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A daily podcast delving into the biggest stories of the day throughout the sports betting and igaming sector.
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Evolq shares fell on Tuesday as the William Hill operator published a Q4 trading update despite labelling the quarter as its strongest of 2025. Highlighting the difficulty of last year, Evolq confirmed that plans to close retail shops and a potential sale remain on the horizon. CEO Per Widerstrom asserted that these mitigation manoeuvres are necessary to offset the UK tax pressures. Welcome back to iGaming Daily, this episode is brought to you by OptiMove, the creator of positionless marketing and the number one player engagement solution for iGaming and sports betting operators. Learn how OptiMove's positionless marketing is changing how iGaming teams operate. Discover how operators are using OptiMove's positionless marketing platform to launch personalized CRM campaigns, dynamically change casino lobbies and bet slips and create engaging gamified experiences. You can learn more about that at OptiMove.com. And to see how this approach comes to life OptiMove Connect returns to London on March the 11th and 12th, 2026. It is the only user conference where marketers from around the world share real world results of positionless marketing, driving efficiency and ROI. And you can register for that at connect.optimove.com. I'm Charlie Horner and joining me to discuss all things Evoque uh SBC News editor Ted Orme Clay and iGaming expert editor Joe Streeter. Joe, how are you doing? I'm great, thanks Charlie. Yeah, I'm recovered from a hectic few days in Barcelona. It all went by so fast, but yeah, back on the grind and some interesting UK stories developing as well. yeah, lots to get into. How about yourself? How are you? Yeah, very good. Very good. was a nice uh week at ICE. We survived and yeah. iGamingDay leaves back to usual service. Ted, how are you? Yeah, pretty much the same as both you and Joe. Charlie, yeah, had a good weekend, know, refreshing weekend after Ice. Quite recovered from that. Obviously, like, we all had a pretty hectic week there as usual. um And yeah, like Joe said, we've kind of come back to quite a few big developing stories in the UK. You know, we're starting to get into the start of results season, aren't we, with some of the full years and Q4s coming up. So, yeah, big week to get back into things. Yeah, those stories you kind of speculated upon and the rumour mill was running rife at the end of last year, you're now starting to see that come to fruition. So it is a really interesting time. Yeah, border up the hatches everyone. Earning season is nearly here. And the curtain raiser really for that is Isovox trading update or post close update for 2025. Ted, how about you give us some of the top line figures from this update? know, Evoke is a company that's had a few struggles over the years, like a lot of other companies, know, it's been got hit by some regulator adjustments. A lot of its brands were sort of had to ride out the COVID pandemic and things like that. I that was obviously pre the William Hill acquisition, but that's a thing that, know, William Hill's retail units would have struggled with a lot back then. And then yeah, gambling app review and so on. A lot of the political and public pressures since. These results show a company actually had a decent end to last year out of a year that we talked about a lot last year was very challenging for the industry. Q4 they've highlighted as being the strongest quarter of the year with revenue of $464 million. That's up 7 % on the previous quarter. They did acknowledge that this was 3 % down year over year, which was the, as we've seen with a lot of other operators in previous quarterly updates last year. It was all difficult comparatives with 2024, obviously 2024 having the Euros, some of the bigger international ones as well, like the Copa America and things like that. But like we spoke to with some operators last year, know, the Club World Cup just wasn't enough to fill a gap that was left by cups like the Euros and so on. Obviously this year you'll have the World Cup, which I assume will swing back in a pretty big time to fill that gap. And they expect full year 2025 revenue to be up 2 % year over year at I believe 1.7 billion. So a good close to the year for them really. In what was a year where we saw a lot of a recovery for them, especially among retail. But it is also a year that's come with a bit of a dampener at the end of it for their UK assets with the tax obviously. some cause for celebration with their figures, but cause for concern moving forward, I think. Yeah, mean, Evoke said that this is the strongest quarter of 2025, but I think it's fair to say that the bar isn't incredibly high. It's well documented that it was a tough year for the group. uh Joe, how would you dissect these numbers and how would you say that Evoke are? trying to recover from what has been a tough period. Yeah, I think uh Ted's kind of broken it down quite nicely. A few other things. I think there were a lot of things that were kind of left unsaid because they just don't know, right? They were kind of vague on future projections because we just don't know what the year holds. They did obviously confirm the closure of shops as well, which I think we can finally now dispel the myth that by not putting tax hikes on the retail sector in the budget last November? November, yeah. that the retail sector would be completely shielded from the impact of tax rises. Yeah, Evoke has confirmed the closure of shops. But, you know, that's also kind of seen us uh trimming the fat on their retail assets. yeah, retail did grow for them. It