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The stories from the places where people gather.
Dana Kadwell (01:28)
And today we are welcoming Anthony Lambatos. Anthony believes heart led leadership isn't good for people, it's good for business. Since purchasing Footers Catering from his father in 2010, Anthony and his wife, April have quadrupled revenue, maintained retention 50 % better than the industry average and opened an event center called Social Capital. In response to industry demand,
Anthony founded MIBE, a leadership development and culture building organization that helps leaders grow people first organizations. An award winning speaker, Anthony inspires leaders to create workplaces where fulfilled employees fuel unstoppable results. Welcome to the show, Anthony.
Anthony Lambatos (02:04)
Thank you, Dana. It's awesome to be with you and I really appreciate you having me.
Dana Kadwell (02:09)
Yeah,
yeah. So I actually, don't know, I don't remember actually when I officially met you, but I saw you speak at Cater Source. I don't know. It had to be like three or four years ago. It was like the year before, I guess it was only three years ago, cause it was right before the first venue master class. And I was like, I have to get this guy to come to the venue master class.
Anthony Lambatos (02:29)
Thank you, yes. Well, I'm a huge fan of what you've created and what you're doing and yeah, honored to be friends with you as well. So thank you for having me.
Dana Kadwell (02:36)
Yeah.
Yeah, of course.
I think just to start us off, if you want to just give our guests a little bit of an abridged version, I know there's probably like, we could talk for hours about how you became the owner of Footers and how you opened Social Capital. But if you want to talk a little bit about that journey.
Anthony Lambatos (02:50)
You
Yeah, so my father started footerskatering in 1981, so I would say I grew up in the business. And I grew up never wanting to be part of the business. That was my dad's thing. He loved it. He's passionate about hospitality. ⁓ And I saw him, you know, be at work all the time, which was where his passion was. And I had aspirations to do other things. And you know how life has a funny way of turning around and ⁓ ended up back working for him. And we didn't work.
Dana Kadwell (03:24)
does.
Anthony Lambatos (03:28)
really well together. We just had different philosophies, we could dive more into that later, but he, ⁓ I think I was too young and arrogant to really appreciate like what it takes to build a business from scratch and I think he was too stubborn and set in his ways to appreciate what we could bring and so it kind of came to a head and at that point it was, I was soul searching on what was next and
My wife April and I were kind of talking like what are we going to do? Where are we going to go? And it kind of came full circle was like, well, why aren't we looking at buying footers? Like it's a business we know really well. She had a background in catering, hospitality, ⁓ and complimented a lot of things that, you know, I love the business aspect of things. That was what I kind of came to this realization that, you know, the strategy and the game plan and culture and bringing people together and helping them grow is what I'm passionate about. And she, you know, had these tools.
Dana Kadwell (04:00)
Mm.
Mm-hmm.
Anthony Lambatos (04:21)
and had worked in kitchens and ⁓ a love for events. so together we were like, I think we could probably make a run at this. And so we bought the business from my father. And our main thing was just create a great place to work. wasn't about being the biggest catering company in Denver. It wasn't about winning a bunch of awards. It was just, let's build a place that we enjoy coming every day that is going to be fun. And our team is going to enjoy it. And that's manifested itself into something that's just beyond my wildest dreams. If you would have like,
Painted the picture of where we are today compared to where we were when we bought it 15 years ago ⁓
You're crazy. What? don't know what you're talking about. So, ⁓ that, that led us to multiple moves. ⁓ and most recently as we act wealth, they shouldn't even say most recently, cause it's been five years now, which is absolutely crazy. ⁓ that we, yeah, this month are celebrating five years in social capital. ⁓ so that was our, our venue. That was the next iteration. and then you mentioned my as well, which is where I spend a lot of my time now on helping other companies develop their leaders and create
Dana Kadwell (04:59)
Yeah
I know, I know. Bunkers.
Anthony Lambatos (05:28)
places to work.
Dana Kadwell (05:30)
I love that. I, if you haven't heard Anthony speak, he's like such an inspirational person. I think I love so much about the story. You talk a lot about like how you kind of turned the whole culture of footers around by just believing in a simple, though, what you just said, like creating a great place to work. But I feel like, when you've experienced one way of doing business, right. And you experienced your dad, who would you call him? Like the tornado? Is that what it was? Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Anthony Lambatos (05:55)
Oh yeah, his nickname was the tornado. Yes, old school,
typical yelling, throwing pots and pans, like chaos environment. Just that was my dad. My dad would go above and beyond for guests. Just, I mean, there are countless stories people will tell me still to this day, like, your dad did this for me, or your dad's amazing, you did this. But often he would do it at the expense of his employees and run right over people to do it.
Dana Kadwell (06:24)
Well, was there like a moment, whether maybe before you owned it or after you owned it, that really solidified this concept for you that we have got to create a place to work? was there like this defining situation that was like, this has got to change?
Anthony Lambatos (06:40)
I think it was a culmination, to be honest with you. remember, you know, I remember seeing that at an early age in the chaos and kind of thinking like, is this normal? this what it should look like?
Dana Kadwell (06:42)
Okay.
Anthony Lambatos (06:52)
My dad gave us another opportunity at a young age. had the, was called the Parade of Homes. It was a 30 day contract where they'd build seven or eight spec houses. And we had the whole concession contract to do it. And I remember working there when I was young, but when we got to about high school, my dad gave me and my buddies, basically he let us operate the whole thing. And it was a major stand. Like we'd have a walk-in cooler, a temporary cooler that would be built, ovens, grills, fryers. Like it was a massive stand. And he told us, you got 20 % for your
Dana Kadwell (06:58)
Yeah.
Wow. Yeah. Yeah.
