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Long Game: A Heated Rivalry Podcast is a re-watch and deep-dive podcast dedicated to Heated Rivalry, hosted by Declan and Silvan. In each episode, we revisit key moments across the series, unpacking the slow-burn tension, character development, and emotional beats that make the heated rivalry world so compelling. Through thoughtful discussion, close reading, and a fan-informed lens, we explore themes of competition, intimacy, identity, and growth over time, celebrating not just the heat of the rivalry, but the long game it takes to truly understand these characters and their relationship.
New episodes published every Sunday
Silvan (00:00)
Hi everyone, welcome to Lone Game.
A heated rivalry podcast. Now, we are so excited to have Alex Cross join us on the podcast today.
Now Alex is the author of the books Echoes of Us Becoming Us When we ignite and from our ashes. We also know her from our book club as the mother of Ati and Noah.
So we are going to get into the emotional roller coaster of it all in our conversation today. So thank you so much for joining us, Alex.
Alex Cross (00:30)
Thank you so much for inviting me.
Declan (00:33)
Mm, we're really looking forward to this. Everyone on the book club has really enjoyed the characters and the story and all the themes that you include in the books. So I was really excited whenever you agreed to come on because I've been following you for a little bit now and slowly making my way for your books. So I have one left. And yeah, I was just very excited. Thank you very much for agreeing to it.
Alex Cross (00:57)
That's amazing. But I'm really I'm so flattered.
Silvan (01:02)
So Declan is a lot more prolific in his reading than I am, and he was the one who was like, You have to read these books. So I did. I bought the books. I've annotated
Alex Cross (01:10)
Yeah.
Silvan (01:11)
the books. I'm sorry if I'm not supp if I'm not allowed to do that. But it's just like
Alex Cross (01:14)
Yeah, you are.
Silvan (01:16)
the notes and it the the writing just came so freely. I I was sort of wondering for anyone who's not familiar with your background, like when did you start writing?
Alex Cross (01:27)
Okay, I I feel like that's a long story. So I'm gonna go on a tangent in the f in the very first question. But
Declan (01:33)
Yeah.
Alex Cross (01:36)
I feel like it all comes down to I was like the the youngest of all of my cousins and of my siblings and everything, and it sounds it it sounds really sad, but it's not. Like nobody wanted to play with me when I was a kid. So and I was also I know it sounds sad, but I swear it's not traumatizing. and I'm
Painfully shy and I've always been that way. So before the age of computers and iPads and everything, you basically only had yourself to entertain yourself. And that made me into a chronic daydreamer. So ever since I can remember, I've always been living inside of my head with stories. And I mean this like ever since I was a little, little kid, it's always been love stories for some reason.
as I started growing up, I had a lot of trouble when I was a kid because I was diagnosed dyslexic and I have ADHD. And
For some reason, Spanish was really hard for me to read and write. It was really, really hard for me. And when I was like around 11 or 12, I started reading books in English. And that did something to my brain. It just, it sort of clicked for me. And this came from having teachers and having everybody in school tell me that I was never gonna be good at reading or writing. And then just like right now I could be in their face, like, you know, ha. But I just
It opened up a whole new world for me and I turned into a very big reader. I loved reading and I started reading romance when I was like 15. I had an aunt who gave me the books, which I don't recommend,
Declan (03:18)
Mm-hmm.
Alex Cross (03:19)
but I started reading romance when I was 15. And that made me a little bit more curious. And then around that time, it was the time when we started having computers in our houses. And when I had access to one, I started playing around with writing.
And then my life took sort of a detour and a ton of sad, bad things happened. And then when I eventually found like my path again in life and I was at a steady job, which was when I was around like around 23, I think, I discovered fan fiction. And I started reading fanfiction and I mean like I read it constantly.
Constantly. It's all I ever did was read fanfiction. Because of course, when I discovered fanfiction was when I discovered also MM stories and queer stories. And that was something that was incredible to me. And I love the fact that we got happy endings in these stories versus what we got in movies and stuff. And one day I just decided, like I have this idea of this book in my head, but it's fanfiction. And I started to write it.
And then one story story turned into another, and another, and another, and another. And I published for a while. I think I have like four fan fictions published, but since I wrote in my phone, which was what I had available to me at the time, and Google Docs, which I still use, I have like a folder that's filled. I must have like around 40 or 50 stories that are not finished, but I've started them over and over and over.
And then I think you know this about me, but I'm a chef by profession. But I had two little kids and restaurant work is not it doesn't work having kids because you don't have weekends, you don't have special occasions, you have crazy, insane hours all the time. And I worked as an executive chef, which meant I had to do more of the of the back end of stuff, but it still required me to be in the place at all times.
And when I was close to having my second kid, I started thinking like I need to maybe make decisions and see what I can do with my life and see if I can work with the kitchen and stuff in in a different way that'll give me more time and give me more flexibility. And when I was in that maternity leave, it was really, really bad. my youngest didn't sleep at all for months and months on end. And
The only thing that kept me up at night was writing on my phone. So she'd be nap trapped, I'd have her on top of me, and I just, I just write. And when I was doing that, I was thinking I don't have any path in life right now. I don't know what I'm gonna do for work. So what if this time I didn't write fan fiction? What if this time I wrote original characters? And I think it was it was so quick.
Around two months, or I think a little bit less than that, I wrote my first book. And when I did that, one of my friends I told one of my best friends, and she told me, and I I feel like that phrase is like something that completely changed my life. And she said, You know, you can publish your own books on Amazon, right? And that just altered the course of my life. And I said, I am gonna dive into this, I am gonna figure out how you do everything. Because when I started writing those original characters,
Every second that I spent daydreaming, it just sort of magnified. And it wasn't just them. I started thinking of so many other stories and so many other characters I wanted to write. And everything just started clicking. And I said, Yeah, I'm gonna do this and I'm gonna do it the right way. I'm gonna do courses. I'm gonna figure out what authors do. I'm gonna figure out what the steps are and I'm gonna publish this book. Which I didn't actually. I I never I've never published the first book I wrote of original characters. I started writing Echoes of Us.
I finished Echoes of Us and when I finished Echoes, I said no, this is the book that I want to publish first.
Declan (07:23)
Hmm. That's so interesting. It's also really inspiring as well that obviously you being dyslexic and ADHD, then becoming a writer is wonderful. That's
Alex Cross (07:35)
Yeah.
Declan (07:35)
that's such an achievement, a really brilliant thing to do. and the fact that you're also writing in your second language, that's kind of crazy, Alex. I mean
Alex Cross (07:44)
Yeah. But but
to be fair to be fair, I can't write in my native tongue. Like I'm terrible at it.
Declan (07:52)
Really?
Alex Cross (07:53)
I can't write in Spanish. I can't I mean like people have asked me if I'm gonna do translations because I could technically translate my own books and
Declan (07:59)
Yeah.
Alex Cross (08:00)
I'm like, No, no, there is no way.
Declan (08:03)
Wow.
Wow. That's so interesting. I also like the way that you got into MM, very similar to me. I sort of just like fell into it. I didn't I it hadn't occurred to me that positive, like queer romance stories just existed. I thought everything was like
Alex Cross (08:18)
Some
Declan (08:19)
sad and brutal and you know, was all about the negativity of being queer and having really negative queer experiences. Obviously.
very
important for those stories to be told, but nothing was ever like very uplifting or just fun or you know romantic. It was always something quite dark. So I just randomly found a book that was MM romance and it was Boyfriend Goals by Riley Hart. And I read that and I was like, my God
Alex Cross (08:51)
Yeah.
Declan (08:52)
Why have I been reading anything else? And it just took off from
Alex Cross (08:55)
Yeah, exactly.
Declan (08:56)
there.
But yeah, it's really, really interesting that you sort of fell into it in a very similar way in free fan fiction as well, which I'm hearing is a lot more common than I expected.
Alex Cross (09:06)
Yeah. I think there's a lot of authors that I've met that you kind of feel like they came out of nowhere and then when you speak to them it's like, No, I've been publishing in Wattpad or I've been publishing in fact fiction and in AO three for years and years. because it's just easier and I think a lot of us didn't know that KDP was an option and that it was so easy and that you could control it and do all of these things. It just it just
You know, it feels like a a hobby and something that you just think about by yourself and you don't think somebody's actually gonna be interested, even though there are people following you in fanfiction and reading your stuff. Like you still think nobody's gonna actually pay me for this.
Silvan (09:49)
Take all my money, Alex, honestly. And
Declan (09:51)
Yeah.
Silvan (09:52)
and this narrative of a lot of authors starting out in fanfiction like you were saying, is is a lot more common than I actually realize. We were speaking to Scarlett Drake a few weeks ago and she was saying something, you know, very similar as well. What was it like for you then to transition from, you know, writing for yourself or writing for fanfiction to actually writing to then be published?
Alex Cross (10:16)
God, I think publishing was a shock to my system. It was very hard, very, very hard. I published again, I was just sort of investigating on my own and I didn't know anybody. So I started my my Bookstagram account after I published, I think around a month after that. And a lot of the people, like authors and editors and everything, I've met through Instagram rather than TikTok. And I had a teeny tiny platform in TikTok when I published.
So I didn't know anything about alpha readers or beta readers. I didn't know anything about ARCs. I just I did have somebody who copy and line edit it my book and I had somebody who proofread it. But it was a very professional way of editing. Like I gave them the manuscript, they gave it to me back, and there was no discussion, like you have to fix it all yourself.
So I feel like that kind of closes the door into you being able to ask questions and educate yourself into what you're supposed to do and how the process is supposed to be. So I literally just pushed my book out in the world and had to figure out what was gonna happen. And then I started getting readers and I started getting reviews and I started to panic basically. because I'm very I I feel like I'm a very, very emotional person and
I've always needed to manage like the highs and the lows in my life. And getting review also, nobody told me you're not supposed to go in Goodreads. So I was in Goodreads all the time, reading my reviews that first month. And my emotional state, it was just ups and downs and ups and downs and ups and downs all the time. I was never at a stable place. I was never emotionally like I felt like I was shaking all the time. It was horrible.
