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TBPN is a live tech talk show hosted by John Coogan and Jordi Hays, streaming weekdays from 11–2 PT on X and YouTube, with full episodes posted to Spotify immediately after airing.
Described by The New York Times as “Silicon Valley’s newest obsession,” TBPN has interviewed Mark Zuckerberg, Sam Altman, Mark Cuban, and Satya Nadella. Diet TBPN delivers the best moments from each episode in under 30 minutes.
Do you know how I got here today? I drove through the Hollywood Hills, drove through the San Fernando Valley, because we're covering Hill And Valley today, but we're doing it from the TBPN UltraDrum. Have a whole bunch of news. Doesn't like it? Anyway, what do you think about this, Jordy?
Speaker 1:We have to recap some things. There's been a whole bunch of news. We had the great peptide debate of twenty twenty six. Brandon Guerrell on our team wrote about this in the newsletter today, tbpn.com. You can go subscribe.
Speaker 1:Who do you think won? I was talking to a lot of people. Very interesting. You had scheduled this. I wasn't even really aware that there was a peptide debate going on.
Speaker 1:We talked to some other folks on the show about peptides and how there was debate rating. And I was aware of the meme, like the Chinese peptides in Silicon Valley, all of that stuff. But I wasn't aware of, like, that the debate was boiling to a particular point and that there were a lot of people that were discussing So it was great timing, so thank you for organizing that. And thank you to our guests, Max and Martin, who took the time to come and talk to us. And I thought did a really good job of being simultaneously entertaining and also very cordial.
Speaker 1:Like, they weren't actually going at each other's throats. They were scoring points, but I don't think that either of them crossed any lines. Yeah. There was some there was some discussion over, should we have done more fact checking? I genuine I generally think that the chat is good for fact checking.
Speaker 2:Or the experts.
Speaker 1:Yeah. It's kind of like your view. But I don't know.
Speaker 2:Yeah. There's a bunch there's a bunch of people that made very fair points pointing out, you know, a study here or a patent here. Yeah. And it would have been great if we got to a conclusion yesterday and it was like, yeah, this is all bad and Yeah. Should all be banned or, you know, they're all good or or figured it out.
Speaker 1:But But that's where we started.
Speaker 2:We started with,
Speaker 1:like, with, like yeah. Everyone there agrees that GLP ones that are owned by pharmaceutical companies are probably not beneficial, blah, blah, blah. And then the really far out stuff that hasn't been studied that's made in a basement is probably risky. And we actually had a good friend of the show, Sum It Up, Creatine Cycle, Atlas, of course, said, The peptide debate is as follows: Against. I would be worried about unknown unknowns.
Speaker 1:Pro. While there isn't much human data, the anecdotal evidence is pretty strong. Anecdotes are not enough for me. Pro. Fair.
Speaker 1:It is for me. Against. Okay. Fair. And I think that's a good point.
Speaker 1:And truthfully, people can make their own decisions here. I do think interjecting with a ton of fact checking during the debate would be disruptive. I'm not a fan of that. I sort of just like having one person, like, the the the guest, the debater fact check the other person. Because if they know the fact and the other person who they're debating against drops something that's not factual, that's their opportunity to come in and say, no, that's not accurate.
Speaker 2:Throw that canister whenever
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Martin had. Oh. Throw it.
Speaker 1:Throw the flash bang. Throw the smoke grenade. But but I do so so I like I like leaving some of the fact checking up to them and and then just trying to recenter the debate as a moderator. But I don't know. Should we do more of these?
Speaker 1:Let us know. It seemed like a lot of people had a lot of fun with it and were entertained. It's hard to come up with you know, if we were going to try and do this weekly, it'd be very hard to come up with, like, 52 really hot topics that everyone cares about, and there are two opposing experts who are willing to hash it out and be entertaining on a live show. Probably not going to happen all that much, but when the time is right, I think there's an opportunity for us to do another debate. Someone was saying we should do an accelerationist versus decelerationist debate.
Speaker 1:I think Bev Jazos was proposing that. I think that would be sort of interesting. I think I could maybe sit in the middle of that and have some interesting discussions there.