Anthony Lambatos (07:23)
labor cost 25 % for your food cost anything under that you guys get a keep and we're like alright we're know we're business owners now we're gonna be rich like we had no idea what we were doing we were like you know just cocky little teenage kids and you know we
Dana Kadwell (07:36)
Yeah.
Anthony Lambatos (07:39)
We hired all of our friends to come work for us because we were like, all right, well, we'll just make this a fun environment. We had Hawaiian shirts that we'd wear and we had a bell that we'd ring and we'd give out awards each week for the best of this and best, know, silly, you know, the best burger presentation. You know, it's just like, we're just having fun throughout the whole time. And I remember one day specifically where like,
my face was just caked in grease. I'm working the grill and I turn around and we've got like a line, 15 people deep at five different cash registers. And I looked and like everybody in that stand was working almost in perfect harmony, like just buzzing around and food is flying. And the thing that struck me was every single person in the stand had a smile on their face. And it was like such a pivotal moment because I realized like, my gosh, like fun and productivity go hand in hand. Those aren't
Dana Kadwell (08:23)
you
Anthony Lambatos (08:31)
separate things. Like when we're having fun, we're more efficient. We're cranking things out. This isn't distracting. This isn't about goofing off. This was about being proud of the work we were doing, but accomplishing something great too. And so ⁓ I think that was a fundamental moment for me. And then over time you start to see like other scenarios where it's not that way. And you're like, wait, why, why are you stripping the fun out of something that could be enjoyable for policy or for red tape or just because that's how you've always done it. And you're not comfortable with somebody
Dana Kadwell (09:00)
Alright.
Anthony Lambatos (09:01)
doing it in a quirky or silly way that gets you, you know, an even better result. So I think over time, it just, we, saw that.
as a better path.
Dana Kadwell (09:15)
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Dana Kadwell (10:03)
Yeah, it's so interesting. My husband works for a corporation. So he's in corporate America, right? And so they're always fighting for this honor of best places to work. And pre-COVID, they were very adamant about it. And he's like, it's so bizarre. Like, they'll just like bring in like a beer cart. And I'm like, this isn't going to retain me. Like a beer cart is not what's going to retain me, right? He's like, what's going to...
Anthony Lambatos (10:21)
Yes, 100%.
Dana Kadwell (10:25)
It's
like what's going to retain me is yes, being appreciated and valued, but it's also like having like me understanding clearly like what my goals are. Because when you work for a corporation, you never, there's no security. especially if you're at the top of the list and you're a high paid salary, you know, you're always in the chopping block because they can hire someone cheaper and younger and all that.
Can you talk more about the not tangible things? Like obviously those things are great, but the non tangible ways that you create a great place to work that doesn't, it's not like a product, if that makes sense.
Anthony Lambatos (10:43)
Yeah? 100%.
huh. Yes. I couldn't agree more because the conversation around culture really deviated to, you know, beer fridges and, you know, perks and benefits, right? Like the perks and benefits are part of culture, but that's not at the core. And so when we, ⁓ really dove in at MIBE and said, okay, what did make us successful at Footers? Like, yes, we do some fun things and some quirky things here that our team
Dana Kadwell (10:58)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah, yes.
Sure.
Anthony Lambatos (11:17)
members love, but at the core, when I think about culture, it's three things. It's our people doing jobs they're really good at. I truly believe everybody has strengths that they are naturally gifted at. And when we get to utilize those strengths 75, 80 % of the time in our job, we're going to be more effective. We're going to enjoy that work more. We're going to be better at that work. We're going to take more pride in that work. And it's so impactful and the whole burnout
conversation is real. We're having a lot of conversations about that right now, but burnout doesn't come from the number of hours you're working. It often comes from the work you're doing. And so if you're doing work that is miserable, that you're not good at, that you don't like, that will have a much bigger impact on burnout than working for eight to 10 hours on something that you love doing. Like you're going to end that eight to 10 hours fired up and proud and excited about what you just accomplished because you are utilizing what you're great at. So that's number one.
Dana Kadwell (11:55)
Right?
Anthony Lambatos (12:17)
Two is there has to be purpose in the work you're doing. And by purpose, I don't mean we all have to be rocket scientists or brain surgeons. We just have to understand why our work matters and feel like we're part of something bigger than ourselves. And so when I come to work... ⁓
Do I feel like I'm part of a company that's doing something I believe in? Do I feel like the work I'm doing contributes to helping somebody else do their job? Or the end user, do I understand what my work is going to be? We get to be part of some of the most special days of people's lives. And so if we think that our job is just to put a plate of food down in front of somebody, we've missed the mark. Our job is to make sure that experience as a whole is fantastic.
Dana Kadwell (12:48)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Anthony Lambatos (13:04)
that says a cater or a venue, there's a lot of things that are not in our control that we could just draw the line and say, nope, not our responsibility. But I will tell you like our team, because they understand that our job's not to do that, it's to create an experience. They'll go above and beyond for clients.
but when we
Dana Kadwell (13:21)
No.
Anthony Lambatos (13:21)
come to work, do you have people that you believe in you that will pick you up when you make a mistake, that will cheer you on when you have a big win? That experience is so much different than somebody who goes to work and is isolated.
And so those are the three things that we really talk about when you get strengths, purpose, and relationships. That's at the core of culture. And then you can add all the fun stuff, the beer and fridges, but you do it because here's the thing that people get wrong is they try to
Dana Kadwell (13:36)
Mm-hmm.
All the fun stuff, yeah. Yeah.
Anthony Lambatos (13:52)
with all those things and they haven't taken time to get to know their people. One of our big things that we talk about at MIBE is value people for more than the job they do. So if I know who you are Dana and I know the things you like, the things you don't like, all of a sudden whatever perks and benefits we're gonna add in are gonna be very personal to something that you truly appreciate.
