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Welcome to Nostalgic Travel Talks! I’m a former Spanish teacher turned travel advisor, passionate about curating unforgettable experiences. My expertise lies in European adventures (with a special love for Spain), cruising, and all-inclusive Caribbean getaways. I specialize in creating tailored trips for families, multi-generational groups, and teachers—whether they’re traveling solo, with colleagues, or leading student groups.
In this podcast, we celebrate the joy of travel, uncover hidden gems, share practical tips and tricks, and embrace the spirit of adventure. Each episode features inspiring conversations with fascinating guests from all walks of life as they share their unique travel stories, lessons, and favorite destinations. Whether you're planning your next getaway or simply love to dream about the possibilities, this is your place to explore the world from wherever you are.
Let’s embark on this journey together! 🌍✈️
Ladies and gentlemen, may I have your attention please.
0:07
Ready for an adventure? Whether you're revisiting cherished moments or planning new escapades, Nostalgic Travel Talks is here to inspire your wanderlust. Let's take off. Hello everybody and thank you for joining us on this episode today. I'm here with Dr. Veronica Flake, who is a doctor who had the opportunity to study in Cuba. And if you recall,
0:33
a couple episodes ago, I interviewed Dr. Gigi Simmons, who is a colleague of hers. So welcome, Dr. Flake. And I would love it if you could tell us a little bit about yourself. What first inspired you to study medicine in general? And then maybe you can expound on that and talk about Cuba.
0:48
Oh, hi. Thank you so much for having me. So a bit about myself. I'm a Philadelphia native. I have an interest in languages, reproductive health, global health and medicine. So I've always had interests and desires to become a doctor.
1:02
I have my composition book from, I believe I was roughly seven years old and in it I wrote, I am going to become a doctor. So it was just something that was innate in me. I was looking to apply to medical school abroad, particularly South America or in the Caribbean, but not Cuba.
1:20
And at the time I had a coworker when I lived in the Midwest who mentioned that she thought I would be a good candidate for the medical school program in Cuba. And at the time I was very naive and I just didn't know much about Cuba in regards to whether or not Americans could travel there. So I thought I couldn't go. And I told her no. I mean, she was pretty insistent that she thought it would be a great fit for me based on my work experiences and my global health
1:46
experience as far as travel. And she recommended I watch a documentary which is called Salud, which explains very thoroughly about the medical program in Cuba. I remember watching the documentary and I was floored and I just knew I was going to figure out how to apply and go to medical school in Cuba, which is how I ended up studying medicine in Cuba. That's amazing. And what year was that that you that you started? You're aging me here, Cheryl. Yeah, so I watched the documentary in 2000, beginning of 2008. And
2:21
I started medical school in 2009, the fall of 2009. And I'm just curious, I'm jumping ahead, so I apologize for that. But does this program still exist? Yes, the medical program still exists. So Latin American School of Medicine located in Havana, Cuba. Okay, so it's much, it's much the same as it was when you were studying. Yeah, so it's the largest medical school in the world. It's very international.
2:46
There's students from well over 150 countries throughout. It's a six year program, as my colleague mentioned in a previous episode, and it's fully funded by the Cuban government for American students. I mean, at the time we were studying there, there were different parameters as far as which students
3:04
from which countries could receive full scholarship. And as Gigi mentioned previously, at times some of the scholarships per country maxed out and some certain students had to pay a certain amount out of pocket for their medical studies, which would likely be cheaper than their home countries. And keep in mind, there are many countries globally who have lack of medical schooling or lack of specialty care. So for example, places such as Belize,
3:32
they may not have any specialists or maybe a bit more difficult to become a doctor or to go to medical school. So lots of students travel from Central America to Cuba to study medicine.
3:44
OK. It's a great, it's something, obviously, it's very much needed, especially in countries that are underserved. So, so they're doing a great service. What was it like adjusting to life and medical school in Cuba?
3:58
Well, that's a very compounded question. Because I always say in Cuba, we were living in a bubble within a bubble. And we were obviously, if you're not Cuban, then you're a foreigner, clearly. But when you're an American in Cuba, it's a different type of way of existing in Cuban society. And if you are of a particular ethnicity, in my case, African American, it's even more
4:23
particular, because many times walking down the street, folks would ask if I was from Jamaica, Venezuela, Honduras, Haiti, you just really didn't know. And then once you were more comfortable saying that you were American, and folks from Cuba, oh, Americana, mi gente,
4:43
you know, we were very well- well received. Adjusting to life in Cuba was, it's a process, in particular, it's a process for anyone if you go to any country that is not of your country of origin. So you have your culture shock and I always say Cuba is, it's very, it's very Cuban. So it has particularities from America, given its proximity to Miami, in particular Florida or just US. It's very Latino, Hispanic.
