Are Trump & Musk the COUNTER-ELITES? w/ Derrick Broze

Join me for an important discussion with Derrick Broze.

Follow Derrick's work at https://theconsciousresistance.com/

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What is Man in America Podcast?

Seth Holehouse is a TV personality, YouTuber, podcaster, and patriot who became a household name in 2020 after his video exposing election fraud was tweeted, shared, uploaded, and pinned by President Donald Trump — reaching hundreds of millions worldwide.

Titled The Plot to Steal America, the video was created with a mission to warn Americans about the communist threat to our nation—a mission that’s been at the forefront of Seth’s life for nearly two decades.

After 10 years behind the scenes at The Epoch Times, launching his own show was the logical next step. Since its debut, Seth’s show “Man in America” has garnered 1M+ viewers on a monthly basis as his commitment to bring hope to patriots and to fight communism and socialism grows daily. His guests have included Peter Navarro, Kash Patel, Senator Wendy Rogers, General Michael Flynn, and General Robert Spalding.

He is also a regular speaker at the “ReAwaken America Tour” alongside Eric Trump, Mike Lindell, Gen. Flynn.

Seth Holehouse: 00:13

Welcome to Man in America. I'm your host, Seth Holehouse. Obviously, Trump getting in with the power of Elon, the money behind them, the technology, the young kids running the Doge operation are making significant changes in our society here in America. And I'm seeing a lot of amazing amazing things happening. Looks like the Department of of Education is being stripped down bare.

Seth Holehouse: 00:41

The entire world is now being exposed to the massive corruption that is USAID. I hope they continue to expose the corruption of the health care, the Medicaid, Medicare entitlements, let alone the Pentagon, the military industrial complex. It's absolutely wonderful. However, however, I wanna pull up a quote from one of the most important people in our history, which is Thomas Jefferson who said the price of freedom is eternal vigilance. Now there have been a lot of individuals that are trying still to raise red flags and saying, look, folks, don't get too excited.

Seth Holehouse: 01:15

We have to still be watching what's happening. And what I'm seeing is that these people, folks like Whitney Webb or Katherine Austin Fitz or my guest today, Derek Rose, people are very quickly rushing to say they're black pilled. They're black pilled. And it I can't help but be reminded of the fact that the labeling of information like this goes back to the CIA and their creation of the label of conspiracy theorists. How are we gonna get people to not question the JFK assassination?

Seth Holehouse: 01:41

Oh, we'll call them all conspiracy theorists. And, obviously, that expanded to if you're anybody that questions any particular narrative, whether it's nine eleven, any kind of shootings that happen, the vaccine and big pharma industry, you're labeled as a conspiracy theorist. Now look. I'm not what I would consider a black pilled person. I'm actually a really happy person.

Seth Holehouse: 02:01

The thing is is that I don't take any pills. Right? Like, I'm not a pill kind of guy. I just am what I am, and I take, you know, natural healthy things and nicotine as for Brian Arndest, but I'm not a pill guy. And I think that it's really dangerous if we get placed into these buckets where we're not willing to look at certain types of information and at least give it a chance to to analyze it and think about it before we put it into some sort of bucket, like, that's black pill information.

Seth Holehouse: 02:28

I'm not gonna look there. And, look, as a journalist and as the host of Man in America, I believe it's my job to expose you to different opinions. Because if I was just feeding you one pipeline, if if now that Trump's in office, if I just became a journalist that is only gonna be, you know, rue rue for Trump, and I'm only gonna be telling you, hey. This is what the White House is doing. Here's the official press release.

Seth Holehouse: 02:52

I'm not doing my job. I have to continue to question everything. Now, again, I still have hope for this country. I have a lot of hope in what Trump is doing. I have lot of hope in what Elon Musk is doing.

Seth Holehouse: 03:03

However, as per mister Jefferson and I'm making you proud, mister Jefferson, I am still being eternally vigilant. I'm questioning the fact that, you know, Trump brings out on day two or three Larry Ellison in project Stargate. The guy Ellison who's, you know, steeped in in in heavily in with this background in working very closely with the CIA, to the, you know, point that they're now talking about AI developed vaccines. It's like, oh, wait. Oh, they're gonna solve cancer.

Seth Holehouse: 03:33

Oh, they're gonna solve the cancer that the previous mRNA vaccines have been causing turbo cancer cases. Okay. That doesn't make sense to me. So it's our responsibility to question things and to remain vigilant. And so my guest today, Derek, is someone that will commonly be thrown in the bucket of being black pilled, right, along with, say, Whitney Webb or Katherine Austin Fitz.

Seth Holehouse: 03:54

These people that I think actually are raising very, very important points. But my own perspective is that I wanna be able to listen to all the different viewpoints and then come to where I feel comfortable and make my own decisions. So I wanna hear what they have to say because I wanna be watching these things. If I see Trump, you know, starting to push forward more initiatives and executive orders that, in my opinion, are closer to us being in some sort of biometric digital monitoring state, I'm gonna oppose that. I'm not just gonna take it and say, well, if Trump's doing it, we're okay with it.

Seth Holehouse: 04:28

I need to know what's going on so that I know exactly what to put my support behind and exactly what I'm gonna be resisting and becoming very loud about resisting, and I hope the same is for you. So I'm doing this interview. There is a certain risk of me now being considered black pilled for even having this conversation. And look, if I'm now a black pillar, please let me know in the comments. I look forward to reading those comments, but I just feel like it's my duty to bring different perspectives to you because you have the ability to listen to different angles and make your own decisions.

Seth Holehouse: 04:59

I'm not forcing you to believe anything, and that's the beauty of it is that you have your own independent will where you can take this information, analyze it, and see what's right. And if you wanna look at this and say, you know what? I'm done with Seth. You know, he's now an anti Trumper. Well, I think you've misinterpreted things because I'm actually not.

Seth Holehouse: 05:16

But if that's your perspective, hey. Great. You know, you can go find someone else that's gonna tell you exactly what you wanna hear. But if anything, I hope that you can watch this interview and walk away with this perspective of saying, that's a good point. I'm gonna make sure that I'm eternally vigilant about those things.

Seth Holehouse: 05:30

One other issue is that the, for some reason, the video signal with Derek coming in was out of sync with his audio for some of the time. So I apologize in advance. There's no way for me to really correct that post because it's it's kinda sporadic instead of one kind of consistent thing. So I do apologize if there are some parts of the interview where Derek's audio isn't completely synced up with his, video. However, the audio should be perfect, so you should be able to get the full effect of the interview.

Seth Holehouse: 05:55

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Seth Holehouse: 06:20

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Seth Holehouse: 06:32

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Seth Holehouse: 07:06

So, again, that's goldwithseth.com or [phone]. Mister Derek Brose, it's an honor to have you on the show. Thank you very much for joining me today.

Speaker 2: 07:19

Hey. Thank you for having me on. I appreciate it.