I can't tell you how many offices I walked in years ago. It's kind of fallen out of trend now, but you'd walk in and see that ping pong table and it's got a layer of dust on it that's like this thick. No one plays this. But there are offices where like they're playing that ping pong table every day. They have tournaments and like it's awesome. Great. There's nothing wrong with the ping pong table. It's just do your people like to play ping pong?
Dana Kadwell (14:21)
Yep. No.
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Yeah, yeah.
it sounds a what you're talking about
kind of finding that thing that they, that your employees really love and value and understanding them. And then that's kind of what you're adding in, which is, which I think is hard. think it's hard, you know, from a perspective, from multiple perspectives, like of, you have to take the time to do it. Like it's not fill out the survey and then I'm going to be like,
Anthony Lambatos (14:53)
Yes. Yes.
Dana Kadwell (14:57)
a survey might start the conversation, but you have to spend time with them. Like you have to be in the office and watch them work and interact and understand and ask questions and invest in their story and all that. And that's hard for a very, very busy person who has a lot on their plate. So obviously when you're in it, right, you started this, you knew in April started the company and I know that beginning entrepreneurs, you're like in it, you know, like you are slinging the dishes right next to them.
Anthony Lambatos (15:07)
Yeah.
Ha ha ha.
Yeah. He's our first
child.
Dana Kadwell (15:27)
Yes, exactly. What happens
as a CEO, because now you're like a CEO of multiple things. How do you maintain that level of care when you don't have the same amount of time to invest in that part of the business? That makes sense.
Anthony Lambatos (15:44)
Yeah, that's a, it's it's a great question. And you, you talked about something you said it's hard. And that's what I, I share all the time that culture is not easy. It is not easy to build great culture. takes dedication. It takes work. It takes focus. And we learned that early on. I mean, we, uh, we bought the business. We focused on culture. We created this great place to work. And then we just went back to catering and about, you know, six months later, we're like, what happened to our great place to work? Like this kind of sucks now. Like, what are we?
Dana Kadwell (16:14)
Yeah.
Anthony Lambatos (16:14)
like what's
going on? And what we realized is culture is not a project. Culture is something you have to think about every month, every week, every day. You need to be thinking about something that has to do with culture in your organization. Because if you are not intentional about steering the culture in the direction you want, the culture is going to continue to persist. It just may go a different way. Because every organization has a culture. And culture is what happens when people bump into each other in the hall, when problems
Dana Kadwell (16:35)
All
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Anthony Lambatos (16:44)
arise when communication happens. That is how culture exists within an organization. And so every day it's continuing on. And as a leader, I think it's one of the most important things that we have to embrace that, this is a huge part of my responsibility. Even though I can't see it on a line item of culture on the balance sheet or the P &L, it's something that you have to weave in to say, no, no matter how busy I am, I have to dedicate time for culture. And it's hard.
Dana Kadwell (17:04)
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Anthony Lambatos (17:14)
It's not easy. It's
not something that you can just set and forget. So I think that that is that reminder for me always that like culture is one of the most important things that I can do as a leader for an organization. The other piece though is making sure that everybody else in on your team understands their responsibility when it comes to culture. I talked to a lot of organizations and they kind of fall into two camps. It's either like, well, the leader's responsibility.
They're the ones and or you know for larger organizations like all what HR HR handles that and and you can't delegate culture to to one person or to a Department culture is something that everybody has to be aware of and everybody has to take part in now there can be certain people that administer and put put on different aspects of of your culture, but when everybody becomes a Protector of the culture they're clear on what the values are here how we treat each
what our mission is and now I'm going to make sure that not just I live into those values but I'm going to be watching what Dana's doing. I'm gonna be watching what everybody else on this team is doing and when somebody is really outside of that, if I don't have hiring or firing responsibility, that's okay but it's my job to go tell somebody or go talk to somebody about, here's what's going on. You guys are saying that these are our values but...
Dana Kadwell (18:25)
Mm.
Anthony Lambatos (18:42)
This is happening over here and I don't necessarily think that that's in line.
Dana Kadwell (18:46)
Yeah.
Anthony Lambatos (18:47)
And you've given them the opportunity to do something about it. And if nothing happens, then I would say it's on the employee because every single day you walk in that organization, you are essentially putting your stamp of approval on whatever that culture is. And, as, as hard and, you know, just direct as, as that is, I truly believe it that you are making a choice every day. And if you're continuing to walk in that door, you're saying, I don't like it, but I'm okay.
Dana Kadwell (19:02)
Yeah.
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Anthony Lambatos (19:17)
with it because I'm not really willing to do anything different. And so I think it really starts with, with, starts with the leader. The leader has to be there, but everybody on the team has to own it. And that all of a sudden is what allows, you know, somebody like me to have other businesses and dedicate my time in other areas because I know I've got a team of footers that is protecting that culture, just as much as I would when I'm not there.
Dana Kadwell (19:20)
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah, yeah, it's a lot of, yeah,
it's a lot of like creating that kind of ⁓ tiered leadership too. And, you know, and I think there's this, it's really hard to let go of control. And I think something when you feel as passionate about the culture, and for me, I've gotten it so wrong in the past
Anthony Lambatos (19:50)
Yes.
Dana Kadwell (20:00)
I think when I look back on my mistakes, it was a project. was like, okay, we're going to do some training and we're going to learn how to do this. And then you, and then you're good, right? We're good. As opposed to being a continual thing. And then you don't think about it until it's a problem. And then you're like, what the hell just happened? Like, why are we here? And like my personal experience,
Anthony Lambatos (20:18)
Yes.
