually just told people
if you can't just tell me that you're using it and
and without fear then I'm not gonna be able to help you
because this is just absurd
the
the police are not gonna come knocking down your door
because you posted about using
some research chemical that nobody's ever heard of
so that and that paranoia quickly stopped
and I can even get into
how they became so large and prevalently discussed
from being so small
because there is actually a timeline to what happened
that would be that would be fascinating
I mean cause
I think for a lot of people who are new to the space
and you know
just you know
searching on YouTube
they're looking for the word peptide
they know very little
there's a common misconception that peptides are
steroids steroids are peptides
uh is that something that was present
when you first started looking at it
or is it is it simply something uh
you know whenever there's a police bust uh
we
we just had one here in Malta where we record this show
you know and peptides get linked together with steroids
and I'm not too sure if it was the peptides
that they were actually able to
you know prosecute and seize
you know what probably was the steroids
so you know
where those sort of two bedfellows sit
you know early on and
and where do they kind of sit now in your mind
so early on
it was viewed kind of like in that category because
like I said bodybuilders were the only ones using them
looking for performance enhancement
and ways to get maximal growth really
and quickly it came to the realization
1 there's this huge misconception
that human growth hormone
makes you massive or puts on size
which it does not human growth hormone does so well
when it's stacked with steroids
or used with other compounds that slab on
or pack on slabs of muscle
human growth hormone is great for lean
muscle gain and fat loss over time
but the main reason
that athletes were using human growth hormone
was for recovery
because they were recovering from injuries
so much faster it was not making them so crazy strong
or have all these abilities
so that's that's number one
No. 2 these are growth releasing hormones
so what they're doing is
instead of you taking exogenous human growth hormone
these are allowing your body to produce it
without taking synthetic growth hormones
so if you take something like Ipamorelin
and it's gonna allow for more growth hormone release
which is ideally what you want
it's a safer way of doing it
and it's a natural way of releasing
human growth hormone but at the same hand
you're not getting massive
or super strength from these at all
so they were really not really utilized
or they were just kind of looked at like well whatever
they were the ancillary they were the ancillary
I mean they sort of
you know yeah
it was the the soda with the vodka
there were a few people
that really grasped and understood what they did
and why they were important
there were a couple people out there
but they were few and far between and for me
for my audience and what I was going after
my vision was wow
SARMs are the future
they're gonna be the future of bodybuilding
I never saw peptides turning into what they are today
I I can tell you in all honesty I did not see that coming
and how do you think that happened
I mean with
you know jumping in now 2026
15 years of looking into this market
as you say it's now massively overtaken uh
you know steroids as a
as a point of conversation
to the point now where it's so
so much in the public zeitgeist
it's even it's even overtaken terms such as crypto
it's one of the most you know
one of the most googled search terms
why are we here in 2026 what's happened
so here's what happened
and I'll give you a little timeline first
there was a prohormone ban in 2014
so prohormones were basically
synthetic steroids that were legally sold
oh wow yeah
so when this happened
this was where we started to evolve
into what we're seeing today
more mainstream companies
had invested hundreds of thousands
even millions of dollars in raw powders of prohormones
that were now scheduled drugs
that if you sold them
you were certainly getting a prison sentence
it was like selling cocaine or heroin
yeah
so they were stuck what do we do with all of these
that's when they started to find SARMs
and so what happened
they started to put SARMs that were research chemicals
into capsules and start selling them
which was actually quite illegal
but they were
it was just another loophole to get away with it
for some time here's where the problem comes into play
what a lot of these companies were doing
was selling things as SARMs
but putting in their pro
hormone powders to get their money out of it
and trying to make SARMs look like they were
packing this serious
serious punch that these synthetic steroids
prohormones were already giving you
so that's when
we started to see
all of these research companies start to come out
because it was quickly realized
you can't sell SARMs as supplements
you can't do that and it was get
they were getting away with it
there's no GRAS
there's no GRAS certification for them
no absolutely not
and then you know
what happened was
is they got rid of their prohormone powders
but then people started to get these side effects
that weren't really associated with SARMs
steroid side effects
so then this misconception comes out that wow
SARMs are just as dangerous as steroids
well then
you start to get people that were getting them tested
seeing they were laced with different prohormones
and then even companies were putting steroids
actual steroids into these products
wild
and then that's when boom
the research
chemical industries just went out of control
and what you see is
a lot of them get busted and shut down
because the second you start marketing them