Seth Holehouse: 07:21

Absolutely. So you are, I would say, a true independent thinker, which I have so much respect for. And you have been well, actually, I first came across you. You did an interview with Ian Carroll, and it was kind of one of these discussions about, you know, is Trump the lesser of two evils? Is it okay to have that approach even?

Seth Holehouse: 07:42

Because, obviously, I think most people didn't wanna have Kamala coming in for four years and, you know, who knows what else. But, there have been a group of people, yourself, Whitney Webb, Catherine Austin Fitz, that have been, I think, in a lot of ways sounding the alarm and saying, look. Don't get swept up by the doge and all the the great things that are happening because we could also be, you know, being taken advantage of, and they could be constructing something that is not good for our future. And I think that the reason why I wanted to have you on is that it's important for us to stay vigilant. Right?

Seth Holehouse: 08:15

It goes back to founding this country, you know, the the the importance of eternal vigilance. And I really respect, again, people like yourself that are willing to go out there and and raise these issues even though you're saying, oh, you're black pilled or whatever. We still have to listen to this perspective and just keep an eye on things. And so, anyway, I'll let you introduce yourself first, and then we can get into that that discussion.

Speaker 2: 08:37

Yeah. Thank you for that. And I think I've probably been called black pilled more than I have in the last fifteen years in the last six months because of what you were just stating there. So, yeah, I mean, I appreciate the introduction. I've been doing independent media for going on about fifteen, sixteen years now, I really kind of came from an activist background.

Speaker 2: 08:56

I didn't go to journalism school or really have any plans of doing this whenever I was going to college or anything like that. It really came about from me getting into activism in 02/2009, '2 thousand '10. And then after a couple of years of doing the usual activist things, protests, marches, passing out flyers, I lived in an activist house for a few years, and we would do everything from community garden builds, trying to teach people skills to, as I said, information, trying to spread info and reach the local population in Houston, Texas, where I'm originally from. And after doing that for a couple years, we did have some successes. We were actually the only city in The United States to kick the TSA off the buses.

Speaker 2: 09:38

They tried to bring the TSA from the airport to the bus line, and we successfully organized and kicked them out in 2012. We started to make the local media make the news, and it wasn't long before I realized that they weren't doing a great job. And, you know, for example, one time we made the news because a Houston police department officer pulled a shotgun on us, a group of about 50 unarmed people, and arrested me. And this became a viral story in the city. And the way the media reported was that a local group of conspiracy theorists surrounded the police and, you know, did all sorts of made us try to sound like we were dangerous or violent.

Speaker 2: 10:11

And really quickly, realized like, okay. I can't count on these people to tell our story or tell my story or really to ask the hard questions to the politicians. And so I just started picking up a camera and started going to the Federal Reserve, started going to press conferences, getting kicked out of press conferences and doing what I just was kind of mimicking what I was seeing other activists at the time, do on the Internet, just confronting politicians. And then after a couple years, really started to take it seriously, and I launched the Conscious Resistance website in 2013 as a home for my my investigative journalism, my podcast interviews, and then eventually my books and documentaries. And, really, you know, I'm I'm a guy who's interested in sort of conspiracies, if you will, con corrupt government corruption, historical corruption, things of that sort.

Speaker 2: 10:56

Also interested in, you know, the the spiritual world and the world beyond the five senses, interested in, you know, some of the more esoteric side of things. And for me, the conscious resistance was kind of a a place to bring those ideas together to do real fact based hard hitting investigative journalism and just to explore any sort of weird topic that I might get a, you know, wild hair to look into. And and yeah. So I've been doing that since 2013, and it's led me all kinds of different places, as I mentioned, writing books and and doing documentaries and doing public speaking more recently. And, yeah, but it all kinda comes back to that root of of activism.

Speaker 2: 11:31

And And I will also mention that the reason I call the website and the book series and the movement, if you will, The Conscious Resistance, is because my work is definitely an exploration of the intersection of liberty, individual liberty, and as well as the search for liberty, I think, in the kind of internal spiritual realm. And the reason that that was important for me is because my, you know, my political awakening, conspiratorial awakening, if you will, came about in 02/2010. I, read Ron Paul Ron Paul's book, Revolution Manifesto, read Jim Marr's book, Rule by Secrecy, watched Alec Jones', Endgame. This is 02/2010. And also was listening to some music that was kind of anti government at the time.

Speaker 2: 12:16

And, like, all of these things were sort of coalescing at once, and that caused me to really change and shift my worldviews. I was never really a young kid that was trusting of the government generally. You know, I come from like a punk metal background. So it was sort of like, yeah, f the government, but not really any sort of deep philosophical, understanding of it. But with time and with diving deeper into these topics, that's you know, that was sort of part of my awakening.

Speaker 2: 12:39

But prior to that, about five years before that, when I was 20 years old, I got addicted to crystal meth and I went to prison, got locked up, spent some time in a meth house, spent some time homeless on the streets and got myself sober, but it was still kind of in that drug world and ended up getting arrested. And between 02/2005 and October 2008, I did nineteen months in Texas state prisons. And it was really that experience that first kind of caused me to start waking up, if you will, in a more spiritual way, where I started to, you know, open up to God and spirituality for the first time and meditation and prayer and had a really big, influence from my grandmother who was sending me books about these topics and kind of really was a lifeline for me while I was in that space and starting to do some reflection on like, where am I headed? You know, what what am I gonna do with my life? This is definitely not what I wanna do.

Speaker 2: 13:30

And so, yeah, that was really my first awakening, I think. And then when I got out of prison in October 2008 as a felon, now I had this fun experience of being judged as a felon, can't get jobs certain places, can't get rent certain places, can't get house in certain places, things like that. I would spend a lot of time at the library, applying for jobs, and it was in that library that one day I checked out a book that was about the history of the drug war, and that was one of the first That was the first book I ever voluntarily took notes on just because I was so enthralled by the topic, especially because I had just come out from being charged with drug charges as part of the drug war. And that was like the first seed of something in 02/2009 where I was like, okay, this is not the version of history that I heard when I was in high school or college about why drugs are illegal or how that whole drug war started and all those sort of things. And from there, my interest was piqued.

Speaker 2: 14:20

And as I said, I kind of went on to discover these other bits of information. But I share that part of my story because I think it is important and it's intrinsic to my message that I don't think that the struggle or the fight that we're in is only one of the physical realm. Obviously, there's lot of importance there, exposing governmental and corporate corruption and the physical manifestations of power, and that is what my journalism focuses on. But I also recognize and and try to encourage others to recognize that there is a a deeper struggle as well, what I often call our internal tyrant, the fight against our own internal tyrant, our doubts, our fears, insecurities, and limiting beliefs, and things of that sort, can hold us back. And, yeah, the exploration of that is what I call the conscious resistance.

Seth Holehouse: 15:06

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Seth Holehouse: 16:22

Man, what a what a story. I'm I'm sure you condensed a lot of information into that, and I couldn't agree more. I mean, especially on the point of just the the spiritual battle because to me, it's the only way that I can frame all of this. Like, because I've also done you know, I've got a shelf, you know, whole, you know, kind of library full of the the Jim Mars and, you know, the the a lot of more esoteric things and the, you know, Sprigmeyer and, you know, just that that search for, okay, what does the pyramid structure look like? Who's controlling it?