5:12
It's very Cuban itself, and it's very global. So it was, you had to really adjust to like the Cuba way and Cuban lifestyle of living, whether it's the Spanish, And I was fluent in Spanish prior to attending medical school in Cuba, but Cuban Spanish is its own particular language. And it's its own particular dialect.
5:34
And it's very fast. We were in Havana, which I always say is the New York City of Cuba. So we say La Mecánica Cubana, like the Cuban mechanics you really have to know, especially in Havana.
5:44
The word cucumber is a cucumber in the United States, but in Cuba, pepino, cucumber is the big bottle of water, a pomito de agua. So it's just learning the Cubanism or the how to be like a habanera, like a, of someone who can, you know, maneuver Havana. So it took a while to adjust to whether it's the heat and humidity because it's unlike
6:05
any heat and humidity I've ever experienced in my life. And I think Africa is warmer, it's hotter than places I've been to in Africa. It's very hot, it's very humid for many hours of the day. You know, you have to adjust to being uncomfortable, whether it's not having light, electricity for a few hours or a day, or sometimes a few days at a time, water, having to store your water, thinking about how are you going to buy your vegetables,
6:30
how are you going to store them, would you have water to clean them, would you have electricity to keep certain things that are perishable okay without, you know, if your refrigerator does not have electricity, what do you do? So it's just learning how to live a locoano, as we say, it was an adjustment. And I had spent time in South America, various countries, and I was actually in Colombia, South America,
6:54
prior to moving to Cuba. And I thought I'd be okay, because I just assumed everywhere in Latin America it's the same, and it wasn't. So no, that was a major adjustment. And little by little, you learn to adjust to the Cuban lifestyle, and then it just becomes a part of you. And then just medical school is medical school.
7:12
But Cuban medical school, it's like a different beast. You know, you're learning in Spanish. I was bilingual, Spanish is still not my first language. So you're giving presentations about biomedical pathways in Spanish, you were doing rounds in Spanish, and you know sometimes you can become self-conscious because your colleagues or our classmates, a lot of them were from Spanish-speaking countries, so of course they were more comfortable, you know, during a case presentation, presenting patients, doing rounds, etc. And you just have to learn just how to study and be uncomfortable sometimes studying or doing your rounds.
7:51
We're rounding with the team of internal medicine, a team of 15 folks with attendings, residents, fellows and medical students, where you have to wear a white coat. So in Cuba, you have to wear a uniform. It's very hot. There's most of the time no air conditioning,
8:07
depending on what unit you are, except for most of the time in the ICU, we had AC. So you had to just learn how to like, just be like, you had to be learning a lot of grit in Cuba. And I just, there are many moments of like culture shock, but that's any country you go to. But I think Cuba is a particularly different place.
8:27
And if you haven't been there, it's hard to encapsulate it until you experience it.
8:33
Yeah, I can only imagine learning, like, and it's like, it's, I don't even know how to put this into words. Like you're learning how to be a doctor, but you're also having to become fully fluent in a second language at the same time. That's like-
8:46
Yeah, and I always say, we have colleagues from Mongolia. I have colleagues from Mongolia and Cuba who end up leaving, we all end up sounding like a Cuban. So everyone, even for those who know little Spanish, by the time you finish your six or seven years there,
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you sound, you're fluent because you don't have a choice. You have to buy your groceries, you have to go pay your electricity bill, you have to study, you have to take your classes, you have to figure out how to take the bus or ask someone in walking down the street, where do I, how do I get to ABC place? So you learn and then you just become very Cubanized. Even folks in Latin America become very Cubanized. And I, even to this day,
9:29
people still think I'm Cuban when I speak Spanish.
9:31
A lot of people.
9:32
I'm not surprised. And you know, and it's just so funny because just thinking about how, just that's the most amazing way to learn any, you know, just to be dropped in a country and, you know, you don't have a choice.
9:45
You're forced to, you know, to become fluent and the benefit is that you're getting, you know, your degree in medicine as well, so.