Speaker 2:Kind of like 60 miles per hour, stay under the speed limit Yes, kind of yes,
Speaker 1:yes. Well, on that factor, I am an extreme accelerationist. Leading up to the debate yesterday, we had several guests on the show discuss peptides. In February, Andrew Huberman came on and predicted that Retta, essentially a more aggressive Ozempic, become a trillion dollar drug. That same day, we had longevity entrepreneur Brian Johnson on the show.
Speaker 1:He encouraged people thinking about taking peptides to be cautious because we don't know what the negative effects of these drugs are. And last week, Maximus CEO, Cameron Maximus, which I don't think is his real name. Is his last name Maximus? No, it's not. It's
Speaker 2:I can't.
Speaker 1:But I like to think of him as Doctor. Cameron Maximus.
Speaker 2:That is his name on X.
Speaker 1:Oh, okay, okay. That makes sense. But I He argued that there's no real reason to be taking Reta, not FDA approved, only available in the gray market, when they could be taking when people who are, you know, in the market or, you know, their doctor recommends something, they could be taking tirzepatide, which is essentially has the same benefits, can be bought legally, and it's FDA approved. Yesterday, So Schreli argued Martin Schreli argued that the current peptide craze is more psychology driven than science driven, and is essentially a passing fad among Silicon Valley elites who aren't really expert trusters. In his view, there is no rational reason to experiment with compounds like Retta when proven regulated drugs like Ozempic already exist.
Speaker 1:He thinks gray markets should be shut down entirely, and there was a big debate over how feasible is it to actually try and shut down the gray markets. Gray markets have existed in a whole bunch of other categories. I'm very familiar with the gray market for illegal flavored vaporizers because they have been the bane of the legitimate industry, the nicotine industry, that's been the bane of their existence. Martin argued that the FDA's rigorous approval process exists for a reason. Now, we had Max arguing the peptide bull case.
Speaker 1:He argued that he doesn't believe all peptides are safe and effective, but that a subset of them likely have real therapeutic value. He said that since people are already using peptides, a regulated white market would reduce harm compared to the current gray market. Lots to debate there. We'll let you make your own decisions. You can go listen to the full debate, and you can see where you weigh in.
Speaker 1:How not having Tyler Cosgrove in the TBPN UltraDome is it's a death knell for our clapping during the ad read strategy. We need to get some soundboard going. We need to show these supporters, these sponsors some love because we're we're fighting we're fighting two men down right now, maybe three men down. We're we're we're on our last leg over here in the TBPN trip. Apple is in a completely different situation.
Speaker 1:They have their heir apparent, John Ternus, the nice guy, potentially taking the reins maybe this year, maybe next year. It could happen any day now. Tim Cook doesn't wanna talk about retirement, but John Ternus is emerging as his most likely successor. This is from a friend of the show, Mark Gurman in Bloomberg. Go subscribe.
Speaker 1:This is an interesting profile of John Ternus from March 2026, just two days ago this, was published. And it tells an interesting story of John Ternus, and I think Gurman does a great job of going deeper than some of the other reporting that had, like, one quote from an employee that left Apple a decade ago and was sort of vague, and that person doesn't have like any sort of profile, and it was very hard to read into who is John Ternus as a person. I think we're getting a clearer picture now. Let's read through some of this, and then I want you to cosplay as John Ternus and let me know, would you do things differently? Do you agree with his management style?
Speaker 1:Because this might be the management style of all of Apple soon. The company's chief operating officer recently retired. The CFO and general counsel took smaller roles as a way to prepare for their own retirements. And in a single week in December, its heads of artificial intelligence, user interfaces, and environmental initiatives all announced their departures. While part of the exodus was related to Apple's, Inc.
Speaker 1:Well documented struggles in AI, it also reflected a logical transition at a company that turns 50 on April 1. Apple stock made everyone at the top of its org chart fabulously wealthy, and many are entering the stage of life that often inspires people to prioritize family spending some time finally spending some time with their families instead of the next generation of iPhones. In his response to the employee's question, Tim Cook, the company's 65 year old CEO, struck an atypically reflective tone. When people get to a certain age, some, he said, are going to retire, letting the word some hang out there in a way that suggested he wasn't talking about himself, drawing laughter from the audience. It's like, some people, they they they can't hang.