Seth Holehouse: 16:50

And and the more I dive into it, the more I realize that it's not just this centralized thing. There's all these different factions, and they're playing against each other, and there's, you know, there's it's they're we're just pawns in this in this giant war. But the only way that I've been to make sense of it all of it is to realize that, yeah, at the the tip of the pyramid is just evil. It's just pure evil. Right?

Seth Holehouse: 17:10

You may call it Satan. You may call it whatever you want, but it it is a battle, I believe, of of good versus evil, and the fate of the souls. Every soul on this Earth is is, I think, is part of this bigger battle right now in terms of where we end up. And so it's it's as I mentioned earlier, I've I'm seeing this this term black pill, right, being thrown around. And when I was reflecting on it as I'm, you know, with my wife that I find there's people that they have a a very, I think, very, rational perspective.

Seth Holehouse: 17:42

You know, Whitney Webb, she seems to be the person that has the biggest black pill target on her back, that she'll come out and say something and, you know, like, even recently, she put a tweet out basically saying, hey. Look. Everyone that's saying, yeah. We're destroying the deep state. You don't realize it's just changing forms, and you you look in the comment section, and everyone's like, oh, don't be a don't be a downer.

Seth Holehouse: 18:01

You're so black pilled. And and I I think that it's it's important that we to listen to people like her. Even if someone doesn't wanna agree with it, at least listen to it. Because whenever we get into a place where we create a label and we say this kind of information is this label, therefore, I'm not gonna look at it, It's no different than the CIA creating the, know, conspiracy theorist term. And that way, anything they don't want us to look at, they say, oh, that's a conspiracy theory, and it keeps the public from looking there.

Seth Holehouse: 18:32

And so, anyway, I wanna dive into that more with you, but I guess what are your what are your thoughts on that?

Speaker 2: 18:38

Yeah. I mean, I think that's a a great way to to frame the conversation because I I would assume most of this audience and anybody hearing this is gonna be familiar with or been a victim of being labeled a conspiracy theorist for questioning the status quo, and we understand how that is I mean, not only do we have the CIA documents, post JFK talking about using that term conspiracy theorist as a way to diminish people's, standing in, you know, in civil society, if you will. And, that same thing is is as you you perfectly outlined, is being used against people like Whitney, myself, Catherine. I'd also mentioned Ryan Christian. Most of people we're working with in the Independent Media Alliance, I think, are are taking flack in their, you know, sort of respective corners of the Internet because of asking questions.

Speaker 2: 19:24

And I don't think that I I mean, if we're gonna even have this term black pilled, I guess I would redefine it or try to more clearly define it from what people are saying, which basically what what people who are throwing that at myself and Whitney are saying is, I don't like what you're saying. You're negative. You're so you must be wrong. Right? That's pretty much it.

Speaker 2: 19:43

They're not actually debating the facts or, you know, even responding to the information we're presenting. And I think it's because largely they can't, because they can't deny that we're pointing out the influence of Peter Thiel and these other people, that are very obvious to anybody who looks and we're not making things up. We're not, you know, using some sort of secret anonymous sources. We're using publicly available data to show these facts, and that makes some people uncomfortable who I think would like to believe only the narrative. As you said earlier, surely there are some good things that people will celebrate, including myself who is very, you know, not a bunch of Trump supporter in any way and not optimistic about Trump.

Speaker 2: 20:21

But sure. Do I did I celebrate the night Ross Ulbrich was freed? Of course. I was there in the courtroom when Ross was sentenced to two life sentences. I've been a friend of his mother's for over a decade now watching and being a part of the fight to get him freed.

Speaker 2: 20:34

So, you know, thank you Donald Trump for freeing Ross Ulbrich. You know, I I don't think he did it because it was something he really particularly cared about. I think there's certain things what I've been kind of promoting and sharing on my my pages and channels, like, especially right after the election is that I believe there is, and I think this is already playing out, that there are gonna be some very quick easy wins for Trump in these first few weeks. We're three weeks in now, and I think that that bears out. But at the same time, despite those easy wins, which don't cost Trump much political capital and, you know, he's not really taking a lot of heat for, the other things that myself and Whitney are pointing out, the sort of technocratic influence within his administration, which is very big and, pretty obvious if you're paying attention, that that side of things is continuing to march forward while everyone is well, let's look at what Doge is doing or JFK files are coming or Ross Ulrich got freed or Trump ended the TikTok ban, which, by the way, I think was just some kind of sigh up.

Speaker 2: 21:31

I mean, I'm not on TikTok, I have friends who are on, and they told me that it was down for a total of fourteen hours. And then whenever it came back on, the CEO of TikTok had a, you know, welcome back USA. Thanks, president Trump. And, of course, he was sitting right there with the other big tech oligarchs, at Trump's inauguration. So, you know, I I I generally think that, sure, there's gonna be some positives, and, I I will, you know, be objective and acknowledge those when when and where they happen.

Speaker 2: 22:00

But I also am very skeptical as I think most people should be. And generally speaking, if I have any kind of bias, especially as a journalist, it is an authority bias, like an anti authority bias. Like, you know, I think and that to me, that's what all journalism should be. I think all journalism should be adversarial to people in power. Again, doesn't mean we can't acknowledge if something positive happens, but I don't think we should just take official statements from the White House or from intelligence agencies and say, hey.

Speaker 2: 22:29

Look. They said this. We're gonna repeat it. Take those press releases and then report them as news. That's what the establishment media has done for generations.

Speaker 2: 22:37

And it seems like some people right now in the sort of Trump universe would prefer if those in independent media like myself and Whitney and others would just stick with the party line and not ask too deep of questions. Or another kind of extension I've heard about this even just today as Robert F. Kennedy Jr. Was confirmed at HHS is just let them have their wins. Just let them have their celebration or whatever.

Speaker 2: 23:02

And sure, I guess there's an argument for that. Have your day, have your celebration. But at the same time, guess from my point of view is if people are celebrating things that are not what they appear to be, or if they're celebrating things that also include Like there's a part of that puzzle. So just to zero in on the RFK thing. RFK nominated, now he is the head of the HHS.

Speaker 2: 23:27

People are thinking, you know, this is gonna be good for the truth about vaccines, and it may well be. I have friends who are in the fluoride fight, which I've been reporting on for, you know, several years now as one of the only journalists in the courtroom reporting on the fluoride lawsuit that are very hopeful. And according to some sources I have, close to RFK, like that is gonna be a focus of his. Right? Those are things that I would celebrate.

Speaker 2: 23:49

But also you have to look at the fact that the deputy secretary at HHS, Jim O'Neill, comes from the Thiel Foundation, comes from the Thiel Fellowship, and likely, as Whitney has reported recently, will be in that position to potentially stifle. Like, if you take the pure object the pure view that RFK is, you know, coming in with good intentions, good heart, all that stuff. Well, the the case might end up being that Jim O'Neill is there to stifle anything that he might wanna do that goes against the, broader technocratic picture. I'm skeptical of RFK in general. You know, at his confirmation hearings, he said that he trusts the childhood schedule.