and saying that humans are using them
you start talking about any sort of human benefit
the FDA can really come in and shut you down
because you've broken the loophole
which is very slim as it is
and then what you're finding is
a lot of these research companies
when they go in there
they're doing other shit so they're selling steroids
they're into other things
they're not just doing one sort of thing
and they're just they're towing a gray line
to where it's just like slapping the FDA in the face
and eventually they're getting shut down
and some of them are even going to prison
because they're doing so many other shady things
and indeed, and there was a case
you know quite recently in the US
an entrepreneur who you know
and I think that the two got tagged in together
when you look at the areas
which were ultimately prosecuted
and probably what he went to jail for
it actually
I don't think was the peptides and the research use
only nature of them it was faking of COAs
it was the the steroid related activity
um peptides
like I say I think have become such a
a buzzword
that it will now get dragged into the equation
um
with with all of the
the excitement around peptides
and obviously now
a very different group of people who are using them
from when they originally were out there
15 years ago um
what's your biggest concern when you
when you look at the market today
well
there's a huge misunderstanding when you say peptides
now people think of two things
they think of GLP-1s
and they think of BPC-157
and they don't know anything else
that's like the majority of people out there
that when they think of peptides
they're thinking massive weight loss
ultra weight loss
we're gonna just turn ourselves upside down
or they're thinking well, we're gonna heal an injury like this overnight
and I
I have friends who are using GLP-1s and they say I'm
I'm I'm really
you know really happy with the results
but I could never see me using peptides
well and that's just it for one
and we could argue back and forth on GLP-1s
on if they're safe or if they're not and this and that
I'm gonna tell you this
and I'm a very spiritual person and you know
people know that that follow me
and I say this out loud and I try
when I say things
without getting too passionate or too aggressive
or any of that
I just like to say things very slowly out loud
and then you hear it and then you tell me how it sounds
so I'm gonna do what I do
with people that are just staunch GLP-1 supporters
do you think that it's wise
to shut off your brain from thinking that it's hungry
and if so what happens when that switch flicks back on
if your body was intended to eat to survive
do you think that it's smart
to turn that mechanism of action off
and again I ask you what happens
because eventually that switch has to come back on
and of course it's not just food
you know we're seeing more and more
you know suggestions that
you know this could also lead to
you know potential positives around
sort of alcohol and substance abuse but
but also you know
suggestions that you know
people are working in you know
sort of go out there and get it type careers
investment banking they're like
we don't want you taking these things because uh
you may lose that sort of uh hunter gatherer mindset
you know
there's other facets here so people will argue well
I'm only microdosing it
and there are cognitive benefits
there are there are
there I'm not
gonna sit here and act like there's not benefits
I have studied these with some of the most brilliant
peptide minds in the world
and some people are very pro
some people are very anti
I am always in the camp of mindful usage
and understanding what you're getting yourself into
I have put out some studies about how it's
it can cause cellular aging
heart aging then there's people that will argue
it's got heart benefits but just remember something
this was designed for diabetes
this is a diabetic medication
that was
secondarily found to have the fat loss benefits
so you're also got to be
aware what the primary use of this was
it's kind of like Jardiance for example
it's an SGLT2 inhibitor designed for again diabetics
but it's found to have benefits
for people suffering from heart failure
so increased ejection fraction
but you have to remember what it's primarily used for
and that the trickle down it could have
when you're using it for something else
it wasn't intended for
so the problem that I have is this out of control
like and misunderstanding of what peptides are
and how many there are that do so many amazing things
I don't want people to think that all peptides are just
GLP-1s
that can potentially have
all these negative effects
unlimited amounts unlimited amounts
yeah. I mean, my favorite peptide is KPV
of all the peptides you could pick
that's my favorite
and then something like SS-31
that has shown potential to help heart failure
MOTS-c for mitochondrial health
Selank and Semax for people with anxiety and stress
and things that are having mental issues
these are the ones I look at that I have all the the
the the um
study and care in that I know have such value long term
so and
and BPC-157 fair enough is amazing for what it can do
I just want people to look beyond that
and see what else is there
and if someone was looking to do that
you know they
they were talking to you uh
you sat uh
you sat sipping a cup of tea um
and and
you know and
and they feel that a GLP-1 is right for them because
you know
and let's say we are going more towards the classic um
your indications for it and for weight loss
and you were sort of saying
you may want to consider some alternatives
what are those sort of alternatives to GLP-1s
which sit in the peptide family
my second favorite peptide is tesamorelin
and I'll tell you why I like tesamorelin