And then I met my very first author friend who had just published the book, the one I told you that publishes really quickly. And we started talking. And she was the one who told me, please, please, please don't go on Goodreads. And as I stopped doing those things and I started to focus on the next book that I was gonna write, and I started focusing on marketing and stuff like that, it became a little bit easier. And I started building a community. So that made it
better but and every single book I published I've been able to manage my emotions a little bit better and I've been able to stay away from good reads and that's made it easier. But b publishing was a shock to my system. It was very, very hard. And it's especially hard because I thought when people reviewed your book, I was expecting people to say the writing's not good, the pacing is not okay, there are not enough
word variations. Like I I honestly thought that's what reviews were gonna be. I had no idea that reviews were gonna be about questions about the morality of my characters and whether or not they're supposed to be together or not. And that was it was so hurtful for me because Echoes and all of my books, but especially Echoes of Us, was an incredibly vulnerable book. So just handing that over and having people
Despise Noah was so hard for me and I wasn't I just I wasn't prepared for that. I wasn't prepared for people to tell me they hated my character. I was prepared for them to tell me you need to go take writing lessons. And I felt like that would have hurt way less.
Declan (13:50)
Hmm. That's really interesting. did that inspire you to write Becoming Us? To sort of give Noah's the context to Noah and you know, where he was actually coming from, what he went through to get to where he was?
Alex Cross (14:07)
No, it actually wasn't. I was writing Echoes of Us was it was hard, but it was kind of revealing. You know, usually when I do this, I don't know what the ending of the book is gonna be. You can even see it in this one. Like the there's a lot of planning in what isn't the first part, then I have like the second part and it's a little bit more sparse. And I don't have the endings of the books. I do these things while I write. So I usually don't know what the ending of the book is gonna be while I'm writing it.
And while I was writing echoes, I wasn't sure if they were gonna have a happy ever after. I was also wondering while I was writing if that was gonna happen or not, because again, I knew nothing about publishing. So I had no idea that, you know, writing romance required you to have a happy ever after. So I was just writing this book and seeing what was gonna happen and just diving into their relationship and trying to figure out if,
forgiveness was possible or not. And once I got to that point, I thought there is so much more that has to happen, but I can't tell it from Atty's POV.
Declan (15:19)
Mm.
Alex Cross (15:20)
I can't keep going from Atty's POV. I can't close this story from his point of view because he's not the one who has to do all the work. So I finished writing it.
And the second that I finished writing it, I started writing Becoming Us. And I think I finished writing Echoes around I think in May. And I published Echoes in December. So I had started writing it before, but then I just I kind of realized what Becoming Us was going to be about, and I started avoiding it. And I started writing When We Ignite, and I finished When We Ignite, and then I then I I completely focused on writing Becoming Us. but I knew.
that that part of the story had to come. I just again I didn't know anything about the publishing world. So I didn't know I had to warn people that I was gonna publish another one and that it wasn't a standalone. I didn't know that I was supposed to do that. So I never did that. And then the second book was just kind of a surprise to everybody, but I knew that it was gonna come.
Declan (16:20)
Yeah, it's I find that at the end of Echoes of Us, I thought at the end I was like, some people are really gonna love this and other people are not gonna like this. And it's gonna be I think it's actually
Alex Cross (16:33)
Yeah, that's exciting.
Declan (16:35)
completely down to your own personal experience of relationships and
Alex Cross (16:41)
Mm-hmm.
Declan (16:42)
how you view forgiveness and recovery and second chances.
And so because it's such a personal decision for people, I knew that it was going to it was gonna ruffle some feathers. I personally really enjoyed it. I felt it was a really wonderful journey that they went on and a nice journey of forgiveness and understanding. And the way in which he told it between the two time periods was really clever as well. And it's not commonly done. and so I really enjoyed the structure of it and think it really worked in that way.
But yeah, I knew whenever I finished it and I was reviewing it, I was like, Some people are gonna be bothered by this.
Alex Cross (17:20)
Yeah, that's exactly right. Okay, Echoes is actually my how do you say that? It's my lowest rated book. And
I
Declan (17:28)
Mm.
Alex Cross (17:28)
feel it's because it triggers a lot of people. And that's something that I've had to learn to to separate from a personal criticism to me as a writer and for my characters, is to understand that everybody brings their context and their experiences when they read a book. So there are things that other people have gone through in their lives that are just
It's gonna rub them the wrong way. And if you've lived through similar experiences, it's a little bit easier for you to empathize with the characters and feel like this journey was something that you wanted to root for. But if you haven't, and you've had the negative side of it, it's gonna be a really rough book. Like I had one reader, I felt so bad for him because he started reading Echoes of Us, and I think he went into Echoes Blind.
And then he posted a video, I think, on TikTok, and he was like, This is exactly what happened in my last relationship. And my ex ghosted me, and he just broke out, broke up with me out of nowhere. And I just ran on ran into him in the gym. And now I'm reading this book. And I was like, I am so sorry. I'm so sorry. But you know, when when you have the negative experience, it's it's hard. It's really hard because it's gonna trigger you. And if you've never gone through this sort of experiences,
I feel it's gonna make you very uncomfortable and it's gonna be very difficult for people to understand why Noah did the things that he did and why I think in spite of that it's still he's still redeemable. At least
Declan (19:01)
Mm-hmm.
Alex Cross (19:01)
for me.
Silvan (19:03)
Yeah, and I'm wondering for anyone who hasn't read either of the books, I mean please just go get the book, it they're so good. I wonder if
Alex Cross (19:11)
What?
Silvan (19:12)
you can explain or describe what the story of Noah and Anaticus are.
Alex Cross (19:19)
I feel like I should be so much better at explaining this. because I've got this question so many times. But for me, Echoes of Us is a story centered around a breakup. And
What happens in this book is you get to see two people meeting and having those first sparks and see all that attraction happen. And then you get yanked out of it and you're thrown a little while later. Like I think it's six months after the breakup that you're thrown in the first first part.
And then you do another time jump, and it's been two years in the same chapter, and the main character is completely devastated and broken up about what happened. And then you realize that he's completely wrecked because of the guy he met in chapter one. So you go, like, what the hell just happened? And you have to go to the other one and start fighting out. So you're finding out w how this relationship worked, why it was so intense, what brought them down, what were Noah's issues.
you as a reader start catching the red flags before Atticus sees them because you already know this went south. And then it's a story like the present timeline is a story of
Grief, I think. It's like grieving your relationship about struggling with forgiveness and with admitting what you want and then eventually forgiving this person and then becoming us goes completely into the healing journey of them as a couple. so yeah, if I would have to I've always
thought that when I have to condense it, I just I always say that Echoes of Us is a story about a breakup.
Declan (21:13)
Mm.
Alex Cross (21:13)
That's the only way that I can view it. But I feel like that's such a terrible thing to say to romance readers, but that's what it is. Yeah, I know.
Declan (21:21)
It's criminal.
Silvan (21:24)
And one thing that struck me when you were talking, you know, you were talking about this one reviewer who just said, like, this book is my life, essentially. And what I noticed in the beginning of, at least for Echoes of Us, you have the trigger warnings or the content warnings rather. Is that something that you were mindful of putting right from the beginning, or was that something that you put in sort of in the re released edition?
Alex Cross (21:46)
I sort of in the middle, because when I st when I first released Echoes of Us, like while it was out, I think around two weeks, it didn't have content warnings, and I felt very bad about that. Very, very bad. Because the cover was very cute. So I think people were misleaded into thinking it was gonna be a nice book and a sweet book, and it was just not the case. and then somebody told me about content warnings, and I was like,
I need to do that. And then I added the content warnings. But that was like two weeks after I released it. The whole re release was the c completely different story.
Silvan (22:23)
Can I ask a little bit about that? Because I've not seen content warnings in like a published book before. So that was quite new for me. And I noticed in the forward for the edition I have. So Declan and I have different editions of the book.
Alex Cross (22:34)
Yeah.
Silvan (22:35)
Mine is a little newer.
And in the forward that I have, you know, there's a note that you say that this version has been re edited to improve the writing, the flow, and the overall experience. I wondered why it was important for you to go back and and do that.
Alex Cross (22:53)
Because I was releasing Becoming Us. And
as I told you before, when I edited Echoes, I still didn't have my team in place. And the most important person for me in Becoming Us was my current editor, Jessica. And I met her because I needed a proofreader for When We Ignite.
And before that, I was just trying out like people from I think Readsy, it's called. And they have like professional editors that freelance there. And I felt like that wasn't really working for me. Not to say that their work wasn't good. It just it wasn't what I needed. And
Declan (23:36)
Mm-hmm.
Alex Cross (23:37)
I met Jessica through an author friend and she was proofreading when we ignite. And
It was a completely different way of working because and I mean Jess has turned to be one of my closest friends right now. Like she's like my best friend now, and she's my editor who I met a year and a half ago. And the reason why it was so good is because Jess works at the same time as I work. So she has my manuscript and she's editing, and then I'm going through the manuscript and I'm fixing it, and we have an open conversation in which every time
That I'm wondering about something, I ask her about her, and then she takes the time to to teach me why something I'm doing can be corrected and how it can, you know, work better. So after I'd released Echoes and I'd wrote and released When We Ignite, when I was working on becoming us, my writing style had changed so much because I I had learned so much. And I feel like that's true.
Like every single pass you do of your manuscript, every time that you read it, like from the first chapter to the last chapter, you're always like a different, improved writer once you get to the end. And by now I had done like 20 passes of my manuscripts, and it just it felt so different. And there were so many things that I wanted to fix that had nothing to do with the plot, but it had a lot to do with the writing. Like, for example, dialogue tags. In Echoes of Us, the original.
book, it had a ton of dialogue tags because I had no idea that's something you had to like work around and not do and use action tags and use like environmental cues to show who was the person that was speaking. And that's one of the things, that's one of the biggest things that I fixed in Echoes of Us. And there were a couple of things like like weird word choices because again, English is not my first language. So I I have I don't have like
This English that originates from one place. I have this English that just kind of takes from everywhere.
Declan (25:35)
Mm.
Alex Cross (25:36)
And what my editor does is try to locate me in the map and put me like, okay, you're writing in American English and you're writing American English from this part. So this are the kind of phrases and the idioms and everything that works for this place. Because there is a lot of things that I picked up also from like British English. And I would have those in my manuscript. And
There were stuff like that that I that I really needed to fix and I wanted to clean up. And I am an annoying perfectionist. Like I have issues with with you know having to have everything perfect. And I just thought I can't release it and feel like the books are so differently written, you know. I feel like it was gonna I feel like my my editor says that nobody was gonna notice it, but I was gonna notice it so much, so I had to do it. And
The funny thing was that I decided to do that with Echoes of Us and I had already given the audiobook to Tantor, who was the one who who has my rights and is doing it. And I completely forgot that they're supposed to match. And when I decided that I was gonna re-edit it, I was like, I talked to the person in Tantor was like, I'm re-editing it. Do you want the new version? Because that's the one that's gonna match the book. And they were like, Yes. And it's like, we need it in three weeks. So I had to re-edit Echoes in three weeks.