Speaker 2: 24:25

And people are telling me again, you're black pilled, Derek. He's just saying what he needs to say to get into office. And that may well be that's why I'm not very good at politics, because I just think that if you have the truth, and in this case, we know the truth, the vaccine schedule for children is atrocious and is part of the problem, is the problem, I wouldn't go there and say, hey. No. I'm I'm okay with the childhood schedule.

Speaker 2: 24:47

I trust vaccines. I just want, you know, better science and stuff like that. And so maybe that's maybe I'm just maybe this is where me being black pilled comes in, and I can't see the forest for the trees. This is what I've been told by some people. It's like, no.

Speaker 2: 24:58

You just can't see. He has to lie and kind of keep himself undercover so he can get in there, and then he's gonna disrupt things. Obviously, we're about to find out, but I remain very skeptical about that. And I I also think just on that to kinda make that last point a little more fine. Like, I do think that when we have truth and bringing it back to the spiritual side of things, when we have truth on our side, we need to stand strong in that truth.

Speaker 2: 25:21

You know? And if that means we, quote, unquote, lose in their game, that to me is more important than winning by compromising ourselves and saying, okay. Well, I won. I become part of the machine, and I'm gonna sort of try to do some good piece you know, little crumbs here and there, do some good work. But in the process, I've, you know, compromised myself or compromised my principles and values.

Speaker 2: 25:43

And I I think you know, I also have other problems with RFK as far as the Zionism and things like that, but I hope that some good happens. I'm not here saying these things or reporting on these things because I want everything to be bad all the time. Like, and at the same time, I mean, I did have a conversation yesterday with a friend sort of asking myself aloud, like, if this was what people genuinely believe it is, the golden age of America and, you know, we're about to have all this disclosure and truth being revealed, would I be capable of recognizing that? You know? I'm I'm self aware enough to ask that to myself and say, okay.

Speaker 2: 26:18

Am I would I be capable? I don't currently trust what's happening right now, and I think for good reason, and I have data to back that up. It's not just, oh, something feels bad. My gut says something, which, you know, sometimes your gut can be right too, but I'm going off facts. But, you know, I do have the self awareness to step back and say, if this was what people believe it is, would I be capable of seeing it?

Speaker 2: 26:36

And I think I would. I just don't think it's what we, you know, are being told right now.

Seth Holehouse: 26:41

I also think that one of the big things working against us is just looking at, you know, like Stockholm syndrome or or just the the psychology behind psychological operations and where we've been at for the, say, the patriot or the truth or community. You know, there's this feeling like we've been under attack for four years. Our country's been under attack. It's been, you know, bled dry. We've got the open borders, and there's a sense of, finally, the hero is here.

Seth Holehouse: 27:07

Finally, like, it's it's our turn, and look at Elon Musk. Wow. The one of the billionaires is finally on our side, and, I think that also can create a lot of blind spots. Right? Because it's very easy to manipulate someone in that situation.

Seth Holehouse: 27:21

Right? Say you're in a in a prison camp for four years, and all of a sudden, you know, the general shows up, and he's like, we're gonna free you. And, you know, what if that general is also a dictator, and he's just gonna take you from one camp to another camp? It's it's that situation that we have to be so vigilant about, and that's, again, that's why I think that these conversations have to happen. And and for me, I feel very optimistic about a lot of things happening, but a lot of my optimism actually, there's one book I always keep at my desk now.

Seth Holehouse: 27:50

You've probably read it, The Crowd by Gustave LeBron. Right? And there's this I I read this, you know, passage, you know, so many times. There's this one thing in the very beginning, which I think I have my my bookmark file. Anyway, basically, what he says in here in talking about what what is the most important thing actually, here it is right here, and, like, what actually creates lasting change in society.

Seth Holehouse: 28:13

He says, the destinies of nations are elaborated at present in the heart of the masses and no longer in the councils of the of princes. And it was through this research understanding that, actually, the the thing that determined the fate of the country was truly the people. And that's why the propaganda, the social engineering, the Edward Bernays following a lot of his work has been so critical in making sure that the will of the people can always be co opted. And so I I do think that, again, that's why having these discussions is so important because what gives me hope is that if enough people can see through and see the truth, but ultimately realize that our own freedom is on us. Right?

Seth Holehouse: 28:53

And that's what, like, know so your book here, how to opt out of the technocratic state, it this is this is it. It's it's about personal responsibility because I think that if we get stuck into a place where we are relying on some sort of politician or something at the federal level to give us our freedom, we've already given up our freedom. And I think that that's that's one thing that I'm trying to do within my own life. You know, we live out. We've got a small homestead.

Seth Holehouse: 29:19

We're out in the country surrounded by forest. I'm a big believer in the second amendment, you know, and being being sustainable, growing our own food, producing our food, knowing how to preserve it, knowing how to fix things if they break, all these kinds of things. To me, that's where true freedom lies. And so as much as I think that maybe the fact that I've lived a life like this, and and my wife and I created a life where we have a lot of control, it allows me to be more, I think, objective about what's happening in DC, what's happening, because I'm not placing all of my hope on on that. And so, anyway, I'll I'll I'll pass it back over to you.

Seth Holehouse: 29:54

Yeah. What you think.

Speaker 2: 29:55

I think that's a that's a a major, important point that you point out there is that the more free actually, in in the the how to opt out of the technocratic state, there is something in there that I call the freedom equation. And I'll just mention that everybody can download the book for free if they want if they wanna pick up the PDF first and decide if you wanna buy it at the consciousresistance.com/howto. There's also a free audio book there that you can listen to, and it's available in Spanish, French, and German. In there, I talk about this freedom formula. And basically, what it comes down to is that you take your level of desired freedom.

Speaker 2: 30:32

So, you know, what is it that you're actually trying to get? And, of course, to even get to that point, you have to have the self awareness to even know what does freedom mean to you. Right? So the there's, like, kind of a foundational conversation there. What does freedom mean to you?

Speaker 2: 30:45

What does liberty mean to you? Get to understand that. And then from there, get to understand what does that mean in my life? Like, you named a few things. Okay.

Speaker 2: 30:52

Having land, being able to take care of my food supply as much as possible, being able to repair things in my home, like being as independent. Right? That'll look different for each person, but I encourage people to, like, get to know that. What does freedom look like to you? Be specific.

Speaker 2: 31:04

Write this down. You know? If you're artist, draw it. Like, really be able to visualize and see what it is that you're after. So you take what your vision of freedom looks like, and you add that to what you're willing to do to get that.

Speaker 2: 31:18

Obviously, like, this is gonna vary person to person as well. And somebody might say, I have this vision of having a homestead and homeschooling my children and, you know, clean water and organic food and all these sort of things. But right now, I'm living in an apartment in the city with minimum income, and it it feels very far, away. But that's where that second part of the equation comes in. What are you willing to do to get it?

