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Beth takes over the podcast and Stephen takes role of guest this week as they discuss expectations within the mentoring relationship. This week features a discourse on what realistic and unrealistic expectations might look like for the different stages of a mentee's life.
Show Notes
Beth takes over the podcast and Stephen takes role of guest this week as they discuss expectations within the mentoring relationship. This week features a discourse on what realistic and unrealistic expectations might look like for the different stages of a mentee's life.
youcanmentor.com
Purchase the You Can Mentor book:
You Can Mentor: How to Impact Your Community, Fulfill the Great Commission, and Break Generational Curses
youcanmentor.com
Purchase the You Can Mentor book:
You Can Mentor: How to Impact Your Community, Fulfill the Great Commission, and Break Generational Curses
Creators and Guests
What is You Can Mentor: A Christian Youth Mentoring Podcast?
You Can Mentor is a network that equips and encourages mentors and mentoring leaders through resources and relationships to love God, love others, and make disciples in their own community. We want to see Christian mentors thrive.
We want to hear from you! Send any mentoring questions to hello@youcanmentor.com, and we'll answer them on our podcast. We want to help you become the best possible mentor you can be. Also, if you are a mentoring organization, church, or non-profit, connect with us to join our mentoring network or to be spotlighted on our show.
Please find out more at www.youcanmentor.com or find us on social media. You will find more resources on our website to help equip and encourage mentors. We have downloadable resources, cohort opportunities, and an opportunity to build relationships with other Christian mentoring leaders.
You can mentor is a podcast about the power of building relationships with kids from hard places in the name of Jesus. Every episode will help you overcome common mentoring obstacles and give you the confidence you need to invest in the lives of others. You can mentor.
Speaker 2:What's up mentor and mentoring leaders? I want to share with you guys some exciting information we got. You Can Mentor has released a book. It's entitled You Can Mentor, How to Impact Your Community, Fulfill the Great Commission, and Break Generational Curses. The purpose behind this book is to train up more mentors and more mentoring leaders to effectively disciple the next generation through mentoring.
Speaker 2:If you will, please go purchase a book on our website. You can find it on Amazon. If you go to Amazon, leave a 5 star review. That helps us out a ton. If you're a mentoring organization and you want multiple copies, holler at us and we will give you guys a deal.
Speaker 2:You can find out more information on the You Can Mentor website. Go pick up that book. You Can Mentor.
Speaker 3:Mentors, we love to see you win. So we've got a 2 part crash course series on setting expectations that lead to life in your mentoring relationship. Today, we're talking about making expectations realistic. We hope something you hear today encourages you, and if it does, we'd love to hear about it. Leave a review, rate this podcast, and share it with someone you wanna talk about it with.
Speaker 3:Thanks for listening. You can mentor. Welcome back, everybody. This is You Can Mentor. My name is Beth Winter, and I'm here with my co host today, Stephen Murray.
Speaker 4:That was great. That was very inviting. I wanna I wanna listen more. Keep going.
Speaker 3:Are you not gonna introduce yourself?
Speaker 4:Hello, everyone.
Speaker 3:Okay. Welcome, Steven. How's it feel to be sitting on the other side of the table?
Speaker 4:This this is fantastic. All the pressure is off of me and onto you, which is great.
Speaker 3:It's great. I am just sweating over here with the pressure, so I'm glad you're having a good time. You're doing great. Today, we're talking about expectations, and we've come up with 3 things that we think are important for expectations for your mentee. Expectations, we're gonna talk about they need to be realistic, reaching, and relational.
Speaker 4:Wow.
Speaker 3:Three r's.
Speaker 4:The re the re's the re's are in right now. Yeah. Recycling, refurbished.
Speaker 3:Did you forget the other environmental r's?
Speaker 4:Redesigned? Reuse? Reuse.
Speaker 3:Yeah. I don't know the last one.
Speaker 4:Reputation.
Speaker 3:That sounds Yeah. That's different. Katie is gonna be disappointed.
Speaker 4:Keep going. So, Beth, why are we talking about expectations?
Speaker 3:Expectations are always there whether you recognize you have them or not. And so when you have unrecognized expectations, that can lead to some problem areas in your relationships. And so it's better to think about what they are up front and recognize, are these realistic? What is a good expectation? What's an unfair expectation?
Speaker 3:And how do we help our mentees reach those.
Speaker 4:That's good. So you're saying you're saying that everyone's walking in with expectations, just not everyone knows that they are.
Speaker 3:Right. And sometimes you don't know you have an expectation until it's not met. And when you're going home frustrated, whether you're the kid or the mentor, that's when you realize, oh, frustrated, whether you're the kid or the mentor, that's when you realize, oh, I had an expectation that wasn't being met. Yes. Sometimes it's not always phrased like that, though.
Speaker 4:It's usually,
Speaker 3:like, a little more honest. Mhmm. Yeah. Less PC.
Speaker 4:Mhmm. Mhmm. With my mentee, he's driving now and we've started meeting up and so I'll tell him, hey. 8 o'clock breakfast tacos this place. Sometimes that text message comes at 7 AM.
Speaker 4:Sometimes it comes a few days before. It it it inevitably does get to him and he says, okay. I'm in. Thanks. See you there.
Speaker 4:Something like that. Usually, see you there is the longest text message I've ever received from from my mentee. I'm joking. But there are sometimes he shows up on time. There are sometimes he shows up 5 minutes late.
Speaker 4:There are sometimes he shows up 30 minutes late. When we started meeting, he was consistently 15 minutes late. And I just had this thought in my head that I say breakfast tacos at 8 and he leaves his house at 8 AM. And maybe that was in his head or maybe that wasn't in his head. He was just historically late to things.
Speaker 4:I never mentioned it to him for the first three or four times that it happened. I didn't say anything. I was just I was that guy.
Speaker 3:Mhmm.
Speaker 4:You know people
Speaker 3:like that. Yes. I know you.
Speaker 4:I'm working on it. Well, anyways, I I assumed that it would it would resolve itself, that he would figure it out or he would realize that I was always there waiting for him, that the tacos were already ready for him when he showed up, all that stuff.
Speaker 3:And I
Speaker 4:finally realized just like, I don't think I've said anything about, hey, you need to show up on time when we do this thing. But there's another thing, like, if he shows up 3 or 5 minutes late, I've had this feeling of, like, should I say something or is it is it not that big of a deal? And so I always usually tend to lean toward it's not that big of a deal. And I don't know. I think I wonder if 7 minutes is, like, my threshold where I'm like, okay.
Speaker 4:I I need to say something about this. What's your threshold for lateness? It's probably, like, 30 seconds.
Speaker 3:Yeah. I'm pretty timely. I'm definitely in the category of if you're not early, you're late.
Speaker 4:So you're already mad about this podcast starting 10 minutes late. I'm I
Speaker 3:have not looked at the clock for a reason, Steven.