Silvan (26:56)
Wow Gosh
Declan (26:57)
Wow.
Alex Cross (26:59)
It was it was and I had I had I think I had edited like around six chapters. But I mean it was still nothing compared to what you had to do in three weeks. And and me and my editor literally we didn't sleep for three weeks. We just worked around the clock, the both of us, and she just kept giving me like motivational speeches and it's like we can do this, we can sleep afterwards, don't worry about it, we can do this. And then it
just ended
ended up working because I could give it to the audiobook people and then I could also have the two books released the way that I wanted them to for people to pick them up because I feel like these are stories that are so important to me and I wanted them to be the best, you know, the best version possible and and
Declan (27:42)
Mm.
Alex Cross (27:42)
matched.
Silvan (27:43)
Yeah, it definitely paid off. I mean, were you ever tempted to change anything, either the story or the characters rather or just stick to the actual the writing?
Alex Cross (27:53)
No,
no, no. I feel like once the story, once I know what the story is, and I've already gone through beginning to end, it doesn't feel natural to me to think that I would have to move something in the plot because everything everything has a ripple effect. So every little decision, if I would have changed somebody's decision in whatever situation,
It was gonna cause a ripple effect that was gonna affect the rest of the book, that was probably gonna affect the beginning of the book too, and then the other book. It just I'm very intentional when I write my character's actions and I think about it to an alarming degree. And I think the idea of changing something to me is just it's monumental. It's it's like it can't, I can't, I can't conceive changing a plot point in my books. I can't conceive it.
So no nothing plot was modified, it was just writing style.
Silvan (28:55)
Yeah.
Declan (28:55)
So is this like is this like a collector's edition at this point then?
Alex Cross (28:59)
Yeah, that's a collector's edition at this point.
Now you can see it and see look at all the dialogue tags Alex used to use.
Declan (29:06)
I'll keep this in
a special place then where it doesn't get accidentally destroyed or anything.
Alex Cross (29:11)
Yeah. That's good.
Declan (29:15)
I wanted to ask you, obviously you were talking about the reaction that you got whenever the first book came out and it was properly published by yourself. that you felt that you were expecting people to criticize the writing quality, but instead you got a really emotive reaction.
From readers instead. Like, I felt that it was down to the realism of the book that gave people that feeling. W did you intend to sort of write it like that, with that level of realism where people were like, wow, I see myself in this?
Alex Cross (29:53)
I think that's something I've discovered of myself while writing and publishing. Like it's I think it's just the way that I I feel and think the things and write them down. That's just it's like I just said, it's it feels like the only option in my head. And when I write.
And that's something that's been happening to me a lot with the book that I'm writing right now and the fact that I'm having to take pauses and take so many breaks. It's when I'm writing something, I need to be inside of the character a hundred percent. I need to physically feel everything that they're feeling. And this is something that I've done again since I was a kid. I mean, my mom used to walk in on me when I was like, I don't know, 10 years old and ask me, Why the hell are you crying? And I was like, I couldn't tell her.
It's because I was imagining this two people in my head and that somebody died in a car crash or something like that. And then I was just grieving what the other person was feeling. Like that's something that I've always done.
Declan (30:55)
Mm.
Alex Cross (30:55)
And so I really, really, really get into the character's mind and they're just they just kind of become a part of me. And when I'm writing it down, I try to convey that. And that's why I use music so much too, because using songs and using music lets me stay in that exact emotion.
For a longer period of time. Because you know, a song only lasts like three minutes. And when you write a scene, it can be like days, you're still writing the same scene. And I just leave the song on repeat so the emotion won't leave me. But I really feel what they're feeling in the moment. And then the playlist also kind of feeds on that. But it's it's a double-sided sword because when I'm writing books that are heavier, like again, this one, or like Echoes of Us and Becoming Us, especially Becoming Us.
I kind of forget that it's not me. And I just stay in that same mindset. And then I start having a ton of problems with my mental health. Like after I finished writing Becoming Us, I I had a depressive episode that was something that was something very alien to me, something that used to be me when I was in my twenties, but not something that made sense in my life right now. And it was because of that, because I was just like kind of stuck in Noah's head.
Especially in Noah's head when he was younger. And it was very, very hard to detach myself from that emotion. And like, even with like, I know I think you haven't read this one, but in From Her Ashes, Ash, one of the characters, has so much anxiety with his work. And while I was writing that book, I was an anxious mess, and I had no idea why it had so much anxiety. And then I realized, it's Ash's anxiety, and that's the thing that I'm carrying. And then with this book, it's horrible. And
I've been having to see my therapist regularly and have all these exercises and do stuff that actors do that's like shedding skin and stuff like that. And then you you change
Declan (32:53)
Mm.
Alex Cross (32:54)
your clothes after you finish writing and you take a shower, you take a walk and stuff like that, because it helps you kind of ground yourself in your own body and let go of that emotion. So that that's also why I think I take those reviews and those criticisms so personally, because it feels like an attack.
to me and my moral choices and you know, it's not just I don't it's it's very difficult for me to understand that the characters aren't me. And I know I know that sounds crazy, but it feels that way to me.
Silvan (33:21)
It it doesn't sound crazy at all. In fact when you were talking, what came to me was you are such an empath and even as a child you were feeling all the feelings and as you were talking I was like this is almost like method acting but for writing.
Alex Cross (33:36)
Yeah, I had I actually had an actor tell me that last week. It's like that's what we do. And I was like, well now I know.
Declan (33:44)
Yeah.
Sulvan, I
Silvan (33:45)
Yeah.
Declan (33:46)
don't know about you, but I was getting a lot of like if you're not aware, Alex, me and Sulvan have a background in therapy and in counseling and psychology. This
Alex Cross (33:56)
That's amazing. I had no idea.
Declan (33:58)
like for me, the way you're talking, like we need to be aware that we're not doing this with clients and you're doing it with your characters. Like there's something counter transparency where you are basically
feeling too much of the emotion of the person that you're currently dealing with or it's bringing up something in you that like you think is coming from them but it's not. It's just that it's touching or resonating something inside you. So yeah, I'm seeing so much of that in in what you're talking about. And it's a experience that I have as well. Sometimes you have a client and you are in their life for sixty minutes. And sometimes it's not always easy to pull yourself out of their life.
And then you're going home and you're trying to find a way to like leave that behind to to set it aside and go, That's not yours. That doesn't belong to you. You need to sit that there and then you can return to it and hold that space for that person so that they don't feel the same anxiety that you've you felt in that moment. So that's really interesting and really intense way to write.
Alex Cross (35:05)
Yeah.
Silvan (35:07)
But it sounds like you've developed sort of practices to help sort of like shedding the skin, taking a shower, going for a walk to sort of create that separation. It's a work in progress.
Alex Cross (35:18)
Trying. I'm trying.
It's a work in progress. Again, I'm just I'm really feeling it with the new manuscript. Like before, I feel like I lacked the words to explain what was happening to me. And it's just been a process of discovery as I'm writing this books, and as people tell me, like, your stories are very character-driven. And I have to stop and think, okay, why do people think this? Why do people think that my stories are so character-driven? And then I realized.
Well, of course, they're right. And second, like stop and reflect in my process and how I write and how I think of the characters. And that's what made me realize that I do that. That I I try to be inside of their bodies and feel everything that they're feeling. And it's like do you know that scene in Echoes of Us? I don't know if I'm allowed to talk about this. So I'm gonna talk about it and in case you I can't, you can edit it out.
Silvan (36:12)
Spoiler
alert, just in case anyone's
Declan (36:13)
Just in case you
Silvan (36:13)
listening.
Declan (36:14)
haven't read it.
Alex Cross (36:16)
when I was writing that scene in which Atty and Noah are at Noah's birthday and Atty tries Molly for the first time. When I was writing that chapter, I remember it w but perfectly. I was in my bedroom, I had like the covers on top, and while I was writing it, I was freezing. And like this is the part that I'm not sure I'm supposed to mention, but you know, when you do Molly, you you get this.
You know, you get your your body lowers in temperature a lot and you start like shaking and freezing and you get all this intense emotions and you your heart starts beating faster and then everything looks brighter. You know, the whole experience. And I I was literally feeling all of that while I was writing that scene. And that to me was like this is so intense because it's it's not something that's happening right now, but it's something that I'm completely feeling in my body. And that was the first kind of clue that showed me, you know.
how far I go into the characters to be able to feel that. And then that goes into everything. That's why I I keep saying that too. Like my readers sometimes message me and they're like, I sobbed so much in the scene. And it's like, yeah, me too. Cause it's just it translated the emotions into that when I'm writing too.
Silvan (37:29)
Yeah, and and as you were talking again, I was really struck by by your process. 'Cause everyone writes so differently, right? Some people are more visual. You s it sounds like you really embody the character and what they're experiencing. And I was listening to a podcast interview with an actress called Hayden Panetier, who recently passed away, and she was talking about how as her as a mother, she can't be a method actor because she has a family and she has people that rely on her. So she can't stay in this character.
for months and months on end when she's shooting. And I wondered what impact that might have had on your personal life. And you can share whatever you feel comfortable, of course, but it sounds like you really embody these characters, but you've also got other responsibilities and other things going on at the same time.
Alex Cross (38:16)
I feel like my kids are very so important for me, especially during this process, because they bring me back into this life, into myself. Because I think if I would have started publishing and writing books when I was 20, it would have been terrible for me.
It would have been terrible. Like the course of my life would have been horrible. And there would have been there wouldn't have been anything that would have forced me back into my life. Like I just would have swept myself and just let myself go with those emotions. But now with my kids, there's always like time frames. So my little one goes to daycare and I drive her and I pick her up from daycare. So I have from nine to twelve to write and then
I have from like around two to four to write, and I usually don't write at nighttime. So I'm having relatively short periods of time in which I'm immersed and then I'm called back. And
I think that's the thing that's most help that's helped me the most while writing this books and that's kept me grounded and that's kept me, you know, like able to do all these things. Because also I haven't been as consistent as I should have been, probably, with my therapy. And the reason why I go back to my therapist and the reason why I'm trying even more right now is because of them. You know? Cause if this is I love
productivity and I'm one of those people that I just kind of like immerse myself in what I do. If and if I'm my own boss and I have to manage my own business, I'm just gonna work around the clock all the time. And this is really taxing for me emotionally. So if I don't put those limits and I don't set those boundaries for myself, it's something that's gonna hurt me and it's gonna burn me out and I'm not gonna be able to continue doing this. And I love doing this. So I wanna be able to do it for a long time.
