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The Moonshots Podcast goes behind the scenes of the world's greatest superstars, thinkers and entrepreneurs to discover the secrets to their success. We deconstruct their success from mindset to daily habits so that we can apply it to our lives. Join us as we 'learn out loud' from Elon Musk, Brene Brown to emerging talents like David Goggins.
And welcome to the moonshots podcast. It's episode 162. I'm your co-host Mike Parsons. And as always, I'm joined by the man himself, Mr. Mark Pearson Freeland. Good morning, mark. Hey, good morning, Mike, what an exciting moment for you and I and our listeners as we crack into this new year and a brand new series, how good is it to be kicking off?
I think I lose count. I think this is like four years that we've been doing the show and to start with a big new series, we asked ourselves what is the perfect way to start the year? And mark, I think we have the. I think you are right, Mike today listeners starts our brand new series on entrepreneurship.
We've done a few episodes on world, famous, globally renowned entrepreneurs. Of course, we've done lots of one-offs here and there, but this is marking the first series where we actually delve into the [00:01:00] ideas, the lessons, maybe the mistakes, but also the opportunity. That present themselves for entrepreneurs and Mike today, episode 162.
We're kicking off with a grand book and a grand individual. Mr. Darren Hardy, who wrote the entrepreneur roller coaster. I think this is such a good title because building starting a business, it truly is love and hate. It is up and down. It is a rollercoaster. It is indeed. And Darren Hardy. Mark. He just says it as it is.
He is like straight to the point. And I think that's why the book entrepreneur rollercoaster is so successful is I think he gets to not just one or two, but I think he's got four or five, six big ideas that truly represent the day to day experiences of entrepreneurs. When people are trying [00:02:00] to start a business, there is no better place to sell.
Then the entrepreneur rollercoaster, right? Yeah, I totally agree. And I think that the reason why books on entrepreneurship are so popular still is because they present individuals and opportunity to go and do things their own way. Sometimes maybe you've sat on the sidelines and watched your colleagues or your boss or your.
Going a different direction and you've always dreamed of doing it yourself. I think Darren Hardy's book is the perfect introduction into the entrepreneurial space, because like he say, it gives us that dose of realism and a realization that yeah. Times are going to be good. But you've got to remember with each peak, there's going to be a trough.
It's going to get a little bit dicey here and there. And I think Darren Hardy's with all of his experiences. Is the perfect individual to really lay out the pathway to becoming an entrepreneur [00:03:00] bottles. So reminding yourself that yeah. Times are gonna get that little bit tough. So just heed the warnings and learn from those around you.
That's so true. And I think the reason that this book matters the entrepreneur roller coaster by Darren Hardy. Is that often when we start something new and encountered difficulty and hardship, we abandon it. Don't we ma it's oh geez, this sucks. I'm outta here. How many moonshots have we covered?
Where we learned that was a big lesson that defined them. Elon Musk is just a, just one big entrepreneurial example, but we've also found a series of sports individuals as well as other authors or philosophers who really remind us that. Yeah. When times get tough, don't step away. Make sure to get in that arena, lean against the.
And ultimately the results will be far greater for you. And I think it reminds me as well, Mike, that you shouldn't [00:04:00] necessarily chase the results, but instead just enjoy the journey. And I think that's an entrance way of thinking about a roller coaster for an entrepreneur, because you're strapping yourself in it's going to get bumpy, but you're going to have fun along the way.
And I think that's a nice way of thinking about being an entrepreneur rather than trying to get out of it and run away instead, just enjoying. Yes have fun. Yeah, I think this next hour, we're going to spend together. You, me and all of our listeners is going to be about preparing ourselves, getting battle ready.
And with our feet firmly on the ground, we can jump straight in to perhaps one of Darren Hardy's biggest ideas and it is going to totally make you rethink the relationship between product and marketing. So let's kick things off with the author of the entrepreneur rollercoaster. Darren has. Talking about.
Sales look you started or wanted to start your business because of your great product idea. I know [00:05:00] how passionate you are about your product. I know that you spent countless hours working on it to make it excellent. The best that there is the unfortunate reality and reality is the quality of your product doesn't mean.
That much to the success of your business. You gasp, let me tell it to you straight. The number one selling product in any category is probably not the best product. Look around you. What's the number one selling restaurant in the world with all these celebrity chefs, cooking shows, cooking competitions, and a whole new Brita foodies like never before yet.
Still the number one restaurant in the world. Is the one with the golden arches on their roof and a crazy headed clown as their spokesperson. How about an automobile or beer? Wine, bottled water insurance, product franchise hair product, or face cream. Yep. In every category, the best selling product is rarely the one with the very best product.
In fact, the majority of those most revolutionary amazing and problem-solve products that have ever been [00:06:00] invented. You've never even heard. Why because they're inventors, the founding entrepreneurs didn't know how to market and sell. Here it comes. Here's the money line. Are you ready? Every time? The number one selling product in every category is owned by the person who is the best marketer period.