9:54
And as like Gigi mentioned, like you're not just living in Cuba studying medicine there, you're in society. Same medical curriculum that we had, our Cuban medical colleagues who are classmates we had, and you go to folks' homes, you meet folks, we do house calls, so you're really ingrained
10:12
into the Cuban society as well, and you learn a lot of mannerisms, or you just learn a lot of cultural things you would not particularly have received if you, if I was, say if I was a foreign medical graduate who had come to medical school in the United States,
10:27
it wouldn't be similar.
10:29
Absolutely. And I just love that. I'm a retired Spanish teacher, so. I have been on my head to go to Cuba. I don't know if it'll happen.
10:39
Well, yeah, you can still go. I love Spanish, my favorite language outside of, yeah, so. But I mean, and I think that for me, the difficulty would be definitely just the accent, just the, because it's so different. Very different and of the Spanish accents from the Caribbean islands when you can consider like when you compare Cuba, Puerto Rico and Dominican of Dominican Republic, Cuban is like the fastest.
11:06
But I always say, if you can understand Cuban accent, like I can, you can understand any Spanish accent in the world. And the positive of the many positives we had is that we have colleagues from literally every country in Latin America.
11:21
So I can point out a Colombian accent, Mexican, Paraguayan, Uruguayan, Chilean, because we were interacting with our classmates and our colleagues every day. So you were hearing various accents and then you're still existing within Cuba. But yeah, we all left on the same plane.
11:38
And Havana Spanish is not like if you go to like Cienfuegos or if you go to like Santo Espiritu, if you go into, Cienfuegos or if you go to like Santo Espiritus, if you go into, we call it el interior, like so eastern parts of the island, the Spanish is clearer. It's like being in New York City and then going to Mississippi. So folks are clearer, slower, they enunciate more. It's like a New York City pace, so it's like we have to get stuff done,
12:03
let's go, what are we wasting time on? But learning that accent, you can understand it, but you'll
12:09
be fine.
12:10
Yeah. And it makes you so much stronger to just that that type of immersion just makes you so much stronger. Yeah, I mean, I mean, not just Spanish, but just like it makes you very resilient. Mm-hmm. Oh, definitely. Yeah. Hmm.
12:26
Was there a specific, was there any specific patient or moment during your training that has stayed with you?
12:33
I mean, there are lots of moments. I remember often, one of my favorite cases, and well, in Cuba, I should just say that we don't have a lot as far as medical technology and things of that sort.
12:45
So we use what our best resources are, our ears, eyes, hands, and our stethoscope. And I was on a 24 hour call when I was on internal medicine my last year there. And I had a patient and I just did a lung exam on him. And I knew that he had asthma exacerbation
13:04
also where it's superimposed pneumonia based on his symptoms that he mentioned to me, and his physical exam findings. This was even before I ordered x-rays, because in Cuba, we had to be really stringent and really cognizant of how many x-ray films or images we ordered, because we only had sometimes 10 films per shift. So the patient, and I remember him because he was actually my neighbor, he received his asthma treatment and then he left.
13:33
And I let him know, I was like, hey, I think I'm pretty sure you still have pneumonia. Let's get an x-ray for you. And he's like, no, I feel fine. And then I saw him the next day, his wife came back with him and I thought, well, he still doesn't feel well. And I was like, yes, because I told him, I think he has asthma exacerbation on top of his pneumonia. And he did. And actually, I ran into him one day going back to the hospital where he was on his bike and he saw me and he thanked me, you know, so it's so many of those instances that you recall, you remember, and it's that gives you more confidence in your clinical judgment, but that just goes to show how well
14:06
we were trained to use what at times, you know, minimal resources that we did have. But there are many, many occasions, patients, I deliver their babies, and they see me walking down the street, and they say hi, and she'll, you know, they do you remember me, you deliver me? Yeah, of course. There was another, like a patient I had. She had a twin sister, the patient actually ended up dying from lung cancer. Her twin sister was an artisan. And this is actually the artwork that she gave me my last year.
14:36
And it's also this is handmade. Yeah, so this is beautiful. Yeah. So you know, like you just little gestures like that. And you always keep them, I always keep them with me. But there's so many, there's countless instances, but those are the main ones that like still stick with me, you know, because sometimes when you're doubting yourself as far as like, because you're a new doctor, but and I was a young doctor. And I was pretty I was confident that I knew that it was an asthma exacerbation as well as pneumonia.