Speaker 1:But look at Warren Buffett, 65 to 95, most productive era of
Speaker 2:his Tim Cook generational run starts now.
Speaker 1:I like the idea of Cook at for the next I'm 30 I'm still bullish, Tim Cook. I mean, I love John Ternus. But I think the thirty year run from Tim Cook going 65 to 95 would be particularly fun to watch.
Speaker 2:Tim Cook was going to retire. Then he started experimenting with some Chinese pep.
Speaker 1:Oh, you think that's what's going on? He's always Now looking
Speaker 2:he's like, I actually got another few decades in me.
Speaker 1:I hope so. He's like, yeah, actually, it's BBC one five seven having a remarkable effects on me. Alright. So he said, the thing we have to do is to make sure that Apple moves on, reaches the next level and the next level and the next level. And he said he spends a lot of time thinking about who's in the room in five, ten, fifteen years.
Speaker 1:I'm obsessed with this. This is Tim Cook at his best. This guy can't leave. He can't leave. He's firing me up here.
Speaker 2:I'm obsessed listening Sunrun.
Speaker 1:Yes. It's amazing. So Cook, who's run Apple since taking over from cofounder Steve Jobs in 2011, probably doesn't expect to be in the room himself for another fifteen years, but I do. I'm betting on him. Well, he's given no indication of an imminent transition.
Speaker 1:He's made it clear he wants his air to come from within the company so he can serve as a mentor. The central candidate is John Ternus, senior vice president for hardware engineering, who oversees development of the devices that generate roughly 80% of Apple's revenue. At 50, Ternus is also younger than many of the company's other senior leaders, meaning he could be in the top job longer. Ternus has spent about half of his life at Apple. Half of his life, Generational run.
Speaker 1:He cut his teeth developing computer monitors, oversaw product design for the original iPad, and eventually took over development of the Mac, getting the top hardware engineering role in 2021. He's overseen an expansion in Apple's product lineup, improving quality and focusing on functional improvements around battery life, performance, and connectivity. Earlier this month, when Apple held an event in New York to announce the MacBook Neo, a May laptop, it was Ternus, not Cook, who did the big reveal.
Speaker 2:Little trial run.
Speaker 1:The next day, Ternus also appeared on Good Morning America to talk up the device, the type of media appearance Cook has generally done himself. Such public signs of confidence in Ternus have been accompanied by steady expansion of his portfolio. Last year, he took control of a secretive unit developing robot robots, including a tabletop device with a screen that swirls to focus on a speaker moving
Speaker 2:around Smart the lamp.
Speaker 1:Is this what it is? No. It's not a smart lamp. It's No. The
Speaker 2:It's the iPad that on a on a Yeah. Swivel arm.
Speaker 1:Yeah. The iPad that follows you around so that you can ask you questions and FaceTime with your friends.
Speaker 2:Can from anywhere. Think there's a rumor that it can do kickflips, but
Speaker 1:I'd be super into that. If it has a motor, you've seen those motor those robots that are on the bikes, and it's just a big battery pack with like a robotic arm that's attached to it. Have you seen this? Oh, this is amazing.
Speaker 2:Apple comes out with a with a with a smart iPad device that's that's just called a bicycle for the iPad. It's just it's just a little bicycle.
Speaker 1:No. No. No. If you if you have a weight up here and you have and you have a robotic arm that can hinge down, if you pull that up really quickly, you can actually jump up. And so there's all these crazy videos of these robot bikes, like, jumping up onto tables and stuff.