Speaker 2: 31:39

Well, maybe you're willing to work double shifts at your crappy job you have right now. Maybe you're willing to spend the weekends volunteering at a community garden or urban farm so you can get some of that experience in the meantime before you get to the homestead. Right? Like, really being able to think about what it is that you are willing to put your self, your body, your mind, your heart, your family, etcetera, through to get to that level of freedom that you desire. And you add these two things together, what your level of freedom is plus what you're willing to do to get it, and that equals your actual experience of freedom.

Speaker 2: 32:12

What you actually are willing to put in is what you're going to get out. And I think it seems so obvious when we really break it down like that, but I don't think we've been thinking in those terms as simply and as clear in those terms, maybe. People kind of have this abstract idea of, yeah, want freedom and I wanna be free to be left alone. I think which is what many of us want, or I want freedom to, you know, just pursue my happiness, whatever that looks like. But if you can recognize that it is in your hands, as you said, that this is still it's all up to you.

Speaker 2: 32:41

I mean, for the most part, the government isn't going to hand you your freedom. Like, there are some big things that government can do through executive action, which I think is a whole another conversation. Because I remember not too long ago when conservatives and libertarians and more right leaning folks recognized that giving presidents this power for executive orders and executive action could lead some pretty bad places. And now it seems like it's something we celebrate. Like, let's celebrate unilateral action by the president instead of going through congress or, you know, consulting the people, etcetera.

Speaker 2: 33:11

As long as it's something we think is good for us, we celebrate executive action. I think that's another kind of hypocrisy. But recognizing that for the most part, your freedom, your liberty is going to come through your own hands, through your own heart, through your own mind, your creator, and what you put into that. You know, this is why I very much have been against these ideas of trusting the plan, q QAnon, or waiting for Trump or any of these sort of things that really at the heart of it teach people to sit around and do nothing and just expect that politics is gonna fix everything. So even if we take the, you know, most charitable view of Donald Trump and his second administration and all the Peter Thiel acolytes in there, which currently number, I think, 10 to 12, and really truly believe that, okay, Trump is who he claims to be.

Speaker 2: 33:58

He's out here to save the day, which wants to make America great again, and he's got all these negative forces going against him. Even if that is your perspective, which I'm sure some people believe that, he won't be able to fix everything for you. So even at the best case scenario, the most charitable case to him, you are still going to have to take care of your own life. Like, sure, Trump could maybe do certain things that lighten the load at the grocery store or at the gas tank and things like that, and sure, celebrate those things. But at the end of the day, he is not going to lead you to liberty.

Speaker 2: 34:27

You know? If anything, he can maybe, or a president, just broadly speaking, can do some things that might make it easier. But overall, the power remains in your hands. And that's largely what how to opt out of the technocratic state is about. I I've been, as I've mentioned earlier, as an investigative journalist, focusing on digital technology, privacy, surveillance, pretty much for the bulk of my career.

Speaker 2: 34:50

Like, I realized early on that this was something I wanted to focus on. And so when I started writing that book in 2019, it was first published in January 2020, and then we updated it in 2022 sort of with, six new chapters post COVID edition. And, when I was writing it in late twenty nineteen, though, I it was at the time, there was digital rights groups and lawyers warning about the rise of facial recognition, which has continued. And currently The United States only has one state that even has any sort of protections against facial recognition, that's Illinois. And the book was sort of partially a warning of like, hey, guys, this is what's coming.

Speaker 2: 35:26

I was talking about things that are a little bit more commonplace now, like warning about AI, warning about social credit scores. We didn't have the terminology for vaccine passports yet, but digital IDs and these sorts of things. And really just outlining how these tools when combined, as we see in China and India and increasingly around the world, that these can be tools for a techno tyranny, a digital tyranny. And then also looking at the history of the technocratic, movement in The United States and in Canada, which was at its heyday in the nineteen thirties and nineteen forties. And, essentially, these technocrats, they wanted to get rid of the political class as well as the business class.

Speaker 2: 36:03

They thought that democracy didn't work. They also thought, like, the capitalists aren't able to fix all our problems. So instead, what we should have is we should have the engineers running society. We should have the technological and scientific elite managing things, and they talk.

Seth Holehouse: 36:16

Wasn't there some famous guy's grandfather that was the head of the the tetradical society in Canada?

Speaker 2: 36:22

Yep. Elon Musk's, grandfather, Joshua Hallumann. Yeah. I talk about that in the book as well. And yeah.

Speaker 2: 36:28

And so, I mean, these people like them. They basically were they're this is also you have to kinda put in the context of the time, great depression, and so people are looking for new solutions. And so they're saying, look. Obviously, the capitalists are failing us. Obviously, democracy is not working.

Speaker 2: 36:40

The answer then is to eliminate those things. People are too dumb to know what's good for them. Let's have the the the engineers and the scientists managing society, and they said they would do this using the machines. I think in our time, we would call this artificial intelligence, but they imagined that the machines would help them micromanage all resources and people would have energy certificates that would determine the amount of energy that they're using and how they where they can spend it and things of that sort. A lot of things that are really kind of currently popular again.

Speaker 2: 37:11

But if you go to Wikipedia and look up technocracy, it'll tell you that this was a political movement that had its moment, and then it faded into the dustbin of history. I basically proposed in the book that it did not disappear. In fact, when you look at folks like Zabig Newberzinski, who is a long time long long term, really deep state agent, secretary of state at one point, adviser national security adviser, excuse me, Kissinger was the secretary of state. But both of them were advocates for what they called the technotronic era. So it it's technocracy in the thirties and the forties.

Speaker 2: 37:43

It kinda fades away. Then in nineteen seventies, Zabig Nabrzezinski writes a book called America Between Two Ages, the Technotronic Era, and he describes many of the same things. He describes a world police state. He says that individual liberty would probably have to disappear if we're going to have this utopian vision of society where everything is micromanaged and perfectly, resources were perfectly allocated. So the book is sort of warning about the rise of these various technological tools combined with this technocratic ideology that I think does guide people like Elon Musk, Peter Thiel, and some other folks in their class who are part of the billionaire big tech class.

Speaker 2: 38:20

And so it was sort of a warning about all those things coming, but also as the title implies, it is a sort of how to guide. And it's just full of different ideas for people to think about. And I will say that I think what's most important is that these are ideas that I have used and continue to use in my own life. I'm not speaking abstractly. I'm speaking from my own experience as well as from sort of crowdsourced information from other people I've met over the years who are on a similar path.

Speaker 2: 38:46

I haven't used a bank account since 02/2008 when I was, like, 20 years old and 22, something like that. And I don't talk to certain US government agencies and never have. And, it can make things very difficult, especially when you add on top of that what I shared earlier that I also have a felony on my record. Even though it's been twenty years, there are still people in places that judge you for that. So, you know, last time I was in Houston, Texas where I'm originally from, and I tried to get an apartment out there.