Dana Kadwell (20:20)
It is so hard to change negative culture, like with current employees. it's, and you talk a lot about red dot employees, like maybe you want to give like a quick intro to what a red dot employee is.
Anthony Lambatos (20:29)
Yep.
for sure. It's there. They're there. They will sink an organization so fast. So we have our employee culture compass, which you're referring to. And essentially you're ranking a person, you're scoring them on how good of a culture fit they are and how good are they at their job, their performance. And we have a whole tool that people can find if they go to themib.com, can email me, we'll send it to you, but you can answer 20 questions about one of your
Dana Kadwell (20:38)
The hardest. But they're the hardest, yeah.
Yeah.
Anthony Lambatos (21:04)
team members and it'll plot them and it'll plot them in one of the four quadrants and either they're a yellow dot which is low performer low culture most companies don't have many yellow dots because they're pretty easy to get rid of like they're not good at their job no one really likes them we think we can move them out pretty easily ⁓ the blue dots are everybody loves them they're great cultural fits everybody you know they remember people's birthdays they're team players but they struggle with their core job and to me those are people you need to to find a different seat on the bus for
Dana Kadwell (21:14)
Yeah. Yep. Right. Bye.
Yeah.
Great, great.
Anthony Lambatos (21:34)
How
do we modify their job description so they're utilizing their strengths? Because they're probably not utilizing their strengths. And get them up to a teal dot, which is your high performers, your unicorns. We want more of them. We want to clone them. They're awesome at what they do. They're great with the culture. They're pushing the values forward. Biggest problem in any organization is your red dots. They're...
really great at their job. And they're so good at their job, they tell everyone how good they are at their job. You know, I'm the one that brings in all the sales here. I'm the one that makes all this happen. I'm the one that solves all the problems. I made sure we didn't. I saved us from doing this. You know, it's I, I, And behind the scenes though, they're eroding the fabric of the organization because they're not really living the culture. And there's probably some gossip and they're starting fires over here and they're talking negatively about these people over here. And they create this story that continues to prop themselves up.
into that position that they've elevated themselves to and as owners we usually believe them. We start to tell ourselves that same story of, gosh how could I ever do it without.
Cheryl, how could we ever, know, if we lost Bobby, man, we'd lose all of our clients or we'd lose all of our employees because he's going to take everyone with him. And, know, it's just, we start to tell ourselves this, this narrative and we hold on to the red dots for way too long. And what they're doing is really holding back the company because a lot of it is rooted in insecurity, to be honest, like there's some psychology behind it, but they're holding the whole organization back because that's
Dana Kadwell (22:59)
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Anthony Lambatos (23:05)
where they are safe and that's where they're comfortable
and ⁓ so we talk a lot about you know you got to let a red dot know they're red dot you're over here yes we love what you're doing we love that you bring in so many sales but the behaviors that you're exhibiting by doing X Y & Z aren't in line with our values and if you can't come over here and do this then we can't have you here anymore and sometimes five percent of the time they see it and they're like
Dana Kadwell (23:13)
Mm-hmm.
Right.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Anthony Lambatos (23:34)
I get it, okay, I wanna be on the right path. I wanna be over here with where you're going. Most times we gotta cut the red dots off and get them out of our organization. And every time I've let a red dot go and I've held onto red dots for my share for way too long.
Dana Kadwell (23:38)
Yeah.
Yeah.
Everyone does, yeah.
Anthony Lambatos (23:53)
We've replaced it with somebody better. And it elevated the spirit of our team. It was a what took you so long attitude, not like, my gosh, we have so much work. Now people are excited to pitch in and do the work because it's almost freeing and this weight lifted off of the rest of the team. And so it's really critical for organizations to not settle.
Dana Kadwell (24:08)
Yep. Yeah.
Yeah. Well, I feel like for me,
like where I really struggled is because for so many years we had such a great company culture. And I'm really talking about my experience with my old venue, the Bradford, and it was really good. And I think a lot of it, there was a lot of pieces to it for sure. It's much more complicated than me being able to say this was the issue. But eventually that culture was eroded by, you know, some Red Dot employees. But I honestly feel like we created the Red Dot, like
because I think when we hired them, were very much, maybe they were blue and kind of readjusted and they were in the teal and everyone was good and we all got along. But how our leadership evolved, it evolved in a way that they could no longer get on board. And so now it wasn't even that they didn't believe in the vision, they didn't believe in the new vision, they didn't believe in the new direction. And there is also a really hard transition from...
Anthony Lambatos (25:02)
guests.
Dana Kadwell (25:07)
we're in the trenches with you. Like we are, our hands are just as dirty. Like I am in that septic system, scooping out the shit. Like literally I'm doing it. I'm not asking you to do it. Right? Like true story, right? I showed up, I handled it to this transition where you're like, okay, that's not my job anymore. Like I've, I, you know, we have X amount of people on our team. Like we, you know, all this stuff. And then there's this kind of like, ⁓ like you're not one of us, you know? And
Anthony Lambatos (25:14)
Ha ha ha.
Dana Kadwell (25:36)
And that's really hard transition. And I think that contribute to part of it for sure. So for me, I always struggled with that when I realized I had someone that kind of crossed over that threshold, not feeling personally responsible for creating that employee. So then I had a really hard time, like not feeling guilty about letting them go. Cause I took so much ownership of the problem and not saying I shouldn't have, but there's no way to rehab that person after that.
Anthony Lambatos (25:41)
Yeah.
Yeah.
Mmm.
Dana Kadwell (26:05)
There's no way and who's going to go them or me. Like it's not going to be me. I own the business, you know? And it's like one of those really hard pills to swallow.
