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C3 Leadership Podcast with Ed Young — Where creativity, church, and culture collide. Join Ed Young and guests for ideas and stories that will help you lead stronger and think sharper.
00;00;01;23 - 00;00;04;10
Unknown
what is the hardest thing about being a pastor?
00;00;04;10 - 00;00;05;27
Unknown
I think for me personally,
00;00;05;27 - 00;00;07;24
Unknown
insecurity and feeling worthy
00;00;07;24 - 00;00;11;27
Unknown
oh my goodness, we're Allison. I'm insecure. Heck yes.
00;00;11;29 - 00;00;21;16
Unknown
this is cathartic. You know, it's part of iron sharpening iron. It's part of being vulnerable and empathetic with one another.
00;00;21;22 - 00;00;29;23
Unknown
you know, I kept asking God, yeah. Am not a hypocrite because I'm. Yeah. Thinking that I'm really struggling to have my own.
00;00;29;27 - 00;00;34;00
Unknown
it'll never go away in this life. The hurt and the pain. It's not.
00;00;34;00 - 00;00;37;14
Unknown
but God has shown us there's a parallel track,
00;00;37;14 - 00;00;40;21
Unknown
of joy, of the peace that surpasses all understanding
00;00;40;26 - 00;00;41;21
Unknown
he goes, well,
00;00;41;21 - 00;00;44;03
Unknown
we're going to kiss this fire, walk away Whistling
00;00;44;03 - 00;00;45;18
Unknown
whoa,
00;00;45;22 - 00;00;49;06
Unknown
let's get ready to rumble.
00;00;51;17 - 00;01;07;29
Unknown
welcome to the C3 Leadership Podcast. I've got one of the great leaders and pastors around. I'm talking about this guy is intergalactic by the glory of God, Shawn Johnson. Shawn, how are you doing, brother? Good.
00;01;07;29 - 00;01;23;06
Unknown
You had the best boys. No. Red rocks church. I mean, man, you've been going now. You were telling me for 20 years. Yes, sir. Just celebrated. You're too young for that. I don't feel that way.
00;01;23;06 - 00;01;27;27
Unknown
And, you know, a lot of people I'm sure know there's some. Don't. You were an actor.
00;01;27;27 - 00;01;31;02
Unknown
Well, trying try and be an aspiring actor, right?
00;01;31;05 - 00;01;37;00
Unknown
Yeah, I, I have, when I graduated from college with the kids. You. Yes.
00;01;37;00 - 00;01;53;03
Unknown
I realized I had no aspirations of actually getting a job. And a semester at school. A guy at our fraternity. I was not a believer at that time in life. A guy in our fraternity said, take this acting class of DCA of this hot girls.
00;01;53;05 - 00;02;11;17
Unknown
So you were. Yeah. And they kind of had fun. And so, yeah, I literally after I graduated, I drove out to Hollywood and, ended up looking up there for a few years. And you're calling to ministry? I've been talking about that recently. We've been talking about the book of Romans, the apostle Paul, how he's called in and he flips and he says, we're called.
00;02;11;19 - 00;02;29;21
Unknown
Tell me, tell me about your call, because I know a lot of people are checking this out. They're going, man, I'm a young guy and I like the ministry. I always say this, Sean, if you if you look at the ministry like some option at a job fair, you don't want to do it. You have to be you.
00;02;29;24 - 00;02;32;05
Unknown
You have to be called. I mean, tell us
00;02;32;05 - 00;02;33;06
Unknown
How did that happen?
00;02;33;06 - 00;02;47;12
Unknown
so I was living out in L.A., and, I had gotten into, drugs as I was, and, got real suicidal one day, and, actually sat down to take my own life.
00;02;47;12 - 00;02;58;06
Unknown
Pastor. And, and my mom had taken me to church a couple times in a school. The kids had told me about heaven and hell. So I'm sitting there going, wait a second,
00;02;58;06 - 00;03;08;24
Unknown
if I do this, if heaven and hell is real, I'm going to be in one of them really quick and I don't know the rules. So I called the only Christian person I knew, and he brought me to a church in Illinois.
00;03;08;27 - 00;03;33;14
Unknown
And so, I went there, got saved that day. I mean, I raised my hand in church with drugs in my pocket and, ended up moving there for just. I thought it would be a few months. Yeah. Like get around church. Because everyone in my life was kind of in this part of drug culture. I started going to a small group and every now and then I think it was.