Speaker 2: 39:14

It was very difficult whenever I have a felon felony on my record, plus they asked to see, rental history where I usually pay cash for everything. They asked see bank statements, tax history, all these kind of things, which in our society, I think, we have been programmed to believe if you have those things, you're a good upstanding citizen. You're a real person. Right? But if you don't have government documents or if you're not being extorted by certain agencies or you're not, you know, using the big banks that have been robbing the people blind and helping Jeffrey Epstein launder money, then you must be some there must be something wrong with you.

Speaker 2: 39:47

Right? So the book does share my personal experiences of that. And, essentially, what I'm advocating for is what I call exit and build, and that is to exit from the systems that are coming very quickly, which I believe what I call slavery systems, and to build and or support those who are building new parallel systems. I essentially believe that the answers we're looking for won't be found in politics. They won't be found in through insurrection or violence, and they won't be found by being apathetic and just giving up.

Speaker 2: 40:15

To me, that's really being black pilled if you just, like, give up. Like, I've I I haven't given up in any way. In fact, I I have a lot of hope for humanity. I just don't see that hope in the political class. So instead, I advocate people to, there's two kind of components to exit build.

Speaker 2: 40:30

One of them is physical location, which I think many people will probably understand because for anybody who lived through COVID nineteen eighty four and was in an area that was extremely tyrannical, you might have thought, you know what? The state over is looking a lot nicer. They did better during COVID. There's more freedom over there, whether that's Florida, Texas, Idaho, etcetera. A lot of people made moves, and that might have been a city over, a town over, state over, a country over.

Speaker 2: 40:53

I did move to Mexico March Twenty Twenty, and, you know, my family's from Texas, so I do go back and forth. But that was sort of part of my exit and build strategy that not to say that's the right move for everybody, but that was the right move for me. And then the other component of exit and build is to take this holistic view of these different systems I'm describing. And I tend to focus on four or five main ones, being food, technology, education, healthcare is a big one. And finances is the other big part of that.

Speaker 2: 41:25

And looking at those systems, know just to take the money side of things, federal reserve, debt based system, fractional reserve banking, etcetera, etcetera, and now CBDCs, stablecoin surveillance, all these sort of things on the horizon. And despite Trump's executive order saying he was gonna ban CBDCs, Whitney and Mark Godwin have been doing some great work, and I've been picking up some of those threads showing that the same end goals can be achieved by using stablecoins, Tether, USDC, USDT, and others. And so the problems aren't aren't gone. And if you can see that that is on the horizon, then it would be smart to start being forward thinking instead of just watching podcasts all day or just complaining on the Internet and actually trying to perhaps be prepared for what's coming and say, okay. Maybe I don't wanna be dependent on these systems with all of my wealth and money and energy in there because sooner or later, they're gonna turn into a CBDC, or they might shut me down because I have the wrong opinion on the Internet.

Speaker 2: 42:19

I don't these think think these things are gone for good just because Trump is coming to office. And, you know, so that's kind of like the approach is, like, take this holistic view and look at the most important areas of your life. Again, I would focus on food finances to start with, and that itself is a big thing. During COVID, a lot of people realize like maybe I don't wanna be dependent on the grocery store for everything that I eat because they can require me to wear a mask or require me to show proof of shots or whatever crazy thing they come up with. Right?

Speaker 2: 42:46

And so if we see the way that these systems are headed and how the the progression that they're on, you know, assuming that it it doesn't stop, which I don't necessarily believe that their vision is going to be reality per se, but I also don't think we should just assume it's not gonna happen or that there's not strides being made towards that area. So then the general principle is like, take this exit and build idea, exit from the systems that you believe are going to lead to less privacy and less liberty in the long term. And it's a process. Like, you don't necessarily and also, maybe you don't have the same end goal as me. There are people who are like, oh, I'm okay with using banks.

Speaker 2: 43:22

That's fine, but maybe consider switching to a local credit union. So you're not supporting the big banks anymore, you have a little bit more control over your finances. Right? In the book, I talk about these sort of half steps. Like, it's, you know, it's a process of going from totally plugged in.

Speaker 2: 43:36

Let's say you're a person that's got credit card debt and student debt, and everything you're doing is being tracked and traced through your check, through the taxation and other systems, and you're totally dependent on the grocery store, and your kids are in the mainstream public education systems, indoctrination centers. And that's not where you wanna be. You have these goals. Like I said, think about what is the what does freedom mean to you? Okay.

Speaker 2: 43:57

I would love for my kids to be homeschooled. I would love to have 50% of my food being grown by my family or at least coming from local farmers. Set those goals and then start taking these steps to get to towards that direction. And that way, whatever happens with Trump, whether he is the hero that some people believe he is or if he turns out to be wearing a mask because I believe he is, you're gonna be okay. Or at least you're gonna be better off than if you did nothing and just sat around and trusted the plan and assume that being, you know, just being in the political game and sort of watching the show is going to solve all your problems.

Speaker 2: 44:30

I think that's the major message that I want people to take home. You know? Whether or not you support Trump or, you know, are skeptical or whatever, like, take care of yourself because at the end of the day, that to me is what really matters. So, you know, I I'm not coming at this from a sort of trying to convince everybody to hate Trump or anything like that. It's more just like, take care of yourself because these these plans and these goals have been around way before we've ever heard the name Donald Trump.

Speaker 2: 44:56

And they've been around for generations. And the people who are working working on them are not simply going to disappear, at least not overnight. Right? And there's still much more battle ahead, both spiritually and physically. So I think it behooves all of us who have this sort of ability.

Speaker 2: 45:13

Like, if you have eyes and ears to see what's going on right now and you choose not to act, I personally believe you are failing the coming generations. And and our indigenous communities, which I'm, you know, my

Seth Holehouse: 45:25

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Seth Holehouse: 45:43

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Seth Holehouse: 46:29

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Speaker 2: 46:34

My family is from, and I've been taught to consider the seven generations and beyond. So not only my children and their children, but great grandchildren and people that I will never meet, what is the world they're gonna be born into? And the world they're gonna be born into is 100% dependent on what you and I and everybody listening choose to do or not to do. And so if we can see that there are some potentially bad things on the horizon, I think it is up to us and the sort of our duty almost to to act accordingly. And that doesn't mean we need to live in fear or assume the worst or anything like that, but be proactive.

Speaker 2: 47:06

You know? The other aspect of this is that I think if you choose not to act, you are failing your ancestors. You know? Every one of our ancestors, no matter your color of your skin or your background or place of origin or, you know, your language, our ancestors had to go through blood, sweat, and tears to get us to be alive in this moment, in this beautiful time and place in humanity. And, I believe if we also again fail to act that we are we are failing them and all the work and energy that they had to put in to make sure that we could be here at this moment, which I think is a truly crucial moment in humanity's, larger history.