Anthony Lambatos (26:09)
Right? Yeah. Right.
think, no, think businesses go through different evolutions and there are certain people that help you get to certain spots and they're not meant to help you get to that next level. I remember years ago, ⁓ it was actually shortly after we had...
Dana Kadwell (26:19)
Yeah.
let's go look at it.
Anthony Lambatos (26:32)
⁓ bought the business. We actually had to fire our executive chef. He was stealing from us. That's a whole other story. But ⁓ we promoted our sous chef. And we use this profile assessment that basically predicts how likely somebody is to be successful in that given job. So it matches them up against what they're expected to do and their personality, their profile. Are they going to be successful? And the guy administering the test said, he is going to do a
Dana Kadwell (26:40)
Yeah.
Anthony Lambatos (27:02)
great job for you. He's gonna work his butt off for you but he's never gonna be able to get you to the next level because he's gonna have to do all the work.
Dana Kadwell (27:09)
Mm. Mm.
Anthony Lambatos (27:10)
And
we're like, okay, we can live with that. We're fine. And I remember the day we had moved into our new building and we are just like hitting this ceiling in our kitchen. And we realized we're like, we're at that point. He was a great chef. He was a hard worker. He believed in what we were doing, but he could never elevate everyone else around him because he had to do all of the work. And so while he served us really well for a portion of our business,
Dana Kadwell (27:22)
Yeah.
Anthony Lambatos (27:37)
He wasn't the one to get us to the next level and a lot of times to your point There's no going back right like he was the executive chef. We're not demoting him to ⁓ a different role just so he can stay on the team I mean you can give people that option, but it usually doesn't go very well And so we had to move on we had to find somebody else that could take us to that next level in that in that role
Dana Kadwell (27:40)
Hmm.
All right.
Right? Yep.
Anthony Lambatos (27:59)
Every one of us has evolved and grown throughout our organization, but for every one of those cases, there's people that weren't able to evolve and grow with us.
needed to move on.
Dana Kadwell (28:09)
Yeah,
that's great advice. I really love that. Like that certain people are just going to get you to, you know, a certain spot, like they're not necessarily ready for that next evolution. Cause I think that's part of like, you know, just, ⁓ it's not a personality flaw. Like I love that about myself. Like I love that I care about people and I want to like, you know, see them be successful, but there's also sometimes you have to take, put the business hat on and say what is actually best for the business in this, in this scenario. ⁓ so I love the way to reframe that. Yeah.
Anthony Lambatos (28:29)
Yes.
Yeah.
And I'll add one more nuance to this because this helps me as well is sometimes what's good for one person or what we think is good for one person is actually really bad for the rest. When you say the business, I like to say the rest of the team, you know, like if we do this for this person, yes, it's going to negatively affect the business, but really it's going to negatively affect the rest of the team. And so are we saving one person to then jeopardize the rest of the team? That doesn't make sense.
Dana Kadwell (28:51)
Yeah.
Yeah, yeah.
Dana Kadwell (29:11)
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Dana Kadwell (30:39)
I want to talk about, yeah, one thing that I think is really hard from a business owner. I see this a lot when I talk to other venue owners
Anthony Lambatos (30:39)
think it's great.
Dana Kadwell (30:46)
is this feeling of when you really want to be generous to your employees. Like you want to be someone that gives a lot, whether that's like with time, whether that's with money or whatever the case may be. And when times are good, it's really easy to be generous. Like I can think of in 2021, we like killed in our sales. And so we were super generous. We took the entire team to engage like in the Bahamas, like to say thank you. It was easy. Like we didn't think twice about it. We had the money to do it.
But in times of scarcity, being generous is really hard. And it feels like sometimes everything you do, there, it isn't, maybe it's not appreciated or you feel taken advantage of or like I have felt in the past where I'm like, I've given you the best I could give you. Like I've given you like, you know, a bonus for Christmas and it's not what I wanted to give you, but it's just what we could do based on the year that we had. And honestly, based on the performance the team had, right?
and the disdain for it, like, because it wasn't enough. It was just like, you know, that feeling like I can never make you happy, like I can never do enough. And it's like soul crushing, like, and it feels like a really heavy place to be. I don't know, just any, like, one, you've experienced that, how you've changed that narrative, even for you,
Anthony Lambatos (32:08)
I have, I have so much here because it's, yeah, this is a, this is a hot button that I talk to a lot of people about and, and it's, it is extremely difficult. So, so first you said something in good times, it's easy to be generous. I'm going to challenge you a little bit about that in good times. It's easy to spend money.
Dana Kadwell (32:10)
Okay?
Anthony Lambatos (32:30)
And so, so don't, what I challenge you is don't confuse ⁓ money with generosity. generosity and ⁓ showing people you care. I hate to say it, but like.
Dana Kadwell (32:30)
Yeah, that's true.
Anthony Lambatos (32:48)
Well, this comes back to I think Money is a lazy way to solve culture like people want to throw money at culture and say ⁓ it's fixed like We bought everybody this we paid for this we did this like we're good And what really drives culture like people appreciate that and it's important that you do that My big thing is people have to understand why you're doing it. And so I I watched my dad do this for years He would give what I called Santa Claus bonuses and at the end of the year he'd come around and he'd give everyone envelopes
Dana Kadwell (33:05)
sure.
Anthony Lambatos (33:18)
of cash based on how he did, how the company did that year. And you know, there might be a couple hundred bucks in that or whatever it is. And the next year didn't, wasn't so good and there'd be 20 and everybody's pissed off. Right. Or like, you know, everybody's mad about, about, and they had no idea why they got a few hundred bucks the year before. They had no idea why they got 20 bucks this year. They just knew their envelope was smaller than it was last year. And, and so, uh, in this, like, well, I wish I wouldn't have done it.