Speaker 4:But, anyways, I there was an expectation that I had. Yeah. He was not meeting it, but I did not communicate it.
Speaker 3:Right.
Speaker 4:And that was affecting me, but it was also not helping him. And so I think that that that's that's the story that comes to mind. Now this morning when I met with him, guess who showed up 10 minutes late?
Speaker 3:You did.
Speaker 4:It was me. And that's not fun when you've just had all of these hard conversations with your mentee about, hey. I expect you to show up on time when we meet together and then you show up 10 minutes late.
Speaker 3:Did he call you on it?
Speaker 4:He did not, but I did apologize. And yeah. Hopefully, next time he sits me down and has a hard conversation. Yeah. Now I also have a 1 year old, but based off of our last conversation about excuses Mhmm.
Speaker 3:I
Speaker 4:don't think that I should throw Ben under the bus in this circumstance. So I did apologize.
Speaker 3:That's a good move on your part. But, yeah, that's a good I mean, asking him to be on time is a little more realistic than asking a 10 year old to have timeliness and show up to things. And so there is a threshold of, at what at what point can I start expecting these things? But, really, that's important, and that's why realistic is our first point.
Speaker 4:And I'm 32 years old, and I was 10 minutes late.
Speaker 3:It's okay.
Speaker 4:I'm sorry.
Speaker 3:Everybody has everybody has their challenges, Steven.
Speaker 4:Thank you, Beth. Thank you.
Speaker 3:We've just gotta be realistic about that one for you. Okay. So realistic. Expectations need to be realistic for the kid to accomplish, realistic for the stage that they are in physically, emotionally, mentally, or spiritually in their development. So these are gonna be different for every kid, but there are some general, like, milestones that kids kinda go through as a group in their age development.
Speaker 4:I love that. My first look at realistic means give them a break. But this is, like, really just have perspective. It's not it's not just give them a break. Like, let them off the hook.
Speaker 4:It's more rooted in understanding where they're at developmentally and how that should influence your expectation.
Speaker 3:Right. Yeah. And when we don't have expectations that fit the kid where they are at in the stage of development that they're at, we're both gonna leave frustrated probably from that situation. So for instance, if I expect a kindergartner to be able to sit through a lecture that I am giving on the difference between jealousy and hope or something like that, they're gonna be paying attention for a maximum of 5 minutes.
Speaker 4:Even if it's cucumbers and pickles. It doesn't have to be some crazy some crazy abstract emotion.
Speaker 3:Yeah. Yeah. But, really, like, if if I expect them to be able to sit still and listen with their mouth shut the whole time, that is just setting me up for frustration at the end of the day because it's not realistic for where they're at. It's good for me to know that.
Speaker 4:So let let I mean, let's walk through some maybe unrealistic expectations that we might have of a kindergartner. You just said 1. Mhmm. Said making them sit down and pay attention to a sermon or a teaching may not be may not be a realistic expectation. What else?
Speaker 3:At that age, really between kindergarten through 2nd grade, they're gonna have their emotions are gonna be really tied to their physical state. So I I remember when
Speaker 4:I Emotion's tied to their physical state.
Speaker 3:So whenever I was a code for 100 mentoring's after school program, I remember one day looking at this kid who was in 1st grade, and he was just crying. And I was like, oh my gosh. Something major must have happened at school today. And so I pulled him aside, and I am just prepared to have this talk about bullying or, you know, failing a test or something. And whenever he finally calmed down enough to tell me what was going on, he just said, I'm just tired.
Speaker 3:And I was just looking at him like, that was a lot of emotion for just tired. What on earth? And it just I mean, I haven't been a 1st grader in a long time, so I I haven't been in that place. But for a 1st grader, for a kindergartner, for a second grader, their their sleep, how tired they are can have a a direct dramatic impact to the emotions that they're gonna feel that day. So there might be more outbursts of tears or outbursts of anger based on, are they hungry?
Speaker 3:Are they tired? How are they feeling that day?
Speaker 4:I'm trying to think if I'm like that.
Speaker 3:Do you get hangry?
Speaker 4:I mean, it makes it makes perfect sense and even just you can recognize how much, like, after recess
Speaker 3:Mhmm.
Speaker 4:How difficult it is for our kids to engage either because they're tired or they're the transition between physical activity to mind work or or whatever it is.
Speaker 3:Mhmm.
Speaker 4:That transition really does probably influence our expectations of their behavior.
Speaker 3:Yeah. Yeah. And, I I mean, I've talked to a lot of parents who, when they get a behavior a negative behavior report from their kid at program that day or even just them at home, they're struggling with their kid's behavior when they get home from school. I've had some parents say to me, like, I don't know what the deal is because he doesn't get these reports at school. I don't know what the difference is.
Speaker 3:And in reality, it might not be that, you know, you're doing anything wrong or there's a reason based on the environment or anything. It might just be the kid just sat through school for 8 hours, and now he's tired. And that's when you get him at the end of the day. And so by the time he's coming home or going to program, he just might be spent. Like, he might not have the physical capacity to process his emotions in a put together way at the end of the day or sit through another lesson or a devotional or whatever it is trying to do with them.
Speaker 4:Yeah.
Speaker 3:Doesn't mean you're not engaging or you're not good with your kid or something like that. It it just is there is a limit for them.
Speaker 4:That's that's really good to know. Talk Talk about a k through 2nd graders control of their body. Because I it just seems like, obviously, we've all been to a little kid's soccer game where they're all running together and learning that, oh, when I hit people, it hurts me, and it also might hurt them.
Speaker 3:Mhmm.
Speaker 4:Like
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 4:What what are what are our unrealistic expectations about behavior
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 4:As it relates to their control person. Like, they barely even know that they're a person. Yeah. So I think 2 things are going on there. 1, kids
Speaker 3:at that age haven't developed fine motor skills or coordination to, you know, the the full extent yet. And so the gross motor skills are there. They can flail their limbs around, but they're not necessarily
Speaker 4:motor skills?
Speaker 3:Yes. That's like your your limbs, like your legs, your arms, like, the bigger movements Got it. Versus the fine motor skills as, like, holding a pencil, like, the more intricate details of movement. So if you've ever seen a kindergartner outside playing with other kids, they're pretty good at moving around, but they are also egocentric at that age. And so the development to think about how their actions may impact another person is not fully there yet, and that's not a deficiency of their moral compass or anything like that.
Speaker 3:That's just the stage that God made it that way of that's where they're at. So there is a lot of times when a kid may be just in their own world not thinking about how them flailing their arm around and smacking the kid in the face next to them impacted that kid. They're just thinking, I was trying to catch the ball. Yeah. I didn't even see you standing there.
Speaker 3:You know? So
Speaker 4:Have you ever tripped a kid before?
Speaker 3:On purpose?
Speaker 4:Yes.