Speaker 1:It's very fun. Ternus has taken a bigger role in Apple's product marketing, sometimes personally editing copy for the website and even product event materials, and he has become central to the company's work to make its devices more environmentally sustainable. Ternus has also assumed oversight of the hardware and software design teams, making him a key liaison between Apple's vaunted design organization and senior management, meaning he's already one of the most influential people in the company's history. He has made a mark on Apple's hardware portfolio, reversing a trend of declining product quality as the company prioritized thinness and sleekness over performance. He is a very meticulous engineer and a judicious executive, says Tony Blevins, the company's chief procurement officer until 2022, who described Ternus as an outstanding and obvious choice to succeed Cook.
Speaker 1:He's a car he's a car racing enthusiast. He's a cycling enthusiast. I assume cycling means performance enhancing drugs? Yeah. Cycles?
Speaker 1:Trend. Trend? Testosterone? No. He is a bicyclist and a car racing enthusiast.
Speaker 1:Ternus is known to take his colleagues to Upstate Washington for off road rally car racing. Let's go. Excellent choice, Tim Cook. I see why you picked bullish. His love of motorsports, notwithstanding, Ternus, like Cook, is risk averse and reluctant to, as one person close to him puts it, upset the apple cart.
Speaker 1:Good pun. As one longtime executive says, if you think Tim's Tim Cook is doing a good job, then you'll think John Ternus is doing a good job too.
Speaker 2:That also feels like an underhanded
Speaker 1:It's maybe a dig. I have been a staunch defender of Tim Cook. Did well on the supply chain, did well on the tariffs, did well negotiating all sorts of tough things, wound up with a great partnership with Gemini, like wound up in like always looks bad as you're like investigating one feature on a one month time when you zoom out over a decade, incredible amount of value created, incredible performance, and very few weaknesses in the business from my perspective. But you can take the other side of that because I know you're frustrated by every app that they release lately.
Speaker 2:Who knows? Not just the apps.
Speaker 1:Not just the apps.
Speaker 2:The operating system itself.
Speaker 1:Also, I mean, the new material is rough. Like, I dropped this phone a lot, and it's very scratched. Despite his reputation for personable management, so he's known as a very nice manager, nice guy. He's the nice guy at Apple. Ternus has, at times, broken with that style in ways that raised eyebrows internally.
Speaker 1:Late in the lead up to the release of the VisionPRO headset, my favorite Apple device ever, unironically, For instance, engineers uncovered a flaw that threatened one of the device's marquee features. It's the ability to stream You're
Speaker 2:not the average user, John. You use I'm power user. The average user doesn't use the
Speaker 1:Yeah. I'm like five standard deviations above on the usage. So the ability to stream ultra low latency audio from the headset to AirPods. This apparently was a capability central to Apple's pitch of a seamless experience for immersive video and gaming.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So you just bought this this
Speaker 1:$3,500
Speaker 2:device. $3,500 face computer.
Speaker 1:And and $3,500 was the headline they're telling
Speaker 2:you and they're telling
Speaker 1:you When I bought one, it was close to $5.
Speaker 2:Just think it's so funny that they shipped this, you know, 3 to $5,000 Yes. You know, computer for your head that's super heavy. And they're like, and you're gonna need to grab some AirPods.
Speaker 1:Yeah. It was clearly important to Apple. Apple's always prided itself on device integration, hardware integration, and they are great at that. Like, you put in the AirPods and and you switch over to a YouTube video on your on your MacBook, and it just plays right there. You switch over to your phone.
Speaker 1:You take a call. It switches right back. Like, the connectivity with their Bluetooth strategy and their wireless strategy has always been fantastic. But apparently, it wasn't going well with the development of the VisionPRO headset. So the ability to stream ultra low latency audio from the headset to AirPods, this was a capability central to Apple's pitch of a seamless experience for immersive video and gaming.
Speaker 1:The problem stemmed from a missing wireless frequency in the net in the then newest AirPods Pro. The only practical fix was to ship a revised version of the earbuds, which the company did at the 2023. It was sort of a weird move, probably cost them some extra money to do. It was a mistake that was caused by a particular hardware engineer on this team. When they launched the Apple Vision Pro in February 2024, that meant that anyone who wanted this feature, they just paid $3,500 They had to spend another $250 on new AirPods that added the ultra low latency support and not much else.