00;03;33;14 - 00;03;50;17
Unknown
But, you know, they deal like us. Churches mean. We'd love to share testimonies. Yes. And it had a crazy testimony. And so every now and then they would ask me to talk about it in small groups. And so I would do that. And I went to the youth and young adult pastor, who was also the pastor's wife at the time, about 3 or 4 months after being there.
00;03;50;17 - 00;04;04;09
Unknown
And I said, I don't know what this means, but my favorite day of the week is when I go to small group and I get to talk to people about God and I don't know much, is a brand new to this whole Bible thing.
00;04;04;09 - 00;04;13;22
Unknown
And she opened up her journal to the day she met me three or 4 or 5 months ago, and it said, Sean will come talk to me about being in ministry.
00;04;13;23 - 00;04;15;12
Unknown
He has the call of God on his life
00;04;15;12 - 00;04;37;01
Unknown
and unbelievable. And so at this point, I'm like 25. I have a college degree, I've lived on my own for two years in L.A. and, I became an intern at the church and, interned for two years and ended up working with youth and young adults, and then two years later moved to Denver with some friends to start Red rocks.
00;04;37;01 - 00;05;07;18
Unknown
What a story. Yeah. When you started Red rocks. Okay. You and some friends, did you, like, follow? Like a church planting program or some or some system or whatever, or did you just go? We're going to we're going to do this. We're going to build smart enough to follow any program. But but I will say this pastor Ed, and I think I told you this many years ago when we first met, but when I was at that church, brand new believer.
00;05;07;20 - 00;05;08;25
Unknown
Had no life.
00;05;08;25 - 00;05;29;09
Unknown
idea what I was doing. They said you can go to a church, you go to one conference this year and I went to see three really by myself. Yeah. And literally I wrote in a notebook that night, I think I'm supposed to start a church. I went back to the hotel right down the street from your grapevine campus called my wife, probably.
00;05;29;12 - 00;05;53;16
Unknown
I said I think we're going to start a church. And so it was. It was really things, man. Thanks. I remember you telling me that now. But thanks for sharing that again. That man. That means that means the world to to our team. Because, you know, when you you know this, Sean, you do conferences and preach or whatever and and it's so and people say, oh Sean, I'm sure you hear this all the time and, and and I know you hear this all the time.
00;05;53;16 - 00;06;03;01
Unknown
I go, no, I don't tell me, you know, so so that's what's, that's what's great about what you're telling me. It energizes me and our team because
00;06;03;01 - 00;06;09;16
Unknown
I had no idea we would do this conference for so long. I mean, I ran out of stuff to talk about as far as leadership ten years ago.
00;06;09;16 - 00;06;12;25
Unknown
Well, but anyway, God.
00;06;12;25 - 00;06;34;29
Unknown
God is good. God is good. And it was that conference. Yes. God said, you get started. I love it because again, being in the ministry is not something that we go, oh, I want to do, you know, I want to do that. Like I want to sell real estate or I want to be an actor. I mean, it's, it's on a, it's on another level, a whole nother level because it's awesome.
00;06;35;02 - 00;07;00;22
Unknown
Don't get me wrong, I love it. But I'm telling you, just to be frank, there are some major times of discouragement and depression that I think all of us walk through in various degrees. Yeah. You know, when I told my friends and family that I was going to become a pastor, they they were like, you kind of what?
00;07;00;24 - 00;07;27;05
Unknown
Gosh, yes. What was wrong? I know your church, the church, Red rocks has grown, and it's, so, so dynamic. But you have also faced some hard times. I know you have a new book coming out called Kiss the Fire. What a compelling title. Tell me about your journey and tell me a little bit about this book, because we all need to get this book, I guarantee it.
00;07;28;06 - 00;07;49;22
Unknown
I try to be super fast. So about three years ago, I thought I had a pinched nerve in my neck. Went to a doctor. They suggested doing some scans. It was like neck and head scans. I had no idea they were actually thinking brain scans. And so me and my wife went back. We're seeing a doctor's appointment.
00;07;49;22 - 00;08;12;13
Unknown
I'm thinking he's going to tell me I have a pinched nerve. And he says, I'm sorry you don't have attention or you have a brain disease. And I think that's what I think it is. The average lifespan is about seven years, and, you know. Wow. Going in my life. Yes. Yeah. You just don't think that's going to be your story.
00;08;12;14 - 00;08;36;05
Unknown
No. And so my truck and just cried and I cried. She never cries. I'm I cried, I'm reading scriptures, and, she's so cool, man. She just looked. I was like, babe, I'm so scared. She looked at me and she was like, well, I'm not. And we're praying for a miracle. I went into a deep spiral. You know, you and I.