15:06
So that felt good.
15:07
Yeah. And then, and then I think, even though you were low on resources, I think that's another another thing that would make you stronger as a doctor, because even when you come back to the United States and you practice, you don't, you not that you can't use them, but you don't have to rely on all of those resources to do good medicine.
15:28
Yeah. And it's just because, again, we work with what we have down there. Sometimes you may not have, you know, electricity that you need to see an x-ray image or to be, you know, so you have to use what you have. Your greatest tool is always your stethoscope and your hands.
15:48
Wow, that's, that's pretty impressive. So how did the Cuban approach to medicine shape your philosophy as a doctor today?
15:56
Well, in Cuba, we go by the bio-psychosocial model, so the biological, psychological, and so model and medicine. So medicine is not just what you're coming, what symptoms you're coming with. It's biological, it's psychological, and it's social. What neighborhood do you live in? For me, I live in New York City,
16:18
or it doesn't matter where you live these days. Every time I see a patient, I always, what country did you grow up in? Because that can affect you in a multitude of ways. Where did you grow up? What country did you grow up? What neighborhood did you grow up in? What's your education level like? When's the last time you
16:36
talked to a family member? When's the last time you've gone home to see your parents or your family in the Dominican Republic? All that can affect your physical state of being. So we always keep that in mind. Is your neighborhood polluted? Is there noise pollution in your neighborhood? So we were trained that way in Cuba.
16:52
Do you live on a route where there's a lot of bus traffic? Is that air, is that the fumes from the bus in your area, et cetera, causing, making your asthma symptoms be exacerbated? So it just changed my philosophy in that way. And you always see people as like a person first, and not
17:12
as like, you know, a medical record number, you know, you always want to see them like as a person and just to get to know them and it just it just makes you like, more empathetic, you know, and you want to be like, we say in Cuba, like, doctor, like a doctor of like, like a doctor, like science and conscious. So it can't, you can't just approach medicine from just what I read in the textbook. And what I, what I read in a board exam and approach it to medicine that way, each person individualized, right? So like a holistic approach to very holistic, very integrative, you know, it's preventative medicine focus, but as holistic is integrative,
17:55
no two folks in the same home have the same experience or the same outcome, most of the time, even with the same parents. And this would be you know what I'm saying? So that's the way I approach, you know, everyone I see. Do you think any, is, I don't know how to word this, do you think that they're like, if you had done your, your education in the United States, that you would be the same doctor you are? I don't think so. I wouldn't have had the experience of living in Cuba. Like that alone, if you take medical school out of the picture, just living in Cuba for six years alone, I wouldn't be
18:32
the same person because you're three different people. All of us who went to school in Cuba, we're three different people. You have the Cuba U, I'm sorry, you have the pre-Cuba U, you have the Cuba U and the post-Cuba U. So it's impossible. It's not possible. And I would think majority of, if not all of my colleagues who I've studied with, will have similar, you know, thoughts. Okay. Well, so I'm sure you're very thankful that that that person was very insistent with you, persistent about-
19:03
Yes. If she ever hears this, yes, Stacey, yes, she changed my life.
19:06
Yes. Wow.
19:09
What's something most people don't realize about the Cuban healthcare system? Or I should say most people in the United States don't realize.
19:17
I mean, I think the humanity of it, that's a difficult question. Because it's so much that you don't realize, but you don't know. But I think the most, the most pressing thing that folks don't realize is how humanistic it is. Remember we have doctors who are all over the world. So it's just, you know, so Cuban and we have physicians that are trained all over the world from Cuba. So it's a very
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like humanistic, empathetic, not to say that American healthcare system is not, but it's just a certain Cubanismo touch to it that is really difficult to explain. But I think like the Cuban way you approach patients in medicine,
20:01
I think that's what a lot of folks may not be aware of if you don't know anyone who studied there or have not heard about the program. Mm hmm.