Dana Kadwell (33:24)
Mm-hmm.
Hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Anthony Lambatos (33:48)
Anything is kind of the mantra to your point of, be appreciative that I didn't have to even do that. I did something for you. So we have made a big push to make sure our team understands how the company is doing as a whole. And they understand, are we hitting these metrics? I mean, we have different lenses that people get to see, but there's a sales number and there's a cost of goods. Those are things that everybody has control over. ⁓
Dana Kadwell (33:49)
Yeah.
Yes.
Yeah.
Anthony Lambatos (34:18)
I'm, we need to advocate why, ⁓ the dishwasher understands cost of goods, right? They can have be rerunning things through the dishwasher too many times because they're not doing it properly. There's like, if we start pinpointing on how they impact these two main numbers in our business, you know, when we do a great job, that is the best way for us to grow our, our business. Like people love.
of what we do and they go tell somebody else about it. So when you go above and beyond and create an exceptional experience for a client, that drives sales, even if you're not a salesperson. And so when people start to see their job through those lenses, they realize they have some control over those things. And then they get to see the score every month. Here's where we're at. Here's how we're doing. We're missing our, you know, our costs are out of line. We got to do something about that. How are we going to fix that? And at the end of the year, it's not a surprise. The company did well or the company didn't do well.
Dana Kadwell (35:08)
Right. Mm-hmm.
Anthony Lambatos (35:10)
I mean, I think you saw me do my numbers presentation, my seven numbers every business. Those are numbers that we're measuring on a rolling 12 basis. So every month we're getting a score update of where we're at, not just year to date, but how are we doing year over year. ⁓ And so that's, think, a critical piece to that everybody understanding,
Dana Kadwell (35:13)
Yes. Yeah.
Anthony Lambatos (35:30)
Ike, did a similar, we, in 2017, we had the largest event we'd ever done. I mean, it was literally a million dollar event over the course of three days. Like just crazy, 2200 people, breakfast, lunch and dinner. And it was sandwiched in between our two busiest weekends of the year. It was like in a midweek event and we went to our team and said, what do you think? Can we do it? And our team rallied. They were like, yeah, let's do this. This is awesome. What an opportunity for us. And so we literally took 50
Dana Kadwell (35:43)
Wow.
Mm-hmm.
Anthony Lambatos (36:00)
people to Vegas a couple months later to celebrate that. And we had built it in. And I was just like, look, this is what we're going to do. But it was very much tied to that specific thing. Like we just did this and to celebrate, we are going to do this. So it wasn't like next year, like, why don't we go into Vegas? It was like, well, if we get another whale piece of business that we all go get, like, yeah, we can do something like that. ⁓ And so really tying those, those rewards to specific things, I think helps, helps a ton. But
Dana Kadwell (36:02)
Wow. Yeah.
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
you
Anthony Lambatos (36:30)
back to, I want to bring this back full circle of generosity. there was that great article, but they were talking about you can be generous, showing up early to a meeting is generous because you're waiting so they don't have to. ⁓
Dana Kadwell (36:46)
Mmm.
Anthony Lambatos (36:47)
It was, there were like three things that was awesome that I loved that was like not anything with money. It was something about listening, like giving you an opportunity to talk, is being generous. Like it was just these things that are rooted in.
in generosity that didn't have anything to do with spending money. so challenging this idea of how do we give to people when we don't have money? Because there's going to be times when the businesses suffer and we don't have it. And ⁓ what are the things that I can do to show you I care, to show you you matter, that you, you know, I want to still invest in you, I want to see you grow, but I I can't do X, Y,
Dana Kadwell (37:09)
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah, yeah,
that's great. That's great advice. And I love that idea of tying it to something. I think that's ⁓ a really smart move because it makes sense. It's measurable in a lot of ways, but it also kind of, it's like, you know, specific.
Anthony Lambatos (37:43)
Yeah.
I have full circle moment right here too. Like literally right now I'm on ⁓ one of our five year trips. we, years ago, New Belgium, we were there. And after you work at New Belgium for five years, you get a trip to Belgium to learn how to brew beer. And we're like, how cool. That's awesome. And somebody was like, well, you you guys own the company. You could do that. We're like, ⁓ yeah. And so we planned this thing and it was.
Dana Kadwell (38:10)
Yeah
Thanks.
Anthony Lambatos (38:14)
Lindsay and Colbert, had been with us five years. It was a cruise sponsored by Food and Wine Magazine to Alaska. And they got to bring their significant other and on that trip, Lindsay's husband Ryan goes, this is an every five year trip, right? And we're like.
Yeah, sure. If you're here five years, we'll do it again. Well, you know, we did her 10 year trip to Greece and her 15 year trip was to Italy and now we're working on her 20 year trip. But ⁓ one of our team members were celebrating in Mexico her five year trip. So when you're a manager at Footers for five years, you have to be in a manager role for five years. You get a culinary experience where we take you and significant other and it's a combination of April and I go with them. So we get to spend time with you and it's,
Dana Kadwell (38:29)
Yeah
Sure, yeah.
It's so cool.
That's so cool.
Anthony Lambatos (38:58)
acknowledging the work that you've put in over the course of five years but also the support that you've received from somebody special in your life. Right? Like we understand we're nights, we're weekends, we're holidays. We're taking people away from their loved ones on those days and they wouldn't be able to last here for five years if they didn't have that support and so we want to honor that as well.