Full-stop bottom line, the end, like it or not. The success reality of your business is 10%. The quality of the product. Of course, it's gotta be legit otherwise in a transport. Amazon feedback rated world. The world's going to know that it's crap. So it's gotta be legit, but 90% of your success is going to be based on its sales and marketing.
So let's prevent you from making this colossal mistake. I am here by putting you on notice. You are not. The restaurant business or the flower business or the dry cleaning business or the insurance business or the mobile app business or whatever business you're awesome product is in you're in the sales and marketing business period [00:07:00] one, which just happens to sell the product that you have to offer.
This is such a critical distinction for you to get clear about and quickly if you want. Revolutionary product to succeed. You need to become an expert in sales and marketing. The first step you ask here, it is fall in love with your perspective client. You must learn how to get into the head and heart of your prospective client to feel their desires, their hopes, their fears, and their problems learn how to transmit your love for them in your sales and marketing communication, and connect with them.
Heart to heart only when your sales and marketing are on board, will your clients get on board as well? Then they will be a path to your revolutionary product and fund your big dreams. Learn the essentials to mastering that 90% the sales and marketing skill. Every entrepreneur needs to master in order to succeed in today's brutally competitive marketplace.[00:08:00]
Mike. What a clip to begin entrepreneurship series, a big bucket of icy cold water for all of the entrepreneurs out there. Did you think that was ice war? I think that was like a punch in the face. Yeah. But it reminds me of that, that that fallacy of build it and they will come. And how you see so many Entrepreneurs victims of wishful thinking, right?
Yeah. I think there's a lot, there's another phrase there drinking the Koolaid and I've certainly been guilty of that throughout my career, working on a product or a project that I just believe is the greatest thing that humanity has ever done and what happens. It doesn't matter how good the phone is or the video that you've made is if you can't get it in front of the.
Your consumes. It doesn't matter how much money you spend, how much [00:09:00] millions or billions of dollars you put into it. If nobody knows about it. And I love this breakdown that Darren has 10% product quality, 90% marketing and sales that's a percentage or a ratio that probably some of us have now realize is against maybe what we've thought before.
That's heavily outweighed. So I think this is what this goes to is that when we have a product idea, we fall. So in love with our own idea that we failed to understand that the rest of the world just doesn't care and you've got to make them care. You've got to present your story. You've got to go tell it in the best way possible, but most importantly, tell it through the lens by.
They perceive the world. And I think mark, if we think about where sales really trips up entrepreneurs, it's the, they are so caught in their own box. They are so living[00:10:00] the world of the customer through their own lens and not through the lens of the customer, that they just can't imagine a world where customers would not be excited about this product.
But the truth is nobody's excited about your product until you've worked really hard on your sales and mark. And I think that what if we want to get a little bit uncomfortable here is I think we all hope that if we have a great idea, it will just sell. But the truth is that make a legitimate product as Darren Hardy would say and realize that more than anything.
Regardless of what your product or services you are in the sales and marketing business. That's what you're really in. And if you take one step back, that's kind of life. That's how we make friends. That's how we find a partner. Maybe get married. Those are essentially sales and marketing activities. If you think about it, right?
[00:11:00] Because if you hide at home, no, one's going to know about you. If you hide your product in the warehouse, nobody's going to know about it. Get over ourselves, get over the wishful thinking. Don't just build it and hope that they will come make sure that they know about it. And then they will come. What a powerful, whether you want to call it ice in the face or punch.
I think this is signature down Hardy, and I think this is why it's so good to start a new year with some good, cold, hard facts on entrepreneurship. What do you think we've got plenty more in store from Darren. Don't where he's a very, he's a sharp shooter. He's direct to the point. And I think he's a really good start to this series.
And I think his lessons that I'm already starting to see Mike, and we'll see you throughout the rest of the show as well. He's quite a peaceful. Orientated person, isn't he's looking at the bigger picture. And he's asking us to really think about those that we're talking to, whether they're our clients [00:12:00] or end users, our teammates, our colleagues, our bosses, and so on.
And I think that's a great foundation. As we look ahead through the rest of the entrepreneur series as to how we start to develop and be the best entrepreneur that we can be in the in the business sector. So I'm really excited. That's so true. And I'll tell you who else has a lot of energy mark.
That's our members. And I think it is only appropriate as we start the new year with a new show on entrepreneurship that we should give a big tip of the hat and a big shout out to all of our Patrion members. So mark, let's do this roll call. It's getting bigger and bigger every show. So maybe you get, maybe you're going to have to drink extra coffee, just so you can get through the.
Even cricket, but mark. I dunno whether I can do it in one breath anymore, but let's give it a go. Good morning and welcome to Bob nails. John Terry Bridey and Nial, Sandy modular and Ken [00:13:00] and DMR, Tom Byron, mark and Halena, Yaniv of margin Connor, Rodrigo Yasmeen spaceman. Daniela Lizza and said welcome guys, our Patrion members and moonshots family team.