20:07
Okay, well, the things that I've heard about it so far, between you and Gigi, I'm just blown away by just how great it is. And, you know, not even realizing that. I mean, I knew that Cuba had an excellent educational system, but I just didn't realize the amount or the impact that they had on
20:27
worldwide healthcare. Yeah, and it's just not healthcare. I have friends from countries throughout Africa, Caribbean, who study architecture in Cuba, nursing, art, music, fine arts. You'd be surprised. So Cuba is, you'd be surprised. It's educated folks globally, just not Americans. And just, I mean, every corner of the world, most of the time, the Cuban education system has touched in some way. But the pedagogy of the healthcare system is very streamlined. It's very, it's detailed, but it's hard to see the farce through the trees until you're at the end
21:10
of your studies. It all makes sense because going into a six to seven year commitment in Cuba is not for the faint of heart and it's a long hard road. And you get to the end and then you're sad it's over because you reflect back. And we all think about every day. Yeah, it's just always in you. I'm always talking about Cuba and all like the values
21:37
and it's just everything. Most of the time when I approach a problem in life, I approach it from the angle of what would I have done in Cuba, or what did I learn from Cuba that would help me get through this. Yeah, so in Cuba there's a phrase that is no es fácil, but tampoco es difícil. So it's not easy, but it's also not difficult.
21:59
So basically you can do it. You can do, you know,
22:03
Yeah, it might be hard, but you can do it. You can do, you know. Yeah. In such a blind fit. Maybe you're not from, but you can do it.
22:08
So I understand that you've been back to Cuba several times.
22:12
Yeah.
22:13
I've been back to Cuba many times. So I do global public health teaching. So I've been fortunate enough to have a dear mentor, a colleague of mine who I actually met in Cuba. So we facilitate and me summer study abroad programs for undergraduate graduate students and medical students,
22:30
particularly in San Fuegos, Cuba. But I've been back to Havana and San Fuegos many times since graduating.
22:37
Okay.
22:38
And when you, do you go back with former, I don't wanna say, former classmates, I should say, or is it just a wide?
22:51
For our study abroad programs, it's not with classmates. I have not been back with my, you mean my American classmates or my non-American classmates or just-
22:59
Or your people that you went to school with.
23:02
Oh, so no, I haven't been back with anyone I went to school with? Oh, so no, I haven't been back with anyone I went to school with. I have been back with friends I made in Cuba just by living there.
23:14
Okay, now I know Gigi told me that, I don't remember how many years, how many years before you can go off campus and live?
23:27
Our first two years, we were in a naval base out in Santa Fe, Baracoa, which is roughly 45 minutes outside of Havana. So we were there for two years doing our basic sciences. And then after your second year, for your third and sixth year, depending on what country you're from,
23:41
will determine which part of the island you'll be based at for your final four years. So as Gigi mentioned, we were American students, mostly American students were located in Havana. Okay. And did you, did you, now maybe I, I just want to make sure I understood it correctly. So you, if you decide to, you can just live with, you can have a host family.
24:11
Is that something that's arranged by the school?
24:14
We have housing and some folks find like, you know, housing by other means, but we don't have a, it's not a host family. Like you would maybe like I had a host family when I was in Ecuador. No, it's not. No, campus housing for the most part. Okay, very nice. So, so when you were able to get off of the, you said the naval base, when you left, but it was it was a formal naval base.
24:37
Uh huh. Right.
24:38
But it was for Yes. So as you mentioned, we had, you know, we had quite a few roommates,
24:43
you know, roommates. Okay, so when you went off to your different destination, which one did you prefer? Did you prefer being with your classmates or with-
24:59
I'm a city person. I really enjoyed the final four years because I was able to see the true essence of Havana. You know, when we were on for our first two years, and we were, you know, in the outer skirts of Havana, we did have time as Gigi mentioned, to leave campus to get into the city to see
25:16
things, but it was nothing like like living and being in Havana, like the rhythm, the flow, the music, the sounds, the people, just the rhythm of the flow, the music, the sounds, the people, just the ritmo, the rhythm of the city, you just like the heartbeat. I really enjoy that.
25:30
Okay. And do you get to see some of the same, you know, when you go back for your visits, do you get to see some of those people that you met?
25:40
Of course, we all, everyone has a Cuban family, you know, Anthony Cormier is like, cool, uncle, we all have family friends. I have patients who became my family. One of my favorite patients when she was, they were brother and sister, they were 11, 12 ish or so, maybe a bit younger or older. On my one of my pediatric patients, they invited me to their birthday party. And they're still my family years later. And now they're in their 20s, you know. So I see folks, and I'm someone who really has an affinity for elderly individuals. So I had so many abuelos in Cuba, and some have moved on, and they have transitioned, which is sad. And it's hard because we don't
26:20
have that great of communication with the older folks on the island. So some folks you just don't know they're gone until you return and are there. And I still am in touch with my favorite professors, as much as I can be. A lot of them have WhatsApp or Facebook, which is nice.