did grow. It was increased in terms of profitability, but they have still taken the decision to close some retail shops and kind of trim the fat. on their retail portfolio perhaps with a view to that being picked up and acquired this year at some point. Who knows on that front but yeah, very interesting times ahead. of course know that the tax hikes haven't come into play yet and they hadn't by the time Q4 had come into play. So just, you know, even though there has been a recovery on the retail front, still mitigating ahead of those future tax exposures and we know that Evoke is... is more exposed to the UK than most other operators just due to the fact that the other big operators are more diversified in terms of the markets that they're in. How have the markets reacted to this update? Because we've sort framed this as a quarter of recovery really for Revolt, but has the market agreed with that, Ted? em The share price did dip a little bit earlier, I think only by 2%, which isn't a catastrophic amount. uh Like you said, think uh the last quarter of year been particularly strong for them and I'm expecting some growth um albeit uh minor in full year figures does present a decent financial picture for them. I think the thing that may be impacting uh share price and more just be uncertainty around potential future direction with the strategic review being ongoing and the prospect of em further sharp closures and things like that. The other thing around that is, course, I'd imagine across the markets there's some investor interest, M &A interest m in the group. this continues a trend of little bit of fluctuation in the markets because off the back of reports last week um that Bally's and Betfred were eyeing, flirting with the idea of picking up some of the evoke assets that the share price did jump a little bit. yeah, nothing really too much to write home about just a little slide today, think, but nothing too major. you know, for like, we know speculatively, the share price will start creeping back up again, as we've seen occur, you know, occur after previous quarterly results, after previous budget announcements and things like that, you know, markets are always, always subject to change. There is also, you know, the prospect that if they were to that they're doing this strategic review, if they were to sell off some assets, that would give the company a financial boost and stuff could have an impact on dividends and things like that. So that can always impact shares. think there's been a lot of talk about what M &A could look like in 2026 in the aftermath of the, not just the taxes in the UK, but ones in other markets as well and regulator adjustments across lots of different markets in Europe and Latin America and so on. changing dynamics of things in the US, do think Evoque is going to be one of the big ones to watch on that front as they continue with this strategic review of their business. think one of the factors we should just take into consideration is the profit expectations. think that Evoque said somewhere in the region of £355 to £360 million in adjusted EBITDA for the year. I think that's slightly down on previous projections earlier in 2025. So that might have moved the market slightly. Something just to keep an eye on. We mentioned some of the reports that we saw last week and we'll talk about this a little bit more in the back half of the show. But did leadership provide any update on the strategic review? Is that something that they managed to comment on in Peter Wiedershram's remarks? Not really. just seems to be, that's going to be a very in-depth and long running process, isn't it? When you're looking at the potential future direction of a company like this and a company that owns some very high profile brands as well. The William Hill brand is one of the oldest, if not the oldest, I think in the UK. em Mainstay of the retail sector, quite a big online presence as well. 888, obviously very widely recognized group of brands. Deciding what you're going to do with those and the different financial and regulatory and legal intricacies involved in that is going to take a while. So we're just seeing really, I think, a continuation of the line we saw last year. em reading it straight up here, the board is assessing its strategic options with a resolute focus on maximising shareholder value. Apart from the confirmation towards the end of the CEO's quotes that shop closures can be expected. not really had too much more insights into I think what the strategic review is uncovering. I guess on the topic of the shop closures as UK retail has been struggling for some time with participation rates down and things like that. Evoke actually is sad to see that trend booked a bit last year. We saw in a lot of quarterly results are saying retail revenue is up, but there will have still been a number of shops I'd imagine were not cost effective, that weren't profitable. So regardless of the tax increases or not, we could have potentially seen some shop closures in 2026 anyway, but perhaps the tax closures have just dealt a final nail in the coffin of some retail outlets, perhaps. Brilliant. Ted, Joe, we'll go for a quick break and then we'll come back and we'll dive a little bit deeper into this. Welcome back to iGaming Daily. We're talking all about Evoke's Q4 trading update. Joe, before the break, we were talking about the strategic review and some of the post tax increase plans for Evolk. How are you reading what Evolk's leadership does next in terms of the strategic review, in terms of the shop closures? yeah, this is em the million dollar question, Charlie. It's a really interesting one. And I think we kind of got clues, right? We have clues of the approach they're taking and it's