And I think, yeah, I think my my kids have really, really helped me to make me stay because they need me, you know, they need me to be me. They need me to be their mom. They need me to be there for them and to teach them stuff and to be present. And they're the ones that drag me back and they say, like, you need to be here and it has to be you. And again, I told you, like, when I finished writing Becoming Us, it was very, very, very, very hard for me. And
I had to rely a lot in my partner and I had to talk with them and tell them what I was going through and that I was working on it. And I had to go out on walks and exercise a lot and find a way to bring myself back into my body and sort of let that go. But it's it took me months to be able to bring myself back. And that's what I'm trying to avoid with the new manuscript. Cause I don't I don't I don't want to sacrifice my well-being, but I also don't know.
How else to write, you know?
Declan (41:22)
Mm.
Yeah. Yeah, a hundred percent. And thank you so much for sharing that as well, by the way. I think a lot of people have such different processes when it comes to writing that they're everyone has like a unique thing that sometimes is the negative, it's the drawback of what they're doing, whether that's hyper fixation or if it's a real drive for perfection or like it comes out in so many different ways for people and
and yours as well, I find really unique and it lends like obviously the after effects are so terrible for you, but I can't help but think that the the realism within your books is a testament to that. like when I was reading Atty and Noah's story, like I was relating to a lot within it about the relationship, the
The wonderful spark at the start and the wanting to constantly be around each other and you know, not realizing the creeping toxicity as it comes in, how much you've compromised yourself to sort of fit a version of somebody who is not in a healthy state of mind. And so when I was reading through that, I was feeling emotional. I was feeling these real moments of like, wow, like I am like sometimes I had to put the book down and leave it.
For a day or two because the feeling was too intense. So I can imagine as you as a writer living in the moment, living in the lives of the characters, how intense that would be. And then you said specifically that becoming us was really difficult after you finished that. I can fully see that because of Noah's circumstances, of the conditional love of his mother, the narcissism, the
wanting to numb it all and this resulting in all the trauma that happens to him. yeah, I can fully appreciate why at the end of that book you might have needed a bit of a break.
Silvan (43:29)
And I think as readers we don't get that insight, right? You know, we we see the finished product, but we don't see what happens to get there and what happens afterwards. And so I can imagine, you know, then the reviews come out and it does feel like it's a personal attack, because you've literally, literally poured everything into these characters. I'm wondering what it's like then to have readers or other people sort of look at these characters and interpret them in a way that you didn't intend them to be.
Alex Cross (44:02)
So I feel like that happened a lot more with Echoes of Us than it did with Becoming Us. I feel like in Becoming Us because it was such a healing journey and it was just like the negative things weren't inside of the relationship. They were external, in Noah's life specifically. I felt like that made people like they could feel and they could be sad and it could be like contained and
not have it feel like they interpret anything in a different way. Like they all I think everybody because so many things happen to Noah, like you can relate to any of them. Because I feel like I also feel like that's very real human experience. It's not like it like one thing happened in your life and it's the only bad thing that ever happened to you. And that that for me is not realistic. It's usually like a conjunction of things. And with Noah, it was a conjunction of things that led to the the circumstances and everything that happened in his life. but
Well that comes with us because all of the toxicity was actually in their relationship and you were supposed to feel that. You were supposed to feel that they were not right for each other at that time.
That it was not a healthy relationship, that it was harming both of them. There are people that have felt that or the critique that I've gotten for that is that I'm romanticizing addiction and that I'm romanticizing codependency and emotional manipulation. And you know, that was never my intention, but it's the way some people have seen it. And I think it has to do again with what with what we were talking about.
With people's context and their own personal experiences. And if somebody has gone through something like that and it has been very traumatic for them, I can imagine starting the book out and reading it does feel like I'm romanticizing coercion. But I feel like what was the feeling was also you were always always supposed to read Echoes of Us and have that nagging feeling telling you like something bad is gonna happen, like something bad is happening.
Like that's something that I felt the whole time that I was writing the past timeline of Echoes. Like you always have that anxiety of thinking like something bad is coming. And it's not supposed to be a mystery, but you do feel the relationship deteriorating, you know, with time. So it was never like I never intended for the first part of the book to feel like I was romanticizing the bad parts. It was supposed to feel bad. It's supposed to be uncomfortable. but again, I can understand that
everybody's gonna interpret it in a different way. And it's reading is so subjective.
Declan (46:40)
Yeah. Obviously you did decide to go into, you know, drug abuse and drug addiction in the book. And obviously it was very important for you to to get that right. did you sort of agonize over that whenever you were writing it, like, am I doing this a certain way too much or am I not depicting this in the correct way? Or was it only really after that you really thought that people might view it in a different way than you intended?
Alex Cross (47:10)
Okay, so with addiction, no. because full disclosure with that, that's one of the experiences that I share with Noah. And I I've always felt like everybody has such a different experience. And I knew that mine was realistic just in because it was real. Like it already happened, so it was real. And
Even though it was different, even though it wasn't exactly the same linear, it w you know, stuff was different. a lot of the feelings behind it were very similar. And I think that for me was easy to to show in the book.
Declan (47:51)
Mm-hmm.
Alex Cross (47:53)
and keep it accurate. And I feel like a lot of people who've gone through the same situation, who've struggled with addiction, who are in their process of sobriety and everything that are the people that most have most reached out to me.
To talk to Bian about their own experiences and how seen they felt while they were reading this book, specifically because of that. sometimes I felt that way, like I wasn't I was scared of how I was approaching the grief in becoming us. Because
Declan (48:24)
Mm-hmm.
Alex Cross (48:27)
again, that's also an experience that I share with Noah, but because it's something that was so emotional and so personal to me.
There were times where it felt irresponsible to show so much of the pain, you know?
Declan (48:43)
Yeah, one percent.
Alex Cross (48:45)
like I didn't I didn't want to trigger people, especially if they've lived through that experience. Like I I've told my my my sister to not read that book. I I've told her, like, please, for the love of God, do not read that book. If you want to read all my books, read them, but just you know, don't read Becoming Us. And people who know me and that are closer to me in my life and have been with me through all of that, I usually recommend they read When We Ignite In From Our Ashes if they want to read my books and just like stay away from the us do it.
Because obviously it's different in the way that you tell the story, and there's stuff that is exaggerated and brought to the limit in a different way. But there are still parts of me that are gonna resonate with people that know me and it's gonna, you know, trigger them
Declan (49:26)
Mm-hmm.
Alex Cross (49:27)
and worry them. and I feel like because I always had that voice in my head saying, like, you know, what if somebody
close to me read this book, I always felt like maybe those emotions and the grief and everything, it was just like a little too much. but ultimately I just I wanted to make sure it was real. I know,
Declan (49:49)
Mm.
Alex Cross (49:49)
I wanted it to feel realistic and I wanted it to feel
Like it really made an impact on him. Like it couldn't be just something that kind of made him sad and it it just kind of passed. It it's something that, you know, climbed and it was horrible. And then you thought it was gonna get better. And then no, it just gets progressively worse. And that's just usually how grief works. It's not linear, and it happens again with addiction too. It's not a linear process and it sort of goes around in circles. And I felt that it was very important to show that.
as real as realistically as I could. I feel like that's something that I always that I feel like I need when I'm writing my stories. I need it to feel real.
Declan (50:32)
Mm. Yeah. And
Alex Cross (50:34)
'Cause I
can't connect.
Declan (50:36)
think with Becoming Us, you definitely do get that feeling. I think the way in which Noah's journey through drug addiction, the way it's portrayed, is entirely realistic. Because when he has the support and he has the backing, he has obviously his father to lean on and he has a sort of hope in his life for how things can turn out. he can manage it. He can control it. He can
He can limit himself in a certain way. But whenever obviously the grief hits, things go wrong. And it's always like one thing after the other. Like, you know, it's not just one bad thing happens and suddenly you give up. It's usually there's a bad day and then there's a particularly bad day to follow it, and then an even worse day after that. And that's usually what actually pushes people over the edge. It's not just one thing that sets them off. And I felt like I was quite convinced by that in the way that it was depicted through Noah.
but what was so lovely then about it was you were getting him the next chapter and he was in his sort of moment of healing, he was finding he's found his light, he's found his his sort of hope and in all these negative and horrible experiences that he's been through and he is proving to the reader that you can overcome this. It's really bad and it gets worse and it can make get even worse still.
But even despite that, how dark it gets, look where he is now. Look after all these years, look where he is. Look at the like the person he's become and look at how hard he's trying and how strong he's being. And even the way in which Noel learns to react to rejection with Atty throughout becoming us is fantastic. It's real growth. You can see growth in his character, like he's different from the first book alone.
Never mind when he was back as a teenager. And that's a wonderful message to read. And I felt that that made the sort of negative experiences that he went through, all of them, sort of represented in a way that gives a bit of hope. As in you don't need to let these things define you forever. You can find happiness, you can find the strength to pull yourself out of it. And I like that Becoming Us is so centered around that journey. I think
It was a brilliant decision to to write the second book. I think your instinct was right.
Alex Cross (53:09)
Thank you. And that makes me so happy because I think now that we were talking about this, I just I just thought about that. one of the things that pushed me into writing about addiction and then writing about recovery this way, it's something similar to the fact to MM books and queer stories always having that horrible ending, you know,
Declan (53:30)
Mm-hmm.
Alex Cross (53:30)
before like when Brokeback Mountain and all the movies and all the queer characters always had terrible endings. And there was something that always bugged me about
The fact that if somebody is an addict, like if you ever watched like sitcoms or TV shows or whatever, like in the 90s, you tried drugs once and you were addicted for life, and your
Declan (53:48)
Yeah.
Alex Cross (53:49)
life was over, and the guy was dead in the next chapter. It's like there's no way that you can come back from this. And that's something that always bugged me. One, it was the fact that they taught people that addiction only happens you know, like the first time you try it and then you're addicted for life.
They teach people that. And I think that's very that's a very dangerous lesson because the person then tries it once and goes like, but I'm not addicted, so I'm fine. And then it becomes a little bit less guarded and things slowly like Noah, things slowly escalate into the point where he doesn't even realize when it happens and he goes like, crap, you know, this is a big problem right now. It kind of snuck up on him, and I think that's something that can happen to a lot of people. And then the other part was thinking that addicts.