Thank you so much for joining us every single week. And also for checking out the Patrion show. Yeah, because I'm hidden away in the lock in the in the basement of the moonshot podcast members area, you will find an entirely new podcast series. In fact, you're going to find that we have the moonshots master series and you will be able to access that as a member of moonshots.
So get in there. It's like a dollar a week and you get a full additional podcast from us. One mega 90 minute episode, every single month. It is a complete masterclass on one of [00:14:00] the topics. So it is a different format and we encourage you to jump in, join the conversation, be a member because it's your support that helps us pay all the bills that we.
To provide this show, our hosting, our transcripting, all of the services we need to pull this show together. We actually have to put some cash behind it and it's your support that helps us do it. So we appreciate your support. So head over to moonshot, start IO, become a member, or listen to the moonshots master series and give a little bit of support to the moonshot.
I think it's only appropriate now that we returned to Mr. Darren Hardy and talking about people like all of our members. They're also important when you kick off a new business, when you start something, when you're building something and Darren has some big thoughts. So let's listen now to Darren Hardy, author of the entrepreneur rollercoaster talking about.[00:15:00]
A players added, just become added just because they are true. It takes money to make money. That's a perfect example in growing your business, there are a thousand ways to spend your money, but there are only three that actually matter the most. Marketing and personal growth, meaning learning. Let's focus on people here.
When I interviewed Jack Welch in south beach, Miami, he said this to me during our interview, he said, no matter the innovations and changes in the marketplace, the one thing that hasn't changed is the team who fields the best players. So the game is decided who will win before the game begins in today's dynamic and intensely competitive marketplace.
The main battle is for talent. You cannot pay too much for the best. In fact, a level talent is not only inexpensive. It's free. A players will always produce above the wholesale price that you're paying for them. But BNC play. They are very costly in so many ways. [00:16:00] Let me give you a wake up call 65 to 80% of all your operating costs will be consumed in salaries and wages.
It is crucial that you get team-building right. As Jim Collins will tell you the single most important thing you need to do as a leader is to pick the right people and keep them there is nothing more important than this. Hey, just one bad. Hire can see. And your business. Most people don't know the math.
Let me give it to you here quickly. The cost of hiring a poor performer is not simply what you paid them while they were with you. Oh no, that'd be getting off cheap. It is much higher. When you consider the time and resources you'll spend to replace. The value of lost opportunities and the chemotherapy, your organization will need to undergo and to stop the scam, the cancer that they have usually spread before they, they left the cost of a poor performing team member is reported to be six to 15 times their annualized salary.
So book invest upfront in quality people or [00:17:00] pay through the nose around the. What a great again. Classic Darren hon pity.
We're a health in Kansas show, but according to Daryl, when we might. Yeah, I know exactly the chemotherapy of repairing your teammates after a bad hire is left. But Mike this is so important. And as Darren calls out the lesson that obviously we've learned from Jim Collins, and actually I'll say Patrick Lencioni as well, getting the right people is absolutely essential.
But what I like that Darren does, which is extending on this idea of getting the right people on the bus is actually reminding of. Nope how negative it is when they leave, but the financial implications after they leave, because you've got to go through the whole process of rehiring. Like he says the lost opportunities that happen because that teammate's gone.
And obviously that chemotherapy with, for teammates as well. This is a [00:18:00] new idea for us actually. Yeah. I wanna jump into this one because As he was talking then, and I was listening to Darren Hardy. It was like, oh my gosh, it's so true that if you look at any business, if you look at the cost structure, the employee salary and related overhead insurances is a massive item on the balance sheet.
In fact it's usually with the cost of leasing a premises rent the rent and pay. Most of your costs. And so it's really interesting. What Darren's really challenging us to do is to hire a players. And this is a thing. That I've heard so many times. And I think the job here is to ask ourselves mark, or how do we do that?
I think it's, it sounds interesting. It sounds pretty [00:19:00] compelling. Let's to use a sports analogy, let's hide. Kobe Bryant let's hire Michael Jordan to be on our team. Of course, that makes sense. Many times we see companies don't get that job done. So what do you think how do we hire a players and how do we avoid making mistakes when hiring people?
I think. I'm going to extend it and try and make a albeit a poor sports reference. But it's reminds me of the England soccer team. Whereas we say back home in the England football team, got some amazing players, very good, some of the best in their age brackets and so on. So if you now think about it as a business, you're going to hire the best person that you can possibly find, but just because they're the best person.
For the job doesn't mean they have the fit. With the rest of the team. So what happens with England football, particularly when I [00:20:00] was growing up was you have all these huge names, but they wouldn't be able to work together efficiently enough and productively enough to score the goals and win the game.
Therefore, with business, I think what is the most important thing in my experience when trying to find new individuals to join the team, it's gotta be a good, I don't know whether the word is cultural fit, but there's gotta be a nice. Alignment with interests, with hobbies, with personality, chemistry, maybe chemistry, attitude.
I think these are the key things that maybe even outweigh. The physical performance that an individual might have in the business space in favor of the chemistry and the emotions that are actually at play. What do you think might? Yeah, I think another way of saying what you were talking about is we hire very much on like skills, but not so much on behaviors.