not a surprising one. They're kind of streamlining what they do. I think the UK retail portfolio is one that is incredibly enticing to many. think that's a big asset that they have. They're just trying to trim the fat around that with the shop closures. think kind of a similar principle taken to that we saw kind of at the end of last year with uh the departure of William Hill from numerous markets across Latin America and Africa as well. They're just kind of streamlining their portfolio and just uh making those cost cutting decisions that strengthen the allure of their portfolio to investors. And you mentioned, both of you mentioned actually, reports in the news last week about of Bally's and maybe Betthread circling around some of the VIVOX assets. Obviously a lot of the industry was away at ICE last week, so maybe it would be beneficial for listeners if you brought us up to speed on those reports and a little bit about, you know, what could happen, who's circling and maybe... Is it just rumour or is it something we can read a little bit more into? It's hard to say because obviously the news that was broken have their own sources on that. Just to purely be speculative, obviously Betfred is one of the UK, alongside William Hill, is one of the biggest retail names on the British High Street. It's Betfred, William Hill and Ladbrokes Coral, it? I'd say probably the big three of the British High Street bookies. Maybe they would be potentially interested in acquiring some of the more profitable William Hill assets, know, Betfred is also a company which will have a huge retail stable, a number of which will also be struggling. I'm just a little skeptical as to how much of like William Hill retail assets they'd want to acquire in that sense. Bally's Intralot is obviously a company that is much more digitally em focused, isn't it? So perhaps from them, perhaps they could be interested in the William Hill Online. I don't know how confident I'd be that they'd be interested in expanding their retail footprint, particularly at a time like said, when UK retailers been struggling with some, oh I say struggling, but it's not like figures are down catastrophically, but participation rates according to the gambling commission have been going down year over year. Yeah, it's a tricky one to say. then obviously outside of speculation on William Hill, there is also the 888 brands to consider as well, which are very, very recognizable. They have a bit more of an international presence than William Hill. You know what, I actually kind of take the opposite tact here because I think, Betfred, I think the retail sector in the UK is always going to be there. And I know we've seen further kind of political speculation at the start of this year. It doesn't seem to have as much traction. as it did kind of last year about intensifying regulation around the gambling industry. We've seen some further pressure on the retail betting sector this year, but I think the retail betting sector is always going to be there. It's always going to be somewhat strong and for Betfred to kind of have the opportunity to grow that asset. We know that's a big part of what they do being on the UK high street and having that strong presence. It makes a lot of sense to me if, and you know, I'm not going to be in any negotiating rooms or anything like that, but if the price is right, I think Yeah, this is a uh great January deal, Charlie. think this is a real opportunity, a long-term investment. think, you know, we know how strong William Hill is on the high street. We know I recognize that brand is, as Ted said, one of the oldest UK brands. So yeah, I think a real opportunity there for somebody like Betfred. I think how they use it then is pivotal. I think the UK retail sector. needs innovation. think it really is starving for innovation. Maybe that's to boost the omnichannel approach, but the emphasis is on operators to do that now, right? Because the tax rises on the online sector really just squeeze as much profit from that as possible, almost making it just unprofitable and unmanageable like that. yeah, you're going to have to look to the retail sector. You're going to have to boost that omnichannel experience. So yeah, what an opportunity I think for somebody like Betfred. Don't backtrack now, Don't backtrack now. I would agree with you. think retail will always be resolute. There'll always be a retail betting presence on the high street, but it is going to be getting smaller, I think, over the years. We'll still see it there, but it certainly is not going to be on the same extent we've got. Undefined by what Evoke have announced today, right? streamlining that portfolio, but it is still going to be there. what we know from what Betfred have said before as well, like what they've said to SBC before, but I think, maybe they would acquire it, but they would also be looking very much at which shops to acquire. It's going to be based on where the shop's located, how profitable they are, how much long-term sustainability you see in these areas and things like that. Well, I think maybe Evoke is kind of trying to make that decision for them with these moves to kind Closing the shops already. They're saying, we, you we will already trim the fat. Here's the, here's the wrong thing. uh Another element we should consider in this though, is the regulations around em competition, you know, we've like, so Betfred already has, like we've said earlier, a really huge retail presence over a thousand shops. William Hill also has over a thousand shops. If Betfred was to, you know, hypothetically acquire a significant number. of those of the profitable ones, the CMA might take the competition and markets authority, maybe might have something to say about