Speaker 1:And so this was a debacle, And the debacle reverberated through multiple teams, including hardware, software, testing, and the VisionPRO group. People involved said Ternus alienated some people on staff by focusing initially on finding out whom to blame.
Speaker 2:Who did it?
Speaker 1:In the aftermath, a senior AirPods executive was reassigned. I'm laughing because I so I asked Jordy this morning. I said, Okay. I gave him like the overall broad strokes of what happened. And what was your first recommendation
Speaker 2:for Shut down both product lines.
Speaker 1:Shut down both
Speaker 2:Just shut product product lines down entirely. And then I would have focused on coming out with a pair of wired headsets made of wood using horsehair Horsehair. For the actual connectivity.
Speaker 1:Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 2:And then
Speaker 1:No wires at all.
Speaker 2:Yeah. And then sort of like with a leather
Speaker 1:Certainly no plastics. No macroplastics or microplastics.
Speaker 2:Yeah. It's probably creating some type of tallow to make them more comfortable.
Speaker 1:You don't want the wood. So you can put splinters in Splinters your like a beef So you lubricate your ear canal with beef tallow.
Speaker 2:Just go back to basics.
Speaker 1:Just back
Speaker 2:to Introducing AirPod Yeah. Caveman.
Speaker 1:Caveman. Yeah. Yeah. That that's what you thought.
Speaker 2:That's where I would have started. This issue comes down to, from my understanding Yeah. This senior executive who is responsible, it was the AirPod. Right? Yeah.
Speaker 2:He did not process that the Apple Vision Pro was coming out Yeah. And they were selling against this feature. It's a misreport. And Apple yeah. And and and Apple the thing that I think they still do really well Yeah.
Speaker 2:To this day, even though, you know, almost all their other software on the iPhone is is a total disaster
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Is connectivity between the devices Yeah. And syncing them and things like that. So they still do that well. Yeah. And so to come out with this and in a in just a blatant sort of unforced error, didn't didn't communicate properly with the other teams.
Speaker 1:Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 2:For the AirPods, which are just designed to sync perfectly with all the other
Speaker 1:It would be like it would be like if if one of the cameras was blurry or something like that. It's like, well, the iPhone, like, yeah, it's not it's not, you know, dominating AI crazy features yet, but, like, everyone counts on the iPhone for having a good set of cameras. Like, they're always good. And so if you mess up something that is is the basis of the strategy, that is risky. You know, is is he is he is he a nice guy or is he too hard?
Speaker 1:Ternus looks at mistakes as systemic problems that could be solved with better leadership instead of by putting the onus on the engineer, someone who said who worked for him, and this person adds, Ternus is a nice guy. It's a throwback to the the Steve Jobs era. Like, Jobs would have said, hey. I demanded this. Like, you made a mistake.
Speaker 1:Like, heads must roll. And that was a bit of the company culture, at least in the lore. And who knows how true that is, but this doesn't seem like it goes too far into like ruthless business behavior. But that's sort of where the discussion is around Ternus. It's like, is he a pure nice guy?
Speaker 1:Does he have a harder edge? I don't know.
Speaker 2:I think Ternus didn't go hard enough.
Speaker 1:Didn't go hard enough. Yeah. Yeah. Should have got after him personally. We were featured in the world's 50 most innovative companies, the definitive guide to the future of business.
Speaker 1:We're up there with Tubi, Google, Walmart, BYD. These are some big companies. Ramp got a nod, and TBPN got a nod right next to Ramp. And they sent us a very nice letter, and we are sitting here with a nice little mural of a bunch
Speaker 2:of our guests.
Speaker 1:Who do we get? We got Brian Arcon and Spiegel.
Speaker 2:Tell me tell me who we got We beat were the number two media company.
Speaker 1:We were the number two most innovative media company. Got beat out by a CDN. Matthew Prince over at Cloudflare smoked us.
Speaker 2:Smoked
Speaker 1:us. Smoked us.
Speaker 2:Smoked He
Speaker 1:didn't stand a chance. Just look at the scale of Cloudflare. They distribute so much media. That's what it's a content delivery network. They deliver content.