Always had to have a not a happy ever after, you know? There's no redeeming no redeeming them. The everything has to be like prison or death. And that really bugged me because it makes you feel like when you're recovering, it makes you feel like you're broken and there's nothing that's gonna fix you. And there are no there's no way out of this. Like it's already done.
You know, you fucked up your life and it's already done and you should just probably quit right now. And I feel like that doesn't give the right message. And I know that's dangerous, like in the sense of saying that you also need to teach people that this can be something big that can blow out of proportion, that it's gonna spiral out of control, and that you have to pay attention to it. But I think it's also important to give people hope and to know that it doesn't mean that you can't
Say you're sorry and rebuild your life and show with your actions that you're trying to rebuild your life. And there's like there's this one scene in Echoes of Us. when Atty and Noah are talking in the bathroom in the present timeline, like in a match. They were in a match, and Atty fucked up the match because he wasn't passing to Noah, and then they have a conversation in the bathroom, and Noah tells Atty, like, I'm trying to get my life back. And that is
You know, one of those things that I feel like it's so important because when you're trying to recover from one of these things, you really you're just trying to get your life back and it's so hard. And then having Ezra eventually tell him, like, I mean, this guy is putting in the work because you know, any other person would have just moved across the country and just said, like, good riddance, and I don't have to apologize and I don't have to show anybody, I'll just start new and show those people that I'm a better person.
But having to go back into your past and make amends and apologize for all of that, I think that's also it's a very important part to show. Like you don't always have to throw your life away and start over in another place. It doesn't mean your life is over. I feel like I needed to be able to give him a happy ever after because of that.
Declan (56:45)
Hmm.
Yeah. I think his most admirable quality that I found in Noah was his resilience. Like even after he was in recovery, he always went back to Atty, knowing that he was going to suffer rejection after rejection after rejection. And when you're in a vulnerable state, and whenever you're in a state of recovery, that kind of rejection can be really triggering.
it
Alex Cross (57:12)
Yeah.
Declan (57:13)
can sort of be antipical to everything that you're trying to do for yourself. But he cares so deeply about wanting to fix this relationship and wanting to show Atty how deeply he does care that he's willing to risk it. He's sort of he's sort of risking his own recovery in in taking the chance to allow Atty to just come at him and just give me what you got.
I wronged you, just throw it all at me. I don't I don't mind, just do it. and being able to bounce back without having to rely on the drugs is such a strong moment. And it's scattered throughout both books, and I think it's such a wonderful quality to to highlight as well. especially for people that are in recovery. like that takes a serious amount of resilience and being able to bounce back whenever you're
deeply affected by something. Like that is what it's all about. That's that's what keeps you sort of on the right path. So yeah, I really liked the way it was depicted for him.
Alex Cross (58:23)
Thank you.
Silvan (58:27)
I wanted to ask, Alex, was there a character that you really enjoyed writing for?
Alex Cross (58:36)
Like evolve my characters or from the us to it?
Silvan (58:38)
Hmm.
either. Yeah.
Declan (58:41)
The O the Ostia I think
first.
Alex Cross (58:47)
I I can't pick and choose. I feel like I feel
Declan (58:51)
Like your favorite child.
Alex Cross (58:53)
like I feel like that's that's really difficult because
Noah, from all the characters, and that's including all the characters that I've written so far, Noah is the character who I relate to the most. So writing him has been such a healing journey because you're kind of controlling the narrative and w the events that happened and everything that happens, it's sort of different, but you're healing along with him. So I'm so appreciative of Noah as a character because I felt like it helped me so much.
but also then Atty is just this angel of patience
Declan (59:34)
Okay.
Alex Cross (59:35)
and just he's so good. And I know that he's I mean, you know he's not completely perfect. You know that he's young, you know that he's naive, you know that he doesn't know that he's not supposed to tell an addict that they're gonna break up with them if they use again. Like there's stuff that you know that he does that's not okay.
you know, checking if Noah is drinking the pills or looking through his phone or all those stuff, you know it's not okay, but it also comes from such a place of love and him not knowing any better because he's so young. And then seeing him grow up also in becoming us and seeing him going through all the struggles and still wanting to be there.
For Noah and just seeing the amount of love that he has for Noah, that's just it's something that I just I loved, I loved him. I love him. Because it's just he's so he's like a ball of love. And
Declan (1:00:27)
Mm-hmm.
Alex Cross (1:00:27)
he just wants he just wants to love Noah like unconditionally. And that's such a beautiful thing because Noah has never had unconditional love like that. So I can totally understand why Noah saw saw him and said, Like, I I need I need this man in my life.
So I don't know, I don't think I can I don't think I can pick.
Declan (1:00:49)
What
about from when we ignite?
Alex Cross (1:00:56)
I think with When We Ignite, I loved writing Ethan. I really,
Declan (1:01:03)
Mm.
Alex Cross (1:01:03)
really loved writing Ethan. And the reason why I loved writing Ethan was because he didn't do anything scripted. Like I usually plan my books and I plan out like what the scenes are gonna be and what I want the themes of the book to be.
And with Ethan, it was like every time I sat down to write a scene and he was supposed to do something, the guy just did something completely different. And I know, I know, again, that sounds a little bit crazy, but I'm serious. He always did something different from what he was supposed to do. Like, and when we ignite, I started out thinking, like, I want to write a scandalous age gap. I want to push myself to write a spicier book. And I was thinking, like, maybe I want to write a book that has like Dom and sub dynamics.
And Ethan just flat out refused. Like that was a struggle in the book because every time I tried one write one of those scenes, Ethan was like, no, I'm not into this. And then it that shaped the dynamic of When We Ignite. And I think it made it very, very interesting. but I swear that wasn't me. I swear that was 100% Ethan. And then in From Her Ashes, it was even worse. Like because he had grown such a personality, he had grown so much into himself.
And if you haven't read it, it's just I'm not gonna spoil it because he is an experience in that book. And every time I wrote a chapter, I called my editor and I was like, I don't know what to do. Every time I write this book, I have to pivot and I have to think of everything all over again because the scene always keeps changing on me. So I feel like he is the most fun character I've written so far. He is very interesting. He's very unlike me. So I feel like that keeps me like.
I don't know, it it's always so interesting to go back and write a scene and see what's gonna happen because I never I just I never know.
Declan (1:02:46)
I wonder if that's to do with his aid as well. He's just he's at that point of being just a contrarian way, everything. And but also
Alex Cross (1:02:53)
Yeah.
Declan (1:02:54)
the sort of force of his personality too is just he is quite fiercely independent and he doesn't seem to like to be told what to do by anyone in his life.
Alex Cross (1:03:06)
No. No.
Declan (1:03:08)
even someone like he's this extremely talented tennis player who
Could basically be a professional, but he's like, No. Likes it. No.
Alex Cross (1:03:18)
Yeah. No, exactly.
That's that's exactly the feeling that I had with him. Every single time I was like, okay, this is what we're gonna do in this scene, Ethan would just go, No, no, that's not what we're gonna do in the scene. Every single time. So I feel like that came I feel like that came through a lot and I really had a ton of fun, which which is not saying that I d I this is horrible. I feel like I'm choosing my children. Because I also I
Declan (1:03:42)
Yeah.
Alex Cross (1:03:44)
also love
Ash, and there's something about Ash that I love, and it's like writing him and the way that he speaks, it's kind of like more elaborated. And in comparison to Ethan, in comparison to Atty and to Noah, Ash has this like affected way of speaking. And he's like Ethan that always accuses him to be a smooth talker and just like sort of trying to manipulate him with words. But he's so good at it. And I also had so much fun writing that because I feel like again, he wrote himself.
a lot of the times and just like getting into the mindset of Ash and then just listening to him to say all these romantic things, it was swoony. I feel like I have a crush on Ash.
Declan (1:04:27)
Sullivan, if you're not aware,
just think of like old money flirt.
Alex Cross (1:04:32)
Yeah.
Silvan (1:04:32)
D'y what, I'm all for it
All for it. Especially if I can marry Rich too.
One thing you were talking about, Alex, was how music plays such a big part in your books. you can see that from the actual chapters and you list the music that you're listening to and it's also on your website and that was such a lovely surprise where I saw all the playlists on Spotify and that was so so lovely and and it's so varied. Like you have Camilla Cabello, you have Mariah Carey, you Lincoln Park, you have Wee Test, like
I'm just wondering like how much of an encyclopedia of music do you carry that you draw from?
Alex Cross (1:05:12)
I feel like I feel like I'm not, it's funny to me because I feel like I sometimes I'm not aware of myself and the things that I like and stuff about myself. And like the other the other day, my kid, he's six years old, he was asking me and he just like hummed a melody and he told me, What what you mom, what song is this? And I was like, I have no idea. He just hummed three notes. How am I supposed to know? And he told me, because you know all the songs.
And I thought that was so cute. And I I think it's something that I don't realize about myself, but it's true. I am I love music. I've always loved music. And my taste is very, very varied. And I think it also ties into the whole thing of me relating and deep diving into my characters. Because then again, my multiple personalities, it's not just me inside of my body, is all of these other people.
So I have not just my music taste, but all of these people's music tastes inside of me. And I feel that's what makes it so varied. And actually music is one of the things that led me to writing in the first place because every time that I think of a book or the way that one story sparks, it's usually because of a song. I could tell you with every one of the stories that I've written, what is the song that inspired and sparked that book.
And it's always been one scene that it's just been stuck in my head for two weeks or a month. And I say, I know I need to write this. I need to write this story because I need to know what happens. And it's always one song. And then it all just I start listening to songs and I start constructing all of the scenes. But then all of the scenes, like the important ones, they're always tied to a song. And then that's that starts feeding off the playlist. And I'm I live in the city in which I live has so much traffic.
And I'm always stuck on traffic. So when I'm stuck on traffic, I'm listening to music and it's usually then when scenes you know, scenes start popping up in my head and then I come back and write it on my post-its and that's how books are made.
Silvan (1:07:17)
That's
amazing. Are you sort of picking up music subconsciously? Are you looking for particular songs that that are going to resonate with a certain character or a certain scene, for example?
Alex Cross (1:07:29)
I feel like when I start to write the book, it's usually one song with one scene. And then as I'm as I know where the story's gonna go, I start Spotify really helps with that because it has like the recommended songs in your playlist. So it's gonna start showing you songs that feel like what you already have. And sometimes I confuse the algorithm, but
Declan (1:07:53)
Sure.