26:37
Yes, I see folks all the time. And even the most unlikely person to know you will remember you because you know we always stand out we as an anyone who is not Cuban there and go back to old neighborhoods or even on campuses and folks you may not remember but they remember you you know it's nice to go back and it's nice to go back you know
26:59
having you know on the other side of medical school or residency it is nice to do that and they're very proud, always proud. So it sounds like a family reunion, like, yeah, I mean, it's always hard to not is that's just the Cuban way. I always say, you know, here in America, things are very structured. And we're all very busy.
27:17
And you have to have, you know, 25 texts between friends. And it takes three months to schedule a brunch date. One time in Cuba and I went to Havana and I got to the city late and I just went to one of my family's homes and it was one in the morning. The dog was so excited to see me and I wanted the dog to bark to wake someone up and she didn't. She just wagged her tail and I put my hand in the window and I you know just yelled, come on smile,, you know, you know, and they were like, Veronica, you're here and they turned the lights on, you know, and it was just, it's very Cuban. Like it was 1.30 in the morning, they decided to see me
27:53
and turn the lights on, of course, offer coffee. That's the Cuban way, you know, and that would
27:57
never happen here, you know, so those are the things that I'll, you know, always stick with you. That sounds amazing. And so obviously you've met other doctors during your time in Cuba. How many like how did your did your friendships grow? Like obviously you're still really
28:16
good friends with with Gigi. Do you have that same type of relationship with other doctors?
28:22
Yeah, of course. Yeah. American as well as not. I mean, for Americans, for Americans studying medicine in Cuba, you have to be a particular and special type of person. So our class, we were very close in class. I'm in a lot in contact with a lot of folks and I always say we were there during like the Cuban like gold rush, kind of. We were there right before things opened up, with Obama being when he was in the White House.
28:52
And things just flourished. It was a very exciting time to be in Cuba. So there was a lot of action. And we flourished. And those relationships continue because we are in contact with a lot of our colleagues.
29:04
So my best friend from medical school was Belizean. That's one of my, my dearest friends on earth. I vacationed in Belize last year. Anytime I want to go, I can, and I'm in contact with some, my one, another one of my best friends is British, but lives in Scotland. I met her at a really cool cafe in Havana. She's not a medical student, but we became close friends. So there's like people in places I would have never met or gone to had I not gone to Cuba. And even within the US, like if you're traveling for a residency interview, I've stayed with Gigi
29:35
when I interviewed in Los Angeles for residency. I've stayed with friends from medical school, friends from Detroit, you know, I've stayed there as well. So it just, it takes you globally. And because we have such a particular bond, it's like more familiar like, and it's just an experience that like no one else has experienced the way we have. And you can't replicate that experience. So we're just bonded no matter what. And we still reach out to each other, whether we have, you know, just advice or questions or to reminisce, we do that a lot as well. That must be so amazing to have
30:11
just global friendships. So you can just, I'm guessing here, but could you just point to a place on the map and say, Oh, hey, I could go here if I wanted to go here. I can go to Belize, Mongolia, Venezuela, Canada.
30:27
That is amazing.
30:28
Yeah, and so many places I'm just connected to because I went to school in Cuba.
30:34
Yeah, that is so cool. I mean, I would love for, I don't know, just for people in general to be able to travel that way so they could learn more about the world instead of just being in their own bubble, you know, whether it's the United States or any place, just, you
30:51
know, just so people could get an idea of how other people live. What's the biggest lesson
30:57
you've carried from Cuba into your practice today? The biggest lesson. Always listen to the patient and you know, always listen to the patient, A, but getting a good history. If you get good history, 80% of your battle is over. So a very thorough and detailed history and physical exam, that's just how we're trained. So always, always get a very thorough history and a very detailed physical, you know, but you know, and meeting the patient where they are.
31:34
Okay. If a young student said they were considering studying medicine abroad, especially in Cuba, what advice would you give them?