00;08;36;08 - 00;08;54;25
Unknown
Yes, yes. A history of dealing with anxiety and depression. Anyways. And that thing. Man, I just went into this. This is actually funny. We were in the middle of the 21 day fast at our church. I stopped on the way home. I got a box of Krispy.
00;08;54;27 - 00;08;58;13
Unknown
That's hilarious. I was like, this fast is over.
00;08;58;13 - 00;09;18;03
Unknown
So. So you had Krispy Kreme and then you're like, okay, I did. I went into a pretty just, you know, for me, I think we all sort of deal with bad news and yes, definitely, I, I on autopilot when I just show up, I just, I yeah, yeah, I would talk to anybody.
00;09;18;05 - 00;09;42;27
Unknown
And I had honestly started to feel like I think I'm giving up on everything. Like, I was super mad at God. It didn't make sense. I didn't understand it. I didn't want to talk to anybody. I didn't want to go to church. And that's tough when you're a pastor. Yes. I was just a mess. And a friend of mine who is, a UFC coach.
00;09;43;00 - 00;10;04;03
Unknown
And the only reason I took the call is because he's one of the few people I'm really scared of. And he, he's he's he's amazing. One of the 20 greatest UFC coaches of all time. He's got belts for miles on his ceiling. All these world championships and the stuff he called me and I told him the diagnosis and, you know, of course I'm crying, falling apart.
00;10;04;05 - 00;10;27;20
Unknown
And he just said he goes, well, he's all right because we're going to kiss this fire, walk away Whistling whoa, that coach, that sounds really cool, man. But I've never heard that kiss this fire and walk away whistling. Yeah. And he said, I'll tell you what he said. I'm not saying these things that don't burn from time to time.
00;10;27;20 - 00;10;41;22
Unknown
I'm not saying it's not going to be hot. I'm saying we're up to what we're up to. Walk away from this. We're going to run through. This is not going to change your call. It's not going to take your joy, is that let's do your purpose. You're going to be stronger. On the other side. And they said it.
00;10;41;22 - 00;11;01;18
Unknown
I'll be with you every step of the way. And he said it again. We're going to kiss this fire. We'll walk away whistling. And I had no intention of writing about this. That just became a mantra for me almost on a daily basis. When all the mind games go, you don't know what's going to happen next. Your mind to your body, to your future.
00;11;01;20 - 00;11;13;00
Unknown
And so it became this thing in my heart where every day I would remind myself, this doesn't change who I am or what I'm called to be or the dad I'm called to be or the husband I'm called to be.
00;11;13;00 - 00;11;20;23
Unknown
I'm not going to give up today. Today I will kiss this fire. And so that just kind of became the thing that that I would remind myself of daily.
00;11;20;25 - 00;11;36;21
Unknown
And so that that that's where the title came from. I love it. And you're just sharing with me. I was talking to you yesterday a little bit about how important boxing is. As it relates to the disease that you're fighting.
00;11;36;21 - 00;11;50;29
Unknown
Yes. So, the brain disease in the Parkinson's family, and they don't know that it's what they thought it was, that it has the seven year life expectancy that he did tell me, you know, some some things you don't want to hear.
00;11;51;00 - 00;12;09;11
Unknown
I mean, he said, you know, I said, well, where is this headed? You know, he said, well, it's barring a miracle from God, it's headed to at some point your wife feeds and dresses you, you know, so it's obviously like, tough to take. You know, me, I'm kind of a fixer. I'm not a good listener. Pastor. The fixer.
00;12;09;13 - 00;12;29;09
Unknown
Me and my wife is still working on that counseling and so you know I'm like what do I need to do. Oh 5%. Well the problem is, is they can't like I give them credit multiple times a year. They don't even know how a person gets this. And even though it's genetic and to their knowledge there's nothing that cures.
00;12;29;15 - 00;13;01;12
Unknown
I take medicine four times a day right now, but it's just to hide symptoms. But they do think there's this, there's that. They think that to potentially slow it down, if you if you exhaust your body physically and at the exact same time, your mind has to think really hard. So it's not just like sprinting in a straight line where you're not thinking, yeah, but if you exhaust yourself physically and your mind's working extremely hard, they believe it can help push back against the parts of your brain that wanted to degenerate.