Dana Kadwell (39:05)
Mm, mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Mm hmm. Yeah. Yeah. And
I really want to encourage people to that, like you don't have to go to Greece. You don't go to Italy. You can rent an Airbnb at a beach or in the mountains and have a very similar, you know, like I just I think about it from like my own lens of like starting these two this new company. Right. And, you know, I was talking to my team and I was like, I really want to meet your significant others. I want you to meet my husband. And we've been like, go, go, go. It's like we're going to like a dinner. You know, when we get back from when I get back from our spring break. But
Anthony Lambatos (39:40)
Yeah.
Dana Kadwell (39:46)
I was like, you I would love to just spend time with you guys to get to understand who you are as people. Because for me, it's really hard, especially when you have multiple properties, because I can't spend five days a week in one, you know, and I'm here this day, here another day, and then like all the other things that I have my hand in.
Anthony Lambatos (40:01)
you're spot on there. It's, doesn't have to be elaborate. but something as simple as you're right, spending time inviting somebody over to your house to share a meal together is so powerful. And I think that sometimes gets overlooked.
Dana Kadwell (40:13)
It is.
Anthony Lambatos (40:15)
there, I tell the story because I had a friend and I love this. I wish I would have adopted it.
but he would do a birthday card to the kids of his employees and he'd put $1 bills for what age they were turning. So if they were turning five, there'd be five $1 bills in there. And you just think about, like, if there's something people care more than anything about, it's their kids.
Dana Kadwell (40:37)
Yes.
Anthony Lambatos (40:38)
You do something good for my kid, like that wins you a ton of brownie points in my world. And to know, to say, not just, I know your kid, I've made a note to remember when the birthday is, and then I've made the effort to send a card remembering what age that kid is turning, like $5 plus some postage. That's what it costs. But the long-term value of that act is huge.
Dana Kadwell (40:42)
Yes. Yeah.
That's a lot. Yeah, right. Yep.
It's just going back to this idea that, especially in the world we live in today, people just want to be seen for who they are. Like they just want to, they just want to feel like they matter in this world because it's so easy to get lost in the noise of everything and to second guess who you are, what you're doing, ⁓ all of it. So it's just one of those things of just having someone say like, I see you. And, you know, I took over one of the companies and one didn't come with staff, so I had to create my own, but one did. And, ⁓
Anthony Lambatos (41:13)
Yeah. Yeah.
Dana Kadwell (41:37)
I remember I was like, you know, ⁓ do you want to come to the masterclass? Like I have some extra seats. She was like, my God, yes. And so like later, I mean, she was just like almost in tears, like just no one's ever invested in me to like fly me out somewhere and have me learn. And she's like, and I love this job. Like I love what I do, but just the fact that, you know, she never felt seen by her employer.
And I don't want to speak ill of the, think they were going through a lot. Like they were dealing with their own things, you know, like it wasn't intentional. They're well, they're wonderful people, but it was just very much this realization of how easy it is even to get involved in your own stress, your own world, and forget that part of your job as a leader is like letting people know, like I see you, I value you, I care about you. ⁓ It's a burden that I don't think a lot of people realize that we have to carry.
you I gladly carry it, it's something you have to think about.
Anthony Lambatos (42:33)
yeah. Yeah, I think, well...
Somebody like you, it's not a burden, right? You want to see people thrive. want to, like, I get fulfillment out of that as well. Like how do I, you know, I want to see people grow. I want to see them thrive. And I think that that is what can really make businesses successful is that that true, I'm going to invest in my people. And that's what we've seen as a whole. think the, culture conversation gets labeled as fluff and back to our like, ⁓ it's just the perks and benefits.
Dana Kadwell (42:39)
No, yeah. Yes.
Yep. Yep.
Anthony Lambatos (43:06)
and I have been banging this drum that no, when you really do culture right, it transforms your business and it is rooted in I'm gonna develop people so that they continue to grow, they're successful, they are better at what they do and the business performs at a higher level.
Dana Kadwell (43:09)
Yeah. Yeah.
Yeah, yeah, I love that. I always ask what's a good character trait for someone opening a venue. And I would like to rephrase this for you because I think,
really what we're talking about today is so much so part of a new ownership is leadership. Like being a venue owner, you have to be able to lead a team. Like we know owner operators are only successful for a few years. Sometimes you got to be in the mud. You got to do the thing. That's fine. But eventually for that venue to be successful for you to have a full life, you have to build a team, which means a lot of us don't get into business realizing we are going to become leaders. We're going to become bosses. We're going to have to make these really hard decisions. So what is, would you say a really good character trait?
that you value and you would like just that you look at for somebody like this is going to be an amazing leader. Like what character trait would that be? And that's a tough one.
Anthony Lambatos (44:06)
Mmm.
So, so, well, there, I'll twofold this because we, we, we talk about, the four characteristics that I think separate top performers from mediocre. But I think two, will pull out to, that are going to translate to, you know, if you're going to run a successful venue, I think that this really elevates. Number one is perseverance. Like, can you, I think it just in general business ownership, you're going to have setbacks.
Dana Kadwell (44:21)
Hmm. Okay.
Okay. Yeah.
Anthony Lambatos (44:39)
are going to have things that don't go according to plan and especially in the event world, right? Like even just a venue, like not every event is gonna, something is gonna happen. You mix that many people into a space for a celebration with alcohol involved, like you just gotta know something random is going to happen that you can't make up and you gotta be ready to deal with it. Or you're going to see a turn or something happen in the market and to be able to
Dana Kadwell (45:01)
Yep. Yeah.
Anthony Lambatos (45:08)
Have a challenge hit you and figure out like all right. How do I overcome this? How do I keep going after you fall down after you make a mistake? ⁓ I think that that's such a key thing among just all employees, but specifically business owners and venue owners You've got to be able to overcome those those junk bumps and challenges along the way. So so that's number one ⁓
Dana Kadwell (45:22)
Yeah. ⁓ Yeah.