Speaker 2: 47:39

So that's sort of the time the sort of energy that I'm coming from is like, I'm thinking of the coming generations. I'm thinking of those who've come before me and trying to be as proactive as possible, trying to, you know, raise alarm bells and whenever I see them and more importantly, lead by example. I mean, everything that I'm advocating here for are things that I'm currently doing in my life. I'm not just preaching, you know, and not not actually practicing what I preach. As I said in the book, a lot of it, it comes directly from my own lived experience, including the honest challenges that I've faced, like the thing the difficulties in trying to sort of advocate for this approach.

Speaker 2: 48:13

But I do think whether people push as extreme as I am or just sort of take steps that make more sense to them, becoming less dependent on their systems overall is a positive, you know, positive effort and a positive goal. And if you make that effort, I don't think you're gonna end up somewhere and be like, oh, no. I'm more free now. I wish I hadn't put in the effort. I think you'll end up being grateful that you took the time and energy to consider these ideas.

Seth Holehouse: 48:37

Exactly. I'll pull up this quote from, Jefferson. Right? The price of freedom is eternal vigilance, and this is so important because it doesn't say the price of freedom is getting the right president in the office, and or whatever it is. You know, it's not through that.

Seth Holehouse: 48:53

It it's being eternally vigilant. And I I pulled up another article as you were talking there. Right? You know, I'm like, was it day two or three with Trump, his big announcement with Stargate, and he brings out Larry Ellison. Right, a guy who has talked very openly about having building a modern surveillance state where, quote, citizens will be on their best behavior.

Seth Holehouse: 49:12

If you look into the history of Oracle, it's very easy to see that Oracle was named after the first CIA project that Larry Ellison, you know, got. You look at Facebook, which I think is heavily steeped in in in DARPA and in military technology, and that, you know, Zuckerberg is a front man to get people, you know, okay with the the point of putting their entire lives online so it could be tracked and traced and controlled. And this is something that I've been really concerned about is just the control the control and also the influence, but also the the sudden one eighty degree shift in support for Trump from the entire, you know, big tech leadership. You know, it just it's kinda strange to me because the more you dig into something, you more you you realize that, you know, Silicon Valley is very much so heavily run by the intelligence agencies. And so everyone's cheering and saying, oh, wow.

Seth Holehouse: 50:02

You know, everyone's they're they're they're exposing the CIA and USAID and but well, it's like, well, but how many of those same tentacles are controlling big tech? And all these big tech CEOs that we we've been sold this story that there are these unicorns, these geniuses that built these products in their garage. I think in a lot of ways, it's much more the fact that these are just fronts for the intelligence agencies, and they find the convenient, you know, kind of, figureheads to be the person in charge of these is, like, if you really think that Sam Altman is the guy that's making all the decisions and running a OpenAI, or if you really think even Elon Musk, right, is is much you know, as I have very positive feelings towards a lot of what he has done, the guy got rich off of contracts with a military industrial complex. And A %. I you know, so I'm not gonna overlook that.

Seth Holehouse: 50:49

I can still be happy and celebrate, but I agree with what you said though that I'm still really being diligent, and I'm not relaxing now. I think actually that being prepared and building a lifestyle of self reliance is even more important now than ever even if for the fact let's just say the next four years are gonna be pure heaven and just absolutely amazing. What happens after that? Right? What happens after the next person gets in?

Seth Holehouse: 51:13

And then what happens after two or three or four more, presidencies have passed? Where's America then? I mean, when 2020 like, the beginning of twenty twenty, right right when COVID was hitting, I was living in a high rise in New York City. Like, I was literally living in the opposite of what you'd say is is self reliant. I had no independence.

Seth Holehouse: 51:33

And so that year, I'd actually, I left behind a a successful business, and I made drastic changes with my my wife, and we moved to the countryside of Ohio and start building a homestead. And I think that that's the the key is that I think it's, you know, hope for the best, prepare for the worst. I think that the problem is right now, everyone's so focused on hoping for the best that they've forgotten the other part of it, which is that we still have to prepare for the worst. What if, this structure is being built? What if Stargate, you know, that which already raises so many flags about building an AI vaccine data center.

Seth Holehouse: 52:05

It's just like, oh my gosh. This is like the stuff from from nightmares. But what if that also gets used as a control grid to bring in some sort of digital surveillance state? And everyone now they're talking about, oh, well, the best way to manage immigration and entitlements is through, you know, much more robot robust, you know you know, ID, and it's like I can see the foundation for the the point of them saying, well, it's actually better for every citizen to have robust digital ID infrastructure because that way, we're not gonna be giving away this government waste to the people that don't deserve it. And I can see a lot of people being fooled into that where I think, again, this is why I wanted to have you on, not because, I've I've just become totally black pilled and not because you're black pilled, because this is a very rational discussion that we need to have.

Seth Holehouse: 52:50

Because, again, going back to, you know, old old Jefferson, the price of freedom is eternal vigilance, and that's what I see as my duty as someone that's, in my own way, a journalist and and certainly yours is I'm just trying to be vigilant. I'm trying to be eternally vigilant because not only is the audience that watches me, not only are they depending on me, but my children, my children's children, the seven generations after me are also relying on what I'm doing as well.

Speaker 2: 53:16

Absolutely. And, yeah, I've always loved that Jefferson quote because I feel like it it does encapsulate sort of for better or worse. I mean, obviously, we wish we could get to a place where, okay, we reached this utopia, and now we can all rest on our laurels and just sit on our patios and drink lemonade and everything's fine. But, unfortunately, I I don't think that at least now and and maybe, you know, once we leave this this physical plane, we will find that heaven we've been looking for. But it seems like, for the moment at least, humanity's course is to try to fend off evil that is constantly trying to take over, and that there are people who will try to use the machinery of government and other tools out there, media, etcetera, to create the world that they want.

Speaker 2: 53:59

And it's not one that does respect individual liberty, privacy, self ownership, bodily autonomy, etcetera. And I just wanted to pick up on the point you mentioned there about Larry Ellison. For those who don't know, I I write weekly articles. I'm the lead investigator at the Last American Vagabond, and we we did put out investigation right when the Stargate, project was announced, looking into not only the project itself, but Larry Ellison's history and Oracle's history. And as you correctly point out, Oracle has had deep ties to the CIA from the very beginning then.

Speaker 2: 54:26

And literally just this week as we're recording this, Larry Ellison was speaking at the World Government Summit. Yes. There's a summit called the World Government Summit. And I quote from him specifically, he said, we need health care data, diagnostic data, genomic data, digital health records of the entire population, and to move it into a single unified data platform in order for AI to better understand our country. So the same guy who's talking about mRNA, AI cancer vaccines, promising you they're gonna cure cancer is out there advocating for a single, platform to put everybody's data into.

Speaker 2: 54:59

And you're also correct that and this is something I've been shouting from the rooftops for years that, unfortunately, the people, what I term the predator class, are extremely brilliant and have so much data on us that they understand our psychology better than we probably ever can. And so they often put us in these situations where we're, you know, in a rock and a hard place, right, where, for example, the immigration crisis, which is a real crisis, is allowed to fester and to to balloon and to the point of you don't have to be a hard right conservative to be like, this doesn't make any sense. These policies are seem insane. Why would anybody do this? And so somebody like a Trump or somebody else comes along and says, I'm gonna fix this.