Speaker 3:No? Have you?
Speaker 4:Well, I didn't mean to confess, but it's like the your cousin is running past the table that you're sitting at and you have this instinctual thought to, like, trip them. Yeah. And then you do and you instantly feel remorse because you're like, I'm a horrible person. That horrible person feeling might not completely be developed Right. Yet in this child.
Speaker 4:He just might have thought of doing it. And
Speaker 3:Like, what would happen if I did that?
Speaker 4:Yeah. Which is the exact thing that I do. Well and I don't do that often.
Speaker 3:Are we learning that you're not at the stage of development you should be at? I feel like
Speaker 4:you have unrealistic expectations of me. No. But I'm a sinner. And so I remember a time doing that, and I was just like, what in the world am I doing? And that thought, which I guess you would say is a conscience.
Speaker 4:Is that a good a good way to describe that is saying when you're saying egocentric
Speaker 3:Mhmm. Are
Speaker 4:you saying that we are not considering the thoughts and feelings of others
Speaker 3:in how
Speaker 4:we're acting?
Speaker 3:Yeah. That's exactly it. Yeah.
Speaker 4:So would remorse be something that a kid probably doesn't feel when they're this young? And that's why we say, hey. You need to say you're sorry. And they're like, sorry, but they don't even know what that means.
Speaker 3:Yeah. I would I think, one, it's a these are all general things. And so you might know a kid who is just extremely, extremely empathetic, and this doesn't really apply to him. But the general thing is, yes, like, a kid might apologize for that because he was told to. And kids at this age, they they revere the rules, and so they wanna follow the rules so that they don't get in trouble.
Speaker 3:But they may not fully have processed and come to, like, a personal conclusion of, oh, wow. When I did that, this is probably what it made that person feel. And in response, who do I wanna be? Is that what I wanna be known for? No.
Speaker 3:That is not who I wanna be known for. So I'm gonna apologize, and tomorrow, I'm gonna choose to be the you know, they're not going through all that. Mhmm. They're just honestly trying to get through the day and get back to a a good place. And so if I did something wrong, this is what I do to fix it.
Speaker 3:I apologize. Now I'm back to the good place with my parent or with my coach, my teacher, whatever. But there's not necessarily gonna be that deep thinking yet.
Speaker 4:Yeah. But the the standard is realistic, but them fulfilling the standard may be unrealistic. So I I think in my head, say, there's this rule. Hey. Don't trip other kids.
Speaker 4:That is a realistic expectation.
Speaker 3:Mhmm.
Speaker 4:But if a kid trips another kid I mean, there's a reason that that rule exists for the safety of kids. Yeah. You shouldn't do that. Mhmm. But it may be unrealistic to expect all of the kids to abide by it.
Speaker 3:Right.
Speaker 4:Because there's the reason it's up there is because it's happening. Mhmm. And so does that make sense? Yeah. Because they're they're not thinking about their actions.
Speaker 4:The rule is realistic, but them following it perfectly is unrealistic.
Speaker 3:Right. Yeah. The rules are setting up, and we'll get into this, but they are setting up the reaching that we want our kids to have. And, like, I may not be able to do this perfectly right now, but I am reaching to get to where I can do that. But, yeah, yeah, it's there has to be a grace of understanding that just because I say that this is the rule doesn't mean that this kid realistically is going to be able to get it right every single time.
Speaker 4:So let's move to 3rd and 4th grade. Do you still have this temptation to trip people in no. I'm just kidding.
Speaker 3:Let's move. Let's get away from the tripping scenario. Thank
Speaker 4:you. Thank you. Help me. What what are some unrealistic expectations or what leads to unrealistic expectations of 3rd 4th graders because we just don't know where they're at developmentally?
Speaker 3:Yeah. Well, the biggest thing so at our after school program, we have a coach designated for 3rd 4th graders, and I always tell the coach who's gonna be in that classroom. And I think about strategically who I wanna put in that classroom because I know that will be the loudest group. Like, that will be the most energetic off the walls group because where they are at developmentally, they are just gonna be high energy. And I think it would be easy to walk by a classroom, see kids just cannot sit still, so restless, wanna be moving, wanna be doing something with their hands, and think, like, oh my gosh.
Speaker 3:Like, do all of these kids have, like, an attention issue or something? But, really, that's just where they're at, and that that's just kids being kids, and there has to just be an understanding for that. So high energy is definitely the thing that stands out to me the most about that age group.
Speaker 4:But the the temptation is to put this expectation of calmness and Yeah. Well togetherness and orderliness that Yes. May be preventing that developmental stage from actually going its course.
Speaker 3:Yeah. I think it's easy to think this kid has been in school learning the rules since he was in kindergarten. He's in 3rd or 4th grade now. He should know better. But, really, like, his he's growing up.
Speaker 3:There's things happening in his body, in his brain that are changing, and he's actually just experiencing a lot more energy than he had when he was younger. Like, kindergarteners go through high energy swings where they will be super energetic, and then they just crash, and they literally need a nap time. But 3rd and 4th graders, it's high energy all day long. They can just keep going. And so even though they've been in school, they know the rules.
Speaker 3:There are some limits too. They just need to move.
Speaker 4:Would you say that 3rd 4th graders are the ones that drive us the most insane as adults.
Speaker 3:I mean
Speaker 4:I know that's probably relative.
Speaker 3:I think it is really
Speaker 4:relative. Hate babies.
Speaker 3:Yes. There are some people who do. Yeah. I think it really depends because I've seen some people that just naturally are a lot better with the high emotions of the younger kids and are a lot better with the high emotions of the younger kids and just really take to that nurturing role. And then there are some people who are really drawn to the 3rd 4th graders because they're like, yeah.
Speaker 3:Let's have fun all day and, like, take everything to the max. And then there are some people who are better with the older kids because they wanna dive deeper into conversation, and a 5th grader is way better at holding a conversation with you than a second grader. So I think it kind of varies on what you expect Yeah. Expectations. So,
Speaker 4:this brings me to a question. Expectations. So, this brings me to a question. Just pan out a little bit. That's what happens when a camera does this motion with my hands.
Speaker 4:I don't know how to explain it. Zoom out. Zoom out. Is that better? Yeah.
Speaker 3:There you go. You look at the forest.
Speaker 4:Wow. Mentors, should they attempt to match the behavior of their mentees in order to kind of confront these expectations that they may have.
Speaker 3:And
Speaker 4:so if you're a I don't know. What's the chill Enneagram?
Speaker 3:A 9.
Speaker 4:A 9? Yeah. Well, yeah, I don't I don't know if it's Enneagram or if you're the introvert, but your kid is extroverted or something. Maybe your expectation is related to your own temperament and not theirs at the same developmentally. And so would you say it's best for mentors to match their mentees behavior?