Anthony Lambatos (45:31)
And number two is I've been on this kick of positivity. And I just believe that if we look for the good in the world, we're going to find it. If we look for the good in our business, we're going to find it. And if we look for the bad, we're going to find that too. And if we look for the negative, we're going to find that. And our news cycles and...
Dana Kadwell (45:36)
Hmm.
Anthony Lambatos (45:57)
What we get bombarded with is really good about pointing out all the negative things that are going on in this world. And there's a lot of heavy things. I'm not trying to discount that. But when we're inundated with all the negativity in this world, we start looking and scanning the world for that. And I am just a big proponent that either we're going to have faith in what's going to go right, or we're going to have faith in what's going to go wrong. And I want
Dana Kadwell (46:03)
Sure, right.
Mm.
Anthony Lambatos (46:22)
be on the side of how do we look for what's gonna go right and for a venue owner the same thing like it's not again I don't want to call this silver lining or rose-colored glasses you have to acknowledge when there's true threats but I think sometimes people get so bogged down with all like
Dana Kadwell (46:24)
Yeah. Yeah.
Sure.
Mm.
Anthony Lambatos (46:40)
What are we looking at? Negativity.
I think the same thing happens in every day. What are we focusing on? Are we focusing on the things that are going really well and that we can highlight?
Or are we focusing on this, you know, the loud minority negative subset over here? So there you go.
Dana Kadwell (46:54)
Yeah. Yeah. I needed to hear that. I am not going to lie
to you. I have like one of my properties has been like, I've been, I'm honestly just been negative Nellie about it. It's just been one thing after another. And it's, there's been a lot of conversation of how do I salvage this? Do I, do I create a stop gap? Do I jump ship because I still can. and, ⁓ but like gutturally, I know it's a good move. Like gutturally, I know I can turn it around.
Anthony Lambatos (47:12)
Yeah.
Dana Kadwell (47:22)
Like I know it, like there's a lot of good there, but it's been so focused on the negative side of it that it's tainted like my vision for it. So I needed to hear that. Yeah. Thank you. That's, that's a good one. Okay. So craziest event, like craziest event story that maybe you haven't told anybody. ⁓
Anthony Lambatos (47:23)
Yeah. Yeah.
Yeah, yeah, go look for all the good. Go look for it. You're gonna find it now.
We're doing an event. This wasn't a venue story. It was a catering story. I know it deviates a little bit. But Steamboat is three hours away from where we are. So it's up into the mountains. And we regularly do events there. But ⁓ the truck gets a flat tire and essentially breaks down about 10 minutes from the venue. And
It's in a place with not a lot of great self-service. And so our team is trying to figure out what to do. How are we going to make this happen? And they get ahold of our director of ops who was back in Denver and he said, you guys just, just figured out I'll get the tow truck there. I'll, I'll commandeer from here. So he was like point from Denver where he had service and could tell where to go and how to get the tow truck there. The, they, we have a passenger van that, that the staff had written and they
Dana Kadwell (48:14)
Yeah.
Anthony Lambatos (48:36)
They took all the seats out of that and they started shuttling equipment from the truck in the passenger van up to the ceremony. They unloaded the grill off the truck and our chef started cooking steaks on the side of the road to start getting the food. Because we cook all of our food on site, we don't bring it hot. We bring whatever we need. So he's literally cooking food right there, starting the whole process of making this event happen despite the fact that we're 10 minutes away. had ⁓ just everybody
Dana Kadwell (48:50)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Anthony Lambatos (49:06)
jumped in to figure out how to make this happen. we, you know, the tow truck gets there, it gets, you know, we get the truck up there and, know, with two minutes to spare, everything was ready when guests came in and they had no idea what happened. Everybody just walked in, enjoyed a great event. But I, I, I love that story because the stress that our team went through, I asked them, I was like, how did you not lose it on each other?
Dana Kadwell (49:19)
crazy.
Yeah.
Yeah. Yeah!
Yeah.
Anthony Lambatos (49:36)
and like panic in that moment. And one of them said, this was somebody's wedding.
We needed to make it happen. And I was just like that level of buy-in and understanding of, know, they easily could have just said, trucks here, like we got to wait until the tow truck comes. Like every single person. they fed off this positive energy of
How are we going to make this happen? Not look at all the reasons why we can't do it. we're going to be late. We don't have this. We can't do this. They were like, all right, I can start cooking now because I know we're not going to have time once we get up there or I can start doing this now or get this up there so we can start setting that. They prioritized what needed to be where in the loads that would go up there. So every load that went up, there were people that we could start utilizing that equipment. wasn't just take it off the truck and start like they had it all just so dialed in and figured
Dana Kadwell (50:00)
Yeah.
Right.
Right, right. Like Hodgepodge,
Anthony Lambatos (50:27)
out of the chaos behind the scenes that sometimes we have. And full circle, I didn't find out about it until three days later. So that was another thing as an owner of the business to know like our team completely handled this whole situation and I didn't even know about it. ⁓ I just couldn't be more grateful for the amazing team that I have.
Dana Kadwell (50:28)
It's so cool.
Yeah, well that's amazing. I think that's such a testament. Yeah.
Yeah, don't you love that? Yeah. Yeah.
Yeah, that's
amazing. That's such a testament to what you have built thank you so much for your time today. has been wonderful talking to you. I always get so many nuggets. I have like two pages of notes written down. So I don't know what I'm gonna pick for my quick chats, because I could probably have a whole another hour episode and not be a quick chat. But ⁓ thank you so much for your time today. It's just been wonderful.
Anthony Lambatos (50:58)
ahead.
Ha
Thank you for having me Dana and thank you for the work you're doing to inspire other venue owners and to help them on their journey