Alex Cross (1:07:54)
it usually works.
And they start like feeding me songs that relate to like when I was writing Echoes of Us, the songs that it would always bring up were always like breakup songs. And it was easier for me to form that. And then with this book, it's kind of hilarious because there's a lot of songs in English, but there's also a lot of songs in Spanish. Like From Arashus has some of them. This one is unapologetic. Like it has a ton of songs in Spanish. And
It's still a very like dramatic, very heavy book. So it just recommends these like dancing Spanish songs. And I'm like, No, we need to add these other songs. So
Declan (1:08:33)
Yeah.
Alex Cross (1:08:33)
I put them in and then the algorithm is like, I don't know what to give you anymore.
Silvan (1:08:38)
And I think that's so interesting because whilst you write in English and you sort of write and think in English, the Spanish songs are quite important to you. So there's something there's a shift there in a way.
Alex Cross (1:08:49)
Yeah. Yeah. Well I'm always thinking, you know, you know, you're bilingual, you're always thinking in two languages. So yeah.
Silvan (1:08:57)
Yeah.
And is there like one song that sort of sums up Auntie and Noah?
Alex Cross (1:09:04)
You know, that's the one question that I I had like my notes written. because it's it's I can't I if I'm having a trouble picking between two characters, can you imagine me trying to pick between one song? And it's like the song that brought me no, there's two songs. The songs that brought me to write Echoes of Us were Angels Like You.
By Miley Cyrus and Cry by Benson Boone. And it was literally the two sides. It was like Angel Sing You was the falling in love part, kind of, but you're bad for me. And then the other side was Atty pissed off and saying, like, I go cry to somebody else, you know? So that kind of sparked that duality. I think those were the two first songs that I had in my playlist. And then there's a ton of songs that I feel like are so
intertwined with the plot of the of the book. And there's like Gravity by Matt Hanson. That is such a beautiful song. And it's about that. It's about, you know, feeling from Atty's perspective, and you're like feeling this person is coming back and they're trying to get back together with me. And I'm falling for this again, but I can't, but I also can't control myself around this person. And it's such an emotional song, like the beat of the song, everything it's like it has like these moments in which it's just
Like like a cry for help. And I feel like that aligns a lot with Atty in that book. But then there's like there's I have a song also for that moment when I when I told you about the club and the Molly and everything. And it's Infinity. I I wrote that one down because I always forget his name by James Young. And that song, that first line of the song that it's like.
Baby, this love, I'm never gonna let it die. And it's like so toxic and it feels so intense, and it works perfectly for them in that moment of their relationship where it was just like it got it had gotten completely out of hand. Like the
Declan (1:11:11)
Enough.
Alex Cross (1:11:11)
c the toxicity was running rampant at that moment. But it's also a moment in which the love was, you know, like at an all-time high. So it was like both things happening at the same time. And I feel like that song also related a lot to that. But then there's
can't fight this feeling, which is a song that Noah sings to Atty. And then that song is so precious, and the message behind it and what Noah was trying to communicate, like, you know, this is what you mean to me. And that song, I feel like even Atty, he felt like what Noah felt for him was different than when what Noah could convey he felt for him. And that song perfectly conveyed what Noah felt for him, which he couldn't.
properly say. And for me that I don't know, that song always makes me cry. And then now, like a prayer also always makes me cry.
Declan (1:12:03)
Ha ha ha
Alex Cross (1:12:05)
Even though I know it's not supposed to, but it always makes me cry now. So that yeah, as you can tell, there's there's a lot of songs I just I can't pick.
Silvan (1:12:13)
I I
Alex Cross (1:12:13)
Mm.
Silvan (1:12:14)
imagine like with the audiobooks, if you had like an infinite sort of budget, how amazing would it be to have these songs loop in the background?
Declan (1:12:24)
emotionally devastating.
Alex Cross (1:12:24)
I would love that.
I would love that. That would be amazing. Actually, I had there's when I had my first edit of Echoes, because again I didn't know anything about that. My first editor told me you're gonna have to cut out all of the lyrics you have in this book because that's copyright infringement. And I was like, no.
Declan (1:12:44)
Mm-hmm.
Alex Cross (1:12:46)
So I had to rewrite.
so much of it that had the lyrics inside of it. But I feel like that also makes, you know, that the kind of things make you a better writer 'cause you have to like pivot and figure out how you can communicate it without using the words, but it's so annoying. Sometimes I wish I could use the lyrics. But
Declan (1:13:02)
Yeah.
Alex Cross (1:13:02)
you know, that's no.
Silvan (1:13:05)
Yeah, and you've got actually in fact you've got When We Ignite and From our Ashes releasing next year in February and June of next year. That's really exciting.
Alex Cross (1:13:15)
I am so beyond excited for that. I can't even tell you. When I heard Jonathan Lake's audition for Ash, I was like blushing, smiling, kicking my feet. It's just the perfect Ash. I don't know how I'm gonna listen to that book. I feel like I'm gonna have to like hide under the covers. I'm gonna be blushing the whole time. Cause just the cadence of his voice and the way that he
You know, narrates that character. It's just the audiobook is just going to be amazing. I can't, I can't, I really, I can't wait to listen to that one. I'm so excited for it.
Silvan (1:13:49)
In fact, what's that like for you to have someone else's voice literally voice the words on the page that you've written?
Declan (1:13:57)
I was about to ask that, yeah.
Alex Cross (1:13:59)
It's it's an odd feeling. And the people at Tantor, they're so nice. I feel like the people in the casting in Tantor, they're they're so nice and they're so patient with me because I have a very specific idea of what my characters sound like in my head. And I feel so bad every time they send me auditions and they sent me like four auditions, and I'm like, no, it doesn't work. None of these people work. We need to go back to the drawing board.
And they just keep throwing auditions, auditions, and auditions at me. And I can't properly, I feel like I can't properly explain it's so difficult to explain like this is the tone of voice, you know, this is the cadence, this is the speed in which I need him to read. There are so many things. And it's very, very difficult to match that to a narrator's voice, but they're very nice and very supportive. And they send me a million auditions until I'm happy with the characters.
Silvan (1:14:54)
And it sounds like you you've found the right ones.
Alex Cross (1:14:57)
Yeah. Yeah. And I also loved Patrick for Echoes of Us. I remember I heard that audition and I was like, I've heard I by that point it was the first time that they sent them to me. So I felt really bad that I kept saying no. And that was like the 20th audition, and I was like, my god, he's perfect, thank God.
Silvan (1:15:17)
And you had three weeks to redo it.
Alex Cross (1:15:20)
And I had three weeks to redo it. That was horrible.
Declan (1:15:26)
Can I ask just looking a bit towards the future? obviously you've focused on sort of drama and you've got almost sort of like a college romance that's just not quite gone well and age gap romance as well. Is there any other sort of like trope
Or
sub genre that you're looking to do, maybe a bit of fantasy, a bit of crime, maybe MM romance based of course, but like something along those lines. Do you have any idea of like a genre you really want to do?
Alex Cross (1:15:58)
Paranormal. A hundred percent. The first
Declan (1:16:01)
Sold.
Alex Cross (1:16:03)
book that first book that I finished writing that I haven't published was actually paranormal. And when I published fanfiction and yeah, all of those stories, everything was always paranormal. Echoes of Us was the first time that I ever wrote contemporary romance. So
Declan (1:16:20)
Wow. That's crazy.
Alex Cross (1:16:23)
so my my taste
It really goes more into paranormal, but not not fantasy. I don't have like the brain space for fantasy. I can't do that, especially high fantasy and all of the backstory and everything that you need to have. Like fantasy is gigantic. Ever all of the information that you need to have. And with with me and my characters, I just I can't there's not enough brain space to do all of the characters plus all the backstory. But paranormal, all of my paranormals are set.
in the current timeline. So it's like contemporary, you know, with paranormal.
Declan (1:16:58)
Mm-hmm.
Alex Cross (1:17:00)
So that makes the world building a little bit easier and I love it. But I've also been thinking because lately all I've been reading reading is dark romance. So I've also been toying with the idea of writing and that one's gonna be intense because it's dystopian, dark, and paranormal.
Declan (1:17:20)
Nice. Can't wait for that one. What
dark romances are you reading at the moment?
Alex Cross (1:17:25)
Right now, I'm reading, I just finished reading Immersed, and I'm writing, I'm reading Entangled by Gail Ian Tate right now.
Declan (1:17:35)
Interesting.
Alex Cross (1:17:35)
Which is like, that's like a horror romance in like virtual reality, because they're like stuck into inside a video game. It's so good and it's so addicting and it's so toxic and so dark. I love it.
Declan (1:17:51)
Mm.
Alex Cross (1:17:53)
And it's funny because I didn't think that I was a dark romance reader. and I started reading, I I don't even remember what was the book that I read that was dark romance. I think it might have been one of your recommendations. I think it was like I read Distorted after you read Distorted, and I was like, okay, I need to read this book. And then I read that and I was like, I need to read everything dark right now. And I it has to be darker every time that I read one, it has to be darker than the next one because I just want to be shocked. I don't know.
Declan (1:18:22)
It's
honestly once you're in and you honestly will not anticipate that you'll enjoy them, when you're in you just
Alex Cross (1:18:28)
Mm-hmm.
Declan (1:18:29)
can't help but to keep going and to just consume more. I start it with
Unhinged by Only James, which is a series about a family of psychopaths who have been raised
Alex Cross (1:18:39)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Declan (1:18:43)
to sort of deal with society's undesirables. So the people that keep escaping justice and escaping the justice system. this psychologist has gone whenever these people are children, taken them into his care and then trained them to be killers.
Alex Cross (1:18:59)
Yeah, I read those I read the first three of those.
Declan (1:19:02)
I love that. That was my gateway. And then from that point on, skate over.
Alex Cross (1:19:08)
Yeah. Yeah. And you can't you kinda keep craving you kinda you know, it's an addiction because then you need something that's gonna be a little bit more dark. So
Declan (1:19:18)
Yeah.
Alex Cross (1:19:18)
I don't know, you just wanna be shocked a little bit more. And this year I started reading Fall Cost. Have you read that one? By Quill Carter. And this is like a fandom because there are I think seventeen books.