[00:21:00] You look at the, they know how to do X, Y, and Z, but. Do they communicate well? Do they hand off their work? Do they brief others? Do they delegate others? All the sort of more behavioral social things that make up to such a big part of how we get along together, how we feel about each other, how we build cohesion in a team.
And can we trust each other? Can we have tough conversations at no point there? Did I mention, can they. Do fancy macros in a spreadsheet for you, apple? No, it was all very human things. I think business is very human, just like a sports team. It's all about personalities getting that right. Chemistry. And we saw that in the last dance.
We've got a bit of a basketball theme emerging on this show we saw with the famous Chicago bulls team led by Michael Jordan, that there was [00:22:00] so much. Cohesion and getting the team to work together, the different personalities, having a common cause having the ability to get the job done.
I would say a big lesson here is hire people, not only for their skills, but their behaviors and another really good thing that Airbnb does is once the skills evaluation has taken place on a new hire, they have somebody who doesn't even work in the team. That the prospect employee is going to go into.
They have someone from a different team, interviewed them purely on cultural fit criteria. Oh, I like that. So a different team entirely. That's nice. Yes. So let's get, let's do an example. So let's say the person is going to be working in technology and engineering, or then what they do is they get someone from finance to sit down and chat with.[00:23:00]
And it's just a cultural fit conversation. That's lovely. Isn't it? Because it's so hard to get consistent individuals across all of the different business sectors. So it's almost like a little test, isn't it. To see whether they do fit regardless of what bracket they're in the busy. It's quite nice because the person from finance to go back to the example, they don't really have a horse in the race.
They're in a different team. Maybe they might not even work with this person or very infrequently. And so they're like, I'll just take the person on their terms. And my job here is to see, do they have a cultural fit? Do they behave? Do they have a cultural alignment with us? Can we get along?
Can we get the job done? Can we learn together, grow together, even if they wouldn't actually be working very closely on a day-to-day basis. So that's another way that. Apart from looking at behavioral, you can actually [00:24:00] have people from other teams come in and evaluate the person, give you a perspective and maybe do it beyond the skills.
And that's a great way. I've seen work a lot of times to help you avoid just hiring someone who. The classic thing that we have, we're like when you look at the CV, they should be great, but then you go back and I don't, what are we missing here? Because they had all the right. They said the right things on the CV.
Yeah. They said the right things, they've done the right things, but something just doesn't fit. And I think it depends, obviously it's going to be different from every business and you've got different types of business owners, different types of colleagues and so on. But how important is that little.
Business unit interview going to be when you've got an individual coming from outside. And I love that idea particularly for a brand like Airbnb, which has so many people to keep the same vision or integrated across the entire [00:25:00] business must be really challenging. So it's almost a little test to make sure that the finance team are singing the same hymn sheet as the marketing team or.
It team or whatever it might be. It's a nice little practice that actually I like that. Yeah. Yeah. Really good. So they have it. So we've got two critical ideas. Sales is key is way more important than you realize higher. The A-players you can never. Never overinvest in great people. You could just, you want to surround yourself with great people.
What a great start to our entrepreneurs show and to our entrepreneur series. And it's. A little bit of rollercoaster. We had definitely some bumpy stuff with Darren, highly giving us the real facts around the role of sales and marketing and how important it is. But now it's time to turn ourselves towards topics of leadership and productivity and [00:26:00] market the goods.
The good stuff keeps coming from Darren Hardy. Yeah, it really does. Mike. And I think the next section that we're going to be digging into, like you say, is all about leadership productivity, which are two big columns within his book, the entrepreneur rollercoaster and the. Part of this section, like in leadership is really about how you can think about being smart in your job, but also learning from others.
So this is a great case for anybody who's going into a job, similar to what we were just saying about hiring the right people, thinking that everything that there is to learn in the business, you are the best person in the room. Smartest person. So let's hear from Darren reevaluate, this idea that we might have and tell us that actually there's a real value in delegating work.
Mistake. Number eight of the eight tragic mistakes most entrepreneurs make is being smart and thus not seeking the help [00:27:00] that you need. Michael Jordan didn't win a single NBA championship. Seven seasons. Until Phil Jackson was the head coach. Then he won three in a row. Kobe Bryant spent four years trying to win a championship to no avail.
Then Phil Jackson became the head coach and Coby won three in a row. Phil Jackson amassed an unprecedented 11 NBA championships. The difference wasn't the. It was the coach. Here's a prime example. Tennis star. Andy Murray had appeared in three grand slam finals without winning a single set. Then he hired Yvonne Lindell to be his coach.
Shortly after Murray took Olympic gold. Then he won the U S. And then Wimbleton in succession. As coach Ivan said, I took a good player and I helped them become great. I bet you're already good. You probably wouldn't be watching this and trying to start or grow a business if you weren't already good, but [00:28:00] don't let this be your mistake, thinking that you are good enough on your own in order to become truly great.