00;13;01;14 - 00;13;20;06
Unknown
Yes. Say, oh, you don't get it. You don't get to slow down today. You got too much going on. And so boxing is a really good, workout because it is super exhausting, but you're always having to think about the combinations and the defense and the footwork. So here you fight. Are you fighting people or just a bag?
00;13;20;09 - 00;13;41;14
Unknown
I'm fighting the coach. Whoa. Told me that day, said. And he lets me he lets me train with him in the Octagon. So I pretend, gosh, it's time. I have begged him to let me smite some of this new fighters and he won't do it. I'm not supposed to get him the. Yeah, you don't want to do that.
00;13;41;14 - 00;14;05;19
Unknown
No. We'll say I'm still upset the last time I hear couple shots. You know, Sean, my brother Ben, who's a pastor. I don't know if you know this. My my dad stepped down as pastor, and when he was, like, 87 years old, and my brother, my, is now the pastor of Second Baptist Church. Isn't that a strange name?
00;14;05;21 - 00;14;28;08
Unknown
The second that he was doing that? No, he wasn't there. Yeah, he was he was on staff, but now he's a he's a senior. He's the senior pastor. But anyway, he's a black belt in jiu jitsu. Those guys you don't mess with those guys. That's what I've heard. If they touch your pinky, they'll joke you. That's what I've heard.
00;14;28;11 - 00;14;34;12
Unknown
Yeah, yeah, it was so. Sean, tell me about, Okay. So a workout yesterday, you went 11 rounds.
00;14;34;12 - 00;14;36;03
Unknown
That sounded brutal.
00;14;36;03 - 00;14;37;20
Unknown
11 rounds.
00;14;37;20 - 00;14;55;09
Unknown
that's not a normal day, but it is, you know, it's it's. Yeah, I watch you. I love watching boxing. I love watching UFC. For me, I fully respect what they do until I try to do it literally on the basis.
00;14;55;11 - 00;15;15;10
Unknown
And I get so exhausted and then you get a minute to rest. And then my, my coach, you know, he's holding these big medicines. Yeah, yeah. And he'll just hit me on the side of my butt. And that's the key that it sounds. You go up and I'm like, that was two seconds. I'm tired. Yeah. No one's even punching me back like that.
00;15;15;13 - 00;15;42;02
Unknown
Like I don't know how they do it. Yeah, yeah, it is so mean that that's a that's a great parallel, a great story. And, you know, the apostle Paul talked a lot about athletics and relating it to the Christian life. He used the metaphor of fighting and okay, tell me, Segway into what has God done in your life since this, this diagnosis?
00;15;42;02 - 00;15;46;18
Unknown
So much faster. I mean, I know it's kind of a general question, but I mean, and, you know, just,
00;15;46;18 - 00;16;01;06
Unknown
or what have you learned or you know, what? What? And I've learned so much. I'll tell you, one of the things is, I don't know if it's me or if it's just sort of, a personality trait of people who are, you know, a little bit naive and risky or whatever.
00;16;01;06 - 00;16;19;00
Unknown
I don't think about it. What we're trying to accomplish. Yes. I think the goals that we're trying to chase down and this diagnosis, really messed with me because it just was this gigantic reminder that I'm not going to be here forever.
00;16;19;02 - 00;16;43;01
Unknown
And so I'll tell you what. Since the diagnosis, I don't miss a chance to shoot hoops with my son. I don't miss a chance to sit out on the back porch with my other son and talk about life. You know, right after the diagnosis, me and Jill had this, like, bucket list trip. Or, you know, as soon as we start having kids, she always one day wanted to take the kids to the Atlantis in the Bahamas.
00;16;43;03 - 00;16;59;15
Unknown
And it was one of those will. We'll never actually do that. Yeah. Yeah, that's that's a. Yeah. We we went the next month after the diagnosis, like, Man, are those are those aquariums unbelievable.
00;16;59;15 - 00;17;07;09
Unknown
and those slides, I hesitate to tell you this because I don't know the statute of limitations. That's okay for the world.
00;17;07;12 - 00;17;37;01
Unknown
There's none of my three boys snuck out in the middle of the night and jumped in the shark tank to take pictures. And I mean, Sean, that next day was like, what are you doing? What's wrong with you? And my son goes, I looked it up, docile, like angry. Well, you know how he didn't get kicked out, you know, you know, what's so funny about sharks is, you know, some of the sharks.