Speaker 3:I I don't think that has to be a factor personally. I mean I think a mentorship should be about learning and so not just for the mentee to learn from you, but also for you to learn from them. And so I think that there can be a lot of really great, like, push and pull there in that relationship. And I know when, like, one of my mentors was the most chill, patient, just, like, put a cup of tea on kind of, like, let's just take it slow and process everything kind of person. And I would get so frustrated with him because I would go in there and be like, here's what's going on.
Speaker 3:Let's develop a course of action, and let's go figure it out right now. And I wanna fix this. And he'd be like, let's instead take 20 minutes to just sit in silence and hear from the Lord. And I'd be like, what? No.
Speaker 3:Like, you're wise. You probably already know what to do. Let's just figure it out right now. And so that was a really good experience for me to learn from somebody who I had a hard time relating to the way that he did life. And so that was a growing thing for me.
Speaker 3:And so I think it can be really great to be with somebody who's your total opposite.
Speaker 4:That is a great answer. So, I mean, his piece was confronting your chaos. And and so mentors can match the chaos and just run around, go crazy, and normalize their their behavior as a child who is wanting to play.
Speaker 3:Totally.
Speaker 4:But then also, you can provide contrast of because I've seen
Speaker 3:mentors do that where they
Speaker 4:they are just themselves. They're not trying to be someone else. And I think that that's really powerful to to witness because I think there are some temptations to to change who you are Yeah. To be a mentor. Yeah.
Speaker 4:And you don't necessarily have to do that.
Speaker 3:Yeah. I think it just ultimately comes down to, humility to wanna understand the kid and not make them like you, but just understand who god made them to be and help them grow into that. And it's not about making them understand you. It's about you understanding them and helping them become who they were made to be.
Speaker 4:It's good. Okay. Zoom back in.
Speaker 3:Okay. Wow. That was great. Great sound effects.
Speaker 4:Where are we at? We are we at 5th are we are we getting to middle school?
Speaker 3:We are. Well, we're we're getting there. Okay. 5th through 8th grade. It's a really big group of kids there.
Speaker 4:I I think it makes sense though because 5th graders are really different than 3rd graders.
Speaker 3:Yes.
Speaker 4:And for some reason, they're in the same school
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 4:Most of the time.
Speaker 3:6th graders are in the same school too, at least here in Dallas. So Isn't that weird? Yeah. It wasn't like that where I grew up. It separated at 5th grade.
Speaker 3:But, yeah, like, our 6th graders, I frequently have conversations with them where they know that they are at a different place developmentally, and they are honestly annoyed with the kids younger than them all the time because, you know, we're all in the same they're all in the same program together. Mhmm. And they have you know, they can respond to a correction the first time. And, like, they've got it together. They understand the rules.
Speaker 3:They know how to self regulate. Meanwhile, there's a kid right next to them just just all over the place, like, laying on the floor, and then coach is, like, trying to get them up in their chair, like, 3 times. And everybody's just waiting on this kid, and the 6th grader is just looking at him like, come on. I wanna go to recess, and we're all waiting on you.
Speaker 4:Has anyone talked to these 6th graders about the unrealistic expectations they have of kindergartners?
Speaker 3:I'll I'll send them this podcast.
Speaker 4:Yeah. That's great.
Speaker 3:Yeah. But, yeah, that that happens because at this stage, these kids are starting to think more like adults. It they don't require as much moment by moment direction. They they know kind of the way things go. They know the rights and wrongs for the most part, and they're starting to think critically about some of those things for themselves and even question some of the rules.
Speaker 3:Like, it is so typical and normal for kids in this age to be like, yeah. I know that is the rule, but why is that the rule, and does it have to stay that way? So and that's not necessarily, like, defiance. They are really just exercising new parts of their brain that weren't getting to, you know, step on the court before. So it's a good thing for them to start thinking like that.
Speaker 4:I know a lot of kids ask the question why. But you're you're saying and 6th grade, specifically, that I need
Speaker 3:Yes. I I learned quickly when I started working with 5th and 6th grade specifically that I need to be really good at having a reason for everything that I do. I need to be able to explain to a kid why I am asking him to not wear his hat inside the program or, to not wear his hat inside the program or, you know, something as simple as that. He's gonna ask me, why is that a rule? And I can't just say because it's a rule.
Speaker 3:I mean, I could say that, but he really wants
Speaker 4:to know. That's most of what people say is, like, because I'm an adult.
Speaker 3:Right. Yeah. And, like, there's there's fairness to that of just needing to respect the authority of the adults. But I also think it's more personally, I think it's more helpful for you to help them see why you came to that conclusion. So because they really do wanna know.
Speaker 4:So why can't they wear hats?
Speaker 3:Well, that's a great question, Steven.
Speaker 4:That is that how you respond? You start there. That's a great question. That's You validate the question.
Speaker 3:Yes. It's good. I honestly don't know the answer to that one.
Speaker 4:Would you tell them that if you didn't know?
Speaker 3:If I didn't know, I I probably would tell them that. I would say, that's a great question. I think I'll think about that too. And if we decide that is a rule that doesn't have to be a rule, you'll be the first to know.
Speaker 4:That is a great response. Now take your hat off.
Speaker 3:Well, the reason, like, a lot of our kids, they like to pull their hoods up all the way, and then they end up inevitably, like, laying on the table and, like, wanting to sleep instead of paying attention. So what we've explained is it the hoods especially go in hand in hand with the hat, so we just eliminate it altogether, and it's about participating. And it feels like you're not wanting to participate whenever you've got your hood up, you've got your headphones on, and you're, like, very obviously trying to not engage. Mhmm. So that's that's what's coming to me of why we had that rule.
Speaker 4:That's good, Beth. It's a great example. Kids are usually open books, but this is a stage where you kinda start guarding information. And so talk about expectations for privacy and just sharing in general.
Speaker 3:Yeah. Yeah. I remember even in my own life, I don't know that there was a specific day that I was like, I want to be able to close my door. But I remember that being a fight with my parents because they added, like, an open door policy. And but I think that there is just at some point, there's this transition where you wanted your parents involved in everything.
Speaker 3:You sought them out for everything to all of a sudden you're like, I'm my own person, and I wanna have some things that are just mine. I don't necessarily wanna tell my mom every single thing that happened or my friend said or that I thought about or did. And that's not I think when we think of a kid wanting privacy, there's automatically, for mentors and parents, a lot of fear that comes up with that of, well, you wouldn't wanna be hiding part of your life unless you were doing something you weren't supposed to be doing. But I I don't think that that is a fair thing to assume because even in our own lives, like, boundaries are really healthy, and kids have to start developing those at some point. And, you know, the longer you practice something, the better you're gonna get at it.
Speaker 3:And so if we teach kids healthy boundaries, by the time they're adults, they're gonna have way less problems at knowing what are the things that you don't owe to tell other people or share with everyone, and what are the things that are really good to let other people in on.