You need help. Every superstar does invest in your learning and growth. If there's one common trait among every super Cheever that I've met, studied or presented on the cover of success magazine or on one of my success television shows, it is that each of them is an avid. They're constantly looking for the edge, seeking the insight, the advisers, the coaches, and the consultants that will allow them to iterate, to improve and to break through their current success ceiling.
As my mentor, Jim Rohn taught me, you cannot achieve beyond your current level of personal development. You don't achieve goals. You grow into. So seek the books, the videos, the audio programs, and the seminars that will help you grow beyond your current level of success, and then use them for goodness sakes.
You want to be an idea and success [00:29:00] importer. There are great ideas surrounding you every day. You don't have to earn. Any of them, you just need to grab them and apply them to your situations. Even the late great Steve jobs was criticized for not really inventing anything new jobs didn't invent the mouse or the graphic user interface.
The iPod was certainly not the first MP3 player, the iPhone, not the first smartphone and the iPad, not the first tablet device. What Steve did was take existing. And make them better. He reinvented the way that they were put together and how they were inserted into popular culture. As a result, he's considered one of the most genius and creative people who's ever lived and founded the first United States publicly traded trillion dollar company, bringing in experts everywhere is what you want to do for every problem that you have.
Someone has dedicated his whole. Time and passion to becoming an expert in that area. The longer you spend trying to originate a [00:30:00] solution to a problem, the less time you have to solve other problems and grow your business. My dad taught me this. He said, you can never pay too much to rent somebody's brain and gain their expertise while there are no shortcuts in life.
There are for success in business. The store cuts. Charted out by those who've already been where you're going and have returned to give you the map of the safest and most expeditious route. This guidance will save you time, energy, money, pain, and anguish, the ones who have gone before you can warn you where there is treacherous terrain ahead and where there are great danger so that you can avoid them entirely their expert and experienced direction.
Just might say the life of your. Oh, my gosh, there was so much in that one. Clip, mark. I could break this down. I could talk about number one, renting other people's brain. Don't try and be the smartest in the room. Always be learning, take existing [00:31:00] things, make them better. We, maybe we should have just done the whole show on that clip.
That was hugely. Yeah. I really enjoy that clip. I think there's so much to get out of it. And I think it's a big, I, again, it's not a punch in the face necessarily, but it is a good slap at least, because I think a lot of us, whether it's in the hiring process or whether it's in a meeting room, whether it's physical or zoom, it doesn't really matter.
We're often trying to sit there and Put across our big ideas, prove that we're original thinkers proved that we're innovators and try and portray yourself as the smartest guy in the room. And I think what Darren is, again, reminding us here is you don't need to do that. Stop trying to show yourself as this big individual, because when you look at history, some of the greatest innovators and entrepreneurs out there, they didn't do it.
So you don't have to either. And I think that is a bit of a wake [00:32:00] up call. Yeah. It's so tempting. I think when you start something as a founder, so tempting to feel that you have to be the Sage, the guru, and in doing so I think the real trap is that you're not open to other ideas. You think that you demand you, the lady who's got everything and gonna deliver everything and know everything, which is impossible.
And I think that's the big trap. Yeah, it's the big trap here. And as Darren calls out of the beginning of that clip and in his book, the entrepreneur's roller coaster, you're not necessarily good enough on your own, no matter how good you nobody's going to be stronger. Yeah, exactly. You're going to be stronger with others.
A team with people who can say to you, Hey, you know what, mark? I don't know whether that is that good. It's a dose of realism. Somebody who can give you [00:33:00] feedback, somebody who can help you learn and even being a mentor to you, there's still so much that we can all learn. No matter how old we are, there's always going to be something else that we can learn.
So being surrounded by individuals who are 18. As we just heard from the first there, from the second clip from Darren, but also surrounding yourself with interesting people that you can learn from whether it's in business or whether it's just in social situations. You surround yourself with interesting people.
You can then absorb and learn and be that avid individual who can pick ups. Every point in life. And so you become that little bit richer and more experience. I would say that he Darren Hardy gave us this great little factoid, which is somebody has already solved the problem. You're trying to say.
Why would you not just go and find that person say, Hey, could you give me the cliff notes, the executive summary [00:34:00] around, am I getting this done? Or maybe coming, just give me a hand because otherwise I'm going to spend days, weeks, maybe years trying to fix this thing, but you've already. I mean was really nice when it speaks to what we try and do in the moonshot show.
Doesn't it where we're learning out loud from these entrepreneurs, these authors, these individuals who have done these amazing things in life. And we're trying to learn from them where we're trying to say, okay Michael Jordan did this. What can we learn from him? And I think that's actually, I think what I'm trying to say, Mike is I think Darren Hardy, if he's listening to the moonshot show, I think he probably enjoyed it.
I think he would. I think he would love it. I think he would. I think he would love us learning out loud together. This is signature. What he's talking about, mentoring, keep on learning. It's almost like he stole our idea. Ah, there we go. There we go. [00:35:00] This constant learning thing is why we created the moonshots master series.