Speaker 1:We try and deliver content. We we deliver three hours a day. They deliver probably billions of hours a second. I can't even imagine the scale of that business. It's everywhere.
Speaker 1:But Matthew Prince is a very innovative leader, and I completely agree with the ranking that
Speaker 2:he should coming for you next year.
Speaker 1:We're coming next year, Matthew. It's on. Producers at CNBC wake up in the morning to look at the public markets in order to plan the day's lineup. John Coogan and Jordy Hayes, cohosts of TBPN, a daily talk show devoted to the business of technology, wake up and look at what's trending on x. That's true.
Speaker 1:And then they gab. That's us. Quote says, Hayes, we cover something like 50 to a 100 topics rapid fire, five days a week in bespoke suits, the duo riff on the news for three interrupted hours accompanied by a revolving cast of venture investors, startup founders, and the occasional single name elite like Zuck. On good days, the livestream draws more than a 130,000 simultaneous viewers. Millions more watch the highlighted clips and listen to the podcast.
Speaker 1:We basically leverage the algorithm. Howie Hayes says of TBPN's programming strategy. Love them or hate them. They do a really good job of sorting what people are interested in. Anyway, you can go check it out.
Speaker 2:As as a boy, I subscribed to the print edition of Fast Company and always looked forward to getting it in the physical mailbox at home.
Speaker 1:Unwell. Alex Cooper's network is 23. So how she must be media. She must be higher than us.
Speaker 2:What's the category, though?
Speaker 1:Oh, I don't know.
Speaker 2:Because if Cloudflare is a media company
Speaker 1:Call it Mediavine.
Speaker 2:Unwell might
Speaker 1:be It might be a CDN. Who knows? Yeah. Let's see. Unwell was ranked oh, Unwell is in the advertising and marketing category, but not media news.
Speaker 1:Cloudflare is media news, and we are second behind Cloudflare. That is interesting. I would I would say unwell beat us fair and
Speaker 2:square in the words of the Canadian Olympic team, John, silver shines just as bright.
Speaker 1:We've been on a bit of a silver tear lately. We're the second highest ranked technology show on Spotify. Thank you to everyone who's been subscribing and leaving us five star reviews over there.
Speaker 2:And, yeah, thank you to Team Canada for Pioneering. Making it a little bit more Pioneering cope as strategy.
Speaker 1:It's a marketing strategy.
Speaker 2:OpenAI's new nonprofit foundation announces plans to spend 1,000,000,000 this year and has appointed OpenAI cofounder, Waj, and Jacob of Coefficient, giving to leadership positions, still searching for an executive director.
Speaker 1:Mhmm.
Speaker 2:Sam says AI will help discover new science such as cures for diseases, which is perhaps the most important way to increase quality of life long term. AI will also present new threats to society that we have to address. No company can sufficiently mitigate these on their own. We will need a society wide response to things like novel bio threats, a massive and fast change to the economy, extremely capable models causing complex emergent effects across society, and more. So it's great that this has gotten set up, I know.
Speaker 2:You can imagine just how much has I would gone into this.
Speaker 1:Would love to see them. I mean, they have a lot of money here. They're gonna be donating a lot of money. I think it's gonna be the best funded nonprofit in the history of humanity. That's very exciting.
Speaker 1:I would love just a little carve out for developing, like, consumer apps or consumer technology. I mean, they've had so much success spinning things out. It's it's funded the nonprofit so effectively.
Speaker 2:Why not keep it going?
Speaker 1:Yeah. Why change horses in the middle of a stream? If it ain't broke, don't fix it. Right?
Speaker 2:In other news
Speaker 1:What else is on?
Speaker 2:Andrew Bosworth is taking over supervision of the company's efforts to become AI native. That's He's going to be overseeing Meta's AI for Work initiative that was previously led by another exec.
Speaker 1:He's been with Trusted General. Yeah. He's been there for so long.
Speaker 2:Yes. This is AI for Work is their internal initiatives. Yeah. These are gonna be, I think, like, internal products that help the company operate more efficiently. This, you know, signals a a shift Mhmm.