And each one of the books is like 700, 800, 900 pages. It's like thick. And it's again, it's dystopian. It has, it's really dark and it's paranormal too. And you kind of get really sucked in into the story. And it's like there's a there's a main timeline, but there are also books that are they go outside of the timeline and there are other characters, so you kind of go back.
And forth and back and forth. but I got to the fourth book. I think I finished the fourth book this year and I said, like, I need a break because this this is just
Declan (1:20:15)
Mm-hmm.
Alex Cross (1:20:16)
my brain can't take it anymore. Like I need to exit this world for a little while. And then that's when I picked up immersed and I was like, my god, this got it, this book is so good. But I haven't been able to read anything other than Dark Romance, I think, this year.
Silvan (1:20:33)
I'm so intrigued
Alex Cross (1:20:33)
Yeah.
Silvan (1:20:35)
to hear what authors are actually reading 'cause I feel like it it gives you this almost different perspective into a different world that you're thinking.
Alex Cross (1:20:45)
Yeah. Yeah, I love that too. I'm so nosy. I always want to see what other people are reading. So that's what I l I love about Instagram and Instagram because I always want to see what they're reading and I'm always like adding stuff to my TBR. But then I can't read when I'm if I'm drafting a particular part or I'm editing the book, I can't read. Like I feel like I can't have other characters enter my space. So my reading has just it's terrible. I think I read like one book a month now, which kinda sucks, but you know.
It is what it is.
Silvan (1:21:18)
Yeah. I wanted to ask Alex, I know you've been teasing the next book on Instagram. Can you tell us a bit about the book or the title of the book? 'Cause I I'm hooked already.
Alex Cross (1:21:31)
So the book that I'm gonna release next, which I don't have a date for yet, because I usually wait until I finish the first draft to have a release date. Otherwise, the pressure will just get to me and I can't do it. And the title of the book is called Between Here, I so it's in Spanglish, it's between here and there. And this book has a Colombian MMC.
And it kind of originated. I I wanna I wanted to write this book for a while now. I think I started drafting this book the year before, but it was like a different concept. And then I rewrote like the first two chapters or something like that. And everything that was happening in the States at the beginning of the year with immigrants and ICE, those kind of things, you know, like they hit you culturally very hard. And having so many people
in the States right now. Like my PA works, lives in Minnesota. So having all of that information from the people over there and knowing that my family also lives in the States and everything that's happening, it really, you know, like it hit a fiber. And then I and then I'm I feel like if you follow me, you know that I'm a little bit obsessed with Bad Bunny. I went, I saw the Super Bowl concert, the Super Bowl concert.
This superball halftime show. That was not a half time.
Silvan (1:22:59)
It's basically a concert. The
Declan (1:23:01)
This is what
Silvan (1:23:01)
the the football is supplementary. No one's watching
Declan (1:23:02)
we're all watching her for anyway.
Silvan (1:23:04)
the football.
Alex Cross (1:23:06)
Well yeah, the Bad Bunny concert that happened during that game of football, yeah. so that show it made such an impact on me because all of this was happening. And then this man goes up there and he goes and he says, We're all the same. It's not just about Puerto Rico, it's about all of these countries and and what we bring to the table. And just we really we really have grown up
with this kind of music. And seeing that showcased in such a big space, it just it felt I felt incredibly proud in that moment. You know, very, very proud of where I come from and my country and the people here and being able to say that I'm Latina. Like all of that stuff. Like I'm very, very proud of that. And that show made me realize that I didn't want to keep like
like washing away that part of my personality in my books to fit the audience that I have because it is an English speaking audience and I wanted to kind of show all of that and I thought okay then I'm gonna write a book about a Colombian MMC and I'm gonna be so unapologetic about the amount of Spanish songs that I put in there. And actually the main character is obsessed with Bad Bunny. So that's also in there.
Declan (1:24:26)
Yeah.
Alex Cross (1:24:29)
And there are
Silvan (1:24:29)
Relatable.
Alex Cross (1:24:30)
Yeah, there are a lot of like sprinkles of the songs. And again, like the the the song there's a song that's a Bad Bunny song that's the one that inspired me to write this book and the theme that is this book. And then when I started writing this Colombian MMC and he comes from Barranquilla, which is a small town in the Atlantic coast, and it's very conservative. It's very Colombia's very Catholic country too.
And I started to write and kind of touch on all of those things. And then what surged from all of that was writing about religious trauma. And I feel like you're gonna be well, I think you're the first to know that this book is gonna have religious trauma and share it with the world exclusively. But yeah, it does touch on religious trauma, which I've talked about before also in my platform. Like it's a subject that really interests me, and like one of my favorite books.
Favorite series is the On My Knee series by Alice James, which is about a Christian pastor. And I just really like, I feel like there's subjects that we also need to discuss, the same with addiction and the same with grief. It's like stuff that we need to talk about. And I feel like specifically for me, is something that I it's like a wound that I need to open up and heal because that sort of religious trauma when you're erased with those things, it's something that just kind of echoes in your life again and again, even if you're not.
If it doesn't align with you anymore. Like I'm an atheist, and there's stuff that still hurts me about religion. And so this book has a lot of that in there. And that's the only thing that I'm gonna share. And that it's a very, very, very long book. That's the
Declan (1:26:13)
Mm-hmm.
Alex Cross (1:26:14)
only thing I'm gonna share. Like yesterday, I finally finished writing part one, and it's three parts. And part one is
eighty three K words, which is I think three hundred and twenty pages.
Declan (1:26:30)
Is this gonna be a number to add?
Alex Cross (1:26:34)
No, I refuse. There was I had so much emotional damage from writing when we ignite and releasing a cliffhanger and then having everybody all the time asking me when from our ashes was gonna be released. It's like I'm not going, I'm not doing that again. So you're just gonna get a very long book.
Declan (1:26:50)
I'm okay with that.
Silvan (1:26:50)
I'm
I'm down. As somebody who was raised in Catholic schools my entire life, I'm looking forward to this.
Declan (1:26:57)
Yeah, me too.
Silvan (1:26:59)
And you know the the title is in Spanglish. Will there be Spanglish elements in the writing itself?
Alex Cross (1:27:05)
Yeah. And there's a there's a cute little thing because the Colombian Mem C when he drinks, he starts speaking a little bit more in Spanish. So it's kind of cute because it starts like showing up in different moments of the of the book and it kind of intertwines, which is what happens to people, you know, when you're bilingual, you can't and that's why I sometimes I just kind of like struggle to speak because I'm just like I'm thinking and the next word I need to say is in Spanish, but I know I can't say it. And then the same thing in when I'm speaking in Spanish and I need to speak in English.
It's like you're always kind of struggling to find the words to just stick to one language.
Silvan (1:27:40)
Hundred percent. I have a friend who when she gets very angry, the Spanish comes out and that's all you will hear. And I love
Alex Cross (1:27:45)
Yeah. Yeah.
Silvan (1:27:47)
it. And I don't do it deliberately, but it's fun to watch.
Alex Cross (1:27:50)
Yeah.
Declan (1:27:51)
So funny. So
whenever you're like in between Spanish and English, you call it spang Spanglish?
Alex Cross (1:27:59)
Spanglish, yeah.
Declan (1:28:01)
My boyfriend's
from Hungary and every time they speak to each other they don't say they speak Hungarian, they speak English.
Alex Cross (1:28:09)
I love that.
Silvan (1:28:12)
I love it because it's such a blend of all these different cultures and the languages and and you know and the subcultures that exist within that language because the Spanish that you'll speak in Southern America is going to be a different type of Spanish that I speak in Spain, for example. And I and
Alex Cross (1:28:28)
Yeah.
Silvan (1:28:28)
I love that and I love hearing that in in the language itself and the cadence of it.
Alex Cross (1:28:34)
Mm-hmm. I love that too. And I have I've had a bunch of author friends come to me because they have like Spanish speaking characters and they want to like check. And they're always come to me and it's like, is the does this work? And it's like, no, wait, where are they from? What part of this country are they from? Because it's always gonna be different. Like there's always gonna be different phrases, there's always gonna be different pet names. Everything is gonna be a little bit different. So like even me writing this character who is like he's Colombian, but then he's from the Atlantic coast, and then he speaks completely different.
like someone from Medellin or someone from from Bogota would speak. Like it's completely different accents. So then I have to find a way to make that work with the book and not scare away the English speaking readers. And what I'm trying to do, and what I think I'm gonna actually do is gonna end up taking all of the phrases and the words that I have and then have like a translation at the back so that you can just check and you don't have to like Google. But I can
tell you what they mean. Cause sometimes it doesn't mean the same thing. Like like the curse words, they do not mean literally what the curse word is. So it's important to people to know that.
Silvan (1:29:46)
The
only thing that I don't think needs a translation is La Chancla. That
Alex Cross (1:29:51)
Yeah, that does not need a translation. Yes.
Silvan (1:29:53)
is universal. It's
the slipper, basically, the thing that your mum will throw at you.
Alex Cross (1:29:58)
That your
mom will throw at you when you're misbehaving. Yeah. It just like the act of pulling it off your foot. It's like, my god, yes, I'm not gonna do that.
Silvan (1:30:06)
You run there is no pause.
Alex Cross (1:30:09)
Yeah, yeah, that's universal. That one's universal.
Silvan (1:30:12)
And Alex, you mentioned earlier that you are a professional chef. I wanted to ask, I do a lot of baking, and I'm trying to perfect my brownie recipe. I would love to know your secrets on how to make the perfect brownie.
Alex Cross (1:30:30)
No, the brownie brownies are my enemy. It's like I'm always trying to figure out a recipe, but brownies are so difficult to make. Like I usually didn't work in I wasn't a pastry chef. I was a line chef and an executive chef. So I I usually like managed the savory food. and I like pastry stuff, but
I don't know if you've ever seen there's just like this distinction between pastry chefs and line chefs. And it's just like we have a different way of thinking and working. And I'm I sit somewhere like in the middle because I'm still very organized and very like recipe oriented, which doesn't happen usually with like line chefs, and does happen a lot with pastry chefs. So I have a lot of friends who are pastry chefs, and even in and they
despise me in the kitchen because I'm always looking for shortcuts and I'm always looking for like
Declan (1:31:24)
Yeah.
Alex Cross (1:31:25)
a scientific explanation behind what's happening with the recipes. And brownies are I mean, I love cooking everything. And I have recipes for everything. And my nemesis are brownies. It's the most difficult thing to make. I swear it's the most difficult thing to make in the world. I've perfected cookies. I do killer cookies. But with brownies, I don't know. It's it's horrible. It's terrible. It's terrible.