And we've mentioned it earlier on the show. And if your if your really. To do some mentoring and learning just like Darren Hardy talked about. Then we have created a second podcast where you can get not just a deep dive, like this show where we go into one author, Darren Hardy in this case. But what we do is we create an entire master class based on a really important thing.
Things related to your improving yourself, how you think, how you lead and entrepreneurship. Those are the four big areas that we cover. And if you go there right now, we've got a whole master class on communication, first principles thinking, and we know not everybody wants to use patriarch. So we've actually put the master series in the apple podcast app and in Spotify.
So you can actually subscribe to. The master [00:36:00] series through whichever platform you want, whether it's Patrion, Spotify or apple podcasts. So all you need to do is go into however you love to hear this. Let's say it's in the apple podcast app, just type in moonshots master series. And you will find that you can subscribe and become a member through apple podcasts and you can do exactly the same thing in Spotify and mark.
We've got a lot of goodies on that master series. We do. And as you've just said, Mike, they're really comprehensive deep dives into a series of topics that we actually encounter on the moonshot on the weekly moonshot show. But given the opportunity to do these comprehensive, deep dive, we can spend a good 90 minutes delving into each of the topics through a plethora of interesting innovators, entrepreneurs, and authors.
So already Mike, and all of our listeners, you can head on over to. My moonshots master series on whichever platform you prefer, and you [00:37:00] can check out our episode on the motivation first principles thinking collaboration and teamwork. I think Darren Hardy would appreciate that one habits circle of influence Mike, as well as the art of communication.
Got such a plethora of interesting comprehensive, deep dives. That for me even though you and I were doing it together, Mike, I do feel like I learned so much from just taking part in the creation of the product. So I'm hoping listeners, if you pop along and take a listen that you get a lot out of it as we do as well.
Absolutely. Absolutely. And now we're going to turn our minds towards Darren Hardy. Again, we're going to learn about this entrepreneurship rollercoaster and he's got some strong, no surprise there, some strong and clear thoughts on how we should think about the tracking of results and how we can embrace failure.
When I first started out, I was afraid of failing. I did all that I could to avoid. [00:38:00] And that is what kept me from success. I didn't understand the law of duality. The entire universe is built on duality just as you cannot have day without night, you cannot have up without down. You cannot have good without evil.
You cannot have success without failure is not possible. The process of success is failure until well. It's a success. But up until that point, it's a sequence of progressive failures. That is why former president of IBM, Thomas Watson advised the key to success. Is massive failure. If you are only moderately succeeding, it is because you aren't doing much and you aren't growing.
My father taught me this on the ski slopes when I was eight years old, I had skied on my own all day, that day. And at the end of the day, I ran up to my dad, excited to report dad. Yeah. I ski by myself all day and I didn't fall down. Once he looked at me flatly and said then you didn't get any better sensing my disappointment.
He explained. [00:39:00] If you're going to get better, you have to push yourself. And if you push yourself, you're going to fall. If you're not falling, you're not pushing. Falling is part of getting better. The only way to accelerate your success is to speed up your rate of failure. The only way to elevate the magnitude of your success is to raise the stakes of your failure.
Stop trying to avoid it. Your avoiding success in the process. Pursue failure with passion and joy. And when you do fall or fail, celebrate it, you've grown. You've given to duality pendulum, a shove that will have it's swinging back on the side of your favor soon. Here's what I know for sure. The only thing holding you back from realizing your potential and accomplishing any goal, your mind can continue.
Is fear. If you can learn to turn fear into fun, something that you pursue rather than a void, the top of your potential will [00:40:00] pop open and out will pour your greatness. I can help you do that. I know that you're thinking there's no way you could have me want to fail that I will want to pursue it and that I will enjoy it.
Oh. But I can. And when you do no one and no one can stop you. You will forever be unstoppable. Hear me again, the only thing holding you back, suppressing your potential, keeping you from living the life that you were designed and meant to live. Are your fears. Turning fear to fund Mike. That's another big Ida from Mr.
Hardy, isn't it? Yeah. And is I listened to this? And I think when I about myself, I think if anything has kept me back in my life and put tear Keely When I was young when I was growing up as a kid, my fear [00:41:00] of failure was so strong. I thought everyone was an overnight success. I didn't realize you had to work hard and you had to actually fail to become successful.
I was. I would rather have given up and walked away rather than failed in front of people. And this aha is so big that you can transition from fear to fund that you can see mistakes as opportunities to learn and to grow and that you are that much closer. To winning and to succeeding if you're actually failing, because now at least that's not the way to do it.
And maybe that inspires you and shows you the way to do it. Yeah, I think in that previous clip we heard from the idea of learning from others. And I think that's really valuable. And I think from Darren in this clip about learning from the mistakes that you make as well this is [00:42:00] the secret sauce, isn't it, Mike, to being a really successful or at least dynamic entrepreneur because you're taking failed experiments or challenges in the past.
And helping pave the way for opportunities in the long run. I'm certainly like you, Mike, there was certainly times in my career where the fear of my ego and my ego blocking me being able to maybe extend myself a little bit further, maybe taking the reins on a project or two it's certainly.