31:42
Just to be like very open, adaptable, malleable, you have to be able to be uncomfortable and lean into discomfort. And you know, as Americans it's hard for all of us, you know, when you want it, how you want it, when you want it, and that's just not how life functions
32:00
in Cuba, so you have to be very, very flexible as well. Yeah, I can certainly imagine how hard that would be for any American. Well, and, you know, just dealing with a different way of life, not just language, but just without the comforts of home. You don't have the comforts, the technology. We were there, it was very little technology. Cuba's a bit more technologically advanced now, but it was a time we checked internet once a week at 1230 at night.
32:38
You know, for an hour, and it was spotty, it was dial-up, you know. So you have to just learn how to have far less access to technology. But the beautiful side of that was you're talking to people more, you're in the community, you're, you know, you have to like pick up a book and read, you can't just Google what you want, you know? Things have changed there now, but during our time, it was a bit different. So we really had to lean into community, your classmates, your colleagues, and our classmates,
33:07
and particularly the first two years, we had to lean on each other a lot.
33:10
Mm-hmm.
33:11
I can imagine. Wow. Well, I can only, I guess I'm gonna just do my best to figure out how I'm gonna get there.
33:21
You should, how you recommend.
33:23
I would love to go there with you and Gigi. That would be fun. Make it happen. I'm going to work on it. Well, it's time for rapid fire questions. I have a few questions here. And let's see. I think I know the answer to this first question. I'm going to ask you coffee in the US or coffee in Cuba.
33:48
I'm going to put a twist on this Cuba and Columbia. Ah, okay, the two best. Yes, my some of my favorites.
33:59
Yes.
33:59
Mm-hmm.
34:00
Okay. So like when you're here, do you even drink coffee here? When you're even though, you even drink coffee here? I do. Even though, you know, the reason I ask is because like I know that I've gone places and I've had, for example, I remember going to Italy and having carbonara. And I don't know, you know, and then I come back here and I'm like, oh, that was so good. I'm
34:20
going to try it. And I go someplace that's highly recommended. And it's just like, this is just such a letdown.
34:26
Well, I try I mean, when I go to Cuba, obviously, I bring pubita back, which is Cuban coffee and some of my close friends who are like my dear family are Colombian. So I typically keep a nice stash of Colombian coffee around, which can hold me over. But yeah, I understand the sentiments is not the same.
34:45
Yeah, it's like chasing a high.
34:48
Yes.
34:51
What is your favorite Cuban dish?
34:54
Arroz con gris with some vianda. So con gris is like rice and beans. In Cuba it's either arroz con gris or moros y cristiano, some northern Christians. But like vianda, it's like a yuca, et cetera, with like pescado frito, like fried fish with wine.
35:10
And people like to put like little small cucumber tomato slices on your food.
35:15
Uh-huh.
35:16
Now, do you know how to make Cuban dishes? I do, yeah, but it's not the same as being there like the, yeah, I do.
35:23
Yeah. Yeah, I know what you mean. Personally, I'm not a great cook at any way to begin with, but I have tried. I know how hard it is to try and replicate something. And, but I think the good thing about that is
35:38
it's something to look forward to when you go back.
35:39
When you go back, always, yes.
35:41
Yeah.
35:42
Yeah.
35:43
How about the most surprising country that you visited?
35:50
The Gambia.
35:52
Oh, okay. In what way? How was it surprising?
35:55
I always call it Gambia. It's like the little engine that could, have you been to West Africa? No. Gambia is a very slither or tiny country that's surrounded by Senegal. And in such
36:08
they have very stark and different societies because Gambia was colonized by the British, Senegal by the French, and it's just they're very similar, but very, very different. It was just I had an experience there last summer. It was just amazing. It just it just took me by surprise when I actually really got to like, know the people learn some of the lingo and there's so many languages spoken there. So I knew a little Wolof, a little Seren, you know, to get around,
36:36
but it was a very, it's very beautiful. But it's just very, it's very, it was a very surprising country for sure. Yeah. Wow. And, you know, this is just so amazing to listen to this. You're so well rounded and just all of these great experiences that you've had. Thank you. It's really nice to listen to.
37:00
What is the passport stamp that you're most proud of?
37:05
Cuba.
37:07
Yes.
37:08
Because you worked hard for that one. I worked hard. We all worked very hard. Six years is not easy anywhere. Six years in Cuba is definitely not easy. And we've all, you know, it wasn't an easy road.
37:19
But looking back, you know, it's one of, like, the most transformative, like, experiences I've had. And it definitely, you know, I is one of like the most most transformative like experiences I've had. And it definitely, you know, shaped who I am. So I'm very proud of multiple Cuban passports. Now, as you should be, I mean, just imagine like, it's, it's one thing, it's tough enough going to medical school, in
37:37
Europe, in your native language, and to compound it with, with a
37:43
second language is just.