Speaker 4:For mentors, usually asking questions is the way that they prove their interest in a child.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 4:But if a child isn't sharing, it can feel like the child's the reason I can't show him that I'm interested. And so what would be your encouragement to that mentor who who feels that?
Speaker 3:Yeah. I think, again, it's just I would wanna encourage you that it is not a symptom that you're doing something wrong. And that's why I think there is a lot of freedom in just understanding where kids are at developmentally because that is a totally normal thing. Like, there is a kid in our program I can think of right now who, for whatever reason, he like, I could ask him, what's your favorite color? And instead of telling me his favorite color, he'll say, I don't have to tell you that.
Speaker 3:And there's a part of me that wants to be like, why wouldn't you? Do you not trust me to know your favorite color? But, you know, for him, it's like, this is something that I have that an adult doesn't have to they don't have they don't get to tell me to give it to them, and I wanna hold on to this. And so for that kid, it might just be him exercising control over what he may feel like is the only thing he has, which is his thoughts and opinions. And it doesn't have to indicate that he doesn't trust you or that he doesn't even want you to be in his life.
Speaker 3:It it doesn't mean that, but it's just that kid exercising some authority that he might be feeling for the first time.
Speaker 4:Yeah. I well, I I'm very interested in that, this dynamic, because there are some kind of just natural possible survival coping mechanisms in not sharing information where possibly in this season of life, information is being used against you. Yeah. Like, I remember when I was in 7th grade and I told somebody I was dating somebody,
Speaker 3:and
Speaker 4:I wasn't dating them. I was just acting like I was. Yeah. Then word got out about it at school and this girl was like, I'm not dating you.
Speaker 3:Oh, that's tough. And I
Speaker 4:was like, and so you inevitably get to this place where you're like, if I share information, it could be used against me, which we're all living in that world now.
Speaker 3:Oh, totally. Yeah.
Speaker 4:But 5th 8th graders are in that world as well Yeah. And feel a lot of social pressure. But then the other side of it is that maybe people close to them have feigned interest in their life, but have more just been using it
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 4:And using them to probably prove a sense of love or affection or earn, a place in their life that maybe they haven't earned. Yeah. And so as a mentor, that's kinda what you're doing. You're trying to earn a place in their life as quickly as you can, and maybe it's gonna take some time for you to actually prove Yeah. That you're a person that's trustworthy and is worth sharing with
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 4:And isn't gonna use that information against you.
Speaker 3:Yeah. I would definitely agree with that. And so, like, unfortunately, I feel like the best encouragement I have is to just be patient and stay the course because whether it because whether it is that or it's just the stage of development, I mean, I can think there's, like, all these memes out there I've seen of, you know, thinking back to when you're a kid, and you're like, oh, my mom's calling. Like, oh, I'm gonna hang up. I'm not gonna answer.
Speaker 3:And then now, like, as an adult, being like calling your mom and being sad if she has plans and like, what? You don't wanna talk to me. I wanna talk to you. I mean, the process is and so the kid will come around eventually if you are a person who is worthy to come around to. And
Speaker 4:a single color Wow. In that moment. And so he he says
Speaker 3:he's sorry. That's great
Speaker 4:to hear. Okay. Are we
Speaker 3:moving into high school now? Yes.
Speaker 4:Let's do it. High school. Well,
Speaker 3:we should just expect everything from
Speaker 4:high school students. Right? I mean, clearly, they're in adulthood. 9th 9th, 10th grade. They should be getting jobs.
Speaker 4:Right?
Speaker 3:Yeah. If you can drive, that's it. Right? You're done growing. You've learned everything.
Speaker 3:Your brain is
Speaker 4:fully it's good. Right?
Speaker 3:No. No. No. No.
Speaker 4:Is my brain done? You're the brain person. Is my brain done doing its thing? Well,
Speaker 3:I think all the the big parts of your brain should be
Speaker 4:say yes or no.
Speaker 3:Okay. Okay. It's not a yes or no. I mean, like like, the major things should be set, but your neurons are still rewiring every moment of your life. And so even for you, Steven, the age you're at, there is there's hope for you.
Speaker 3:Come on.
Speaker 4:So encouraging, I think. Okay. Talk talk to us. What unrealistic expectations do we have of high school students?
Speaker 3:The number one thing on my list is about the amount of food they consume and the amount of sleep that they require.
Speaker 4:And the minimal amount of gratitude they they communicate.
Speaker 3:I mean, you know, but really, like, high school kids are growing rapidly, and so that requires a lot of fuel. So it is totally normal for your teenager to clean out the pantry and eat literally everything.
Speaker 4:So that's a thing. Like, they they're burning more calories. Yeah. I guess that makes sense because you're bigger.
Speaker 3:It's, yeah, it's a growth spurt, and that's gotta be fueled by something. And so
Speaker 4:I've never seen that.
Speaker 3:A lot, sleeping a lot, That's what they need. They're not lazy.
Speaker 4:They need to sleep more?
Speaker 3:Yes. Isn't that interesting? Because you think back to the kindergarten, and it's basically they're going through this process of kind of going back to that state where there's energy highs and energy lows. They need a lot of food. That's that's kindergarten.
Speaker 3:Extra snack time, nap time. We're back there with with the high school.
Speaker 4:Do we need high school nap times now? What has our country become? Sorry. I'm I'm I have unrealistic expectations.
Speaker 3:Yeah. I'll work on it. That's why you're the co host on this one.
Speaker 4:Freaking Gen z.
Speaker 3:Some other things, though.
Speaker 4:That's a good point, by the way, that we we all have unrealistic unrealistic expectations of people from different generations than us. It's not just those younger than us. It's also those older than us.
Speaker 3:That's true. I think that's a separate is that part 2?
Speaker 4:Are we yes. We should. We should.
Speaker 3:I didn't have notes on what development has
Speaker 4:to be a little longer than you guys.
Speaker 3:Great. I'll work on that one. The kids at this age, though, you you can expect that they're gonna be more coordinated. They're gonna be a little more
Speaker 4:I don't know. That wasn't true for me. My basketball coach told me I was as coordinated as a 3 legged cow.
Speaker 3:Okay. Once again, I feel like this podcast has turned into realizing you had some development delays. Was that
Speaker 4:so I I think he had unrealistic expectations of me, if I'm honest.
Speaker 3:But was it was it giving you a reachable goal?
Speaker 4:I mean, he'd he gave me 20 seconds in the Q4 when we were up by 10 points or more. So I I don't know. I'll get back to you.
Speaker 3:Let's process that after.
Speaker 4:Okay. Keep going. I'm sorry.
Speaker 3:Expectations for high schoolers, you can expect that at this age, there's gonna be more arguments, honestly. Mhmm. Because they they're thinking for themselves. They may not have they're they're gonna have a little bit more of that long term planning, but they're not gonna have all the wisdom that comes with the long term planning that somebody like their parent or their mentor might be able to have. And so there's gonna be more of this pushback of, you don't know me.