that. If I remember rightly, the CMA did rule back when Ladbrokes and Coral merged that that combined entity would have to close down a few shops because it was, you know, after that merger, would have too much of a combined dominance over the high street. you know, in a hypothetical Betfred William Hill merger, Betfred William Hill takeover. might be an element of that to consider as well. where do you sit on this? I'm interested to know your perspective on this. I see both sides of this argument, but I think the way I would come down on it is, can you imagine a high street without William Hill? I think it's such a heritage brand. It's such a well-known brand in the UK high street sector that I struggle to see a world where we don't have it. So I would lean towards someone will buy, if it's available, someone will buy it. I think particularly, you you talk about January deals, Evoke's market cap at the minute is something like 130 million pounds. That's not going to be a final price of any sale, but it goes to show that that's one way of valuing the company. You could probably get a much cheaper price than say what Evoke paid for, the William Hill brand in the first place. So there's certainly a deal there for someone who wants to make it, but you know, like you said, Joe, I'm not going to be involved in any negotiations. So I'll leave that to the deal makers. Really great debate, Joe and Ted. I think let's let the listeners make up their minds from here. I just want to end this really by coming back to, you know, we are going to see Q4s streaming in over the next few weeks. And this is going to take up a lot of both your time and your team's time. How will we read in operator Q4s as they come in over the next few weeks and what the storylines that you guys as editors are really looking out for? things I would say, and they kind of are intertwined in a sense. Obviously we've covered the retail sector quite heavily today. That's going to be interesting. But one is around the World Cup. How much reliance is there from operators on the World Cup this year? um And the other is on marketing spend. on the ground last week at ICE, something that I heard was, there was a lot of previous speculation that kind of marketing spend would be one of the first things that would kind of get cut. It seems less likely that that will happen. And it also seems less likely that will happen in a World Cup year when we know marketing is so crucial to to customer acquisition and then subsequently customer retention as well. yeah, I'm interested to see uh what and how much we will get from this in the upcoming results. don't know, but I'm interested to see marketing spend this year and also just how much operators are really relying on a favorable World Cup, particularly when in some of their core markets it's on at two o'clock in the morning or whatever time it's on. I'll still be there. I know you'll still be there, but maybe the more casual audience will be tuckered out in bed. Yeah. Come on. We need more hardcore sports fans up there to work in the morning. Productivity in the nation will plummet, but we'll have a good time whilst we're at it. Ted, what are you looking out for? I think, yeah, to build on what Joe said, think maybe for a company like Entain, I'd be interested in seeing what they might say about the UK market and the exposures there. Obviously they've got a bit more of an international presence, I think, than Evoke across Europe and Latin America, for example. It'll be interesting seeing what they might project about the UK market, whether they say similar things to what the Evoke CEO has said today. Companies like Flutter and Alwyn, I think, will be interesting to get more of bigger, wider international picture. I'm quite interested in seeing what Alwyn might say regarding the prize picks acquisition and what some of their ambitions are in North America. Maybe super group as well as another company out there interest in seeing what they're planning in Africa because they've mentioned that last year has been Quite a big focal point for them. So yes seeing how that continues to play out in their financials will be will be an interesting point Yeah, just built building on a couple of things Ted said there You know when we talk about Africa, there's some some real turbulence in terms of taxation in Africa Nigeria Being one of them uh one of those markets I'll be interested to see how those kind of Africa focused operators do adjust to that. And if they're planning on that and another one, obviously that we kind of off mentioned, but is, a whole new podcast. um But for the North American operators around prediction markets, because boy, oh boy, that's going to be a story this year. Right. mean, yeah. Well, flutter via Fangio, a draft Kings and then all in via prize picks are all getting involved. There's other companies looking at getting in on that as well. So yeah, it'll be interesting to see. what impact that has on financials, whether that's like spend or potential revenue from that. Yeah, that'll be a big one. I wonder how much of a moneymaker Prediction Markets is just in terms of volume and, know, because it's not, it's peer to peer, right? It's like an exchange, so it's difficult to make too much revenue out of it. But it's certainly something from a strategic point of view that I'm really intrigued to see what happens. and we should definitely do a prediction markets roundup when it comes to reporting season and we'll make sure to do that. But for now, Joe, Ted, a really fantastic debate. Thanks ever so much for joining me and to the listeners, thank you very much for tuning into today's episode of iGaming Daily and come back tomorrow to keep up to date with all the latest global gambling news.