because it has the ability to drop fat
cut visceral fat
but still build lean muscle in the process
so it's I
I I always call it recomposition in a bottle
because it carries that ability
now of course
you have to have the right kind of diet and training
to coincide with that
but if you're looking anatomically
you have that ability
everybody should have the goal of dropping fat
and gaining lean muscle right
because you want to gain the lean muscle
it's not about looking at the scale
it's looking at your body fat and your composition
and how you feel so that's one
if you're just chasing weight loss
tesofensine
AOD-9604
these are all other good options. Ipamorelin
isn't gonna be as drastic on fat loss
but it certainly has that kind of benefit to it
so there's plenty of other options that I give people
as alternatives to look at
that have different mechanisms of action
have more safety efficacy
aren't gonna shut your mind off
aren't gonna make you starve or forget how to eat
so you know, there's definitely options out there for people
and and
and you touched on it briefly
and it's a very important point uh
around that sort of augmentation uh
of diet and exercise if somebody is determined to
to to go the GLP-1 pathway
or they're looking at some of the alternatives
what are sort of
and you know right now protein's the craze
uh to
you know to protect themselves um
and to to
you know to sort of take to
to advance the things which are important
well with GLP-1s
you have to you have to really put a focus on your diet
and you know right now proteins
you can get it in every
you can get it in everything these days
even star even Starbucks will do a pro
a protein matcha latte
if you go down the line from when I was a kid till now
first it was the low fat craze
which was like a decade
and every single thing had to be fat free or low fat
then we realized that that's not great
so then everything is low carb and I mean
the shittiest product in the world
as long as it said low carb
that's good for me haha
now every single thing has protein in it and I mean
I'm seeing everything under the sun and it's like
listen people
just because it's got added protein in it first of all
doesn't mean it's good-quality protein
and also there's a fine line you don't want it I mean
I don't care who it is there's a line where protein is too much
yep absolutely
it is one of the keys to muscle gain
and you wanna make sure especially on a GLP-1
you have adequate amounts now adequate amounts
we could argue what that is
but you are gonna need a little bit more
and is that 20% 30% more
what
what should somebody be looking at if they've got a
a sort of a you know a
a typical protein range but then they
you know they're going towards a GLP-1 where
where should they try and be percentage wise
this is more general because I'm a very
personalized person on everything I do
but with GLP-1 use
I would be more in like what I recommend to people
really training hard which is one
gram per pound of body weight
I'm not saying that's the end all be all
but that's what I would like to see people doing
just to ensure that you're getting
adequate amounts of nutrition
taking something like a GLP-1
because let me tell you something man
especially as you age
sarcopenia and muscle loss is very dangerous in
and in extreme conditions can be quite fatal
but certainly can really
really lower length of life and quality of life
when you start to lose too much muscle
and let me tell you something
when you lose that amount of muscle
and then you stop taking the GLP-1
you're gonna gain weight back
but you're not gonna gain the muscle back
so that's something to keep in mind
would you say that there is
a an over prescription of GLP-1s at the moment
in the United States
oh yeah
I would say there's definitely an over prescription
over desire to use misunderstanding on how to use
and in a like a glorification
so to speak where people will glamorize something
that they don't even know how to use
that they misuse
they abuse and then have adverse effects later on
there's a way to use them and a way to not use them
that's much safer and I think there's an abusive nature
and I also think that people buying them
are often going underground
and don't know what they're buying
they there's there
I'm not saying every underground site is bad
cause that would be a lie
but the way they pop up out of nowhere right now
most of them don't test their products
most of them are just throwing things out there
and a lot of the the peptides I'm talking to you about
you can't get from compounding pharmacies
which are not perfect either by the way
and so you have no choice but to go underground
so let's talk about that underground market
you've obviously seen it evolve over the last 15 years
what are what are
you know some of the benefits of of that market
obviously cost is is one of them
but what are some of the
the negatives that you've you seen
what are
what are some of the real sort of horror stories
things that you really wish uh
you know were not happening
well catalog is one of the benefits
cause you're gonna be able to get so many things
that you would not be able to get otherwise
the catalog on some places is to the highest level
and a lot of stuff that comes from China
the people out in China will tell companies hey
we got something new coming or this is being developed
and so they'll get a heads up on that
the really good ones will
and just on China
and just on China before we go any further
cause it's a common theme and a common misconception
what percentage would you say
of the raw materials in America's peptides
actually come from China
well probably 95% if not more I mean
the the vast majority
now things have changed a little bit
but the vast majority
and there's ways around disclosing it