Speaker 2: 55:38

Obviously, insane problem. People cheer that on. They celebrate it. They vote for that. But at the same time, Trump has been saying for years that his solution was a biometric entry and exit system for The United States to solve the immigration crisis.

Speaker 2: 55:51

Same thing you could say with the sort of voting malfunctions and voting errors and people suspicious about trusting the elections, which I don't necessarily trust any election. But the the solution that will be proposed will be digital IDs for maybe they'll start with, okay. We're gonna have all the immigrants use digital IDs. Inevitably, these things will be expanded to the whole of the population. Like you said, they're gonna argue this is gonna be the best for America and all these different ways.

Speaker 2: 56:18

And I guess that that is sort of the the situation we find ourselves in. The people who want to push us in this predetermined, destination, this predetermined goal, they create or allow situations to fester like this so that we clamor for the solution they've been wanting the entire time. And I do worry that by the end of this Trump administration, despite whatever good may come, that we're gonna be a lot closer to this technocratic police state that, than we have been under any administration. And in fact, it'll be the people in the MAGA movement, at least some of them. I do know that there are some consistent people who support Trump.

Speaker 2: 56:51

I don't, you know, claim all Trump supporters are just blind loyalists. But for certain, he does have those just like all the other politicians. And there will be people who will cheer this on and who will, you know, talk crap at me and probably you for calling it out and say you're black pilled, you're negative, and try to do some mental gymnastics to make it make sense. But I I absolutely think we need to be very skeptical of this. And one other point I wanted to make, you mentioned something earlier that reminded me of this book I've been diving into from 1943.

Speaker 2: 57:22

It's called the Machiavellians, Defenders of Freedom. And the reason it came up to me is because I was listening to an interview recently with Marc Andreessen, and he is, you know, one of these big technocrats who's funded PayPal, Facebook, etcetera, just another one of these kind of guys in the background that's associated with Peter Thiel and Elon Musk and others. And in an interview recently, he was mentioning how the the worldview that he is informed by or that he believes in essentially says that there will always be an elite, that there's going to be, you know, this elite that the people rebel against and the masses push back and this and that. But the way to solve that is for there to be a counter elite. And, essentially, Andreessen has framed himself and Elon Musk and these others as that counter elite.

Speaker 2: 58:06

So I think at best, sure, they may have some plans that might benefit people. They are pushing back on transgender stuff and pushing back on some of the insanity that, again, a lot of just average Americans are like, this doesn't make sense. But at the same time, they still see themselves as just the next ruling class. It's not that they think we're going to liberate the people, and the people are gonna become, you know, autonomous beings who recognize their self ownership and, you know, are able to to live out their life to the fullest, etcetera. It's just that we're gonna change from one elite to the And in their in his view, at least the way he explained this and the way the book described it as well is that this is just the path of history.

Speaker 2: 58:45

It kind of offers a sort of different historical analysis than, say, Marxist views of class struggle. And this is basically saying, like, there's always gonna be an elite. You can't get rid of them. It's just a fact of life. It's just about will the elite, you know, bend the people's will.

Speaker 2: 58:59

And after a while, they don't, a counter elite will appear will appear to sort of push them out and essentially use populism to appeal to the people so that they can become the next elite. And so I don't even think these people are really hiding what they're really after. It's just that they see themselves as the next, you know, the right people to be in charge, and they're gonna guide us to some golden age.

Seth Holehouse: 59:20

And that's what we have to be looking out for. Derek, I know you got a pretty hard cut off today. You have something coming up after this. But before we sign off, I do wanna bring up your website one more time, the conscious resistance Com. The links that I pulled up today, I'll put into the description, specifically this one, especially the the book that you have here that we you give away the book for free.

Seth Holehouse: 59:41

I bought it online. I'm a big fan of paper copies because they'll survive an EMP. So, but you've got the access here as well. So, Derek, as we're we're closing, do you have any final thoughts for folks?

Speaker 2: 59:55

I I appreciate you having me on, brother, and I'd love to come back on when I have more time. I'm sorry for the short time today, but, I did I'll just mention one other thing and then a closing thought. For anybody who does wanna check out my work, The Conscious Resistance is the Best Place. And you'll see the latest link on there as we're recording this is the most recent chapter of my 17 part documentary series, which is called The Pyramid of Power. And I've been working on this for the last four or five years now.

Speaker 2: 01:00:19

We're almost to the end of it. And for anybody who is kind of new to some of this information or, you know, just wants a refresher, I encourage you to start at the beginning of that series. Each episode is intended to be thirty minutes or less. I essentially tried to take the best books, the best documentaries, plus my own original research, make them, you know, palatable and and bingeable for the Netflix generation. Every episode ends with suggested solutions.

Speaker 2: 01:00:43

Every episode ends with, if you wanna learn more, watch this documentary, read this book. And the idea is that it you know, we start with the education system, and it progressively gets deeper and deeper and more, quote, unquote, conspiratorial. We're gonna be releasing the final episode this spring, which will try to answer the question of who or what is at the top of this pyramid. So I encourage people to check that out. And overall, yeah, I mean, I I think that it just we're at a really crucial time.

Speaker 2: 01:01:06

I mean, this is I'm I'm readily willing to admit this is a wild time. We're in some unprecedented territory for sure. So it's gonna be interesting one way or the other. Let's celebrate the wins where they're at, but let's not put our blinders on. You know, let's not be cult members.

Speaker 2: 01:01:20

Let's be critical thinking, free human beings who have the strength of our ancestors and who have the future generations depending on us. Let's step up to the plate. Let's rise to the occasion. And, yeah, just, you know, pursue your independence and whatever that looks like, and don't allow yourself to be sucked into any sort of echo chambers that tell you that it's not okay to question things. I think that's what we really need to look out for.

Speaker 2: 01:01:42

So thank you for having me on today.

Seth Holehouse: 01:01:43

Absolutely. One final thing is that if people wanna follow you on Elon Musk's data collection, system called X, you are at d bros live, live free. So, there's that Yeah. As well. So funny enough.

Seth Holehouse: 01:01:56

And you can use a Grok AI to tell you what's really going on in the world and tell you who Derek really is according to Elon's AI system.

Speaker 2: 01:02:04

Even tried that out yet, so I'd be curious. Yeah.

Seth Holehouse: 01:02:08

Anyway, Derek, it's it's been a pleasure speaking with you. I thank you for giving me your time. And, yeah, we'll have to set up another time when we've got, some more just opportunity to dig into some more, deeper topics. You know, I'm sure we could go on for for many hours. You know, I could pick your brain on things, but thank you for what you're doing.

Seth Holehouse: 01:02:24

Thank you for the information you're putting out there, and I, yeah. Appreciate the time you give me today.

Speaker 2: 01:02:29

Thank you.

Seth Holehouse: 01:02:31

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