00;17;37;01 - 00;17;39;18
Unknown
Of course, are nurse sharks. And people think,
00;17;39;18 - 00;18;01;14
Unknown
oh, nurse sharks are benign. They're tame. A nurse shark causes a lot of damage because when he grabs you, it's like a pit bull. He will not let go. So you're snorkeling or diving and 150 pound fish grabs you. Sean, it's not good. No, no, that's not good. I don't trust sharks at all.
00;18;01;17 - 00;18;22;28
Unknown
But, man, you're, Man, your sons are brave. Yeah, well, and not the smartest. And so I remember those slides to. Yeah, those were really cool. It kind of felt like Disneyland around a swimming pool. Yeah, it was fun. It was not relaxing.
00;18;22;28 - 00;18;23;16
Unknown
so Sean.
00;18;23;16 - 00;18;37;13
Unknown
So so God has shown you just the urgency of the moment, taking advantage. Okay. You have these these these windows. Boom. You have these doors opening boom. Yeah. And you know, I think another thing, pastor is
00;18;37;13 - 00;18;47;06
Unknown
oh is he used to be Jesus saying, in this world you'll have troubles. Yes. And I came to give you life to the fullest.
00;18;47;08 - 00;19;13;00
Unknown
And I guess I always sort of thought it was because I've never had anything like this personally happen. I always kind of thought it was like life was like a roller coaster. Yeah. And I was like, well, this week it's troubled. This week. Yes, yes. Troubles like people. And when I got this diagnosis, I remember one day I prayed and I was just like, I don't know, like which one is it?
00;19;13;02 - 00;19;39;21
Unknown
Is it? I'm going to have troubles or is it I can live life to the fullest. But I felt like you dropped this little above my head that was like, just like, yep, I know, but which one is it? And I see it now. More like yes. And the whole point of me writing about this, the book is the sermons I need to hear about not giving up, but and now I feel like it's train tracks and it's like you can go through really hard.
00;19;39;23 - 00;20;03;15
Unknown
And have peace and joy and purpose. That's right. And tell and that's the biggest thing that I'm trying to do on a daily basis is I got this thing that I'm not happy about, but I can also have peace. That's right. At the exact same time, if I'll do some of the things that that's be really clear in this world.
00;20;03;18 - 00;20;21;14
Unknown
And so, you know, I mean, it's some it's easy to talk about this stuff as a pastor. It's a whole different deal when you got to walk through it. It isn't. You know, I shared with you that we lost our daughter. She's in heaven. Yeah. Five years ago. And I would echo exactly what you're saying. We did a book.
00;20;21;16 - 00;20;52;27
Unknown
Really? It's a great book because my wife wrote it. It's called, A Path Through Pain, and we talk about those parallel tracks that you just described so vividly that, you know, it'll it'll never go away in this life. The hurt and the pain. It's not. I mean, it's not going to, but God has shown us there's a parallel track, you know, of joy, of the peace that surpasses all understanding and and that's it.
00;20;52;27 - 00;20;57;12
Unknown
And, I don't know, it's,
00;20;57;12 - 00;21;20;05
Unknown
Yeah. These. Yeah, these bad things happen, these these tragedies, these, a sickness or whatever. It's it's hard. Yeah. And I think, you know, I've watched you do this, because, you know, we obviously know and love you, right? My boxing coach, the guy who said kiss the fire. Yeah.
00;21;20;08 - 00;21;43;09
Unknown
What we're saying he has this term, he calls it a crack back and he says, when we're working on combinations, he'll throw something in me. And he said, the idea is that my muscle memory learns that you, the enemy, will always pay a price for trying to hurt me. So he's like, if I throw it to you, you're going to step and check up because you don't get nobody gets to punch you without paying a price for it.
00;21;43;11 - 00;22;05;05
Unknown
You crack that. I love that. That's that's honestly one of the biggest. Yeah. But that's cracked back things that keeps me going. It's like I just decided I won't let the enemy. Make you pay a price for it. And so I'm going to take what's been really hard for me that I think he's tried to hurt me and take me out with.
00;22;05;08 - 00;22;19;08
Unknown
And I've just decided on the turnaround in a location and I'm going to help people find Jesus because of it. And I've watched you do that. I love it. And then you've got a huge and well, well, God is good. And it's just a reminder I will never fight you.
00;22;19;08 - 00;22;20;23
Unknown
I'm not
00;22;20;23 - 00;22;22;01
Unknown
I don't fight my brother anymore.
00;22;22;01 - 00;22;32;20
Unknown
I did when we were young, not now. And I'm definitely not fighting you. I don't want I don't want to have you do an L step. Boom! I'm out. Okay.