but I know better and how it works
so when that when that sticker on the Bodega door says
you know made in America
then there's not a lot of truth to it
I have there is so many of those places that do that
that are so full of shit it is just undeniable
and it's maniacal to me
because it's just a flat ass lie
I mean it and there's
there's no way to quality control that
it's impossible
yeah don't
don't buy your peptides
next to the monster energy drink
it's it's if they're gonna lie about that on the poster
they're probably gonna lie about everything else
including the really important stuff such as the COA
I mean
what are some of the shenanigans that people are doing
with with COAs
I could make a COA in five minutes
I and I always tell people I say listen
you're going and buying places
that fake Louis Vuitton bags perfectly
like designer things perfectly
do you think they can't make you a COA in 5 minutes
like what the hell is wrong with you
and and it's it's that tax stamp anomaly
so if you're selling illegal drugs cocaine
you know heroin whatever
you can get charged with a tax stamp
meaning that you didn't file taxes on the money
you were doing selling the drugs
you know what I mean it's just this
this nonsense that then it's the same with this
there's no way to know if those were made in
America or not
cause nobody has to do anything in an FDA facility
when it's illegal to the FDA so
you know that is just nonsense absolute nonsense um
now one of the other things that I find rather funny
and I always say this
Reddit is the biggest cesspool of bad information
and hate
and just dipshits that I've ever seen in my life
so so go there for your protocol advice
if you wanna get as stupid as possible go to Reddit
well here's the thing and why I bring that up
so if you go to Reddit
you'll see these arguments in different forums
or whatever you wanna call them threads
where people are saying oh
this company is so much better
and I had so much better results with this company
and this company sucks
two things that I want to say of hilarity
and one shady and one hilarious
the shady is
is most of those places are bought and paid for
so they're owned and ran and they're controlled
secondly
you'll see them comparing 2 3 companies right
and I have a big smile on my face because I know this
because I've seen it and talked with all of the people
cause I'm privy to this information
they'll mention 3
4 different companies and say how shitty one is
and how great the other is
it's the same product because if they're buying
these companies
have drop shippers and manufacturing companies
that put the same product with a different label on it
so you you people that think you're so brilliant
you're taking the same shit that you're saying
doesn't work over here
because you're shilling for another company or lying
or whatever the case may be
it's the exact same thing in a different label
so
what should people actually be looking for with a COA
and and how can they tell if it's legitimate
you have to remember when somebody shows you a COA
you can call wherever they got the COA from
and verify it here's the problem
the companies they'll get a COA
and they'll test one batch of things
and just leave it up there like great you
you got a good batch of something
but that doesn't mean every single
bottle that they sold has been tested
and verifiable
so that's a whole another thing
some people will put batch numbers on their thing
and show you and you can call and verify it
so I would say first is follow up and check and see
and make sure that these are all flat out tested
and it's not a COA from a year ago on a batch
somebody got that sent in
cause you know
it costs a lot to get these things tested
so a lot of people they'll test once and then skip the
the whole thing from there on out
because it's not cheap
do you think
people are getting better at checking that now
and what should they be really looking for
I don't really follow it intently enough to know now
cause I'm not really like involved in that realm
cause I can pretty much I don't personally use any
really anymore to that extent
and I don't you know
I I kind of stopped using pretty much everything
aside from the TRT that I take
so I'm not really entrenched there now
but I I
I would recommend it and the
the things that I do take
I just get from I I work with a few different vitality
clinics that I just go to
that I get with so
but I think I think there's more awareness
I think there's more people in tune
with the need to do it yeah
cause I see people talk about it and discuss it
absolutely
so looking forward
where do you see this whole space going
and do you see peptides becoming more widely accepted
well I see a future of I say this alternative medicine
I think that the term conventional medicine is nonsense
and what we call conventional is actually non
conventional and something like peptides
to me would be more on the conventional side
considering what they are
and so I I do feel that the acceptance
level of these is growing by the day
and more people are coming to the realization
of the benefit I do worry that it's gonna again
get taken over somehow by Big Pharma
and it's kind of hard to avoid
so I don't know what they'll do to them
how they'll control them how they'll push them
but I do believe that more people are aware now
and going that route
you just never know when
with people that are in control and money
and how it's gonna affect them
and if they're gonna shift their ways or try to
you know take over
I hope and
envision that there is gonna be a lot more use
and understanding I just don't know to what level
Dylan thank you very much
it's been a fascinating conversation
thanks very much for joining us on Peptide Show
thanks for having me man