And I tried this one recipe that worked really well. And I feel like it has a lot of potential. And one of the secret ingredients that it has inside of it is chocolate pudding mix. And it helps a ton with the flavor and the texture. Cause you know, you want it to be like fudgy, but then you want that crust. And the pudding helps a lot with the fudgy texture and the the chocolate flavor. So I'll give you that tip.
Silvan (1:32:15)
gonna have to try
that. I do end up on a rabbit hole on TikTok and it all it will feed me is brownie cookies and I'm literally in my kitchen until one AM trying these things out. So I'm gonna try the pudding. I I think that's a that's that sounds like a winner.
Alex Cross (1:32:31)
Look it up because it it really, really works, but it's usually like a longer cook recipe brownie. Like it takes more time in the oven. But I feel like that works. But brownies are they're so hard to make. They're so hard to make. Good ones.
Declan (1:32:42)
I have zero
Silvan (1:32:42)
They're so so good.
Declan (1:32:45)
baking skills. Like I like I
Alex Cross (1:32:47)
Mm-hmm.
Declan (1:32:48)
will make a full savory dinner, no problem at all, but you try to make me even make a cheesecake and I can't do it. So yeah,
Silvan (1:32:58)
I am all about the dessert.
Declan (1:33:01)
Nate Nate does the baking in our house. He's trying to master his Basque cheesecake at the moment. So need
Alex Cross (1:33:08)
Mm, that's a tough one.
Declan (1:33:09)
to give that a try.
Alex Cross (1:33:11)
That's a tough one, but it's good. It's just I had this one time when we were working at the restaurants and we were trying to make this like cheesecake menu because I worked at a one of the like a restaurant group. So it was a lot of restaurants and I was the chef to like I think like three brands. And all of the executive chefs, we worked together and we did like workshops of the recipes, and one time we had to do like she cheesecake recipes, and then every one of the restaurants got like two cheesecake recipes.
So we had to do like sixteen sixteen different cheesecakes and I swear to you, I'm still traumatized. It's like I can't see them anymore. Because we had to bake them and try them every single day. We had to make them and try them and bake them and try them and bake them and try them. I feel like everybody was sick of cheesecakes because obviously then we we had all these test subjects and we had to give them to the people in the kitchen, the people in the in the table, you know, like the staff, and everybody was just like sick.
of trying cheesecakes.
Declan (1:34:10)
Mm-hmm.
Alex Cross (1:34:12)
and it you can't do like a tiny portion, you know, you have to do the whole cheesecake. So it's God, it was a lot of cheesecake. Yeah.
Silvan (1:34:20)
How do I get that job? As a taster.
Alex Cross (1:34:22)
I I feel
I feel like everybody always told me that. Like everybody was like, you have the best job. And it's like I felt like I was always sick to my stomach. I
Declan (1:34:30)
Yeah.
Alex Cross (1:34:32)
was eating all day. I didn't want to eat anything when I got home. I was like, I don't want to eat. I don't want to see food. I don't cook in my house. I still don't cook in my house. And everybody is like, Why don't you cook? You're you must be amazing that you know you're a chef and your kids. And it's like, no, I don't cook.
Silvan (1:34:52)
That
Alex Cross (1:34:52)
Just for special
events, but day to day, nope. No cooking. I cooked way too much.
Silvan (1:34:58)
You paid your dues, definitely. And
Alex Cross (1:35:00)
I paid my dues, yeah.
Silvan (1:35:02)
the one thing I've noticed about your online presence, Alex, is you are so good with the responses to your fans. I mean, I have left a number of comments on your TikToks and on your Instagram pages, and you've always replied and I thought you don't always get that from people who are at your level writing and writing so much as well. What does it mean to be able to interact with your fans online?
Alex Cross (1:35:30)
It's having a social media presence, I think it's one of the hardest things while being an author because it's it's a necessity. Like you need to, especially if you're an no, I feel like if you're traditionally published, you still need to have your social media presence. Because what they tell you is you're also selling yourself as an author brand. And that's what's gonna help market your books. Like if you relate to an author, then you're gonna, you know, look up their books and what's gonna keep you like loyal to them and what's gonna keep you coming back, it's
If you find that connection with an author and you feel like you're both aligned and that that's gonna make you want to keep reading the books. and I've really struggled with that because I've made a lot of great connections and I've met amazing people. And like just like us sitting here right now, like you know, this is possible because of social media, but opening that door also opens the door to all the bad stuff.
And unfortunately there is a lot of bad stuff in the internet, you know, in the internet that sounded like there's a lot Yes.
Silvan (1:36:35)
So millennial.
Declan (1:36:36)
Mm.
Alex Cross (1:36:40)
it also opens the space up for a ton of negativity negativity and so many, you know, difficult things that come along with that. And as I've told you before, I'm not exactly the most social person. I actually what I started to do after I published my book is that I have a separate phone for social media.
And I use that as a nine to five. So I turn it on at 9 a.m. I turn it off at five, unless I have to, you know, look at something specifically. and I try not to use it in the weekends and just limit my time in there. And so when I go in there, I'm specifically looking for messages for like comments and DMs and stuff that people have sent me so that I can see like.
The reviews that they've posted or the edits that they've done and it's I'm like I'm trying to filter the the prettiest part of social media, which are those amazing connections, and try to lower the volume of all the negative stuff. But I feel like I'm finally in a place in where I feel like I've been able to find that balance and people are so nice.
And you keep coming back, like I've been posting a lot lately because I'm trying this like TikTok experiment, and I don't usually tell people that I'm doing these experiments, and then these people keep coming back to all of my posts and commenting on them. And I'm like, aren't you tired of commenting on my videos? And I feel like it's it's it's an amazing thing that they keep coming back and they're posting, and so I try to reply to everything. I've also gotten
Amazing emails, which are a little bit harder for me because sometimes those get lost. But sometimes people have sent me these incredible emails telling me how they related to the book and their story. And I feel like that's what really makes it worth it, you know, doing this thing and publishing the books and putting them out there is being able to have these conversations. So it's I feel something that I need to balance, like I need to have it in a schedule.
But I I I still want to be really present and I still want to be able to respond to these comments and talk to people. And I I feel bad because as I've grown my author career, it's a little bit more difficult to be able to answer to every single one of them. They kinda like slip through the cracks. Like sometimes, you know, I having to answer to DMs in Instagram, it's like a two hour job every single day. You have to sit down with your phone and answer every single one of them.
And then you have like tags and mentions and stuff, and it's it's difficult to keep to keep them straight and to answer to everybody. But I really do try my best to keep that relationship open with the people that want to have a healthy relationship with me, I think.
Silvan (1:39:30)
Yeah, and one thing that struck me was especially on your Instagram, you know, you advocate for a lot as well. When the earthquakes happened in Colombia, you know, you were posting a lot of information and and that's something that I thought, gosh, you know, that that would that felt really touching as well. how important is it to use your platform for things like that?
Alex Cross (1:39:53)
I feel like right now I have a responsibility. Like I've always been quiet about things. Like I ha I'd have an opinion about it and like what with what happened with the earthquakes, like, you know, I'd make a donation and just not advertise that I'm doing it. Right. But right now I feel like having a platform gives you a responsibility because you can actually make a change.
And speaking out and asking for help and doing all of these things. And the the earthquake was really, really devastating for our country. It's not a country that's used to having these sort of things happen. So there's not very good planning around it and the infrastructure, especially in the places where there's less money, I guess. it's very, very difficult. Like all of the buildings fell down, the structures fell down.
And these people need help now. So if in some way, having gotten the amount of followers and I have and have people engaged and are reading my books, if if at least one person makes a donation, then I'm actually making a change. So I do feel like I have a responsibility to tell that. And and I feel like I I wish I could do more because between here, yeah, it's still it's still a while until it's published. And I do intend to give those pre-orders.
to probably construction and if they're doing more infrastructure things like schools and stuff like that, usually they take care of housing first and then they deal with infrastructure. And if I can be able to make a great donation with that with pre orders, that's gonna feel fantastic for me, especially because it's a book about Columbia. So it's you know, giving
Declan (1:41:42)
Mm-hmm.
Alex Cross (1:41:42)
back to giving back to where it's supposed to give back.
Silvan (1:41:48)
Yeah. And and speaking of socials, where can people find you on socials, Alex?
Alex Cross (1:41:55)
Well, technically everywhere. So I have the same handle across Instagram, TikTok, Facebook. I tried opening YouTube. I don't think that's gonna stick, but I tried opening YouTube to like upload shorts and stuff. And I do plan on launching a Patreon soon. and it's at Alex Cross Author.
And then there's my webpage, which is alexcrossauthor.com, which you can also find all of the information. And I do plan on launching a Patreon and then have special stuff over there, artwork, add a little bit more expansions on the same characters than I have. So maybe half like short stories and stuff like that. And I'm still figuring that out because I'm also gonna launch direct sales.
in the US this year. So I'm trying, I've been trying to build and commission art and have all of the things ready because I'm I also have to go to the States, sign a bunch of books, and then come back. So I need to make sure that everything is set up before I launch them. So those are my this year's projects because between here yeah is not gonna be published this year.
Silvan (1:43:17)
Sounds you're booked
and busy and as long as you
Declan (1:43:18)
Yeah.
Silvan (1:43:19)
keep posting the videos on Insta and on TikTok, we will keep commenting, don't worry.
Alex Cross (1:43:25)
Thank you.
Declan (1:43:26)
Ha ha.
Alex Cross (1:43:27)
I appreciate that so much.
Declan (1:43:31)
Alex, thank you so much for joining us. We've had such a good time talking to you. I have been following you now for over a year. I absolutely loved your books and so it's just been such a privilege to get you to come on and get to talk about them. It's been fantastic.
Alex Cross (1:43:46)
Thank you so much for everything.
Declan (1:43:50)
And for anyone who is interested in watching our previous episodes, we've also discussed with another offer as well, Scarlett Drake, if you're familiar with her works. She's also done an episode, or if you're big into Heat at Rivalry, of course that's where this all started. So we have plenty of episodes on the books, TV show. or if you're just interested in learning a bit more about MM romance and sort of adjacent media, then keep on following us.
make sure you like, share and subscribe to this as well. And don't forget to follow us on our book club on Fable. It's a long game book club and right now we're reading Sweat by Jonah York. So if that sounds like someone you'd be interested in, then check us out over there as well. But thank you very much and we'll see you all again next time.