Speaker 2:A deprioritization of the metaverse, which has been obviously, you know, in the works in different ways for quite a while. But Dreamer
Speaker 1:What's going on?
Speaker 2:Is joining Meta Superintelligence Labs. Interesting. David Singleton shared, excited to announce that his founder his co founders and the entire team over at Dreamer are joining Meta. The last few months have been extraordinary. We built Dreamer, put the beta in the world just a month ago, and saw magic come to life for real people.
Speaker 2:Since then, thousands of people have used Dreamer to build personal intelligent software with our sidekick in the world's newest and most popular programming language, English. They're building and sharing agents to manage email calendar, to dos, create learning tools for their kids, learn new languages, plan trips with friends, become better cooks, help them with work, achieve their health goals, or simply to creatively express themselves. All sorts of surprising and unique personal needs. These are agents as unique as the people building them because they're built exactly each person wants them to meet. We've captured some of our favorites.
Speaker 2:Yeah. People are building timers, receipt scanners, citation assistant. This is great if you're using ChatGPT to do your homework. You can build a little citation assistant. People are building personal financial apps.
Speaker 2:Yeah. I'm curious, again, with with any of these sort of meta MSL acquisitions, you have to wonder, this can you read into their product direction at all with the acquisition? Is Meta gonna be making is Meta AI gonna have the ability to make your own agents? That is still to be seen.
Speaker 1:Most people will think like Aquahire rolled into Manus, rolled into other products. At the same time, there is an interesting like diffusion in consumer question that's going on that I think might be a little bit underrated. Just the question of what will adoption and retention be like when you don't have to buy a MacBook or a Mac Mini, when you don't have to get any API keys at all versus it's an app on your phone versus it's in ChatGPT or it's Instagram. Bundling those things together, actually, we never really got firm data on how much llamas
Speaker 2:I really want to build an agent that can predict which videos
Speaker 1:Mhmm.
Speaker 2:Funny videos that I would send to you Yes. And just have it do it automatically. Because I think we're our feeds are pretty synced up right Yes. Now where sometimes John will send me a a video. Yep.
Speaker 2:And then I just got started. Ten minutes later, I'll send him the same video, but I didn't see that he sent it. Then you look
Speaker 1:at it. Let's let's go over to the Chinese billionaire who says America's EV market is doomed without him. Not a problem because we're building v eights and v twelves over here, baby. We're going back. We're going back.
Speaker 1:No.
Speaker 2:This is serious. Timing for for all of this. Bad timing for for our our our desires to get the Tesla Roadster to have a naturally aspirated V 12.
Speaker 1:Well, maybe good timing.
Speaker 2:Given energy prices.
Speaker 1:Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's rough. Anyway, Robin Zhang of Cattl, c a t l, can't build a factory in America, but Tesla, Ford, and GM rely on its technology.
Speaker 1:Inside a headquarters that's shaped like a giant battery cell, you gotta give it to them. That's design. That's what we need to be seeing from our tech leaders. Apple did it well with the UFO campus. I wanna see more headquarters that are shaped like a product that you sell.
Speaker 1:The billionaire who runs the world's largest battery company confident that Americans will come calling eventually.
Speaker 2:I got a great post from Gary Tan Tell me. Who we can cap the show off with. He says, I guess the amazing thing that my haters don't understand is you have no idea how much I eat your hate for breakfast. I am uniquely a person who is driven by all the energy you give me in particular.
Speaker 1:Love it. Love it. Prime agent says, I like funny g stack berry Gary better than M and M Gary.
Speaker 2:And we'll end the show Yes. With a note from Naval.
Speaker 1:What does say?
Speaker 2:He says, a lot of software is about to get a lot better right before it becomes unnecessary.
Speaker 1:Interesting.
Speaker 2:What does he mean by this?
Speaker 1:Who knows? Who knows? We'll let
Speaker 2:you But it's provocative.
Speaker 1:Sign Sign up for a newsletter at tvpn.com and we will see you tomorrow at 11AM sharp. Throw We some flash
Speaker 2:love you.
Speaker 1:Get ready. Tomorrow. Goodbye.