Speaker 3:Like, I know what's best for me and them thinking through things, but it it isn't necessarily gonna come with all the picture that you can see. And so the in that fight for their independence, and that's a good thing for them to wanna be independent. There's probably gonna be a little more friction in them wanting to assert, I can make decisions. I can trust myself. And that stems from a really good thing because that identity development is so key during this stage, and it's really setting in during that those grades.
Speaker 3:So it's a good thing that just needs to be kind of put on the what are those those things called whenever you're bowling and you're really bad at it?
Speaker 4:Bumpers.
Speaker 3:Yes. It needs the bumpers of how to how to make it still a good relationship
Speaker 4:Mhmm.
Speaker 3:In that.
Speaker 4:That's good. I have no more thoughts or any total comments.
Speaker 3:Great.
Speaker 4:Though I did experience the depression that you put on here go through a period of sadness or depression temporarily.
Speaker 3:Yeah. I experienced that. I think knowing that honestly, there's just such a mass reconstruction of the brain kind of in the I think it starts around 12 and goes till around 14 or 15. It that it just makes sense that there's gonna be
Speaker 4:some Oh, you're talking about the apoptotic period.
Speaker 3:K. Well, one of us, I guess, went to A&M, and one of us went to tech because I didn't learn that. But, really, like, I think it's relieving for a parent or a mentor to know there's not necessarily something totally off with your kid just because they go through a time of sadness or a time where they may have some temporary depression. Their their body is just literally going through a lot, and that affects your emotions. It affects mental state.
Speaker 3:And so learning how to cope with those things is gonna set them up for success in the future. The this is a time when that identity development is gonna be really tied into them learning the resilience that they have to overcome things, and that kind of mood swing is one of those things. And that kind of mood swing is one of those things.
Speaker 4:Should we talk about unrealistic expectations of high schoolers' sexuality?
Speaker 3:I'm gonna let you lead on that because I don't really know where you're going with that.
Speaker 4:Well, they have more interest in romantic relationships and sexuality.
Speaker 3:What
Speaker 4:is an unrealistic expectation?
Speaker 3:I think it is unrealistic. All prude? It's unrealistic to think that your kid is gonna be the one teenager who's not thinking about sex or wanting to date or wanting attention from the girl or guide. You know, that's just unrealistic. They're gonna be thinking about it, and that's not necessarily a bad thing.
Speaker 4:Would you say it's unrealistic to think or expect them to not sleep around? Is this one tripping you up like the the hat question?
Speaker 3:There's just so much room for a fence on this one.
Speaker 4:Well, I'll tell you. At our high school ministry, our the the leader said, hey. Who here wants to be married? One kid out of 20 said they wanted to be married. One kid said that he wants to sleep with as many women as he can.
Speaker 4:And this is at a high school youth group mentoring program, Which is which is the one that's more realistic in the mind of a high school student?
Speaker 3:I think my response to that would be it is unrealistic to think that a kid who may not have been brought up in the same household as you with the same expectations that you had with the same values, with the same outlook on life, the same view of God, relationship with God is unrealistic for you to expect that they are gonna naturally fall in line with the things you believe. And so I think it's probably fair that in our mentoring relationships, we're gonna run into some things where it our mentee is gonna do some things that we personally think are not okay or are gonna be hurtful for them or for other people that aren't the best choices. But I think it's just really important for us to be mindful of where they came from and, you know, what information did they have when they made that decision and just be be full of grace for they didn't have the same experience that I that I walked into the room with. They don't think about this the way that I do. How can I meet them where they're at with what they think about this with love and grace and a desire to just impart wisdom to them, not punish, not shame, not condemn, but bring them up into better choices?
Speaker 4:Yeah. This is the the most interesting part of the unrealistic expectations deal to me because this is the time that kids are becoming adults. They're making huge life decisions, and there's a a larger responsibility for the mentor in in these situations to recognize what expectations they have. Yeah. And how it could embitter them and frustrate them and cause them to tap out
Speaker 3:and
Speaker 4:be like, this kid's not taking my advice. He's not doing what I think he should be doing.
Speaker 3:Yeah. And
Speaker 4:yeah. I mean, that this is this is tricky.
Speaker 3:Yeah. It is. Well and I think when you when I think back on even my life or, like, some of my friends and family are parents now, and when you think about all the things even growing up, all the people I'm thinking of grew up in Christian households with these values instilled in them, like certain values and morals or whatever. They still made mistakes and didn't meet the expectations of their mentors or their parents regarding, like, drinking or having sex before marriage or some of these, like, big topics that feel like, oh my gosh. My kid is off the rails.
Speaker 3:God, where are you? But in all of them, all of the people that I'm thinking of, I just have seen how, like, they were never so off the path that the lord had for them to where it was just this unredeemable thing. All of them have come to a place where it's a part of the testimony of, like, I was lost, and I was making these decisions out of hurt, out of the loneliness, out of of just a an apathy, whatever it was, and that the lord met them in those things. And so I think that's our response too is when our kids when our mentees fail to meet our expectations and we sense this just hurt and just the sadness of, I wanted better for you. Like, I want better for you.
Speaker 3:Our response has to be to meet them where they are because that's where the Lord is gonna be in that situation too.
Speaker 4:Yeah. When when I think about sex in high school, most of the mentors I know would say that's the worst idea or the worst thing you could ever do. Like, that that's just if they were to put it in one sentence, they'd be like, that's the worst thing you could you could do right now. And I like how you just communicated that there's always a reason why and that there is a need, there's a feeling, there's a desire that's underneath that. And so it's it's not necessarily the focus shouldn't be on that's the worst thing you could ever do.
Speaker 4:The focus should be on I recognize like the desire and the feeling and what led to that decision and trying to articulate that with a child is very hard.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 4:Because on the surface they're not always going to be able to attach that longing and desire for connection and intimacy to sex or the novelty of I mean just doing something that everybody else is doing. You're curious and Yeah. Having those conversations with with with kids that isn't just the teaching, like and I'm not saying that you shouldn't have teaching on a biblical view of sex and marriage and and all of those things, but does that incorporate an understanding of physiologically what we desire and long for in the reasons that we attach to others, the reasons we're curious, all of those things. I think those conversations are less had than just don't do this.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 4:Don't do that. Yeah. And so the rules are clear, but the conversation is absent.
Speaker 3:Yeah. Which is like, that goes right with what we talked about with the hat thing earlier of, like, with 5th and 6th graders, us as mentees and adults needing to be able to have an answer for the role. I think there are a lot of adults out there who have been told that this is this is just the way it is, and maybe they have always abided by that rule, or maybe they even messed up. And there was a lot of guilt that went along with that for them personally. But they're just repeating that same rule without ever having thought, what is the reason that this was kind of laid out as the way God wanted things to be?