00;22;32;20 - 00;22;45;20
Unknown
Speaking about hard stuff, what is the hardest thing about being a pastor? And it's Sean. A lot of people can look at you and go, well, yeah, this is awful what he's going through, but, oh, his life must be like skipping down the primrose path.
00;22;45;20 - 00;22;48;22
Unknown
Being a pastor, it's fun. It's smooth. CS
00;22;48;22 - 00;22;55;21
Unknown
I think for me personally, insecurity and feeling worthy is always been, oh
00;22;55;21 - 00;23;02;22
Unknown
I feel you of people. Yeah. Oh, it hurt you. And sometimes you don't need to know
00;23;02;22 - 00;23;23;14
Unknown
Hey, Sean, let me let me interrupt you. This might help you. This is a stat. The average person over a lifetime is betrayed seven times. The average pastor seven times a year. Yes, sir. I'm, writing a book on betrayal because I've been betrayed so much.
00;23;23;14 - 00;23;38;13
Unknown
And there's a beautiful side to it. But what you're saying is so, so rich. It's like you give people your heart, and we're not jamming people. I mean, you know, they they have their issues like we do, but but it's it's a it's a tough thing, isn't it. Yeah.
00;23;38;13 - 00;23;47;08
Unknown
maybe the two hardest situations for me in my life if I wasn't doing ministry has been either over.
00;23;47;11 - 00;24;12;20
Unknown
People leaving. Oh yeah. Yeah. And then about six years ago when I was really struggling with anxiety. Yes. Panic attacks, I felt like maybe I shouldn't be a pastor if I'm this broken. And it kind of felt like, you know, I kept asking God, yeah. Am not a hypocrite because I'm. Yeah. Thinking that I'm really struggling to have my own.
00;24;12;21 - 00;24;34;05
Unknown
And, it was really hard for me to make my peace with. I can be a pastor and be broken at the same time. Yes, that's a great word. So. So that was a big learning curve. But I think broken heartedness has been the hardest. Yes. Constant. I've and I've just battled my whole life and not kind of with not feeling like I'm worthy.
00;24;34;09 - 00;25;01;27
Unknown
Yeah. He used by God. Yeah. Always difficult for me you know. It's difficult for me. Not that you I mean I'll say it but I'm sure you'll echo this is the speaking every week. For me because I'm so A.D.D. and have all these. I know I've never been diagnosed learning challenges. Problems for me to to spend the time I need to spend,
00;25;01;27 - 00;25;07;10
Unknown
you know, studying in the word whatever to to preach for me is is a challenge.
00;25;07;10 - 00;25;34;13
Unknown
I mean, I know I'm called to it, but people go, oh, you must have you must have a lot of fun preaching. I'm called and I, I think God's given me a gift to do it. But as far as being fun, complete, I don't. I wouldn't call it I wouldn't call it fun. That is is that is that would you would you agree with that fun.
00;25;34;15 - 00;26;09;11
Unknown
I've had those feelings. I have thought like, oh God, I've done this 20 years. Yes. No. Yes. Did they not? Well, I've done it 35 years and I'm still asking that question every week. I feel like I have to fight off anxiety every single week. Yes, I feel like a semi-truck is sitting on my chest. Yeah, I feel this pressure deal with all the thoughts of being, right on the neck coming up with me, people who think it's so hard for what are you preaching on right now?
00;26;09;14 - 00;26;35;26
Unknown
So we're in a series called Rowdy Church. I like that rowdy church. We're not called just to make noise for the kingdom of God when we get together in the building. But when the church has got to leave the building. I love it. And go make some noise for me. That's great. That's great. But, I struggle every single week I preach and people are like, well, do you love it?
00;26;35;29 - 00;26;53;06
Unknown
And I said this the other day, I said, I don't know if this is jacked up or not. If I said, I love the feeling of walking off stage, I do. Y'all like when I get them all. Yeah. When I get in the car, drive home. Yes. Because, whether I think I failed or six if you're done.
00;26;53;08 - 00;27;03;05
Unknown
Did what I thought I was called to do. I gave it everything I got. I can breathe and watch. Yeah. And then Monday I have a holy hangover. Monday and Tuesday.
00;27;03;05 - 00;27;07;05
Unknown
There are times on Monday and I'm like, yeah, I'm not a Christian. Oh, I know, I know,
00;27;07;05 - 00;27;10;27
Unknown
Showing that that's so good because it it helps.