37:46
And just, we're not even talking about coming home in the summers and bringing four 100 pound suitcases
37:51
to Cuba.
37:52
Oh my goodness.
37:53
Bringing textbooks, you're bringing clothes, computers, things for loved ones, toiletries. And most of us were not going home, you know, in this during the school year. So I would go to Cuba in August or September and not come back to the United States until July, the following year, you know. I remember one time I was packing, she was like, why are
38:17
you packing so many tubes of toothpaste? Is there nothing in Cuba? I was like, you know, I have to pack this way because I'm not coming back. And there's not access to the same resources that we have here. So it was a tough road. You know, we had to clear through customs,
38:35
you know, through various countries. A lot of us had to travel through Mexico to go to Cuba. So you're clearing customs twice with 400 pounds of luggage and you're answering the same questions and you're worried about missing your flight. If you miss your flight, you're stuck in Mexico, you're stuck in Cancun for a day and that money adds up, you know, and as you're not seeing your family.
38:54
So it's a sacrifice. You miss funerals. I miss, you know, a dear loved one passed away while I was there. I couldn't come home. You miss birth, you miss parties, things happen. You miss things culturally, it's the cultural gap. Even now, when I, some music I hear and my friends are like, oh, this is the, you know, this is our song back in the day. And I was like, did this come out between 2009 and 2015? Because that's why I don't know, some of the cultural references I don't know, or my friends have to fill me in because we're not here. That is wild. I never I didn't even think of that. It's a huge sacrifice for your family as well. And then like, because they don't
39:30
really know you because you change so much the more you come back each summer. And so you your family's trying to get to know you, but you you're this different person, but you're you, but not really. And it's very interesting. Yeah, so that's my most proud passport stamp, because I worked very hard for that.
39:53
Oh my goodness. That is just, yeah, I hadn't even thought about the fact that you would have to be there for so long.
40:00
Yeah, some folks, remember we have classmates who came from as far as Solomon Islands, Vanuatu, flights home three or $4,000, can't afford that. So some folks stay for a year or two before they can even go home and see their family members.
40:17
That wasn't the case for us, luckily, because we're our proximity to, the US is proximity to Cuba, but you have to keep that all that in mind, you know, is so and you really have to rely on like Cubans, because or if you don't, if you run out of your funds, and you don't, you know, no one's sending you funds. One
40:35
time I didn't have any sugar. neighbor gladly gave me a half a pound of sugar, you know, so things like that, like my partner, I remember I was, you know, financially stretched for a little while. $3, that $3 felt like 300 at the time, you know, tying with $3 in Cuba, you could buy a lot of stuff. Yeah, man, that is just, just listening to this makes me, I just want to be transported. I mean, we were there doing a very special time, you know, things are different there now, obviously, given,
41:06
you know, the thing, the state of the world, post COVID, post COVID, etc. So we were there on a very special, special, it was a special time to be there for sure for our class.
41:17
Wow. Such great memories. And yeah. Let's see one last question I have.
41:25
Who was your most fun travel buddy? Let's see, one last question I have for you.
41:28
Who was your most fun travel buddy? Myself.
41:29
That's amazing, I love it, I love it.
41:32
Yeah, so most of the time, I'm a solo traveler, most of the time, unless I'm doing like, study abroad groups, but I am my most fun travel buddy.
41:43
That is great.
41:44
I'm going to see my friends in other countries, which is basically the people I met in Cuba, you know, that I visit globally, or just other countries I'd like to go to as well.
41:53
Well, you can always depend on yourself. That's for sure, you know? That's great.
41:58
It's true.
41:59
Well, I thank you so much for the opportunity to talk to you about Cuba. And I'm hoping that we can, I don't know if it'll be possible, because I told Gigi she's always welcome back to come and talk to me. I would love to have the two of you together.
42:14
I would absolutely enjoy that. So let's make it happen.
42:17
Yeah, for sure. Let's do it. Yes, I appreciate it. I really appreciate it. It was wonderful talking to you. You as well. Thank you so, so much. Thank you. Thank you for tuning in to Nostalgic Travel Talks. I hope today's episode inspired you to dive deeper into your next journey.
42:34
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