Speaker 3:What is what is really the purpose behind this guideline for life? And so I think as mentors as mentors, we kind of owe it to our kids to do the searching in ourselves of understanding, okay, whatever the expectations are that I am giving my kid, why are those expectations I'm giving them? What is the actual purpose? How does this play into the bigger picture of me helping them become all that God made them to be and fulfill their potential?
Speaker 4:That's good. I read a book recently from Barnabas Piper. He is the son of John Piper. Stay with me. He read a book called The Curious Christian How Discovering Wonder Enriches Every Part of Life Mhmm.
Speaker 4:And in the book he detailed, obviously, if your if your dad is John Piper, what kind of upbringing do you think you're going to receive? Do you think strict? Do you think
Speaker 3:This is the way it is.
Speaker 4:Yeah. Well, he actually shares in his book that as he was growing up, his dad fostered his curiosity and allowed him to make decisions on what he wanted to watch, what he wanted to read, what he wanted to listen to. And his dad would always just ask the question, how his dad would ask a question. Why do you why are you interested in that? What are you receiving from it?
Speaker 4:What what good is coming from this?
Speaker 3:That's great.
Speaker 4:And I was like, that is not the the image in my head of what John Piper would do. He would be like, you're not watching that. All you're watching is The Passion of the Christ. And I don't I don't know if kids even watch that. I don't know.
Speaker 4:It's pretty violent, but it's also beautiful. That was actually Katie and I's second date when we watched The Passion of the Christ Wow. By the way. And then I told her, I could never love you like Jesus loves you, but I freaking love you.
Speaker 3:Really going in deep there Yes. Real quick.
Speaker 4:Yeah. Our first date was Hotel Rwanda.
Speaker 3:Wow. That that just is exactly the kind of thing I would expect from you guys.
Speaker 4:But, anyways, I I was really challenged by that that that encouraging curiosity. Yeah. While at the same time giving guided discussion questions and helping helping your mentee articulate the reason why
Speaker 3:Mhmm.
Speaker 4:They want what they're wanting. Mhmm. And so even if it's cc's, it's like where do you want to go to to dinner? The kid says cc's. You say oh okay why?
Speaker 4:Why do you want to go to cc's? And maybe they'll say like oh I just I really like when my mom gives me quarters to buy a bouncy ball. Mhmm. And you'll just recognize so many different connections to why. Yeah.
Speaker 4:But even if they don't respond and answer, I think it is an opportunity I doing the things that you're doing.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 4:Being given the opportunity to do that.
Speaker 3:Yeah. That's really good. Good job, John.
Speaker 4:Way to go, Pipes.
Speaker 3:Alright. So we've talked about some of the realistic expectations of typical development stages in kids, but we are mentoring kids. And so a reasonable expectation for some of our kids is that they have endured some trauma in their life. In trauma, we just have to recognize that it it impacts the brain. And so not gonna go into the in-depth analysis of how it impacts the brain, but I do just wanna hit on just the short version of this.
Speaker 3:I thought
Speaker 4:you were I'm just gonna hit on the hippocampus real quick real
Speaker 3:quick. That would have been great. Yeah. So trauma, we just have to understand that it it actually affects the growth of the brain, which is crazy to me to think about because at least when I was growing up, I don't think that there was as much access to that kind of understanding of how going through something really hard. You need to be aware of how that might impact a a child later on in their life and be able to draw those conclusions together of, like, oh, my kid and be able to draw those conclusions together of, like, oh, my kid lost their mom when they were in 3rd grade, but they seem to be doing fine now.
Speaker 3:You know? No. There needs to be a greater understanding of all the ways that it could come out later, and just be prepared for that. So, a response to things. And so a kid who has endured
Speaker 4:it makes it grow?
Speaker 3:It makes it grow.
Speaker 4:Interesting.
Speaker 3:Yeah. So when it gets bigger, basically, your reactions get bigger to things. Woah. So a kid who has endured trauma, they are gonna be more reactionary. They're gonna be more sensitive.
Speaker 3:Their fight flight response is gonna be way easier to trigger.
Speaker 4:Woah. Yeah. I did not know that.
Speaker 3:Yeah. In addition to that, the hippocampus, we are gonna be to that, the hippocampus, we are gonna talk about it.
Speaker 4:But but, like, the amygdala is like it the brain is like a muscle. So the part that you're working in more is developing more. And so what you're saying is that if you have adverse childhood experiences, the part of your brain that responds to fear or survival, you are cultivating
Speaker 3:Yes.
Speaker 4:A reliance upon it.
Speaker 3:Yes. So yes. Just to clarify, that growth is problematic. It's not growth in the way of thinking like
Speaker 4:My biceps are getting
Speaker 3:huge
Speaker 4:because I'm doing push ups. It's yeah. It's something that know it makes your biceps grow. I do biannual workouts. But, yes, it's not good.
Speaker 3:It is not good.
Speaker 4:And there's not very much room in there, I don't expect. So if the amygdala is getting bigger, the other parts probably can't get bigger. Is that fair to say?
Speaker 3:I mean, I don't that is fair to it I don't know if causation equals correlation or whatever the the term there is or whatever. You know? But yes. So the amygdala is getting bigger. The hippocampus is getting smaller.
Speaker 3:Yes. So technically, you are correct. So the hippocampus affects cognitive functions. And so basically, what I'm saying is a kid who has gone through trauma, it would not be unrealistic to expect that he may have more behavior issues and struggle in school
Speaker 4:explain more about the hippocampus. I've lost you there. Never really talk about that one.
Speaker 3:K. So the hippocampus, it stores our memory. It
Speaker 4:You said cognitive skills too or something?
Speaker 3:Yeah. Well, cognitive functions. And so
Speaker 4:What what is the tell me. What is a cognitive function? Is that thinking? Is that making connections between experiences?
Speaker 3:It's really, the hippocampus is primarily the memory. And so short term memory, long term memory.
Speaker 4:Okay.
Speaker 3:So a kid who has gone through trauma I don't know if you've ever heard somebody talk about, like, blackouts in memory with somebody who's gone through trauma, but there may be literal times of their lives that they cannot remember things from those years. But even just in a more day to day thing, you might find yourself frustrated that you have explained the process of how you want a kid to do something, whether it's just when you get home from school or when you when I pick you up, this is what I expect, and we have to go over this routine every single time. Like, why can't you get this yet? But for that kid, it may just be there are some short term memory lapses there, and it's not defiance. It's not, like, a learning disability.
Speaker 3:It's just don't care. Right. Right. It's not apathy. Yeah.
Speaker 3:It it might be something so outside of their control and something that, like, they are a victim of. Like, they are suffering from this consequence of something that had nothing to do with their choices.
Speaker 4:Wow.