00;27;10;27 - 00;27;27;14
Unknown
So, you know, I know so many leaders look up to you and hopefully they're going to watch this. But I think this, this is cathartic. You know, it's part of iron sharpening iron. It's part of being vulnerable and empathetic with one another. So
00;27;27;14 - 00;27;31;19
Unknown
think I think this is great because I feel like I'm sure I do.
00;27;31;21 - 00;27;55;29
Unknown
Well, you seem to be so confident. I know we're all insecurities. Yeah. One thing that I have to have a counselor really help. Okay, I could use a reminder of who I really is. Social media world with. Oh. My head. I try to fight it every week, but there's something in me that wants to perform.
00;27;56;03 - 00;27;56;24
Unknown
Yes,
00;27;56;24 - 00;28;14;17
Unknown
can. I used to, like, every single week. Part of the pressure of putting the message together was knowing that the creative team was going to ask me 15 minutes later what my. Quirky little quote was going to be. That was going to rhyme and it has to rhyme. I got to hear from an invisible God.
00;28;14;19 - 00;28;39;26
Unknown
Yes, a thousand yes. I've never met. And I gotta have something to write for social media. Yes. And then I had to deal with this thing of like, watch my little 62nd clip and then going to go like this, and I'm going to see the best preachers on the planet, and I just really struggle. I even for a while this is horrible.
00;28;40;02 - 00;28;56;06
Unknown
I even for a while saying that sometimes when I was preaching I was almost auditioning for people who might be watching or I totally Sean, I totally get that was like, God forgive me, have jacked up. Yes. Yeah.
00;28;56;06 - 00;29;05;02
Unknown
And so I'm trying so hard these days. I'll tell you what. This diagnosis has really helped me. Yeah. Not give up.
00;29;05;04 - 00;29;14;11
Unknown
Yeah. But I'm about 100. Yes, I think what it used to do, I still deal with it. I do too, you know what Jerry Seinfeld said?
00;29;14;11 - 00;29;19;26
Unknown
watch the this this thing, this, this post from Jerry Seinfeld. He said
00;29;19;26 - 00;29;25;18
Unknown
some people hate you and you react over it.
00;29;25;20 - 00;29;51;24
Unknown
Why? They're going to be gone and you're going to be gone and no one cares. Oh, like that's good. But but yeah, but but anyway, so what I've tried to do with social media is and it really happened in snail mail 35 years ago when I would get letters saying, you know, wow, we love Fellowship Church and AD, you're the next Billy Graham.
00;29;51;27 - 00;30;09;08
Unknown
Oh man, I'm feeling so good. I'm feeling good. And then the next letter. You're a heretic. We're leaving the church at mid-winter. So I was up and down, up and down, up and down. Kind of like the slides at the Atlantis and and and so I made a decision. I remember it, it was 30 something years ago. I'm not going to read it.
00;30;09;08 - 00;30;33;21
Unknown
I'm not going to read it. I mean, if if it's good. And it's really a strong testimony, I will, but I can't. I'm that insecure. So now in the social media world, I do not read the comments. No, no, no. Now sometimes people will tell me, like our, our daughters, what people are saying. I got one here.
00;30;33;21 - 00;30;57;19
Unknown
I stop up in the name of love. Stop, stop, stop. I just post it, let it go. And that's really helped me because the moment I begin, this is how again week I am to to to move down that trail, to peek over into the dumpster. I take that dive in, man. It's a brutal dive. And so it's just better for me, for me, for me.
00;30;57;21 - 00;31;29;11
Unknown
And I would encourage other pastors, don't take the bait from the enemy. I have lost more days to a lack of joy because of reading what somebody said. They don't even know you. I don't even know. No. I'm like, how am I the let and invisible. Yes that's right. We can't we can't I to try to do the smart and all that stuff.
00;31;29;11 - 00;31;49;07
Unknown
I don't argue with people over online, I don't that's good. And hopefully, young leaders are going to hear this and go, man, I'm going to I'm going to take my cues, this practical word from Sean, just don't argue. Don't, you know, don't. Well, I think for me, it's what you just alluded to. I'd like to think I have real tough skin,
00;31;49;10 - 00;32;13;14
Unknown
Yeah. I just don't know. I don't think pastors do. I think the calling I think, yeah, I don't I don't think we, we have thick skin, even though I say I do. I go to people at church who were like part of the. Yeah, it's you know, I got it. Sure. Yeah. But man, take that family. It's true.