Blocked me growing. And I'm reminded of Ron holiday's work, particularly ego is the enemy that we've covered in the previous, in the past. What a book, how good was that? When, once you realize that actually your ego is a real blocker in your ability to learn and be the best version of yourself. Only then I think, can you understand what Darren's really saying in that clip [00:43:00] where you need to turn your feelings, that deep down feeling of fear?
Oh, no, I don't want to do this because it'll expose something I'm not comfortable to. If you can turn that idea, that mindset into something that's a little bit more opportunistic, more positive, something that I think every entrepreneur is going to experience that idea of failure and turn it into actually, yeah, that was fun.
Maybe the project I did, or maybe the company I'd started didn't necessarily work out well. I learned heaps during the process. I'm now that much more informed and educated. I think that's a big lesson that Down's really calling out. Isn't it? It's huge. It reminds me of a quote that Thomas Edison gave creator of the light bulb, just a bit of an innovation guru.
He had this quote just talking about all the mistakes [00:44:00] and missteps that he'd made in his career. And he said, I have not failed 10,000 times. I've successfully found 10,000 ways that will not work. And he tried, he could he, it was so hard to create the light bulb. There was all these chemistry issues with the burning of the wire and he had to try it literally 10,000 times.
But he got there. And I think that this is a real nod to what Darren Hardy's saying. Just be like, great. Okay. I'm learning. That's one way I know tick that won't be that way to get that job done. I'll try another way. But often it's when you ask yourself what could I do differently? This is really the great moment with failure because.
And you might be able to isolate what actually failed. Half of what you did actually worked, but it was the other half that was blocking. [00:45:00] And if you reconfigure your approach to that, maybe that's the unlock. Maybe it's not some radical a change, but it's just a slight pivot. It's a slight adjustment to get it right.
So just keep tracking your results. Embrace the failure. What a huge theme on moonshots, huh? Embracing discomfort and failure. Thinking about what had happened. Imagine who she would have been if, when she got fired from television, when they said she wasn't right for TV where she would be now, she didn't stick with it and embrace their failure.
Where would Walt Disney be when he was told he didn't have a match urination imagine, imagine those things. This is super important because I think this makes us run for the Hills. This idea of failure, actually, it's something we should be just embracing.
It's interesting. What Darren also calls out in that clip, Mike, which is, if you aren't pushing yourself to failure, maybe you're not giving yourself the [00:46:00] opportunity to grow. So there's kind of two prongs to it. Isn't it. There's one which is embrace. Embrace, maybe the mistakes or the rejections that you might get, but also it's push yourself in that direction when you're starting up your business.
When you're talking to clients or thinking about a product or your end users, push yourself in those areas that are pretty discomfort uncomfortable, because then you can. I run into them. So I think that there's the failures or the mistakes that you run into kind of accidentally, which you can almost force yourself into as well as the mistakes.
Are there failures that other people put onto you both are really positive and both you should embrace. There's one that I think you can manufacture, which is the pushing yourself to learn or push yourself into uncomfortable situations to continue. I totally agree. And I think Jeff Bezos [00:47:00] talks about, if you're not failing, then you're not pushing the boundaries enough.
So I really like this idea of it's actually a really good sign. I'll tell you another technique that I think is really interesting mark, is that you can at least say. Don't be scared of failure because what is far worse is getting to the end of the life and regretting that you didn't try. Yes. Yeah.
So I think that was really important for me, which when I was very failure averse at a certain point, you're like, I've got to give it a go. I've got to try. Otherwise. I'm just going to watch. Sal right past me. So I think that's an effective way of if you're sensing some trepidation, maybe feeling a little hesitant to say listen, in five years time, do I want to look back and say I didn't actually give it a [00:48:00] go.
I didn't embrace the risk of failure. I just chose not to play at all. And then at one point in time it will be too late. So that can be a very powerful motivator. Yeah, very big motivator one one way that I try and hold myself accountable, Mike, to do that is we've talked about on the show before journaling setting goals and reminding myself if this is where I want to, if this is where I think I want to be, how might I drive myself towards that area?
And I think without being able to. Reflect on what it is that you're trying to learn perhaps, or what it is that you see yourself failing in. That's the way that you can then. Expand on that growth or chase out those opportunities to try and grow, because you're being honest with yourself, and I think you're right in order to never have the [00:49:00] fear of missing out the fear of not giving it a go. I think you also need to be aware of the things of when you're doing that does that make sense? You need to be aware of. The unconscious decisions that you perhaps you're in avoiding that failure.
And listen, you mentioned journaling. That's where you can write your learnings and your reflections. And that's how you can turn the failure into succeeding because you're like, here's what I learned yesterday. Here's what I'm going to do today. What a great way to start the day. And mark, I tell you what talking about starting the day, Darren Hardy, and even has thoughts on starting the day and having positive habits.
So why don't you set up our last and final click for. That's right. We've got one final clip from the heavy hitter, Mr. Darren Hardy and the entrepreneur rollercoaster, which to be honest, Mike, I've enjoyed every step of the way so far. [00:50:00] The journey has been fun, but like you say, there's time for just one more clip from Darren Hardy.