Speaker 3:So for us to just have empathy in that and understand they are having to overcome some things that other kids at their at their age, at their grade are not having to overcome. So I'm gonna look at this kid and see the fight in him Yeah. And the strength in him rather than look at him and just see, why can't you be like the other kids at your age? Yeah. I don't understand.
Speaker 4:That's really good, Beth. Mentors, it is not fair to assume they don't care.
Speaker 3:Yeah. It's good.
Speaker 4:I need that.
Speaker 3:Mhmm. Yeah. And then the last part is the development of the prefrontal cortex. So You're just
Speaker 4:gonna talk about the whole brain, aren't you?
Speaker 3:I said this is the short version. Basically, the prefrontal cortex gets shut down. It it's put in lockdown. Like, the amygdala guards the rest of the brain. And so if that is bigger and more reactive, it signals to the rest of the brain, like, when when something occurs that might trigger a response.
Speaker 3:Let's say that a kid is sitting with you, and you correct him on something, and his reaction is intense. Like, it's way bigger deal to him than it needed to be, and that is his amygdala going off, and he is going in fight or flight right then. And so he's either gonna shut down or he's gonna blow up. That's the amygdala. And so when that happens, the prefrontal cortex, which, relates to helping you make good decisions, make good decisions, or develop skills.
Speaker 3:All of a sudden, that is not in the picture at all, and it is just this primal survival brain running the thing. The survival brain is in the driver's seat in in that moment.
Speaker 4:I'm a little confused. Let me see if I'm picking up what you're throwing down.
Speaker 3:K.
Speaker 4:Are you saying that the prefrontal cortex is, like calling the shots but may not be doing a great job and gives gives up its authority to other parts of the brain instead of making decisions. And so when it's underdeveloped, your brain is run by your amygdala or run run by things that aren't made for decision making? I I don't
Speaker 3:Yeah. I mean, the way that it was explained to me whenever I went through trainings and classes on this was thinking of all of this I
Speaker 4:didn't go to bring class. Alright. Skip
Speaker 3:that one. Was if we're thinking about these three parts, like the White House. The amygdala is the security gate at the front. White House. This is the way it was explained to me.
Speaker 3:Okay? You asked for clarity.
Speaker 4:Can't you just use a a sport analogy?
Speaker 3:Like, use literature. You're gonna understand. I promise. Okay. The amygdala is the security gate at the front.
Speaker 3:It controls if you're if you're getting past that point or not. It's the shutdown if they if they perceive a threat. So the hippocampus is, like, the history that you can just, like, walk around that White House, and there are artifacts and things. So it's all of that stored information. The prefrontal cortex is, like, the president.
Speaker 3:Wow.
Speaker 4:Okay. Woah.
Speaker 3:I don't know how to make that a sport analogy.
Speaker 4:No. That's cool. So, I mean and to to further it, it's it's like you're tying the hands of the decision maker.
Speaker 3:Yes.
Speaker 4:And he can't get
Speaker 3:And also those memories too. Like, you're not getting in the house. You're not getting the president. It stops here.
Speaker 4:Woah.
Speaker 3:Yeah. So I don't know. I mean, I can think of immediately, like, 15 examples of when I have been sitting in front of a kid, and I am looking at him. And I am like it is like there is there are crisis alarms going on in his head. And I am thinking, this is such a alarms going on in his head.
Speaker 3:And I am thinking, this is such a small thing that I just needed to talk to you about real quick. But all of a sudden, it is like military Code orange. Yes. That's what's
Speaker 4:going on, though.
Speaker 3:And so in that moment, I can't be frustrated with that kid because he is in a defense mechanism that he had to learn for whatever reason to survive something that happened to him. And all I can do in that situation is just have empathy and patience, and that works. So the the encouragement for for mentors because you might be thinking of what your kid has experienced or what you're currently experiencing with your mentee and just are like, well, is it always gonna be like this? And it's not. Like, research has shown that the brain is so much more flexible than we ever thought it was.
Speaker 3:And so with the proper support and relationships and just learning coping skills, overcoming things, the brain has a desire to heal itself. Like, God designed our brains to seek healing, and so, eventually, those neurons can rewire, refire, whatever it is. And as we develop and teach patterns of a better way of doing something, a better habit to develop, the more they walk on those roads, that's gonna be the one that becomes, like, the highway for for decisions and information to process in that kid's brain. And that old way of thinking is gonna be, like, you know, the old trail that eventually just all the grass and brush grows over, and they don't go down that one anymore. It might still be there, and they may, like, take a detour every now and then, but it's primarily you're gonna be building new highways for them to
Speaker 4:travel on. That's so good.
Speaker 3:That's why I love the brain.
Speaker 4:You do love the brain. It's hilarious. Your brain will never see itself. Does that make your brain
Speaker 3:sad? I've seen my brain
Speaker 4:on an MRI. Does that count? Oh, I guess that does count. So if the amygdala is the security gate, the hippocampus is the White House pictures, paintings, declaration of independence behind glass, and the president is the prefrontal cortex. Who who are who who's the mentor?
Speaker 3:That's a really good question. Is the
Speaker 4:mentor the National Guard? Or are we the protesters?
Speaker 3:Oh, I guess
Speaker 4:that Are we diplomats? Or are we the the lawn care? I yeah. I don't maybe I'm am I taking this too far?
Speaker 3:I think
Speaker 4:you're taking it too far.
Speaker 3:Every metaphor breaks down eventually.
Speaker 4:We are air force 1.
Speaker 3:Mentors are probably, like, the happy tourist who just wants to come in and and learn and experience.
Speaker 4:That yeah. Because mentors are trying to take a tour Yeah. Of memories and understandings and seeing their perspective and how they view the world. It's a pretty good analogy. But most tourists are stuck at the gate.
Speaker 3:It's true. Yeah. I guess you need to be less threatening.
Speaker 4:Which isn't working out right now in in our nation's capital at the moment.
Speaker 3:Wow. You really went there.
Speaker 4:Okay. Well, it was unrealistic of us to expect to do this entire series in one episode, which calling it even a series maybe was the telltale foreshadowing sign that that we were gonna do multiple episodes.
Speaker 3:Wow.
Speaker 4:Did we call it a series?
Speaker 3:I don't know. But now I wanna go back and listen to see if we did because it was was like our brains knew what we didn't know yet. Yeah. Unconsciously, it was telling us.
Speaker 4:So next week, we are gonna talk about
Speaker 3:Reaching expectations. So setting expectations that are within reach but that require your mentee to grow a little bit towards and then relational. So how setting expectations and helping your mentee reach them is a relational process.
Speaker 4:So good. Not too high, not too low, just right, but also relational.
Speaker 3:Mhmm. It's
Speaker 4:good. So join us next week. Thank you, Beth, for all of your insight.
Speaker 3:Thank you, Steven, for being my guest today.
Speaker 4:This is your podcast now. You totally you totally took it from me. No. It's great. You can mentor.