00;32;13;14 - 00;32;35;21
Unknown
Sean. Right. Sean, you know this, announcer on the UFC. Bruce buffer. You know him? Yes, yes, I love that guy. I don't know him, but I just, like, really good, like, voice techniques not to lose his voice with all the yelling, and. Yeah, he's amazing. And then, of course, his brother, his older brother
00;32;35;21 - 00;32;56;00
Unknown
Is his older brother do it in the boxing ring. Oh, yeah. His older brother. Let's get ready there. Okay. Yeah, yeah, I've even tried to do that before. Like when I'm fishing and the fish aren't biting. I was with a friend of mine, and we. We started listening to Michael Buffer say, let's get ready to rumble.
00;32;56;02 - 00;33;02;27
Unknown
He's worked on that. So much. I mean, it's it's like a it's like he's singing,
00;33;02;27 - 00;33;16;18
Unknown
let's get ready to rumble. That's okay. But if you hear him, you might go, oh, that's a good imitation. No. It's pitiful. You got to hear him do it. But he, he has that, you know, and then,
00;33;16;21 - 00;33;48;01
Unknown
Yeah. Bruce Buffer is talking. Yeah, I love that. That's a that's an interesting little part it out for themselves. And they made a fortune. Yeah. And they're not creating new content. No they're. No. Hey they're not they're not running sermons are they. Okay. Tomorrow it's time. Next Monday it's time. Five months from now. It's time. Wow. I want that job.
00;33;48;04 - 00;34;08;03
Unknown
Gary. Okay. Sean is great to have you, my man. Yeah. We love we love you guys, too. And, man, keep rocking. Well, that's that's beautiful. Hey, Sean. You know what? Talking about that I said that might make my humor strange. You know, I said that as a joke to me because I knew it was cheesy, and I.
00;34;08;03 - 00;34;39;22
Unknown
I like to sometimes throw stuff out, and I laugh that people laugh at cheesy things. That's how I am. Okay, so this goes back to preaching. I don't I don't try to be funny. I'm not like people laugh sometimes at stories. Well, sometimes I'll say things that I think are hilarious. Crickets. Okay, this past week I read this corny joke from this old preacher and I told our team, I'm using it.
00;34;39;24 - 00;34;46;29
Unknown
I guarantee it, the crowd will laugh. Now this is in Dallas Fort Worth. You know, the hip, cool people. And here's the joke.
00;34;46;29 - 00;35;01;28
Unknown
A little boy had a mangy dog on a leash. She was sitting in the veterinarian's waiting room. A man across the room looked at the dog and goes, son, what kind of dog is that?
00;35;01;28 - 00;35;04;01
Unknown
Because the dog was kind of weird looking.
00;35;04;01 - 00;35;25;02
Unknown
And the little boy goes, oh, this is a police dog. And the man said, A police dog. Well, he doesn't look like one. And the little boy replied, well, that's because he's in the Secret Service. No, Sean, I don't think that's funny, LaShawn. I don't think that's funny. Oh, they tore the house down.
00;35;25;04 - 00;35;26;00
Unknown
Yes.
00;35;26;00 - 00;35;48;22
Unknown
I don't get it. I ain't then I work at work at work telling a funny story. Nothing, Sean. And then I, I just tested it. And people. I'm telling you, even red rocks guarantee it. You look up, just just test it. A couple of cheesy jokes. I promise you, Sean, because I've discovered that's kind of the level that most people are on.
00;35;48;24 - 00;35;49;29
Unknown
The dad jokes.
00;35;49;29 - 00;35;56;02
Unknown
but that. But that, that illustrated the go back to the dog that many Christians are in the Secret Service.
00;35;56;05 - 00;35;59;15
Unknown
Get it? Yeah. That that was he wasn't that great. But they laughed.
00;35;59;15 - 00;36;16;04
Unknown
All right, Sean, anyway, listen, man, we love you guys. Keep on keepin on. And and, man, we're praying for you. And I'm looking forward to this book. Kiss the fire by Sean Johnson
00;36;16;04 - 00;36;19;22
Unknown
and walk away whistling Let's Go.
00;40;54;19 - 00;41;04;08
Unknown
this is cathartic. You know, it's part of iron sharpening iron. It's part of being vulnerable and empathetic with one another.
00;41;07;03 - 00;41;15;04
Unknown
you know, I kept asking God, yeah. Am not a hypocrite because I'm. Yeah. Thinking that I'm really struggling to have my own.
00;41;18;11 - 00;41;27;01
Unknown
about six years ago when I was really struggling with anxiety. Yes. Panic attacks, I felt like maybe I shouldn't be a pastor if I'm this broken.