And this one's another big one. So let's hear from. Really tell us about the mistakes perhaps of being that big thinker that he referenced in a clip earlier on, but also the encouragement to actually start small and get better every single day. Being a big thinker and trying to quote dent the universe.
You're saying now, Darren, I've always been told the opposite that I need to think big. Yeah. That's the mistake most make, because it stops you before you even start look. No. Revolutionary leader started out imagining their likeness in a bronze bust. They didn't start up attempting to dent the universe as an actual universe.
Denter sir, Richard Branson said, he said when my friends and I started the first burgeon business 40 years ago, we had no master plan, especially not one for a group of companies that [00:51:00] by 2011 would number more than 400 businesses around the world and employ 50,000 people had, we tried to plan for such a.
We certainly would have messed it up. This is the mistake, because if you start out with illusions of grandeur, you'll likely, never start. Or as sir Richard said, you'll probably mess it up. Why? Because you will overestimate your projected sales. You will overbuild and you will over spend on the perfect scalable systems.
And while you are dreaming of your contribution to human progress, you will miss payroll. Then it's game over. Learn to start small start, right where you are ship, what you've got as my friend, Seth Godin would say, sell something today and then improve again, most, every legendary business leader who built many of the brands that you love today.
And most. How they achieve such legendary status almost every time their answer was, [00:52:00] we just worked at getting better every day by focusing on getting better every day, versus some imagined lofty goal. They surpassed any goal they could have even imagined when they started. Now. I'm not telling you never to set goals.
Learning how to stick to and achieve big goals was one of the skills that I learned that I attribute my success to. In fact, if you don't give yourself some direction, you will wander aimlessly into bankruptcy, but on a day to day practical basis, thinking too. Paralyzes you and keeps you from doing anything at all.
You'll figure if your product or service isn't revolutionary yet that you're not changing the world. You have a convenient excuse to wait to delay and to continue to aim, rather than work, work at just getting better. You've heard this before the journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step.
So think small. Think about today's step then with [00:53:00] each step that you take work on. Work on getting better and do time you'll look up and realize you're much further than you could have even seen over the horizon. When you started back yonder, Hey, you might even travel so far in your constant, never ending day to day growth and improvement that the world feels your step.
And as slightly dented by it, it could have. Oh, my gosh. I think that might be his most moon shot thinking. Mark, what do you think that compounding the daily habits bias towards action is very moonshots. Isn't it? Yeah. And exactly. It's the compound of facts. It's the habit. I think it's the reminder to not be overwhelmed by the idea that it's going to be this big thing.
So very consistent with all of the other clips we've heard from Darren Hardy today. You don't need to be overwhelmed. You don't need to fear the failure. You don't need to be [00:54:00] the smartest person in the room. With the most experience you need to lean on others, you can learn from others. You can just learn from opportunities that arise from those challenges that you run into, but gradually just start doing it day by day, whether that's starting a business in your free time.
Whether it's just learning a new skill. Mike, maybe it's learning to be a better project manager or whatever it is that you do day to day. All these little things have a knock on effect. And as we know from James clear, the habits series, if you can work on getting maybe just 1%. Better every day that government interest is enormous.
Isn't it? It's huge. It's really is huge. So of all the ideas we've covered today, mark from Darren Hardy and his book, the entrepreneur roller coaster, is there one that was a little spicy one that was quite memorable, perhaps more than the. [00:55:00] Oh, that's a great question, Mike. I think the classic one for me actually is sales is key.
The one that we have right at the very beginning, the idea that it's actually really about the, it's not necessarily about the quality of the product that only 10% it's the marketing and sales that makes up 90% of the success. I would have to agree. I really liked that one. I also liked the one don't try and be the smartest guy in the room.
Somebody has already solved your problem. Just go find love and get them to help you out of it. I like that. I really do well, mark, thank you to you and thank you to you. Our listeners, it has been great to have. You with us on this journey on show 162 into the world of the entrepreneurial rollercoaster, a book by Darren Hardy and in this journey, he started by really hitting us in the face and saying, regardless of what business you think you in.[00:56:00]
You're really in sales and marketing because 90% of your success will come from that. And the next step is to make sure as you build that team, hire some A-players no more B players. And when we reflect upon ourselves, he gave us great advice and said, don't try and be the smartest guy in the room.
Somebody has already solved the problem you're working. Go find them get their help and their support. And as you go on that journey, you need to speed up your rate of failure to grow. So if you're avoiding failure, you're actually avoiding success, embrace failure, and you'll be that much closer to realizing your dreams.
And as you go about this incredible roller coaster, don't get paralyzed with the size of your ambition. Have a bias towards action. Take a step forward and watch the compound interest. And a free single guy. And that is really your path to being the best version of yourself, which is what we do here on the moonshots podcasts.
We learn out loud [00:57:00] together so we can all get better. All right. That's it for the moonshots podcast, that's a wrap.